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2023-24 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Timberwolves (2024 Opener, which is kind of a thing)

Obviously, this could also be the OG Opener, but, I mean, come on, how do you pass up the first game of 2024? I apologize OG, I truly am very excited to watch you make your debut today, but, come on, 2024 opener is too hard to pass up!

The new-look Knicks host the surprisingly good Minnesota Timberwolves today, back at the Garden after a weird (and annoyingly unsuccessful) road trip.

The Wolves are big, so having OG will help a lot! It’d be amazing to get a win in OG (and Precious)’s debut!

Let’s go, Knicks!

326 replies on “2023-24 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Timberwolves (2024 Opener, which is kind of a thing)”

You know how B-R lists player’s nicknames, e.g. RJ is Maple Mamba? I just randomly looked up Evan Fournier’s page, and the nickname they list for him is ‘Don’t Google’. 😀

Repost:

I think djphan’s points are entirely fair and well-reasoned, and unlike, um, others, I don’t think he has an agenda or an axe to grind. In other words he’s not a troll.

I also disagree with him in key a respect that renders his first and third concerns less pressing–I will go ahead and predict that Anunoby will be able to raise his usage a tick without a major efficiency drop off. Put me down for 20 PTS/36 with a .570 or above TS% for the rest of the year.

My primary reason for thinking this is basically the eye-test. I’ve always been intrigued by OG’s ability to use his size to attack mismatches and create space in the short-midrange, which he didn’t get to do all that often in Toronto. I won’t harp on this too much because it’s a subjective take and we’ll just have to wait-and-see.

I do think there are numbers that support the idea of him succeeding in a larger role too though. For various reasons it seems like he and Barnes never quite clicked, and dating back to last season in about 900 minutes with Barnes off the floor OG put up a 58 TS% with 20% USG. With VanVleet also off the floor last season his TS% was 61 and his USG was 22.6% (about 500 minutes).

Ultimately these sample are way too small to say anything even remotely definitive, but I’m a believer in OG’s ability to expand his offensive game in a beneficial way. I think he’s a better shot creator than RJ Barrett and that will bear itself out.

The backup point guard issue is very real though and we might have to move DDV back to the bench to give those units some juice if we don’t acquire anyone else.

I’m less concerned about the incresaed staggering we’ll have to do with Brunson and Randle because those guys have never played all that well together anyway. Our net rating has always been better with one of them on than both of them on, and significantly so.

What I hated about the Hart trade was that we gave up assets to go from 8th to 5th. And now that Jacquez Jr has turned out to be one of the 4 best players in the draft and we probably could have had him if we didn’t trade a pick for Josh Hart, the book is officially closed on how terribly stupid a mistake that was.

I think it’s pretty telling that to make the case against the Hart trade you have to pretend our pick was a lot higher than it actually was. I understand the idea is that without Hart we would’ve lost a bunch of additional games, but while Hart was obviously very beneficial down the stretch we were 20-14 with the 6th best net rating in the pre-Hart, post-Reddish/Fournier banishing period.

There’s just no way to know exactly where our pick would’ve fallen without Hart, but I find the whole exercise a little weird anyway because if you employ this logic you could also say it about any other player who helped us win games. Maybe Hart cost us Jaquez, but Brunson and Randle cost us Wembanyama! It’s just a roundabout way of saying we should be tanking, which, maybe! We’ll have to see if Leon can land the hybrid plane.

–I will go ahead and predict that Anunoby will be able to raise his usage a tick without a major efficiency drop off.

and so what is a tick? to 20? that’s not really going out on a limb and that’s also woefully short of what was outgoing…. i even went so far as to assume he’d reach his previous career high which was 20…

if we’re going to see any meaningful difference in OG impacting the offense… he needs to be in the 23-24 area… which is A LOT… and he also needs to get to the free throw line a lot more than he has…. if nick nurse could not get him there… in an offense that has way less ball dominant guys around…. i highly doubt that’s going to happen here..

but ok.. let’s assume he gets to 23-24… there’s still another 5-8 possessions up for grabs… where is that coming from?

RJ is averaging 18 points a game this year. But OG needs to average 23?

As far as IQ’s points. Well let’s see there’s more shots for Grimes, DDV, Hart, McBride, IHart and even precious. Oh and don’t forget Brunson and Randle!

Like yeah we’re gonna have to make up for these points but let’s not act like it’s going to be impossible to do.

and so what is a tick? to 20? that’s not really going out on a limb and that’s also woefully short of what was outgoing…. i even went so far as to assume he’d reach his previous career high which was 20…

I answered this in the post:

Put me down for 20 PTS/36 with a .570 or above TS% for the rest of the year.

And yes, this is clearly to some extent a vote of confidence in the ability of DDV, Grimes, Hart, et al. to raise their usages.

Hart is an interesting guy to watch in particular. In 2021-2022 he put up a .610 TS% on 18.6% USG without even shooting all that well from 3. I’ve said a few times before that it feels like there’s some extra juice left to squeeze with him in the half court. At the end of the day, he’ll have to seize the opportunity, which is not something he often looks comfortable doing.

Guys, DJ’s talking about USG% not PPG…

We can disagree with him*, but at least let’s talk about the same things 😉

* And I understand where his point come from, the difference is that I think it will find a balance after a 10-15 game adjustment…

Little Hart is one of the rare NBA players who doesn’t shoot as much as he probably should.

Spree, Gallo, JR Smith and now OG. Number 8 has been a pretty fun number in recent Knicks history.

Going from RJ to OG loses you like 5 shot attempts per game. It’s not a big deal and even if he doesn’t shoot more OG scores a lot more efficiently so it’s probably at worst a wash, and if you can get those shots to people better at making them than RJ its probably a boon. The big problem for the offense is losing IQ.

obviously this usage is going end up somewhere…. but if it ends up as grimes creating from the top of the key … yes it’s going to end up worse than RJ’s possessions…

RJ’s possessions are worse relative to what’s out there…. but the difference in the grand scheme of things is relatively small from what’s acceptable… when you put guys who are not used to doing those things… like donte.. hart… grimes… OG… it’s quite possible despite their efficient and ‘better’ offenses… that they do worse than RJ…

they’re efficient because they have narrow roles… when you ask them to do things that they don’t normally do.. because they don’t do it that well… then you’re going to wish you had RJ back doing those things….

and if you can get those shots to people better at making them than RJ its probably a boon.

to who!? who’s going to iso from the top of the key after Randle swings it around after getting doubled and be expected to do something? all these other guys just jack it up as soon as they touch it….

Big Hart is another guy to watch usage wise. Can we unlock the version that had that Reddit guy saying he was the next Jokic?

In all seriousness, RJ set the bar so low I’m cautiously optimistic the offense won’t suffer from replacing his shots with OG’s + the remaining guys picking up the scraps. I think that tradeoff will be flatly beneficial, actually.

IQ is of course a completely different story. The “good news” is because we didn’t play him as much as we should’ve, we’re only asking for ~14 true shot attempts from the rest of the roster. The bad news is the path to getting those at Quickley’s ~60 TS% isn’t clear. It would be great if Quentin Grimes would stop sucking!

Ultimately we traded a seriously disjointed roster for a still-disjointed-but-less-so roster, and we still need to add a high level shot creator. The reason I fall in the pro-trade (with some hesitation) camp is because I think our roster is now substantially better suited to adding such a player, because we’ve opened up flexibility in terms of the player’s position.

“Spree, Gallo, JR Smith and now OG. Number 8 has been a pretty fun number in recent Knicks history.”

You forgot Big Bells…

then you’re going to wish you had RJ back doing those things….

I’ll take the under on this

One last mini-prediction:

Precious Achiuwa will get a lot of Knickerblogger virtual ink spilled compared to his role. I do not think he is good or will be good in the future, but I am happy we have him nonetheless.

I liked Precious at draft time, but alas he hasn’t developed as much as I thought he would. I wonder if Thibs can help him become a bit more disciplined and effective.

guys… usage is not just fga… there’s 10 fta per 36 out the door.. that cuts our ftr in almost half….

where exactly is that coming from now? you’re asking for wholesale changes in who people are… there are a couple ways we can have a good offense… but donte… grimes… OG… mcbride.. hart… ‘making up’ this usage is not one of them….

I’ll take the under on this

so are you also in the camp that we are going to be a top 10 offense this year?

i am very curious to see where people are on this and how much conviction they have because apparently i am a crazy person….

RJ took like 5 unassisted shots per game, probably a few more if you add in FTAs. Every one that wasn’t at the rim was a sub 40% shot. It’s not a lot of quality shooting that needs to be shifted elsewhere

Very happy to have Alan picking up Wally’s usage today. Go Knicks!!

OG! Welcome 😉

This usage conversation about the starters is very silly. If DDV is going to be the starter, we have an excess of scoring ability on the court. The only issue is scoring on the bench. We’ll see what Thibs does.

Why does anyone want Murray over DDV? The guy’s been incredible this year.

Leave Donte alone!

This usage conversation about the starters is absolutely comical.

I think it’s a valid concern, just overstated because 1) RJ sucked and 2) more importantly, everyone on Earth knows this move was made with another move in mind, not with maximizing our 2024 title chances (lol) in mind.

The spacing hasn’t been so good so far. You can tell OG doesn’t always know where to go yet and they wind up with multiple players on top of each other. It’s going to take a few games at least.

Where will shots and USG come from? Early evidence suggests Randle…

Edwards is looking really polished now compared to his rookie year…almost like a different player.

Yeah I thought Edwards was going to be a chucker coming out of college but I was wrong

Deuce will need some help and we dont have any…

OG definitely a bit lost, but it should not take too much time to pick it up

I don’t think “point-forward” Randle running the 2nd unit is a very good idea, Thibs…

I don’t think “point-forward” Randle running the 2nd unit is a very good idea, Thibs…

was point-‘guard’.. mcbride any better?

Brunson is in a bit of a funk lately…I wonder if he’s playing through something…

Wolves showing you why I want another big wing instead of a diminutive guard. They’ve only got two scorers but they’re so damn big it doesn’t matter.

Let’s be big like this.

The bench unit where Julius Randle goes 1-on-5 and the rest of the No Usage All Stars stand around and do nothing needs some work

was point-‘guard’.. mcbride any better?

I’m saying we need a new Quickley.

I can’t even put into words how disappointing Grimes has been on offense this year…

EDIT: well, there you go, lol

Some impressive defense and offensive rebounds, some absolutely boneheaded decisions, in like 5 minutes we’ve gotten the full Precious Achiuwa experience.

Good to see Brunson hit some shots!

EDIT: well, there you go, lol

Haha. Was typing same about Grimes and then Alan said it out loud: This is your opportunity, Grimes. Use it.

Conley doesn’t look 75 years old…

I’m sure you don’t either, big guy.😉

“I’m sure you don’t either, big guy.😉”

I’m actually going to try playing some rec basketball…between that and my upcoming teaching gig, it’s like a second childhood thing!

I’m enjoying the low usage guys cooking a little more. I miss IQ dearly…but we’re a lot more watchable without the other guy.

OG having an impact on both sides despite not much scoring yet. I’m enjoying that a lot more than watching RJ barrel into the defense and get blocked or dribbling around and throwing up bricks.

Seems like our backup PF problem is kaput…

One of the upsides of the trade.

Add Mitch to this defense and you have a championship caliber defense.
Moving IQ unlocks Grimes and Deuce.

So if Townes actually helped Edwards up while Townes has the ball and Edwards is still out of bounds, does that mean Townes is out of bounds too, by contact?

Defense is looking scrappy. Wonder if we could pick up another combo guard type for the bench and a cromulent backup big to spell iHart

We have a big wing who moves without the ball. Christmas came about 358 days early.

Leon: “If Thibs can’t/won’t teach cutting and passing, I’ll get some guys who already know how.”

Serious question: you think Thibs benched iHart vs Orlando to be a little petulant and show Leon how badly we need size?

lol Thibs will play OG 40 minutes in his first game.

Fun quarter. More of this, please.

This is looking so damn nice, defense was everywhere in the 2nd period. I love it.

The way we are running out in transition is disorienting…like who is the fat guy bellowing on the sidelines and what have they done with Thibs?

Very good half, it’s early and there’s works to do but hints of good things…

OG moves, cuts, passes, defends, sometimes shoots, I’ve a new crush…

The DiVincenzo – Anunoby connection was so nice to see because we finally get dudes that are willing to make cuts and move without the ball, ball handling and dribbling aren’t the only way to create shots. I’m glad I won’t ever get to see another RJ 0 assist performance ever again.

OG also gonna help out with rebounding, really sucks not being able to see this team with Mitch.

Be optimistic!
Don’t you be a grumpy
When the road gets bumpy
Just smile
(Smile and be happy!)

Your troubles can’t be
As bad as all that
When you’re sad as all that
No one loves you

Be optimistic!
Don’t you be a mourner
Brighten up that corner
And smile

Don’t wear a long face
It’s never in style
Be optimistic
And smile!

OG +20 in the first half. I’m not used to seeing a + next to our SF’s name.

It would be really rude of Minnesota play well in the 2nd half and spoil these vibes.

Also, I feel people around the league are really going to start paying attention to Hartenstein now that he’s starting, he could start on like 15 teams right now and be an improvement.

“Also, I feel people around the league are really going to start paying attention to Hartenstein now that he’s starting, he could start on like 15 teams right now and be an improvement.”

Sadly, it means that someone’s gonna pay him…

Thibs at halftime: “Seriously, though, guys, that thing you did where one of you runs to the basket receives a pass and then passes back to the first guy for an easy layup. What’s that called?”

Paging Clyde.

Knicks gonna have their rough stretches especially until Thibs locks into a set minutes/lineups rotation but so far so good.

“Where is clyde…still in the Bahamas?”

St. Croix, but yeah, probably. I don’t think he was a fan of RJ…

With iHart’s EB rights I’m pretty confident we’ll be able to keep him if we want. I don’t see anyone going above the full MLE, unless the Jokic prophecy is fulfilled.

You can definitely see why all those beat writers bought into the CAA lie that a lot of teams wanted OG Anunoby

This may be a New Years hangover game for many on both sides, but we look incredible.

I can live with any outcome if we keep up this level of energy on both sides. I’ve never seen a Knicks team play like this.

A bunch of guys cutting and moving without the ball, who thought that would work?

And Randle abusing KAT

Also, if we’re getting 2+ BPM out of Donte a year, that’s looking like one of the best contract values in the NBA. Great signing so far.

I was joking about whether OG had out dunked RJ in one game but apparently RJ had two non transition dunks all season. OG has three today.

A bunch of guys cutting and moving without the ball, who thought that would work?

My only worry is that soon Thibs is gonna run a practice with them 😉

It’s nice to have a two way positive player on the court that doesn’t stop the ball instead of a two negative player that does.

I believe that’s two threes and four dunks for OG.

And not a single ‘blocked at the rim.’

I now know from reading Thibs’ lips that one of our offensive plays is called “forehead”

That’s the thing, Barrett soaked up usage by taking garbage shots that he shouldn’t be taking. Just redistributing those shots to OG and all the other guys is already a positive effect.

Brunson must be gassed…we need a better backup PG if Deuce can’t play more than 4 minutes a half…

How ‘bout we just give the extra usage to Donte? Dude’s playing like Klay Thompson this year.

How ‘bout we just give the extra usage to Donte? Dude’s playing like Klay Thompson.

Dontesanity?

Normally the Hart-to-Hart connection in transition goes the other way, that was awesome

Seeing iHart go down hard is absolutely terrifying…is he our most indispensable player right now?

Yeah Deuce is looking like Frank out there, unfortunately… maybe Flynn can do better when he’s available?

Deuce is a lot like Frank, it’s just easier to stomach because we took him 36th, not 8th.

Fournier for an overpriced backup PG with an extra year on his deal (so we can package his expiring in the future) seems like the next move. Maybe Terry Rozier?

Brunson missing bunnies something’s not right with him.

Tired. That’s my worry with the loss of RJ. At least Brunson and Julius could “rest” when Barrett was calling his own number. Without him they’re gonna get gassed faster IMO.

This is not the team to go small against, but I guess iHart can’t play 48 minutes

It would be really rude of Minnesota play well in the 2nd half and spoil these vibes.

I Owen’d it.

Knicks just scored 61 points in 1st half vs the #1 defense in the NBA…

Would that make a loss the ….

What a picture god damn perfect example of why CAA was able to defraud so many reporters into thinking a lot of teams wanted OG

Refs didn’t call KAT tripping Brunson for his 6th foul and then they do this.

Ok so Brunson had maybe the worst shooting game I’ve ever seen but like did he just get a game winning stop on KAT?

Julius “Empty Calories” Randle. Wish we traded him instead of RJ.

All Randle does is put up empty stats in crucial moments against the best defense in the NBA

Also — Kinda think DDV makes both those threes if he didn’t sit so long.

Phew…had to run Brunson and Randle the whole qtr….thibs knew that shit was gonna get tight…all gas no brake

17 points on 12 shots with 6 rebounds, great defense and a steal?

Welcome to NYC OG!!!!

man.. a thread full of guys with a chip on their shoulder…

it was a good win.. i dunno how much of this stuff is sustainable but for a day it’s nice…. playing all the starters like it’s game 7 minutes probably not one of those…

Last 2 games at home Knicks beat the Bucks and Wolves while opening up huge double digit leads in the 2nd half. But the Knicks were lucky so it doesn’t matter….

Randle looked at KAT and all he saw was barbecue chicken.

If you told me earlier today Brunson would shoot 5-23 against the Wolves I’d expect us to get blown the fuck out.

Very nice debut from OG, showed all the little things he can do on both sides of the court, that was pretty solid.

That was very fun. I want to let this cake bake for a while. No Mitchell, no Murray. Just a backup for Jalen, if Malachi ain’t it.

Hopefully one of the unsustainable things is Brunson shooting 5/23!

We definitely are a much more conventional team now in that we stack our starting lineup and try to survive the bench minutes. Could definitely still use a bona fide backup PG and probably a C too, though I kiiiiiinda want to give Achiuwa a shot.

But man, sure seems like the source of our stagnation may not have been Brunson or Randle…the ball was zipping.

If Randle can close like this in big games in the playoffs, I’ll be glad to eat a ton of crow.

OG with a terrific debut. You can already see that the projections and hopes are likely to come to pass. He’s going to help a lot on both sides & with spacing for Randle and Brunson.

To win a game like this against a top team on a night that Brunson shot so poorly is pretty big.

playing all the starters like it’s game 7 minutes

I def concede this point, but there is a path to many more “easy” baskets with this good passing group. We can hope this lessens the minutes load for Brunson and Randle against lesser squads.

Add in Mitch one day, and …

Well that was nice!

And thus ends the 12-game stretch since the IST where 4-10 seemed very possible and I went on the record saying I would sign up for the 6-6 we ended up going. I write that not as a victory lap, but as a sigh of relief. I truly feel like the season began in earnest today.

And I know Julius had a great game and all, but he also had a lot to do with the Wolves getting back into the game. Still, gotta love that he outplayed KAT down the stretch.

In all seriousness it was a great win but I’m sure it’ll still be a bit rocky over next few weeks. Thankfully the schedule will finally help and hopefully Thibs can settle into a good rotation sooner rather than later.

I swear I didn’t hallucinate Brunson getting a game winning stop on KAT, though it had more to do with KAT seeing he had Brunson on him and…deciding to take a tough floater type thing. It was weird.

Finally a good defensive performance after a log time! This game showed how important the OG trade is for the Knicks. The alarming part has to do with the bench which seems so inept and thin without IQ. Deuce did not show he belonged on the floor today, at a time when Brunson, who had to play almost 41 minutes, seems exhausted and in desperate need for a solid backup.

Nice win. OG played as well as advertised, hope he can continue this way.

It is a bit worrisome the situation for backup PG and C. Precious has not looked like a C, but we have to give him more time. In any case, I have more hopes in Sims taking those minutes. Deuce also did not look too good, we will have to stagger Randle to help him, and maybe start Grimes so that DDV can be in the 2nd unit more time.

But man, sure seems like the source of our stagnation may not have been Brunson or Randle…the ball was zipping.

Kinda shocked to look at the box score and see the whole team had just 9 assists outside of Brunson. Definitely felt like a lot more.

“If you told me earlier today Brunson would shoot 5-23 against the Wolves I’d expect us to get blown the fuck out.”

Right?

I wonder whether the pace we played with plus the extended minutes gassed Brunson…there was that play where KAT kept the ball inbounds and then walked into a 3 where Brunson was the closest defender and it looked like he had nothing in the tank to go after either the ball or KAT. It didn’t help that the Wolves glued a 6’9″ long-armed defender to him all game.

Maybe keep starting DDV but have him come off after 6 mins so he can start the 2nd quarter with the bench? I think in most games Deuce will be fine for 10 mins a game but it would probably be easier to play him with DDV also on the floor.

And tip o’ the cap to Grimes, going 3-4 for 10 points and 4 rebounds in 18 minutes. Exactly what he ought to do.

Don’t mean to be harsh but Deuce is not fine. He can do a whole lot of damage in a very short time. -10 in 7 minutes today. And I’m never going to forget Miami’s 10-0 run in the two minutes Brunson sat Game 6.

This is nothing there. Kick him to the curb and trade Fournier for a backup if Malachi isn’t good enough.

It’s one game for McBride. Give him some time. He hasn’t been getting consistent minutes for awhile.

So there’s 22 games until the All-Star break, which will bring us to the 55-game mark. seems like we have to go 14-8 to stay on a 48-win pace. A lot depends on how we fare in the 8 games against the Grizz, Pacers and Mavs.

I’m used to looking at the +/- at the end of the game and seeing more pluses among the bench players. Today it was the other way around. If the starting unit is the relatively better unit that won’t surprise me because the loss of Quickley in the 2nd unit is big and RJ to OG is monster in the other direction. I’d rather have a stronger starting 5 because that’s whose going to be playing more minutes, especially in the playoffs. I’m not sure who Rose has on his mind for using that Fournier contract, but if he can’t get a more major target, getting a PG that can score is an option. I like Deuce and maybe he deserves a chance, but we need more than we got tonight. He’s got a few weeks to make his case.

if Malachi isn’t good enough.

I’ve heard that he’s a matador that likes Swiss cheese, but I haven’t really seen him play.

Pretty crazy the Knicks now have a player who you can put on both Ant and KAT without worrying about having to send help.

By rules, does extending Deuce’s keep him out of trades for a period of time?
The contract is descending, a coveted trait in trades…

Here are the usg #s:

Randle 41.6
Brunson 26.2
DiVincenzo 22.8
Anunoby 15.3
Hart 11.4
Grimes 10.9

only one game but gonna take awhile to even out… and we’ll see where the numbers settle at but we’re are going to need more of the top 3 looking #s….

the mvp tho was ihart who annhilated 6 pts from the board by himself which proved to be the difference…. we’re going to need more of that too….

We actually need a high priced vet to replace Fournier’s critical salary. It should be fairly easy to trade Evan’s expiring for someone. Bill Simmons’ Clarkson idea was weird but makes sense. I like Rozier more bc he has one year and a team option, that gives us lots of flexibility. There’s probably more guys out there who fit the bill.

I think Grimes did a solid job of making himself an option, it would be a great plus if he became a more consistent contributor for the 2nd unit.

One name I’ve been thinking about is trading for Malcolm Brogdon, as he really doesn’t fit Portland’s timeline and he would help us immensely, the issue really is how expensive it would be and if he’s going to stay healthy. Maybe if they accept a first, Fournier + Flynn?

Yeah finding a decent guard for the bench to give them 10-15 mins of solid ball handling and 3pt shooting shouldn’t be difficult to acquire. But it would probably cost them a 2nd rd pick or if it’s a really decent player a protected 1st rd pick and considering some here still complain about the 1st rd pick traded for Hart not sure I want to rehash those same arguments again this year lol

Here’s a nuts idea.

Alex Burkes.

He played PG for us so he could be a decent back up PG option and would definitely give the second unit a scoring punch.

But it would probably cost them a 2nd rd pick or if it’s a really decent player a protected 1st rd pick

I’m thinking we can just use money.

I don’t like Clarkson, but the idea there is if we trade Evan for him we save Utah $28mm. If we trade Evan for Rozier we save the Hornets $25mm. That kind of money usually negates the need to throw in a first.

if you trade Fournier.. you can kiss the next big move goodbye without it gutting the team…

clarkson just got extended and he has 3 years left … i doubt he will be a target…. if it’s even works under the cap rules…

One name I’ve been thinking about is trading for Malcolm Brogdon, as he really doesn’t fit Portland’s timeline and he would help us immensely, the issue really is how expensive it would be and if he’s going to stay healthy. Maybe if they accept a first, Fournier + Flynn?

I’m with you Bruno, i really like Brogdon to replace Quick. And maybe he’d play the Celtics like Evan did during the first season. 😀

I would love for Brogdon to accept that role, but in his most recent 5 games he logged 37, 37, 30, 37 and 28 minutes. I don’t think he’d take to kindly to being a 10-15mpg backup.

Well, if we acquired Brogdon he’d be playing more than 10-15 minutes probably. He’s having an outstanding season in a prominent role for that odd duck Portland team. He’d be a great, great depth piece for us, as we’d be right back to having a 6moy type player on the bench.

If you can get him for Fournier and some other minor asset, that is a no brainer.

We definitely need a backup PG who can soak up some usage with the bench mob and not force us to play Brunson to exhaustion. But damn, the ball movement looked so pretty for so much of the game. It was mainly the Deuce stretch that was ugly.

The more I think about the trade, the more excited I get. I believe the Knicks have taken a huge step in doing the two things we all know they needed to do: find a legit starting 3 who can at least defend other 3s and shoot, and break up the Randle/RJ duo. Like most of us, I hate seeing IQ leave, but since he wanted starter money (and true starter minutes), this trade gives him a team to do that with. Also, the Knicks traded from a position of strength (surplus guards) to get a true SF that they really needed.

I think I’m kinda with Hubert (sup mane) – let’s give this team at least a month to see then fully incorporate OG, and to see if Grimes can fill some of the production IQ had without having to constantly guard the opponent’s best wing.

I think Brogdon could be sold on the idea of playing Quickley minutes, around 20-25 depending on match-up, but he might be expensive as other playoff teams are surely keeping tabs on him too.

Maybe the best way is to look for a stop gap guy, even Jordan McLaughlin who had some nice minutes today but hasn’t been playing much in Minnesota.

I watched the highlights- BACKDOOR CUTS!!! MOOR PLS!

And 23 assists on 39 baskets is not bad at all. I remember Riley used to consistently harp on that figure when he coached the Knicks.

“But damn, the ball movement looked so pretty for so much of the game. It was mainly the Deuce stretch that was ugly.”

Even the Brunson minutes looked pretty ugly when he wasn’t passing and exhausted for much of the 4th. There’s no way to sugar-coat 5-23 shooting. But Deuce looked unplayable tonight and Leon should definitely take notice.

I don’t think Brogdon could be had without including a top-notch draft asset or two…but if we can get him for say, Fournier and this year’s first (unprotected) you’d have to at least think about it…

if you trade Fournier.. you can kiss the next big move goodbye without it gutting the team…

This is probably the argument for Murray.

They can try to use Fournier plus picks for Murray. They’d get a good look at that lineup and if they don’t like it or a better option comes up later they can use Murray as part of the deal. I’m not sure if that’s even doable. The Hawks may want a good young player like Grimes back also. I’m not sure I like that deal anyway, but I agree that if we don’t do a star deal with Fournier now then we are ultimately talking about moving a player like Randle for salary. The other option is to keep Fournier for another year after this, but that’s almost sadistic.

Just for the record, Deuce did suck today.

But also for the record, Clarkson sucks. Demonic gunner who can’t hit the three (.295). Sportin’ a monster .506 TS% and a -4.7 BPM.

We may indeed need a backup point, but it’s not him. I mean, Deuce is 42.1%, .653, and 1.1.

That’s not to praise Miles (among other things, small sample size theater), but to slam Clarkson.

I can’t be the only one here with no dog in any of these CFP games and thus about to tune into the Raptors/Cavs game

I’d watch that raps/cavs game! I genuinely want IQ to do well and RJ too.

This could end up being one of those works out for both sides trades.

if you trade Fournier.. you can kiss the next big move goodbye without it gutting the team…

No, you just use the guy you traded Fournier for instead of Fournier.

I can’t be the only one here with no dog in any of these CFP games and thus about to tune into the Raptors/Cavs game

I have a slight dog in the Michigan/Alabama game because my wife’s family are all diehard Michigan fans. But it’s like a pomeranian. A puppy pomeranian.

I don’t know what’s up with Delon Wright this year but if he’s still the same guy I’d give Washington their Fugazi pick back for him.

Interesting question, if Knicks last May had OG and DDV instead of RJ and IQ do the Knicks beat the Heat?

Obviously biggest issue was Randle missing Game 1 and playing rest of the series on a bad ankle that needed surgery but I’m hoping that this year’s team while should finish with similar regular season record even without another move is better suited for the playoffs than last year.

If deuce has been practicing well I guess you give him a run of like 10 games or so and see what you got. Trade deadline is far enough away that you can try him and Flynn for a but if Bronson misses 2 games in a playoff series we look pretty boned right now

FWIW IQ took the first Toronto possession end to end and missed a layup (maybe fouled). Seconds later he hit his first 3 attempt. IQ wants to make a statement.

I have to believe both IQ and RJ are bummed to leave NYC bc, well, isn’t everyone?

I bet RJ is gonna be really confused when the Raptors act like IQ is better than him.

RJ is back home, pretty sure he’s happy to be back in Canada

IQ was never going to get his money here, but I think for sure he would rather be In NYC

Quickley is playing well and now playing alongside Schroeder. RJ didn’t do anything and was yanked.

RJ is back home, pretty sure he’s happy to be back in Canada

Nah. Toronto may be home but “going home” also carries a whiff of failure after being in NYC.

And, unlike Obi or even IQ, RJ can’t argue he didn’t get a chance to show out. I like the kid. He’s gonna be bummed for a while.

RJ path to success is the other 4 Players on the court need to be good shooters

Chris Fedor
@ChrisFedor
New Raptor Immanuel Quickley just picked up his fourth foul at the 5:41 mark of the second quarter

Yup. IQ was playing well but the fourth foul might keep him on the bench. RJ started meh and has played fairly meh except for a brief stretch when he scored twice by, wait for it, taking it to the rack. No clearly bone-head plays (yet). They’re both 3-5.

This also reminds me why I don’t want Mitchell. He’s an extraordinary basketball player and I’m not convinced he makes anyone he plays with better.

Hubs, it’s a bit of a gamble though to assume that if we traded for Dejonte some other team that is trading us a star next year would want him, right?

I don’t know. The Dejonte gambit seems dicey to me.

Without Mobley and Garland, hard to expect Spida to do more than he did in that half…

Not following you, Swifty. I’m anti-Dejounte for many reasons. Not the least of which I think Donte might be straight up better.

With Fournier, i’m just saying trade his expiring this year for a backup whose salary expires next year.

https://ripcityproject.com/posts/og-anunoby-blockbuster-new-malcolm-brogdon-trade-possibility-portland-trail-blazers

I don’t know how reliable this is, but some guy named Andrew Hanlon said this:

On the flip side, the Knicks now have to find a replacement sixth man and combo guard who’s able to manage minutes alongside a small scoring guard in Brunson.

Enter Brogdon, who’s not as talented as Quickley but would be a better fit with the Knicks as a bigger backcourt player who can defend the guards Brunson can’t. He can score when needed but is a better facilitator than Quickley has proven to be. He still gives coach Tom Thibodeau a 3-point shooting threat and is comfortable playing in the starting lineup or coming off the bench.

Brogdon wouldn’t cost the Knicks a ton, either. Reports say the 31-year-old Blazers guard is worth a protected first-round pick; if New York strikes out on the superstar they’re hoping to add, Evan Fournier’s expiring contract and a protected 2025 first-rounder should get a deal done.”

Ah, there’s the RJ brain fart — jump in the air and pass it to Mitchell for an easy fast break the other way. Four turnovers so far…

Man this raptors game is not making me miss RJ. Dumb pass with numbers in transition and can’t keep his feet in front on D. Even Quick’s floaters aren’t falling…

Brain farts aside, RJ’s numbers aren’t bad for this game. He has 19 points on six of twelve shooting with 9 rebounds and he made two key free throws to increase the lead to three with seven seconds left.

So Barrett, 19 and 9 on 6-12 shooting. The Raptor announcers LOVE him, and he looks natural. As do the 5 turnovers.

IQ 14 and 6 rebounds on 5-13 shooting. He looked lost and sad and unnatural in that goofy uniform, but that might just be me…

But they won.

– Tip o the cap to Knicks fan…

RJ with a solid finish, hit his last foul shouts and smart foul on Spyda to take the 3 off the table.

yep, weird watching quik play for the raptors…RJ looks like a perfect fit for them…

so glad he’s no longer a knick…

bucks/pacers are a interesting matchup…

-Zman

If the price for Brogdon is truly a protected first and Fournier, that would be a huge upgrade for us…

Some disarray today as everyone was adjusting to playing with new teammates, yet they still beat up one of the best teams in the association.

Thibs needs to figure out how to make the 2nd unit work. Even if it’s doable, it may take some tinkering over the next few weeks to come up with the right rotation and sets.

OG was everywhere on defense and it really freed up Donte to play the passing lanes.

Raven I watched that game and had the exact same thought. RJ looks natural in a raps uniform. He flamed out here but maybe going back home to Canada will do him well. IQ looked sad though. And it was weird seeing him in that uniform.

Could we sign him this summer as a free agent lol?

“If the price for Brogdon is truly a protected first and Fournier, that would be a huge upgrade for us…”

Agreed. We’d once again have one of the best benches in the NBA. And if Mitch actually does return this year….

-Strat

The other option is to keep Fournier for another year after this, but that’s almost sadistic.

The Knicks are Fournier’s moneypig and he just needs to get over the shame of being our kept Frenchman that we don’t let out on the court.

“Could we sign him this summer as a free agent lol?”

I believe there is a specific clause in the CBA that prohibits that…

Mavs getting their asses kicked by the Jazz and will be 19-15 after tonight

Maybe we get a nice pick from them this year?

“I believe there is a specific clause in the CBA that prohibits that…”

…although I have been unable to locate that clause…

Z-man, I think you’re thinking of the clause about how a player traded mid-season can’t re-sign with his original team during that same season. It was designed to prevent teams trading good players solely as salary cap filler, where everyone has a wink-wink ingredient that the new team will release that player so he can return to where he started.

We don’t have the cap room to bring back IQ, but there’s no rule against it.

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