[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 7:11:02 AM
Brunson posts career-high 38, Knicks edge Spurs 117-114 AMNY
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 2:13:12 AM
Knicks play the Raptors, aim for 4th straight win WABC-TV
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 2:10:46 AM
Matt Damon rings in the new year with wife Luciana Barroso at a New York Knicks game Daily Mail
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 2:03:33 AM
Knicks play the Raptors, aim for 4th straight win Sacramento Bee
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 1:54:00 AM
Knicks’ Julius Randle has strong night on defense New York Post
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 12:55:00 AM
Knicks’ Jalen Brunson proves Gregg Popovich right with ‘monster’ game vs. Spurs Yahoo Sports
[news.google.com] — Thursday, January 5, 2023 12:00:00 AM
Randle’s resurgence keeps Knicks in thick of the East Amsterdam News
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 10:24:00 PM
Jalen Brunson’s 38-point night propels Knicks past Spurs: ‘He’s a monster’ New York Post Knicks 117, Spurs 114: Scenes from the ugliest win of the season Posting and ToastingSan Antonio Spurs at New York Knicks odds, picks and predictions USA TODAY Sportsbook Wire
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 10:18:59 PM
Highlights: Spurs at Knicks 1/4 NBA.com
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 10:13:07 PM
N.Y. Knicks 117, San Antonio 114 Trumbull Times
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 8:01:01 PM
‘Situational’ Obi Toppin Available For Knicks vs. Spurs Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 7:00:00 PM
Game Thread: Knicks vs. Spurs- 01/04/23 Posting and Toasting
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 6:30:00 PM
How to Watch New York Knicks vs. San Antonio Spurs: Free Live Stream, TV Channel, Start Time Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 6:18:02 PM
Knicks’ Obi Toppin set to return but will be ‘situational’ Empire Sports Media
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 5:47:59 PM
Stephen A. Smith says Donovan Mitchell ‘wanted’ to be with Knicks, who he says make him ‘sick’ Cavaliers Nation
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 4:53:17 PM
Who are the Knicks? How good or bad can they be in their final 44 games? The Athletic
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 3:35:52 PM
Knicks: 2 best trades to make before 2023 NBA trade deadline ClutchPoints
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 1:45:47 PM
RJ Barrett’s Injury Status For Spurs-Knicks Game Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 1:15:15 PM
NBA DFS Picks Today: Jalen Brunson Flourishing in Diminished Knicks Backcourt stokastic.com
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 12:44:55 PM
San Antonio Spurs at New York Knicks odds, picks & predictions for … NorthJersey.com
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 12:15:35 PM
Sharpton calling on Knicks owner to lift ban on Charles Oakley Amsterdam News
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 11:59:45 AM
Julius Randle’s All-Star play driving Knicks’ resurgence Yahoo Sports
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 10:29:31 AM
Zach LaVine trade: Perfect offer Knicks must make for Bulls star ClutchPoints
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 10:18:26 AM
Nets emerge as NBA title favorite, but Knicks still betting underdogs … AMNY
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 9:46:23 AM
NBA rumors: Zach LaVine “monitored” for potential Knicks trade ClutchPoints
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, January 4, 2023 8:00:00 AM
Knicks News: Julius Randle’s excellence continues, Obi Toppin trade rumors Daily Knicks
51 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2023.01.05)”
We tried our best to throw away this game but luckily to no avail and now we bring our 3-games winning streak to Canada, for a subtle “meaningful” game.
Brunson had a great game, Randle was engaged on defense but inefficient on offense (both have a case of FTs-yips that needs an immediate cure), Mitch wasn’t there, some of his fouls took us in the time machine.
But the offense yesterday was really bad, with JB, Randle and, to a lesser extent, IQ taking turns in an unending sequence of isolation plays (often with the “original ballhandler” shooting without a single pass), with Glue Grimes the only starter that tried to move the ball, cut and break free of defenders.
This was barely enough to beat the worst defense in the league, I fear it will not be enough against better opponents.
Anyway we’re 21-18 and with the usual january-february dog days of the season looming we’re right in the thick of the play-in/playoffs race, currently 6th with a decent margin over the 11th place.
The next weeks will shape the league landscape for the trade deadline, I don’t expect anything bombastic and I really hope they don’t move pieces just to do it (read: avoid decision on extensions, there’s time for that), let the chips fall this season and wait the offseason to make the moves.
Meanwhile the Bucks comically tried to up-Knicks the Knicks, blowing a 16 points with 1:50 to play, but weren’t good enough and won in OT…
Thibs’ definition of garbage time immediately raised to “up 30 with 30 seconds to go”, not a good news for our benchwarmers… š
What an absolutely gross game.
As much as Brunson was cooking in the 4th quarter, Thibs just has such an unimaginative late game offensive strategy – ie. give ball to player X and let him go 1-on-1. (Brunson is amazing though)
I wonder what the story with Cam is. I get the idea that he’s out of the rotation, but is it really worth the risk of playing Quickley 46 minutes a game, just-off-injury Brunson 41 minutes, and Julius 40 minutes? Are they worried that Cam will get hurt and so mess up the inevitable Cam for the 44th pick in the 2025 draft?
This team really is missing RJ and Obi, but in addition, they really could use 2020-21 Nerlens Noel. They’re not letting Hartenstein pass much, and without the passing, he’s really just not that great.
The last 2 years with the Clippers, Hartenstein was in the 92+% in AST% for centers. Last year was 84th% in points per shot attempt. But with us this year, he is 15th% in AST% and 24th% in PSA. He’s a bad defensive rebounder, and in conjunction with Obi’s overall poor rebounding, is a major weakness on the 2nd unit.
His acquisition (which we were all in favor of) feels a little Cam-like – meaning it’s clear the FO player personnel dept / stats-guys really like a particular player, but that evaluation doesn’t take into account the coach, who may or may not have a plan for said player and ultimately determines what happens on the floor. I mean, acquiring a player like Hartenstein and having him play like Mitchell Robinson (ie not letting him run any offense) is frankly malpractice, even if the concept of acquiring a player with such great advanced stats makes sense. I’m not totally sure whether this is an FO problem or a coach problem, but it’s collectively a real problem.
It honestly makes a lot more sense to trade Hartenstein for something, let Sims get the backup minutes, and pick up an emergency 3rd center off the scrap heap.
Would the Clippers try and get him back since he clearly works in their system? ie. Hartenstein for the slightly washed Robert Covington, currently getting lots of DNP-CDs, who would fit a need as a Cam-like guy who can guard bigger wings? Covington makes more but is otherwise on a similar contract, and the 1-for-1 trade works in the trade machine…
I 100% agree on this.
And Hartenstein is not the first instance of this problem (Kemba and Cam come to mind).
It would be nice to have FO and coach on the same page…
by the way – Randle casually being 100% correct and saying he played like garbage last night so had to “do something” (3 steals and 4 blocks) – to me indicates a guy whose head is again in the right place. 2021-22 Randle would never have admitted he played badly, and also would never have had 7 stocks in one game.
Great point Frank. Randle looks so locked in this year, like a man on a mission. That sequence where he scored and Pop called a timeout and he started spitting and snotting going back to the huddle was jarring, but also shows how intensely focused he is this season.
Good for him bouncing back after that debacle last season.
Even with his undeniable (but less frequent) lapses and low effort moments on defense Randle’s season so far has been something that probably not even his most die-hard fans would have expected…
I could see a Hart for Chris Boucher trade happening. The Raps need a traditional center and Boucher is more of a Thibs big. Either that, or we move Hart in a 3-team deal where we get Bamba back and let him fight it out with Sims for backup center.
Aside from fixing the Hart mistake, we also need consistent bench scoring. Not sure who that guy would be.
Randle looks a little lighter and quicker to me. It may have just been the garbage Spurs defense but his first step looked pretty dynamic driving from the edges last night. He missed a lot of shots but I will take it. Visually he looks a bit slimmer. I don’t know if he was too bulky last year but he looks right. Both the block and that follow slam were indicative of a guy operating at 100%.
Other than that, I remain obsessed with Grimes. It’s like someone crossed prime Landry Fields (ok, his one good season) with David Lee. The guy is so heady and I hope as respect for his game grows the way he moves the ball and moves off the ball will be contagious. He was great last night.
Rationally, I know we should probably give Cam some burn instead of doing things like playing Quickley 46 minutes. But I can’t help but be entertained by the extent to which Thibs drives the insufferable Cam Hive insane. He did the same thing to the Frank Hive back in the day, and has been fully vindicated on that front. I suspect his decision to not play Cam Reddish will age similarly gracefully.
If you told me before the season we’d be modestly but legitimately exceeding expectations at the halfway point, I’d be certain Hartenstein had a lot to do with that. Instead he’s been a total non-factor. Since we use him the exact same way we use Sims outside of the occasional 3PA, we should probably just play Sims instead as he’s better at doing the things Jericho Sims does.
I’ve always thought Covington was overrated because the idea of him (switchable wing defender who can knock down threes) is so appealing it drowns out the unexciting production, but I like the idea of that challenge trade because the risk is so low. We’re not getting anything from Hartenstein anyway.
So another piece, this time recommended for all in our little family who says the kids aren’t growing up fast enough so let’s bundle and trade them for peanuts and floss. Turns out that this is a ‘thing’ around the league, or at least in this case the 2021 rookie class, and one could arguably say most of our kids measure up reasonably well with this group (even if they’re not all from the same class).
Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t bundle them together and trade them for peanuts and floss, but maybe also the kids are doing okay (well except for Deuce’s shooting, which is making me mad).
I suppose there are alternative lessons one might wish to glean (e.g., never build through the draft!), but I’ll let y’all fight those out.
https://theathletic.com/4058733/2023/01/05/scottie-barnes-evan-mobley-nba-sophomore-ratings/
i think with hart you really have to be patient because his niche in the offense will likely take a bit to play out…. after all.. he is just a bench piece and not really a priority to build an offense around even with the bestest of offensive minds… and we do have thibs so not sure if it will ever come around…. but the upside is that it could… and if you are able to unlock it you can reap all the benefits and have some flexibility come playoff time…
sims and people like him will always be there.. including hart who does an approximation of what he does… it’s worth the upside to see if the other stuff will eventually come…
They didn’t just do that, though. They traded a lottery pick for the chance to do that. Malpractice is absolutely correct.
“sims and people like him will always be there..”
not sure this is accurate…a 6 11 guy who can jump out of the gym, play dee on a variety of offensive players and grab rebounds at will, never gets tired and is not a head case and doesn’t care what his stats are and just wants to win is not “always” available….again…I think he could be a Rodman type of player (maybe not)…how many of these guys come around every decade?
Has anyone actually suggested this?
I mean, yesterday we were talking about trading two of them for one of the most coveted players in the entire league.
The article also dumps cold water on anyone who thinks he might be more than just 3&D role player.
Hart’s passing is kind of wasted because we don’t have guys who cut to the basket except for Grimes and Obi. I think he will still be a decent backup if he can hit enough 3’s to stretch the floor a bit. I think Sims is developing into a defensive stopper, who is very switchable onto 3, 4, or 5’s. All three of our centers are foul prone, so we really need all three.
Hartenstein wasn’t brought here for his playmaking ability or to maximize his boxscore stats.
He was brought here because Mitch is very limited around the basket and they wanted a backup C that could shoot from the outside a bit, create more space, and give the team a different look for the opposition to defend. To the extent he does that and draws defenders away from the basket, some of his value will accrue to other players due to the better spacing he provides.
He hasn’t shot particularly well from outside, though his floater has been OK and leads to offensive rebounds. They could probably add a few plays to take advantage of his passing skills, but I’d still rather have the ball in the hands of Brunson (for sure) Quickly, Rose, and Grimes than Hartenstein. (Randle it depends on the version lol)
I don’t care about Hartenstein boxscore stats other than doing the job he’s here for well, which is better spacing, defending, rebounding on both sides of the ball.
Anyone else here that likes when Sims doesn’t have a teammate open to pass the ball in the backcourt and he brings it up the court fast and with what seems like a good handle? I love it!
Anyone else here that likes when Sims grabs a rebound and moves away from the basket and then spins and shoots a fall-away jumper?
I’m feeling agnostic on that one. But yeah, almost everything else Sims does is fun. I could see paying money just to watch him jump up and down.
i don’t think sims lasts in the league unless he changes his primary crouching tiger back up beeper pnr defense. for all his ridiculous strengths (like, all time elite feet for his size/ups, and of course the double jump magic), you just can’t be that limited on offense while also being a drop coverage welcome mat and not get exploited. it’s not the hardest thing in the world to change, so maybe he will. it shows up a little less playing with hart, but i doubt that lineup works in the long run.
Oh, totally. If he doesn’t stick in the NBA, he’ll have a place in the Harlem Globetrotters. š š
I’d like to see what he could do in the triple jump…
Sims didn’t play drop in college, despite his age he may improve there. He needs a switching scheme to maximize current value.
RAPTOR & EPM like Hartenstein’s defense. He had a lingering Achilles issue a month ago that may still bother him.
The upside argument is the best Iāve seen for hanging on to Hart, but youād think heād be able to show *some* passing ability in our offense even in the Mitch role if he was averaging 4 per 36 in LA. Yet he hasnāt. He doesnāt stretch the floor either (heās been atrocious from 3, and is in the bottom quartile of points per shot attempt among centersāthe idea that he does is purely notional).
I also think thereās a little more to Sims than āreplacement level scrap heap centerā, so Iād like to see if he can learn to play drop given his obvious strengths in switches. Hart distracts from that and doesnāt really seem to add anything, and could probably be traded for something more useful to us. If anything, heās looked like the replacement level scrap heap player so far.
Itās not insane to hold onto him, because his passing was that good in LA, but I donāt think he does anything well outside of passing, and hasnāt really done anything well at all this season.
And the foulsāthe insanely, head-scratchingly dumb fouls!
” it shows up a little less playing with hart, but i doubt that lineup works in the long run.”
I just had a long debate with someone about that combination.
He wants so see Cam get those minutes instead of Sims and was trashing Thibs over it. He doesn’t like that combo at all. I have no major problem with Cam, but I have no problem with using Sims and Hart until it’s not working. Anyway, he’s a Thibs hater and makes a big deal about every extra minute anyone plays in blowouts and every lineup decision he disagrees with. I think the whole thing is irrelevant because as soon as Obi is in game shape he’s going to play his 15 minutes and he can complain about that instead. š
Nuggets could really use Hartenstein, or even Sims. Unfortunately they have garbage outside of players they’re never going to trade. They also have zero tradable 1sts.
Maybe Sims for a couple 2nds and Ismael Kamagate could work if we want to move a center.
Would we want Bruce Brown or KCP as a backup wing for Hartenstein? Would the Nuggets move KCP for him?
Cam is a RFA after this season. He doesn’t have a future with the Knicks. I don’t see a good reason to bring out the acetone.
i find it hard to criticize thibs for the lineups of late. our recent bench options have seemed murky and difficult. sims/hart together are unappealing as a general matter, and morally repugnant as part of their regular mƩnage a deuce polycules . then again, i am way under apparent consensus on how useful basketball cam has been this year. yet i also understand what was not to like in 22-23 fournier and rose. but the old obi/randle with no five option (health permitting) also seems fairly terrible. conviction is a fickle bitch.
Ack, Zion out a month.
Polycules? Polycules.
Is Zion part Latvian?
For what it’s worth, I think Sims/Hart or Cam is a necessary evil unless you’re willing to play Svi or Arch until Obi comes back, all of which we should consider.
There was just a random dude walking down 14th Street shouting “Knicks tape.” Really brought me back.
porzingis has played more minutes since the trade than mitch
I hope we keep Sims. He moves kinda like a transformer or rockem-sockem robot, but his one and only facial expression is priceless.
Hart? He has a bit of Frank in his game. Hmm…Frankenstein? (I think he’s better than given credit for here, a decent backup for the money.)
Anyone think this describes the Knicks front office? https://dilbert.com/strip/2023-01-01
I thoroughly enjoyed the Isaiah Stewart Draymond Green dust up.
Also, not sure what the NBA Trade Report is but it says the Knicks donāt want to trade IQ anymore and view him as a long term piece. Letās hope itās not a parody account.
Clicking on that Dilbert link did not seem to do wonderful things for my computer.
However, halfway through the day today, the ads on this site *majorly* calmed down. That makes me appreciably happier than the Dilbert link made me sad. So there’s that.
I don’t think there’s a chance Denver would trade Brown for Hart. He’s a a key rotation piece for them and is a pretty unique player in general, I think they value him far more than an upgrade at backup center.
Maybe there’s a chance they’d trade KCP for him but I still doubt it. There’s just not enough value to them in bolstering the 5-8 minutes Jokic will be off the floor in the playoffs.
“(I think heās better than given credit for here, a decent backup for the money.)”
The problem is it’s wildly easy to get semi-decent production on the cheap at the center position, and whether it’s because of the way we’re using him or because he’s just playing badly Hart isn’t meeting that low bar.
His TS+ of 96 is frankly atrocious for a center and that’s at very low usage. There are probably 10-15+ *unsigned* centers who could beat that right now. Our defense is better with him off the floor so there’s not really any counter veiling benefit.
I think he’s a talented player but if we’re not going to actually use those talents (and FWIW I think that might be more endemic to the roster than something Thibs is choosing) we’re better off with a more generic backup center.
Hereās a question for you: whose supporting cast is worse – LeBron with the 2007 Cavs that got swept by the Spurs or Luka with the 2022-2023 Mavs?
Itās pretty close imoā¦
If only we ran an offense that valued a big who could pass out of the pinch post, Hartenstein would be KILLING it!
I canāt blame Phil too hard for passing on Nikola Jokic because every GM in the league did the same, but itās so ironic that the guy who fetishizes pinch post passing bigs chose not to draft the GOAT passing center so he could take a flyer on Cleanthony Early
D-Mar – Great question!
With Kleber out, I donāt know, itās tough.
Varejao, Ilguaskas, Gooden, Donyell. Those were decent frontcourt options, although Lebron made them look good.
Gibson had a career year.
Maybe the Cavs? So tough
Markaten with 49 points in 36 minutes tonightā¦ not too shabby.
āi find it hard to criticize thibs for the lineups of late. our recent bench options have seemed murky and difficultā
As far as I can tell, lineups are part trying to get the needed skills on the court, part trying to take advantage of matchups on the other side, and part the other team trying to take advantage of the weaknesses in your lineups. But sometimes you donāt know until you put combinations out there to see what works when. Itās logical, but too complex to be clear.
My feeling is that we have some nice players but the fit is still not ideal even if better than last year.
Still, I have this strange calm about me this year. I know we are going to have to make a big move thatās going to require some luck to take the next step, but so far imo almost everything is working out great.
Brunson is exceeding expectations, Randle bounced back better than I expected and looks movable now if we wanted to trade him, and Grimes is becoming the player I hoped to play next to Brunson. If RJ gets itās going Iāll feel even better.
āHis TS+ of 96 is frankly atrocious for a center and thatās at very low usage.ā
Unfortunately, heās not shooting well, but part of it is also a function of his role in NY. His role is not to maximize his TS% so advanced stats models and fans like him. His role is to shoot floaters, shoot some 3s, shoot some higher quality mid range shots, drag big men away from the rim and everyone attack the offensive boards.
Thibs is intentionally trading away some TS% from Hart to gain some offensive rebounds and spacing for whoever is on the court with him.
If he drags some big away from the rim and Obi gets a clean dunk on a cut or Randle gets an OREB, thatās partly Hart. If RJ gets a clean drive to the rim because the big is not there to help, thatās partly Hart. I donāt know the value of that trade off, but thatās the goal. Itās on Thibs to try to calculate the net of what heās doing and adjust.
@TNFH,
That’s pretty much my conclusion. There aren’t any deals that make much sense.
Denver is finally getting healthy. This is my first look at them at close to full strength. I feel pretty good about my bet on them to win it all. Wow, they are tough at home.
I have a few other teams also, but the Nuggets are the biggest.
I also have the Nets, which was a bet that Simmons would be OK and the perfect fit next to Kyrie and Durant. Now that they are getting healthy thatās starting to look OK too.
Weāll see how long it lasts. Health is a big risk on those two.
Svi and Arch should not be on the roster. That’s just the simplest thing about this team. With Cam buried and RJ and Obi out, how do you have two guys on your roster with no upside that will never play? Why are they here? What is the reason for them being on this team?
It’s kind of hilarious that in the first batch of All-Star votes, the only Knick even in the top ten of either the frontcourt or the backcourt voting is…Derrick fucking Rose?!?!
Svi at least 100% looks like a future assistant coach.
Brian, Svi and Arch make sense to me. Fringe but actual NBA players who are good with not playing, good practice players and can play in a pinch.
If we were tanking Iād agree but weāre not. Having a ādevelopmentalā player who never plays in those spots is counterproductive.
Randle and Brunson definitely deserve consideration, but itās far from a no-brainer. If our goal is to win as many games as possible, we might be better off if they rested for a week, especially Brunson.
But Rose??? Come on.
But Rose??? Come on.
Remember his standing O at the United Center last month? That’s likely 19,661 votes right there.