[New York Post] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 15:00:00 GMT
Julius Randle has learned to ‘calm the f–k down’ with refs and it’s led to his ‘growth’
[New York Post] – Sun, 14 Jan 2024 03:48:00 GMT
- Jalen Brunson-less Knicks grind way past depleted Grizzlies
- KNICKS at GRIZZLIES | FULL GAME HIGHLIGHTS | January 13, 2024
- Knicks 106-94 Grizzlies (Jan 13, 2024) Game Recap
- Down to eight healthy players, Memphis Grizzlies fall apart in second half vs Knicks
- Scenes from an ugly 500th win for Thibs
[Posting and Toasting] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 12:00:00 GMT
- HoopsHype Knicks intel: Daniel Gafford, Dejounte Murray, Malcolm Brogdon…
- Knicks don’t need flashy deal, just one in Tom Thibodeau’s mold
- NBA Trade Deadline: Struggling Knicks bench needs more pop
- Does the Knicks second unit need an upgrade?
- Knicks inquired on Daniel Gafford
[Posting and Toasting] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 17:00:00 GMT
- Knicks Bulletin: Losing at Dallas, Mitchs return, shorthanded Grizzlies…
- Knicks know they have only themselves to blame for loss to Mavericks
- Josh Green set the tone early against the Knicks with his defensive pressure
- A few takeaways from the Knicks first loss of 2024
- Mavs’ Josh Green on Bringing Physicality vs. Jalen Brunson: ‘Our Job to Hit First’
[New York Post] – Sun, 14 Jan 2024 09:22:00 GMT
Tom Thibodeau talks Bill Belichick after snagging 500th career win
[Bleacher Report] – Sun, 14 Jan 2024 01:27:23 GMT
Knicks Insider Says NY ‘Got Rid of the Softies’ with Barrett, Quickley, Toppin Trades
[Daily Knicks] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 13:00:00 GMT
Knicks News: De’Aaron Fox’s disgraceful MSG take, latest on Dejounte Murray trade
[Sports Illustrated] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 19:58:16 GMT
Jazz Deal Kelly Olynyk to Knicks in NBA Mock Trade Ahead of Deadline
[Heavy.com] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 15:43:07 GMT
NBA Insider Hints At Knicks Landing $39 Million Forward
[Larry Brown Sports] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 19:10:35 GMT
Knicks open to trading 2-time All-Star?
[Heavy.com] – Sat, 13 Jan 2024 15:00:58 GMT
Paul Pierce Believes Knicks Will Reach Conference Finals on 1 Condition
73 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2024.01.14)”
Even worse than the Dallas stinker but winning was too important to spit on this ugly win.
Against a G-League team with only 9 active players (later 8) we were awful.
Only a handful of players had a good game (Deuce, Evil-DDV, I-Hart), others were meh bad did something good (OG, Original DDV, J-Hart, Grimes), one was bad (Achiuwa) and Randle reminded me how sad it the 21-22 season was, his “matador cardboard” defense made me scream at the TV more than once.
In the meantime Zach Lowe in his “9-things” called J-Hart “human fastbreak” and I feel robbed 😂
P.S. The minutes distribution was alarming, Malachi deserved a bit more and we need a backup center.
Glad to hear that at least Deuce looked good, even if there were concerns in the last thread about how he did or didn’t set up Randle.
The Malachi Flynn thing is odd. By all accounts, was terrific off the bench in the first half, and then got dungeoned in the second. I understand — even if I don’t in any way love — Thibs deciding he couldn’t trust Sims or Precious in a dogfight game. But Flynn played well enough, it seems, that he could have been used to give Deuce at least a short breather, no?
Last night was what I expected with Brunson out. I think Randle needs to just attack and pass out of double teams whenever Brunson is out so he can cut down the turnovers from trying to make plays for other guys. The thought process is fine in trying to make plays and get everyone involved if your Julius. But the way his game has been this season, he should just make plays off of his aggressiveness. But at the same time, the whole team probably was looking past Memphis. Still though, when Brunson is out- I’m ok with Randle looking for his shot more and letting guys fit around that. Nevertheless, I love this version of Randle we are seeing this season. He’s no longer playing like he thinks guys can’t stop him. He knows it and adjusts his game accordingly. This version of Randle should get a new contract.
Also, I think the team should probably ship Fournier to Detroit for Burks and Morris, then ship Flynn to Phoenix for a pick in lieu of a Brogdon trade. Oh and bring Taj back in some capacity whether it’s end of bench or on the coaching staff
That was like A Christmas Carol where the ghost of Christmas future shows us what life would be like without Brunson
Terrifying…
Terrible game to watch (especially after the previous stinker — professional athletes are supposed to learn from mistakes, right?). But it was way pleasurable to watch Deuce exceed my expectations (not my hopes, but I have boatloads of those).
One thing the Griz did was double Randle early, and sometimes triple him, and Julius was really unprepared for it (seemed unprepared for the game in general, try a different med combo next game please Ju!). He’d be almost invisible under a pile of Griz players with no clue where an open guy might be — and no surprise there were guys super open. Occurred multiple times. That just can’t happen.
Much as my only pleasure was derived from watching Miles, I agree Evil Donte deserved another five minutes. Deuce can handle it — he’s young, he’s super-strong, he might actually be unbreakable, but just to see if those early minutes by (checks spelling for Doogie’s sake) Malachi were fool’s gold or not.
FYI, yesterday Orlando was missing Franz Wagner (right ankle sprain), Wendell Carter Jr. (right knee tendinitis), Markelle Fultz (left knee injury maintenance), Gary Harris (right calf strain) and Joe Ingles (left ankle injury maintenance).
So I guess expect us to play badly again…
Flynn scared me on defense. He was fine on offense, but MAN was his defense BAD. Footwork off..a step slow..unaware…yikes! He never was a good defender, but I expected him to be better than that. I wonder- was it more because he hasn’t played, or is that his normal? Also..I wonder why Sims didn’t get any time since Achiuwa was ineffective? I didn’t like seeing Hartenstein play so many minutes even though we needed every minute of his effort.
So I guess expect us to play badly again…
A couple of days ago I chided Swifty because he was disappointed Doncic was out. But…just maybe…he has a point in wanting to play teams at full strength.
Woj: “The Pistons and Wizards are finalizing a deal to trade Marvin Bagley, Isaiah Livers, and two second-round picks for forwards Danilo Gallinari and Mike Muscala, sources tell ESPN.”
How is Troy Weaver still employed?
I bet we are still very much involved in the Murray sweepstakes. We need another distributor to help Jalen, and even though Deuce is awesome in many ways, he’s not that guy. And if that trade happens, Grimes is as good as gone.
The Sims in Jail thing does make me mad. Against two undersized teams filled with scrubs, getting him some minutes to spare iHart — and see how Sims handles himself — seems more than sensible.
Still not sold on Precious (has anyone actually seen him jump?).
Maybe Sims isn’t in jail but still isn’t 100 percent? I know it’s easy to immediately jump to Thibs must be punishing someone when they don’t play but it could be something else.
Playing iHart 24 minutes straight is unacceptable. It was Thibs 101 — treat a January game against a G-League Grizzlies team like it’s Game 7 of the Finals. Well it’s not. If giving iHart a 6 minute break costs us the game then so be it.
If he gets seriously hurt, the season is over.
I have mixed feelings about Thibs playing iHart and Deuce the entire second half. Maybe it’s a motivational technique to let the scrubs know that you have to pick it up to get playing time. OTOH, I agree with Oakman that it is not conducive to iHart staying healthy.
But I think that at the end of the day, concerns over healthy players playing big minutes are probably overblown. It’s more about players showing fatigue at the end of games…and clearly those two still had a lot left in the tank.
Oakman,Z—agree with you both: Oak, losing iHart means we are toast so let’s protect against that happening even if it means we lose some games as a result; Z-man in that iHart played 82 games last season so he is the last player you consider load managing.
Clueless about what the right balance should but given Thibs is the coach, his view of balance may be “what is that?”
Alan, apparently the Detroit Washington deal
Is mostly about getting rid of Bagley’s $12.5 salary for next season. They have plenty of centers so losing him is ok for Detroit. Everyone else in the deal is an expiring contract and it gives the Pistons a little more outside shooting. It’s not as horrible as it sounds at first, but it’s still kind of being done to fix past mistakes by Weaver (too many centers). Washington is getting two second picks to take on the salary of Bagley, but I doubt they will end up being very helpful to them.
i absolutely love how julius explained the situation with the refs and how he’s learning/trying to “calm the fuck down”…
i love that combo of anxiety and anger – even when you are trying to move away from anger and anxiety…you’ll get it julius, you may be retired by that time, but you’ll get it…
wouldn’t trade julius for anyone…
I get the motivation for the Detroit trade, Knick Fan. I’m referring more to how Weaver got here where he needed to attach draft picks to get rid of a guy he probably shouldn’t have traded for and definitely shouldn’t have re-signed.
Leon has had to do that, too. But he’s also made lots of smart acquisitions, where Detroit is pretty barren other than Cade.
I think this gives them room for 2 max or near max deals this offseason. Maybe they try jumpstarting their rebuild a la Houston
A lot of strange analysis on this site. Especially about Deuce. Like, “He’s a small wing.” Well, he may not be prime CP3 yet but that’s a prototypical point guard’s game. He dribbles. A lot. Gets to the hoop. Facilitates. Dishes. Plus the threes and six rebounds. He may not be good enough to start but I’d say the quality minutes plus the money bag means he’s earned that spot for the time being.
Yes, the Malachi thing is odd. He had the steal for the layup and the team barely seemed to acknowledge. At least on the feed I was watching. He blew a defensive assignment and IHart glared at him. He killed it in his minutes. I’m not mad a Thibs for doing what he had to to win, though. This was a classic trap game so kudos, fellas.
The major difference between OG and RJ is the amount of time they dominate the ball. RJ seems to take more time setting his feet than OG does on drives. OG just makes a decision and goes. You might not even know he’s out there. He’s perfect next to Julius.
Interesting Danvt. First, yeah, Deuce ain’t a small wing. He’s a mediocre point guard with some slowly growing skills.
Second, on your last point, I was amused to see that OG’s line last night was very RJ-like (18 pts on 15 shots, 4 turnovers). Yet it was so much less painful to watch, partly for the reason you mention (less time futzing with the ball, doing stupid stuff in slo-mo — even when OG screws up it’s quick and over almost before you know it). Also OG actually plays defense, which makes up for a lot. Four blocked shots is not an RJ line.
I don’t know, it sounds pretty horrible. Why do the Piston’s need to get rid of one year, $12.5MM so badly that they’re willing to give up two of their own incredibly valuable second round picks? They plan on bringing in some superstars or something? Unless there’s top 40 protections on those picks, this seems incredibly foolish.
Deuce can play, and deserves a spot in the rotation, but we still need an additional facilitator who can put some pressure on the rim. That’s not really Deuce’s thing. On that second unit there just isn’t enough shot creation.
If you had to send out Grimey in a trade for Dejounte, that probably woudn’t be the end of the world because you could just use Dejounte as that bench unit facilitator and slide McBride to the Grimey role– POA defender who can knock down some perimeter shots and also give you a bit of secondary playmaking.
What does everybody think about Dejounte’s contract? After this year he has something like a 4/125 extension on his deal, so you worry about that becoming an albatross contract. If you think he’s going to hold some of that value, and that you could possibly move him again in another deal, then a trade for him makes a lot more sense. That deal covers his age 28-31 seasons. It’s not a $50M mega max contract, so maybe you could move that again if you so desired.
What if we all got this Dejounte thing wrong and instead of him being the big name Leon is pursuing, he’s actually a salary dump/buy low candidate?
I am beginning to think Atlanta might be happy to get Evan Fournier and the two protected firsts for him.
Also beginning to think Murray would be the 6th man.
I’m guessing this is a prelude to Detroit moving Bojan for pick compensation worth more than two 2nds. So this lets them keep a vet stretch 4 in Gallo to replace Bojan.
Or maybe they try and flip Gallo at the deadline too
DJM’s contract is concerning in that he’s not really a starting 2 so you’d be locked into starter money for someone essentially in IQ’s role who might not even be as good as IQ. You’d essentially be taking on ATL’s failed experiment and hoping that the same experiment wouldn’t fail here. I don’t think it’s a risk worth taking. But if it actually did happen, it could work out…if DJM’s 3pt shooting is for real and his defense is still capable of being as good as it was back in SA. So if they do it, I’d be skeptical but not outraged.
Dejounte is still a plus player despite being a giant disappointment, he has a 1.1 EPM with a 1.5 EPM on offense. He’s shooting probably falls off and lowers his EPM, but that could be offset by an increase in assists if you slot him next to a less ball dominant guard than Trae (or a different team could slide him back to PG).
I don’t think that deal could even qualify as a true albatross anymore. I don’t want it on the books and it could definitely mess stuff up, but it’s not max money. It’s barely half of KAT’s deal.
I love Deuce…his grittiness, his demeanor, his interviews, etc. But he’s going to have to show me a lot more than a couple of good games (especially vs. G-League-teams like POR and MEM) for me to feel confident in his prospects vs. good teams. But I’m really happy to see him get a bonafide shot.
“He’s shooting probably falls off and lowers his EPM, but that could be offset by an increase in assists if you slot him next to a less ball dominant guard than Trae (or a different team could slide him back to PG).”
But that’s the issue…Brunson at a 29% usage is actually very ball-dominant, only slightly below Trae’s 31%. So I don’t see how it works out any better here than it did there, but I suppose it could. It just seems like DDV has great chemistry with Brunson right now so why risk it on a long, expensive contract like DJM’s, especially at the cost of assets?
I think the Pistons are tired of losing based on what I’ve been reading.
They have a few promising young players (Cunningham, Ivey, Duran) and a couple of youngsters where it’s too early to tell. They should get another very good prospect this year.
They can keep tanking for God knows how long without striking gold or they can try to add some veteran players that can help develop the youngsters, teach them how to be pros, and win some games next year.
They’ll have a ton of cap space next year. They are probably hoping to land a couple of high level players. I doubt they will given how bad they are. But if they give out 1 year contracts or 2 year contracts with a team option, they may be able to bring in some good vets without damaging long term flexibility. Then they’ll start winning some more games and be able to make more serious moves a year or two later as the kids are getting good and the space is opening up again.
I wonder if DET would be interested in Zach LaVine…
The more you look at trade possibilities that are not the final all in on a superstar move the more a trade for Malcolm Brogdon seems perfect.
Yup. And the part where he hates the celtics is a nice bonus.
Raven, I don’t know how you came up with “mediocre” as a descriptor. He’s been a revelation since the trade and really that’s the only sample size that really matters. Not what he did as a third stringer in garbage time. Who does he really look like out there? It’s the guy he needs to replace, Quickly. I think the staff has to be over the moon at how that transition has gone so far. No to Brogdon. No to Murray.
I like Deuce but in no way does he look anything like IQ out there. Even now as he’s very confident shooting 3pters you still can’t compare him to IQ. Brogdon is exactly the type of guard this current roster needs and seems like acquiring him shouldn’t cost too much.
Well, I’m with you on no to Murray, and really no to Brogdon too (maybe). “Mediocre” was more along the lines of Z–man’s tendency to say wait and see, and a reflection that “good” is mostly reserved for starting point guards (and a few resplendent backups). You’re right he’s a revelation. If he can keep it up I’ll happily eat my mediocre.
He dribbles a lot, but doesn’t get to the hoop against good defenses. He facilitates, but he doesn’t break down defenses and create easy buckets for teammates. Seems pretty obvious to me that he has a long way to go to be a lead guard. If he weren’t making 3s, he’d be a liability on offense. But he is, and his D is solid, so he’s fine for the moment.
I looked at a Pistons Blog. The fans hate the trade, mostly because of what Alan said; they are pissed about the whole Bagley story. Apparently they traded two second round picks to get him, then overpaid him (which I remember being an obvious overpay at the time), and now used two second round picks to get rid of him, making it a waste of four second round picks overall. They mostly figure this trade was made as preliminary to something else and are very afraid of the something else.
I think probably what Detroit is hoping to do is what Houston did. That is, get another good pick and then fill the holes with free agents in the off season. But doing it well takes a certain amount of smarts that I’m not sure they have.
I don’t think Deuce creates advantages for his teammates. He found Hartenstein on a nice PnR last, but that’s one of the only times that come to mind.
Playing 38min to put up 5asts to 3TOs against non-rotation players doesn’t sell me on him as a PG. The Knicks had a 106.4 ORtg with him in, Portland is last this season and they have a 106.8 ORtg.
Through the last 7 games (still a small sample of course) he’s at a 101.8 ORtg despite a personal 62.7 TS% on 20.4% usage. The one outlier was the 140 he put up against Philly, but even that took he and Grimes scorching the nets.
So most of the time when he’s out there the offense stalls out other than those 2 shooting. And a lot of Grimes 3s are stepbacks or coming off a curl/pin down rather than Deuce drawing the defense in with his drives.
go packers…
I wrote this before. There’s a reason Thibs kept Deuce on the roster. What Deuce needs is decisiveness. He has to learn to read and attack the defense quicker. I hope he will figure it out the same way Quick did last year around mid-season.
count me in with the current hive mind of thinking – we need a back up for isaiah…
i’d really like to see deuce get a shot at being our backup point, good looking shot, good defense – he really needs though to create more for others…
we had a lot of turnovers last game, 20 something i think…not gonna win too often doing that…
jalen will most likely be back monday…i hope we get back to playing well…starting the game off well…
The DJM contract continues to scare me because he’s simply not a very good scorer, which necessarily places a cap on how many teams will be interested in him, and his contract, at any given time.
He’s absolutely talented in other ways which is why we’re even talking about this, but if/when the shooting falls off you’re looking at a guy you basically have to build lineups around and it’s not at all clear to me he’s good enough to justify that.
I’m not 100% sold on him being an albatross—he’s a young, good player at the end of the day and I’ve said before it’s nearly impossible to overpay anyone who fits that description. I’d just rather make a smaller investment in a more “normal,” adaptable player like Brogdon.
Dunno about this, I think the next time I see Deuce McBride get to the hoop in the NBA will be the first.
Knickerblogger = “A lot of strange analysis on this site.”
well said indeed dan…i may have asked this before, in which case, sorry – have you ever been inside that bookstore in the small town you live by?
DJM is actually a nice complement to Brunson, who isn’t an our PG, and with Deuce on the 2nd unit. This would also make Grimes expendable.
The real key is can Thibs unlock the defense DJM has shown in the past… I have no idea.
But if he can keep hitting threes and return to his old defensive form, he’s actually a nice fit, and he’s significantly younger than Brogdon.
Isn’t a “real” PG
Dear Noble:
https://www.nba.com/watch/video/deuce-mcbride-drives-baseline-for-the-layup
Dear Noble, 45 second mark:
https://www.nba.com/knicks/videos/highlights-miles-mcbride-18-pts-4-3pm-knicks-at-trail-blazers
I put $$ on the Cowboys thinking this would finally be the year they don’t shit the bed in the playoffs
Oops…
Cowboys getting owned
Rodgers better come back and help the jets becusse the packers look just fine and have a solid young qb
Any willing to take the future prediction that Bill belicheck wil, be the next cowboys coach
I’d wager money on that right now
Dear Noble, my favorite one, from last night, 5 minute mark of the video:
https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=Knicks+grizzlies+video+January+2024&mid=41DE2BA5459522A9888F41DE2BA5459522A9888F&FORM=VIRE
You know I have a very hard time believing a brand new poster just randomly showed up and now has so much to say about everything.
Maybe E isn’t away after all.
I love that Raven went through the trouble to find 3 instances of Deuce getting to the basket. But just because those exist, Noble’s larger point is not refuted…that he is extremely limited in that regard. Might he get better with some reps? Maybe, but it is coming at the risk of a) burning Brunson out and b) not having a suitable backup in the playoffs.
The trade deadline is in less than a month, so you don’t want to invest too much in the “hope” of Deuce. He has to perform, like, now. I guess so far, so good, but only if we turn a blind eye to the ORtg stuff that EB posted…and to the quality of the recent competition we have faced, with more relative creampuffs ahead. I do have some concerns that while we are auditioning him, Brogdon will get snatched up.
But if the worst case scenario is that we get trigger shy and roll with Deuce, and he just doesn’t cut it, then there will probably be a better than either Deuce or Flynn but not great option available on the waiver wire. Or alternatively, maybe we find a creating type at another position. Or maybe after the deadline, Grimes or DDV gets banged up and Thibs gives Fournier another shot and he clicks with the second unit. And it is not outside the realm of impossibility that Flynn improves his D just enough to be playable. The kid can score.
I just felt bad for Noble…
With respect to DJM, it’s not clear to me that he is even having a better season than DDV is. Acquisition cost aside, – I’m not sure that we should disrupt backcourt’s on and off the court chemistry for the remainder of the season, especially, since I’m not convinced that DJM adds anything that DDV doesn’t.
Meanwhile, Josh Hart has not looked like an $18-21M player thus far this year. He needs to step it up…not to his unsustainable 2023 numbers but at least to where he’s not an offensive liability. Right now he’s looking more like salary filler in a big trade than a core piece.
https://twitter.com/_analyKnicks/status/1746361443388182613/photo/1
DDV contract could turn into a steal,- if he keeps this up.
In other words, what exact problem does DJM solve with the our starting unit? – Don’t tell me it’s wise to trade away two 1st RPs and pay 5yr – $135m+ for a reserve.
I don’t understand why Milwaukee fouled Fox on purpose, up 3, with 10 to play. Is that really sound mathematical strategy? (I certainly did t work out).
I recall that some folks being concerned that the DDV deal was an overpay on the basis of him being a bench player, probably the 8th or 9th man in the rotation, who was going to cannibalize minutes away from IQ and Grimes. The rebuttal was largely that a) when you have an opportunity to sign “good” players to “good” deals with nothing going out, you do it and b) that he was insurance at the 2 in case one or both of IQ and Grimes had to go out in a trade.
As it has turned out, he has been much more than that, and if he keeps it up (hardly a guarantee) he will be on one of the best non-rookie deals of any starter in the NBA. The 3pt shooting is probably going to regress, but how far? He is certainly presenting like a 40% shooter. But the other facets of the game…defense, rebounding, passing…seem pretty sustainable. I wonder if playing for the Warriors had an impact on his confidence and mindset. He had a lousy playoff run, was that something that motivated him over the offseason? Will playing with Brunson help him be more confident in the playoffs this time?
DAME TIME
Well… I guess it kind of worked.
rooting against the bucks, but that was one heck of a nice shot from distance…
Lillard is still ridiculous in the clutch.
“Lillard is still ridiculous in the clutch.”
Ironically, he missed two critical 3’s in the final minute of OT prior to the game-winner, almost sealing the game for the Kings.
That’s the play I was thinking about. Don’t tell me IQ had that lefty finish at the same stage. The kid is good and has the ability to run the team in Jalen’s absence. If he falls off, I’ll swallow my “not mediocre” but, in the meantime, save your bullets for Donovan Mitchell, Leon
Good for the Lions.
Yes, Geo! And legal cannabis. Though I travel to Mass where the prices are better. Come say hey any time.
i swear to you dan, back in the day when i was working – i spent soooooooo much time at my desk looking through those photos of the bookstore and imagining myself there…
it just looks so friendly and comfortable inside…i love the wood look…
WHAT!!! ya got access to that legal wacky weed 🙂
nice, any faves on your menu there?
i do a combo of both edibles (chocolates and gummies) and flower…flower wise i go with the infused pre-roll joints and blunts…i gave up on rolling my own a while ago…
don’t do bongs/water pipes/percolators anymore cause they just stay dirty…and provide a very clear reminder as to what the inside of my lungs must look like (completely coated in oil)…
occassionally i’ll bust out a wood long stem pipe to puff on some hash…i like mixing both bubble hash and traditional hash together with some “moon rocks”…
had a chance this morning to go pick up these nice one inch square 100mg chocolates, in sugar-free versions to boot…they were out of stock on those for a month or so…i noticed i smoked a whole lot more without those chocolates…
one thing is for sure, smoking weed costs a lot more than eating weed…
stopped taking a daily anxiety med (zoloft) a while ago, it just wasn’t having an prolonged affect for myself…i will say though – pharmaceuticals are most definitely cheaper than weed…
edit: i’m getting closer to travel ready as far as both health and resources…it would be a dream to visit yourself and the area you were wise enough to settle in…
https://twitter.com/SportsandMath1/status/1746570697961291878
Happy 2024….#1 in the entire NBA in Rebounds, Blocks and Steals?
8th best player in the league over a two week span?
WTF!!!!!
ha, isaiah’s such a surprise – they don’t even have an avatar for him…