Categories
Game Thread

2023-24 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Bulls (ABC Primetime Opener, which is kind of a thing)

The new-look Knicks are enough of a draw (and, let’s face it, nostalgia for the 1990s Knicks/Bulls series) that they have been moved to be the ABC Primetime game tonight, which is a really cool thing for the Knicks. I mean, it doesn’t really mean anything, but it’s still cool!

The Bulls are playing with a very thin roster, and so they’ve turned to defense to carry them through, and their D has been very good.

Luckily, Good D/bad O is a perfect matchup for the Knicks, as they try to build on their huge win against Minnesota by starting a nice winning streak.

Let’s go, Knicks!

197 replies on “2023-24 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Bulls (ABC Primetime Opener, which is kind of a thing)”

I asked a *lot* of questions!: Brandon? Bogdan? Bojan? Boban? Brogdon? Brogdan? Brojan? Burksan? Bueller? Bueller? Bueller?

Bogadan

waiting for my food…they’ve just recently changed ownership…hoping they maintained the same recipes…

I believe so, I see a bunch of them still training in the back…

fooooood fooooood…

and now, sitting here laughing about bogadan…

wow, they’ve really cleaned this place up nice…never realized just how dingy the place was before…a lot less clutter on the walls…foooooood…

Meanwhile, my son just pointed out to me that Joel Embiid is averaging 34.8 ppg, which translates to 36.8 pts per 36. For comparison, Wilt averaged 37.4 pts per 36 in his 50.4 per game season.

Phenomenal.

So the Bulls are kind of good now?

I watched much of the game against Philly last night. The Bulls looked miserable on both ends of the floor. I hope to witness the same tonight 😂😂😂

wow, they’ve really cleaned this place up nice…never realized just how dingy the place was before…a lot less clutter on the walls…foooooood…

Not a good sign. The best food comes from the most rundown, hole in the wall shops.

I predicted 50 wins, and I’ll stick with it even though Mitch went down. Mitch is worth 6 wins in my book, but increased playing time for iHart mitigates that somewhat to 4 fewer wins. I think OG is worth maybe 6 more wins than RJ, but losing IQ is probably 5 fewer wins.

Point being that the real issue remains losing Quick. If we had him AND Mitch and OG I’d be at 54 wins. Pretty close to contender.

But we don’t have Quick… So we need a move to get back to 50.

Ok, that was way too baroque. I just mean that the net of all that’s happened still leaves us short of my prediction, but only because we aren’t done yet and surely will make another move.

Don’t scare me EB. I so desperately need this to be everything I’ve imagined over thr last couple of days.

I just received my food, and the world is right once more.

I don’t believe in jinxes, so I’ll say right here the Knicks really haven’t had any bad losses this year (the Jazz have actually played well lately)

Please don’t hate me 😁

I actually like Ruocco, he’s excellent when he fills in for Michael Kay on Yes for Yankees games.

I don’t believe in jinxes, so I’ll say right here the Knicks really haven’t had any bad losses this year (the Jazz have actually played well lately)

Please don’t hate me 😁

Everybody revise your predictions down 1

I do miss having Quickley to look forward to. The Precious Achiuwa anticipation doesn’t do it for me.

What’s up with Brunson’s TOs these days?

Meanwhile Coby White is not supposed to be good but somehow always plays well against us

How many of us KNEW we wouldn’t get a shot off at the end of the quarter…

Lots of growing pains so far… looks like they’re trying to move the ball more but struggling to connect.

Went to NBA.com to check the stats and saw 1) SGA and Hali named players of the week and 2) RJ and Quick having good games in Toronto. Ouch.

Right now we’re looking at the problem, but let’s get Deuce scoring 10/game consistently plus Grimes.

When washed as hell DeRozan is hitting multiple threes against you, what can you really do?

Even playing with the scrub squad Julius really has to pass out of those double teams

Feels like one of OG or Donte should be in with that 2nd unit. I think this will look a lot better in a couple weeks either way. Still not sure it’ll be good

I’ve never seen a guard be this allergic to the paint like McBride is, Jesus christ… well, since Ntilikina I guess.

I’ve seen some Raptors fan say that watching Achiuwa feels like watching someone who just woke up today with this body and has no idea how to move in it, and damn that’s an accurate description.

I think my favorite bit of irony is the guys are trying to do stuff they don’t normally do, which is exactly what they should be doing, except so far they suck at it.

Donte might need the demotion/promotion to full time 6th man

That was my suggestion also. They need more scoring in the 2nd unit. Grimes will up his usage as a starter a little without RJ in there.

The 2nd unit got killed again.

I think my favorite bit of irony is the guys are trying to do stuff they don’t normally do,

Mine is the part where you guys were dicks to djphan all day and now you have to watch us miserably struggle to replace the USG we sent out in the OG trade 🙂

It’s like ray-ee-ain…. On your wedding day…
It’s a free ride… when you already paid…

Bright side: we got our 13/game turnovers out of the way early, so 2nd half should be tight.

One of the ABC guys said that Knicks put up one of the worst passing halfs they’ve seen all year. I concur.

I wonder it the Griz are having buyers remorse re: swapping our Dillon Brooks for Marcus Smart…

Do not demote Donte. Starting your best players is a thing.

The 2nd unit can’t score well enough as current constructed. The only scorer on the court is Randle. Double him with no help and we already know what we are going to get, bad shots and TOs. This is the 2nd night they got killed. That used to be our plus unit. It’s better to have a better starting unit, but we can’t allow the bench to get killed.

RJ wouldn’t have kicked out on that drive to the open DDV, he’d have forced a terrible shot.

RJ wouldn’t have made that corner 3, he’d have bricked it

I wonder it the Griz are having buyers remorse re: swapping our Dillon Brooks for Marcus Smart…

That team has had more key injuries than any team in the NBA and Morant missed a ton of games.

They are going to have to make another trade to help out that 2nd unit. I’m sure Thibs and Rose know that.

I’d like to reiterate my interest in acquiring Caruso. He’s probably off the table or too expensive now though

The stats speak for themselves but it also feels like Randle is doing a lot less dumb stuff these days. I find myself trusting him with the ball more.

We would be sooooooo screwed without Donte.

The Bulls are a dumb franchise and them playing well recently might make them not trade the guys they should

The 2nd unit can’t score well enough as current constructed.

You’re absolutely correct… but it’s fine. Most NBA teams have bad second units and they don’t mess with the starting lineup to fix it. Donte’s arguably our 3rd best player. Do not bench him. Take the lumps.

Wow. Randle, man. Those last two finishes. And iHart is having a monster game.

The idea would be to “demote” Donte but raise his usage, and probably his minutes too. It’s probably moot though, seems like he’ll get all he can handle as is.

I do miss having a reliable bench, but OG is chrome and leather (ht JK47).

What we should do with Donte — and it looks like Thibs is doing it tonight — is just play him more. He only played 24 mins vs Minnesota. He’s already at 25 now.

Move him up to 32 mpg and he’ll have plenty of time on the 2nd unit.

Thibs is just going to play the starters 44 minutes a night

Exactly this. Someone must step up. I mean Grimes is/was “untouchable” and he’s a ghost now. Maybe having routine minutes and responsibilities will help.

EDIT: Grimes on cue.

I understand missing the old second unit but I really like not being pissed off 9 mins into the 3Q when one of our best players still hasn’t gotten into the game.

You’re all right that it’s a problem,
but work the waiver wire or make a minor trade to fix it.

Jeez, I step away for a bit and iHart has 16 rebounds and 5 blocks.

this is why I wanted to try to get Drummond he’s going to be rebounding when he’s 60

Losing to DeRozan and Coby White hitting all of their 3s is a top 5 most annoying reason to lose a game in the 2024 NBA.

Drummond seems incredibly difficult to play against for a guy who has bounced around the league so much

OG looking around MSG after that dunk. ~ never heard that roar before. Hahaha.

OG got the deflection for that fast break dunk, then forced DeRozan to pass to Ayo for a clanked 3, then scraped up that loose ball for a dunk.

Leon needs to make another trade otherwise Thibs will kill the starting lineup.

Alright for the first time I’m a little worried iHart’s EB rights won’t be enough

mitch is what – 15 million a year, give isaiah 16 million and let mitch back him up…

The problem is we can’t go above $15M or so

I was about to say why is Randle dribbling one on one against Caruso from the 3pt line lol

Our defense in the 4th has really, really picked it up… it’s almost as if defense is important too and Anunoby is a premier All NBA type of guy at that.

I was about to say why is Randle dribbling one on one against Caruso from the 3pt line lol

Right?!

So our defense got better, our starting lineup got better and our bench got worse

I’ll take that trade off.

Good defense is sometimes hard to see, but OG’s is so obviously excellent and visibly so.

We could definitely use a bench guy but so far redistributing the RJ shots among everyone else seems to be working out just fine. Way easier to scour the market for some bench scoring than for an OG.

Leon Rose really should be calling Portland right now and negotiating a price for Malcolm Brogdon, he would fit this team like a fine silk glove.

Well, took care of business against a mediocre team. But the bench issues are going to be a problem

The ABC guys really have no idea what this team is about. Get paid to say stuff that has no value at all… This is a defensive team, Thibs is a defensive coach, the offense has never been good but they try hard, etc etc. Guys, it’s not that hard to look up some basic numbers… But I guess changing the narrative is tough.

It’s going to be hard to keep Mitch and I-Hart. I’m starting to think the correct move may be to pay I-Hart, keep him and use Mitch as an asset in a trade. I’ve said it a few times already, but if Mitch is your starter you HAVE TO have a good backup because he gets hurt too often. We are lucky we have I-Hart. Mitch is also vulnerable to “hack a Mitch” down the stretch in the playoffs and may become unplayable. If we make a big deal, we are going to have send salary out. Mitch may be the young guy that can help entice a team to make a deal.

Brunson with our only double digit assists games two games in a row

I’ll give you one hint why he’s piling up assists

Starts with R ends with J

The ABC guys really have no idea what this team is about. Get paid to say stuff that has no value at all… This is a defensive team, Thibs is a defensive coach, the offense has never been good but they try hard, etc etc. Guys, it’s not that hard to look up some basic numbers… But I guess changing the narrative is tough.

They are unwatchable unless you laugh at them. Otherwise you’ll start thinking about how much these guys get paid to know less than many fans.

If Hartenstein keeps playing this well for the rest of the season, I do think there’s some merit to the idea of doing what the Celtics did trading Rob Williams with Mitch, yeah… it would hurt because I love the guy, and let’s wait a bit to think about this to see if Hartenstein consistently performs at this level against top competition, but it’s an idea to keep in mind.

I wish it was possible to isolate how much having OG on the court instead of RJ is helping Brunson and Randle. When OG is standing in the corner, the defender is not right on him, but I’m sure he’s more worried about OG than RJ.

Over the next few games I hope they slowly start trying to incorporate OG into the offense a little more or he’s not going to be happy. He wanted to be used more on offense in Toronto. So he won’t be happy with less here. That’s on Randle, Brunson and Thibs. They have to get the balance right. We don’t need or even want to become dependent on Brunson and Randle giving us 30+ each every night.

It’s difficult not to have the thought of trading Mitch in the back of your mind, but I don’t want to acknowledge it. Hard enough losing Quick.

Besides, a lot of possibilities over the next month – this is very clearly not the finished product. More to come by the deadline, probably; Leon is probably thinking they are one piece away, and he may be right.

If you want to keep iHart you pretty much have to hope that Mitch is indeed done for the season. It is clear that iHart has become a quality starter in this league. Like IQ, he’s not going to want to go back to being a backup, at least that’s the way I see it.

That 65-45 second half says it all. The second unit is the only issue. The Knicks gave a contract to Deuce because they view him as a backup PG, but it does not seem to be working right now. He cannot run the second unit. He is a worse version of what IQ was in 2022 when he was dribbling, dribbling and did not know what to do. IQ eventually figured it out. I hope Deuce does the same. The second unit is stuck in the mud at the moment. Unless they figure it out, Thibs will have to run the starters into the ground. He has no choice.

There were some stretches in there where the defense looked pretty ferocious. We really need to stay healthy because our depth is nonexistent but man does it make a huge difference having a bona fide defensive ace.

Duece can’t run an offense and never will

Flynn wasn’t good , but I think he gets a chance the minute he is able to play..maybe a change of scenery will help

I’m just not seeing it with Deuce, which hurts to say because I love his toughness and hoped he would develop his offensive game. But alas…

I watched some Malachi Flynn highlights and he definitely has some creation abilities, but he’s not the answer either.

ihart is hakeem olajuwon….

the offense has been about as suspected.. but it’s really the defense and OG has some to do with it… but like 90% of it is ihart.. probably the best two game performance i have seen in awhile… really a virtuoso performance even taking into account the entire nba…

dunno how long this lasts but enjoy it while it does…

Two things I hart can do that mitch can’t

Run offense at times through him- has pasing skills

Make free throws – not excellenct, about 70%, but not a total non factor like mitch. Don’t think hack of I hart would happen

“…but man does it make a huge difference having a bona fide defensive ace.”

It was clear that he bothered DeRozan tremendously, same as last game with Anthony Edwards. I know Caruso is a great defender, but Randle went right through him. OG’s size/strength/wingspan/mobility make him pretty unique.

I get the drop off on offense for the 2nd unit, but Grimes, Hart, and Deuce are supposed to be plus defenders, no? They looked terrible on both sides of the ball. I hope that’s just growing pains.

FWIW Thibs used Hart instead of Devo to finish with the starters, basically all of Q4, so maybe there’s a swap there.

Deuce’s contract is very small, 3 for 12 million or something. Not a big issue. They will take a look at him as backup PG in January. They are not in a rush. After Mitch went down, the center position weakened significantly, and they don’t anticipate a deep run in the post season this year. IHart has played exceptionally well as a starter though.

With 10, 20 and 5 iHart joins Camby, someone named John Gianelli and of course Ewing as the only Knicks to accomplish that feat in a game. Ewing did it 12 times!

Thibs used Hart instead of Devo to finish with the starters

Yeah, OG and Hart finishing was a type of clamping down D we have not seen in a very-very long time. The Bulls didn’t know what to do. 😂

“…someone named John Gianelli”

Sadly I’m old enough to remember him…he sucked! But he did get a ring while playing some garbage time minutes on the ’72-’73 championship team.

Deuce could fit well next to Brogdon or Murray as a 3&D type. He shouldn’t be running the offense too much.

I’m thinking Sims gets his job back, not that it’d make a huge difference.

They need more practices together to gel.

Maybe we can convince the Wizards to trade us Tyus Jones?

More of a traditional PG than a shot creator and he’s starting for them, so he might not be happy to go back to being a bench player like he was in Memphis, but he’s been very good and the Wizards are going nowhere anyway, so it would make sense for them to sell high.

Spolestra is running circles around Darvin ham

Even lebron looks bad

With Duncan Robinson playing big minutes and helping now..I’m convinced he could make fornier a positive impact player

Quick with 26 points. We’re going to regret how we handled him. It wouldn’t hurt so badly if it had made sense.

You guys like basketball, so I highly recommend the Kings v Magic game. Good offense beating good defense is the best the NBA has to offer. These guys are actually earning their many points.

13 ties, 22 lean changes is fun.

Some guy named “Queen” tried to go through a Sabonis screen instead of around it. I think he may have died.

I was hoping Banchero would hit that last shot to force triple OT, wasn’t ready for this one to end.

Sorry to hijack the thread (Banchero v Monk shoot-out opener, kind of a thing). Sometimes I feel bad for you east coasters and Europeans out there, there’s some good after-hours basketball every now and then.

Watching this bench unit try to score reminds me of a thought exercise we used to do back in the Dave Berri days, which goes like this: what would happen if you assembled a team of the kind of low usage players who rack up high WP48 scores. All five guys are Tyson Chandler/Ronnie Brewer/Landry Fields type players. How would that team of WP48 All Stars fare in a real game?

Well, now we know the answer.

Deuce’s contract is very small, 3 for 12 million or something. Not a big issue. They will take a look at him as backup PG in January.

But it’s like throwing your wallet out the window and saying, “What’s the big deal? I only had $60 in it.”

They didn’t have to give Deuce any sort of contract. They just sort of quadrupled his salary for three years for…I guess the possibility that he would suddenly improve dramatically once they started playing him regularly? That’s the best theory I’ve got. “He might improve a lot once we start playing him regularly, so let’s sign him to a contract that will be cheap if he improve a lot.” It’s just shooting themselves in the foot for no reason.

I adore iHart. I’m very happy they have him on the team. I can easily see him re-signing for the max Early Bird, though. I think he likes playing here, and his girlfriend (wife?) is definitely a big city type of lady.

The Deuce contract feels like a “we might need salary filler in a trade” kind of move…

I really miss IQ and it was sad to see him in that gaudy Raptors uniform doing the IQ prance. Alas…

Whether Brogdamn or Typhus, I think the bench issue is a rather easy problem to solve at a modest cost. No Dijon Mustard, please!

If you signed iHart to a $15M AAV extension, the good news is that due to Mitch’s descending contract, the positional spending doesn’t go up all that much, maybe like $4-5M. And since they’d be making pretty much the same money, it would no longer be all that controversial to play them as indicated, meaning having iHart finish games to avoid hack-a-Mitch. And one of them (probably Mitch if iHart keeps it up, plus he might not be tradeable until summer 2025 anyway) can be future trade bait.

Seems like a no-brainer to extend him…

Comments are closed.