Game Thread

2022-23 Game Thread: Knicks vs. OKC Thunder and Future Knick, SGA

The Knicks host their future star player, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, on this Sunday matinee game, along with SGA’s soon-to-be-former team, the Oklahoma City Thunder, as soon as Sam Presti convinces the Knicks to give him all of their first round picks in perpetuity (okay, for as long as they’re allowed to give them. Thank you, Ted Stepien!).

We all know how the Knicks work. They have to play JUST well enough so that Thibs will never get fired, so I imagine that they’ll pull this one out so that they will be 6-5 headed into the West Coast trip.

Let’s go, Knicks!

209 replies on “2022-23 Game Thread: Knicks vs. OKC Thunder and Future Knick, SGA”

How do people feel about offering the Mitchell package for SGA? He has been pretty unstoppable this year.

IQ is a 36% shooter from 3 & 88% on FTs. He’s an excellent shooter, he just can’t get to the basket which deflates his fg%.

He shot better on pull-ups last season than he did on C&S 3s. The season before that it was the opposite.

SGA would be great, and a better fit defensively with Brunson than Mitchell. However, if there are rumblings of SGA beig tired of losing, I think Presti would be be better trading his chips for players and compete now. If he trades SGA for even more draft picks, they are going to depreciate because he cannot keep all of them.

EDIT: It would actually be nice to win this game convingcingly so that SGA is enticed to speak up.

Yup, a 24 years old 6’6 backcourt player that can work on and off the ball can be a good catch 🙂

Let’s Go (west) Knicks!

Can’t watch today because i have a project delivery tomorrow. If you can, be sure to detail the game here in the game thread, i’ll be reading it. 🙂
Agree with Iserp, Presti needs players, not picks. But if he can slightly extend the timeline swapping SGA for RJ (and picks), i think he might do it. And the tank would be more safe with RJ than it is with SGA.
Gooooo Knicks!

36% from 3 does not align with “excellent shooter.” It is more like league average. And that’s the issue with IQ, if the shooting doesn’t improve to something close to elite, he’s just a guy.

so good to finally meet up with someone from the site…

had a fantastic time with hubie at the show yesterday…

the theater at the Ace hotel did not disappoint, beautiful location with amazing acoustics…

the performances were stellar and fun…the audience was crazy engaged…

probably my last show for this year…gonna start doing some research of orchestra, jazz, symphony, opera performance events for next year…

thank you hubie 🙂

yeah, I got some bananas and apples somewhere in the kitchen…

I generally though do not seek out fruit in the kitchen…

hmmmmmm, maybe smoothie time pepper…also, hoping you get a chance to head out to arizona at some point and travel by this way…

now that I’m not completely bunkered down inside my home, it would be really nice to get a chance to sit and speak with more of the folks here at KB…

Heading down to AZ next week…but flying this time…I was thinking of coming down for your soiree last night but was in Florida all week and just got back Friday night…didn’t have the energy for the six hour drive…

Not sure doing a TV feature on Julius *while* he’s meditating is pulling him in the right direction 😉

And then throws the ball to Poku for a layup.

I know it’s not 20 games but I am ready to give up on the Reddish era

I am not a Thibs basher, but if he cannot get this team to defend the perimeter, this team is not good enough to make the playoffs. It is also clear that losing Mitch was a (expected?) blow. Hartenstein is better offensively, but he’s not a rim defender, nor does he crash the offensive boards.

RJ can learn a lot about how to use the glass from Brunson…

I’m always worried that Poku can slip through a crack in the floor…

Sims: “So you wanna take ME out of the starting lineup. Nuh, uh.”

Sims crushing. Obi hitting. Cam hitting. This young group, with Rose. Do this more, please.

Knicks 2nd unit is clearly better than OKC’s.
It would be nice if we had one true point guard taller that was taller than 6’2”.

That’s like three open three-pointers that Fournier has passed up. He has to stop doing that, because otherwise, why play him?

As someone who grew up with the 90’s NBA this level of defense from both teams is really difficult to watch.

I mean JFC they are literally running away from dribblers and giving shooters a mile of space WTF are they doing.

Lovely example of a team’s series of unforced errors leading to total self-destruction.

Team Thibs — all defense, all the time… except when it’s not.

We just don’t have good defensive personnel, and then on top of that the effort is poor on the defensive end. Not sure what our defensive scheme is supposed to be.

There’s no chance in hell this is going to be a top 10 defense.

They are so ofter miles afar from the outside shooters that it looks a real (crazy) strategy…

“Not sure what our defensive scheme is supposed to be.”

Eye test says it’s endless switching that ends up with late closers on all shots. The nice bonus of failing this way is that our players are also demoralized over and over and over each time they are late.

Barrett sucks…if his jersey name said Smith…he would be on the pine most of the time..

I have honestly never had strong feelings either way about Thibs, but at this point I think he needs to go. He’s supposed to be a defensive oriented coach, and he doesn’t have this team playing any semblance of defense. The defensive scheme seems to be “maybe the other team will miss some open shots.”

They’re not playing hard or smart on the defensive end, and honestly it’s been a problem all season. It’s probably time to head in a different direction.

The whole team is getting cooked on team defense and crap closeouts. RJ is getting cooked 1-on-1.

RJ might be fine on the 2nd guy (or 3rd) but he is not a stopper by any means.

Sims, Obi, IQ showed some strength during their sequence. Thibs should try them against OKC starters some time in the 2nd half

I want to see Deuce this game, and nit just garbage time when we’re down 20

Maybe a Sims/Hart lineup

Maybe a Sims/Hart/Cam/IQ/Deuce lineup

At some point, teams shooting 50+% from 3 is no longer a coincidence and comes down to bad scheming or execution. Thibs is compounding the latter with the former.

“I feel like I deserve credit for turning Cam’s career now”


Best lineup today eye test wise was Cam, Obi, Sims, Rose, IQ

RJ on the bench. Grimes with the starters for awhile. Grimes doing a good job on SGA.

Our defense SUCKS. You can’t blame it on Brunson because Brunson is actually an upgrade over Kemba defensively. But the loss of veteran players that did valuable things on defense over the last 2 years (Bullock, Burks, Taj, and yes even Frank’s limited minutes) has accumulated to the point where instead of our defense keeping us in games against better teams with some hope of lucking into a win we are vulnerable to bad teams getting hot and beating us. We need defenders that take pride in stops. It’s embarrassing how bad our defense is. We are making a scrub team look good. And make no mistake about it. They are scrubs. It’s the lack of defenders that’s the problem.

“Reddish with a bit of a staredown after that hoop!”

Haha. Saw that, too.

Gotta head out to tennis now. Bring us home, Cam.

Nobody playing defense. Total embarrassment. This is type of basketball That I can’t stomach.

We’re on pace for a 192-144 game. Strap in guys!

@GoNY, you should’ve specified the Knicks would be the ones with 192!!

Okay, off to wash my hair, trim my nails, and clean the garage. Good luck, Knicks.

Is Tom Thibodeau aware that when the other team makes a shot from behind that line they draw on the court around 23 feet out, they get three points?

Now I understand when people were using the term “chalk “…in assessing this team…it was in reference to a corpse outline on the sidewalk at a crime scene…

A 20 point loss to OKC at home is fireable on the merits even if OKC is better this year

With the brutal 5 games in 7 day road trip coming up I honestly don’t see how Thibs will still be the head coach by Thanksgiving.

IMO, it has little to do with schemes. It has to do with players. Maybe when Mitch is back he’ll help protect the paint a bit better, but we have too many holes on defense. You can cover for 1 bad defender if you have a few smart plus defenders on the court. I’m not sure we have single smart plus defender on the entire team right now. 122 points in a quarter is beyond embarrassing. Grimes at 100% is not going to fix this even if he winds up being as good as we hope on defense.

Kemba played fewer than 1,000 minutes last season. For the part of last season when the Knicks were actually decent on defense, Burks was the PG most of the time. He’s a better defender than Brunson, that seems clear to me.

So, we’re not quite back to Kemba levels of suckitude at PG, but Brunson’s deficiencies on defense are definitely a part of the problem. He’s still a good player overall, but he’s a well below average defensive player.

RJ’s defense is also a mirage. He’s just not disruptive enough. We generate very, very few turnovers on defense because we generate no ball pressure.

Wow, super athletic tip from Giddey

That was a terrible turnover by Obi

OKC has a good thing going here. Other than SGA there isn’t a single guy anyone has heard of on this team. And they are pretty good.

Brentford of the NBA

I’m ready for that Strat “stay calm…we’re right on plan post”…I can feel it coming after that stick man dude hits another wide open 3…

Rose is so cooked. It’s funny to me when Thibs calls him as the first guard in and thinks he’s gonna get some vintage Rose scoring and the guy can’t even blow by a center guarding him anymore. Lol.

Geo…I am coming by your front door soon…just look for the bandwagon with the “Wemby 2023” banner on the side…feel free to hop on…

Pretty funny to see Obi flying in to the frame a full second late to stop the layup.

Giddey looks solid. Saw him have a triple double last year in some random game but he seemed to be a bit of a frenetic mess. Been on point today though.

I thought we might make a run when SGA was out, but Giddey is carving us up.

Pretty demoralizing.

Not my best game choice but gotta say SGA has put on a hell of a show.

Every single time I’ve ever talked myself into RJ Barrett, he puts up a few of these.

“Kemba played fewer than 1,000 minutes last season. For the part of last season when the Knicks were actually decent on defense, Burks was the PG most of the time. He’s a better defender than Brunson, that seems clear to me.”

Good point. I agree with that.

All the guys everyone wanted to get rid of (Bullock, Burks, Taj, Nerlens and even Frank) were our best defenders. We’ve been going backwards defensively since our surprise year.

You would think our franchise would eventually figure out that you start with defense given that’s how we built the two best teams in franchise history.

I underestimated the problem also and that’s a big focus for me.

I knew the Brunson/Fournier backcourt was going to be a problem and the Brunson/Mitchell backcourt might have been even worse against some teams, but I was expecting more from Grimes and RJ to at least make up for Burks. I agree on RJ’s defense. He’s OK, but he’s not good. Grimes has been out. Randle is terrible. Mitch is out and Hart is nothing special. It’s ugly out there. When you play defense like this anyone can get hot and blow you out.

It’s also unbelievable that Fournier is getting the crunch time minutes over Brunson/Rose

IQ really uses his long arms to great effect on defense. They should have challenged that call on the strip.


And of course part of defense is defensive rebounding and we have had some terrible nights at that also when teams attacked their offensive boards.

It’s a shame we wasted the two best games of Cam’s Knicks career (tonight and in Memphis)…

There’s a tune in my mind that sounds like:
Let me do some stats stuffing, stats stuffing, yeah!

I don’t know who did write the music, but the words are Randle’s 🙂

“It’s also unbelievable that Fournier is getting the crunch time minutes over Brunson/Rose”

Hey, Fournier may have been 0-5, but he was… um… a zero plus/minus…

that wasn’t too terrible a game to watch…as far as home losses…

something is off when your team stops defending…

time for johnnie bryant to get a shot…he’s been on the bench now long enough…

give the man his shot…we already know what even the best of thibs will accomplish…

time for a new voice for the team…plus, I like his beard better than thibs’…

I think johnnie’s rocking a beard now…

I don’t know how you beard folks do it, I feel like ants are crawling on my face after a week without shaving…

Would love to know what Dolan is thinking right now.

Dolan probably had no idea we’re even playing today…getting ready to host band practice.

I know it’s early in the season, but it’s time to move on from Thibs. The Nets fired Nash and now they’re playing ferocious defense (and winning)

That game was a massive wake up call

I think you let Thibs get through the tough schedule, or part of it. Let the new coach come in with some easier games.

Definitely in favor of moving on from Thibs. He’s not an albatross but he’s consistently not making the right decisions and his schemes on both ends are positively dated. He’s been a little more creative this year, but it’s really too little too late.

yeah, holy shit, cam giving consistent effort and energy is freaky to watch…a lot less sulking…he still needs to get to the weight room…

really good to see, less crazy bumbling stumbling to the rim…

I saw him pass a couple of times…that was encouraging…

even if we lose, poor rotations, point of attack defense – should put you on the bench…

ol’ prop joe junior included…

>wait strat – did you just blame us all for this roster 😛<



We were eventually going to move on from those vets and any benefit they brought to the young players, but I think we went away from the right formula in terms of the kinds of players to try to accumulate. IMO, the role players should be plus or elite defenders that can maybe do one thing well on offense. While you are doing that you try to find your #1 and #2 option. We sort of went in the opposite direction where we jettisoned all the good defenders and replaced them with role player level scorers that look pretty good paper but aren’t that good.

I'm embarrassed at myself for not recognizing how big a problem this was going to be since I've spent the better part of some years here whining about defense and why some of our defense oriented players were better than they looked statistically.

I think Wally is correct that we miss Mitch badly, but the problem is much deeper. A lot of these young players we have are not only not good defenders, they are bad.

We have good defenders they’re just not our “stars”.

IQ, Cam, & Grimes all looked good on defense. Cam & IQ were outstanding.

I’ve been in a 12 game coma, but I just woke up.

We can live with Brunson’s sub par defense as long as Mitch is back there cleaning up and we pair him with a plus defender. But we have to make defense the priority.

It’s time to take stock of every one of the young players and begin an overhaul at the deadline (and of course Fournier and Randle if we can because they suck defensively).

Who can be a good defender and who can’t?

Anyone that can’t is out.

almost humorous now thinking of RJ wanting to guard the other team’s most offensively potent guard/small forward…

RJ’s too slow…brunson’s too slow…evian too slow…rose too slow…

you can only afford to have one of those guys on the court against young, quick teams…

unfortunately teams with tall frontcourts kill us on the boards…

still, this level of defensive effort and execution…

most importantly, unless the front office plans to keep him past his current contract – make the change now…

bet on the team playing harder for bryant and him giving more minutes to guys that play better defense…

Hart might contest shots at the rim as well as Mitch but he’s nowhere near the rim way too often defensively.

Fournier has to go- at least out of the rotation. As frustrating as Cam is the ceiling is just too high not to be in the rotation and Grimes needs to play as long as he’s healthy.

The lack of defense is utterly disturbing. We don’t defend the 3pt line, and without Mitch, we lack interior defense too.

I am not really sure what we are doing, but I think I would try to simplify it. Either have each player stick to their man, or play a zone defense, let the other team shoot, but be well positioned and grab the rebound. But I feel like some of our team is playing (bad) man to man defense, and the other half is floating aimlessly in the court, and that results in many easy shots. Not to mention that we fail to get back on defense fast enough. This looks bad on Thibs.

Brunson, RJ, and Randle are slow and unathletic and Randle barely tries on D. Gonna be tough to have a decent defense with those headwinds.

Bondy – “ About 40 minutes after the game finished James Dolan’s security was still guarding his suite at MSG.”

Not sure if this means anything, but….

I don’t understand all the Xs and Os of our switching, but one thing I notice repeatedly is that we are one step too slow in a lot of it. Maybe it’s the recovery, the 2nd switch or whatever, but we are one step too slow.

“Maybe it’s the recovery, the 2nd switch or whatever, but we are one step too slow.”


You might want to consider that it’s because the players are slow.

How do people feel about offering the Mitchell package for SGA? He has been pretty unstoppable this year.

Sam Presti would die laughing.

It really needs to sink in: our entire package of young players and highly protected picks is not attractive to anyone because neither the players nor the picks are good.

We couldn’t even get Josh Giddey for the Mitchell package.

thank you hubie 🙂

No, thank you, sir! It was a pleasure.

By the way, am I the only person who has no idea that Geo is short for George? That was a pretty “duh” moment for me.

As y’all might imagine, Geo/George is every bit as kind and dear in person as he is on this site.

I’m 42 yo, I know I’ll watch the Yankees win another championship before I die and probably the Giants will too if not at least reach another Super Bowl. But I’m 100% convinced I’ll never see the Knicks play in the NBA Finals again let alone actually win a championship.

“It really needs to sink in: our entire package of young players and highly protected picks is not attractive to anyone because neither the players nor the picks are good.”

Sam Presti’s the guy that pawned off that trash in exchange for a real live lottery pick, so why now would he want it back for a really good player he picked 6th?

He’d die laughing if they were backwash offered to him for SGA.

As y’all might imagine, Geo/George is every bit as kind and dear in person as he is on this site.


Not surprising, good to hear confirmed.

“Geo” has a neo-George Washington kind of vibe to it. Me like.

Jerome Robinson-Earl was drafted by Presti with one of those 2nd round picks that Leon doesn’t think is worth using, a strategy that Team Leon has defended to the death.

Let’s put aside the question of whether you’d rather have him or Deuce & Rokas, bc that’s too easy.

What do you guys think would be more valuable in a trade right now? A 6’9” stretch big or a top-18 protected first round pick from a lottery team that converts to two seconds if not conveyed in the next two years?

“It really needs to sink in: our entire package of young players and highly protected picks is not attractive to anyone because neither the players nor the picks are good.”

That’s not true.

We could have landed Donovan Mitchell but then today we would have lost 155 to 145. 🙂

Hey Hubert n Geo/George! Glad yall met up. We had a big football game on campus last night – we were in contention for a conference title, but we lost to Ventura, and watched them celebrate on our field. Bleh. My wife ran the snack bar.

I’m out with the wife and bonus daughter to the 2nd leg of our maternity photo outing, so I didn’t have time to catch the K’s on the short end of a track meet game. Even with the bad defenders, I don’t know how Thibs survives if the team keeps giving up 50% on 3-ball makes in a 3pt shooting league.

If Wemby and Scoot are absolutely worth it – and by all accounts, they are – I think you gotta give this team a shorter leash of say 30 games to see if they can do better than .500 ball. If they’re at .500 or below by then, hit the big reset button.

We should fire Thibs for all of the same reasons we never should’ve hired him. He’s stubborn, uncreative, and sure seems to have a personality with a shelf life of sorts. I won’t pretend I know enough about Xs and Os to properly diagnose the defense, but we sure do seem to leave A LOT of 3 point shooters open.

However, the rot runs a lot deeper than the coach here and there’s not much available to us when it comes to moving away from this failed “win now” morass.

We can glue Rose and Fournier to the bench (no one is giving us anything for them in a trade) to free up more minutes for young players.

That’s…about it? Obviously, we should be putting in 18 hour shifts at the Trying to Trade Julius Randle Factory. I don’t think there will be any takers though. There aren’t really any similarly long and bad contracts floating around right now.

Maybe the Lakers can talk themselves into Randle, Fournier, and Rose as a talent upgrade that wouldn’t cost them any picks. They’d have to give up on using their forthcoming cap space though, and they’re the Lakers, so they probably think there’s a superstar around the corner waiting to take their money and bail them out. They might even be right.

So we’re pretty much stuck hoping we get major lottery luck. Needless to say, very bad position to be in. The damn empty gyms…

Looking forward to the next off-season, a lot of teams will have cap space. The Knicks will likely only have the full MLE. I don’t know what free agents or trades will be available, but who ever we go after, there could be a lot of competition for him. The only silver lining I see is that competition for players will probably drive up salaries and our players under contract might not look so bad salary wise. Although it’s hard to imagine Fournier looking good salary wise under any circumstances.

From the Athletic:

Cap space: Houston Rockets ($61 million), Detroit Pistons ($48 million), San Antonio Spurs ($44 million to $67 million), Orlando Magic ($35 million to $60 million), Indiana Pacers ($36 million to $51 million), Charlotte Hornets ($30 million to $39 million), Oklahoma City Thunder ($31 million)
Wild cards: Los Angeles Lakers ($30 million or over the cap/tax)
Over cap but likely full non-taxpayer MLE: Memphis Grizzlies, Utah Jazz, Sacramento Kings, New York Knicks, Minnesota Timberwolves

Can’t say much about Shai getting 37, nobody has been stopping him this year (averaging 30.5 before this game). But that game sucked. And man, Barrett’s body language sucked most of all.

Had to leave after the first quarter… can’t believe we blew this so badly. Why did Fournier play more minutes than RJ?

I think the cap space list above is bad for the Lakers. At least some of those teams, for example the Hornets and probably the Pacers, are going to be looking to get better through hiring free agents and most of all the teams money will get spent, one way or another. Salaries will almost certainly go up, and the Lakers possible $30M in space won’t go very far. Maybe they can get one pretty decent player who likes the idea of living in LA, but then they have nothing but a late first round draft pick and minimum salary players for the rest of their team. They might do better getting several MLE range players, but they still won’t be good.

This loss has got to be bad for Thibs. If we keep losing winnable games through bad defense, I can see the team thinking of a change. I say this even though I agree with Strat that it’s the lack of defensive minded personnel that is the problem, not the coaching. But that never stopped GMs from changing coaches in circumstances like these. Four obvious candidates for a new coach are Ime Udoka, Quinn Snyder, Frank Vogel and Kenny Atkinson. Any thoughts?

“Mercifully, it was the middle of the night here so I slept through it.”

so did most of the knicks

“Four obvious candidates for a new coach are Ime Udoka, Quinn Snyder, Frank Vogel and Kenny Atkinson.”

Even a moron like Dolan wouldn’t touch Udoka with a ten foot pole right now…no way on Vogel…I don’t think Snyder would come to NY…Atkinson would be good…not sure where he is these days…but I know Cassel has been in a few interviews on other teams…he was a good defensive guard…might be worth a shot…

Let’s not discuss whether Robinson-Earl is going to be a better player than RJ or Toppin

Also sign me up for SGA future Knick. He really seems to be living up to the hype.

I’d struggle to choose between him, Ja Morant, and Kevin Knox.

Four obvious candidates for a new coach are Ime Udoka BECKY HAMMON, Quinn Snyder, Frank Vogel and Kenny Atkinson. Any thoughts?

Becky, of course. 🙂

Here’s the thing about Thibs, and I think it’s pretty clear now:

His whole system is take away the paint and count on your opponent to miss three pointers.

Without Mitch, he’s toast.

Obviously, we should be putting in 18 hour shifts at the Trying to Trade Julius Randle Factory. I don’t think there will be any takers though.

Wait are you saying those victory laps people ran around you after Randle’s first game of the season were premature? I don’t believe it.

Embiid with 59 points on 28 shots doing his Wilt impression.

Why can’t we have nice things like literally every other team?

Aw, I didn’t want to find out that geo is short for George. I had in my mind that it was a reference to the Greek prefix for earth, making him like Knickerblogger’s earth god high priest…

Oh well, another idealistic idea dashed.

Even a moron like Dolan wouldn’t touch Udoka with a ten foot pole right now

I think some people fundamentally misunderstand what makes Dolan such an awful person. He is a narcissist with a savior complex. Yes, he absolutely would touch Udoka. He’d trade for Kyrie, too. He is the kind of guy who thinks these people have been wronged and that it would make him a great person to give them a second chance. For proof, see Isiah Thomas and Steve Mills.

“His whole system is take away the paint and count on your opponent to miss three pointers.”

He wants to take away the paint, but he also wants to take away the corner 3 and I assume if the scouting report are good the best spots for the best shooters. That leaves a lot of 3s that they are supposed to close out on anyway, but if it’s a 32%, 33% or worse 3 pointer he’d rather give that up than something in the paint or where they are more likely to foul. But the variance with 3s is such that even at low 30% they are going to in 40% or more some nights.

Right now though, our guys can’t keep anyone out of the paint. Even if Mitch was there he could only do so much. So it’s a train wreck if they are hot from outside too.

IMO, we have to change directions in the types of players we draft and bring in here. We had the winning formula with guys like Bullock, Burks, Nerlens, Frank, and Taj (defenders). We have to get back to those kinds of role players, but ideally younger. We reverted back to the losing formula we had for years and years before that by putting the priority on role players that can score. We are worrying about the 3P% and TS% of guys that give up more than add when we should probably just get rid of them even though they are young.

Just to add to that last comment, I’m dismayed that I didn’t see what a train wreck this could become defensively earlier. I knew we were heading in the wrong direction defensively over the last two years, but I didn’t see how bad it could get and I should have. I’m sure when Mitch and Grimes get to 100% things will improve, but there is more we can do.

Longer term we know Randle has to go, but I think we should probably put Obi on the block and try to bring a more defense oriented backup PF, totally bury Fournier, and give Deuce a chance at backup PG. A Deuce and Grimes backcourt could get pretty ugly on offense but at least they’ll try.

The Knicks are now ninth in the East instead of tenth because the Lakers just got their third win at the expense of Brooklyn. I guess it’s good for the Knicks, but I just couldn’t bring myself to root for the Lakers.

Who in the league currently is a defensive minded power forward that exemplifies the kind of guy you’re suggesting trade Obi for? I’m not against it, just trying to understand better

Growing up, the local funeral home was Geo. T. Davis, with the Geo. being George (this was back when space for stuff like an extra three characters in an ad made a big difference).

I remember those days. There were a lot of AAA enterprises too, like AAA car repair so that by first in the yellow pages they might get more calls.

That still comes up with comic book companies, as they all want to be in the front of the catalog for stores to look at, so every new comic book company seems to be A something (Ablaze, Aftershock, AHOY, Artists Writers & Artisans, etc.)

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