Knicks Morning News (2015.01.03)

  • [New York Times] Curry, Green Lead Warriors Past Raptors, 126-105 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 08:51:57 GMT)

    Forced to go small, the Golden State Warriors keep coming up big.

  • [New York Times] Grizzlies Hold Off Lakers for 109-106 Victory (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 06:28:01 GMT)

    Mike Conley had 19 points and nine assists, Marc Gasol scored 18 points and the Memphis Grizzlies edged the Los Angeles Lakers 109-106 on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Pistons 97, Knicks 81: Knicks, Desperate for Points and Bodies, Fall Again (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 05:01:33 GMT)

    The injury-depleted Knicks lost for the 20th time in 21 games as the struggling Pistons easily sent them to their ninth straight home loss.

  • [New York Times] N.B.A. Roundup: Nets Contain Rally by Magic, Returning to .500 With a Win (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 05:01:25 GMT)

    Mason Plumlee had 18 points and 9 rebounds, helping the visiting Nets beat the Orlando Magic, 100-98.

  • [New York Times] Teague Help Hawks Beat Jazz 98-92 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 04:58:07 GMT)

    Jeff Teague scored 25 points, and the surging Atlanta Hawks beat the Utah Jazz 98-92 on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Green Helps Suns Pull Away From 76ers, 112-96 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 04:54:59 GMT)

    Gerald Green and Markieff Morris each scored 21 points and the Phoenix Suns pulled away in the fourth quarter to beat the Philadelphia 76ers 112-96 on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Miles Helps Pacers Beat Bucks 94-91 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 04:27:58 GMT)

    C.J. Miles scored 22 points and Roy Hibbert had 18, leading the Indiana Pacers to a 94-91 win over the Milwaukee Bucks on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Rondo Returns to Boston, Helps Mavs Win 119-101 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 04:15:52 GMT)

    The Boston fans had never seen Rajon Rondo in an opponent’s uniform before.

  • [New York Times] Rajon Rondo Stars in Boston, Wearing Blue This Time (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 04:07:28 GMT)

    In an unremarkable season, honoring the team’s former stars has become a highlight, and Dallas’s Rajon Rondo was the latest to benefit.

  • [New York Times] Durant Scores 34, Leads Thunder Past Wizards (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 03:49:13 GMT)

    Kevin Durant scored 34 points to help the Oklahoma City Thunder beat the Washington Wizards 109-102 on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Pelicans Rout Rockets, 111-83 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 03:43:00 GMT)

    Ryan Anderson scored 22 points, Tyreke Evans added 21 and the New Orleans Pelicans routed the Houston Rockets 111-83 on Friday night.

  • [New York Times] Pistons Hammer Knicks 97-81 (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 03:31:00 GMT)

    Brandon Jennings scored 29 points and the Detroit Pistons extended the New York Knicks’ losing streak to 10 games with a 97-81 victory on Friday.

  • [New York Times] Love, Cavs Beat Hornets 91-87, Snap 3-Game Skid (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 03:06:52 GMT)

    Kevin Love scored 27 points, Kyrie Irving had 23 and the Cleveland Cavaliers snapped a three-game losing streak with a 91-87 win over the Charlotte Hornets on Friday night.

  • [New York Post] Frustrations mount as Bargnani goes down again (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 00:24:07 -0500)

    It is almost mind-numbing. After finally making his season debut on New Year's Eve, Andrea Bargnani checked in during the first quarter for his second game Friday. And left after…

  • [New York Post] Carmelo, take a break — maybe for the whole season (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 00:02:16 -0500)

    Take a seat, Carmelo. Not just for one game, for an extended period of time to help heal your left knee. Put All-Star ego aside. Carmelo Anthony needs to do…

  • [New York Daily News] Fisher says Carmelo may have to shut down prior to 97-81loss (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 06:46:05 GMT)

    Carmelo Anthony spoke in recent days of possibly having to skip certain games to rest his sore left knee.

  • [New York Daily News] Bondy: It might be time for operation shutdown with Melo (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 05:50:14 GMT)

    The Knicks fell again for the 10th straight time, serenaded by jeers, slaughtered this time by the lowly Pistons, 97-81.

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks’ Calderon says frisky fan held him, ‘loved’ on him (Sat, 03 Jan 2015 05:26:52 GMT)

    Knicks point guard Jose Calderon claims a fan tried to get a little too frisky with him after he barreled into the Garden crowd.

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    Mike Kurylo is the founder and editor of KnickerBlogger.net. His book on the 2012 Knicks, "We’ll Always Have Linsanity," is on sale now. Follow him on twitter (@KnickerBlogger).

    40 thoughts to “Knicks Morning News (2015.01.03)”

    1. Wow. New year, same old Knicks.

      Meanwhile, the 3 point guards that the Knicks balked at trading Iman Shumpert for last year (Lowry, Collison, and Teague) would all be, hands down, the best players on the Knicks this year. Two of them will even get MVP votes this year.

      But at least we can still say SHUMP SHUMP, so it’s all good.

    2. In the beginning of the year, people were talking about Shumpert like he was going to get (and deserve) a 4-year, $48M offer in the offseason. Because of, like, 10 games of good play. And lots of people wanted the Knicks to extend that offer.

      Shumpert’s career TS%: 48.9
      Shumpert’s YTD TS%: 48.4

      Have ye learned nothing from the Jerome James contract?

      Seriously though: Shumpert has fluctuated between 11 and 16 FGA/48 in individual seasons and his TS% has fluctuated almost not at all.

    3. We could have gotten WAY more for Shumpert and/or Hardaway last year, when there was at least a perception around the league that they had value. In the meantime, Shumpert has regressed and if I’m another GM watching Hardaway this season, I’m not even sure I give up a 2nd rounder for him.

      And thank God Dolan said enough is enough and didn’t give up that 2018 pick for Kyle Lowry, the man is tough as nails.

    4. Lowry for shump would have been great, but Lowry for Shump and another first? I dunno. I’m a huge Lowry fan, but we’d still suck and he might not have wanted to stick around.

    5. Well, Toronto was never giving us Lowry for Shump, or even for Shump and Hardaway, so that’s moot.

      Look, I get not wanting to give up more picks (especially after giving up our 2016 for Bargs) but this is such a point guard driven league, and Lowry is one of the best. He’s good enough that we would have made the playoffs last year, and I can’t imagine we’d be any where near the suckiness we are this year with him running the show. And I do think we could have re-signed him.

    6. Can’t give up that pick unless you are sure you are getting a long term asset. Lowry basically would have to have agreed to extend in order to make the deal.

    7. The extension is moot because of bird rights. If the Knicks thought Lowry would rather take less money to play outside of NY, then they would know just how pathetic they are as a franchise, which they don’t.

      But Lowry may not even turn out to be the one that got away. Jeff Teague could have been had for Shumpert and no future 1st. He was seen as a salary dump at this time last year. And now he’s got a 22 PER, a .200 WS/48, and has the Hawks in first place in the conference.

    8. If we traded Shump/Hardaway for Lowry, we’d probably still have Mike Woodson and Tyson Chandler. Kyle Lowry and Tyson Chandler might have won the Atlantic Division this year, but we wouldn’t be much more than a team that wins in the 1st round. I like the reset button we hit. Gimme more Cole, draft Jahlil Okafor (.660 TS on a 28.8 USG), and offer Jimmy Butler the max. If that doesn’t work, go after Wesley Matthews. Try to pull a trade for a point guard, and you might win 50+ games next season.

    9. Remember, in 2010 the Nets lost 72 games and ended up with Derrick Favors in the draft.

      Worst record has a 25% shot at the top pick. That’s bad odds.

      The last time the worst record in the league got to select #1 was over 10 years ago (when Orlando drafted Dwight Howard).

    10. The best spot to be in is 3rd. Since the start of the lottery, the 3rd place team has one the 1st pick 7 times. Next best spot is 5th, which has won it 5 times. Then 1st place (or last depending on your perspective) with 4 wins. It’s a crap-shoot either way, and even more so when you consider previous #1 picks who turned out to be complete busts (here’s where I’d put my obligatory Bargnani joke, but really…the joke’s on us); but it’s still the best method for building a good team.

    11. But Lowry may not even turn out to be the one that got away. Jeff Teague could have been had for Shumpert and no future 1st. He was seen as a salary dump at this time last year. And now he’s got a 22 PER, a .200 WS/48, and has the Hawks in first place in the conference.

      The worst thing was that the Knicks could have had Teague or Collison for Shump but in both cases insisted on including Felton in the deal. Their obsession with dumping Felton at all costs really screwed them. Both there and in the Chandler deal. All to get rid of a contract they didn’t have to give Felton in the first place (did Felton seriously have other four-year deals out there? Sure seemed like they were bidding against themselves there).

    12. The worst thing was that the Knicks could have had Teague or Collison for Shump but in both cases insisted on including Felton in the deal. Their obsession with dumping Felton at all costs really screwed them.

      Almost as bad- Calderon has been no improvement at all over Felton. I’d be very surprised if the Knicks could move him without adding a sweetener- he’s an atrocious defender (especially in transition) and plays with zero pace on offense, can’t get into the lane, etc… Simply put, he’s no longer a point guard in today’s NBA given that most teams want to spread the floor and run multiple PNR sets. Of course, he’s not helped by the fact that 35 games in, the triangle still seems to be a mystery to most of the team- it’s tough to get the team into proper sets when two guys always seem to be setting up in the wrong position or failing to make the simplest reads. But the fact that the Knicks have been 3 points worse with him on offense speaks volumes- he’s stunk.

    13. If there’s one positive thing about this crap fire of a season, it’s that I can turn on a college game and see a big time player and know that he actually might be playing for us next year.

    14. I wish we had someone we could trade for another pick this year. Then I could get really into college basketball

    15. Okafor with 28 pts on 7 for 11 FG and 14 for 17 FT to go along with 8 rebs and 4 blks. He’s Duke’s version of Cole Aldrich :-)

    16. The “non-trade” looks like a blunder because the knicks, as a team, are playing like shit and losing almost every game.
      If the trade was made and Lowry was here, and the knicks were losing, which they probably would be, the deal would have looked awful. Shump, on a better team that’s winning a lot of games would look much better than he has for the knicks this season.
      When a team is losing at the rate the knicks are, everyone looks bad. You have to weed out the main cause of the losses. Melo? Fisher? Triangle? Not enough talent?

    17. The best spot to be in is 3rd. Since the start of the lottery, the 3rd place team has one the 1st pick 7 times. Next best spot is 5th, which has won it 5 times. Then 1st place (or last depending on your perspective) with 4 wins.

      Let me know if you want to join my poker game.

    18. By wins produced we have 3 above average players this season. By winscore we have 2. Box score metrics don’t tell you everything, but that’s pretty strong evidence that we juat don’t have enough good players. As hoolahoop says, even with a terrific player like kyle Lowry this team would still be bad. We need a massive talent infusion next season.

    19. @21 A lot of good things happen when you have a PG that can actually penetrate, score and also play defense. Not saying he and a healthy Melo would lead us to the promised land, but I do think we could be hovering around .500. And I know it’s a big leap from 5-30 to 17-18, but that’s the impact a top flight PG would have IMO.

    20. No thanks to a Colafor front court- two slow-footed fives does not make for an attractive pairing. Coltown would probably make a lot more sense. Personally, I think Cole is best an average starting 5 (which unfortunately makes him one of the best players currently on the team) and that might be optimistic. He’s not a great defender- gives up post position way too easily and doesn’t move his feet well on the perimeter. He does have good hands on defense and rotates to the rim pretty well so he’s not awful but pretty meh overall. Serviceable on offense but little more than that. If he gets his rebounding back to where it was last year (and after the last couple of games, his TS% as well) and keeps his turnovers where they are now, then yeah he’s a decent starter but the fact that he’s one of the only guys worth thinking about keeping for next year just shows how god-awful this team truly is.

    21. A lot of good things happen when you have a PG that can actually penetrate, score and also play defense. Not saying he and a healthy Melo would lead us to the promised land, but I do think we could be hovering around .500.

      I dunno, you’re basically saying a top PG would be worth 12 wins in less than half a season, which would mean you’re talking about a 24 win player. A good John Stockton season was worth about 14 wins, and Magic Johnson’s best seasons were worth around 16 wins. I know those metrics are not exact, but 12 wins in a half a season is a MASSIVE amount of wins to be generated by one player.

      If you could stick a prime Stockton or Magic or Gary Payton on this team, his two-guards would still be Shump, JR Smith and Tim Hardaway Jr., and Jason Smith and Amar’e Stoudemire would still be the power forwards trying to hold down the fort on defense and you’d still be counting on a washed up Sam Dalembert to be a key part of the rotation. Quincy Acy would still be a key rotation player. This team just sucks, and it is a lot more than one player away from being close to respectable.

    22. If the Knicks traded for Lowry they make the playoffs last year easily and most likely dont trade Chandler in the off-season and dont sign Jason Smith with their 3m player exception.

      The question is are the Knicks better off long-term now with having a likely Top 3 pick and all the cap room they will have this summer than having Melo and Lowry on the books with a mid to late teens 1st rd pick and not much if any cap room this summer.

    23. @25, sums up my feelings exactly. Lowry is a very exciting player, but once we made the regrettable Bargnani deal, it was not worth squandering another #1 and tying up the cap space just to be a .500 team. I, for one, am glad we are looking at a major shift in philosophy, away from dealing #1 picks and towards building a sustainable winner.

    24. Problem is, the Lowry deal or no-deal wasn’t really about a philosophical shift away from lackluster stop-gap measures towards a long-term sustainable future. It was Dolan getting in the way of himself again and fearing he was getting hosed once more by Ujiri. I’m glad we didn’t make that trade for the reasons already stated, but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking this was a decision made via well-thought out and rational decision processes. That was pre-Phil, so hopefully there actually has been a philosophical (I can’t resist a terrible pun, sorry) shift, but it’s probably too soon to tell yet, though the signs are less than promising I’ll admit.

    25. @25, sums up my feelings exactly. Lowry is a very exciting player, but once we made the regrettable Bargnani deal, it was not worth squandering another #1 and tying up the cap space just to be a .500 team. I, for one, am glad we are looking at a major shift in philosophy, away from dealing #1 picks and towards building a sustainable winner.

      I mean, I definitely agree that I am pumped that they are going to have a top five pick most likely for the first time in thirty years. However, since that clearly wasn’t their plan for this season, then I dunno if we should give them much credit for a change in philosophy yet. Phil’s plan for the season was for them to make the playoffs and then sign another star in the offseason. That sounds pretty much like the previous plan for the Knicks.

    26. We could argue this forever, I guess it comes down to the known vs. the unknown. The known: a top 5-7 PG with less cap flexibility and a lost draft pick 4 years from now, or the unknown: the hope that 1) we get a player in the draft that can have an immediate impact (i.e. before Melo starts breaking down) and 2) we are able to sign free agents that transform us from a 20 win (optimistic at this point) team to a playoff team and eventually a contender.

      I don’t think not pulling the trigger on the Lowry deal was as much of a no brainer as some do, but that’s all I’ll say on it. What’s done is done, time to move on.

    27. @19– Have you ever thought that maybe the reason that Shumpert looks bad is not because he’s on a bad team but because he’s a bad basketball player? He hasn’t improved at all since he came into the league. It’s amazing to me how many people act like, if only Woodson hadn’t called him Rook and somehow jerked him around, and the front office hadn’t talked about trading him, he’d be another Kawhi Leonard.

    28. Yo, last time I checked, 2011-12 was a killer year for Knicks basketball, and he sucked then, too.

    29. If the Knicks traded for Lowry they make the playoffs last year easily and most likely dont trade Chandler in the off-season and dont sign Jason Smith with their 3m player exception.

      Even if that, very optimistic scenario, were true, that means Woodson would still be here. There’s not a player in the league that would be worth keeping Woodson.

      Have you ever thought that maybe the reason that Shumpert looks bad is not because he’s on a bad team but because he’s a bad basketball player?

      I’m not saying that Shump is great. Clearly, his growth has been dissappointing considering his potential.
      My point is that when a team is 5-30, for the most part, everyone looks like garbage. On a good team, it’s probable that Shump would be playing at a much higher level.
      The knicks have been abysmal at developing players.

    30. Shump is just not good at some of the real basic elements of basketball, namely finishing around the rim. He’s a terrible finisher and a mediocre to weak jump shooter, which is why he ends up around a .480 TS% year after year. Shump is one of the few guys here who has worked hard on defense over the last few years, and I do believe he’d be a better defensive player on a team that had some degree of defensive coherence. I appreciate his effort on D. But his offense just stinks, and as a result he’s a fringy player. I don’t think it was ever in the cards for Shump to be anything more than that.

    31. Shump is just not good at some of the real basic elements of basketball, namely finishing around the rim.

      His inability to finish at the rim jumped out at me the first time I ever saw him play – in an inter-team scrimmage. I’m really surprised he never fixed that.

    32. Again, it’s not the Lowry non-trade that is stinging. It’s the Teague non-trade.

    33. Okafor would be nice, but they’ve needed a competent point guard in the worst way for about , oh let’s see…..forever. I can’t even remember the last above average point guard the Knicks have rolled out there. Charlie Ward maybe? Calderon has sucked, Felton sucked, etc…, etc.. Lin is actually looking pretty good compared to the dreck that replaced him in NY. That being said, although Lowry would have been a great addition, not at the cost of yet another #1 draft pick. Those picks are extremely valuable and not having them for years is a major reason the Knicks have been terrible for almost all of the past 15 years.

    34. There’s not a player in the league that would be worth keeping Woodson.

      Hasn’t Woodson pretty much been exonerated by the Fisher Knicks?

    35. Hasn’t Woodson pretty much been exonerated by the Fisher Knicks?

      I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say that Fisher’s poor coaching is more a knock on Fisher than a positive for Woodson. But I certainly see your point – it definitely does make Woodson look not quite so bad to see them get even worse this season.

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