Knicks Morning News (2016.02.17)

  • [ESPN.com – New York Knicks] Knicks Daily Links: Wednesday (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:46:21 EST)

    Knicks Daily Links: Wednesday

  • [New York Daily News] Jalen Rose: Spend time with your Valentine or Fisher will (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:56:32 GMT)

    Hide your Valentine when Derek Fisher comes around — at least, according to Jalen Rose.

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks still on guard, but Jennings off list after trade (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:49:43 GMT)

    Phil Jackson can cross Brandon Jennings off his list of available point guards after he was traded to Orlando in a multi-player deal.

  • [New York Times] Israel’s First NBA Player Omri Casspi Having Breakout Season (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 07:48:37 GMT)

    When Omri Casspi was 13, his family took him on a Bar Mitzvah trip to the United States, the highlight of which was a visit to New York City where the Israeli youngster stood in front of Madison Square Garden and boldly vowed he would one day play there.

  • [New York Times] Sports Briefing | Pro Basketball: Sue Bird to Remain in Seattle (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:38:14 GMT)

    Bird, a point guard, signed a multiyear deal that should allow her to eventually retire with the Storm, with whom she has spent her entire career.

  • [New York Times] Blake Griffin Apologizes for Punching Clippers Staff Member (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:30:34 GMT)

    Blake Griffin apologized Tuesday for punching a Los Angeles Clippers staff member last month, saying he wishes he could take back the incident that left him with a broken right hand and the employee with facial injuries.

  • [New York Times] League to Crack Down on ‘Piggyback’ Foul (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:12:32 GMT)

    The NBA is cracking down on ‘piggyback’ intentional fouls, instructing referees to potentially consider them for flagrant violations. In a memo sent by Vice President of Basketball Operations Kiki Vandeweghe and Executive Vice President of Referee Operations Mike Bantom on Tuesday, referees were urged to take a closer look at the fouls.

  • [New York Times] Rivers Pours Water on Reports Claiming Griffin to Jump Ship (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 05:03:28 GMT)

    Los Angeles Clippers coach Doc Rivers has quashed the persistent rumors surrounding Blake Griffin’s future by insisting that the injured power forward was definitely staying with the Western Conference team on Tuesday.

  • [New York Times] N.B.A. Roundup: Pistons Add to Youthful Roster, Acquiring Tobias Harris From Magic (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 03:35:05 GMT)

    Harris gives Detroit another athletic young player, and he will be under team control for a while. Orlando acquired Brandon Jennings and Ersan Ilyasova.

  • [New York Times] Grizzlies Send Courtney Lee to Charlotte in 3-Team Deal (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 01:39:48 GMT)

    The Charlotte Hornets acquired veteran swingman Courtney Lee from the Grizzlies in a three-team trade that will help bolster the team’s perimeter shooting and defense after losing Michael Kidd-Gilchrist for the season to a shoulder injury.

  • [New York Times] AP Source: Chris Bosh Resumes Taking Blood Thinners (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 00:25:04 GMT)

    Chris Bosh is back on blood thinners to treat a clot that formed in his leg, the second straight year the Miami Heat forward has dealt with such a situation over the All-Star break.

  • [New York Post] Knicks’ trade deadline options: NBA execs reveal brutal truth (Wed, 17 Feb 2016 00:27:38 -0500)

    The NBA trading deadline is Thursday at 3 p.m. and Knicks fans await a move to reverse the recent fortunes that just before the All-Star break headed farther south than Key West. If pervading thoughts from several executives around the league prevail, fans should simply anticipate the showdown between Kristaps Porzingis and Karl-Anthony Towns in…

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    Mike Kurylo is the founder and editor of KnickerBlogger.net. His book on the 2012 Knicks, "We’ll Always Have Linsanity," is on sale now. Follow him on twitter (@KnickerBlogger).

    91 thoughts to “Knicks Morning News (2016.02.17)”

    1. “Expiring contracts — such as Kyle O’Quinn’s — are not as desirable as in the past because of the money coming from the new TV deal. And if the Knicks are going on a hunt for a coach at season’s end, should they keep players they have for the new guy to judge?”

      Who the hell writes these articles? Can’t they be at least bothered to take a look at the actual contract situation of the players? Kyle O’Quinn’s contract expiring?

    2. I just read something that I never realized before — the Warriors drafted Draymond Green with a Nets pick that they acquired in some trade involving Dan Gadzuric. Until just now, I though that the Lillard for Gerald Wallace trade was bad, but Green for Gadzuric was undoubtedly worse.

    3. That Tobias Harris trade is really interesting. Orlando knows him better than anyone, and it’s not like Hennigan is a dumb guy — yet they cut bait on him for 1 guy that will almost certainly go elsewhere this offseason (Jennings) and another guy who is just not that great (Ilyasova). Will be interesting to see what SVG can do with Harris. I guess either way it’s not like he’s a bad player so the downside for DET is relatively small given his semi-reasonable contract in this new cap world.

    4. boring…

      Yeah, it’s not just player movement in free agency that is restrictive by the cba. Shorter contracts and rising cap space make trades a lot less enticing for most teams.

      Increasingly, the draft is becoming the only Way to build a contending team. (Well, it’s actually always been this way, but teams are now being forced to accept it)

    5. Increasingly, the draft is becoming the only Way to build a contending team.

      I understand your point, but we’re only a season and a half removed from Miami going to 4 straight finals. There are always going to be superstars that don’t want to stick around on the teams that drafted them, so free agency will continue to be important. But yeah, draft picks are definitely important and should not be traded for Bargnanis.

    6. I don’t think building through the draft is the only way to build a winner. It’s about exploiting market inefficiencies along the way and handing out the right contracts. I think it’s a combination of drafting/developing your 1 and 2 options, signing the right free agents, and making the right trades. Curry, Green, Barnes, and Thompson were the guys GSW drafted, but they don’t win a title without Iguodala and Bogut. It was also lucky for the Warriors that Green was a 2nd round pick. I think in the NBA (and any sport), the order of importance on building a winner is:

      1) The Draft
      2) Free Agency
      3) Trades

      If we were to build a contender, that would be the only way to go from here I think. Build around Porzingis in free agency and make the right trades to supplement that group. Unfortunately for the Knicks, the trade that makes the most basketball sense for all parties involved is being blocked by a No Trade Clause.

    7. Building a contender through trades is a tough way to go, since you have to give up value to get value. It really comes down to either sacrificing current success for future assets or sacrificing future assets to immediately improve. And then there are those times when a team trades all their best players AND future draft picks for Carmelo Anthony. Somehow that hasn’t worked out well…

    8. What are the cases where trades/free agency really won a team championships? Of recent examples, I can only think of the Shaq trade to the Heat, the Lebron acquisition by Miami, and the 2011 Mavs.

      I tend to think the only way to win is to get lucky in the draft and with injuries. Or have prime Lebron. Of course there are edge cases like the Shaq-Wade Heat and the Dirk-Chandler Mavs, but those are flashes in the pan compared to the continued success of Lebron-led teams and now Golden State.

    9. That Tobias Harris trade is really interesting. Orlando knows him better than anyone, and it’s not like Hennigan is a dumb guy — yet they cut bait on him for 1 guy that will almost certainly go elsewhere this offseason (Jennings) and another guy who is just not that great (Ilyasova). Will be interesting to see what SVG can do with Harris. I guess either way it’s not like he’s a bad player so the downside for DET is relatively small given his semi-reasonable contract in this new cap world.

      Detroit definitely did it for the cap certainty. Orlando, though, I think has just found that they like other players on their roster more than their previous guys. For instance, they like Austin Gordon more than Harris and they like Elfrid Payton and Evan Fournier more than Victor Oladipo, and are dealing the lesser guys to avoid clogging up their roster with contracts to guys they don’t plan on playing as much. It’s the same reason they’re shopping Channing Frye, who has fallen out of the rotation. What Orlando thinks they’re going to get with their new cap room is beyond me, though.

    10. @8

      Re: Melo
      Not necessarily. You have to consider who you’re getting back.

      Is there a player that you can trade Melo for to rebuild or contend right away? The answers are both “doubtful”. Any team you trade Melo to, at this point, will offer you poor draft pick selection. Let’s say you trade Melo for Blake Griffin. The Knicks are still stuck without their own pick, with a bad record.

      So the surefire way is to never trade picks for players you’re putting extra expectations on, i.e. expecting Bargnani to be an 18/8 guy when he has barely been that most of his career, despite having the potential to be that.

      In my opinion, trading Melo makes little sense at the moment for the Knicks. The only true course of actions that make sense are:
      1. Hoping there’s a sucker born every minute and landing a Rubio/Teague.
      2. Hoping Jackson has the clout this summer to attract a top tier free agent.

      The Bargnani trade essentially limited the Knicks to these two courses of action — not the no trade clause.

    11. And then there are those times when a team trades all their best players AND future draft picks for Carmelo Anthony. Somehow that hasn’t worked out well…

      I thought Amare was the best player on that team? Also the Billups amnesty and barnani trade were worse for the Knicks than giving up chandler , Gallo and moszgov.

    12. sorry, was just thinking –

      WHY THE HELL DID THEY NOT PROTECT THE DRAFT PICK IN THE BARGNANI TRADE?

      Thanks-

    13. What are the cases where trades/free agency really won a team championships? Of recent examples, I can only think of the Shaq trade to the Heat, the Lebron acquisition by Miami, and the 2011 Mavs.

      I tend to think the only way to win is to get lucky in the draft and with injuries. Or have prime Lebron. Of course there are edge cases like the Shaq-Wade Heat and the Dirk-Chandler Mavs, but those are flashes in the pan compared to the continued success of Lebron-led teams and now Golden State.

      You make it sound like winning is impossible. I presume you mean until Lebron is past his prime?
      As for trades as Knicks fans we should all know a trade that made a championship. Alas, that was 40 years ago. More recently NJ trading Marbury for Kidd made them an Eastern Conference powerhouse for 3-5 seasons. The recent Celtics were Paul Pierce and whatever you want to call the manner of acquisition of Ray Allen and KG.
      I do agree with Kevin that our best piece to trade has a no trade clause and has not/will not have played > 65ish games in several seasons and has chronic knee issues.

    14. I thought Amare was the best player on that team?

      OK, I was exaggerating a little. But Amare had such an awful contract for a guy who’s knees could crumble at anytime, that he had absolutely zero trade value, anyways. I do agree that the Bargs trade was worse, but that doesn’t mean the Melo trade was good.

      In my opinion, trading Melo makes little sense at the moment for the Knicks

      If Phil thinks that he can make the team a real competitor for a championship through free agency this offseason, then yeah, you keep Melo. But if we are still 2 seasons away? Well, that makes the window real small for a championship caliber team if you are relying on a major contribution from Melo. It’s obvious Phil thinks this team is better than it is performing right now, so he probably does think that they can be a real competitor next season, so I’m sure Melo stays.

    15. Because bad GMs exist in the NBA. It is why we are also hopeful that we can snag a player by tomorrow, at 3 PM.

      All in all, the Knicks aren’t as far away when you look at the core. We’re missing a PG and a solid shooter. As much as people talk about lack of assets, quality PGs are a robust commodity. Shooting is becoming more prevalent too as we move away from the Jordan era.

      Most of us know the key to this team is how fast Porzingis can develop. If KP is putting up 20/8 in the second season pretty efficiently, we’ll become an attractive destination. If we can find a PG this summer to jumpstart that, then we’re really talking. For once, we’d be filling in the cracks rather than replacing holes.

    16. I was listening to the podcast with Howard Beck recommended in a recent post, and they started discussing mid first round draft picks that turned out well. The thing is all the players they mentioned were drafted in something like 2011 or earlier. That suggests that mid first round players who turn out well usually don’t seem that great until 4 or more years after they are drafted. This is the crux of the problem for rebuilding through the draft. No GM hired to upgrade a lousy team wants to wait that long for the team to be good so they almost all take shortcuts. Hinkie is one exception — he’s more patient with losing than almost anyone else. This is an alternative to the ways suggested in post 12, but it also takes the longest time.

      Phil actually seems to be trying to build with this sort of time frame in mind but also not be terrible in the short term by signing free agents to short, reasonable value contracts and having them hold the fort while the young guys on the team get better. Of course, the free agents who can be had for short reasonable contracts aren’t the best free agents out there, so the team is struggling. I don’t know if this will work, but it makes for a more entertaining team than the Hinkie approach.

    17. WHY THE HELL DID THEY NOT PROTECT THE DRAFT PICK IN THE BARGNANI TRADE?

      Protect Denver’s pick?

    18. Amare probably had the worst contract of the decade.

      The only thing positive about it was that he didn’t cost anything but cap space.

      No picks, no assets, nothing.

      He came here for 100 million and left with it.

    19. You can win championships through trades and free agency if you manage to snag a true mega-star in a trade or as a free agent, like a Shaq-LeBron-Durant level mega-star. The surefire way to NOT win a championship is to try to win through trades and free agency, and then build your team around guys who are NOT mega-star players such as Amar’e Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony and Stephon Marbury.

      That’s where the Knicks constantly fail. Hey, we didn’t get LeBron James, but we did get an extremely pale imitation at the same salary cap number! Maybe this will work out! And unfortunately the Knicks are still following this same failed formula, pretending that Decline Phase Carmelo Anthony is a franchise cornerstone type player.

    20. What are the cases where trades/free agency really won a team championships? Of recent examples, I can only think of the Shaq trade to the Heat, the Lebron acquisition by Miami, and the 2011 Mavs.

      ’08 Celts (everyone) trade
      ’09 Lakers (Gasol, Odom) trade
      ’10 Lakers (Gasol, Odom) trade
      ’11 Mavs (Chandler) FA
      ’12 Heat (everyone) FA
      ’13 Heat (everyone) FA
      ’14 Spurs — organic
      ’15 Warriors — organic

      Pretty much all of the champs are made through lopsided trades and strong FA signings. The Warriors and Spurs are outliers for sure.

    21. Oladipo would be such a great trade. Why aren’t we trying to get in on that deal? Oladipo and Porzingis would be prime time basketball.

      @12 you make good points. There really isn’t a trade out there that makes sense. Melo to Toronto for our pick, Patterson and Carroll would probably be the best we can do if we could send him anywhere, or probably a deal this summer with the Lakers for their post-Kobe ambitions. Otherwise, the market for him doesn’t really inspire much. That 3 team deal where we get Brooklyn’s pick, Melo goes to Cleveland, and Boston gets Love would also make some sense for us, but I’d play hardball and try to get Isaiah Thomas or Kyrie Irving back. What a heist that would be; sending Melo and grabbing Irving/Thomas AND Brooklyn’s lottery pick? Amazing. It would never ever happen, but it would still be awesome.

    22. If we trade Melo, we will NOT attract any FAs this year unless Porzingis finishes like an MVP caliber player. That means we must be committed to a long term, 3-5 year rebuild. I think Jackson wouldn’t mind this. For us fans, it’s years of watching developmental basketball. It could be very fun or very brutal depending on how the pick plays.

      If we keep Melo, we try and build through FA. I think Jackson prefers this route simply because he knows Melo by himself isn’t very attractive (see: this past summer) but Melo with Porzingis is very attractive. His guts to take KP can be combined with “see, that’s why I have 11 rings.”

      Interest in a team isn’t linear. If you can show leader + distributor Melo and Stud big man that’s got your back on defense, I think we’ll be successful finding the right FAs (not the settle for Amare kind). It can begin to snowball, the key initiator being KP.

    23. If we trade Melo, we will NOT attract any FAs this year

      With Melo, who do we attract? Every team in the league is going to have cap room this offseason. Why would any highly sought after free agent pick the Knicks, coming off their third straight losing season, over a contender? You think Melo has that kind of pull? He didn’t this past offseason. It’s going to be really tough to find value this coming free agency with every team having money to spend.

    24. That means we must be committed to a long term, 3-5 year rebuild.

      I’d love a long term, 3-5 year rebuild at this point (although hopefully closer to 3 than 5 ;)).

      As for Melo’s trade value, if they could actually get Blake Griffin for him, they could get good picks for him, because they could get good picks for Blake Griffin (the Nuggets, for instance, would love to get Griffin). But, of course, Melo is never leaving. That’s very important to always repeat to ourselves. He’s never leaving. He’s never leaving. He’s never leaving. He’s never leaving.

    25. @18 – You said:
      “That suggests that mid first round players who turn out well usually don’t seem that great until 4 or more years after they are drafted. This is the crux of the problem for rebuilding through the draft.”

      It’s what I’ve been saying about Grant. We need to be patient with him. Not only does he have to adjust to the NBA, he had to learn to play point in the triangle.

      As for trades, I can’t see any being made and I disagree with anyone that’s suggesting we trade Melo.

      @26 – You said “With Melo, who do we attract?”
      Last year it was Melo alone. Next year it’ll be Melo+KP. The big difference is having the second draw. It takes 3 stars to tango in the NBA.

    26. Protect Denver’s pick?

      yeah the Nuggets will probably finish with a worse or similar record so the swap didnt even matter.

    27. Last year it was Melo alone. Next year it’ll be Melo+KP. The big difference is having the second draw. It takes 3 stars to tango in the NBA.

      I guess. It’d help a lot if we finished the season strong and squeaked into the playoffs, which is probably one of the main reasons Phil did ditch Fisher. It seems like that is what Phil is banking on, so we’ll see how it turns out. I’m not optimistic, but I guess there is still time to trade Melo in the offseason if we strike out in free agency. I’ll keep my fingers crossed that he doesn’t suffer any major injuries…

    28. Yes, I believe KP and Melo combined have that kind of pull.

      Take Durant. If you look at West teams, the salaries are either near the cap or at the cap that can realistically contend. If he goes to GSW, he’d be labeled a front runner. Doesn’t mean he cares, but he might.

      You can sell Durant on ECF/Finals. In the west, the path still leads through GSW and SAS.

      The teams you are talking about having cap room aren’t any more of locks than the Knicks. If injury free, a core of Melo, Durant, and KP is pretty much ECF guaranteed. There’s no other teams in the east you can say is a finals guarantee with him. So yes, I think you sell him on MSG, Melo + KP, and Jackson’s history of winning.

    29. 08 Celts (everyone) trade
      ’12 Heat (everyone) FA
      ’13 Heat (everyone) FA

      Everyone? Even Paul Pierce and Rajon Rondo in Boston? Even Dwayne Wade in Miami?

      All the teams on the list you provided had hall of fame players that they drafted: Pierce, Wade, Dirk, Kobe, Duncan, Parker, Manu, Curry. Only one championship team in the modern era of NBA basketball didn’t have a home grown hall of famer as a cornerstone.

    30. @32, I don’t think he’d like that. When is the last time a superstar besides Lebron bailed to join another?

      If you sit down and listen to these players talk, many have said “I want you to come join me.” That is an ego thing, and I think to be great, you need to have that. I think it’s easier to sell a great player on having the right pieces to beat the best rather than joining the best.

    31. Durant has to have his head examined if he DOESN’T sign with GS!

      The Bay Area is one of the best places on earth to live and they are an all time, fun team.

    32. That would be Adam Silver’s biggest nightmare. He already prefaced it with comments about not modeling for the TV money.

    33. @31 – I would much rather have Westbrook over Durant if we still have Melo. Ideally, we sign both. Realistically, we sign someone like Mario Chalmers or Rajon Rondo and we all put guns to our heads.

    34. Knicks lack the pieces for a big trade for anyone.
      They’re in perfect position to get their pockets picked, tho.

      Not going to happen; we’ll have to finish with the horses we started with, I think.

    35. I’d try to sell it. KP’s on a reasonable contract. Melo should still be reasonable by 2017. Durant and Westbrook would make us locks for the finals.

      This is the part where Jackson puts together a presentation and plan and shows it to Durant. We’ve heard of the Billionaire Athlete crap in the past. We can actually sell those two on being finals contenders for the life of their contracts. I mean, they either buy it or they don’t, but we have the cap, the young stud, the vet star. We have a good story if they want to buy it.

    36. Melo should still be reasonable by 2017

      what does the word “still” mean in this sentence

      The Bay Area is one of the best places on earth to live

      Yeah, but I don’t know how his family’s going to deal with moving into a 600 sq. ft. 2BR. He’d have to move some money around to make sure his shower doesn’t have a direct line of sight to his oven.

    37. I don’t know how his family’s going to deal with moving into a 600 sq. ft. 2BR.

      My son lives in something like that in Manhattan. It looks like a studio apartment they converted into a 2-BR. It’s more of a broom closet now ;)
      I think Melo can affort an upgrade.

    38. I think in the NBA (and any sport), the order of importance on building a winner is:

      1) The Draft
      2) Free Agency
      3) Trades

      I think it is

      1) the draft
      2) trades
      3) steroids
      4) bribing the refs
      5) free agency

      More often than not, free agency ties teams into expensive contracts for aging players. Sure, the Heat landed two free agents in 2010 and proceeded to dominate the East, but they also had a franchise player that they drafted themselves already on the roster.

      Trades can be useful, but only if you have a diversity of accumulated assets, like Boston had back in 2007. (That Celtic team was built through the draft: those young players were just cashed in for super vets– something that Ainge couldn’t have done if he hadn’t been committed to a rebuild through the draft for years).

      Look at the top free agents over the past decade that actually changed teams: outside of LeBron and Bosh (and possibly Aldridge), most of them quickly became albatrosses for their new teams. Larry Hughes was the top FA to move teams in 2005; Ben Wallace in 2006; Rashard Lewis in 2007; 2008 had Elton Brand, Barron Davis, and Gilbert Arenas as the top 3– all of them complete disasters; Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueva in 2009; Amar’e in 2010; Dwight Howard (okay) and Tyreke Evans (terrible) in 2013; Lance Stevenson in 2014. These aren’t just the free agents that didn’t work out so well. These were the TOP free agents available that were convinced to switch teams.

      Free agency is not a viable option to building a winning team. It is a finger in the damn for most teams, with a few rare exceptions.

    39. To me, that means he’s still productive. Something like 18/6/5 on his 43-45% shooting. In other words, a good second or third option.

    40. Can you protect a pick where you’ve already given away the pick swap rights? I know that you can’t add protection to a pick you’ve acquired if you’re trading it away (i.e., Boston can’t send out the Brooklyn pick and say “we keep it if it’s top 3”), so I wonder if the CBA gave us the ability to put any protection on that 2016 pick given that we already had the swap set up with Denver from the Melo trade.

      As always, though, horrible trade. Not Eddy Curry-level, but horrible.

    41. ‘re: The Tobias trade

      I think it had a lot to do with Skiles and Harris relationship. Skiles was also behind the trade that sent Harris to Orlando. He has also coached Ily and Jennings.

      It seems like the first two trades were more about the relationship the coaches had with the players; skiles- Harris/Jennings/Ilyasova and Clifford-Lee

    42. The way to build a championship contender is thru ALL 3 options. You need to draft well, make a good trade or 2 and sign a good FA or 2. Its not just by the draft, not just thru free agency or just by trades. You need all 3 and its not just in the NBA, its in the MLB and NFL too.

    43. Sure, the Heat landed two free agents in 2010 and proceeded to dominate the East, but they also had a franchise player that they drafted themselves already on the roster.

      Most importantly, the Heat did not just get “a free agent.” They got LeBron James, who might be the greatest all-around player of the modern era. When you land a FA that is considered on the same tier as Jordan, Magic and Bird, you didn’t luck out in free agency. You got the best player of all-time for $16M a year.

    44. Can you protect a pick where you’ve already given away the pick swap rights? I know that you can’t add protection to a pick you’ve acquired if you’re trading it away (i.e., Boston can’t send out the Brooklyn pick and say “we keep it if it’s top 3?), so I wonder if the CBA gave us the ability to put any protection on that 2016 pick given that we already had the swap set up with Denver from the Melo trade.

      Yeah, you can add protections to a pick swap. You know, like “we agree to swap the worse of two draft picks unless the worse pick is also in the lottery, in which case you get the pick outright the following year or the pick becomes two second rounders or whatever.” That was one of the brutal things, in the sense that you have to imagine the Raptors wouldn’t have balked at any protections, as they were just trying to dump Bargs outright. And yet they somehow got what looks to be a freakin’ lottery pick out of the deal. Ugh.

    45. Stein reports Houston aggressively looking to move Lawson. I wonder if we can get him if it comes down to the wire.

    46. I’d do Afflalo + Calderon for Lawson

      I guess I would, too, but I don’t like the idea of putting too many eggs in the 2016 free agent basket. This is not a “one good offseason away” team.

    47. I agree, the finals mvp was acquired through a traded

      That’s a bit misleading, though, isn’t it? If you go by sign and trades after a player has committed to signing with the other team regardless, then Chris Bosh and Lebron were also acquired by trade.

    48. To be honest, any deal we can concoct is only going to make us marginally better. At best this team if it get’s it’s shit together is fighting for a 8th seed in the East even with a minor improvement to rotation guys. I would rather sit tight and just play with the hand we’ve got. Let’s just give some burn to Gallo, Grant and KP (maybe O’Quinn as well to improve his stocks by the off season) and see where that takes us. If the FO can be patient over the trade deadline, I would be more impressed with that than any roster shakeup. A salary dump might be nice, but from what Chris Herring is reporting on Twitter, we aint doing much. That said, it can always change in the last 24hrs. I am looking forward to seeing some teams make FOMO deals and hope that we aren’t one of them.

    49. There’s nothing the Knicks can do to jeopardize their off-season or their on-court performance this season. They don’t have enough assets to take on a star and they likely won’t take on any assets that extend beyond this year at even a middle of the road salary.

      So trades make sense. You’ve kicked your own tires for half a season, kick someone else’s. Maybe you can unveil a gem of Galloway’s caliber which is always valuable both on court and in future deals.

      Also could be done through D-League. They can really use Jimmer’s skills though it won’t do anything for their perimeter D.

      I’d try to package Seraphin and Vujacic for a late 2nd rounder just so Rambis can’t play them.

    50. I have a feeling Phil likes Afflalo, I believe there was an article out not to long ago mentioning how he was a core piece. Which seems weird to me because Phil is supposed to be in love with ball movement which is something AA doesn’t do.

      but I don’t like the idea of putting too many eggs in the 2016 free agent basket.

      There are not too many good eggs to begin with that are not restricted. The knicks will probably be left trying to max out Harrison Barnes. He already has a ring and might have 2, why not go for the money and try to create a name for yourself. He could easily play the two.

      Orlando has space to resign Fournier and Portland has enough space to keep Crabbe. So, its not that many options. I do hope they can steal Harkless away from Portland though. He’s a UFA that is young and seems to have room to grow.

    51. I’d do Afflalo + Calderon for Lawson

      No way! You’d have to pay me to take Lawson. I suspect he is an alcoholic, and alcoholism is really difficult to treat and one of the hardest addictions to treat. Even if I am wrong (and I hope I am), his last two employers have both been desperate to get rid of him.

    52. From what I’m reading, Phil is only married to two players on the Knicks, and AA is not one of them.

      I don’t think there’d be any discussion, really, on Afflalo’s game if he can find consistency. He’s averaging 14 a game, but he’s achieving (if you can call it that) through games single digit scoring up through 35+ point scoring. It’s baffling how, as suddenly as he finds himself in the offense, he finds himself out of it.

      If he can find that consistency, he’d be a valuable piece on this team. He probably won’t though as this was his game in Portland as well.

    53. There are not too many good eggs to begin with that are not restricted. The knicks will probably be left trying to max out Harrison Barnes. He already has a ring and might have 2, why not go for the money and try to create a name for yourself. He could easily play the two.

      Yeah, that’s why I’d prefer they just punt their cap space to the next offseason (or use it on something other than free agents).

    54. No way! You’d have to pay me to take Lawson. I suspect he is an alcoholic, and alcoholism is really difficult to treat and one of the hardest addictions to treat. Even if I am wrong (and I hope I am), his last two employers have both been desperate to get rid of him.

      The trade would just be about dumping Calderon’s salary for next season. No reason to keep him going forward. Lawson is expiring after this season. So you get to see if Lawson has anything left and then you can just let him go.

    55. Honestly, I am just waiting to see tweets that the Knicks traded so and so and everyone gets exited that Phil pulled off a great deal, only to have Woj. tweet the 1st pick/good player will go to a 3rd team involve. The knicks will receive a protected 2nd rd pick in 2018.

    56. By the way, one area where Melo has been slipping a little bit recently is talking about his lack of help. He has always been very good about not talking about that (instead letting his friends do it anonymously on his behalf) because he has to know that he’s pretty much responsible for him not having star teammates, so I was always impressed that he didn’t bitch about it in public. During the All Star Break, though, he still toed the line barely, but he was getting close to it.

    57. (or use it on something other than free agents).

      Do you mean be the third team in trades that take on Salary but receive minor compensation?

      I guess that’s an option. If someone does max Harrison Barnes they may decide to dump Livingston. How much of a hit would it be to GSW if Barnes got the max?

    58. They have his bird rights, so they can go over the cap to sign. Last I checked, they had around $17M in cap space. He (probably) won’t get the max, and likely takes a discount to stick around.

    59. Lawson is more appealing than Calderon. teams really do not want that extra year even teams with space.

    60. The trade would just be about dumping Calderon’s salary for next season. No reason to keep him going forward. Lawson is expiring after this season. So you get to see if Lawson has anything left and then you can just let him go.

      The proposed trade was Afflalo and Calderon, that’s definite value we’d be giving the rockets. If it’s just Calderon, the salaries don’t match at all and there’s no way to make it work that I can see. Even if we could just lose Calderon, I still would hesitate.

    61. That’s easy enough to fix to make salaries work.

      Throw in a Seraphin.

      Issue is Rockets think they can get more value.

    62. They have his bird rights, so they can go over the cap to sign. Last I checked, they had around $17M in cap space. He (probably) won’t get the max, and likely takes a discount to stick around.

      You sure, I may have rushed it in my head buy they would have around $6m-$8m in space if they hold on to Livingston too,nShaun is partially guaranteed so his hold only at $3m. I am pretty sure they want to hold on to Ezeli and he has a $5m cap hold. Barnes Cap hold is $9.6m.

    63. During the All Star Break, though, he still toed the line barely, but he was getting close to it.

      In fairness though, I would imagine it would be hard to talk to reporters about a team under .500 and not mention either a) getting better as a unit or b) bring help in from elsewhere.

    64. That’s easy enough to fix to make salaries work.

      Throw in a Seraphin.

      Issue is Rockets think they can get more value.

      I’m not in favor of it at all. I don’t understand why everyone seems so eager to get Lawson. he has two DUIs in six months at which point the Nuggets almost gave him away. They got a protected first and a lot of players they didn’t use. Now the Rockets have given up on him too, and somehow his value is just as high or higher (judging from your trade offers). On the other hand no one wants Dwight Howard because his body language is bad, even though he’s still a very productive player.

    65. For Barnes, GS can go as high over the cap as they want. It’s only when it comes to those Durant scenarios that they need to be creative (free up max space to bring in Durant by renouncing Barnes, Ezili, and Barbosa, etc).

    66. 76ers apparently listening to offers/fielding interest in Okafor. They must have some real faith in Embiid and Saric.

    67. @71

      I agree, I’d eat Watson and Frye if it was necessary to do it to.

      Oladipo would run the point for me in the triangle.

      The problem is I don’t think they will trade him or might wait until draft/summer time.

    68. By the way, one area where Melo has been slipping a little bit recently is talking about his lack of help. He has always been very good about not talking about that (instead letting his friends do it anonymously on his behalf) because he has to know that he’s pretty much responsible for him not having star teammates, so I was always impressed that he didn’t bitch about it in public. During the All Star Break, though, he still toed the line barely, but he was getting close to it.

      I agree with Dtrickey. Also he’s not responsible for Amare being a glass man, the bargs trade, billups amnesty etc. I mean it’s been 5 years. That’s a whole contract

    69. I would argue that Carmelo Anthony was a good addition to the team and that his contract was never the issue. I feel like the moves we made around him were the ones that hurt most. Amar’e’s knees, the Woodson contract, the Bargs trade, etc. hurt a lot more than Melo, who has been a better Knick than he was a Nugget. Just imagine if we amnesty STAT instead of Billups so we could have signed Chandler. The course of the franchise is seriously altered and could have had a shot at a 27-28 year old Chris Paul.

      With that said, I’m content with where we are as a franchise. We got Euro Ewing, Galloway, Melo, and cap space. Of course things could be better, but Porzingis just makes the Knicks fun no matter the outcome of games.

    70. I would argue that Carmelo Anthony was a good addition to the team and that his contract was never the issue.

      lol ok

    71. I would argue that Carmelo Anthony was a good addition to the team and that his contract was never the issue. I feel like the moves we made around him were the ones that hurt most. Amar’e’s knees, the Woodson contract, the Bargs trade, etc. hurt a lot more than Melo, who has been a better Knick than he was a Nugget. Just imagine if we amnesty STAT instead of Billups so we could have signed Chandler. The course of the franchise is seriously altered and could have had a shot at a 27-28 year old Chris Paul.

      That the Knicks have made many terrible moves over the past seven years doesn’t make the Melo trade any better. It was awful. The current contract is also awful. Neither were as awful as other moves, but is that really much of an argument? “Other things were even worse!”

      The Bargs trade wasn’t as bad as the Curry deal, so the Bargs trade was never the issue?

      They were all bad. They were/are all the issue.

    72. at the Knicks have made many terrible moves over the past seven years doesn’t make the Melo trade any better. It was awful.

      Right but my point is that it’s been 5 years. How long can you hold on to that? This 2016 swap wouldn’t have even been a big deal with out the barg trade.

      The Knicks clearly gave up too much because of dolans meddling. But did Melo make Dolan not trade shumpert for Lowry for instance?

    73. How? He will be making 10mil below max ?

      He’s 31, his knees hurt, he’s rocking his worst mostly full season WS/48 since 2008-09 (I figure we gotta discount his awfulness last year, right? But if you want to count last year, then it’s even worse, as he’d be rocking his worst WS/48 since…the previous year of his contract) , but the good news is that he’ll be making $10 million (I believe it’s actually $6-7 million, $24 million vs. $30-31 million) less than a full max contract next year at age 32? All with a no-trade clause that he refuses to waive? I think that lines up pretty well with “that’s an awful contract.”

    74. Right but my point is that it’s been 5 years. How long can you hold on to that?

      He said during the All Star Break:

      “I think everybody always kind of dreams and hopes that they can play with another great player, another star player. It’s a star players’ league. I think that’s what we all talk about every time we get together. ‘I want to play with you. I want to play with you.’ Even here, different guys say, ‘Come play with me, come play with me.’ That’s always the mindset.”

      But when given the opportunity to give the Knicks the chance to add said star player back in 2011, he specifically did everything in his power to prevent them from doing so, all in the pursuit of making sure he got paid as much as humanly possible. And then, after that didn’t work out, a couple of years ago (which is why this is still relevant), when given the chance again to join other star players, he decided not to, because he preferred to stay in New York and again make the most money possible (less a couple of million).

      All of this is fine, of course. I have never begrudged him for choosing money and a great lifestyle for his family as his priority. I absolutely respect that decision. But you can’t choose money and a great lifestyle for your family as your priority and then bemoan the results of said decision with no acknowledgement of your role in things. And during his time here he has always made a point not to do that, which I’ve always admired. He’s wavering a bit with these remarks, though. That said, he’s still toeing the line enough that he hasn’t gone there yet, which is good.

    75. I am surprise that we have not heard that Millsap is on the block too. I know they gave him money last year but if they are doing a rebuild around Dennis why keep a vet his age. I am surprised that we haven’t heard rumors about Love for Millsap.

      I will admit that the new rumor of Anderson and Crowder to Cleveland and Love to Boston is pretty good. I would want Olynyk? included if I was the Cavs though. Even without Olynyk, Crowder and Anderson makes them a very versatile and scary bunch. Just having Crowder makes it easier for them to match up to a team like GSW when they go small.

    76. The Anderson/Crowder deal is fascinating. Here’s my sort of problem with that deal, though. Anderson is a free agent, right? With the rising cap, he’ll make probably $16-18 million next year. Do you really want to lay out that sort of money just because he fits in slightly better? You’re downgrading, talent-wise, and you’re not even saving that much money. Plus, of course, you’re using your one big trade bullet by dealing Love.

      But yes, Anderson/Crowder definitely does help them match up better against GSW, as Love can’t even stay on the court against GSW as a 4. So I’d be tempted.

    77. In other news, Phil should call Sac and take advantage of Vlade while he is there. He might give up WCS in exchange for Lopez for all we Know. smh

    78. Sounds like the Nets are trying to save money on their new GMs salary. They picked someone but are still negotiating a contract because he’s reluctant to leave the Spurs for the Nets. Their second choice is Denver’s assistant GM, whom I’m sure is not currently a highly paid guy. Given the state of the Nets, this seems a dubious strategy to me, unless you assume that whoever you hire, it wont make much of a difference to the Nets in the near future.

    79. The Anderson/Crowder deal is fascinating. Here’s my sort of problem with that deal, though. Anderson is a free agent, right? With the rising cap, he’ll make probably $16-18 million next year. Do you really want to lay out that sort of money just because he fits in slightly better? You’re downgrading, talent-wise, and you’re not even saving that much money. Plus, of course, you’re using your one big trade bullet by dealing Love.

      Yeah I don’t get that trade at all from anything but the most short-term perspective for Cleveland. Love’s value is down but he’s still a much better player than Anderson, who is as much a zero on the defensive end and is an inferior offensive player and much inferior rebounder.

      If I’m Cleveland, I cut Anderson out and deal directly with Boston. Avery Bradley, Crowder, one of the less valuable 1st round picks, and filler (ie. RJ Hunter or someone like that) for Love is a pretty fair trade. Then you trot out Irving, Bradley, Crowder, LBJ, and Thompson against GS’s death lineup. And since Love makes more than all those players combined, Cleveland gets a big break on luxury tax.

      If I’m Boston, the 1st round pick is not a big deal, and while it hurts to lose both Bradley and Crowder — well, you have to give something to get something.

    80. BC spitting truth on this thread, love it….

      But when given the opportunity to give the Knicks the chance to add said star player back in 2011, he specifically did everything in his power to prevent them from doing so,

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