Knicks Morning News (2018.01.10)

  • [NY Newsday] Knicks’ Willy Hernangomez hopeful he’ll get more playing time
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 10:32:25 PM)

    Willy Hernangomez worked another kind of lane for the Knicks Tuesday night.

  • [NY Newsday] Tim Hardaway Jr. participates fully in practice for the Knicks
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 5:58:55 PM)

    Tim Hardaway Jr. took a big step toward returning to the Knicks. On Tuesday, he went through practice in full, scrimmaged full-court with his teammates and afterward did some individual work.

  • [NYTimes] On Pro Basketball: Team Unity or Dad’s Rants: Lonzo Ball’s Hard Decision
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 9:58:30 PM)

    LaVar Ball has created another uproar, this time by saying the Lakers’ coach “has no control” of the team. Shouldn’t his son draw some kind of line?

  • [SNY Knicks] GEICO SportsNite: Hardaway Jr. returns to practice
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 11:37:37 PM)

  • [SNY Knicks] Hernangomez hoping to see more time in Hornacek’s ‘bullyball’ scheme
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 3:30:13 PM)

    Knicks head coach Jeff Hornacek has created a new strategy that involves C Willy Hernangomez finally seeing more time on the court.

  • [SNY Knicks] Tim Hardaway Jr. ‘feels good’ in first full practice on Tuesday
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 1:56:02 PM)

    Knick SG Tim Hardaway Jr. (stress injury) was a full participant at practice on Tuesday, while F Michael Beasley (ankle) was limited

  • [SNY Knicks] Kristaps Porzingis continues to fight stigma that he’s ‘soft’
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 9:23:02 AM)

    Knicks F Kristaps Porzingis continues to try and dismiss the label that he is “a soft, skinny, white Euro.”

  • [NYDN] Current and former stars gather at 19th Annual Knicks Bowl
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 3:42:16 PM)

    In the shadow of MSG Tuesday night, Knicks stars present and past came out to give back to their community and fans.

  • [NYDN] Knicks’ Hardaway Jr. says ‘it’d be great’ if Burke gets called up
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 12:09:59 PM)

    When Tim Hardaway Jr. returns from his stress injury, he may have a new and familiar teammate.

  • [NYDN] Tim Hardaway Jr. inches closer to Knicks return
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 10:04:29 AM)

    As he had hoped, Tim Hardaway Jr. continued his progression to practicing fullcourt on Tuesday and has possibly bumped up his return date.

  • [NYPost] Doug McDermott: It’s time to be more ‘selfish’ offensively
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 6:07:59 PM)

    You don’t have to beg Knicks forward Doug McDermott to be more aggressive offensively. His coaches have delivered the message, and McBuckets is ready to answer the call. “Definitely I got to be more aggressive. That’s on me,” he said Tuesday night at the 19th Annual Knicks Bowl charity event. “The coaches harp on [it]…

  • [NYPost] Hornacek plays coy as Knicks’ Trey Burke hype begins
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 9:46:33 AM)

    The Knicks are working on a deal to add point guard Trey Burke to their roster, The Post reported Monday, but a day later everything was status quo, according to Jeff Hornacek. “[Team president] Steve [Mills] and [general manager] Scott [Perry], they handle the roster and I haven’t talked about that,” the coach said after…

  • [NYPost] An early Tim Hardaway Jr. return comes into view
    (Tuesday, January 09, 2018 8:20:37 AM)

    Tim Hardaway Jr. is nearly back. The Knicks shooting guard was a full practice participant Tuesday for the first time since he was shut down with a stress reaction in his left leg, even scrimmaging full court at the end and then sticking around to put up extra shots in a workout with an assistant…

  • 43 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2018.01.10)”

    Sounds like good news with THJ, possibly back as soon as Friday. I assume he’ll be on a minutes restriction but I’m really interested to see if KP looks any better playing with a guard that can actually attack the rim.

    Still scratching my head on Trey Burke, but I guess there’s zero downside to having him on the team rather than Sessions. If anything he is a bit of a chucker (but good 3 point shooter) so just having a PG out there that’s not afraid to let it fly from 3 might be good for the offense.

    Interesting that we actually have too many unselfish players on offense now. Lee keeps passing up open 3’s and has to be constantly told to shoot more, McDermott is being taken to task for not being aggressive enough, and Frank’s overpassing has been discussed as nauseum.

    tonite is a must lose for us. our schedule for the next 20 games has 14 on the road, thjr and burke could get some wolverines chemistry going and put us back to dreaded .500 a.k.a. ‘no mans land’

    Woohoo, Kyle O’Quinn, good job making sure the Knicks are just good enough to not get a good draft pick before you leave to go play somewhere else!

    I know this was said in humor, but imo…

    O’Quinn is an asset that is contributing to wins now. IMO, he’s either a good or bad asset depending on his contract relative to his productivity and his marketability to other teams. If he is traded, we will have a new asset. That player or pick may good or bad, younger or older, but it should then be evaluated in the same way. If he is not traded and eventually leaves, we will have a different asset. It’s called cap space. Cap Space gives us greater flexibility to accumulate other assets via trade, free agency, G League and things like that.

    Just because a guy is older or about to leave does not mean he’s a negative.

    When those guys are gone you wind up with new assets in their place.

    It’s on management to collect as many value oriented and marketable assets as possible, arrange the finances so there is cap flexibility, and slowly construct a team of better players that fit together and that can sustain good play.

    O’Quinn is a good asset at his salary. Now it’s on management to either keep him cheaply or replace him with a better one via trade or eventually free agency. The preference may be for a young player or pick, but as long as it’s another good asset (hopefully an even better player or one that fills a need better), you can keep moving upward and forward.

    About 3 point defense. KP is average, Jokic is below average.*G*30:FG3A*G*2&Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=C&sort=PLUSMINUS&dir=-1

    Before we start throwing around DBPM to say Jokic is as good as KP at defense. Lets agree, by DBPM we mean link below:

    Per this entry, “Defensive BPM is simply overall BPM minus offensive BPM.” In other words, its a difference of estimates from two different 11 factor (!) multiple regression models. We know error band of only one of those.

    Still scratching my head on Trey Burke, but I guess there’s zero downside to having him on the team rather than Sessions.

    Yeah, pretty much. He’s been atrocious as a pro basketball player, but he is a talented kid and there’s always a chance he finally put it together. There’s also little point in having a G League team if you have a guy playing as well as Burke and don’t give him look.

    How do the Magic lose EVERY game? They’re 4-25 since an 8-4 start. Got smacked by an awful Mavs team today.

    Might I remind you that they’re also 2-27 since a 6-2 start. Also, they’re 9-28 since a 3-1 start. And they’re 0-5 since a 12-24 start. And 1-14 since a 11-15 start. Maybe best put: 12-29 since a 0-0 start.

    I’d try to sign Elfrid Payton this offseason and hope the stink of playing for such bad teams creates a shitty market for him.

    I don’t trust any of the stats that try to measure defense.

    My feeling that in general they seem OK, but I occasionally see one that seems so out of line, it’s hard to trust any of them. For example, if a stat tells me Kawhi Leonard is a good defender with a rating of XYZ I’m initially going to trust it. But f the same stat tells me Derick Rose is slightly above average, I’m not only not going to believe what I see about Derrick Rose, I can no longer trust what it says about Kawhi Leonard to be accurate even though it’s in the right direction.


    Defensive tracking stats are notoriously noisy and inconsistent season to season. I would hesitate using them as definitive evidence of anything except in the case of rim protection and close-to-the-basket shots (<6 feet).


    DRPM is likely a much better metric for measuring defense than DBPM–my point was more that all the defensive metrics point to Jokic being a better defender than advertised (likely because of his excellent DRB, in my eyes.) They might very well be wrong, but it's hard to explain the fact that Jokic's teams have been better defensively with him on the court rather than off the court, and that when he's on the court teams score slightly below league average in PPP. If he was as terrible a defender as people like to say he is, we'd see it more obviously in the metrics.

    I’d try to sign Elfrid Payton this offseason and hope the stink of playing for such bad teams creates a shitty market for him.

    Only if he gets rid of that bizarre hairdo. I’ve never understood how he can get a rebound if whenever he looks up he all he sees is his “hair shelf”

    My guess is the Magic match any reasonable Payton offer because at some point they’re going to actually have to hold on to their young players. It’s got to be humiliating to watch Oladipo, Harris, and Sabonis all be major contributors for other teams. I’d see if Hezonja could be had on the (very) cheap though.

    No more PG’s please! Unless they are of the veteran leader/backup variety. Ntilikina is the future, let him develop. I know being patient with young PG’s is hard to do (see: NYK history), but we gotta start allowing young talent to develop, and Ntilikina can be transcendent defensively. He may not be an explosive scorer, but with KP roaming the paint and Ntilikina on the perimeter, we already have the makings of a good young defense with more potential on offense.

    Now, if there’s a can’t miss FA PG or one available in the draft- you grab him. @8, I like Payton as well, but he’s Ntilikina with little growth in his game and less natural ability defensively. We can’t have 2 Ntilikinas- at least one has to be able to put pressure on defenses. That’s why it’s a good idea to call Burke up with Sessions expendable because of the unexpected Jack effect.

    I’m going off topic and on a bit of a rant. Have you guys listened to Steve Kerr’s answer about LaVar Ball? Damn, I wish he was our coach! What a bright man. He basically said ESPN didn’t have money to pay the 100+ reporters that they canned but they could afford to send people to Lithuania to cover a person that is a nothing, a self made celeb. Or, as he called Ball, a Kardashian. Instead of criticizing ESPN, he criticized us, the public, for our appetite for his BS. And he’s dead on. That’s why I’m changing channels whenever I hear or see anything about him. It’s an irrelevant boycott. Nobody cares that I flip the channel, but I want to do my part to change the course of our nation. Ball is a symptom. I don’t want to touch on politics but we do have a “celeb” in the oval office, not because he had credentials, but more because he’s a game show host. And when Oprah gave a speech at the Golden Globes, she suddenly became a would-be candidate. Seth McFarlane tweeted earlier about this and said “Oprah is beyond doubt a magnificent orator. But the idea of a reality show star running against a talk show host is troublingly dystopian. We don’t want to create a world where dedicated public service careers become undesirable and impractical in the face of raw celebrity.”

    So, I’m giving Mike K. a pass for including LaVar Ball articles in the Morning News, because I like Mike and this forum. I’m rationalizing (please don’t wake me from this fantasy) that the morning news is gathered by some software bot and is not in his control. But otherwise, every time I hear the name, the next sound from my easy chair will be is the click of the remote as I flip to another channel. I will not acknowledge his existence.


    The problem is that defense is partially an individual effort and partly a team effort. That may be true of offense also, but with all switching and help involved, it’s really hard to isolate the impact of one player.

    It’s also hard to measure the impact of one player.

    For example, setting aside defense, we know that if the Knicks got Steph Curry he would have a gigantic positive impact on offense. But let’s say we got Andre Roberson who is considered one of the best defenders in the NBA. How much would he help our defense? I don’t think it would he have nearly as much impact on defense as Curry would have on offense.

    If we do sign Trey Burke, I hope we’ve learned enough over the last decade to add a non guaranteed second year deal or a team option to his deal.

    Ah, who am I kidding. He’ll have a player option and a full NTC.

    I largely agree with you, but I also think that Oprah and Trump, whether rightly or wrongly, are thought of by a lot of people as successful businesspersons (not just celebrities), and thus qualified to be president. I know people who voted for Trump, thinking that he’d be “good for the economy.”

    LaVar has his BB brand, so many may view him as some sort of entrepreneur (though in my mind he’s just the lucky parent of super talented athletic sons exploiting them for all they are worth). But I agree, I wish at least the big sports media companies like ESPN would ignore him.

    So, no Trey Burke, yet? Will Willy really start getting minutes, now?

    “are you not entertained”

    espn and fox sports are in the entertainment business…lavar draws eyeballs and ears…the advertising sponsors whom actually fund all our viewing pleasures like eyeballs and ears…

    is it sports newsworthy – no…then again watching the “butt” fumble over and over again isn’t exactly sports newsworthy either – but it’s there – all the time…

    not sure how long the ball hype will last…personally, i was kind of shocked that espn showed highlights of the kids game in Lithuania…no doubt though that there is someone somewhere within espn with a big ol’ spreadsheet and impressive job title directing folks to air more of that weird ball family shit…

    i still remember how unique i viewed the phil donahue show and then mtv’s real world when i first saw them…now – that kind of stuff dominates entertainment programming…

    yep, the times they are a changin…

    Instead of criticizing ESPN, he criticized us, the public, for our appetite for his BS. And he’s dead on.

    I don’t know. It’s hard to determine if people really want to hear about Ball or if he’s just shoved down everyone’s throat because ESPN wants to make him a thing. You can easily create an appetite for something no one wanted to begin with if you devote enough attention to it. As far I know, for instance, no one actually wanted Stephen A Smith. But there he is. Everywhere.

    The fact the ESPN’s rating suck might indicate it’s more them than us.

    Fred Hoiberg announced that Nikola Mirotic is doubtful for tonight’s game at the New York Knicks.

    I love Kanter but someone mentioned a Portland trade for Harkless and I think if we can do that, we should. It would have a couple of benefits for us.

    It would balance the roster and give us a starting caliber SF (or at least a fringe starting SF who is still relatively young). Maybe then we could resign OQuinn for a similar deal to the one he has. Quinn is 27 but I think another 4 years he would still be productive at the same level and he’s really been a pretty great and steady back up big for us. His first year was rough but the last two he’s been solid. Lets say we did that deal and then resigned Oquinn, McDermott and Beasley/JJ (as a back up to Frank) for next season. We could roll with…


    This is not including our draft picks. That’s a pretty balanced roster that has a nice mix of youth, vets and young vets. Noah can start but because he wouldn’t play a ton of minutes, I think it leaves plenty of time for both OQuinn and Willy in each game. You get Noah for more defense and rebounding, Willy for more scoring and OQuinn who is a balance between of those two things. Harkless I believe has two more years on his contract after this one? Draft a SF with our first round pick and another PG with the Chicago pick?

    Mo Harkless has 2 more years left at $11M each. he’s not a scorer, or a good shooter. Plus the salaries don’t match; you’d have to take on expirings too. plus, I don’t think Portland does that deal….they already have Nurkic. I guess if they are in win now, they might want Kanter, but IDK.

    I’m taking the other side of the Kerr statement.

    I think it’s ironic that so many NBA coaches are upset that someone without basketball coaching expertise like Lavar Ball is getting a soapbox to criticize a coach when the for the last year Kerr, Popovich, VanGundy and other coaches are constantly making comments about economic, domestic, and foreign policy when their expertise is in basketball.

    Everyone has an opinion, but just because you have a special talent in one area and gain a soapbox that does not mean your expertise extends to areas where other people have spent their entire lives thinking and studying about BOTH sides of an issue.

    I think Ball should stick to worrying about raising his sons and NBA coaches should stick to coaching basketball and the voting booth. Both should let the people that have dedicated their lives to other issues and understand the realities (as opposed what people casually read/hear in agenda based newspapers and TV) fight it out politically. Of course if they want to quit coaching and actually become experts they can do that too. But you don’t get to be a blowhard when you want and trash the other blowhard when he says something you don’t like.

    Mo Harkless has 2 more years left at $11M each. he’s not a scorer, or a good shooter. Plus the salaries don’t match; you’d have to take on expirings too. plus, I don’t think Portland does that deal….they already have Nurkic. I guess if they are in win now, they might want Kanter, but IDK.

    You’d have to add Ed Davis who is an expiring.

    Well if you look at my above line up, you could switch him and McDermott to give the starting unit more scoring and spacing. I think Lee and Beasley with Oquinn/Willy could smash second units scoring wise.

    right; but why trade kanter for Harkness and davis, straight up, and take on Mo’s $$ for 2 more years? that’s a great deal for Portland, especially if they don’t want Kanter long term…..he’s gone this year, or there 1 more if he opts in. They would have to throw in a pick to get me to do it. but, again, Kanter would be their backup center……I don’t think they would do that.

    We’d probably take on Harkless’s money for an extra year, but open up cap space this year given that Kanter is very likely to opt in and Davis expires.

    What it comes down to is what you think about Kanter and Harkless.

    I think Kanter is a bad value contract (especially when he’s blocking Willy’s development at less than 1/10th the cost) .

    I think Harkless is also probably a bad value contract (for an extra year), but it’s for less money, frees money this off season, frees up Willy, and we need a legit SF anyway.

    Is it stealing? Probably not. But if it was ideal, then we’d have no chance of making the deal.

    I brought this one up initially because I’d be happy if we moved Kanter and got a decent return. The Knicks were rumored to be interested in Harkless if they did a Melo deal with Portland. So I tossed it out there.

    If I were Adam Silver, I’d put out a rumor that I was looking into the legal questions related to fining/suspending Lonzo Ball for enabling a member of his management team to criticize the Laker’s management by sharing internal information (locker room discussions, etc.) I would take some kind of action against ESPN as well.

    If I were the Lakers, I’d ban LaVar from the Staples Center indefinitely, either bench Lonzo or send him to the G-League, and start trade rumors immediately. I’d actually trade him if the right offer came along. The Lakers are a classy and storied franchise, and should not allow itself to be held hostage by a middling rookie’s meddlesome father. Let him shoot off his mouth in Memphis or some place like that.

    espn sends ppl to chase lavar for quotes because ppl pay attention to him… if ppl stopped paying attention to him then this wouldn’t be an issue…

    this isn’t the first time a parent of a nba player has said outlandish things….

    I get that Harkless is a wing and is relatively young, which already makes him better than watching Lance Thomas start, but I really don’t see the allure he has on this board.

    He can’t really shoot, he can’t really rebound, doesn’t get to the line or pass well. He’s probably a decent defender and that’s pretty much all. He’s behind Evan Turner and Al-Farouq Aminu in the rotation of a decent, not very good team. I really don’t see what he brings to the table other than being an almost throwaway piece in a salary relief trade. I would rather just keep Kanter and let him expire if that’s the case then add a very mediocre wing just for the sake of it, unless we’re just tanking anyway and having a fire sale.

    @31 No, it’s not the first time. I don’t “blame” ESPN from a fan’s perspective, it’s actually entertaining. LaVar can say or do whatever he wants. I was merely saying what I would do as a Commissioner or especially as a team owner. The kid is a nice kid, but his dad is trying to strong-arm management and ownership via social media/the press into making Lonzo (actually LaVar) the center of their universe. They already asked him politely to tone down the rhetoric. Saying that the coach has lost the team is a bridge too far.

    It doesn’t help that Lonzo couldn’t shoot his way out of a game of H_O_R_S_E with a 1-armed blind man.

    I think it’s ironic that so many NBA coaches are upset that someone without basketball coaching expertise like Lavar Ball is getting a soapbox to criticize a coach when the for the last year Kerr, Popovich, VanGundy and other coaches are constantly making comments about economic, domestic, and foreign policy when their expertise is in basketball.

    nice…that is kind of ironic…

    i like harkless… he’s not an amazing player but we wouldn’t really be giving up something amazing for him….

    we need a SF… presumably we draft one this year but they probably won’t be starting day 1…. harkless could theoretically hold the position until the guy is ready and maybe develop into something himself if the draftee fails….

    we also need that kind of guy at pg…. and to a lesser extent at pf also altho it’s possible we may think wily might be ready to start by next year….

    Harkless isn’t very good.. Seems like a trade just to make a trade, doesn’t get us anywhere.

    Right. That’s why I’m doing my little boycott. One less set of eyeballs and ears listening to their station because they want to chase an attention-grabber.

    @25 – Strat, you’re entitled to that opinion but the reality is that these coaches, just like every other asshole out there, are entitled to make their statements. Does CNN or ESPN pick up my words? No. Why would they?

    But we’ve become a culture of the media. That is where the fault lies. Not every word out of people’s mouths need to be communicated, but our society has collapsed. ESPN is a guilty party, but more-so, we are the guilty ones. We watch the Kardashians. We create the demand.

    The thing with the coaches is they are making those statements to NBA reporters not Business Insider or CSpan as far as I know nor are those outlets seeking them out. ESPN is totally to blame. They really sent reporters to Latvia???? Was anyone stalking Brandon Jennings’ parents for their input on the NCAA when he was in Italy. They don’; show streakers and other such people who run onto the field, why ids he any different other than because he isn’t running onto a field?

    So, back to hoops.
    Trey Burke! Trey Burke! Trey Burke!!!

    I’m all for it. We need kids like this. If he hustles on defense, he could be the missing link. I love it. Put him in the starting lineup with Kanter, KP, Lee and THJr. Now that’s an offense that will give opponents fits!

    Or, put him next to Frank and let him and Beasley be the 1-2 punch off the bench with McDermott and O’Quinn. I can’t wait for it to happen.

    @39 – No. ESPN didn’t send anyone to Latvia. They send people to Lithuania to follow LaVar Ball. Not that there’s a big difference 😉

    Sorry, but any kind of political entreaty from a person who holds Alan Dershowitz’s pocket comes with an extra grain of salt.

    Lavar Ball is spouting armchair commentary about not seeing enough high-fives on the court, and Kerr and Popovich are talking about the President of the United States’ blatant disregard for the Constitution and increasingly-apparent collusion with a hostile foreign government. Care to figure out the difference in cultural importance, or should I wear my Dersh mask so you unplug from Fox News long enough to think with your fucking brain?

    I mean, it was even Carlisle that blasted LaVar for talking about Walton first, and then reporters obviously came to Kerr to have his opinion since Walton coached with him in GSW.

    You can hate on Kerr and Pop for being outspoken, but Kerr was literally involved in all of this because he was asked a question and gave an answer that was even quite fair to LaVar’s role in all of this.

    For me, the NBA is extremely lucky that Popovich, Kerr, Curry and so many other big names are outspoken and articulate guys who don’t shy away from calling bullshit when they see it.

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