(Thursday, September 27, 2018 1:16:39 PM)
Kevin Knox isn’t in Las Vegas anymore. Knicks coach David Fizdale acknowledged the lottery pick has had a tougher go during training camp than he did during his dominant summer-league showing that had the team’s fan base agog. Nevertheless, Fizdale has seen improvement since Day 1. Knox, who just turned 19 and was the second-youngest…
(Thursday, September 27, 2018 12:40:29 PM)
Knicks coach David Fizdale said rookie shooting guard Allonzo Trier is on the radar for making the 15-man roster — and even cited LeBron James’ rare knack for chase-down blocks. The undrafted Trier is on a two-way G-League contract, meaning he can only spend a maximum of 45 days with the Knicks and the rest…
(Thursday, September 27, 2018 9:07:11 AM)
Two medical experts believe an extremely tall player such as Kristaps Porzingis could have a normal recovery and rehab while returning from an ACL tear — citing a lack of evidence to the contrary. “Porzingis’ height should not play a role in the speed of recovery and rate of success,” Dr. Armin Tehrany, founder of…
(Thursday, September 27, 2018 6:29:20 AM)
It won’t stop the speculation, but it will settle Celtics fans’ stomachs for now. Kyrie Irving, who surely will be hounded all season about his future as he plays through the last year of his contract, tried to parry that conjecture in an interview published Wednesday. Of course, Irving did not commit to Boston, did…
(Thursday, September 27, 2018 8:50:07 PM)
Knicks rookie Mitchell Robinson continues to get praise from teammates, the latest coming from Enes Kanter.
51 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2018.09.28)”
From the tone of an article I read, it sounded like Knox is having a bit more trouble with Pros than summer league.
And in other breaking news….”Dog bites man!
I guess I was hoping he was going to come out guns a blazing.
I mean, the unexpected would be if he was ready to play. I’ve seen people argue that Knox and Mitchell are partly reasons why the Knicks could make a playoff push, and I think those people don’t realize just how incredibly raw those two are. We shouldn’t expect actual production from those two, specially from Robinson, until next season realistically. Of course they can show promise here and there and the faster they develop the better, obviously, but it’s gonna take a while.
Isn’t this a good thing that Knox and Robinson aren’t ready yet? I mean how better to execute a tank then play raw players. You get them experience and lose games, best of both worlds. The Knicks need a top 3 pick in the draft this year to really put the future on a good base. Porzingus, Knox, Ntilikina, Robinson, and a top 3 pick would go a long way in solidifying the Knicks for the future. THJ and Lee are trade fodder, although probably next to impossible to move THJ with his contract without taking back something bad. The Knicks should trade Lee before the season starts to put the tank on the right track. Play Kanter and the kids at crunch time to get them experience and assure the loss. Knicks need to stay under 25 wins this year and I would prefer under 20 to wrap up the maximum amount of ping pong balls.
I agree in principle, except that I expect Robinson to develop more quickly than Knox. He’s older and already has the most transferable skill package–offensive rebounding and putbacks, shot blocking, and lob-catching. He has two main challenges–not fouling and not getting backed down in the post. Knox does not have an NBA-level skill to fall back on at this point. Sure, he might develop quickly, but it’s more of a long shot than that Robinson will.
I’m pretty sure the people who think we can push for a playoff spot this year will change their tune once 10 games are played. Knox and Robinson will get experience but won’t impact wins. The defense will be terrible. Think about Burke guarding the point of attack with Hezonja and Kanter as the bigs. We’re not treading water till Porzingis comes back, we’re sinking straight to the bottom of the ocean. Thank god.
@6
Yeah, I agree the path for Robinson should be somewhat easier as he’s a prototypical rim running Center who seems to have the skills and the most important thing, the body. I think though the lack of organized basketball will put his contributions this year somewhere between DeAndre’s rookie year (lost but kinda useful sometimes still) and Capela’s rookie year (so completely lost he was pretty much unplayable for a team looking for wins). But he should have an easier path of development and a strong skill set to improve on, while Knox has so much to work on.
It’s absolutely not a bad thing if they are still raw. Well, it is bad if they don’t develop eventually, and we would like to see signs of development early on, but I’m not worried at all about those guys this season. I’ll be much more focused on Ntilikina and Burke in terms of expectations for productive basketball.
Ted Cruz says Brett Kavanaugh might never coach basketball again. So I really hope this Fizdale thing works out
It is so, if you believe it. Stats be damned, he’s an All-NBA star if you say so. So say it!
Truly a travesty of justice.
The poor guy just can’t catch a break. His life is ruined. A victim for sure. Thoughts and prayers.
The defense is going to be atrocious until KP comes back. The only exception might be when some combination of Frank, Thomas, and Vonleh are on the court, but then the offense will be terrible.
My feeling is that in summer league he showed a much broader set of skills than advertised. So he was either improving rapidly (which was the reason we supposedly drafted him) or he was underutilized in college. If I was betting, I’d make the under/over on his TS% in the 50% range. That’s doesn’t mean I’m right. I could easily be wrong and he may blossom a lot quicker than expected. I’m hoping to be wrong.
Kevin Knox is very likely to be 2,000+ minutes of negative basketball, and that’s great for the tank so long as he demonstrates he can shoot 3s/get fouled and play decent defense. We’re gonna be really bad this year, but we’re gonna fight.
Knox shot 35% from the field on his 4 summer league games. I would say an under .500 ts% is pretty much a lock against NBA level competition.
I think his progression will be tied to two main things, which are reasons I was scared about drafting him in the first place: in college he struggled mightily finishing inside, he relied on weak floaters and runners that will get swatted every time in the NBA; he also showed no ability to create for others at all, he had almost two times more turnovers than assists in his college season.
Those issues will be even tougher to deal with in the NBA against more athletic defenders. The good news is that he had a pretty good free throw rate and he seems to be fast enough and have the right mentality to draw fouls, and he can hit foul shots decently well, so that should translate well to the NBA. He has A LOT to work on, and I’m fine with being extremely patient about him and letting him play and develop no matter how unproductive he is on both ends.
Except that the Knicks don’t really need a reason to tank. Vegas has the Knicks win total at ~29, third worst in the league.
And to add salt to the wound, you know the team is going to play their vets in an attempt to win games and stay competitive. So the raw guys aren’t going to see the minutes they should see. It’s the Knicksiest way to go.
Would you take the over or under?
I can think of some wings like Otto Porter and Kawhi Leonard, elite players in different ways, who added a deep shot to their repertoire. Jayson Tatum isn’t yet “elite,” but is well on the way, and he also has seen an enormous improvement since college (although he was a good 3PT shooter in high school, so perhaps it was just a small sample).
I can’t think of anyone who came into the league as a piss-poor defender and left elite. This is the most important takeaway from the season: whether Knox will hold up with the two young elite defenders we currently have on the roster.
Knox still has a lot to prove to me… That pick was iffy at the time and while he showed some flashes in summer league, he’s really not my kind of player. As of now he’s all eye test, and projects to be an “empty calorie” kind of player who will score some pointzz on low efficiency but not really stuff the boxscore in other ways. Considering who was on the board at 9 he was a reasonable pick I suppose, but I’m not super pumped about him as a prospect. If he plays 2,000+ minutes this year he’s going to generate lots of TORP* though.
*Tank Over Replacement Player
haha!
Can we just wait a week and thoroughly investigate the first half of preseason before we decide whether we should either tank or trade Robotron Knox and Frank (forever) for Jimmy Butler and go get that ring in the spring
If Knox puts up 20 PPG on ~.530 TS% by the end of his RFA year, there will be calls, on this board and elsewhere, to give him the 25% max. Some might say that he’ll give a few million back “to make it team-friendly, and to show he’s committed to improving.”
“I believe the Bulls when they say that the vile Jimmy Butler trade happened to them, but I don’t think it was the Timberwolves that did that to them.”
::motions to the Wolves::
“Do you swear to God that you did not do this to the Bulls?”
“I swear to God.”
[stern, squinty, character-assessing glare]
“I yield.”
“This committee has reached the two-hour mark. Adjourned.”
::proceeds to trade everyone for Jimmy Butler, calling it a tragedy for both teams::
I really like what Cock did right there.
Mr Mudiay, do you believe in god? Look me in the eyes. There is a statement that you are good at basketball. that’s not true.
It’s damned difficult to keep politics and hoops separated these days, as GianaDani’s criticism of BobNeptune yesterday underscored. I held back on a response because I don’t want to appear before a Senate subcommittee, but I can honestly say that nobody here gives a rat’s ass what sort of genitalia anyone has or how you use it. 40+ win predictions will get slammed by every sane person on this board. There. I hope that passes the PC subcommittee.
As for Knox and Robinson, Fizdale already said that KK will be matched up defensively with the LeBron’s, KD’s and their ilk. With few other options, those guys will be covering him too. That does not bode well statistically for our top pick. But that’s all good because he won’t get better by playing JV basketball. Robinson’s going to come off the bench and will likely be facing 2nd team players. He might do better but he hasn’t face competition for a year.
@17 I’m less hopeful about 29 wins. Getting the overall #1 pick would be a huge coup for this team. Take this 2018-19 team without KP and then next year add KP, the #1 pick and a max free agent could mean a 30+ win swing. If, somehow, we could unload Lee and Thomas that would allow for a 2nd near max player. How about KD and Kyrie? So add KP, KD, Kyrie and Zion. How do you like them apples?
But first, we must cultivate our garden.
MitchRob also has to learn to play organized basketball at a level higher than high school or he’s gonna get ate up, but generally agreed that his development path is likely to be easier than Knox’s.
Robinson’s fundamentals are much worse than Knox’s, but if he’s even slightly coachable, his athleticism should make him impactful much more quickly.
29 wins is 8 more than I would find acceptable. Emmanuel Mudiay should have something to say about that.
Also, for all of those who want to hold Noah through the season, I believe the situation has already gone nuclear:
https://twitter.com/TommyBeer/status/1045787706335404033?s=20
Oh, poor Noah. Trapped in this awful contract he signed for himself. Brings tears to my eyes.
Yeah he’s definitely overreacting but that’s kinda why he needs to stay away from the team. You can’t keep him around the Knicks and then say you’re trying to rebuild team culture. Hopefully he follows Luol Deng and gives a chunk of his money so we can have more cap space.
Man, I would hate having someone pay me $18 million a year just to hang out. Hope many years of that could you take before you just lost your mind?
So what does everyone make of all the positive comments about Mudiay coming into camp 15 pounds lighter and shooting better?
That no one ever came into a season saying they are in worse shape then before and shooting worse? Or that every team would win 40 games at least if everything said by preseason actually happened on the court in real games?
I guess it’s better than showing up fat and shooting worse
It’s better than Mudiay showing up missing a foot and both eyes.
ITBSOHL*
Never heard that one before
*In The Best Shape Of His Life
This season feels different. There’s literally no bullshit reason for a stupid eye test kind of person like me to get excited. No “Bargnani to attack those closeouts”. No “Melo to facilitate other players”. No “KP to take his place among the NBA’s ten best”. There is really no hope of them being good. The Knox hype is so feeble even I can’t believe it. I mean, the kid was NOT that good in Nevada. As Z-Man said, no left hand. (Durant comparisons? Really?) He will dunk the ball once or twice but he’s definitely gonna miss more than half of his shots (and he’s likely to take many. I’m no stats maven but that won’t be good, right?) Of course, I still like these guys because I’m a “fan bois nut hugger”, per Bob Neptune, but for once I see absolutely no reason for hope. They will never be the better team on any night this year. They don’t need to try to tank. They are the tank. I don’t know if I can root for them to lose. I know I won’t have to. It’s in the bag.
And maybe that IS the reason for hope. Go ahead and bottom out boys. Get THE NUMBER ONE PICK. Maybe some idiot team takes one of our big money players and we can go out and buy some quality vets or another great player. Maybe Zion becomes all NBA in a NYK uniform. Maybe he makes a formidable 1,2 punch with a more efficient KP? Maybe I can start to believe that Knox, Robinson, Ntilikina will grow into rotation players…
I agree with 26 “But first we must cultivate our garden”. Well said. However, I feel this management team will find a way to screw this rebuild yet. See what a pessimist I’ve become. Are you proud of me Jowles? Um…go Knicks?
Thanks, but I borrowed the line from Voltaire’s Candide.
🙂
Ha! This best of all possible worlds. So much Knicks.
Bruno, I am totally in worse shape than I was in training camp last year
Well, my agent will let you know that I’m in the best shape of my life and I’ve grown 1 1/2 inches since last season, so I’m rounder than ever.
Markkanen out 6-8 weeks with Landry Fields Syndrome…
@40 compliment still applies. If only they’d started doing it at the end of the Ewing era…
Congratulations to Miles Bridges on his induction to the basketball hall of fame.
Lots of gloom here tonight.
Welcome to year 2 of “build exclusively through the draft”.
I wonder what the mood would be like if we drafted Jahill Okafor in 2015 and Malik Monk in 2017. We’ve actually done fairly well given we didn’t even have a 2016 pick. However, we are so young, even 3 years from now we could conceivably still be pretty bad and discussing the lottery.
Of course, the other possibility is that KP comes back and has taken a step up, Frank is playing high level defense, hitting 3s at a 37% clip, penetrating and rebounding better with his stronger frame, Knox is among the top 2-3 rookies in the class, and the Knicks add a legitimate all star in the off season. Then next year could be pretty good.
Well, there is gloom as usual, but trust me, if we had Charlotte’s roster or Detroit’s, I can assure you at least I would be much less interested in the Knicks. I would probably be so checked out that I wouldn’t even be angry anymore at the team.
For all the shit we’ve had to endure we have something more to look forward than watch our team pay Blake Griffin and Reggie Jackson 50+ million combined for the next two seasons or rooting for Kemba and his band of overpaid misfits to reach their ceiling, the 8th seed and a quick sweep in the hands of Boston or Toronto.
I agree it’s more interesting to watch the kids and have hope, than to, say watch Detroit. I’m not too worried about Knox not to doing great in training camp compared to summer league. I wasn’t expecting him to be able to be the team’s go to scorer this season. He should be able to hit shots when he has the opportunity, and he has to learn what to do to defend his position. Then I think he will get minutes.
Thank you all for refocusing me on my negativity about the Knicks. Been getting a little distracted….
@48
You can always focus on the worse cases, but we could be Houston too.
Maybe we’d have a few franchise crushing injuries but keep accumulating sold FA players at prices that make sense, pick up a solid player or two in the draft, win a few trades, blow a few deals, but the net of all would be a 60 win team that’s major contender for a ring and trying to win a trade for Butler.