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New York Knicks vs. Atlanta Hawks Injury Report: News, Statuses, Inactives for Wednesday, February 12 – The Associated Press
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Knicks vs. Hawks NBA Game Time, TV Channel & Live Stream ? February 12 – The Associated Press
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Karl-Anthony Towns, Josh Hart Applauded by NBA Fans as Knicks Beat Haliburton, Pacers – Bleacher Report
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Josh Hart?s All-Star game snub is a blessing in disguise – New York Post
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Tyrese Haliburton Stats Tonight: How did Pacers star perform against the Knicks? (Feb. 11) – Sportskeeda
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SLIDESHOW: Pacers get Stuffed by the Knicks at Home – NUVO
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“Montoya, Por Favor”: After Luka Doncic’s impressive multilingual display Knicks $18,144,000 forward teases his Spanish skills – Sportskeeda
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Towns drops 40 as Knicks maul Pacers, Sixers flop – News- Graphic
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Knicks? Mitchell Robinson discusses extended absence, hopes to return at ?100 percent? – The Athletic – The New York Times
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Cam Payne, bench give Knicks ‘big lift’ in Jalen Brunson?s absence against Pacers – sny.tv
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OG Anunoby?s injury absence could hit All-Star break ? even after upgrade – New York Post
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NBA roundup: Karl-Anthony Towns, Knicks trounce Pacers – Reuters.com
02/12/2025 05:06:32
178 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2025.02.12)”
If you have not seen this highlight & you enjoy seeing Embiid flounder, this is for you:
http://www.espn.com/video/clip/_/id/43802463
I think there is a major lesson to be learned by the Knicks here from the Embiid saga, btw:
Do. Not. Extend. KAT.
Now I know KAT doesn’t have Embiid’s woeful injury history. But IMO an extension (which he will soon be eligible for) is a franchise-crippling unforced error waiting to happen.
Did someone say we are 8-2 in our last ten? Did I read that at the end of the thread?
I don’t believe it.
Hubert – Extending KAT is happening. I understand your concerns and have made peace with them myself.
This is the team for a while
No reason for that level of certainty. Leon has been very smart with extensions.
KAT is in the first year of a three year deal with a player option for year 4 that he might not be so quick to decline at age 33.
This can be our team for a while without a franchise-crippling premature extension.
It can’t be because Mikal has to be extended.
Isn’t what we’re hearing that there are going to be fewer Supermax contracts? In other words, if Leon offers something like 3/180 w a player option, who is gonna top that? Would KAT even leave for a better offer with a bad team that had cap space? Would he risk being traded to place he didn’t want to go?
Note that $60m in 2030 will not be the same % of the cap as it is now.
He’s eligible for an extension this summer.
Just to be clear: I believe KAT first becomes extension eligible after next year, right? That’s plenty of time for Leon to get enough info to make a measured decision (and he always seems to do that with extensions before the player reaches free agency; that’s been a strength of his).
If he is eligible this summer I’ll be a little more concerned.
EDIT: E are you referring to Mikal or KAT?
This summer according to Sportrac.
KAT eligible this summer. Mikal will be an expiring when summer hits and will have to be reupped.
They should be thinking of a window of this year and next, no more.
This nucleus stands to get very expensive, very fast.
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/new-york-knicks/cap/_/year/2024
KAT is signed through the 2026-27 season and has a player option in 2027-28 for $61M. There is zero urgency to offer him an extension now and it would be stupid to do so.
Mikal is signed through next year. He could have been extended last year but both parties agreed to wait. So he will not become expensive until 2026-27.
Neither player has a no-trade clause to my knowledge. KAT has a 10% trade kicker.
2026-27 is a basketball year away. The window at this price point and relative flexibility is one more year. And even that will likely cost an unwise Mikal extension.
They didn’t “put off” Mikal’s extension; he’s eligible for way more money and term if he signs this summer than he would have been last summer.
Exactly.
But I mentioned it bc the Sixers found themselves in the same position with Embiid and Morey essentially tanked the franchise by extending Joel when there was zero urgency and it was stupid to do so.
The Lakers did the same thing with Anthony Davis, but got miraculously bailed out.
It seems like it’s not easy to not extend a max player when they become eligible. That is precisely what caused the demise of Butler and Riley.
If KAT is indeed eligible for an extension this summer, it’s something to keep an eye on.
E is trying to fabricate an emergency that doesn’t exist.
Mikal will likely sign for something between Brunson and OG money. If he balks, consider him a sunk cost and trade him to the highest bidder.
KAT should not be extended until 2026-27 the earliest. It would be idiotic to do so unless he agrees to something like 3/$150 past his opt-in year. The only way his price will go up is if really good things happen here. I’m not worried about it at all.
I get the sense that all three of us (me, Z-Man, and E) are actually in agreement here: this is not a team we should be in a rush to lock in for 5 seasons high price points. Leon should proceed with caution and be prepared to pivot at the end of next year, if necessary.
I’m already on record as suggesting he should have pivoted sooner. Like, as soon as we saw this team play. But I know that’s an extremely aggressive position (even though it’s probably the correct one). I understand wanting to give it time, but we definitely need to maintain our flexibility here. That should be non negotiable.
Every negotiation is different. We are in uncharted territory with the aprons, and . Teams are seeing how crippling it is to extend a player for max or near-max money, especially an older player.
Folks here have made a bunch of predictions for like three years now about Leon’s ship running aground on the second apron before the job is done. None of those predictions turned out to be true, and there is no indication that they will veer off of that path. Based on how they have operated, I’m expecting the team to operate below the second apron for the foreseeable future until there is evidence to the contrary.
this is funny
the only players in the league with a NTC are Lebron and Bradley Beal, which is a fun thing to say
BTW, the reason that KAT (and Doncic) became available in the first place is because Minny (and Dallas) were concerned about being boxed in to being above the incredibly punitive second apron. Is KAT going to find a taker that is willing to pay him more than his 2027-28 player option of $61M? If yes, tip your cap and bid him good day, and use the cap space to sign/trade for players that other teams need to dump to stay/get below the punitive aprons. In no, then let him opt in and then negotiate from there.
We’ve got Owen saying it’s already done and he’s accepted it. And we’ve got Z-Man saying it will never happen don’t worry about it.
I’m somewhere in between.
And again, I only bring this up because Embiid was the cover story on ESPN’s NBA page, with Windhorst and the others declaring that he is untradeable after his extension. I think it’s a relevant and cautionary tale.
I generally trust Leon on this stuff, especially after the way he handled Randle & Quickley (i.e. ruthlessly). But it is fair to wonder if he would do the same with KAT, who is one of his guys.
I understood Owen to be saying that he will be extended. He didn’t specify when or for how long. I think KAT wants to stay here for the rest of his career and will negotiate accordingly. I am suggesting that if he is extended, it will not be on a $350+M supermax deal.
whew, woke up in a fright because I thought it was valentine’s day and I had forgotten to send flowers…
yes, i have another day to get prepared…
we haven’t been playing a lot of games lately, so looking forward to tonight’s matchup with the hawks…
I don’t understand why we’re bringing up Embiid and KAT. Embiid’s untradeable because he’s always significantly hurt, has played like crap this year, and can’t be bothered to get in shape. If he were healthy, nobody would be talking about him being untradeable or even talking about trading him.
The reaction to the punitive nature of the aprons is still being fleshed out. KAT was available for a fraction of what it would have cost to trade for him under the prior CBA. Same with Doncic.
At the same time, previously “smart” POBO/GMs are doing stupid shit. Morey is locked in to paying the corpses of Embiid and George $120M in 2027-28. The Warriors are locked into an ancient Butler-Steph-Draymond core for the next 3 years. Who knows wtf Ujiri is doing. The Celts are for sale, who knows how their new owners will react to their enormous tax bills?
OKC really just needs SGA to stay healthy to be in dynasty position
“FROM SHAMS:
The Charlotte Hornets are signing guard Damion Baugh to a two-way NBA contract out of G League’s Westchester Knicks, sources tell ESPN. Baugh has averaged nearly 13 points and 10 assists in G League.”
I can’t imagine a circumstance under which we would have signed him ourselves. Just FYI
Because Embiid was extended as soon as he became eligible, even though it made no sense to do so.
KAT is eligible to be extended this summer, and it makes no sense to extend him.
But the NBA seems to have some unwritten rules. Like, “if you’re good on your rookie deal, you get the max on your second deal, even though it’s stupid.”
And I think “if you’re a max player and you’re extension eligible, you get an extension, even though it’s stupid” might be another one, which is why Embiid got extended (and why Butler revolted against Riley).
And if that’s the case, well, gulp.
“I don’t understand why we’re bringing up Embiid and KAT. Embiid’s untradeable because he’s always significantly hurt, has played like crap this year, and can’t be bothered to get in shape. If he were healthy, nobody would be talking about him being untradeable or even talking about trading him.”
Agreed, but Embiid is/was also a MVP-level player and 30 years old and Morey was not going to let him hit the market. KAT is not on that level, he’ll be 32 on his next contract, and market conditions have changed. Teams are panicking about being in the second apron, both for the tax bills and the way it hampers team-building.
The Luka trade was dumb for Dallas, but it was largely a product of the new CBA. The KAT trade was dumb for Minny, but it was a product of the new CBA. Embiid’s contract not aging well is a cautionary tale for teams that sign players to supermax contracts when there is still teambuilding to do.
Z-Man, since I’m still sort of pissed off this morning, I’ll just say it.
If you want to take someone to task for an overly enthusiastic take (!), and/or relitigate a trade, do it on the thread between games, where endless boring drivel about second aprons and bad trades and accusations about questionable historic takes are endlessly turned over like a bored pig flipping dung. Don’t poison a game thread with that shit. As we’ve said about others, read the room.
That’s all. Back to extending KAT, or whatever.
I agree with you, Raven, but the trolls always come out in the game threads. Moreso than anywhere else, actually. They’re the source of the poison.
Raven, really? It was not an over-enthusiastic take. It was purposeful trolling. The comment stated that if the KAT trade was not made, the season would essentially would have been over a month ago. That’s the kind of shit that shouldn’t be said in game threads. If you want to criticize anyone, start there. Tell the poster who posted that unnecessary (and dumb) shit in the game thread not to post unnecessary (and dumb) shit in the game thread. As to being pissed off, I just payed big money to witness the player in question get his ass kicked all over the MSG floor against our most important opponent, so I’m thinking that his biggest stan gloating in a game thread that he is abusing the likes of Thomas Bryant is what should be called out.
The normal reason for extending someone are to give him a raise in return for getting him committed for longer. This doesn’t apply to KAT. He is already well paid and his contract isn’t expiring quickly. Sometimes extensions are also signed to lower a current salary in exchange for a longer contract for the player. This could benefit the team by, say, getting them under an apron, and benefit the player by giving him more financial security. Something like this could happen with KAT, but certainly not til the summer, and maybe the Knicks won’t have to do that. It’s kind of specious to suggest that because Morey did it with Embiid and it was an obvious mistake that somehow Rose will emulate that mistake.
As for Bridges, he is underpaid and I suspect he will get a raise, but if he gets a raise of, say, $10M, that’s still less than the likely year to year salary cap increase.
It should also be pointed out that my initial response was “okay troll.” It could have stopped then and there. The author of the comment chose to escalate.
That poster got enthusiastic about KATs impact and maybe exaggerated how bad we’d be without. That’s a normal fan reaction to a win where he played a big part. You guys are giving him much more hell for his wording than he deserves.
It’s amazing how one game changes the conversation.
Towns was feeling less than 100%, got exposed defensively against an elite team with elite coaching, had a terrible game offensively and part of the conversation was whether we could win a championship with him at the 5 and Brunson at the 1 or whether he should be traded.
Towns feels 100%, the opposing starting C is out, he goes off and we are talking as if he’s here for the long term and will probably get extended at a crippling price.
Do people think Leon, Thibs and the rest of management and coaching staff are not watching these games and don’t have the same concerns?
If you think they are idiots, then we have legtimate concerns. But they have repreatedly demonstrated they are not idiots both in basketball terms and what they’ve been willing to pay our players.
The only debateable salary/contract on the team is OG. To me, that was an absolute “must pay” because he can be a critical piece for any team with championship aspirations. If you trade him for “assets” you are basically doing a semi-reset. You can’t do a reset every time you have to “pay” or you’ll be resetting until 2050.
If they think Towns should be extended they’ll extend him. I doubt they will until they are ceratin they have the option of moving him to the 4 next to a C like Mitch and it will work. They will also consider his knees.
I know we are running short of coffee and eggs but I have no fear for the future of beef production.
I am not a contract detail guy but it seems clear to me we are going to sign KAT to a long term deal and have him in NYC for the next 5-8 years. I think that’s the plan. And I think it will end badly. But the next few years will be fine.
IMO Morey has been overrated for as long as he’s been in basketball. To his credit he was an early user of advanced stats, but he has a long record of bad deals and mistakes also. He’s just been fortunate enough to get bailed out of a few of them by targeting bad managers.
History indicates that simply becoming eligible for an extension has become a normal reason for extending max players.
It didn’t apply to Joel Embiid, Anthony Davis, or Bam Adebayo, either. But they all got extended as soon as they became eligible with two years left on their deal. It didn’t apply to Jaylen Brown, either, when he became supermax eligible with one year left.
It’s actually hard to think of a max player who did not get extended as soon as he was eligible unless it was because he wanted to bail (like De’Aron Fox).
It seems to be a fait accompli for max players: you become eligible, you get paid. And if you don’t pay them, you’re insulting them.
I think that pressure is what caused Morey to make such a terrible mistake, and I think it bears keeping an eye on here this summer.
I’m a little nervous about this team, currently made up entirely of players in their primes, collectively aging into a team made up entirely of players in their decline phases. I hope there’s some plan to deal with that when it comes. It coincides with the period where we’ve traded away every 1RP that we could legally trade for Mikal Bridges.
At some point we will need to get younger, and I’m not sure how Leon is gonna do that.
What’s more valuable in 2025: centers who can shoot threes or eggs?
It’s amazing that you think last night’s game has anything to do with it.
Good morning, fellow Knickerbloggers!!!
Definitely not eggs, so I’ll go with centers who can shoot threes.
easy on the food talk KB, still under the covers with my furry little snuggle buddy…
love the smell of coffee, mmmmm eggs sound good, hmmmmm, maybe some over easy eggs with bacon and cheese on a bagel, fry up some potatoes…yum…
owen motivating me to leave the comfy confines of bed…
With GMs there’s always the risk that they don’t really care about this because they figure they’ll be fired at that point.
Speaking of young players, it’s surprising that Pacome has only played 5 games for the Westies. I would have thought we’d want to get him more game action
“That poster got enthusiastic about KATs impact and maybe exaggerated how bad we’d be without.”
Sorry, I think you are sugarcoating a comment that clearly fits the definition of trolling. Again, my initial response was brief, and the poster not only chose to escalate, but he doubled down. In addition, I don’t think the trade for KAT was particularly controversial (certainly not on my end) so I don’t understand why that needed to be said.
Definitely not: coffee, eggs, bacon (unless turkey), cheese (unless fat-free), potatoes (unless not fried). Breakfast of choice = three slices of turkey bacon on an everything bagel, eaten as a sandwich.
That’s what I’m afraid of.
What I would like to see is no extension for KAT this summer, make a decision at the end of next year. If we can’t figure out how to shore up the defensive issues his presence creates by then, sell high and pivot.
If Mitch is healthy (big if) I’m 100% fine with this roster over the next three years.
The chips are pushed in. Now develop chemistry, strategies, etc. and use any remaining cap/picks on bench pieces and future diamonds in the rough.
I’m ok with anyone who wants to do the mental gymnastics (in or out of game threads) to find very slightly better fits via blockbusters… but I think it’s wishcasting that won’t ever happen.
Lol this 100% fits the profile.
Again, irony is dead.
Don’t take this the wrong way but it’s kind of funny that you can’t see how “okay troll” was actually the escalation point.
FWIW I disagreed with Noble and thought his take was a little wild but he definitely was not trolling. It was a sincere take.
This, on the other hand, is the kind of trolling that has no place in a game thread but is constantly there:
https://knickerblogger.net/2025/02/11/2024-25-game-thread-knicks-pacers-you-go-your-way-and-ill-go-mine/#comment-946859
My sense is that a lot will depend on what happens in the playoffs, and by extension (npi) on how healthy the team is in the playoffs.
If I had to guess, I would say that if we get beaten down in Round 2 (somewhat likely at this point) there will be some changes. I would also guess that if we again lose in the second round or earlier, at least two of KAT, Mikal, OG, Hart, and Deuce won’t be on the 2026-27 roster.
But it is too early to speculate on such things, because the only meaningful data will likely not be available until May at the earliest.
What’s up with Brunson?
“Don’t take this the wrong way but it’s kind of funny that you can’t see how “okay troll” was actually the escalation point.
FWIW I disagreed with Noble and thought his take was a little wild but he definitely was not trolling. It was a sincere take.”
We’ll have to agree to disagree. But whatever, I’ll leave it at that.
They really aren’t, though. We are pot-committed for this year and next. That’s it. We should keep it that way.
Jalen Brunson’s age 30-32 seasons need to be saved for a pivot if this doesn’t work out.
I don’t think that anything in particular is up with Jalen Brunson other than him having a subpar game last night. It happens. Good to know we can win against a non-bottom feeder without him having to do a lot.
It’s undoubtedly due to massive selective memory, but I don’t really remember Jalen having trash games last year. He’d have quiet games, and games where he’d have a few more turnovers than hoped for. But yesterday was really Bad Julius level.
I’m sure he’ll score 40 tonight, so it’s no big thing. Just interesting.
And while I’m on the topic, WTF with bringing him back with five minutes left and up by 15 or so? The only thing that might make sense is that Thibs was trying to get him to double figures scoring for some streak I’m not aware of, but even if that was true it was still a crime against humanity. One of the weirder Thibs moves in a long, long list of weird Thibs moves.
you can all but pencil in the mikal extension. cba maxes his yr 1 at around 20% of the cap. leon didn’t give 5 firsts and a swap to play mle-rookie max chicken with a cmg godfather.
I definitely remember him having at least a couple of trash games in the playoffs. The first two games against Philly were really bad and we were all panicking about him.
I hope Brunson is just dealing with fatigue and the kind of minor dings that are inevitable around this time of the season. In general, the guys need some rest. Mikal’s been not great the last few games, and my hope is he’ll emerge from the break feeling refreshed and playing much better.
That Thibs has been more willing to rely on the bench (more of Shamet lately, Mikal only played 29 minutes last night) is at least a bit promising. These guys aren’t great most of the time (other than when Payne improbably turns into Steph Curry), but they need to be able to eat enough minutes that the starters aren’t exhausted both during games and from game to game.
And while I’m on the topic, WTF with bringing him back with five minutes left and up by 15 or so? The only thing that might make sense is that Thibs was trying to get him to double figures scoring for some streak I’m not aware of,
Not that I think Thibs did it for this reason, but remember last year when DDV missed the criteria for MIP because he didn’t play enough games of at least 20 minutes?
Jalen definitely had a handful of “bad” games last season, but they were all very early in the season: 7/3/6 on 2-of-12 shooting in a win against the Clippers, 15/3/6 on 6-of-21 shooting in that Game 1 loss against the Celtics, 14/4/5 on 4-of-14 shooting in a loss against the Pellies, etc., were probably the worst of the bunch.
was very relieving to see shamet finally hit a 3 point shot yesterday…
I’m 100pct convinced he wasn’t trolling. It was just a hot take/exaggeration.
Z, so many bigger fish to fry.
On another note, I am more confused about the Sims trade now than when it was made. I thought we were trading him to someplace where he could get minutes and we took Wright and cash back to make the deal work for Milwaukee under salary cap rules, not because we wanted Wright. Milwaukee fans seemed happy to get a young mobile big. But Sims hasn’t seen a minute of play for Milwaukee. I’m wondering what’s going on there.
There is a new 9 episode documentary series on the Celtics that debuts on HBO Max on March 3rd. I’m super excited to watch that…..
😊
I think he’s there if Portis or Lopez gets injured. Or maybe the fans don’t realize he’s already 26.
Wow! We’re on day 2 of “would the Knicks be much worse if they didn’t have Karl-Anthony Towns?”
I truly thought very little of the comment when I made it. It seemed, and still seems, quite obvious to me. The two guys we traded for him are injured and/or underperforming–after much agita about a possible Randle extension here, he now might have to opt in to his player option!
I guess if you want to be Doogie-level pedantic, you can say I was wrong that “the season would be over” had we not made the trade, as I will admit that NBA seasons are 82 games regardless of the significance each one carries. So we’d still be playing basketball games, but I am certain we’d have long since been eliminated from the national discourse when it comes to teams with a chance to do anything interesting in the playoffs.
Is it really sound to assume that Randle and Donte would have the same numbers (and injuries) if they were in NY that they have in Minnesota?
I don’t think you were trolling but it was a pretty wild take. And it’s not pedantic to quote you.
I’m well aware of the apron restrictions, etc. but don’t you truly have to out your hands up and take a “I have no idea what will happen” approach at this point?
In one deadline, Luka Doncic, Anthony Davis, Jimmy Butler, De’Aaron Fox, Zach LaVine, and Brandon Ingram were all moved, and by all indications Kevin Durant damn near joined them. The early returns on the Apron Era seem to indicate it could actually spur at least as much player movement as it deters.
All this to say, I’d take the over on 0.5 major Knicks transactions within the next 3 seasons. As soon as this offseason we should have access to the TPMLE (and maybe even the MLE if we want to move Mitch to access it) and an additional tradable first, and our asset chest will slowly replenish from there.
EB, you are probably right. As for being 26, I think that is young by Bucks standards.
I say it all the time, but I think Thibs is on the spectrum. So no matter how many ex-players, fans and sports writers explain to him the chance your key players get hurt or you wear them out for the playoffs is more significant than the remote possibility you blow a lopsided game that is very unlikely to matter anyway, he can’t change. If one of these guys go down due to this insanity he should be fired.
Aside from a volume dip, Randle’s numbers look like a pretty typical Julius Randle season. His TS+ is actually 3 points up compared to last season. Donte’s been much worse than he was for us, but has played pretty much exactly like pre 2023-2024 Donte. These seasons would’ve been well within the realm of possibilities had they stayed.
I made this point after the trade happened If you’re on the fence between guys whose production is fairly volatile and someone like KAT who has too much sheer skill for much volatility, go with the latter guy.
Sure, anything could happen, but it really seems like Leon is fully in on the core of KAT/Jalen/OG/Mikal. But yes, if Jokic demands a trade to NY, I think he would consider it.
Ok. Let’s get this win and go into the break on a good note, then hopefully get Mitch and OG back above 80% for the next game. Glad they beat a team i can’t stand on my birthday tho..made shoveling snow feel almost ok lol
Brunson played 23 mins last night.
None of this supports your thesis.
The KAT trade seems to have worked out in the near term but I think you vastly overstated the peril we’d be in without it.
Z-Man made a fair point about that Detroit pick, which quintupled in value after Leon traded it: if it could have been used to find an effective Hartenstein replacement in season, then we’re looking at the January Knicks plus Bridges.
And even if we had Jericho Sims, Ariel Hukporti, and some vet min scraps at C, I still think Jalen Brunson & Julius Randle are good enough to have kept us in the thick of things like they did before.
I mean…who was the effective Hartenstein replacement available for what projects to be the 15-20th pick? This isn’t theoretical, we know all of the guys who were available and/or moved this season. As far as centers go, they were pretty much unanimously quite underwhelming (unless the idea is that we could’ve topped Dallas’ package for Anthony Davis).
Hubert,
This is the most manic depressive group of fans I’ve ever come across.
Virtually every win or loss changes the tone, mood and opinions.
There are two issues of concern with Towns. One would go away if our coach wasn’t an idiot-savant.
1. He’s been having recurring knee issues this season and probably needs some time off to improve that and his hand.
2. When he’s at the 5, his defense can be exploited by top teams with good coaches. That goes double because of Brunson. So we have to figure out if that combo can work defensively if we slide him to the 4 when appropriate and play him with Mitch or potentially trade Mitch and find a 4 we can pair him with that works better.
I can assure you with 100% certainty everyone in management and on the coaching staff wants to contend for a title and every single one of them is aware of the defensive issues. If it turns into an insurmountable problem they will not extend Towns unless they are pretty sure they can move him later. They are not masochists and they are not stupid (like some of our former managments).
IMO we would be quite a bit worse so far this year without Towns.
We lost I-Hart and Mitch has been out. They anchored our defense.
Without Towns upgrading the offense relative to Randle our defense would have taken the same hit it has already taken and the offense would not be nearly as good as it is.
IMO we would be a lower 2nd tier team at best and that assumes Randle and DDV were still healthy.
The only possible exception would be if we landed someone like Kessler instead. Then the offense would be similar to last year (not nearly as good as this year) and we’d at least have a defensive anchor even if he wasn’t as good as I-Hart.
Towns is a much better offensive player than Randle in terms of efficiency, spacing and ball movement. I said that when we made the trade and I think the results speak for themselves.
HBD PJ!
Happy slightly belated birthday, Poindexter!
Donte
Donte is playing de facto PG for the 2nd unit. So yeah, I think he’d be better here. His 2p% is down and assists are up, which evidences troubles decision-making when you need to rebalance passing and shooting.
He may not put up last year’s numbers, but it’s reasonable to think he’d play better next to an actual PG.
Randle
Randle is pretty much the same player except that his defensive rebounding is down, which certainly seems like a scheme issue and not a thing wrong with him specifically. His usage is down a bit too but offensive rebounding, passing, and shooting percentages are about the same.
We also have up a 1st Rd pick.
Towns
Yes, Towns is still better. But I’m not convinced he’s a viable option at C for a championship team. He’s never been on a team with a defense good enough to do win it all without Gobert playing next to him and his offensive impact is muted if he plays PF.
When Towns has played on teams next to Gobert his offensive on/off dropped to +1.3 and +0.1. Maybe that’s just Naz being great or something, but it’s a big drop from where he is now at +6.5 and where he was the year before at +7.2 or the year before that at +10.6. His greatest value is at C where he opens up the paint, but if you plop Mitch next to him, then you lose that massive advantage.
We’ve seen Minnesota go all-in on perimeter defense before too with PatBev, McDaniels, Vanderbilt, and Edwards. They still ended up only 13th on defense that year. So are our defenders significantly better than that group? I’m skeptical.
So I won’t say it’s a bad move. I will question whether it’s worth the price for a player who I’m not convinced can win you a championship.
“I’m 100pct convinced he wasn’t trolling. It was just a hot take/exaggeration.”
But the poster himself did not consider it to be a hot take or an exaggeration, and still doesn’t. He defended it as totally accurate, and implied that it was silly to think otherwise. Here are his verbatim comments:
“Wasn’t trying to be remotely controversial? Does anyone actually deny what I said?…I fully believe it due to a wide variety of quantitative and qualitative data….I maintain that without KAT we’d have been out of the running to do anything interesting a while ago, likely prior to 2025.”
Trolling or not, it is exactly the kind of biased hot take that E often engages in, and like E, he has insisted that it isn’t a biased hot take, but a totally reasonable one backed up by evidence, rather than speculation based on questionable assumptions.
We’d be significantly worse without an NBA level starting center to this point.
Again, it doesn’t support your thesis that we’d be in great peril running out a top 6 of Jalen Brunson, Julius Randle, Mikal Bridges, OG Anunoby, Josh Hart, and Donte DiVincenzo. That is still quite a good team, good enough to be 3rd in the East even if our centers were Jericho Sims, Ariel Hukporti, and scraps from the G League. If Leon could have acquired an effective Hartenstein replacement like Walker Kessler, we might even be better.
To answer your question, recents events suggest Mark Williams was the best center we could have gotten with a middling first round pick. He is far from a replacement for Hartenstein, which supports your point.
And for the record, I think that we would have been a similarly good team without the trade if Randle and DDV played something close to how they were playing between when we acquired OG and when Randle went down, because a) I believe that Leon would have found a decent replacement C like Nick Richards, b) We would have had a deeper bench, and c) Thibs is an excellent coach who would have figured out how to get somewhere around 50 wins out of that bunch. And if you add a healthy Mitch to that team for the stretch run and the playoffs, I’d be more than happy to roll into the playoffs with that bunch.
Under those assumptions, which I believe are quite reasonable, I think that the KAT trade has been an improvement, but by that I mean about 5 more wins in the regular season. Sadly, if we play the Celts in round 2, it will probably mean 0 more wins in the playoffs this year.
In other words, I think that “being out of the running to do anything interesting by New Year’s Day” would be an absolute worst case scenario based on dubious assumptions about DDV, Randle, and Leon.
Please let me know if anyone on here is actually medically qualified to pronounce that Thibs is truly on the spectrum, without even so much as a thorough examination. I could be wrong, but I don’t think so. Maybe he’s just super, super stubborn who has beliefs about how to win that may differ than most of our own, but those two things are quite different.
DDV was not playing PG on the second unit when he had his injury—he had been starting.
In other news, the Suns are now trying the Twin Towers approach by starting two 7-footers, namely Nick Richards and Bol Bol.
This is the third time Z-Man has tried to get me involved in his back and forth with TNFH, to which I’m not a party and haven’t been anywhere near.
Bizarre behavior indeed.
Supermaxing KAT and maxing Mikal and otherwise paying full retail for the decline phases of a non-contender — and giving up 5 ones for the privilege — is quintessentially basketball GMing “stupid.”
Nick Richards is pretty bad. We could’ve had him this season and passed on him, likely due to the aforementioned badness. He’s never posted even a positive DEPM and he tends to make his teams, which to this point have included the Charlotte Hornets, significantly worse on defense.
I fully acknowledge that defensive statistics aren’t entirely reliable, but I mean, compare these numbers to iHart’s and Richards looks like an iHart replacement like Landry Shamet looks like an OG replacement.
Thanks Clarence and Raven.
I realized I am now 48..FORTY FRICKIN EIGHT and freaked out a little LOL.
Very much a blessing. I’m from an era and area where guys like me were constantly told we’d be in jail or dead by 21. Aaaaaand some of the dumb shit I was a part of- I probably should have been. So..I’m embracing the fuck outta these grays on my face.
Weird though..my face is gray af, but I don’t have much gray on top of my head. My father was the same way. He didn’t really start getting gray until probably 70 outside of a few here and there in his head. His facial hair was really gray though, I suppose that’s why he kept a clean shave lol
Here’s the thing, though… and credit for this goes to Early Bird because he said it a couple days ago…
Our offense would be really good with Julius Randle at center.
Some of our offensive improvement is undoubtedly attributable to Towns being better than Randle. But most of the improvement, IMO, is attributable to switching to 5 out.
If we were playing 5 out with some combination of Brunson, Randle, Donte, OG, Bridges, Deuce, and Hart while sprinkling in Precious, Sims, and Hukporti when we need size, we would probably have an elite offense and a bad defense, which is exactly what we have now.
That team, IMO, is probably also 3rd in the East.
But there is no way in hell it’s a disaster.
“To answer your question, recents events suggest Mark Williams was the best center we could have gotten with a middling first round pick.”
I don’t think you can compare what might have down in September through November with what has taken place recently. Even so, as recently as January 15, Nick Richards and a 2nd rounder were traded to the Suns for Josh Okogie and 2 second rounders. His $5M salary would have been easy to match with flotsam and jetsam. Would he have been available for something like that price in October or November?
happy birthday poindexter…
I hope for the most part you were able to do as you please yesterday…
any birthday rituals/food that stay consistent with you?
every once in a while I’ll search a KB moniker to try to remember what it relates to…
don’t happen to livestream video games do you?
edit: if you do, obviously overwhelmingly awesome, if not, okay, neither do i…
I sincerely hope i am the only one here who gets stressed out over that 5 minute edit your post thing…
whew, got to remember to breathe…
“This is the third time Z-Man has tried to get me involved in his back and forth with TNFH, to which I’m not a party and haven’t been anywhere near.”
Considering how many times he has specifically called you for making outlandish, unverifiable claims, to the point where he insisted on only engaging with you if certain conditions were met, I thought you’d appreciate the irony. I guess I was mistaken.
Oh, hell no.
Ah, ok — I get it now.
The disconnect is probably a non-meeting of the minds on how little attention I pay to his personal “criticisms” of me. I do try to strip that out and engage with what he’s saying substantively, and that’s hit or miss, some good, some bad.
In terms of “outlandish claims,” I’ve been writing for several weeks now of the very-close-in-time major decisions this FO is going to have to make. Certainly no skin off me that it wasn’t engaged with until now — there’s no obligation to and there are other things to talk about — but Hubert got the ball rolling and you joined in and now everyone knows.
“I fully acknowledge that defensive statistics aren’t entirely reliable, but I mean, compare these numbers to iHart’s and Richards looks like an iHart replacement like Landry Shamet looks like an OG replacement.”
Nick Richards, or any plug-and-play C, did not have to be an iHart replacement per se. He had to be a reasonable placeholder defensive C until Mitch got healthy.
If your starting 4 non-C’s are Brunson-Mikal-OG-Randle, and your bench is Hart-DDV-Precious-Deuce-whoever, I think you have a 45-50ish-win team. YMMV.
Randle is shooting 32% from 3 this year after shooting 31% last year. His 3PT% in the four post-empty gyms season is .325.
Lineups with him at center strike me as “5 out” in name only, and our defense might be worse than the Wizards’.
KAT obviously has his defensive flaws but he’s really good on offense. Like really fucking good. Much better than I anticipated and I knew from looking at his numbers how good he’s always been offensively.
Plus KAT is also a much better rebounder than I realized.
KAT uses a large amount of possessions, and has a 110 eFG+, while Randle uses a large amount of possessions and has a 97 eFG+.
High eFG% is the reason we’re an elite offense. Assign all of those KAT possessions to Randle and you’re no longer going to be #2 in the league in eFG%.
KAT is a career .400 3pt shooter who has been even better than that in recent years. Randle is a career .330 3pt shooter who has been worse than that in recent years. You wouldn’t enjoy the same amount of spacing, as every opponent would simply sag off Randle and dare him to shoot from the perimeter.
Defensively Randle is no better than Towns, and does not have Towns’ length. Towns also leads the NBA in TRB% and I doubt Randle would be able to do the same, so you’d be losing rebounding too.
Thanks, geo!
The only “ritual” i have is visiting my youngest son. His birthday as well, he’s 24 now. Weather stopped that this year so I just sent him money.
I agree that we wouldn’t have run much 5-out compared to what we run now, but that would only mean that we played similarly to last year, with a different starting C and Mikal at the starting 2. I would guess that Thibs would go small with Randle at the 5 in limited circumstances. He clearly was not much of a fan of that configuration.
It is not an accurate statement that KAT leads the NBA in TRB%—that distinction actually belongs to Kevon Looney. KAT is tied for second with Donovan Clingan among qualified players. (Ivica Zubac and Jalen Duren round out the Top 5.) Point taken, though.
In terms of the future, they have $196.3 million in committed 2025-26 salaries to nine players — starting 5, Mitch, Kolek, Dadier. Second apron this year is $189 million. It will go up, but they have very little wiggle room to stay under it. Probably won’t happen.
The year after, Mitch and Mikal notionally drop off and they have $167 million in committed salaries to the seven leftovers. They have a first rounder that year, which if they use (*), projects to a hold of around $4 million. Put Mikal at $40 if they extend him, and that’s $207 without even the draft pick, with no Mitch. Resign Mitch and they’re at a floor of around $220. Second apron, little question.
(*) The fugazi Wiz pick also potentially conveys that year; if it’s at 10 or 11 it would be great in basketball terms — but there’s another $5 million or so on the already bloated cap number. Another incineration might very well be in our future.
So are we determining via statistics whether it was a troll or not?
“Defensively Randle is no better than Towns”
I don’t think this is true, nor do I think Randle’s deficiencies on D are as consequential as KAT’s when he has a decent rim protector behind him.
I also think that Randle at the 4 moves OG to the 3 and Bridges to the 2, which enhances their defensive impact.
Additionally, having Hart and DDV off the bench instead of Payne and Shamet is a massive improvement. The trio of Deuce, Hart, and DDV would be one of the best bench trios in the NBA. Right now we have one of the worst.
My feeling about my posts is that they don’t actually go live until five minutes after I post them. Especially since the u on my keyboard is only semifnctional.
Towns is a lot better than Randle.
It’s projected to go up a lot–close to $208M per Sportrac. I betcha we stay under it next season.
i’m going to blame you for making me think yankees BBA, but – starting to think that maybe giancarlo stanton’s contract might just work out okay, seems a miracle just to say that…
also, saw the thing on espn about poor yankees, no more juan soto…well yeah, soto will probably have another top 10 players in the league kind of season…
a lot of clubs don’t have juan soto, and if you want to watch him live, still possible in the same market…
i think i’m just making excuses, they do have a lot better opening day roster the most of the teams in the league…
when did you ever think you’d hear a yankee fan calling for a salary cap…
wait what, true story!!!
that’s remarkable, my goodness, he’s half your age also…that’ll be a cool picture together when it happens…awwwww…
got a daughter in that age range…i had uncle sam looking after me til i was in my 30’s, it’s tough for young folks just starting out…i wish him the best of luck…
Yea and he’s bigger than me. I’m 5’8″ 182 and he’s a solid 5’11” 208, so I walk around actin like he’s my bodyguard while talking reckless lmao. But my youngest child? She’s definitely the boss lol. She’ll be 13 next week, and I haven’t learned how to say no yet. I’m done-done LOL. Cooked.
It kind of feels like we’re having this argument in a world where we somehow didn’t lose iHart, or we somehow found a new iHart, but alas, when the Towns trade was made iHart was gone, and I haven’t heard a coherent theory of how we would get a “decent rim protector” who wouldn’t tank our offense. Again, Nick Richards is not a good defender. I’m being asked to assume a can opener.
Maybe we’d play a ton of Randle at the 5, which is hardly “5 out” and would be much, much worse offensively than our current group because Randle is much, much worse at making shots than Towns.
Defensively, I think Randle at the 5 is decidedly worse than Towns at the 5. He’s smaller, not as good a rebounder, similarly foul prone, and his effort waxes and wanes all the time.
Or maybe we’d get a shitty center like Richards to avoid all of that, which would come with its own issues. We’d be starting, and presumably giving a lot of minutes to, a shitty player. The “January Knicks” without Isaiah Hartenstein don’t strike fear into anyone’s hearts.
i have a somewhat odd question, nyc specific – has any ever been to the bathhouse flatiron?
One point of agreement is that the aesthetics of our offense are dramatically better post-trade. We are currently 10th in the NBA in assists per game after being 28th and 29th the last 2 years. But our offensive rating was still pretty good even without the ball movement…3rd and 7th. So I think our offense would have still been pretty good, just uglier. And I think our defense would have been at least marginally better.
Given the ups and downs of the Bucks, Pacers and Magic, I think we’d still be in the 3-spot, probably something like 32-21. we’d probably still be getting whupped by the Celts, Cavs, and Thunder, and would be a formidable matchup with everyone else.
We’re projected to have $61M under the 2nd apron that year. If we sign Mikal at $40M, then unless we sign Mitch to a $21M deal, we’re fine.
We’re also, you know, allowed to go over the apron.
13, i experienced that, most i remember is getting the cold shoulder when it hit social situations with their friends around…i’m not bitter about it still…
i’m making sure with the boys (13, 11), they don’t do me wrong in front of their friends 🙂
we shall see how that works out…
i’m in the low 60’s now…i could still get around easy enough for her (20’s)…recently went to the ymca with the youngest, then the park, nearly passed out…
Geo I’ve been to the Williamsburg one. I’m more of a Russian Turkish Baths guy myself. There’s one around the corner from me in Flatbush that has a Dj everyonce in a while. Sausage party.
“The “January Knicks” without Isaiah Hartenstein don’t strike fear into anyone’s hearts.”
But they wouldn’t be the January Knicks, They just paid 5 draft picks and a swap for a player that was not a part of that team. By doing so, DDV, i.e. a guy who had a 3.4 BPM, was moved to the bench. You would be replacing Payne and Shamet with DDV and Hart. That’s an 8-person rotation of Randle, OG, Mikal, Brunson, Hart, Deuce, DDV, and Precious. I don’t think it would take much of a C to make that a .600-ish team, even if you had to go with Sims, Huk, and Precious you could grind out 6 wins every 10 games with that bunch.
oh jesus christ I understand the Clarence lore now and I resent Z-man’s reference now
this dude is in offseason LARP mode 25/8, huh?
If we don’t get KAT, we could still make another trade for a C. Or just start Sims/Precious until Mitch comes back. Unless you’re obsessed with regular season standing, you can probably make the playoffs with that group.
geo, I’m very optimistic about the 2025 Yankees. Sucks Soto left, I was hoping like crazy that he’d stay but except for solving 3b the Yankees did a pretty good job pivoting after losing Soto. Plus I’m looking forward to seeing how the young kids hopefully improve this year (Volpe, Wells and Jasson).
Yankees should be the favorites to repeat in the AL since it’s definitely the much weaker league and I expect the Yankees to win more than the 94 games they won last year. Having said that I’m sure you’ll see alot of comments from me this summer ranting about the Yankees…
haha, maybe I’ve seen one THCJ tennis photo too many. Always great to hear from you, hope all is well up there in the Great Northwest! And yes, Clarence is always trippin’.
Via Marc Stein Via Hoop Hype
We haven’t had a good RJ thread in awhile. 😉
I could live with a Jimmy Butler type extension for KAT. Turn one player option year in to two guaranteed years. Or possibly turn his player option year into 3 years at less than the maximum.
We are lucky that Towns’s extension is first available next summer. Lots of teams have made bad moves due to the new cap situation and the topic of max extensions being questionable and less of a sure thing is very much a big topic these days. I think we are going to start to see much more nuance and discussion around these extensions than in the past and star players simply expecting to get a max extension even into their mid-late 30s will be a thing of the past.
Plus Brunson taking a smaller extension will probably effect both Towns and Bridges and hopefully get them to take less. Bridges has already said as much. Towns is not going to tank his career with 3 years left on his contract simply because we won’t extend him. As long as Leon doesn’t panic, he has time and the extension can wait if need be.
Jowles, don’t be surprised when he turns out to be your cousin….
You don’t have to be a deadly three point shooter to be effective on the perimeter. Just look at Jimmy Butler or De’Aron Fox.
It’s 5 out bc if the ball is in hands most centers in the league are going to be dead meat, especially if you surrounded him with Brunson, Donte, Bridges, and OG.
thanks clarence…
was reminiscing on the fieldhouses located on some of the different bases i’ve visited…at the time i was roaming around a lot of the facilities felt older, a couple of nice newer ones…lot of really nice facilities…
actually funny you in particular answered, was also thinking of places that are easy to have an honest conversation at…i liked the setting we met, watching squirrels run trees is superb…
spending time in a sauna is an activity i miss…something i valued a bunch in my younger days…
can’t tell you how many great conversations i’ve had with strangers in saunas, gyms in general i guess…
never hung out in a salt pool – i may or may not have had a massage back in those same military days…but yeah, been awhile since i’ve indulged in a massage, no doubt work wonders for everything not quite right from head to toe…
real reason though – perhaps a “to do” thing on a travel list…
a lot of you here do it, now i’m thinking more and more of traveling…yep, So let’s take a ride and see what’s mine…
well, first i got some medical appointment things to do, then i’ll ride and ride and ride…
some strangers are getting ready to poke inside my mouth with sharp hard objects…it’s for the best they say…
I think we are much better due to the KAT trade and have a much higher chance of making noise in the playoffs both this year and in the future. It also solved the Randle contract problem.
Without the trade we’d be a playoff team and might have even still been in the running for the 3rd seed but that does not mean we would have been close to as good.
Towns gives us so many different looks and especially when Mitch is back he can play the 4 or 5 and we can either go big and get every rebound and defend well or go 5 out and shoot people out of the gym.
I think everyone is overblowing Towns’s defensive shortcomings. After a rocky defensive start our defense was starting to play better and then Towns got banged up and OG got injured.
I think once Mitch is back and Towns and OG get well our defense will pick up and we have a shot at being a solid defensive team in the 8-13 range which is good enough considering our offense when clicking is as good as any in the history of the NBA. And even with IHart our defense last year was 10th and has only cracked the top 10 once since Thibs arrived.
Huge no on any bathhouses anywhere.
I’m far from qualified. I have a brother and a couple of other relatives on the spectrum. I can’t give you an official disgnosis. I am just very familar with many of the quirks of high functioning people on the spectrum. Caring for brother drives me crazy on a weekly basis.
IMO, If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it just may be a duck.
Some of his quirks are very familiar to me.
He has trouble changing even when it’s obvious to almost everyone what he’s doing is wrong and even ex-players are calling him out. You can call it stubborn if you want, but imo there’s a wire loose somewhere when a game is essentially over and you are putting starters back into the game in the final minutes.
Z-man gets me.
The difference between Towns and Randle on offense goes well beyond Randle playing C. Towns is still a more efficient scorer, a MUCH better spacer and moves the ball. Randle is ball stopper and occasional nitwit. Also, if you think our defense has suffered going from I-Hart to Towns (and it surely has), it would be laughably bad with Randle at C.
Ben, I think our offense is not all that hard for a good-to-great defensive teams above us to gum up. It has been pretty weak against the Celts, Cavs, and Thunder (never more than 109 points). Will that change when Mitch comes back? Possibly, his offensive rebounding is a difference-maker…but then someone has to sit, and if it’s Hart, he’s been an awesome offensive player this year. Is it Bridges? We just payed a king’s ransom for him. Is it OG? nope.
I think our best bet is to physically pound other teams like we did to the Cavs in 2022 and were doing to the Pacers even with Julius out until OG went down. I don’t think we are going to “offense” our way past the Celts or Cavs.
You guys remember that Donte guy provided a lot of spacing, too, right?
He started 8 of his 40 games. Notably, Mike Conley did not starting any of those games.
Randle at C was not going to be much of a thing. Thibs’ head would explode if he had to do it for more than a few minutes a night. Something else would have happened.
The degree of badness doesn’t much matter beyond the point where it’s bad enough not to win a championship, which is where we find ourselves.
(1) You can’t win a championship with KAT at C because his defense sucks
(2) You can play KAT at PF, but then you lose most of the difference between KAT and Randle
(3) We could have survived till Mitch returned or made another deal using Donte or Randle or a 1st
Well now, isn’t *that* interesting??
And so’s that!!
You know, Z-Man, for a guy who snarls a lot at me, you sure do seem to be agreeing with me a whole lot lately. Why even this morning, you pretty much said don’t extend KAT or Mikal. Not only do you agree with me, you also agree with Hubert. Yes, you kind of went through the motions of snarling while doing it, and pulled in supposedly lame predictions in the past about Leon — staying in character; we all know you don’t really *want* to be seen in public agreeing with me — but it didn’t hide or cover much.
Quite the development.
Kumbaya.
I’m not sure what this debate is even about.
It was obvious before the trade that Towns is much better than Randle and after the trade it’s so ridiculously obvious it’s crazy to debate. Towns has made us a top 2 offense and the T-Wolves are already looking for ways to move on from Randle but couldn’t find a deal at the deadline.
If the debate is how much worse we’d be with Randle, that’s at least a reasonable question, but if you use last year’s team as a base and subtract I-Hart and Mitch (the former critical), we’d be kind of screwed. How screwed is dependent on if we were running with Sims or made a trade for someome that was actually good. That’s unknowable but less than Kessler and we would not be very good.
The max extenstion debate is similarly silly because it’s obvious the team understands the issues with Town’s defense and they know his age. There has been no indcation they are crazy when it comes to contracts. If anything, they’ve been very good.
We should be worried about our defense this year not some theoretical extension that could doom us 3-4 years from now when no one is even talking about an extension yet.
It’s like we have to be upset about something because we aren’t the Dream Team and today it’s Towns’ theoretical extension.
We have a tough B2B tonight. Let’s get past that!
Bottom line — if they’d 2023 Cav’d plus Obi for DDV’d, they’d have the best bench in the NBA bar none and a proven high-quality playoff defense. (*)
They … cough … no longer have that.
(*) Z-Man and I might then deviate on whether they should have followed that up with Julius and DDV for KAT — I’m a yes — but the underlying foundation, lacking now, would still be there.
Maxing at full retail a deficient non-contender, especially given alternate paths that could have been taken (and still might be taken).
This roster is not good enough to have to throw Mitch and draft picks overboard and still not have any flexibility — and still be four ones in the hole. That’s the resolution.
“We should be worried about our defense this year not some theoretical extension that could doom us 3-4 years from now when no one is even talking about an extension yet.”
Mikal and KAT are extension eligible this summer. Mikal, if not extended, will go into next year as an expiring. He already turned down the two-year max.
The fact that the writers and commentators we all note and cite aren’t talking about it is on them, not us. It should have been part of the discussion of the Mikal trade itself. That’s their problem.
Strat’s ‘nitwit’ comment made me think — it seems as if KAT doesn’t do a lot of nitwit things. Occasionally tries to thread the needle with a pass to a cutter that doesn’t work, once in a while a heat check three that maybe wasn’t the best choice, but I almost never wince when he has the ball.
TOV% this year is 11.6, compared to 14.8 for Randle…
They’re both inveterate ref complainers, but at least KAT does it while he’s running back up the court…
“You know, Z-Man, for a guy who snarls a lot at me, you sure do seem to be agreeing with me a whole lot lately.”
I don’t have a preference for agreeing or disagreeing with any particular poster. I truly like to call em’ as I see ’em. When I agree or disagree with any substance you post, it’s on that basis. As to the style, that’s another story.
“Why even this morning, you pretty much said don’t extend KAT or Mikal.”
Not what I said at all.
“Not only do you agree with me, you also agree with Hubert.”
Again, I agree with posters when they say stuff I agree with. I was never a fan of the Team This or Team That stuff. I don’t have an inviolate posting “platform” such as Thibs/Leon can do no wrong, as you have often accused me (and others) of having. I don’t shill for anyone, never have, never will.
“…and pulled in supposedly lame predictions in the past about Leon — staying in character; we all know you don’t really *want* to be seen in public agreeing with me — but it didn’t hide or cover much.”
Drivel, very much in line with my comment above about “style.” But hey, you keep right on doing you!
“Z-Man and I might then deviate on whether they should have followed that up with Julius and DDV for KAT — I’m a yes — but the underlying foundation, lacking now, would still be there.”
The trade was a no-brainer given the circumstances and the price. Said that at the time (see the link I posted above.) It’s really the Mikal trade that rankles me at this point. But he’s a very rootable player who I hope makes good on it. Onward!
Yes, DDV only started at PG in 8 of his 40 games. But it was the *last* 8 of those 40 games before he got hurt. He had finally moved into the starting lineup when that unfortunate event occurred. That’s all I’m saying.
The official Z-Man pronouncement. Yes, technically, one supposes that isn’t “don’t extend them.” It’s “don’t extend them unless they accept something they’re extremely likely ever to accept and probably never even entertain.”
Karl-Anthony Towns isn’t going to get paid $61 million and then take a pay cut to $50 million when he’s still in his prime. Unless he’s basically crippled. Jimmy Butler just got $55.5 and he’s 35. KAT ain’t taking $50 three offseasons from now at 31.
It’s highly unlikely he is even going to opt-in to that option. If he does, it will be because he’s basically crippled or has fallen off a cliff, in which case he’s surplus to requirements.
The issue will be joined soon, probably this summer. Leon will probably supermax extend him, particularly since he’s an in-house “friend of the family” guy.
He doesn’t have much choice. Realistically, he’s locked into this nucleus. He paid a shitload in assets for it, they’re all “friends of the family,” and “superstars,” so his boss is happy. Maybe something will shake loose, but that will be pure luck.
I think some of you guys deserve to have Isiah or Phil return as Knicks GM.
It’s highly unlikely he is even going to opt-in to that option. If he does, it will be because he’s basically crippled or has fallen off a cliff, in which case he’s surplus to requirements.
The issue will be joined soon, probably this summer. Leon will probably supermax extend him, particularly since he’s an in-house “friend of the family” guy.
Caveats acknowledged, but predictions. Kudos to E.
Leon is laying the groundwork for a Giannis trade.
I’ve been watching Severance lately and I think it explains the difference between Game Thread Big Blue Al and Off Day Big Blue Al.
Okay, so he started as the de facto PG for the last 8 games and played backup de facto PG the first 32 games. It’s a difference that doesn’t make a difference.
This. But then I think some of them would like that more because they’d have a better opportunity to show why they’d make a better GM.
You ever see his fouls?
Hubert I’ve been thinking about watching that show! I might have to reactivate my Apple TV Plus account soon.
SPOILER-FREE
The way it works, Al, is you get to severe your consciousness into two parts: your innie (who only exists at work) and your outie (who exists in the real world). There’s a ding in the elevator that triggers the conversion of the outie to the innie (and back to the outie).
Tip off is your ding, and Game Thread Al is your innie.
I like the concept. Cybersoze seems to have an in is and an outie too.
Funny part is my comments during game threads are tame compared to the frustrated angry texts I send my brother.
“I think some of you guys deserve to have Isiah or Phil return as Knicks GM.”
Whenever I think to myself, “Go to hell you annoying little poster,” this is what I would like hell to look like.
I’m thinking him seeing “Leave a Reply” is Doogie’s ding…
Here’s the Knicks write up from the Atletic’s recent article grading every team’s trade deadline. Knicks were ranked 18th, which I think is fair because basically the teams in the middle of the ranking didn’t do much bad or good, unlike teams at the top and the bottom. But the Knicks write up is interesting because it suggests another reason for the Sims trade.
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6128022/2025/02/12/best-nba-trade-deadline-moves-lakers-mavericks/
Jesus our post ASB schedule is rough.
We could do the same with Rokas, so I’m not sure how those two compare. Of course, we don’t have to do it this off-season either. Save him for whenever we need to save $1M.
I’m almost looking forward to this game. KAT’s back, and Brunson is going to be furious. Unless he has the flu, in which case I’m not looking forward to this game…
EB, that’s an interesting thought, but Rokas probably makes too much money since the minimum Euro league salary is 1.1M euros.
Elf back in Charlotte and starting again tonight, just as he did for the Pelicans earlier this season. He keeps getting jobs.
Poor Tyler Kolek. Another victim of being overused by Thibs.
Doesn’t Allers have a documented obsession with acquiring draft rights for anyone and their mother as worthless-but-still-technically-an-asset pickups? I’m not sold they grabbed Besson’s draft rights with the intention of actually signing the guy.
Porzingis vs Wemby is one of the most gangly matchups in NBA history
BBA, re: Severance
It’s an incredibly well-made show, well written, well acted, well directed. It also gives the viewer very little to go on or connect to – lots of clues for those who like to replay at 1/4 speed, but on casual viewing, a lot of the time stuff goes by and you’re like, what was that? Did I just see that? But because of the level of craftsmanship, I’m in; I do believe they know where they’re going and will be given the resources to see it through. And presumably, where they’re going will be rewarding to the viewer when it all comes together.
We shall see. I have my theories, but mostly I’m just trying to enjoy the ride and laugh at the many bizarre and incongruous scenes and dialogue.
That’s the minimum?! Either way, salaries scale up pretty fast in the NBA from the rookie minimum. I’d think it’d be worth it financially unless he’s far over the minimum.
Maybe Aller just thought it was funny trading a 58th pick for a 58th pick, maintaining our 58th pick in the draft superiority.
KAT is not going to be worth the supermax in 4 years, and if someone else wants to pay him the supermax I would be happy to oblige them in a sign-and-trade or even to lose him for nothing. I would offer him a bit more than the most another team would pay for him if he was a free agent. My guess is that it somewhere in the 3years/$175M range.
Of course, Leon can bit against himself again and supermax him. Wouldn’t be smart, but whatever, I root for the laundry.
Why does Kenny Albert always sound like a ventriloquist to me?
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