[news.google.com] — Tuesday, January 10, 2023 6:47:46 AM
3 takeaways from the Milwaukee Bucks’ gritty win over the New York Knicks Sports Illustrated
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NBA Notebook: Knicks, Lakers, Raptors, Mavericks, Pistons, Kevin Durant Hoops Hype
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[news.google.com] — Tuesday, January 10, 2023 12:19:00 AM
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[news.google.com] — Tuesday, January 10, 2023 12:16:00 AM
Knicks’ Obi Toppin plays sparingly in return from long injury absence New York Post
[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 10:28:00 PM
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[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 10:12:36 PM
Milwaukee 111, N.Y. Knicks 107 Middletown Press
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Rapid Recap: Milwaukee Bucks 111, New York Knicks 107 Brew Hoops
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[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 7:31:00 PM
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[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 5:03:29 PM
Knicks: Mitchell Robinson says he is ‘becoming something’ with his rebounding prowess Empire Sports Media
[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 4:41:38 PM
Knicks 1-2 punch Jalen Brunson, Julius Randle fall to Donovan Mitchell anew in NBA Player of the Week race Empire Sports Media
[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 3:42:29 PM
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[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 1:41:19 PM
NBA Power Rankings: Where Are Knicks at Halfway Point? Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 11:26:37 AM
Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson is dominating the boards: ‘I’m a dangerous man’ The Athletic
[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 9:58:29 AM
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[news.google.com] — Monday, January 9, 2023 7:39:11 AM
“I never wanted to leave the Knicks” – Carmelo Anthony opens up about his departure from the New York Knicks Basketball Network
70 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2023.01.10)”
Like the Bulls win a while back, I don’t think the Bucks loss really says much about the team one way or the other. I don’t think it was a bad loss, but nor was it a good loss. It was just sort of a…loss.
Nothing to get worked up about, but nothing to get super pumped about. Besides, of course, how awesome it is to have Jalen Brunson on this team. Remember the last time that a Knick guard could get into the paint at will? I don’t.
It’s looking more and more like #10 in the East is a hard bottom for this team, so that’s nice. It’s good that there’s some leeway there, to still be able to make it to the play-in games, at the very least.
Meanwhile, the West is just beating the shit out of each other, so the Eastern Conference teams are actually higher, overall, due to it. The #6 team in the East, the Pacers, are, like, the #10 team in the NBA!
I’m with you BC. I didn’t like the 3rd quarter, but the loss doesn’t really move me. I just hope we beat the brakes off of Indy tomorrow- they’re in our way. I will say this about the Pacers though- they are incredibly well-coached. I don’t think they have a better roster than we do, but they are better than us right now- and that is directly related to the job Carlisle is doing.
Nice to see Obi on the court again. I for one, cannot wait to see this team get healthy and run that 9 man rotation with Obi..withth some spot minutes available for Fournier and whoever doesn’t become the backup 5.
Agreed, Brian, this loss doesn’t say much. We even could have won it if the refs didn’t miss 2 blatant fouls, one on a Brunson 3PA and the other was Portis elbowing Grimes.
I’ll wait for Max’s grades*, but one player stood out yesterday – Hart. That was a really poor game by him.
* – Just kiddin, Max, i know you aren’t doing it anymore! 😉 😛
I said this at the end of the last thread but will repeat it here.
While it is frustrating that we keep losing these close games where we have a lead near the end, it is promising that literally every loss we’ve had in the last month has been one of these types of games. The team is obviously competitive and can hang with anyone on any given night.
It’s a lack of experience with these late game situations. It’s also I believe a coaching issue because we go straight ISO. But also, it cannot be emphasized enough that we don’t have that go-to superstar leader that seperates a good, competitive team from a true contender. So when we face those teams or even teams like Dallas that have bad rosters but a true superstar, if the game is close at all, we’re at a disadvantage.
Maybe these experiences will help the young players and come playoff time, we can close out some of these games (at least in the first round LOL).
But we need one more piece. The questions are who that is and how we get them.
I’m glad Leon did not get Mitchell. IF we had him now, we’d be winning more of these games but that backcourt woudl get exposed in the playoffs eventually and Danny was asking for so much that we would have no more moves left after we made that trade (aka, a Melo trade that leaves us bare).
As it is right now, we just gotta be patient and hope the youngsters continue to improve. We have been missing our best (I know its debatable) young player. And hope that after this season, things will shake loose the right star who fits our timeline and fits our roster somehow becomes available. But there is no rush. Until then, continue to improve internally and try to trim the roster fat where we can. Our only bad contract if Fournier and even that one isn’t so bad that we won’t be able to eventually move it. We got lots of picks. Randle is far more valuable now than he was at the start of the season. Mitch, IQ and Grimes have all stepped up (so has Sims). If that star isn’t available this off season, look to improve the roster where we can. Honestly, an Alex Burks type player for the bench would do this team wonders and we can probably get someone like him this off season for a reasonable price.
Even though it looks rough at times, i’m fairly confident in our ability to get a bucket at an average or above avg. rate, in a tight game, with time winding down…
Where we are an absolute mess, is on Defense… we DO NOT get enough stops on late game possessions… and when we do, we can’t get a rebound… its been happening A LOT…
I really think these games come down to execution on defense… i would sell out my offense for some defense down the stretch… you have to trust your guys 1 on 1… just give it a try…
and defense includes defensive glass
while i am constantly worried about going toe to toe, or in actuality, point for point in tight games… take a step back for a moment, and understand it doesnt have to be point for point… why cant it be stop for stop?!?!?!
so i was trying to figure out how good we actually are seeing as how we’ve been facing so many teams without their best players.. so i thought getting the point differential for the other games should… more or less.. give us some indication…
i took out all the games where the other teams best players were missing… like jokic.. embiid.. booker.. curry etc… and i took the point differential for everything else… there’s some noise in that since that doesn’t count games brunson was missing… but that actually helps the knicks out with the blowout win vs the rockets… and i also counted the games vs the hornets and pistons since i dont’t think lamelo and cade would’ve mattered all that much…
all that said… our pythagorean win% in those other games is .510 which is higher than i expected… if you don’t count those charlotte/detroit games then we’re under .500 since those were huge blowouts… but i think we’re probably somewhere around .500 more or less…
what does that mean for the rest of the year? that puts us around 43 wins for the rest of the year and a dogfight for 7th but i think most likely 8th….
I don’t think anything this season is likely to say much about this team one way or the other. We pretty much know who we are and are along for the ride. It’s Rose who faces the questions now. Can he make this team better? He has the means to do so.
We should have won the game and not just in a we had a big second half lead way. We created better shots etc, but we just didn’t win. Pretty frustrating loss, but yeah I don’t think it tells us anything we don’t already know about the team.
It’s kind of amazing that Brunson can be as good as he has been and we aren’t much better. I mean, I expected him to be this good. And I did not expect us to win more than 44 games. But watching that dynamic play out in real time is strange. Because he is really good. And we are not.
Very curious what Leon’s modus operandi is at this point. How do we think the mechanics of a big trade work? Does Leon proactively call the Clippers front office and signal that if they are considering cashing in on PG while he still has considerable value that the Knicks have the assets at the ready? Or does he wait? Or back channel it? Curious on the chess game there. Anyone know?
Owen, the team over achieved on unsustainable play from Obi Toppin at the end of last year driving up our win % a few games. So if you view it through that lens I’d say this team is somewhere between 7-10 wins better than last year.
Also we have a soft 5 game stretch coming. So if we can go 4-1 on that stretch the improvement profile changes pretty materially at 26-20 no?
This Knicks schedule is so fucking weird. It’s either grueling or a cakewalk. There doesn’t feel like any in-between.
If we’re on pace to win 43 wins, that’s a 6 game improvement from last season. Which is like 15 percent more wins. That’s a fairly significant improvement.
If you’re an absolute shit team, going from like 20 wins to 30 or even 35 wins isn’t that hard. It’s when you’re already average that it becomes harder to go from average to good and from good to great.
Like if we’re a 48 win team and the next year we win 54 games, that isn’t that many more wins but most people would say a 54 win team is a step above a 48 win team.
Let’s not forget that Brunson put up 44 against Jrue Holiday, one of the best on ball defenders in the NBA
I’ve said it before, but it’s mind boggling how a 6’1″ guy with short arms who operates a ton in the paint never gets his shot blocked.
I think there are actually a few major questions to be answered this season that will have a lot of impact on what we should do going forward.
Who the hell is RJ Barrett? The boring answer might be that he’s both the dreadful player we see for disturbingly long stretches and the pretty good one we see for other long stretches, and it averages out to the mediocre-to-bad player his stats say he is. But if he can start playing the latter more often and at least unambiguously become a net beneficial player, that would help us a lot.
Can Randle keep it up? This one’s simpler. If Randle is the high-usage, above average efficiency guy who takes mostly good shots we’ve seen for most of this season, we’re well positioned whether we want to trade him or add to the team with him on it. If he’s not, well, hopefully we can get out from under his contract somehow.
Who is Immanuel Quickley? We’re up to a pretty big sample size of genuinely excellent play, but obviously that doesn’t fully cancel out what came before it. Can he and RJ be the best versions of themselves at the same time? If not, how do we navigate that?
Good news: Quickley trade sounds unlikely
Bad news: we can’t seem to get two seconds for Cam Reddish
It’s not that there aren’t questions remaining; I just don’t expect any answers this year.
I’m going all Random Walk Down Wall Street here, but I’m pretty confident that after 82 games RJ Barrett, Julius Randle, and Immanuel Quickley are going to be exactly what they are now after 41.
The questions you’re asking likely need another season to determine the answers.
It looks like Carlos Correa is going to the Twins.
I’m actually fine with this. It would have been nice to have him on this year’s team, but that contract they were going to give him was absurd. You’re probably going to get 3-5 good years out of him on a TWELVE year contract. There will be other big fish that come along. In the meantime, the Mets have a perfectly fine situation at 3B– a decent veteran incumbent in Escobar being pushed by a top 50 MLB prospect in Brett Baty.
It looks like Correa is going to sign with the Twins for 6/200 with vesting options that can get him to 6/270, so he ended up with a lot less guaranteed money than he was asking for. I’m glad Uncle Steve isn’t on the hook for $300M with this guy.
I think the RJ/IQ questions deserves some discourse. Quickley’s play as a starter has been pretty eye opening.
21.5/5.7/4.3 with a .586 TS% in the games RJ has missed, and he’s only shooting .356 from 3 in that sample so he’s really making strides in other areas.
I’m not going to assume he can maintain that if given the opportunity…but boy I would prefer to find out.
There is one glaring question, but I don’t expect the answer to reveal very much:
Who does Thibs start when RJ comes back?
I think it will give us the definitive answer to the question I’ve often posed: is Thibs really obsessed with winning, or is he just obsessed with repetition and constancy?
Any coach running a merit-based system would not demote IQ or Grimes. I don’t think Thibs runs a merit-based system, though, so I suspect it will be right back to 40 mpg for RJ no matter what.
Hey, JK, remember how my 5 year old only wants to listen to that withdrawn Nirvana song about living under a bridge and the “guitar song” that opens the Meddle album? Well, she’s got a new song that has replaced those two (finally!). The new song is… Hard Knock Life by Jay-Z. (she calls it “the Annie wrap up” and she must have been introduced to it via the infinite playlist that spotify generates after her older sister listened to the Annie soundtrack). She asks to hear it every day on repeat and you are one of the few people who can fully appreciate the eclectic and contrarian musical tastes of this very odd little girl.
That Nirvana song is “Something In the Way.” Great song. IMHO, of course.
Kids have really interesting taste in music.
My four-year old just got a little record player for Christmas, and I gave him some 45s, and he’s totally into it. We have a little chore/behavior chart that we do with him, and if he earns enough stars he gets to claim some sort of prize at the end of the week, and he is requesting records as his prize. Five records, to be exact. His interest in music really skyrocketed when he got that little record player.
He requested a 45 of his most favorite song, “Sit On You” by Tim and Eric, and I had to explain to him that the song was not released in the 45 RPM format. Ditto with his second most favorite song, “Fish Heads” by Barnes and Barnes.
He loves 60’s bubblegum pop, big fan of “Windy” by The Association, “Sugar Sugar” by The Archies, and “This Diamond Ring” by Gary Lewis and the Playboys. I tried “Last Train To Clarksville” by The Monkees, but no dice. He vetoes about 80% of the music I play for him, but occasionally he finds a tune that perks his ears up. The most recent big hit with him was “Beautiful Boy” by John Lennon.
With my 18 month old daughter, I find that she will respond to Broadway musicals, 60’s bubblegum pop/rock, 50’s rock, 70’s folk music, etc.
When we get into 80’s or later, it’s hit or miss.
I think there’s something about clear vocals, simple lyrics and simpler music that makes that older stuff or Broadway where they sing/talk more accessible to little ones. Like when I try to play massive attack in the car she does not have a good reaction to it LOL.
Noticing this too with the tv we let her watch. She only gets to watch about 20 minutes a day. If we try to show her cartoons like Finding Nemo or Pixar movies, etc…she can’t really watch it. But puppet stuff like Sesame Street or the 60’s rudolph christmas claymation special or stuff like Shawn The Sheep…where it’s more real and not just animation…she loves that stuff.
Find it interesting that the team went 2-19 from three just between Randle, Grimes, and Fournier and still almost beat one of the best teams in the league, only losing by 4.
There was some really bad play in the fourth quarter, though. between shot selection, (lack of) playmaking, and atrocious defense, it felt like walking away from what worked the first three quarters. The Bucks started making some big shots, but it felt like the Knicks lost the game, not the Bucks won it. Even with Jrue’s heroics.
Big fan of Hard Knock Life. The lad also loved it a few years back.
Speaking of Jay Z, if your kid knows Empire State of Mind, there’s a fun video by Silk Road from a few years back that’s kind of like unwrapping a present, with all the joy of excited kid faces that come with it.
***That Nirvana song is “Something In the Way.” Great song. IMHO, of course.***
How many thousands of times have you listened to it in the last 60 days?
[edited to add: that song is one verse and one chorus that is looped, so listening to it once is the same as listening to it twice, so I am actually probably in the ten-thousands of times]
My kids like Jojo Siwa and I want to blow my brains out
Obviously RJ is going right back to the role he had before he got injured. He will continue to start as long as he is healthy, Thibs is coach and there isn’t a major upgrade to the roster.
But keep in mind that he was already the first guy to get subbed out and was playing with the bench unit more and more. Thibs also mentioned something about playing him at the 4.
So the question for me is not who will start, but a) what will the minutes distribution be and b) who will finish games?
More specifically, will Thibs go with the hot hand, the best theoretical matchup, or consistency of role?
60s psych pop, including the bubblegum variety, was so damn good. So much flew under the radar, not making the oldies-station rotation but deserving it.
Under-the-radar great psych-folk song, Phil Cordell’s “Red Lady”:
IQ’s versatility is hurting him.
He can be a 3&D low usage but high efficiency starting player like he was last night or a high usage instant offense 6th man role. He has also shown flashes that can also innitiate offense for others at point.
Grimes can’t do that. He’s an excellent 3&D guy. That’s who he is. He can’t put up a series of buckets creating his own shot of the bench. RJ can create his own shot but he’s our golden child who is a below average defender and three point shooter.
To maximize Randle, Brunson, the team’s net rating and maintain political peace with both media and front office, Thibs must start RJ but find a way to ensure that he playes a maximum of ~34 minutes and ~ 40% of those minutes are played with the second unit.
“More specifically, will Thibs go with the hot hand, the best theoretical matchup, or consistency of role?”
Facts! – Excellent point.
That has been my frustration with Thibs all along. He tends to favor consistency of role strategy but he continually flip flops based on his “emotional feel” and is usually late in switching anyway. This specifically hurt us in the Atlanta series where he was severely outcoached.
I gotta lay “Red Rubber Ball” by The Cyrkle on him, I bet my dude will like that tune
If it were just RJ Barrett, then he’d be on the bench. But if he were just RJ Barrett he’d have been on the bench a long time ago. Instead, he’s RJ Barrett former 3rd overall pick and he’ll continue to start for the foreseeable future.
This tweet was made before the Toronto game, but i don’t think the % has changed since.
It was evident that iHart is physically unable to perform last night. He was clearly the worst player on the court by large margin.
Is anyone familiar with this injury and can explain how playing on it doesn’t effect recovery?
Had no idea that “Red Rubber Ball” was co-written by Paul Simon. Makes total sense.
When driving our ( then) 3 yo daughter loved Taj Mahal’s children’s album Shake Sugaree and so did we.
Current parents of toddlers should be thankful that you escaped Barney the Talking Dinosaur ( I saw each episode more times than I rewatched The Wire).
The more I watch Hartenstein play the more I’m sorry for him.
One can see he’s reluctant to jump, has no balance and his timing is completely out of synch, especially in “quick situations” when he’s thinking instead of reacting.
That’s what happens when you know your next step can be the one that puts you out of the game for a year.
To my personal experience he should be resting his achille’s and doing therapies all day, but he’s followed by an elite medical team and I think (and hope) they’re not trying to ruin him.
He has played every game so far and all his availability has gained him is fans’ scorn.
Honestly he joins Obi and Fournier in my list of players I hope will be traded for their own sake…
Wait until your son turns 10 and you’re driving him to his travel hoops game and you’re talking about rap and you ask him if he’s ever listened to Eminem and Dr Dre and he says “I love Eminem!” And he doesn’t realize that’s YOUR music. And the two of you listen to the Marshall Mathers LP and Forgot About Dre for the next 30 mins. Makes all the Jojo Siwa and Broadway lullabies seem like a long time ago. Big smile!
Here’s The Game Theory Podcast segment on Grimes that TNFH mentioned the other day.
Only has the Grimes segment so no need to skip around.
Vecenie is very high on Grimes & indicates that Grimes might be more than a tier 5F role player.
In another segment not included he thinks Deuce’s POA defense makes him a rotation level player and that Sims is a solid 3rd string C. He praised the Knicks as having one of the better drafts.
I had more luck with mine, as he watched Regular Show, Gumball and Phineas & Ferb. I don’t know who loved those shows more, if it was him or me. 😀
If only Bluey had been around! That is the number #1 kids shows for adults.
The Bucks are a very good team, a surefire championship contender and yesterday’s game was very physical, with kind of a playoffs-like atmosphere, I enjoyed it.
But our limits are always the same, despite Brunson’s heroics.
JB (15-30) and Julius (9-29, 1-12 from three) took 59% of our shots, for comparison Giannis and Jrue took 29 combined…
Yes, our supporting cast shot badly (aside from IQ’s 9-14), but they never had a chance to find their rhythm, and that’s because our offensive schemes suck.
Plus we can’t get stops in the clutch and the rare times when they missed a shot we were unable to corral the DReb, so they shot again and again until they scored.
So it’s true, it was a game that didn’t change anything about the perception nor the reality of this team.
Now let’s crush the Pacers please…
RJ will go right back into the rotation, I expect Fournier to be the odd man out, with his minutes going to Glue Grimes and IQ.
If he’s really injured, i don’t understand why aren’t we resting him. We have Sims, we don’t need to play an injured C.
Well, you know i want Fournier gone for my sake. LOL. He drives me mad with his defense. Last night was the corner 3 from Connaughton.
But yeah, i agree on the other two (Obi and Hart).
Maybe I missed the thread, but has anyone watched the british spy-thriller series “Slow Horses” with Gary Oldman?
Is based on Mick Herron’s “Slough House” series of books (also known as “Jackson Lamb”) and it’s very easy to binge, every season is 6 episodes.
Thibs’ ways are not for us uninitiated to understand or doubt… 😉
We had a brief, glorious phase where my kid really liked Yo Gabba Gabba.
We had a less glorious phase where the only thing he wanted to watch was Caillou.
Ugh, Caillou is really annoying. I feel for you. Mine tried that, but i used to watch cartoons with him every time i had the chance, and i guess i’m vocal about things i don’t like. 😛 So probably he started to mold his taste to shows that i wasn’t complaining. 😀
Max, I think Slow Horses is great. I think I did mention it here, but the mention was brief
Don’t remember if we talked about it, but yeah it’s a great show. Gary Oldman is always awesome, i think Jack Lowden is very good in the main role, and also nice that my platonic crush (Olivia Cooke) was in the show too (and playing a badass :D). No spoilers about season 2 please, haven’t watched it yet.
I just found out on Thanksgiving Day that Blue is actually female. I wish I had kept the words “Why isn’t she pink, then?” from falling out of my mouth. The females present didn’t love the gender assumption.
I’m usually much more sensitive than that. Please please please tell me you all thought Blue was a male dog, too. Please?
I seem to have brought the site to a halt with that. Sorry.
@KFNINJ and @Cyber
It’s a really good show and the books are really good too.
I’ll watch season 2 tomorrow, the good news is that season 3 and 4 are already in the works. 🙂
Caillou plays for the Bulls now.
‘Yo Gaba Gaba’ is like ‘Everything Everywhere All at Once’. Come up with a great idea, hand it off to a room full of extremely stoned 20-yr-olds and tell them to make you proud.
I vaguely remember Blue. It never occurred to me to think about gender. It still doesn’t seem relevant to me. Why does anyone care?
I’m actually glad my kids don’t like the music I like because they latch on to stuff and play it over and over until you feel like you’re on the It’s A Small World ride and can’t get off. I’d rather they do that to Nirvana and Jay-Z than to songs and artists that I still enjoy on my own time.
Jimmy Butler has scored 35 pts on 6 FGs.
“Jimmy Butler has scored 32 pts on 5 FGs.”
And the Heat broke the NBA record for most FT’s without a miss – 40. Crazy.
caught the 11 year old singing along to Deacon Blues the other day while we were driving…
Phineas and Ferb is a good one…i never quite got the whole duck, excuse me, platypus thing, but it was a decent show to watch…
as a general rule – high pitched noises don’t sit so well with me – that alvin and chipmunks stuff (cartoons/movies) was torture…although the movies were kind of cool…okay, i also like the alvin and chipmunk cartoon were the smart chipmunk (theodore i think), invents this pizza delivery machine that goes go rogue, that one was kind of funny…
kid’s are moving away from the nick and disney cartoons these days – of the more recent ones though – i enjoy(ed) Big City Greens the most…
Big game tonight. If we’re “good” we should really take care of the Pacers at home. Yet they are trying to figure out how “good” they are and probably see us as a great measuring stick. This could be a prelude to a play-in game…
Excellent point, this really does feel like a bit of a measuring stick on both ends.
Mighty quiet around here this morning.
Katz has an interesting piece in The Athletic this morning detailing how the Knicks totally suck at the end of games, but so does everyone else. I’m paraphrasing that a bit, perhaps, but I stand by my interpretation. As a sample:
“The Knicks can’t hold onto a lead. But there’s a greater context to this: neither can the rest of the NBA.
Thanks to The Athletic’s NBA analytics guru, Seth Partnow, who compiled league-wide statistics on blown leads for this story, we now know the Knicks are one of seven teams that have let go of at least seven double-digit advantages in losses this season. Fourteen teams have blown at least six double-digit leads in losses; 21 have blown at least five.”
Blazers, Hawks, and Mavs all suck even worse than the Knicks at this. Doesn’t make me feel much better, to be honest.
On the one hand that may be true, on the other the Mavs and Trailblazers both beat us in crunch time 😔
I wonder if crunchtime performance during the season predicts playoff success since it mimics the more intense defense of the playoffs, or at least predicts it relative to record.