[New York Post] – Mon, 10 Jun 2024 23:34:00 GMT
- Thunder could seriously complicate Knicks Isaiah Hartenstein plans
- NBA Rumors: Thunder Interested in Knicks’ Isaiah Hartenstein Ahead of Free Agency
- Thunder Could Make Serious Run At Hartenstein
- OKC Thunder Has ‘Real’ Interest in New York Knicks Center Ahead of NBA Free Agency
- Thunder looked upon as ‘top threat’ for Isaiah Hartenstein
[Sports Illustrated] – Mon, 10 Jun 2024 16:31:48 GMT
- What would a Timberwolves-Knicks trade involving KAT look like?
- Knicks ‘100% Expected’ to Pursue Trade of $221 Million Star Big Man: NBA Exec
- Knicks insider confirms what fans already believed about potential star trade
- Knicks News: New York Reportedly To Pursue 4-Time All-Star If Available
- New York Knicks Listed as Popular Trade Destination for $221,000,000 Star Which May See Them Let Go of Julius Randle
[New York Post] – Tue, 11 Jun 2024 01:57:00 GMT
- Knicks’ Josh Hart trolls Mikal Bridges after Nets question: ‘Are you OK?’
- Mikal Bridges Tries to Recruit Knicks’ Josh Hart to Nets in Response to IG Photo
- Stefan Bondy: Mikal Bridges asks if Josh Hart is joining the Nets. Josh Hart asks if Mikal Bridge
- “Might quit my day job” – Josh Hart’s newfound side gig has his Villanova teammate attempting to recruit him to Nets
- Josh Hart Tries to Rescue Mikal Bridges from Nets as NBA Stars Flout Tampering Rules on IG: “If They Have You Hostage”
[Empire Sports Media] – Mon, 10 Jun 2024 17:00:00 GMT
Knicks land All-Star wing in blockbuster mock trade
[Hoops Habit] – Mon, 10 Jun 2024 12:00:00 GMT
Predicting where the NBA’s top 20 free agents will play in 202425
[Empire Sports Media] – Mon, 10 Jun 2024 14:08:41 GMT
- Knicks bring 3-point shooting guard in for free agent workout
- New York Knicks Bring In Former Top 10 Pick
- Knicks to Host Former 6th Overall Pick for Free-Agent Visit: Report
134 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2024.06.11)”
This is categorically wrong. Whether OG gets paid $32MM or $37MM is likely the difference between exceeding the first apron or not, and that has a significant impact on our ability to finish the job.
Again, I don’t see the point of this conversation.
Is it that Leon should consider cap implications when negotiating for OG? He has the best capologist in the business, so my guess it that he has that covered.
Is it that he should pay OG as little as possible but not risk losing him? Sure, okay.
Is it that how much OG gets paid will have cap implications? Agreed. Everyone knows that.
Is it that OG’s theoretical market value in a vacuum is $32M AAV and Leon might have to pay OG significantly above that because he is not negotiating in a vacuum? Either one agrees with that valuation or doesn’t, but it doesn’t matter because the stakes are too high to draw a line in the sand at that theoretical point. The unanimous feeling here is that there is no “feasible” price at which losing OG makes sense right now, cap be damned. It doesn’t make an iota of difference what “similar” or even better players are getting paid unless you can shift gears and acquire them instead, or are willing to take that risk. If that’s not what one is advocating for, then the conversation is pointless.
It should be pointed out that conversations about whether a particular player would be worth the salary they might get paid are not always pointless. It was relevant in the IQ negotiations before he chose to go RFA. It was relevant both before and after RJ got extended. It was relevant both before and after Julius got extended. And Mitch when the season opened until the point he was extended. And Donte. The stakes involved, the options available, and the leverage imbalances were different at those points in time, at least I think they are. For example, we had zero leverage over Mitch, he could have signed for more if more was offered and we had no ability to match.
But once you have invested picks/players in an acquisition, the cards are pretty much on the table. See: Josh Hart, who maybe is overpaid but that was a done deal from the moment he was traded for. Does it have cap implications? Sure.
And some even brought up that Brunson might be an overpay at the number it would take to pry him from Dallas. But that was a done deal as well, there was almost certainly no line in the sand. It is possible that Brunson wanted to be on the most team-friendly contract possible as far as structuring went, but not anything significant. Was there a cap risk that he would turn out to be a good backup but nothing more, i.e. a $15-20M AAV player? Sure.
The larger point is, no one seems to be advocating for Leon to negotiate against himself and pay OG more than least he can pay him. Is anyone actually arguing that he’s worth $40M AAV so just start there and pay the man? If the argument is that Leon shouldn’t do that, I wholeheartedly agree.
Stupid question, prompted by all of the recent cap/apron/tax discussion: what specifically does it mean when a team gets “hard capped at the first apron”? That’s been discussed as a downside of using one of the exceptions this year. But we did that with DDV last year, and it didn’t seem to create any problems with us in terms of making other moves during the season.
I think it means that once you use an exception that is connected to a given level, you can’t then exceed the level on which that exception is based. If the Knicks were above the first apron, they wouldn’t have had access to that exception, so by taking it, they commit to staying at or below that level. Seems to make sense.
On an actually controversial topic, am I the only one who feels that Alex Sarr is hands down the guy who should be picked at #1, regardless of need? Or that Clingan shouldn’t be in the top 10? Or that Topic’s shot looks broken?
Chet Holmgren finished second in the rookie of the year voting to an ungodly generational talent — and finished over 200 points above the third place finisher (who’s going to be an all star very soon).
I’m struggling to imagine iHart going somewhere he’ll get 15 minutes a game as a backup. Maybe that’s me.
Maybe it’s a smart move on OKC’s part in case Chet snaps in two. But even matrimonial discord aside, I’m having trouble seeing it without it being a transformational bag.
obviously they’d only bid up for him if they wanted to play them together some, eg ihart could play 28 mpg and chet 33mpg but staggered, leaving only 13mpg or so together, depending on the matchup. this is sort of like adams and jjj who would often play 15 or so mpg together and 23-25mpg apart or KAT and Rudy who were playing 20mpg together and 25mpg apart this year. chet’s ability/willingness to take over 5 3pas per 36 makes this an obvious possibility. that combined with ihart’s passing and movement gives you far less congestion than, say, the 11 mpg that AD and dwight howard played together during the 19-20 playoffs.
part of the theory of it for okc almost necessarily would have to be to give chet a chance to play some 4, especially against teams with bruising 5s and/or 4s/wings guys he can hide and be a killer roamer against. he sometimes did that already anywhere when he played with kenrich williams this year.
but it’s a tough call for them on two fronts. they have to largely give up their 5-out scheme for those combo meal minutes. it’s not like towns where this is a huge hindrance for chet, specifically, but it’s almost surely a bug for the offense overall. it’s hard to say how much ihart’s passing and screening can offset this. some opposing offenses might also play the two big chet-hart lineup off the court, but in most cases i think the defense would benefit.
the other downside is just that ihart is good but he’s not THAT good. he can’t shoot outside the paint and he’s not a good roll finisher. he’s also not as good on the defensive boards or muscling guys up as an ideal chet pairing. even though a monster two year deal seem like all upside to them, it does come with the big opportunity cost of adding someone even better in their magical rookie scale window, even if that player isn’t immediately available on july 1.
That’s because we traded Obi Toppin away for peanuts to give us some room to work with. Hence the importance of OG’s first year salary. We don’t really know what Leon’s thoughts are on the apron, but if he’s committed to staying under it and he follows last year’s blueprint then the ramifications of paying OG top dollar would likely include one of the following:
– trading Mitch for peanuts like we traded Obi
– punting on our first round picks
– shortening the bench even further by eschewing veterans like Burks and Precious to fill end-of-bench roles from the Jefferies/Toppin bin
Trading Mitch would be the worst case scenario but it would create the most flexibility.
If that’s not what one is advocating for, then the conversation is pointless.
it’s only the specific normative framing that’s unhelpful: we should offer what’s “fair.” the actual conversation about the extent to which OG might turn out to be a hindrance at salary X in some very possible futures isn’t trivial, especially versus the topical competition.
Maybe, we don’t need people to police what everyone else is allowed to discuss. If people want to discuss the cap ramifications of certain moves they’re allowed to and if you don’t want to discuss that then talk about something else.
FWIW, by my calculations if we retain Bojan, make our 1st round picks, and re-sign both OG and Hartenstein I think we’re definitely over the 1st apron. We are only $45M below the 1st apron with Bojan and both our 1st rounders. Bojan’s contract is $19M and becomes fully guaranteed June 28. Our two 1st rounders are $2.7 and $2.8.
I have to say that if there’s one name bandied about as a trade target for the Knicks that I sense might actually happen、it’s Ingram. I’m saying this without fear of jinxing anything, because I don’t even know if I want him. But it just seems like New Orleans might want to shake things up because apparently they don’t want Valanciunas back (he’ll be an unrestricted free agent), Ingram doesn’t fit that well with Zion and they may need help making changes because they are a small market team that is unwilling to go over the cap.
Yes… everyone understands there are cap implications to salaries in aggregate. I still don’t understand the point you are making. The Knicks were 17-15 before the trade on a pace for the 8-9 seed. After they traded for OG they ended up in the two seed. Had they kept RJ and IQ they’d be looking down the same barrel trying to extend IQ at a price they weren’t comfortable with. I have to believe they knew what parameters they are looking at salary wise with OG before the trade.
Cliffs notes: multiple significant salaries bump teams up against cap rules and restrictions. The key is getting the right mix of players that improve the probability of winning. Rose seems to have done a pretty good job of that.
I may be quite obtuse, but I don’t get the discussion like there is/was a better alternate plan. Even if they have to pay him the max (with the apron implications), I like that iteration of the Knicks better than with RJ and IQ on extended contracts.
And we reportedly spoke with the Pels about an Ingram-for-Mitch/Bogey deal not long ago, right? Or am I starting to conflate random fan proposals on RealGM with reported news?
We have no choice but to sign OG for whatever number it takes. Like others, I hope that there’s already a mostly reasonable number that Leon and Leon Jr. have agreed to. That said, if OG signs for the high end of his range (i.e., $40+ mil), and then Brunson signs the extension now rather than waiting for free agency, it’ll create an odd cap hiccup where our best player is making substantially less than the guy who’s either our second or third best player. And then there would be the question of whether Julius also wants to maximize his dollars (totally his right to do so), or if he’s also willing to sacrifice cash to make it easier to build/maintain the team around him, Julius, and OG.
And there’s also the question of whether Leon should/would make some kind of promise to Julius — who loves playing here — to not trade him, at least for a while, if he signs for a lower amount.
So since we’re at something of an impasse on OG, let’s pivot to your Question of the Day:
Leaving aside how much Brunson, OG, or anyone else on the team will be making, what is a salary you’re comfortable playing our two-time All-NBA power forward on his next contract?
I mean, NOT signing OG is not even an option, right? If OG walks and he turns out to have been a rental, what do you even do in that case? That’s an incredibly unpalatable option.
Apron, shmapron, this team just doesn’t work without the guy so he has ALL the leverage.
Like the Knicks, OKC has to make their big signings before their extensions kick in, so of course they’re going to be considering useful free agents this summer. They also have a nice trade chip in Giddey… makes me wonder if a Giddey/Kinrich Williams for Mitch trade might make some sense. Then they get their secondary rim protector/defender and still have a lot of money left over for another wing. They could also just draft Filipowski and get a FA wing. I like iHart a lot but feel like there might be some better options out there for OKC.
No one is “policing” Hubert, some of us are wondering what the point is. They traded for a player who made them vastly better and if they don’t resign him (or find some unimaginable Dr. Spock 3 dimensional chess move/trade) they are bleeped. That is stipulated.
They could have stood pat and been the 8-9 seed and be facing paying IQ a price they weren’t comfortable paying while still having RJ on the books and be in a similar place salary wise.
Everyone understands if you have a bunch of good to very good players on non rookie contracts, you will have cap problems. What is the point?
You draft Ryan Dunn and pray that he learns to shoot lol.
Giddey played his ass off for the last third of the season after it became clear that his rather serious personal problems were behind him. I don’t think he’s a guy they need to upgrade.
https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/rumor-thunder-most-likely-to-poach-isaiah-hartenstein-from-knicks
[Extremely fake Pete Campbell voice] Not great, Bob!
I have to say that if there’s one name bandied about as a trade target for the Knicks that I sense might actually happen、it’s Ingram. I’m saying this without fear of jinxing anything, because I don’t even know if I want him.
think ingram would be a mistake under almost any circumstances. ingram, randle and brunson are a rough fit on both ends.
iHart has played on 5 teams in his 6 year career. His mom says he loves NY. He is about to have his first kid. If we get outbid, throw in a no-trade clause.
If he has made 13.4 million in the last 5 years and his kids aren’t taken care of for life, he need a new financial advisor. My ex works for Morgan Stanley wealth management and I can send him her number 🙂
I can understand if a guy wants 100M over 72M, but the reason won’t be because his family won’t be set for life on 85M over 113M. Do people write that stuff and expect people to believe/ sympathize with it?
I quoted someone who literally said there are zero implications to paying OG extra money.
The aprons are still new and it’s normal for one of us to not understand some of the rules.
Snuck a peek at the OKC subreddit about the Hartenstein rumor. Some really like the fit. Others are skeptical and think it’s been planted by iHart’s agent as a bargaining chip.
It’s not. But what we have to sacrifice to re-sign him becomes part of the cost or acquiring him, so it would be really helpful if we can sign him at a level that doesn’t require the further release of assets. I like to run scenarios for the Knicks and OG’s salary is the hardest variable to project. At the low end, we have an abundance of possibilities. At the high end, we may not like the repercussions.
I’m really not sure. I wouldn’t expect anything to happen before the draft. Teams need to know who they pick and also want to know the status of their own free agents. That said, if it was already discussed in the press, my experience is it never actually happens.
Others are skeptical and think it’s been planted by iHart’s agent as a bargaining chip.
They do know that OG’s agent is Leon’s son…
I am a hard no on Ingram. Just don’t like his game. He’s not quite like RJ but he kind of represents the best case peak for RJ. And it’s good not great on offense and bad to mediocre on defense.
If we have a team next year without both OG and IHart I will be really disappointed.
They do know that OG’s agent is Leon’s son…
bit of a brainfart there…just sign both of them
Part of the calculus is going to be how much the new TV deal raises the salary cap. That being said, Randle’s played atrociously in the playoffs, finished both of the last two seasons injured, and is about to turn 30. I wouldn’t be offering anything close to a max and probably not a pay raise over his current contract. I also don’t think I’d be willing to go more than 3 years.
I think we’ll find the repercussions of not resigning him a lot less palatable 🙂
You are describing a lottery team
Really flies in the face of those who think iHart wouldn’t have jumped at a 3rd year if Leon had offered it.
And honestly if you’re going to trade a lottery pick in a stacked draft to sign a guy, you really should be willing to go three years.
Agree on Ingram. He also just isn’t really what we need (he does have positional size but doesn’t use it effectively.)
I think IG and iHart both likely stay, but the cap hit is a legit concern. We still have our firsts to trade for bench pieces like Trey Lyles/Bones Hyland types while still getting extra 2nds in return to grab some developmental guys.
I guess I’m fine with just running it back but strengthening the bench to 12-deep while still adding some rookies for the future.
Alan… who is the genius who wrote this article? Doesn’t he realize IHart played the 23-24 season and was paid 9.2M? He made 22 M in his 6 seasons. Jeez… this passes for journalism…. it’s a pretty big difference,
So now we are in Leon death by a thousand cuts mode?
You want to criticize Leon for ONLY giving IHart 2 years when none of the other 29 GMs thought to give him a better offer. The Clips thought so much of him (they couldn’t resign him for more than 20% increase in salary unless they wanted to use their mid level exception) , but chose to give it to John Wall instead.
If you felt it a mistake by Leon to expect I Hart off his 22 season would warrant a contract beginning at greater than 16.2M this year, you are some Jean Dixon sort of seer, because no one, including you saw that coming.
“Alan… who is the genius who wrote this article? Doesn’t he realize IHart played the 23-24 season and was paid 9.2M? He made 22 M in his 6 seasons. Jeez… this passes for journalism…. it’s a pretty big difference,”
Let’s be exact about this if we’re going to do it: He’s made $22,655,097.
This blog is full of time travelers!
Bob, fair is fair. If Leon ends up trading what could have been the Jalen Williams pick for two years of iHart, it’s going to take one of his best moves and move it over to the biggest blunders side of the ledger.
And if OKC ends up with Williams and Hartenstein, it’s going to be pretty hard to argue against Mr Presti’s methods vis-a-vis Leon.
I’m not a “professional journalist”. I give my musings on a hoops message board 🙂 But the guy was way off base and should be ashamed of himself. I’m ashamed of myself for not picking it up quicker…
As opposed to what actually is?
In most precincts, overpaying for OG so that you can then be trapped into again having to overpay for OG doesn’t exactly smack of enlightened, intelligent management.
OG’s impending unrestricted free agency was widely-known public knowledge at the time of the acquisition.
The “lottery pick for Isaiah Hartenstein” transaction was a poor one. Poor strategically, poor tactically.
Just a +1 on what Owen said. Ingram’s not what we need. OG and iHart are.
And don’t be making fun of people who don’t understand the aprons or I might start to take that personally…
Frankly, the only question is how much OG wants to use the basically unlimited leverage he has. If he tells the Knicks “I want 5/$245M or I’m walking” and they think he means it, he’s getting $245M. We can only hope this stuff has been ironed out already. Father’s Day is coming up, so hopefully OG’s agent, Sam Rose, does something nice for his father.
The OKC two-year balloon payment possibility is menacing, but if iHart is willing to take a short-term deal in general, are we sure he wouldn’t prefer to take one from the Knicks with a wink and a nod about what would happen after we secure his full bird rights? I remain cautiously optimistic about the situation, partially because being the starting center for a good New York Knicks team sounds a lot cooler than being Chet Holmgren’s enforcer in Oklahoma. I am aware money talks, but we’re not talking about night-and-day differences here.
It was definitely a mistake to give up a lottery pick for iHart on Earth 97 where that happened
Our space under the apron after signing our rookies if we waive Sims, Diakite, and Jeffries is about $51 million not $45. Once we resign IHart and OG we will have 11 players and one roster hold so effectively it is more like $49 million or if we went all the way to 15 roster spots on minimum salaries it would be about $43 million. Even if we traded both 1st round picks, it would save us only about $1.5 million.
We cannot stay below the first apron if we keep Bojan and resign both OG and IHart unless they both take major discounts and we don’t use our last couple roster spots, making our our 1sts or trading them makes no meaningful difference to us staying below the apron this year.
Unless we have a trade lined up, I think the best move is to waive Bojan. That saves us $17 million. If OG gets about $35 million and IHart gets the full $16 million, we could then use around $10-12 million on the MLE, keep both our 1sts, sign roster spots 13-15 to minimum deals, and still be a hair under the 1st apron.
If the MLE is a good signing that contract will have more value than Bojan’s moving forward.
I’m not worried about OG. If anything, this front office is extremely risk averse, so there is no way they would have made that trade without having the general contours ironed out. I also don’t think OG tries to come back for that Game 7 unless he knows he’s a Knick for the foreseeable future. People can change their minds, but I doubt that’s what’s happening here.
I-Hart is tricky. Does a 2 years, $50m offer from OKC sway him? Wouldn’t you rather have the security of 4/72m? And like TNFH says, at that point doesn’t it makes sense to take a 1+1/38m (or thereabouts) offer from the Knicks, with a wink wink arrangement that you will opt out after the first year and get the full truckload? I think chances are better than 50-50 that he returns. I’d say he leaves if he’s offered something like 4/100 or more, at which point it’s hard to justify the pay difference. But OKC won’t do that, I don’t think, and the teams that would are much less appealing and need much more than a center.
Am I the only one here who fucking loves ripping a massive fart at a crowded bank of urinals in a busy airport. DFW is great for it. Like that’s the place you do it and everyone just kind of has to just be pissing. And if someone answers you with any kind of vigor, suddenly you’re all connected by that moment for life.
As for Randle, unless he takes in the neighborhood of 3 years $60 million on his next deal, I don’t see a contract that makes sense for us. I think we need to trade him sooner rather than later. I don’t want to pay him $35+ million for any seasons after age 31 which is the entirety of his next contract/extension.
If we give him a huge contract it’s going to age like Wall’s, Westbrook’s, or best case Beal’s contract.
The idea is that OKC would give him a four year balloon payment bc he’d still be easily movable after 2 years, so we are in fact talking about a night-and-day difference.
That’s what makes Bernie Earnie’s idea about the NTC compelling.
It most certainly is, as this is just mental masturbation. My point is, is it necessary to raise the same issue over and over and over again? Can we at least wait til something bad happens? You don’t particularly like Leon. And that’s fine.
We get it.
I have a feeling I’m going to regret asking….. but why DFW?
I mean, does Ihart wanna win a championship? Does he like wanna win? What if he wants to win.
A lot of players who look movable in year 0 become immovable by year 2 for various reasons. I-Hart’s Achilles could become a real issue, for example. Centers can be volatile. I am not sure OKC would want to risk getting stuck with the contract once they need to pay their core. Sure, they could attach draft picks to dump him, but this could blow in their faces a bit. So for that commitment, they would really need to be convinced that I-Hart is a huge difference maker for them, and I’m not sure that’s the case.
There’s an abundance of beer guts and overall carby bobs whose bellies prevent them from encroaching the urinal during a pee. When it happens your peripheral eye contact is choice. Especially having a very healthy stream it already has their attention. Then the brown note hits and you get that little shadow of a head tilt. And then the harmony hits it puts a little down on that frown. Just enough in the whispers and you have a community.
It’s already happened — they lost to a 6 seed in the second round.
Plus, it’s fair to anticipate and contemplate very near term bad possibilities.
Brown note.
A report came out.
Alan posted it.
We’re gonna talk about it.
You are welcome to engage Z-Man about who the Hawks should take at #1 instead.
Also, everyone here is friends, right?
“Am I the only one here who fucking loves ripping a massive fart at a crowded bank of urinals in a busy airport. DFW is great for it. Like that’s the place you do it and everyone just kind of has to just be pissing. And if someone answers you with any kind of vigor, suddenly you’re all connected by that moment for life.”
Yes, you’re likely the only one.
By this logic, OKC should be panicking and looking to trade Chet and Shai to start a new rebuild. After all, they were the 1 seed and they lost to the 5th seed in 6 games. And the Twolves lost to the 5th seed in 5 games!
Yes, you’re likely the only one
Numbers please.
My comment wasn’t remotely addressed to this.
But that said, on the thing you seem to want to discuss, it’s unclear how/why that’s a mic drop.
If Brunson isn’t a tentpole, the Knicks are a teardown.
iHart is gone…have to accept it and move on; everyone plugged in knows this. He hinted with a Thank You NY video on his IG.
Can’t say they didn’t try though….benching, limiting his passsing skills, injury, minutes restrictions and being the worst team in the league in passing to roll man did not work in us keeping his value at or below $17M aav. Whould you give a discount to an employer like this?
There will be a bidding war, Presti put himself in a position to win and have an amazingly efficient regular season team that will flirt with 70 wins.
I think he will end up with a 2yr ~$65m but to us the exact number is irrelevant. All it matters is that this stupid rule prevents Leon from paying him. And thats how the cookie crumbles sometimes.
Ps. Wife was the first to express her frustration that hes nopt being used right. The NYK/wife model argument is silly now that she’s a Mom.
I’m starting to think that “Clarence Beeks” is none other than Mr. Philip Douglas Jackson himself. If it is you, Phil, hide an Eagles song title somewhere in your next post, k?
The burden of proof is on you, not me. Guess you’ll just have to see if anyone chimes in with a “me, too” or a “yes, I do.”
Totally agree with Jon here, i love Monica’s passion for basketball. And so good that she is one of ours. 🧡💙
We are one or at most two moves away. From what I’ve read, it’s very unlikely we have to worry about aprons until after we start dealing with Brunson, Randle etc…
What exactly am I trying to prove? I just want to know if you enjoy farting as much as I do Doogie. You think I’m the only one that really likes to fart around these parts. I have my doubts. Mind you I’m functionally comfortably numb what with these delta eights so I don’t know if I’m even really farting anymore. But I think the Knicks could win with Brunson even if he wasn’t one of the five best players in the world so long as he’s about as good as he was last year for a bit.
None of those words are in the bible, but doesn’t sound great.
That’s bad news for kp and the Celtics. Bummer.
i think we had a fairly robust (no pun intended) fart discussion a few months back…but if we are heading down that path again…I mean…unless you misjudge the type of fart (eg, might mess up your knickers)…how can you answer no to that type of question…regardless of which airport urinal…some of my favorites are at football stadiums…just seems more clubby than the antiseptic nature of the airport setting..
And that is exactly the type of injury that you get from playing on compromised tissue. The knees are rarely where it starts but too often where it ends. Make sure to get your soleas massaged when you get manual therapy.
Then why did you make it?
Because it did address the thing it addressed — which was something completely different than what you said.
You’ve been talking about nothing else since before the playoffs began. Also, thanks for reminding me why I should just shut up the next time someone accuses you of being an anti-semite next time.
Enjoy!
“Shams Charania
@ShamsCharania
Celtics say Kristaps Porzingis is day-to-day for the NBA Finals with this “rare injury” that is unrelated to his previous calf strain.”
I suspect they’ll give him a game off and see what happens. If they lose they can bring him back for game 4. If they win, they can take their time or leave him off for the rest of the series.
We definitely need to worry about the 1st apron this summer. If we keep Bojan and re-sign OG and Hartenstein we’ll definitely be over the 1st apron. Both Randle and Brunson have player options for 2025-26 so we’re really close to having to worry about the 2nd apron.
Strat, he’s done for the year. Probably needs surgery, and if so, it’s at least 4 months before he can play again, and can take as much as a year. 80% success rate on the surgery, meaning he may never play again.
Of course, 5 minutes of Google research may be wrong, but suffice to say the photos did not look good.
Edit: not photos specifically of KP, just the injury pre and post-aurgery
Edit 2: I’m not going to correct that typo, which seems apropos
I hate the Caitlin Clark story.
Everyone in the media is tiptoeing around the truth instead of just dealing with reality. It’s an all too common unproductive way of discussing issues.
This is way outside my area of knowledge, but if that’s the case why didn’t the Celtics just say so?
If the pain is controllable and playing won’t cause further damage they can deal with it after the finals, assuming they even need him.
https://x.com/NBCSCeltics/status/1800602156858306903
This sounds similar to the Curt Schilling World Series “Bloody Sock” injury
What’s the truth?
No, I don’t. Not at all. I truly don’t.
Just for the sake of being optimistic, Dan Hurley just said no to a contract that paid him double, so not everyone is guided just by money. Perhaps Hartenstein might be similarly minded.
And on the OG front, maybe the extension was agreed before he was traded here. If OG and his agent were to honor that agreement, we may be spared to pay him the max.
Also, if Brunson does take the contract extension now (which would pay him less than if he waits) might rally everyone to make a sacrifice to keep the team together.
Nah, iserp. The worst outcome is what will happen for every player, contract, trade and draft pick the Knicks might make. Don’t you know?
I don’t think they really know at this point.
The only structure he seems to have injured is the medial retinaculum which isn’t weight bearing. It is a band of fascia that goes over the Medial Malleous (the bottom part of the Tibia). Its purpose is to form a channel or tunnel for the tendons that control the foot to pass through, holding them in place and not allowing them to slide over the Malleous and dislocate.
I guess they are evaluating if they can jury-rig something similar to what was done to Curt Schilling in the World Series. He is going to need that fascia repaired at some point.
Pure speculation….
At least on some level many people still identify themselves with the group that is most similar to themselves. It could be country, ethnic background, race, religion, sexuality, size and other things.
We see it at the Olympics, World Cup etc..
Country supersedes race and religion and other factors in those games.
I was never in Italy, don’t speak a word of Italian, but after the Americans are out of the World Cup (the group I identify with first when it comes to international sports), I usually root for Italy because that’s where my family’s roots are.
I’m a vertically challenged guy (in other words short). So I always have a soft spot for guys like Nate Robinson and others that exceed all expectations for their size.
There are more white people than black people in this country and white people on average still have more wealth.
There are more black players than white players in the WNBA.
Put those two things together with a very talented young white prospect and it was likely we’d see some stimulated interest, hype, marketing and money flowing towards the WNBA.
That has a plus and minus.
It’s great for the WNBA and all the players financially.
It was likely to create some resentment and jealously from non white players who in many cases are better players at this stage, worked just as hard or harder to make the WNBA and never got the hype and endorsements that Clark is getting just because she’s a great player who also happens to be white. Plus she’s a rookie, so she’s getting tested also, but that’s a separate issue.
I’m not making a value judgement on any of this. Maybe I’m a bad guy for rooting for short Italian guys. 😉 I’m just calling it the way I see it.
That’s what kind of makes this OG stuff a little off putting. I rarely begrudge a player getting his bag. But here we have Randle already on a team-friendly extension. Josh Hart opted in to let the team sign Donte. Hartenstein, if he stays, will likely take a discount. And Brunson is considering a team-friendly deal, too. If OG wants to play hardball he’s essentially going to be taking all the surplus these guys are giving up for himself.
I do not know how bad the Porzingis retinaculum tear is but these injuries can be serious with long term sequelae if not handled properly. The medial channel (tarsal tunnel) is absolutely necessary for supination of the foot.
I see it the other way — the team depended on a bunch of unrepeatable things rather than take advantage of lower-cost draft picks and building things the normal, sustainable way.
And I doubt Hartenstein will stay for a discount. Maybe a teensy-tiny one, nothing significant. And if Brunson takes Door A, he’s getting value from it. He’s not doing it for the team.
If they were unrepeatable, then there wouldn’t be a bunch of them, just one, since it wouldn’t be repeatable. And yet, it was.
There really wasn’t even one — everyone got value for what they allegedly “eschewed.”
They’re going to be aproned out because they’re paying full retail and worse, they gave up too many assets for the guys they now have to pay full retail for. Lottery pick for iHart, too much for OG, etc. Plus the incinerated picks and charred picks.
Can’t survive that way.
Strat without googling do you know who Breanna Stewart is?
so they did a bunch of unrepeatable things but they didn’t even actually do them. Got it.
No other competing team is dealing with apron issues. Got it.
Or Sabrina Ionescu?
I can’t believe how much money Cade Cunningham is going to get, apparently.
Like anyone should worry about what OG is getting in a world where Cade might get maxed
Why don’t we just get a GM who predicts every future outcome perfectly? The Knicks are so stupid for not doing it.
It’s simple, elementary planning.
What’s the “gotcha” in the questions about these WNBA players?
ORD has a profound appreciation for the urinal trumpet. Got some giggles.
Interesting….
Isn’t Caitlin Clark’s whole shtick that she’s a scrappy trash talker who will talk endless streams of shit to your face during a game? Maybe that’s why she gets crunched on a screen every now and then.
She doesn’t seem to mind it, and in fact IS scrappy and tough. She seems cool as hell to me, and has made the WNBA way more spicy. She gets it: this is competition. She likes to compete. I don’t really see the big problem.
Show business aside, actual competition doesn’t really have much to do with trash talk or insults to opponents. In fact, it’s quite possible to compete really, really hard with other dudes and not say much of anything to them during the games. Dudes did it for many decades.
Although in a Podunk High game BITD in front of a few thousand people at their barn, I did challenge a guy — the other team’s “star” — to “come on, go left” in the second quarter and he kind of snorted and said, “OK, I’ll go left,” whereupon I proceeded to pick his pocket and dribble alone to the other end for an uncontested layup. I didn’t say anything to him on the way back, the point having been made and the fun having been had. It’s been awhile, but I’m pretty sure the bucket got me into double digits on the night. (Other than here and there, the continued woof is more of a 21st century showbizzy thing. The modern masses *love* their trash talk.)
I mean, we’ve all seen Bring It On.
I think we should be talking more about the size of Chennedy’s enormous cojones to flatten America’s (white) sweetheart on national TV. Maybe it would’ve have been a bit more appropriate to wait until the ball was actually inbounded, but in some ways that made it an even more impressive fuck you.
Although to be honest I’ve mostly been ignoring this story, so I have no clue what people are talking about.
Acceptance that iHart is gone is finally here, only about 6 months after I started screaming it from the rooftops.
While I give Leon his due for his good moves, not including a team option or at least 3rd year is a massive unforced error. If you’re going to spend value to take a flier on a guy like iHart, and don’t secure his Bird Rights, you are giving away the entire upside of such a move. It’s not like it would have done harm to iHart to accept a third year — it would have enabled us to beat any offer, likely putting significant upward pressure on his price range.
It’s just as I feared: we start this pivotal offseason in a huge hole losing a 3 BPM guy. Even the much-awaited star consolidation trade is unlikely to give us enough of a positive delta to overcome that.
Looks like we’ll be reminiscing about that magical January of ’23 until this group fades out of the mezzanine. Because, make no mistake — that’s where we are now and for the foreseeable future, with minimal pathways out.
January of ’24. It was *this* year.
I don’t like to fart at public urinal blocks, but I don’t like to pee at them either. In all of my 40+ years of experience I, to this day, still do not understand urinals or why men choose to stand at all.
That said… Pepper, enjoy the show tonight!
Every team in the conference semifinals except OKC is over the cap and has to worry about impending Aprons except OKC. The only reason OKC isn’t is that they got good so young. I’m a few years they will have to worry too. It seems to be built into the CBA that a good team will have enough players who deserve good salaries that you can’t pay them all what they deserve and stay away from the aprons. This gives GMs great incentives to find bargain contracts.
I bring this up because I think some criticism of our front office is unwarranted. They got an excellent deal for Ihart and he liked the deal. That’s not easy to do. It’s easy to say he didn’t do as well as Presti, but there is only one Presti. By any reasonable standard Rose did well.
Wow!!
Oh good, previously I thought it wasn’t impossible to compete without trash talking, that is a fascinating contrarian take you have there and I’d like to subscribe to your newsletter
$12.99 a month for his Substack
What impressed you so much about it?
What is the title of this Substack?
Captain Obvious?
I kid I kid.
Caitlin has had an incredible impact on every measure of public interest hut the numbers on the floor so far look terrible. Definitely not Olympic worthy.
Interested to see how it turns out.
In a vaccuum this could be true. But we had to trade a lottery pick for peanuts to give iHart that deal.
If you turn a pick with franchise-altering talent available into a two year C rental, the 27th pick in the 2023 draft, and three second round picks, that’s a terrible return.
Which draft are we complaining about?
The one where we had an easy opportunity to draft a franchise-altering talent but squandered it.
So either 2020, 2021, or 2022.
We have a very interesting mix of trash talkers and non-trash talkers on this team. OG, Brunson, and Sims never change expressions much less talk trash (of course the latter doesn’t have much to trash talk about). Although I suspect Jalen may slip a few well-chosen remarks in now and again. Mitch only seems to chat right before foul shots, and it seems he might be telling Cajun fart jokes. iHart flexes and mouths off not infrequently, Hart is a non-stop yapper (although it’s never been clear if he’s trash-talking or just trying to make friends), and Divo likes to get his opponents flat-out angry at him. Julius, on the other hand, likes to trash-talk the refs.
What franchise altering talent did we miss in 2022? Jalen Williams? He’s good, to be sure, but were we definitley going to take him if we didn’t want to trade the pick? It’s not like he was the obvious pick there.
Wow. Roisin Murphy knows how to put on a show.
Are you talking about the trade of the 2022 11th pick to OKC for three future protected first rounded on June 24, 2022? That 11th pick became Ousmane Dieng. Two of the picks we received haven’t conveyed yet and I think the third one is the 2023 27th pick you are referring to. But that trade didn’t generate cap space. More likely, you mean the trade of Noel, Burks, cash and a nice second round pick for a heavily protected 2025 second round pick on July 11, 2022. That trade created cap space, some of which was used to sign iHart on July 12. Nowhere in either trade is there anything that could be described as franchise altering talent.
Note that there are no other trades for the Knicks in 2022 that are at all relevant to this discussion. See
https://www.espn.com/nba/team/transactions/_/name/ny/season/2022
Raisin Murphy
The 27th pick in the 2023 draft referred to above became Nick Smith Jr. who is now playing in G-league.
There was also the trade of the 13th pick (Jalen Duran) to Detroit to get off Kemba’s contract.
We traded #11 for 3 picks and then traded one of those picks (#27) and multiple 2nds to get back into the draft and get pick #13 and then traded that to drop Kemba and get the Milwaukee pick.
At 11 there was Jalen Williams at 13 there was Duran, Mark Williams, Griffin, and Eason still available.
So we did directly move a lottery pick to dump salary. If that was the only way to get IHart it would have been worth it but it wasn’t.
The part that upsets me is we could have stretched Kemba or used other assets to get him off the books. We didn’t need to trade a lottery pick to do it. Except once Johnny Davis was off the board Leon didn’t want the pick so he dumped it.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/NYK/2023_transactions.html
No Doogie, it’s Roisin.
Although there’s a little doohicky over the ‘o.’
I always knew that it was Roisin. I just thought Raisin sounded more amusing, since I have no idea who it is. Yes, I know that I broke my own rule for not purposely misspelling someone’s name. I apologize to Mr. (Ms.?) Murphy, as I’m quite certain that they did not deserve it.
— Doogey (I also spelled my own nickname incorrectly on purpose, and now Murphy and I are “even” [two wrongs make a right?])
I really hope that we don’t lose either OG or IHart. The only good thing I can think to say about the situation is that I feel that we are in much more danger of losing IHart than OG, which would be better than the alternative if we have to lose just one of them.)
You have nothing to say about Jalen “Duran” Duren, Doogie? You’re really slippin’.
Yes, I saw “Duran” earlier. If I took the time to mention every single error I ever saw on here, that’s all I’d be doing all day long. 🙂 (For example, I saw “Kinrich Williams” and “vaccuum,” too, but left both of them alone.)
BenR, for some reason the nba.com page I linked doesn’t list that trade, but the ESPN page you linked does. ( And I thought I could trust the internet😄😄)
To quote your page “July 6, 2022, Traded Jalen Duren and Kemba Walker to the Detroit Pistons for a 2025 1st round draft pick. conditional 2025 1st-rd pick is MIL own, New York also receives a trade exception”
The Milwaukee pick is only top four protected and Milwaukee is getting worse. It could end up a lottery pick. It seems to me we shifted a pick into the future and got another pick in order to fix our Kemba mistake. That doesn’t seem awful to me. And, at the moment, Hartenstein is better than all the players you mentioned. I still don’t see that we gave up franchise changing talent.
Simon LeBron was the lead singer of Duren Duren.
You’re working pretty hard to avoid seeing Jalen Williams drafted at 12.