Knicks Morning News (2017.06.09)

  • [SNY Knicks] NC State’s Smith Jr. meets with Jackson, does not work out for Knicks
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 9:55:00 AM)

    North Carolina State guard Dennis Smith Jr. met with Knicks president Phil Jackson on Monday, but did not participate in his scheduled work out with the club on Wednesday.

  • [NYTimes] Draymond Green, Heart of the Warriors, Has a Quieter Beat
    (Friday, June 09, 2017 1:08:15 AM)

    The forward has not seemed as visible as he was in last year’s N.B.A. finals, but that is because he has learned to refine his leadership.

  • [NYTimes] On Pro Basketball: Kevin Durant Outplays, Outlasts and Outmaneuvers LeBron James
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 4:17:12 PM)

    Durant’s much-debated and derided move to the Warriors from Oklahoma City dramatically rewrote the sport’s competitive equation.

  • [NYTimes] The Warriors’ Stunning Finish, Shot by Shot
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 1:55:16 PM)

    With two and a half minutes left in Game 3 of the N.B.A. finals, Cleveland led by 6 points and was poised to get back in the series. Then it all went wrong.

  • [NYTimes] Warriors 118, Cavaliers 113 | Golden State leads series, 3-0: Late Surge Puts Warriors One Step From Postseason Perfection
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 6:19:52 AM)

    Kevin Durant’s go-ahead 3-pointer gave Golden State the victory over the Cavaliers. If the Warriors win Friday, they will finish the playoffs with a 16-0 record.

  • [NYTimes] Oracle Arena vs. Quicken Loans: Like Night and Day (or Warriors and Cavs)
    (Friday, June 09, 2017 9:00:52 AM)

    Oracle Arena in Oakland and Quicken Loans Arena in Cleveland reflect the character and ethos of two very different cities and teams, and their passionate fans.

  • [NYTimes] Golden State Warriors Are Closing In on History
    (Friday, June 09, 2017 4:01:11 AM)

    If the Warriors win on Friday, they would complete back-to-back memorable seasons. Their playoff run would stand as probably the greatest in any sport.

  • [NYTimes] N.B.A. Finals: How the Warriors Stunned the Cavs to Win Game 3
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 1:02:36 PM)

    The Warriors, trailing for much of the second half, went on an 11-0 run in the final minutes to take a commanding 3-0 lead in the finals.

  • [NYDN] Ex-Knick Monty Williams to receive inaugural Sager Strong award
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 10:17:20 AM)

    The inaugural Sager Strong Award, named for the late sideline reporter Craig Sager, will be given to ex-Knick Monty Williams.

  • [NYDN] Derek Fisher arrested on suspicion of DUI after crashing car
    (Thursday, June 08, 2017 8:14:58 AM)

    Ex-Knicks head coach Derek Fisher has been arrested on suspicion of drunken driving after crashing his car early Sunday morning.

  • 110 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2017.06.09)”

    I wonder who’s promised Smith Jr. that they’re going to pick him? I wouldn’t be surprised if it is Orlando.

    Still lame not to just do a workout. This could mean someone like Tatum or Isaac might be available at #8! It could also mean Monk at #8.

    in a weird development, twitter is telling me that Fultz is going to work out for the Kings?!

    It was clearly rubbish to fall to 8 when two weeks out from the end of the season 4 looked like a real possibility.

    But all year, this draft has had 8-10 high level prospects and if anything that number has grown with Collins, maybe Mitchell, and a growing sense Giles may be back to full health. OG also in that mix.

    Clearly there are guys we might want less (monk) or need less (Markennen, Collins). But I’m pretty happy with the choices were likely to have. And if people like Smith move up, others come down. I’ve decided to be optimistic until draft night (when we trade down for Evan Turner and I become a Hockey fan).

    Could be Orlando, Sacto or Minny. Looks like we’re on a crash course with Monk. Get ready.

    I’m amazed that there were folks who were pushing for the Knicks to sign Turner last off season.

    Not sure if this was already discussed, but Fisher actually crashed Barnes’ car?? Lmao.

    in a weird development, twitter is telling me that Fultz is going to work out for the Kings?!

    I doubt the C’s are looking to deal the pick to the Kings unless they’re offering future first rounders. Maybe it’s because the Kings are sort of in the Pacific Northwest?

    Phil traded for Derrick Rose. You never really know with PJ what he actually wants to do until it’s done.

    Let’s just hope Isaac is available at 8 and we trade back into the top 15 for Kennard, Ntilikina, or Mitchell.

    in a weird development, twitter is telling me that Fultz is going to work out for the Kings?!

    That matches up with the rumor I reported that the Kings have an agreement with the Lakers to trade their two first round picks for the number 2 pick

    Maybe the Lakers already decided to pick Ball and if somehow the Celtics draft him before, that would trigger the Lakers/Kings swap.

    Lonzo would be a better fit on a team of good players trying to win now imho.

    Why does Sacto even have a team? They should move that operation down to San Diego.

    I wonder who’s promised Smith Jr. that they’re going to pick him?

    What, exactly, is the benefit of making promises to draftees? I can think of no benefit to a team outside of keeping a player from withdrawing from the draft and going back to college.

    What, exactly, is the benefit of making promises to draftees? I can think of no benefit to a team outside of keeping a player from withdrawing from the draft and going back to college.

    It doesn’t make any sense in this case because Smith was never going back to school and is going to be a lottery pick no matter what. I think people are extrapolating a lot from him not working out, even though he still had dinner with the team president. Maybe Phil and the Knicks felt they had done enough due diligence on his game and felt that the actual interview and getting to know him was more important than anything else.

    It’s weird, but I don’t buy that a team ahead of us gave him a promise considering the amount of trade chatter going on.

    Let’s just hope Isaac is available at 8 and we trade back into the top 15 for Kennard, Ntilikina, or Mitchell.

    I would sign off on this.

    The only scenario I don’t like is drafting Ntilikina at #8 and doing nothing else in terms of trading for Rubio or getting another pick to select some other PG. I have no special insight into what kind of player Ntilikina may become eventually. I guess he has the tools to become a very good 3&D guy long term. But I feel confident saying he’s not going to contribute much next year. He can barely score in the French league now. It’s going to get a lot tougher in the NBA. IMO, he’s going to get very few minutes off the bench and be close to a zero on offense. I also don’t see how he addresses our needs for a PG either. We’d still need a PG unless you want to hand the reins to Baker or Randle.

    Suddenly lots of talk about Philly taking Tatum at #3. That would be party time/excellent!

    What, exactly, is the benefit of making promises to draftees?

    Gets things off to a good start? Builds trust? I really don’t know. It seems like a dumb idea to me, too.

    But it happens every year. Teams bringing players out for workouts and interviews and then only doing an interview because they decided they didn’t need to see him workout does not.

    Suddenly lots of talk about Philly taking Tatum at #3. That would be party time/excellent!

    I was never worried about Tatum dropping. He’s the type of player who is like crack to NBA GMs, especially old school GMs like the Colangelos. I’d be surprised to see him go before Jackson, but I didn’t think he’d last past Phoenix at #4 (provided that Jackson was gone before #4).

    @14 From your lips to God’s ears.
    I live in San Diego, we just lost our football team and and our baseball team sucks. We are due for some good news on the sports front

    Don’t worry about this stuff, guys. Phil’s got our backs. Just relax and feel our greatness getting closer.

    @17 – they’ve needed a point guard for 15+ years now. Management seems to like to kick this major problem down the road indefinitely.

    Would love to see them draft a point guard and trade for Rubio, but not counting on either one.

    sometimes teams make promises with the hope that the prospect will refuse workouts and generally cold shoulder other nearby teams he already doesn’t prefer, on the slim and perhaps delusional chance that might make teams ahead pass given a close call or teams below decide not to trade up.

    Just because we didn’t officially work out DSJr. means nothing. It could just be misdirection (if we really want him). Where is evidence of a promise to him by another team? I haven’t read that anywhere. Smith Jr. met with Knick officials the day after his dinner with Phil.
    Don’t think that you know everything that’s going on. That’s a major problem on these blog sites. Everybody thinks that they’re an expert and smarter than Phil. You’re not.

    Ntilinka is already a better defender than Jamal Crawford, right? 6’5″ combo guard with a 7-foot wingspan just sounded eerily familiar.

    Honestly, wings that can create offense (in addition to at least average shooting) and can defend multiple positions are the rarest things in the league. There’s good reason guys like Tatum and Jackson are probably top 5 guys. Look at these finals — both teams are hunting good matchups and trying as hard as they can to hide Irving, Curry, Love, etc.

    Honestly, wings that can create offense (in addition to at least average shooting) and can defend multiple positions are the rarest things in the league. There’s good reason guys like Tatum and Jackson are probably top 5 guys. Look at these finals — both teams are hunting good matchups and trying as hard as they can to hide Irving, Curry, Love, etc.

    That’s why I think Jackson and Issac should both be gone in the top 6. I think Tatum is more about pointz, but yes, he’s close enough to those two other guys that I can see why he’d go top 6, as well. Isaac is precisely the type of guy who rises in drafts because of his freak athleticism. As you note, you can’t find guys like that elsewhere.

    What you can find is decent big men, which is why the back end of every first round (and the front end of the second round) is almost always filled with decent big men. Some of those guys turn out really well, though, of course. That’s tangential to your point, but I just find that part interesting, about how big men are always clumped together every year.

    @27 I agree, I just don’t think Tatum will ever get the passing part of “creating” down. And considering how much he worked the post and mid-range last year, I’m afraid he’s an Okafor/Beasley-style bust waiting to happen, though I think his D will probably be better than those two.

    Sometimes a team will guarantee a player a spot so the player won’t workout for teams above them in the draft.

    For example, suppose the Knicks were interested in Porzingis and he definitely wanted to come to NY. The problem for both was that the 76ers might draft him before he drops to NY. If NY promises to draft him at #4, then he can refuse to work out for the 76ers and be certain he won’t drop even further and start costing himself money.

    Could it be, then, that Smith Jr. wants to go to Dallas? He’d fit there pretty well.

    I think Tatum improved as the year went on. Not a spectacular passer, but 2.1 assists per game is good for a wing in college.

    He’s going to struggle with the NBA 3 at first, but once he adds strength in his lower body he should develop into a 3 level scorer.

    Defensively he’s too upright in his stance at times which hurts him on ball against guards and quicker wings, but I think his technique can be improved upon and if it is he’ll be fine on that end, though certainly never a lockdown or elite wing defender. Has the potential to become a good small ball 4, which has value to us long term with KP + Willy.

    You’d prefer Isaac to Tatum, though, right? How about Jackson? I’d have them both ahead of Tatum, but I was wondering what you thought.

    I’d probably rank them Jackson>Isaac>Tatum, mostly because Jackson seems the most developed overall (except his jumper). But he’s a good passer, rebounder, and defender, and intangibles (minus the kicking of some girl’s car) seem top notch in terms of effort/work ethic. But I’d be ecstatic with Isaac too, and I guess ok with Tatum.

    That’s where I would have them, as well. Jackson’s far too polished not to want the highest, even if Isaac might have the higher upside.

    Jonathan Isaac has the highest ceiling in this draft and he put up better numbers and film than any wing prospect available. I’m taking Isaac over Jackson and Tatum without blinking. He’s what the future of the NBA looks like.

    @Frank and BC

    Agree on the order, though Jackson and Isaac is really close for me. Tatum is less tantalizing of an all around talent, than them but I think there’s a good chance he turns into one of the better wing scorers in the league.

    Donovan Mitchell needs more consideration… he’s got defense, speed, playmaking ability and a lethal 3… almost 7′ reach…
    dsmjr and ntilinka in one !

    Josh Jackson strikes me as the exact type of player who turns into a pumpkin as soon as ends up on the same court as NBA level athletes. Tatum has a tremendous amount of skill that I have faith that his game translates, and he’s never been the type to out-athlete everyone. He may very well develop into Andre Iguodala, but even then Iggy was truly an athletic freak in his prime. When I watch his tape there are very few things that translate into success as a pro. His jumper isn’t gonna work because the gather too far away from his body. His rebound numbers won’t be so good when he’s not the 4th tallest guy on the team. He catches defenses napping at the collegiate level and that’s nice to see off ball, but his handle leaves to be desired as a wing player on the next level.

    Long story short, I don’t see it with this kid. He dominated high school play and played well as a power forward in college. I don’t see anything outside of a decent role player when it comes to Josh Jackson.

    i would rank them tatum>isaac=jackson… jackson has all the skills but the shooting is pretty concerning since his ft% is pretty bad and he doesn’t have consistent mechanics on that… he’s also older than the other two by a year… isaac to me is more of a 4 and doesn’t have the ball handling to be a true 3…

    tatum i think turns out to be the best of the group since he has much more diverse offensive game .. it really all depends on what environment he gets put in if he develops the other finer points but he comes in ahead of the other SF’s if it’s even only slightly… he’s the third best prospect in my book…

    If I remember correctly KP’s numbers in Europe weren’t that impressive either. I think Frank is the pick for us. We need perimeter players who are good on defense. He’s project but then again so was KP and while KP has so much more improvement ahead of him, he came out way better initially than we all thought.

    I just hope Phil is doing some work to get extra picks in the first round. Even just one more would be sweet. Get that extra pick, get Rubio somehow, trade Melo and I’d be very happy with the off season.

    I have Isaac>Jackson>Tatum

    I think Jackson is slightly overrated and is more worthy of an 8 pick than a 3 pick, and vice versa for Isaac

    Draft models consistently have Isaac in the top 3-4 and Jackson in the 6-10 range

    You have to love how JJ Redick and Kevin Love for Melo doesn’t improve the Knicks according to Hollinger. 🙂

    Taking Isaac over Jackson would depend on his interview for me. He was willing to take a back seat to the veterans on his team- I’d just want to make sure that that wasn’t due to a lack of competitiveness. If you’re taking him at three you’re probably looking at him eventually playing stretch four or even small ball five and you need to certain amount of nastiness/competitiveness if you want to be better than say Rashard Lewis. He’s going to get pushed around a lot early in his career- how’s he going to respond to that mentally? I think he’s the best possible outcome for the Knicks at eight but at three I’d really have to think about it.

    If CLE loses, which seems likely. Do you think LBJ orchestrates this?

    Redick’s salary is going to rise (he’s a free agent) and I think you’d have to sweeten the deal for LAC a little. Kyrie is younger than Paul, which is a plus for them, but CP3 is so awesome I think they’d want more.

    @44
    clippers would never agree

    Clippers MIGHT agree — because the alternative is paying Paul ridiculous amounts of money through his age 37 season. Getting a guy who is obviously not as good but is much cheaper and 7 years younger? And closer in age to Jordan and Blake?

    Honestly, that would be absolutely fascinating to see.

    And guess what – Wade has an opt-out clause. he’d have to take the taxpayer MLE but hey, Wade has always been the one to give-up $. Then imagine they get someone at the Cleveland Clinic to sign off on Bosh coming back on the minimum…. CP3, Wade, Melo, LBJ, Bosh…. Tristan Thompson, Shump, JR, Jefferson off the bench? that team would have a chance, or at least would be great to watch.

    Redick’s salary is going to rise (he’s a free agent) and I think you’d have to sweeten the deal for LAC a little. Kyrie is younger than Paul, which is a plus for them, but CP3 is so awesome I think they’d want more.

    Not saying it’s happening but… Paul can re-sign for $205 million. Clips may be ambivalent about paying that.

    Or you can just do that trade without Redick.

    NYK sends out Melo, gets Love.

    LAC signs/trades CP3 for Kyrie

    Cleveland sends out Kyrie/Love, gets CP3 + Melo.

    (if anything, Cleveland might not do this trade — but if Lebron says he’s leaving unless they do it…?)

    The Kyrie for CP3 component makes more sense than the Love for ‘Melo piece.

    cleveland might prefer to keep kyrie and move love … kyrie cp3 backcourt

    cleveland might prefer to keep kyrie and move love … kyrie cp3 backcourt

    And the Clips would play Love alongside Griffin and DeAndre Jordan? I doubt it.

    You didn’t find a way to include Anthony Davis and Russell Westbrook? I’m disappointed.

    I honestly don’t think that trading Melo is or ever was part of the plan. Unless, of course, the an incredible offer comes along (especially once teams start lpsong out on the top FAs).

    This may well have been Phil making it clear to Melo that this just isn’t his team anymore.

    Or we could just sign Teague or Hill:

    Teague or Hill/Ntilikina/Baker
    Lee/Holiday/Sasha
    KP/Willy/Noah/Plumlee
    Melo/O’Quinn/NDour
    Willy/Lance/Kuz

    55 wins

    Caught the 2nd half of Frank’s semi-final game today which his team won. I’d still be hesitant to make that choice at 8, but I definitely see why the Knicks would be intrigued. His defense will be a nightmare in time.

    In the short time I watched he directly forced 4 turnovers, including a huge stop late in the game where he straight up beat the guard to the spot forcing him to dribble it off his foot. He gets caught up on screens like every perimeter player does at times, but he’s able to get over them quite frequently without a problem and even if he does get caught he makes the effort to recover and with his length he deters the ball handler from making the pocket pass to the roll man.

    Pretty small sample, but I have less reservations about him being the pick at 8 than I did before.

    Frank Ntilikina with 10pts 3reb 3ass 2stl in 29min. Aggressive tonight in a win or die game. Impressive defensively on Casper Ware.— Kevin Anstett (@kevin_anstett) June 9, 2017

    With Ntilikina’s team winning his series and advancing to the finals he’s assured of at least 3 more games of Euroball. This probably means that there won’t be any time for predraft workouts here. I don’t think that that hurts us because he flew into NY not that long ago and I;m confidant that we know everything there is to know about him. I just hope he’s not taken before we pick.

    About Frank:
    “He’s really really good, especially for his age. He just knows how to play, makes good passes, good reads, works very very hard on the court on BOTH ends, unselfish and makes winning plays You can tell he’s had to earn every minute he has gotten. On top of that, the mans an athletic freak from a measurement standpoint. 6’5/6’6 with a 7’1ft Wingspan AND it was also reported that he’s not fully developed and still growing. Possible he grows to 6’7. Similar to how Giannis grew about an inch in the pros”
    Reddit poster

    Reports are that Ntilikina is not an athletic freak at all. He’s got great length but is not a big-time runner and jumper.

    @67 – he’s also just 18. Giannis also came with the “not that explosive” description…

    from DX back in 2013:

    Exceptionally smooth and fluid, Adetokunbo still hasn’t reached his full potential as an athlete, which makes sense if you consider he turned 18 three months ago and has grown 8 cm (a little over three inches) in the past ten months, and still might not be done growing. He’s still working on his balance on the defensive end, and isn’t an incredibly explosive leaper, something that could change as his lower body strength improves. – Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Giannis-Antetokounmpo-7223/ ©DraftExpress

    Supposedly tall, long Frank (not our Frank) is coming in tomorrow for his medical testing. I hope it’s all done at the Air France lounge at JFK and he’s out of here.

    Reports are that Ntilikina is not an athletic freak at all. He’s got great length but is not a big-time runner and jumper.

    6’7 guards don’t have to be athletic freaks. They just need the experience to learn to leverage their size, height and length in ways that benefit their games. But I also believe its too soon to close the physical book on a young man with a large growing frame he has yet to fill out.

    I’ll say it again- 4.5 fouls per 36 without a ton of steals and blocks to show for it in the French League is worrisome. Plus pretty average assist/turnover numbers for a two let alone a one. Those numbers suggest Frank’s probably two years out from serious minutes in the NBA and anybody that far out from being a regular rotation player is a big risk. Maybe he’s one worth taking, I don’t know. Is counting on a guy to develop a more explosive first step a better bet than getting a guy to improve his jumper or decision-making?

    LOL @55 wins

    You gotta admit he nailed his 55 win prediction last year doe

    I’ll say it again- 4.5 fouls per 36 without a ton of steals and blocks to show for it in the French League is worrisome.

    I will tell you what MLB scouts tell baseball fans all of the time. You don’t scout the box scores in the minors for prospects who project upside.

    I’m not very optimistic about Frank. He has the biggest bust potential in the top-10 IMO.

    He reminds me a lot Bruno Caboclo. A big guard with a huge wingspan, who used to be a backup in a weak league without almost any number to evaluate.

    His upside is mostly the same too. Good shooter with great defensive potential.

    Cabloco so far has been a huge waste of space and money for the Raptors. That doesn’t mean that he will be a bust. I just find very risky for the 8th pick.

    Caboclo was drafted with the 20th pick.

    It’s was an OK gamble since the Raptors already had a good team, I guess.

    Unless Isaac slips to 8, I’d be very happy with Frank N. Get a 2nd first rounder and draft a wing, and trade for Rubio. Unload Melo, and let’s play!

    I have a sick feeling that we end up with Monk. Trying to convince myself I’m ok with it IF we get Rubio to go with him.

    @77 Don’t be sick. Phil will draft the right guy. Maybe 3 of them.

    I sure hope that we can end the season tonight so that we can concentrate on making the Knicks great again.

    One of the biggest red flags for Frank is that he plays in a 2nd tier league in Europe. While the ACB and Euroleague is equivalent or maybe even better than D-1 NCAA, Frank’s league is not. Kind of like a mid-major player in the NCAA, you have to take their accomplishments with a grain of salt. The fact that Frank cannot manage more consistency and aggressiveness verses lesser competition is worrisome.

    In the LNB Pro A, young players get pulled for making mistakes. There is no room for error where he plays so you have to consider what that does for a player’s mentality. I think his stats should be disregarded altogether (except for his shooting stats because shooters shoot) and he should be evaluated based on his film alone. He struggles to finish around the basket, but he can shoot the ball at a decent clip and his handle is advanced for his stage in development. If we draft him I’m going to record his summer league film and watch it over and over again.

    If I remember correctly KP’s numbers in Europe weren’t that impressive either.

    This is mostly not true. He was third overall in Kevin Pelton’s statistical model of the 2015 draft, it was what made me somewhat at peace with the pick. To be sure, there were concerns about whether or not the numbers would translate (there still are, I guess) but they were there. The same just isn’t true of Ntilikina.

    I don’t like the idea of drafting someone in the top 10 based on exactly zero empirical data, but there is probably a scenario in which the first 7 picks play out in a way that makes me okay with Ntilikina.

    If we pick him over Isaac or Smith Jr. though, I’ll lose my fuckin’ mind.

    With that said, I think Frank is a shooting guard. Put him next to Luka Doncic and you have a guard tandem.

    Kevin Pelton’s statistical model of the 2015 draft

    The same statistical model which had D’Angelo Bustell in the top 2 positions?

    The same statistical model which had D’Angelo Bustell in the top 2 positions?

    Yes, D’Angelo Russell had very good college numbers. So did Anthony Bennett, Michael Beasley, and a whole bunch of other guys. The numbers are definitely wrong sometimes.

    I still prefer their track record to the “well have you seen his tape” approach, though.

    I still prefer their track record to the “well have you seen his tape” approach, though.

    Is there proof his record is any better indicator of success than traditional scouting or just plain old throwing darts on a board?

    Having actually watched a game I’d say that using box score metrics to judge him is pretty dumb. He’s tasked with bringing the ball up the floor, which he did today just fine even against pressure, something he struggle with previously, and then clearing out to the corner after passing it to their top option. He did run some basic PNR’s including a really big possession late in the game when they had blown a 7 point lead and fell behind by 3 with under 4 left and he finished with his left hand and drew contact for an and 1.

    I still view him more as a combo or a 2 than a 1, but yeah, if you’re using the numbers to dictate your choice on him he’s going to look bad, because his role isn’t one where he’ll put up numbers. That he moved from the bench and is now starting for a team that’s reached the finals of the league playoffs is probably a better indicator of performance and improvement than citing per 40 stats or waiting for a statistical projection.

    Years back, I read an article on the draft that argued two things:

    1) Players with strong college numbers may or may not become great NBA players.
    2) Players with poor college numbers do not become great NBA players.

    We should not be arguing that players who sucked in college might end up good in the NBA. There’s no evidence for it aside from vague descriptors like “explosive” and “upside” and “intangibles” and shit like that.

    We should be determining who the best players were in the NCAA, and whether those skills will translate to the NBA.

    Jowles

    I agree, but in the case of Frank it’s very hard to say because he’s playing in a role where he really isn’t supposed to do much other than spot up and run PNR on very rare occasions. He wouldn’t even be my pick at 8, but I think using his stats to form an opinion about him is really incomplete.

    @88,

    Josh Jackson will fail and Luke Kennard will likely be a good player in the league for a decade. Smith Jr will ball as long as he doesn’t tear a knee ligament. Same with Fultz. Donovan Mitchell played great ball in the ACC this year (for close to 60% of his minute sample) and his film is pretty good. I’d be confident he can decelop into an Avery Bradley type in the right organization.

    The Knicks should not draft anybody because we are obviously not the right organization.

    JVG is a big defender of Khloe Kardashian. Who knew?

    We should not be arguing that players who sucked in college might end up good in the NBA.

    This is broadly true, but the more one & done players and kids from Europe you get in the draft the less true it becomes. There are definitely good NBA players who weren’t particularly good when they were 18 or 19. It’s one of the things that make the draft even more difficult.

    Lebron probably could have been the best PG of all time if he’d wanted to be.

    Kyrie is enough fuego, but the refs are making this game unwatchable.

    How the fuck you score 86 points in the first half of an NBA finals game?

    Also I have absolutely no confidence that the team who put up 86 is going to win.

    That was the greatest offensive display I’ve ever seen. Wow against a great Defense

    The Cavs could still lose
    They might need 160 points to hold on.

    Wow Lebron has an “uninterrupted” commercial right before the finals game comes back fromncommercial . He’s making CASH

    Anyone who said this Finals was boring is a fucking reub.

    I know all he does is score but Kyrie is sure fun to watch when he’s on.

    I take back everything I said about the NBA being in trouble. It was freaking amazing last night. Like others have said here, though, the Cavs were up like 18 with 10 min left and I still thought they might lose.

    So here is the amazing Lebron stat of the day–
    in the 4 games (192 minutes) of the finals so far, Cleveland is -25 in point differential.

    In the 166 minutes Lebron has been on the floor, Cleveland is actually +1 per 100 poss
    In the 26 minutes Lebron has been off the floor, Cleveland is -47.9 per 100 possessions

    This HAS to be a finals / playoffs record. A net rating of +48.9 in a guy who has played 86.4% of the minutes?!!??

    Cleveland’s ORtg with Lebron OFF the floor is 66.9. No one else on the team has an off-floor ORtg of less than 105.7. In other words, the Cavs are basically a middle school basketball team without Lebron on the floor, and all the other guys are immaterial.

    If anything — this is an argument that the Cavs don’t need more defense — they actually need someone who can actually orchestrate real playoff offense when Lebron is off the floor. That makes a tiny case that Melo might be useful to them.

    What makes Lebron so ridiculously valuable is that he’s not only a high usage highly efficient scorer (which is invariably very difficult to replace), he’s also their real PG a lot of the time. The offense runs through him a lot of the time. So when he’s off the floor, not only are you losing the scoring efficiency, you don’t have an effective PG getting good shots for the other players. (oh yeah, he’s also a great rebounder for the position and even though his defense has slipped, he’s still above average)

    By the way, imo Larry Bird is underrated for similar reasons. He was a scorer, the offense ran through him, and he was a great floor spacer, though they didn’t understand how to use that as effectively as they should have back in those days.

    Have you noticed though that Lebron’s seasonal WS48 stats have dropped from the .300 range to the .220 range over the past few years?

    Have you noticed though that Lebron’s seasonal WS48 stats have dropped from the .300 range to the .220 range over the past few years?

    He’s probably at that age where’s he losing 1/2 step, but I think he’s also learned to try to stay fresh for the playoffs.

    I think it’s mostly mailing it in rather than losing athleticism–he’s maybe a hair slower than a few years ago on the offensive end.

    He knows he’s gonna be playing 46 mins a game come playoff time and he exerts himself accordingly

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