[news.google.com] — Wednesday, December 21, 2022 4:38:00 AM
Knicks’ Immanuel Quickley busts out of recent shooting slump New York Post
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, December 21, 2022 3:39:00 AM
Knicks, Raptors matchup features teams with opposite streaks CBS Sports
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, December 21, 2022 2:05:00 AM
Derrick Rose gets brutally honest on falling out of Tom Thibodeau’s Knicks rotation ClutchPoints
[news.google.com] — Wednesday, December 21, 2022 12:06:00 AM
Toronto Raptors at New York Knicks odds, picks and predictions USA TODAY Sportsbook Wire
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 11:39:00 PM
Knicks beat Warriors at MSG for first time since 2013, extend winning streak to league-best eight games CBS Sports
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 11:25:00 PM
Warriors bullied by 3-pointers, rebounds in 38-point loss to Knicks Yahoo Sports
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 10:25:00 PM
Jalen Brunson leads Knicks past depleted Warriors for eighth win in a row New York Post Knicks 132, Warriors 94: “Christmas came early” Posting and ToastingNBA Insider breaks down Knicks’ dominating win over Warriors, lineup adjustments continuing to pay off | SportsNite Yahoo Sports
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 10:09:23 PM
Jalen Brunson’s All-Star Credentials Praised by Fans as Knicks Cruise Past Warriors Bleacher Report
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 9:57:26 PM
Steph Curry may be out till after the New Year Golden State of Mind
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 9:51:03 PM
Golden Eight! Knicks Conquer Warriors Through Familiar Means Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 8:30:04 PM
Shaquille O’Neal unfazed by Knicks winning streak, doubts they can get out of 1st round of playoffs Lakers Daily
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 7:01:38 PM
Toronto Raptors vs. New York Knicks Betting Odds, Trends and … OddsShopper.com
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 6:23:00 PM
New York Notes: Anunoby, Knicks Front Office, Robinson, Claxton hoopsrumors.com
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 3:54:00 PM
New York Knicks 2022-23 NBA Finals odds and playoff update New York Post
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 3:36:17 PM
DiVincenzo, JaMychal Green out for Knicks game Golden State of Mind
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 2:50:36 PM
Are the Knicks Contenders or Pretenders? Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 2:38:39 PM
The Knicks are playing good basketball again. So, how are they doing it? Yahoo Sports
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 12:59:36 PM
The Knicks reportedly asked the Raptors about OG Anunoby prior to current win streak Posting and Toasting
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 12:22:54 PM
Indiana Pacers wing Chris Duarte looks comfortable in return vs New York Knicks Sports Illustrated
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 12:03:02 PM
NBA rumors: Knicks “reached out” for OG Anunoby trade ClutchPoints
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 11:11:12 AM
Derrick Rose 1-on-1 with Shams: On his role with Knicks, Bulls legacy and life after he retires The Athletic
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 10:11:15 AM
Isaiah Hartenstein, Jericho Sims ? Knicks’ unconventional duo ? have New York thriving The Athletic
[news.google.com] — Tuesday, December 20, 2022 9:44:07 AM
Donovan Mitchell, Cavs reveal lesson from Knicks loss vs. Jazz Cavs Nation
99 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2022.12.21)”
8 in a row!
After the dogfight in Indiana a leisuring walk in Central Park was just what doctor ordered for our blood pressure.
Everything’s clicking, I have to pinch myself to be sure it’s not a dream and this team’s reaching the level I’ve thought it could(*) and beyond.
True, the Warriors were missing players (*) and they’re not the same team without Steph, but they have just won in Toronto and this was a complete dismantling, an anaconda-like crushing, the final outcome was never in question (zero lead changes, one tie).
I don’t know live, but watching on TV it was a strange feeling, the crowd was quiet, the muffled atmosphere felt more like a preseason game, the opponents seemed resigned, our guys supremely confident.
While the final numbers aren’t shiny, each member of the Lefty Brigade (**) took his turn carrying the offense (plus each had 5 AST), Glue Grimes was perfect in his role, Mitch beasted as usual and every member of the slimmed Bench Mob was on parade, from the sharpshooting IQ, to a pass happy I-Hart, from Jumpin’ J Sims to a swaggering Deuce.
Stat Of The Game:
47-29. NY’s edge in rebounds. The Warriors had no chance.
27. Knicks’ assists total after dishing only 13 in Indiana. Sharing is caring.
Play Of The Game:
I-Hart to Sims for the dunk!
Barrett B +
Surprisingly low FTA, but 5 ASTs and zero TO. Still searching for his stroke from outside, has ample margin of improvement and needs better consistency during the game, but he’s playing well enough.
He built the gap then he sat down on the bench for a well deserved rest. Tonight it’s a marquee matchup with FVV.
I don’t know his ceiling but I love Glue Grimes and he’s perfect for this team (4 ASTs too). I gave him a minus for the brain freeze at the end of the 3rd, the game was already over but it was the stupidest foul I’ve ever seen 🙂
The shot was off (3 missed FT, 11-40 3FG in last 5) but everything else is here. His physicality is a weapon when he kept it in check.
Another rock solid performance from The Anchor.
He really needed this (22, 5-6 3FG), let’s hope this is the game that change his season. Effort never waver, the 4 TOs are a little too much.
The confidence’s raising, the commitment stay the same. I’m so happy for him.
He didn’t shoot well but put up a passing clinic (Deuce wasted one). I’d like those glimpses to become something.
Sooner or later he’ll jump out of the building…
Arci & Svi NA
Always nice when every player score.
Team’s running as a freight train, he accepted garbage time and rested his starters for tonight game, it wasn’t guaranteed…
(*) My 45 wins prediction is alive, honestly I’d never thought it would have been without Rose and Fournier (and Cam), I was expecting depth to be a strenght.
From the Dept. Of Strange Things:
We’re the only team in the league whose three leading scorers had started all their team’s games.
Would really like to get some data points against full-strength good/elite teams.
More broadly, this situation where teams so rarely field their full squad really needs to be addressed by Adam Silver. Teams tanked and meh/shitty teams BITD were “careful” with injuries after like Game 72, but now it’s the entire season. The Knicks have played *far* less than half their games against a full complement of the other teams’ top players.
I have no idea what the answer is.
Philly on Christmas is the next elite team we play.
We still meeting up today?
So this matches with the eye test, but the Hartenstein-Sims lineups have an ORB% of…. 44.2%, which would lead the NBA by a country mile if for a whole season. Opponents ORB –> 24.4%. A 20% rebounding differential is near impossible to overcome I would imagine. Those lineups (only 93 possessions so far) have +17.2 net rating, seems good.
Was discussing with Alan the other day- the beauty of being a fan is that one can embrace being totally irrational and reactionary. The tank GIFs were flowing, I wanted to trade Randle for peanuts, wanted Thibs fired — and now my brain is thinking about home court advantage.
The ceiling of this team, as always, is determined by what RJ Barrett is, whether as an actual player for this team or as a trade asset for someone better. If you had 2 Quentin Grimeses instead of 1 Grimes and 1 Barrett, this team would be a lot better (certainly regular season-wise), but you probably need the idealized version of Barrett to make any noise in the playoffs.
Re: the Hartenstein-Sims combo. You have to sort of wonder whether that is a better combo than the Hartenstein-Obi combo. Much as I love Obi, Sims is a much better defender and rebounder and is just as good at finishing around the basket.
It’s hard to think what the next move is, if any. We have 4 players who presumably have some amount of trade value around the league who are not playing at all, whether due to benching or injury – Rose/Fournier/Cam/Obi. But I’m not sure what the midseason upgrade is here, and so maybe it’s just for draft assets, even if 2nd round picks in the case of everyone but Obi (one would hope for at least a protected first for him – not that I really want to trade him).
This graphs speaks to point E raised and not surprisingly, Knicks have least amount of games missed
But how many games should players (AKA RJ Barrett) have missed?
Also, Sacramento is basically off the chart to the left but actually lower
Reading about the Hartenstein Sims combination I realized that Sims is successfully guarding other teams’ fours even though he plays the five on offense. Given that Thibs tries stuff out in practice first, that means Sims gets a lot of practice guarding Randle. I think that could be challenging for both of them.
Yeah yeah yeah..8 in a row.
Nah nah..I’m excited about 8 straight. All in all..we were supposed to win last night. Maybe not by almost 40 though. Because of that, there is one thing I’m more excited about right now. Forgive me in advance for not talking Knicks first today, but…
CARLOS FRICKIN CORREA!! Are you shittin me?? Looks like they are gonna stick him at the hot corner and have an all-star 3B in his prime long-term. Hopefully he can pass his Mets physical *fingers crossed*. I’m sure it will be less strenuous than San Fran’s physical as the Giants were looking to play him at short. My only concern is this either blocks Baty, or makes him trade bait. I think Baty has the tools to be a more consistent hitting Robin Ventura..or close to it. I don’t wanna lose that guy. I wonder if Correa can play 2nd? That would leave the door open for Baty, and move McBeil to left while making Canha the 4th OF that can also DH some and play some 1B. That’s how you maximize that lineup IMO. But, if they’re comfortable with Correa at 3rd long-term health wise(I would be)- they can use Baty in a deal to boost the pitching or trade for a certain bat with the Angel’s that we’ve seem play LF, DH, and pitch. Hmmm…
Back to the Knicks. I hope we can win tonight. Not necessarily for 9 straight. But to roll into Christmas hot and looking to smack up Philly. Plus I am sick of the KD-Kyrie led Nets. It is dope to see both teams winning at the same time though.
I’ve been saying that the roster is well balanced all season, they just haven’t played up to it until now and it drove me crazy. The current rotation could use more scoring on the 2nd unit though. I’m wondering if it might be better to re-insert Cam or Fournier on that 2nd unit and move Obi for a legit 4/5 guy and a 1st. Like..a 4/5 guy that is veteran enough to accept his role behind Sims and Hartenstein but can still play defense and keep defenses honest while he’s out there. But he can’t be a big wing playing the 4. He’s got to be big enough to play both big spits. I dunno..just spitballin here. This starting 5 is really starting to click and I’m not sure I wanna mess with that
What I picked up from that chart is that injuries don’t correlate well with wins except maybe for Orlando. And it should give hope to Orlando fans that next season if they are healthy they could be much better given both health effects and a lot of young players who could improve.
Regarding injuries, and I am knocking on wood everywhere — but —
Injuries happen of course, and often injuries are not predictable. But availability is a skill, and certain players are just really injury prone.
We are a young team that does not sit players for “load management” a la the Clippers. A team like the Lakers, who have AD and 38 year old Lebron is obviously going to miss more games. If you have Gordon Hayward on your team, of course you’re going to lose a lot “man games” – that is a fact that is baked into his contract (or should have been).
Randle, other than his broken leg in his first season, has played 71+ games in every season of his career (pandemic year he played 64 but of course that was a shortened season).
Barrett is an iron man and is totally durable.
Brunson, other than a labral injury a few years ago in DAL, has basically never missed significant games either in college or in the pros.
Mitch – injury prone, has missed games.
Derrick Rose – injury prone, has missed games and is now out of rotation
If you put together a very young and notably durable roster, you’re going to miss fewer games.
Knocking on wood everywhere
I’ve been wondering what will happen when Obi is healthy. I love him, want him to play a ton, but it’s hard to argue against how well the twin towers group is playing right now. And also how effective the 9-man rotation has been because it allows Thibs to mix and match the rotation far more than when he’s doing the hockey line thing.
Other injuries may solve this conundrum for us. But if they don’t, then it’s yet another bad bit of luck for Toppin as he approaches his extension window.
Yeah I don’t really know what trades we should do. Would love to get rid of Fournier’s contract long term and since Cam and Rose are expiring, it would be nice to get something back for them.
But at the same time….Fournier, Cam, Rose…even Obi. All are great insurance pieces if one of our 9 rotation dudes goes down with an injury. And this win streak has me thinking playoff positioning and winning the first round (or more!)
Tonight could be really tough though. But if we can win tonight and on Christmas, then we got like 4 more very winnable games after that until we face The Suns. Don’t want to get too far ahead of myself though.
IQ scoring was great last night. If he’s found his shot again, that gives our bench the scoring punch we need.
Also, I was at that Curry 54 point game 10 years ago too! That was maybe the best live basketball game I’ve ever been to.
The thing is…Hart can hit an outside shot and is a good passer. And SIMS is fast enough to cover 4’s but even though he’s only 6’8″, he’s so strong he can also cover 5’s. So the twin tower thing works even though both are technically centers.
I don’t know what we should do about Obi.
re: Obi’s extension window – I don’t see any need to extend him unless we’re getting a very team-friendly deal. Sucks for him to have to either wait for RFA to get paid or swallow a deal that he doesn’t really want, but it would be crazy to commit any sort of player-friendly contract to him.
I’m trying to take a game by game approach, anyway the two remaining games before Christmas’ showcase are both scary dangerous, like giant slices of cheese in a huge springtrap.
The Raptors are on a 6-games skid, close to full strenght (Trent is questionable, OG’s already back) and we’re on a B2B.
The Bulls are basically at full strenght (Ball has been out all year, so to me it doesn’t count), won yesterday in Miami and could be on the revenge trail after the spanking we gave them at home last week.
I’m bracing for two battles…
Just as we’d rather have Hali, maybe being drafted by the Knicks has not been a good thing for Obi’s basketball career…
Vegas has us as 1 1/2 point favorites, which makes me think they’re trying to attract bets on the Knicks.
Which makes me nervous…..
I actually think Obi is going to have a tough time even making it back into the rotation.
He’s going to be 25 in March and will soon be no longer on his rookie contract. As Hubert (and others) have educated us, at that point, he’s a depreciating asset. He essentially is right now.
Just from a Garden politics perspective, it will be interesting to see what they do with his extension. Your first lottery pick not even really warranting a serious extension wouldn’t be the kind of look I’d want if I was a Garden GM. And he’s a local guy/fan favorite.
maybe being drafted by the Knicks has not been a good thing for Obi’s basketball career…
Maybe but also, I know he’s been stuck behind Randle but he’s also not been very good this year off the bench in the minutes he did have.
I would be curious to see what he looks like now that McBride is the back up PG. We would miss Sims defense BUT Obi in theory provides a scoring punch that our bench needs and the real improvement of the defense comes from Grimes, McBride and IQ on the perimeter.
But also, personally, I just like Sims better than Obi. Love Obi’s personality but feel like he’s rather one dimensional. And if Randle is fully cementing his starter status here for the next few seasons, now would be the time to move Obi to get something in return for him.
Your first lottery pick not even really warranting a serious extension wouldn’t be the kind of look I’d want if I was a Garden GM.
Does this stuff really matter? If the team is winning do people really care about this stuff? Like if we were in a tailspin, then sure, pike on. But we aren’t.
I don’t know if stuff like this really matters to people if everything else is going well.
I don’t know. Like yeah it sucks to whiff on a lottery pick. But we’ve seemingly hit on IQ, Grimes, McBride and Sims.
A lottery pick is still not a sure thing. Ideally you nail your higher picks but if you make up for it with other picks made later, does it really matter in the grand scheme of things especially if the team is trending up?
One thing you can say about this FO – they’re prob less concerned with politics and appearances than we may think — they mea culpa’d 5 out of the 6 big contracts they signed 2 offseasons ago – Kemba/Noel/Burks and Fournier and Rose now out of rotation.
They didn’t blow the entire chest of assets on Donovan Mitchell even though the press probably would’ve celebrated trading for him — jury still out on that but the way Grimes is playing (and that we still have all the assets), that is looking at least reasonable at this point .
The Obi over Halliburton thing is certainly bad (and Devin Vassell looks like a real player too), but the biggest miss (not by this FO) still is Kevin Knox over both Bridges (wonder whether there was any inkling about the domestic violence stuff back pre-draft?) and SGA.
Maybe if we had Mikal Bridges we might not have RJ who was drafted the next year, but Bridges would be so perfect on this team.
Kicking the Raptors ass tonight and then losing to the Bulls on Friday after a Brian Cronin jinx feels very Knicksy, so if that doesn’t happen I’m ready to go all in.
IQ made my night. I hope it sticks.
The lefties got to rest (~30 min playing time each).
Sims had a lovely bounce-back game from Sunday. I and others have mentioned Sims as a Rodman for us. I think he wants that job.
Hart-Sims is fun anytime, and with IQ, Grimes, and Deuce, it’s a lineup I suggested almost as a joke a few games ago — All Passing No Baskets — but they played really well as a unit last night. To me it’s the first time Hart really delivered on the pre-season hype. Maybe that’s b/c RJ is not there. Of course Reggie Miller was joking about him being, well, the Jokic of the East and Jokic-light, but we could do worse.
Also, Hart was wide open for three one time (maybe two), begging for the ball from IQ who shrugged him off. IQ got fouled and the result was fine, but if that unit can really get into a flow, with everyone hitting the open man, we may yet see Hart’s 3 pt potential.
Obi is a puzzle. TV had him on briefly as the first guy into the tunnel (in his sweats) as the guys came off the floor. He was still showboating for the cameras and excited (natch) but I have to believe he’s upset not to be part of this (so far). At least Obi is not benched as Coach’s Decision for the moment. Let’s see what happens. I hope he gets one more run with us before any trade.
Obi deserves an extension. The issue is having made too many other good players.
If Thibs really has some balls he should play Sims at the 3 in a Sims/Obi/Hartenstein lineup. East is big.
Walkerand. . . , Jericho Sims is 6’10” per basketball reference.
“If Thibs really has some balls he should play Sims at the 3 in a Sims/Obi/Hartenstein lineup. East is big.”
Yes! Would love this. Also think to avoid injuries, Thibs should seek rotations that reduce minutes even just a little bit for the Lefties without needing blowouts. I worry seeing Brunson crash land on the floor five times a game.
The combine had him at 6’9″ w/o shoes and 6’10” with shoes.
‘Bockers are now up to 7th in SRS. Defensive rebounding ranking is zooming up the charts, and the starting lineup continues to play brilliantly.
No complaints here! Early in the season the team looked discombobulated and poorly coached, but credit is due to Thibs for making the right tweaks and giving minutes to the guys who deserve them.
“The issue is having made too many other good players.”
When was the last time a sentence like this appeared on KB? Ever? 😉
I love Sims too.
I am definitely starting to reevaluate Rose. He’s found great late value in Grimes and Sims and I still think IQ. I loved the Hart signing. Brunson.
Fournier Rose Kemba werent great. But some good things have happened
“He’s 6’5″, 6’9″ with the Afro.” -Chick Hearn describing Fletch’s time with the LA Lakers
I can meet at Tessa around 430 if that works for you. For everyone else interested in coming, would meeting at Tessa or somewhere else around 645 suffice?
“Fournier Rose Kemba werent great. But some good things have happened”
IMO Fournier and Kemba were the only bad ones.
Rose played well when healthy, mentored our other young players, been a good soldier during the demotion, and could probably still fetch an asset if we traded him.
Taj was similar. I’m pretty sure he helped Mitch develop while here.
Burks is playing well in Detroit and could probably fetch an asset now.
Noel turned out badly because he got hurt. It cost us Burks to move him, but I don’t think it was a bad move at the time. He was key to our playoff team a couple of years ago. If he was still healthy and playing well, you could probably trade him for something also.
Kemba was a suspect gamble from the start and they overpaid and gave 1 year too many to Fournier.
I know everyone would have preferred all young guys (as would I), but they have to be available and want to come. Those vets do help the young players develop and keep their heads on straight and if the contracts are OK they can be traded later. We had a couple of misses.
Yeah I can do 6:45, maybe a little earlier. Sorry I’m gonna miss you z-man.
Yeah honestly the only signings that were really bad were Kemba and Fournier. Rose was justified and so was Noel, who just got hurt. Burks was a great one to have come back. Honestly, part of me wonders what we’d look like if he was part of this bench unit cause we could really go 10 deep and Burks would provide that scoring we need off the bench. Would Detroit want Cam LOL?
Per Brunson’s comments, DRose being here may also have helped to get our shiny new PG.
We should try to hold on to D Rose through the end of the season if we can. He is a perfect 3rd string insurance PG if Brunson or McBride get hurt. I can totally see a situation where he’s called upon to play in a playoff game and pulls a vintage Rose game out of his ass to save our season.
Can’t believe Kemba is rocking a 2.3 bpm through 99 minutes. Thought he was done.
Also Matt Barnes on Wally
It’s a little hard for me to get to the UWS on an evening weeknight so don’t think I’ll be able to make it, happy to have these be a rolling occurrence though.
The Obi question is interesting. Sims has somehow succeeded as a nominal PF, which is mind-blowing. My short answer is it’s been fun to watch the jumbo lineups, which is also mind-blowing, but that eventually we’ll have to play teams who can punish them in obvious ways and the need for someone like Obi will become more apparent.
However the jumbo lineups have earned a legitimate look against those better teams, it might just be the case that they pose conundrum modern NBA teams thought they’d literally never deal with and thus can’t quite crack.
It’s unlikely this front office group will ever fully mothball Obi–a lottery pick investment is different than mere free agent dollars–and based on his play they shouldn’t.
My best guess is they try to showcase him for a trade unless he’d sign an insanely cheap extension. Another first-round pick is more valuable to have than an 18 MPG power forward.
Of course, the 500 pound gorilla in the room is the question of how comfortable we are with Randle going forward. We’re more likely to want to keep Obi if we plan on trading Randle at some point.
I’d definitely want to see more from Randle before trading Obi, probably more than can be reasonably seen before the deadline. The best move might be to punt on this decision until the offseason.
Where are you TNFH?
I can meet elsewhere after meeting up with Z if there’s an easier spot for you (and if it works for EB!)
Also, I was thinking the Obi situation could resolve itself if we were willing to play more Obi/Randle frontcourts. That pairing had mixed results, but the new emphasis on switching instead of constantly playing drop has been a huge plus in terms of Randle’s individual D. And Obi can also switch, despite his stiff hips. I think that if we run a switch heavy defense with that pairing in then the defense of that pairing won’t be nearly as suspect as it was earlier in the season when Randle was constantly losing everyone in drop coverage. Worth a look imo.
Also an alert: we are approaching having three 4 BPM guys on our team if current trends continue (Brunson, Mitch, and Svi 🙂 )
Is there a place that works better for you TNFH?
Or should we look for another night?
I’m flexible with location. I’ll be taking the train into grand central.
I can meet at Tessa around 430 if that works for you. For everyone else interested in coming, would meeting at Tessa or somewhere else around 645 suffice?”
Yes, that works. Look for an old bald guy with GOATee
eb, tnfh et. al., no prob, if the good vibes continue i’m sure we’ll be doing this more often!
Also, don’t look now, but we have three top 50 guys by EPM in Grimes (leading our team in EPM!), Randle, and Brunson.
And three top 40 guys by RPM (Randle, Brunson, Mitch). Maybe “three top 40 guys and a bunch of league average guys or better” can get us farther than we thought…
I’ll see you then. Look for the 30 year old with a mustache, dark hair, and a purple jacket.
I live in Cobble Hill, so downtown Manhattan or obviously Brooklyn is better for me, but no need to change the plans to account for me tonight. It’s looking like it’ll be hard for me to get off work in time to travel somewhere for the game anyway.
I’m always happy to go to the UWS on a weekend, I’m from there after all!
Darn it, Grimes is doubtful for tonight with his ankle sprain. So which player gets a reprieve from the dungeon: Rose, Fournier, or Cam? Or does Thibs pull a Thibs and just start Svi?
Grimes doubtful. Gdammit Thibs!!
“Also, don’t look now, but we have three top 50 guys by EPM in Grimes (leading our team in EPM!), Randle, and Brunson.
And three top 40 guys by RPM (Randle, Brunson, Mitch).”
I was going to flag that we have three guys in the top *30* by BPM (the obvious three).
Both the numbers and the eye-test say it is the solemn duty of every Knicks fan to mount an incredibly annoying campaign for Mitch to be on an all-defense team.
should be quik in to the starting unit and svi off the bench…
I think it might be Deuce starting. Definitely interesting to see who comes off the bench.
Think the only other Knick game I could make is Friday against the Bulls (again) if more people can make it. Happy to meet ya Unbearable either way
Grimes news sucks. He’s one of the best guys to watch on this team right now and that’s saying a lot. Fuck Ty Jerome. Injuring opposing players is no way to react to Virginia losing their top spot in the ACC standings to Miami last night.
We’re pretty reluctant to bring players back from the Thibs Shadow Realm, but it would be a little much even for Thibs to just go to an 8-man rotation on the second night of a back-to-back.
My guess is Fournier starts since that situation seems to be less acrimonious than the Cam situation. I guess we could also start Quickley and bring Rose off the bench.
The spread on the rotation is 8.5 guys, I’m taking the under.
Rose is certainly the one that is politically easiest to release for a game or two, since he has already said that he’s cool with Thibs’ choice, even if he’d obviously prefer to be playing. I would not be shocked if it’s Fournier, but I would not expect it. I would be gobsmacked if it’s Cam.
In other new, the Mets swoop in and sign Carlos Correa to a 12 year deal? To play 3b?!
Wowza. I think 2b makes more sense, but whatever.
I hope Grimes doesn’t turn out to be one of those guys always getting dinged up.
Interesting Alan, I feel the opposite…Cam seems to have no real value while it’s at least theoretically possible that a team would be okay with 1.5 years of Fournier at the deadline. Why risk him getting hurt before then?
Which is why I think that Thibs will ultimately either just play Rose or go with 8. It wouldn’t be that hard to do…just start IQ and jack up his minutes to 30 or so, and increase Deuce’s minutes. Also increase the minutes of Randle and RJ, who got a break last night.
We need Rose as Brunson Insurance. Deuce is not ready to run a playoff level team or consistenctly create for himself and others while reading NBA defensive schemes. At this point he’s a younger version of Burks. If Bruson is out for an extensive period of time. Drose is a perfect backup. We keep him and offer him a one year deal next year too.
I’m going to go contrarian and say Cam gets a ( last) shot because, in theory, he can defend more effectively than DRose or E4.
This should be the Svi revenge game!
The key defensive assignment will be on FVV; you can’t let him go off (although he was 3-15 vs Philly) So you can’t start Rose, maybe spot duty here and there. I think IQ gets the start and as Z-man suggests he logs 30+ minutes.
Big night for Quick, let’s hope he’s up to the task!
I say Cam starts if Grimes sits. Nurse usually starts a 5’11.999999999999″ guy and 4 guys around 6’7″-6’9″
The Sims-iHart grouping is both amusing and impressive, for all kinds of reasons. It’s impressive that Thibs even tried it, although he was somewhat pushed into it by injury — but still, he had a lot of alternatives.
The other impressive part is it totally works. Sims has incredible lateral quickness, the best I’ve seen for his size — he’s like a monstrous Deuce. Playing him as the defensive 4 with the lengthy but fairly immobile Hart at the 5, and then flipping it on offense, just totally works.
It’s mostly amusing because I always find it funny to discover something I never saw coming. And we’re living The East Is Big.
I vote IQ to the starters with Rose as the filler. Although with our newly unpredictable Thibs, who knows.
I know it’s way early, but anyone seeing these radical shifts (including not running starters into the ground — remember when the starters always came back in for the last five minutes, even in blow-outs?) makes Thibs a really good coach?
This win streak is showing one issue I have with BPM and other measurements like this.
Stats like these are partly measuring how good the player is, but there is more involved.
They aren’t measuring the skills of the individual players, if they are being used effectively, if they fit together in a way that maximizes the unit etc…
None of these guys suddenly got intrinsically better over the last 8 games.
Getting healthy and adding 2 effective players to the rotation both made the team better and enhanced the effectiveness of other players. That’s translated into better results, which translated into better BPMs, WS48 etc…
IMO, the idea is to figure out the skills, how they fit, and how to use everyone properly. That’s what will maximize results.
The BPM is an after the fact measurement.
What you want to ask is why is Hart’s BPM lower than last year even though he’s the same player as last year. Is it random nonsense or are we not using him correctly?
Part of the answer is that we are probably underutilizing his passing skills.
Part is probably that we are trying to stretch him out a little bit more to create better spacing.
There are probably other factors that are less obvious.
That could all be OK. The goal is not maximize Hart’s BPM. The goal is to maximize the “team” results. So maybe stretching Hart out is not good for his stats, but it’s helping his teammates more than it’s hurting him.
Maybe not utilizing his passing skills as well as the Clippers is hurting his BPM, but we have better options.
Maybe both those things are wrong and we could improve the team by allowing him to handle the ball more.
That’s what Thibs has to figure out. But the BPM is not telling you what Hart can and cannot do or how good he is. Part of the BPM is also all these other things.
Obviously we want guys with high BPMs, but we want to raise the BPMS of the guys we have.
Unless they think Grimes is going to miss multiple games I wouldn’t be shocked if Thibs just plays eight. And Svi is my pick for ninth man. I just can’t see Thibs opening the dungeon door right now.
It’s a good time to be a Mets fan.
The Mets still have a top 10 farm system too, and will have a bunch of compensation picks in the 2023 draft, they have 7 picks in the first 4 rounds next year. With Correa in the fold they now have great depth on offense and tons of positional versatility. Correa is a GG caliber shortstop, so his glove should really play up as they move him down the defensive spectrum.
This is all very strange. NOW the team is legit better on paper than it was last year, and they’re probably still not done.
Strat I don’t think your post is responding to anything anyone is actually saying. BPM is a measure of production, so of course how a player’s talents are utilized will be a factor. No one on Earth thinks it’s a single immovable number that can tell you exactly how talented at basketball someone is, hence the positive changes to both Brunson and Randle’s BPMs.
People are celebrating the fact that we have multiple players with good BPMs because this indicates both that we have talented players and that their skills are being deployed well.
in old, pre-historic & non-analytical days, we used to say that the team needs ~25 games to gel when incorporating a new ball dominant player like Brunson. Think our learning curve is being slighly overlooked?
Nominally related to the Knicks, and completely insane: https://www.nbcnewyork.com/investigations/face-recognition-tech-gets-girl-scout-mom-booted-from-rockettes-show-due-to-her-employer/4004677/
JK47, the pressure on Buck is immense now. Cohen expects nothing less than the WS.
The starting pitching seems the most suspect. It could be great, but right now there’s very little depth. They’ve got enough of a war chest to try to trade for one in the summer, though.
In the same way that politics is downstream from culture, BPM (and even things like points, assists, rebounds) is downstream from inherent skills and talent.
If another metaphor is necessary to float one’s boat, BPM — to the extent it even measures anything real with any kind of precision — is both nature and nurture.
Not sure about BPM… but Hart’s net rating is through the roof in the last 8 games. Leads entire team with a +28.2 Net rating. Hart had a +58.3 net rating against the Warriors last night.
If MSG ticket scanners can detect posting on KBlogger, then many posters may not see their beloved Knicks at the Garden again.
My brother decided to let me know relatively last minute that he and his girlfriend would like me to have dinner with them this evening, so I’m going to have to opt for that instead of meeting up for the game. Looks like I only get to meet Z-Man today…
But let’s try for something else soon when scheduling works better for everyone!
That is fucking wild and creepy as hell.
So question/debate about this whole twin towers/east is big thing.
Do you think it is possible The Knicks being so big up front is actually now an advantage bc so many teams have tried to adapt the small ball philosophy?
Like small ball warriors death line up was a huge advantage at the time over traditional teams. But now look around the leage and while some teams still have some really imposing bigs, a lot of teams don’t have 2 or 3 of those guys in a rotation bc outside shooting is at a premium and everyone is chasing the small ball dream team.
But sports is often about exploiting mismatches and advantages and bucking trends in order to do something different taht other teams can’t prepare for.
We’ve got Mitch, Hart, Sims and Randle in our rotation. All of them are big/tough dudes who can physically dominate in different ways down in the paint. Could this be exploiting a weakness that is now built into a lot of teams bc teams have gone away from having so many bigs like this?
Am I full of shit?
No worries! Hope we can get a group together at some point.
The Mets have surplus prospects now in Baty and Mauricio, both of whom are blocked by Correa and Lindor respectively. Vientos is another guy that doesn’t seem to have much of a role in the future.
I’d like to see the Mets hang onto Baty, and use him as a full time DH who can occasionally play some 3B or 1B as needed. Mauricio’s stock had been falling but he just had a massive season in winter league, and I’d be looking to move him and Vientos for some pitching.
Turns out there are lots of options when you’re willing to spend $500M to field a team, haven’t signed any QO eligible players, and have also held onto all of your prospects.
Was worth it
Somewhere Leon Rose is sitting in dismay that he can’t trade his 2025 2nd rd pick for Charlotte’s top 50 protected 2nd rd pick in 2043
“Sources: The NBA has taken away the Knicks’ 2025 second-round due to investigation into tampering of Jalen Brunson signing.— Shams Charania (@ShamsCharania)”
Alas, another incineration…
My daughter just texted me the Bing Bong gif.
Life is good right now!
That’s a second round pick I don’t mind incinerating, that’s for sure.
The Cavs basically play two centers at all times and have the #1 net rating in the league. The conventional wisdom probably did shift too far in the direction of small ball.
However Jericho Sims and Isaiah Hartenstein are not Evan Mobley and Jarrett Allen, so the question for us is whether we’re exploiting a legitimate market inefficiency or just beating up on injured teams.
It’s probably a bit of both, but I’m still inclined to think a legitimately good (and healthy) offensive team would be able to run our guys off the floor. I shudder to think about what the Celtics could do against it, for example.
But I’m very glad we’re finally experimenting and who knows, maybe you could steal a few good minutes with it in a playoff series. Even if that’s all it amounts to, it’s well worth finding out.
There’s still a pretty big change between old school bigs and the iHart/Sims lineup. Sims is excellent guarding the perimeter in a way that old school 4s rarely were (and really iHart is pretty good at sliding his feet too). The same applies to Mobley.
It’d be very different if opposing PFs could get open 3s or drive by Sims for easy looks at the basket.
Do you think it is possible The Knicks being so big up front is actually now an advantage bc so many teams have tried to adapt the small ball philosophy?
You get the advantage of the initiative and the other team not being able to, or not caring to, prepare.
I’m fine with being optimistic and all, but there’s no chance there will be that initiative advantage and lack of preparation if the games start to really matter. For an example, compare and contrast the empty building regular season Hawks/Knicks with playoff Hawks/Knicks.
The interesting question is whether Thibs is intentionally and consciously garnering this Moneyball advantage. He’s a big preparer and schemer, seemingly, so it stands to reason that he would know what makes preparation/scheming tougher and/or not worth the effort. I think a lot of us are coming around to the answer to that being, “Yes.”
I don’t see a Twin Towers of Jericho Sims and Isaiah Hartenstein being effective in games that matter, no. I doubt it will even be a thing when/if the Knicks are in the playoffs.
Thibs is doing his thing, duct taping and freakballing and elbow greasing his way to wins at/near the top of expected range. He’s very good at that. I’d like him to be be better at just saying, “I want to get better players than the other teams and put those better players out on the floor just win that way.” That’s the tried and true path to association success. Part of me thinks part of him thinks that’s somehow … unsporting.
“The Cavs basically play two centers at all times and have the #1 net rating in the league. The conventional wisdom probably did shift too far in the direction of small ball.”
One of the tenets of small ball is taking advantage of bigs who can’t defend the perimeter. A super-mobile “big” like Hakeem would probably destroyed that line of attack. Allen and Mobley are both pretty mobile on the defensive perimeter.
That’s what gives me confidence with Sims and Hart…more so Sims. He is very good at moving his feet and his height serves him well out there. But I agree that they are more likely to run into a lineup that they can’t keep up with than Mobley and Allen. They’re just not as good.
But damn I like watching Sims out there.
The real concern with the Sims/Hartenstein lineup is that they can’t score except on putbacks. If teams boxout properly or figure out how to neutralize that another way, then the 2nd unit basically won’t score without IQ going nuclear or iHart hitting more 3s.
If teams boxout properly or figure out how to neutralize that another way, then the 2nd unit basically won’t score without IQ going nuclear or iHart hitting more 3s.
If the Hawks figured out Empty Building Julius, I’m pretty sure teams can figure out the “Twin Towers” of Sims and Hart.
It’s not about preventing injury. It’s about avoiding a repeat of the Kemba mess from last year. It is hard to imagine any circumstance in which Cam is still on this team after the trade deadline. They tried, they failed, etc. And even if he’s pissed right now about getting dungeoned, it is hard to argue otherwise, because the team started winning almost immediately after he was benched. Put him back in the rotation for a night or two, and he puts up some middling but largely empty stats, and suddenly he and his management can resume agitating for playing time, etc. There’s no benefit to it, unless you remain a believer that there is a brilliant basketball player inside of Cam Reddish just waiting to burst out.
Rose won’t complain if he’s yo-yo’ed in and out of the rotation. Fournier probably won’t, either, though I do wonder if his good soldier routine would continue if he has a few hot shooting nights while Grimes is out.
“Also, don’t look now, but we have three top 50 guys by EPM in Grimes (leading our team in EPM!), Randle, and Brunson.
Mitch is 2 spots below Grimes
If the Hawks figured out Empty Building Julius
Do you ever get tired of repeating this over and over again?
Little known fact. Lebron has lost in the first round. So did Jordan! So did Kobe! So did Dirk!
I think the concept of the data point of the Hawks series debacle as having much relevance to this year is minimal…being that we have Brunson and not Payton…that change alone would have likely made a big difference in just overall game mgmt and impact on other’s (sic Randle) roles and responsibilities as we are now starting to see….
The one item that is still relevant is Thibs being able to adjust on the fly…
my fave Bing Bong gif: https://media.tenor.com/j10g493m7lcAAAAd/disney-pixar.gif
Why is anyone discussing the Atlanta series?
What could be more irrelevant?
That year the offense was almost entirely Randle, especially when Payton went into a coma.
Atlanta doubled him, walled him off, took him out of the game, end of story. It was smart strategy given our lack of talent.
Now we have Brunson both running the offense and as an efficient scoring option. That changed everything. We are also winning in part because we’ve added Grimes as a starter and RJ has been playing better during this stretch.
I have a trade idea.
RJ Barrett for OG Anunoby as the core of the trade.
That sends RJ back to Canada (where he might also be happy) and gives us a player that’s better on both sides, taller, and still young to play SF . We’d probably have to attach a pick or two and filler, but that makes sense and supposedly Toronto is open to making changes.
Less Atlanta series talk and more Atlanta series talk instead. Where you at geo?
Wasn’t there a report yesterday about TOR’s asking price being something like Donovan Mitchell’s? I believe it was met with derision but the NBA trade market is insane anymore. You can’t even get a MLE player without attaching a 1st or multiple swaps.
“Wasn’t there a report yesterday about TOR’s asking price being something like Donovan Mitchell’s? I believe it was met with derision but the NBA trade market is insane anymore. You can’t even get a MLE player without attaching a 1st or multiple swaps.”
I read that, but I don’t believe the cost will be as high as Mitchell. Maybe I’m wrong. He’s a very good two way player on the improve. We’d have to give up a chunk of our treasure trove plus RJ to get him, but he’s the exact player I’d love RJ to become. It would be an immediate upgrade on both sides but we’d still be young.
Why is anyone discussing the Atlanta series?
Because it shows how much more preparation teams put into important games and therefore how easy it will likely be to eliminate these Knick “Moneyball” advantages.