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The 2023 NBA Lottery Open Thread

Okay, here we go! Let’s see if the Knicks make a trade!

As an informal poll, do you think the Knicks will make a first round pick this year (it counts if they acquire a guy right after he’s drafted, like they did with Nate Robinson)?

70 replies on “The 2023 NBA Lottery Open Thread”

I think the Knicks will NOT pick in the first…but they’ll pick one of Amari Bailey, Ben Sheppard, or Keyontae Johnson in the early-mid 2nd.

Also, djphan, just to answer your question re: Coulibaly:

I think he’s shown a lot as the tertiary option on that team despite the offense basically being one through Wembanyama. He gets to the line a lot, is a slick and explosive athlete, a credible shooter, and an excellent defender. I think his upside is also rather good–he’s not just a Frank-type who has no extra gear. My ranking of him is partly a comment on how unimpressive I find the Thompsons, but I also think Coulibaly’s draft stock has been negatively impacted by being on the same team as Victor, at least from a scouting perspective (why watch Bilal when you can watch the freakish KD/Ralph Sampson/KP hybrid?)

If there was nothing else out there for him (something we can’t tell), then yeah. But I bet there would be a better deal out there, somewhere. The Pacers have wanted Obi for a while, for example.

I’ll say we make a first round pick, maybe with some combination of the protecteds and/or Obi.

Some absolutely wild outfits going on. Who is Gradey Dick again?

Neckwear/neckbling a clear trend.

I’ll say we trade Obi for a first round pick but then trade that first for a future protected first.

VE seems like a sweet kid. His brother is huge too.

Why SAS has to ruin this I don’t know…..

I’ll say we trade Obi for a first round pick but then trade that first for a future protected first.

it’s like you’re listening in on the front office folks talking right now…

As someone who picked Alabama to win it all in his bracket I was very underwhelmed by Miller, he was awful in the NCAA tourney.

Would Bilal have been drafted without playing next to VW? Feels strange.

Monica is great.

Most of these picks so far statistically are not very good 3pt shooters.

Feels like Whitmore continuing a long tradition of Villanova guys getting under drafted….

Leon should think about Mike K’s draft night traffic numbers the next time he passes on having a first rounder….

These Derek Lively notes really hit hard….

The NIL money was a great idea in my book….

Leon should think about Mike K’s draft night traffic numbers the next time he passes on having a first rounder….

Lol, to be fair he’s done him a solid by trading out of the last 2 which generates 90% of our traffic over that timespan

Kobe Bufkin making a fashion statement for sure

Apparently people are scared of Whitmore’s medicals

I can see the Knicks trading a future second round pick for one this year if someone they really like is available and the team with the pick has a full roster. But I can’t see us trading into the first round. So it’s going to be a while before there is Knicks related news.

1 thing I’ve learnt from this draft, to be drafted you have to have a mum who makes up random slogans or mottoes for you to live by

As someone who picked Alabama to win it all in his bracket I was very underwhelmed by Miller, he was awful in the NCAA tourney.

My wife went to SDSU, so we watched the games (seeing her actually give a shit about basketball was a fun twist), and yeah, when SDSU can shut you down, how can you not get shut down by NBA defenses?!

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Interesting trade by SacTown & Dallas.

Dallas doing a really good job retooling with players to put around Kyrie/Doncic. Hopefully takes a year for them to be any good

It occurs to me that since the pacers drafted Jarace Walker (they traded number seven, Coulibali, for him at eight), that probably takes out a market for Obi as some here have suggested might happen

waiting for cash considerations to make their first appearance.

Would someone please check Leon’s pulse to make sure he’s still alive

Bondy posted an article on LaVine’s camp not wanting him in NY

Guessing this is NYK changing the narrative on them not going to draft anyone

Pretty conspicuous timing

Any of the remaining players have any ties with CAA? No? No draft pick then.

LaVine doesn’t want to play for NY!!!

Finally some good news for the Knicks tonight!

scoot to the blazers was almost poetic/ironic and no doubt will spur some dame rumors…

houston had some interesting moves… not totally thrilled with Amen and i think forgoing Black is going to be regretful for them but might be another instance where their second pick outperforms their first (Sengun)… Cam’s not nearly as good as Sengun and i’m not entirely shocked he fell… he had a lot of questions on his feel which are entirely valid given his a/to ratio and apparently some medicals spooked teams… but his fall could look pretty silly in hindsight…

Cason Wallace was one guy i liked a bit better than i rated… and besides wemby probably the best fit to team as there was… the rich get richer…

i always admired what sean marks does in the draft…. Clowney was a headscratcher but Whitehead does have a lot of Levert energy and that’s because he had the same doctor for his foot apparently…. Dariq Whitehead was a top 3 name behind wemby and scoot preseason … he’s one of the youngest in this class… that pick was probably the most interesting of the night…

i’ve always been mixed on ainge’s draft prowess but he had a solid night and probably did the most to move to their team forward.. besides the spurs of course…

Kind of annoying that Rose didn’t buy a pick—clearly they were available! Let’s hope there’s some interesting UDFA plays coming. Seems like it’s star trade or bust this off-season…

It’s impossible for me to know Rose’s real thinking about players like Mitchell, Beal, George, and LaVine. I’d love to know if he made any offers. But IMO they all would have been bad moves. Whether we are getting saved by circumstances, prudent management or a combination of both, so far we are managing to avoid the mistake of panicking into a move that’s not going to get us where we want to be. There’s still plenty of time to add some depth and see if anyone shakes loose at the deadline.

I am tired of how uninterested our team seems to be in making draft picks. I don’t think buying or trading our way into the late 1st or 2nd would necessarily move the needle but it would certainly be more enjoyable.

This is two drafts in a row with nothing to show. It is boring. Watching draft picks develop is one of the more entertaining aspects of regular-season basketball. It is also the best way to fill the end of your bench. Now we will fill the end of our bench with scrubs and play our 9-10 man rotation with no flexibility again.

So apparently we’ve doubled our Toppins instead of removing them

How fucking weird is this move? It would be like signing Cam Reddish’s undrafted kid brother last year.

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It really is crazy how fucking boring Draft Day is when the Knicks aren’t involved.

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OT Elite Jaylen Martin to a 2-way

I think we technically need to cut someone… we’ll miss you Duane Washington Jr or whoever we have there right now

Hollinger has him at 59:

I’m a bit puzzled why people aren’t talking about Martin more. I get the downside: he’s a 6-5 guard with a limited skill level, sort of a poor man’s Hamidou Diallo right now. Nonetheless, his numbers at Overtime Elite were nearly as good as those of the two Thompsons. He also played in the G League Elite camp and was one of the better players there — even though most of them were three or four years older — but somehow he wasn’t invited to the NBA Draft Combine.

Needless to say, I think there is more than enough development potential here to make him an intriguing play with a two-way and I had to resist the temptation to put him higher on my board. I’m really interested to see how the league values him on draft night.

That’s the whole section on him but click through if you have it. Jacob is in there too https://theathletic.com/4623322/2023/06/20/nba-draft-top-prospects-2023-hollinger?source=user-shared-article

Vecenie has him 73

Martin needs much refinement, but you can at least see a world where five years down the line, the guy who is 6-foot-5 without shoes, has a 6-foot-11 wingspan and has real explosiveness plus fluidity in and out of his moves can play in the NBA. Especially if he’s going to be willing to make defense his calling card night in and night out. Martin needs to get as good as he can on the defensive end of the court while also finding a home that will specialize in working on his jumper. If he does that, he’ll best position himself for success. He’s probably more of an Exhibit 10 guy, but I wouldn’t have an NBA team buying in and going for it on a two-way.

Oh so we could have had Cam Whitmore on a rookie deal for the next 4 years if we hadn’t traded our pick.

Our pick was at 23. Whitmore was picked at 20.

Our win % with Deuce in the rotation instead of Hart translates to ~2.3 fewer wins over the last 25 games.

The 20th pick was 3 wins back.

So that’s probably a no, at best a maybe

Our win % with Deuce in the rotation instead of Hart translates to ~2.3 fewer wins over the last 25 games.

Lol

So the list of players who would be Knicks if we had just stayed put and let a bot select the BPA is now:

Tyrese Halliburton, Desmond Bane, Xavier Tillman, Jalen Johnson, Keon Johnson, Jalen Williams, Cam Whitmore.

On the other hand, Jalen Brunson is the best free agent signing in Knicks history. Signing him covers up a lot of mistakes. But holy shit that’s a lot of mistakes.

Feel free to offer a different accounting… Kinda seems like you’re just making shit up. This is what it actually looks like.

I have it on the authority of Z-Man himself that the Knicks wouldn’t have even made the playoffs if we didn’t trade for Josh Hart!

But let’s assume your methodology is correct. It isn’t. But let’s give you the benefit of the doubt.

If you’re right, then without making the Josh Hart trade the Knicks would have won 45 games instead of 47. So we would have been… the 5th seed with Deuce, instead of the 5th seed with Hart.

So the Hart trade cost us a first round pick and it didn’t
even impact our standing?? That would make the trade even worse!!

But there’s no point in even going down that road. You took the Knicks winning percentage with Deuce in the lineup and used it to predict the outcome of 25 games. That can’t be taken seriously.

I’m not saying my method is bulletproof, it’s meant as a rough estimate, but I have a method. You just invented the fact we’d somehow have Cam Whitmore.

Feel free to do some math and get back to us.

And 45 wins ties us with Brooklyn. So maybe do the minimal amount and actually look at the standings.

According to some posters, when the Knicks actually make a draft pick, they inevitably draft the wrong person, or trade the pick to draft in a different and inevitably wrong spot. But if we hadn’t traded this year’s pick for Hart, we would have miraculously chosen the right person and the right spot according to these same posters.

If we had wanted Whitmore we could have traded into the draft. Teams trade into drafts all the time. Trading for Hart is not why we didn’t pick Whitmore. Rose and his indifference to drafting are why.

Like Bernie said, just because we could have been in a position to draft Whitmore does not mean we would have.

Okay, so no draft picks, LaVine doesn’t want to come here because of the CAA factor, we’ve been scared off of PG13 due to the contract extension thing, Booker obviously isn’t moving, KAT is likely not moving, and Dame is going to Miami if he wants to leave Portland.

So what’s the move here? Re-sign Hart, sign someone like DiVincenzo with the mid-level, find Obi and/or Fournier new homes, and call it an offseason? I know that would please some people here, but it feels to me like we need to do something dramatic, rather than largely run it back?

But if we hadn’t traded this year’s pick for Hart, we would have miraculously chosen the right person and the right spot according to these same posters.

when you trade out you’re measured against EVERYONE you passed up because youve effectively made a judgement on everyone that they’re not worth it….

what made the Kevin knox pick so egregious? it was because sga was on the same team and he was better and mostly anyone paying attention could see that… but also because there was a line of starters picked right behind him…. you picked knox and effectively said that he’s better than all those guys….

trading out of the knox pick would be the same thing…. you’re saying nothing or Josh hart or ihart or kemba walker was effectively better than what you would’ve gotten and so you’re judged on everyone you passed up…

this is not some new thing…. everyone has judged every front office on this standard… just the other day someone brought up cleanthony early when we passed up on jokic and no one batted an eye… why is judging rose on all these other dudes so out of bounds is beyond me….

Jacob toppin is not a prospect… he was a straight terrible player in his younger days and didn’t exactly develop into anything…. he has hops and that’s about it….

hollinger is a little right on martin…. but it misses the point in the Thompson twins…. the Thompson twins aren’t judged too much on what they did in overtime…. there’s a suspicion that they weren’t going all out until the playoffs and the numbers kind of show that… and they kind of obliterated the comp when they did…

so martin getting judged on this similar scale is not really cutting it…. this is the second guy they’re taking from this league so they are making some sort of bet that the league is better than it is but Im not seeing it…

“They wouldn’t have drafted him anyway” continues to be a non-defense.

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