[ESPN] – Sat, 28 Sep 2024 02:30:00 GMT
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[sny.tv] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 20:43:41 GMT
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[Bleacher Report] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 23:52:54 GMT
Video: Paul Pierce Shades Knicks, Says NY Won’t Win NBA Title ‘in My Lifetime’
[Sports Illustrated] – Sat, 28 Sep 2024 06:45:43 GMT
NBA Champion Calls Out Lakers Following Timberwolves-Knicks Trade
[New York Daily News] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 18:51:20 GMT
Paul Pierce says Knicks won’t win an NBA championship ‘in my lifetime’
[Sports Illustrated] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 17:00:00 GMT
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[Empire Sports Media] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 17:17:23 GMT
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[Complex] – Fri, 27 Sep 2024 18:29:33 GMT
Jalen Brunson and Josh Hart Are Using the New York Spotlight to Expand
172 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2024.09.28)”
Details are still up, especially from a salary cap POV, and the trade isn’t official yet but here are my two cents after the earthquake that finally put an end to this endlessy boring summer…
– First of all, we’re now definitively a title contender and I can’t wait to watch this team play.
At the same time this is “the move” we were waiting for and this will probably be the main group for the next 3-4 years (with moves to do around the margins to strenghten the bench).
With this both the chances to win the chip and the ones of crushing to earth have raised a lot.
I’d have really loved to give last year team a chance (see below) but I’m okay with it.
– For years KAT has been one of the few real candidates to the Knicks’ “star chasing” and Julius was the obviuos chip, so that part of the trade isn’t surprising.
I’ll let for later a more proper fairwell to Julius, when emotions would retreat.
– Add the questions about Julius’s full recovery and KAT’s offensive arsenal and it doesn’t look so insane.
Doubts about our defense are understandable, but Thibs is a renown defensive genius, he’ll probably find a solution.
Also, the move put Mitch back in the tactical weapon/backup center role whom I think he’s better suited for…
… If he’s not traded (but from a salary cap perspective he has a very good contract, IF HEALTHY)
– On the other end, I’m painfully hurt about DDV.
He and Benedict Hartenstein were two of my personal “boyz” (and Donte still is). Losing both of them stings, a lot.
I know we had a potential PT crunch at the wing position, but the guy gave us some incredible clutch shooting and unforgettable moments last year. We’ll miss you Big Ragu.
Also of note: never break the Knicks single-season 3-Pointers record, it brings you nothing good (see also Fournier, Evan).
We can call it the Starks’ Curse.
– This front office has well sized balls and is incredibly tight lipped, no one saw this coming and it makes all our collective conjectures very funny*.
Also, look at what they do with the secondary/minumum salary signings, every small move has a purpose and Aller is a cap genius.
We weren’t accustomed to this.
– KAT contract is insane (as many others**) and Bridges still has to extend.
Even if Mikal does it at a discount we’re going to be a very top-heavy team for at least the next 3-4 seasons.
That’s why contracts like Deuce’s are a blessing, we need more of them to replenish our bench.
– The “butterfly effect” started with Hartenstein betrayal.
If healthy, last year’s team plus Mikal’s would have been a real contender but I-Hart spurned the greatest city in the world and choose less guaranteed money (despite his wobblyng achilles) only to later whine in all the following interviews about how hard it was to leave his “brothers”, the fans that showed him so much love and the city.
Fuck you Benedict Hartenstein.
And please Knicks fans make his ears bleed with boos in january, when the traitor’ll come back.
* The sequence in the last 10 months:
– No chance Masai does trade with us because of Dolan’s cause
– No way Brooklyn will trade Bridges to us.
– He’ll never break the Nova Boys
Nice streak! š
** I know I’m fairly naive but sooner or later we must start a discussion about the morality of paying a player half million a game or more (no matter the sport) when all the “western democratic countries” struggle to sustain a decent welfare (health, education, pensions) or workers salaries, job security and health safety in many environments.
I expect Thibs to go with Hart, his rebounding skills will cover a bit for the loss of Randle and I-Hart/Mitch, but the the coach bearded version is different so who knows… š
Well, Deuce brings better shooting (even if he’s not as reliable as DDV), but that’s a very small backcourt for a lineup where KAT is your center. Hart brings more size and versatility, but teams won’t guard him as a shooter. On the other hand, if the other four guys in that lineup are Brunson, Mikal, OG, and KAT, does that matter?
So I would guess Hart starts, and Deuce comes off the bench with Precious, Kolek, and… Shamet? Mook? Chuma Okeke?!?!?! Dadiet?!?!!?!?!!?!?
At least until Mitch is back, and maybe even after, we’re pretty thin. Though now it makes slightly more sense that we had multiple vets sign for what seemed to be one end-of-bench spot. The FO knew they’d need some kind of depth pieces.
(For those who missed it, Bates-Diop is going to Minnesota in the deal, DaQuan Jeffries is going to Charlotte, and we may need to send out one more slightly above minimum free agent to make the math work with the aprons.)
So out of the 9 rotation players that began last season, 3 remain. And I predicted 50 wins last year, and will top that this year. Extraordinary.
well there goes my backup PF plan
Precious is our backup big man for now. Or him and Mook together.
We’re a bit thinner at the moment on the wing, though you have to assume that, when healthy one of OG and Mikal will be on the floor at all times. And maybe there’s lightning in a bottle from one of Shamet, Dadiet, or Okeke as the ninth man?
But certainly, the “we don’t have enough minutes for all these guys” problem has been alleviated. High-risk, high-reward move.
Honestly, I don’t see how you can dislike this trade unless you’re a Randle superfan. KAT’s shooting and ability to play the 4 and 5 are going to open up the offense. And for all of KAT’s defensive deficiencies he’s probably a little better than Randle on that end.
We all love DDV but post-Bridges trade we had a huge logjam at guard and wing and I can’t imagine DDV was going to be happy playing under 20 MPG which was what was probably going to happen this year.
On the Minnesota side, I’ve read some reports that they’re not actually interested in Randle and plan on moving him again within the week.
This is legitimately, 100% unhinged.
Wow, that’s wild! It’s 4 if you count Deuce but still. I guess that’s what happens when you make 3 blockbuster trades over the course of what, six months?
I fell asleep reading you guys on baseball and woke up to WTF?!
Lions and tigers and KAT, oh my!
Welcome to the strange new world, KBA!
One thing’s for sure: Knickerblogger is going to be a lot busier over the coming weeks than it was for the last couple of months.
Haha. My brain is blinking ārecalculating ā¦ recalculating.ā
Do we think Randle or KAT plays more games this season?
Gonna really miss DDV, but clearly no āNova lockā on Leon.
LOL. Deuce beware?
PS – did we somehow become less ārootableā?
One of Macri’s commenters raised an interesting point: we probably could have gotten Kessler or another good starting center for DDV, once we were willing to put him on the table. So then it’s a matter of which is more valuable for our particular roster: Julius + Kessler, or KAT?
Wait. If/when Mitch plays *with KAT. Twin towers re-dux?! Are we allowed to do that š
But … January-Platonic-Ideal-Knicks, we hardly knew ye …
From Zach Harperās trade analysis:
āTowns is too aggressive going for blocked shots and not timely enough to actually affect the shot. That leaves the offensive boards open for the opponent. He also struggles with help positioning and rotations when heās the primary defensive big man. Thatās the biggest part of Thibodeauās defense with his big men.ā
You could easily substitute āTownsā and replace with āMitchell Robinsonā. The fact that Thibs has said on multiple occasions that he loves KAT might signal that he thinks he did something wrong with KAT the first time around, learned and applied that to Mitch, and thinks he can do it to KAT as well on defense.
And offensively- forget it. KAT at the 5 is going to make this team unguardable. Porzingis is great at the 5 but KAT is a much better offensive player than KP is.
We can literally put 5 40% 3 point shooters on the floor at once if we put Brunson Deuce Bridges OG KAT on the floor. The rebounding might be iffy with that group (Donteās rebounding was huge for us too) so you could substitute hart for deuce and it would still be amazing offensively.
Shew! Alot to unpack for me since I crashed early. Long week. But let me first try to go through the negatives IMO, then put a positive spin on it.
I like KAT as a player, I just question the fit with the roster as it stands. For starters- even though I felt like DDV would get traded in a possible big move after his breakout and us adding Bridges, I did not want to break up the Nova Knicks. And as Hahn Solo pointed out, we lost alot of toughness in this deal. Alot. KAT has to be the starting 5 now, and that brings into question who starts at the 4. Do you trust Anunoby as a full time 4? And if you do, who plays the wing with Bridges? Hart? Deuce? Either way, we have lost our awesome bench. Or..dows Thibs start Achiuwa at the 4 now, and will he be a consistent enough defender to make up for KAT at the 5? I like the player a helluva lot more than I like the trade. Now the positive spin…
KAT should be back to his pre-Gobert days on offense with this move. And this means he will be destroying opposing 5’s all season. I’m here for it. It creates a super intriguing dynamic for us on offense. This definitely puts us right there with Boston on offense if we scheme properly. Or damn close at minimum. KAT seems to be a player who naturally passes more than Randle, but I still give the slight edge to Randle in the playmaking department. I think the fact that KAT gives the ball up a little more often bodes well for the offense. If Achiuwa starts and plays the same switchable D he played last season, Thibs’ scheme could be better this season. And what we lost in DDV’s shooting, we have made up for with KAT’s ability to stretch the floor and pull opposing bigs away from the rim- thus possibly making up for the offensive rebounding we’ve lost when Hartenstein walked and Mitch’s rehab got stretched out. DDV leaving opens up more minutes for Deuce and Hart, and I think this is a good thing. Especially If Deuce keeps playing free and takes another step. I expect Mitch to be the backup 5 permanently at around 20mpg when he returns. With his injury history, that maximizes his time on the floor and creates a big and versatile lineup when we want to overpower teams for stretches with Mitch/KAT/OG/Bridges or Hart/Brunson. Thibs can use that when guys like Embiid, Giannis, or Banchero are getting the best of us. So..KAT gives us another offense mismatch on most nights with more reliable shooting and floor spacing. That’s gonna be great for Brunson, Bridges, and Anunoby. I really think our offense will be largely unstoppable- especially with this trade being made before camp and giving the coaching staff time to work our the kinks. Hell- maybe Mark Bryant can do for KAT what he did for Ayton’s growth. If so, that is SCARY.
Overall, I’m still a ‘meh’ on this trade. Intrigued, but still ‘meh’. Too many questions right now. Also, does this mean we are in the market for another 4? Or does Mook and KBD both make the team now? Shamet too. Does he now make the team as emergency shooting? There’s a bunch of options now, I just don’t know if they’re all good and if Thibs is gonna be flexible enough to explore them all
Oh! I do wanna credit Leon for not giving up a bunch of good 1sts in his 2 big offseason moves. He improved the team without seriously overpaying
I’m now left with a glut of useless posts in my notes app ready to demand “small ball” this season. I’m furious. Hahaha.
At the end of the day, Julius leaves NYC with a Knick TS% of .553 and some of the most godawful playoff displays you’ll ever want to see. He never worked for me as a key part of a really good team.
I’d always advocated for him to be the main piece in these “superstar” trades but never actually thought Leon could or would pull it off. Massive kudos to him for pulling it off.
I expect the Wolves to move Julius before season’s end. I don’t see him making much sense there. He didn’t make sense here with the new Brunson and Ant is even more ball-dominant than Jalen.
We won’t know what to complain about until Pagliacci sings.
Hah. Just occurred to me: once the deal is finalized, weāll almost certainly have an open roster spot, and THEN we can use the TPMLE
Knick Fanduel championship odds fell from +900 to +750.
Just from a pure talent perspective, I’m honestly shocked KAT was gettable for this package. I’m aware his salary is insane but we’re still talking about one of the best scorers in the NBA who is not yet 29. We thought we were all out of ammo and instead we reeled in an incumbent all-star fresh off a very good playoff run.
It’s hard for me to find any critiques on our end as long as we’re willing to foot the bill. I will miss Donte and Randle as people and wish them well, but KAT is a pretty massive upgrade on Randle and all it cost us was a guy we were having trouble penciling in for more than ~22 minutes a night (and the DET pick, which, “our 2022 draft wasn’t that bad” gang, we’re up today).
A lot of people will understandably be worried about the defense, but…are we sure it even got worse? Is KAT any more exploitable than Randle? Randle is a little more mobile but it’s not like we trusted him to switch anyway. KAT is of course coming from the #1 defense in the NBA and YES I AM AWARE RUDY GOBERT EXISTS but in 1,176 KAT on/Rudy off minutes from the last two seasons the Wolves’ DRTG is a perfectly solid 112.8. I think he’s just gotten much better since the reputation set in. I may have talked myself into the idea our defense is better than it was yesterday.
It’ll be fascinating to see how we decide to deploy the roster, but all the options look pretty damn good to me! Brunson/Deuce/Mikal/OG/KAT? Sure. Brunson/Mikal/OG/Hart/KAT? Also sure. I guess I’m somewhat partial to the latter because I think Hart’s shooting is passable at the 4 and we might want Deuce’s shooting off the bench, but I don’t feel super strongly. We have a ton of really good players.
When Mitch gets back my guess is we move KAT to the 4 in the starting lineup, but continue to deploy him at the 5 regularly. Again, sure. There are no bad options here.
Vegas watch: our O/U improved to 54.5, and your New York Knickerbockers are now in sole possession of the 3rd best title odds at +750, and a hair away from 2nd (OKC at +700). The money men think we did very well and I agree.
I wonder though- what kind of reception is Randle gonna get when he returns to The Garden? I know DDV is gonna get a huge reception, but NY fans can be very cynical? Do we think he’s gonna get the thumbs down when Minny visits? lol
It started with Jacquez taking out Julius. That was maybe the sliding doors moment of all time.
Thereās a little bit of sadness on my end bc I really liked (and believed in) Randle. But also bc I believe that January Knicks formula was the way to build a championship team around Brunson and Randle (RIP Brundle). This is not that formula. Maybe itās better but I donāt knowā¦ largely because I donāt know about KAT. Heās better than Randle but do the pieces fit as well as they did with that old formula? We gain immense offensive ability but we lose the rim protection and the offensive rebounding.
I donāt doubt this is a good move, I probably just need to see the pieces fit first.
Random thoughts:
I know this trade means Thibs is ok with KAT but are we sure KAT is ok with Thibs? He definitely seems like one of the guys who voted for Thibs in that poll.
I know we have the culture to do for him what Boston did for Porzingis. But itās up to KAT to be willing. If it is at all possible for him to grow up, it should happen. But we canāt rule out obstinance on his part.
KAT can bang with the 5ās. As a one-on-one defender heās pretty good. No doubt whoās guarding Embiid. And perhaps heās a big enough star in his own right to not pick up those ticky tack fouls iHart accumulated so easily.
This makes us really thin and opens us up to the player overuse of last year. Weāre going to see game 7 rotations in January again, and all the cascading woes that come with that. I had no such concern with Josh and Donte on the bench.
FWIW I think we kept the better of the two Fugazi picks. The Washington pick converts to two seconds. The Detroit pick only converts to one.
I just realized: we traded both guys on this roster to inspire a Mike Breen double-ābang.ā
I woke up. I remembered this trade happened. My brain won’t stop screaming.
Not much left on the market. Fultz could be a rehab candidate but he likely wouldnāt get any playing time. Jae Crowder makes sense from a need perspective but is getting up there in age. Biyombo might help a bit in case Towns is a sieve at center.
I’m gonna go on record as saying I don’t like this deal. I’m not sure how much better KAT is than Randle. I have serious defensive concerns, and concerns about playing under pressure (even more than with Randle). I thought this was an at least ECF team with the previous construction. Now, i have doubts.
KAT should have been a knick in 2015 if we hadn’t fucked up the tank
Yeah Hubie, you’re right, I need to recalibrate my timeline.
Also, Julius’ injury and trade reminded me of another moment that caused a butterfly effect, KP’s injury.
Both never played a minute for the Knicks after being hurt and honestly that makes me sad, it sounds kind of cruel and lets a trail of unanswered “what ifs”…
I know what you mean, but this dream ended when Hartenstein left town. It was going to be very hard /impossible to get a Hartenstein clone for leftover bits and bobs. So they changed course.
I do think the plan is to slot KAT in next to Mitch but who knows anything anymore. The Knicks are a black box.
KAT gives Brunson a PnR partner that’s significantly more versatile than anyone else on the roster. Remember that Mitch was out for all of January and the Brunson/iHart PnR was our entire offense when Brunson went nuclear. Neither Mitch with his lack of range or Randle with his punch card computer processing speed could have replicated that dynamic. KAT doesn’t pass like iHart but that should be a deadly PnR combo.
It’s never as simple as “who got the best player in this deal” but sometimes it is. The Knicks got the best player in the deal, he fills a need and is a good fit. I really think this is going to help Brunson even more than the fit with I-Hart.
Towns is less of a shot creator than Randle. I think that means Bridges is going to be asked to do a little more off the dribble than we’d probably like if we were trying to maximize his efficiency, but I think he’ll be fine.
There may be lineups and matchups where Thibs decides to go big with a Mitch/KAT pairing, but I think KAT is more effective as a C and we have the perimeter defense to allow that. IMO, that’s the plan A.
After a good night of sleep, I still like this deal.
Yeah, I think KATās PnR skill is the big motivation after the outside shot. Pretty sure weāre gonna hear Clyde say āthe oldest play in basketballā a lot more this season.
10/10 times Thibsā solution is to bench the bad defender.
Heās not the kind of guy who invents new schemes. He demands rim protection and is willing to sacrifice offense for defense.
So if weāre playing Boston and KAT canāt protect the rim, weāre not inventing a scheme to fix that. Weāre going bench him and close with Mitch & Hart.
Iām pretty sure thatās what happened to KAT in the WCF. I think he spent a lot of closing time on the bench bc they had to close games with Reid & Rudy.
As of now, I think we have 3. Obviously we may have less when it’s all finalized.
(1) 15th roster slot was open
(2) Randle-KAT cancels out
(3) KBD goes out
(4) Donte goes out
If we do have 3, I’m guessing Morris & Shamet become roster locks. I suspect Okeke doesn’t have a firm hold on his spot.
Wouldn’t surprise me if we keep 15 open still… of course, there’s always Archie.
I just realized something in KAT’s favor. While he’s no Mitch, he has averaged around 1.5 blocks per game for his career and he’s historically been a better overall rebounder than Randle- moreso with offensive rebounding. Maybe this trade isn’t as bad as it feels. I’m with Hubert when he says
This still is undoubtedly the most talented team Thibs has had with the most options to play with than he’s ever coached. The onus is definitely on Thibs to use them properly. He has to be careful though. Our 2 highest paid players have injury concerns. Maybe KAT can stay healthy not chasing mobile 4’s around all game. Maybe, even at 6’7.5″, Anunoby is better suited as a stretch 4. Who knows, but I hope Thibs can figure it out in camp
I will say this, not sure how the bench plays out. I imagine we’ll have to do a lot of staggering as opposed to hockey switches. I can’t even fathom the “bench unit” per se. Payne/Deuce/Shamet/Mook/Precious? Yeah, no. Kolek being a certified Guy would help but we’ll probably have to make some minor moves here.
Thankfully, in the playoffs we go as far as Brunson/Mikal/OG/KAT/Mitch/Hart/Deuce take us, and I think they can take us very, very far.
Iām a little surprised you love this so much Strat bc it reminds me a little of the Jrue for Lillard deal you called out from the get go.
One note about Josh Hart. He was terrible from 3 last year, but his shooting was suspect from almost everywhere last year. He had an off year on offense. I think knee issues and maybe even becoming a father impacted him last year. Overall he’s not that bad from 3. He’s 34.4% including last year and his TS% is fine. So if teams are doubling Brunson inside all the space he’s sure to have with Towns, Bridges and OG, I think Hart is going to get a lot of wide open looks.
Looking at the play-by-play quickly, that does appear correct.
Hart isn’t a great shooter, but he’s better than both Randle & Mitch.
Even if you don’t think Randle’s shoulder injury affects him moving forward, KAT is a year younger and we should expect his game to age more gracefully than Randle’s.
This is a good trade.
Raise your hand if you thought the Knicks couldnāt trade with Raptors because they were suing them. (I did)
Raise your hand if you thought the Knicks couldnāt trade with the Nets because they were cross-town ārivalsā (I did)
Raise your hand if you thought the Knicks wouldnāt break uo the ānova boys (I did)
With OG and Bridges defending the wings the need for rim protection won’t be as extreme. And if it does become necessary, Mitch, OG, Bridges. KAT, Brunson is better offensively and defensively than any combo with Randle/DDV, IMO
I didn’t like the Jrue for Lillard swap mostly because the gap on the defensive end was so huge.
Depending on how you want to view this, Randle for Towns is probably a wash defensively, but KAT is much more efficient and a better spacer.
If you view it as KAT for I-Hart at C, on offense it’s a huge upgrade with better spacing and sliding OG to PF, adding Bridges, and inserting Hart back into the starting lineup I think mitigates the loss on defense.
I’m more worried that KAT is going to frustrate me at times with bad TOs like Randle and that I think Bridges is going to have to create more off the dribble and he may not be as efficient that way as I’d like.
I honestly never, ever thought this was a thing. If anything Leon has shown himself to be a coldblooded businessman to the extreme.
Brunson is out the door the second Shai becomes available.
Heās been getting them for a year and a half! Wide open looks are his kryptonite.
I think what could make this offense incredible is taking Hart off the three point line and using him in the Hartenstein role on offense. That will force teams to put their second best perimeter defender on Hart for switching purposes.
The screen setting you get from KAT is pretty important. That is something that was potentially going to be a sneaky hidden weakness for the team. Now, no problem! KAT is a prolific screener and he can punish you both as a roll man and in the pick and pop.
Another boring day in Knickland LOL.
Just trying to make sense of the rotation…
PG: Brunson, Payne, Shamet, Kolek
SG: Bridges, McBride,
SF: Hart, Morris, Dadiet
PF: OG, Achiuwa
C: Townes, (Robinson), Simms, Hukporti
I’m not sure how good our depth is. I love the starting lineup. The Knicks will put up points and they have two great defenders.
I love everything about Randles game and losing Dante really hurts. Both will be sorely missed.
lmao š
My point there was that he had a rough year last year and lost his confidence, but he’s better than that. I expect a rebound year. That won’t make him a great outside shooter, but he’s not Frank out there. š
I’m sorry but I don’t understand the reservations here. Randle hasn’t been a good or even engaged defender since 2020-21 and spends multiple possessions every game arguing with refs instead of playing defense. If our defense is worse, it’s only very slightly worse.
KAT is clearly the superior shooter and opens up the floor better for the rest of the team. And KAT is an actual 5.
The team definitely makes more sense now. Hart was actually more effective at the 4 than Randle. We saw it in the playoffs. It made no sense to have a guy who was a main cog on one of the best teams in the game being demoted to a bench role. It made no sense to have the guy with the most threes in the history of the franchise come to off the bench either. You needed a center and got a top 5 player. Itās an insanely great move. Leon is smarter than we are. Iāll root for Julius in Memphis lol
Aside from him tolerating Randle and RJ for years he literally coached Karl Towns before and that didn’t happen.
As Zach says,
‘If youāre scratching your head on this one, join the club. Itās kind of a bizarre trade in many ways, and itās a massive gamble for both teams.’
Plus not a fan of neck beards. At all.
Hartās a good shooter when he shoots but heās never going to be a gunslinger.
But thatās fine. We shouldnāt stand him on the three point line. He can set screens as well as Hartenstein did and heās an even better playmaker if Brunson gives him the ball back.
Think Draymond Green on the Warriorsā offense. Thatās what Josh Hart could do for a lineup of Brunson, Bridges, OG, KAT. Movement, screening, playmakingā¦ everything he does well. I think this could unlock the best version of Josh Hart.
I wonder if we’ll give McCullar a real look during the regular season as a backup to Josh
Morris is pretty strictly a 4/5 these days. GoNY. I also recalls Begley’s reporting that for the moment, Kolek is the backup point guard, Deuce is a backup 2, and Payne is in case of emergency. But that could change depending on preseason, obviously.
Correction. Top 5 at the position of center
On the last Lowe Post Ian Begley said he thought Thibs would lean towards starting the season with Sims starting at center and this is a much better option
HOW?! Please explain. Jrue’s value has always been his DPOY-caliber defense that he can play 1-4, doing a bunch of little things that don’t show up in the traditional box score, while being an average-ish shooter and offensive player; he’s been an advanced stats superstar, not traditional stats That doesn’t describe Randle at all whose entire value is his high usage and average-ish offensive output. This is nothing like trading Jrue for Lillard, it’s like trading Lillard for Lillard.
Leon Rose made a statement to the press when he took over as POBO, then disappeared from sight for eternity. His statement was this:
āNothing about this is easy, or quick, so I ask for your continued patience. What I promise you in return is that I will be honest and forthright. We will develop a plan that makes sense, both to jumpstart our short-term growth and ensure our long-term success. Our team will work hard, stick together and ensure we live up to the honor of wearing the New York Knicks jersey.
While I realize that there have been difficulties on the court, what has been remarkable to me is that your pride remains so strong, your loyalty undiminished. Rest assured, I will do everything I can to create a winning organization.
For the remainder of this season, I will work tirelessly behind the scenes while evaluating every aspect of the organization. Most immediately, we will support Mike Miller, his staff and our team, who have plenty of basketball left to be played this season. I want to thank Mike for his continued leadership and professionalism during this period.
Our team has young talent, significant future assets (including seven first round picks over the next four years) and an ample amount of financial flexibility in the coming years. Everyone ā from ownership to athletes, to staff and especially our fans ā wants this team to be a winner. We will have all the resources necessary to create a great organization ā one that supports our efforts to build a winning culture and gives Knicks fans, and the city of New York, the team you deserve.ā
I LOLed when the knicks hired this guy (you can read my work in the archives, if they still exist). I feel kind of bad about that now.
Hubert pointed this out yesterday, and I think it bears repeating:
If the Knicks can ever get to full health, with a healthy Mitch, they can throw two potentially devastating lineups at you:
Brunson/Bridges/OG/KAT/Robinson
Brunson/Bridges/Hart/OG/KAT
If they can get those lineups on the floor in the playoffs, they can compete with anybody.
Iām glad Randle got a bag from Sketchersā¢ļø before leaving town.
He won me over as a good teammate and a guy who at least kept trying to master the roles needed from him. And those roles changed a lot over the years!
He might even make an interesting sixth man/ball mover in Minny where thereās less pressure and a strong supporting cast. I wish him the best.
Once Mitch is back and healthy, I’d expect something like this:
PG: Brunson – Payne/Kolek
SG: Bridges – Hart – Deuce
SF: OG – Hart – Bridges
PF: KAT – OG – Hart
C: Mitch – KAT – Sims
The reports I read said that Minnesota isn’t planning on keeping him, that they’re planning on rerouting him to another team within a week.
Iām not sure re-routing Randle will be that easy, unless you just want a salary dump of sorts.
I think the Clippers could be an interesting spot for him. Iād hate to see him go to a rebuilding team as an expiring, though.
Even though heās a great player, Donte makes even less sense there. Ant is absolutely a SG and will play max minutes. Neither Donte or Ant make much sense at any other position, so how does that work? Maybe theyāll trade Donte, too, who knows?
I get that Minny sort of had to do this trade for money reasons, but itās tough to see them butcher the 2nd-best team in a very good Western conference.
Rerouting Randle to a 3rd team might be what is holding this deal up. I’m sure Leon has given Mn pointers on who to call… as we offered Randle to a number of other teams.
Alan,
I agree but don’t think Morris is a backup 5. Just working it out in my head he’ll just play the 4. When they signed Morris I posted how much I liked the signing. He’s older now (35) and his MPG were cut significantly last season but up until last year he was a 25 MPG player. He’s a dark-horse starter.
As for Kolek, we all love his game. How can you not? But he’s a rookie. Let’s see how fast Thibs moves him into the rotation.
I like the trade, FWIW. I guess I like it more if Towns ends up playing more at the 4 than the 5, but we’ll see.
As talented as Randle is, the guy is coming off a pretty serious injury, and I won’t miss all his bickering with refs while the rest of the team tries to defend in transition, and his very spotty D in general.
I will miss Divo, but I guess the Knicks are selling high on him.
Possible injuries could definitely be this team’s Achilles Heel, but I guess a lot of teams are the same, and it would have been the same concern with another year of Randle. They really need OG to stay healthy come playoff time.
Leon is effectively “rolling up assets” by which I meant giving up 2 good players for 1 better player or star player. Leon has done that twice now with RJ/Quickley for OG and Randle/DDV for Towns. I think that’s an important part of the hybrid method. I think you almost always want to come away with the best player.
Interesting stuff here from DJ Ace with Towns and Gobert with Towns as the PNR ball handler:
https://x.com/DJAceNBA/status/1796220423522123826
Randle was great creating corner 3s but Towns also is a pretty good passer. And just so much more efficient than Randle.
Thibs has shown he will play rookies when he perceives them able to contribute net to the group.
For IQ… that was immediately. With Grimes it was the middle of the season. With Obi, he never thought his offense made up for what he gave away defensively.
Very good chance that one gets revisited this season, but of course that ship has sailed.
Which is to say, I’m not convinced Hubert’s lineups wouldn’t be even better with the swap undone given the TO/Olympic RJ we’ve seen and what it might portend, and now that the Randle issue has been solved. Certainly the depth wouldn’t be as much in question. But we’ll see and of course that ship has sailed. Net-net, this is a very, very good team.
Gets revisited? Because of RJ 0.1 BMP, IQ’s 0.6 and their 35% win percentage after the trade?
Just letting other people speak my words, since I’m relatively speechless. This from MIchael Pina:
‘Remember: Townsās inability to anchor an above average defense was the biggest reason Minnesota mortgaged most of its future to get Gobert in the first place.’
Knicks are going to be a good defensive team though. Plus, Robinson is still here and now can take his time and not re-injure forcing his way back
Lol no we’re not. “This trade would not have happened without the single second round pick we threw in” is not a serious take that anyone wants to argue.
Dang, DaQuan got a 3 mil contract just for being in the right place at the right time. Good for him.
They had the 13th best defense in the league the year before they traded for Gobert.
Of course, it was a lot more PatBev/McDaniels/Vanderbilt than KAT. Normally I’d say our 3 wings will trounce any other trio in the league, but I’m actually not sure about those three.
Plus Towns showed he can play the 4 last season next to Gobert and Reid. Even if he can’t anchor a defense, he should still a better option at the 4 than Randle.
I wonder if we will move Mitch now? The Pels desperately need a center, and they could work out a 3-team trade where they send Ingram to the Pistons for Mitch and Hardaway Jr., and we would get Stewart and maybe even a future 1st. Iām sure Thibs would prefer Duren, but I doubt thatās possible.
Big questions for me:
(1) How good of a shooter is Donte?
If we regret this trade for non-injury reasons it’s because he goes nuclear. He was fantastic last year, what if he gets even better? More motion, more of a focal point, etc. Maybe he doesn’t regress, maybe he’s got another level just like Brunson keeps showing. Even playing at the same level may be enough to bridge the talent gap between Towns & Randle. He was really freakin’ good last year.
(2) Do we have enough non-Brunson playmaking?
Randle generates a lot of offense even if it’s as more of an innings eater. Even Donte was a capable ball handler and passer. Maybe the offense is better with the ball in Brunson’s hands on every possession, but I’m not sure he can hold up for an 82 game season like that. We’ll see what KAT & Mikal can do.
(3) Depth?
Having Donte was a great insurance policy for OG and could have alleviated Thibs’s minutes death march. Will Thibs trust Shamet/Morris/Payne/Kolek enough to avoid running guys 48min following an injury?
I’ll also just mention that I’ve been impressed (sic) with the glib “OG at the four!” commentary that one sees here. I do think he’d be great in most or at least many circumstances at that position, but it’s also worth remembering that three out of his seven seasons he’s played 50 or less games. It feels like extensive time at the four is a recipe for extensive time in street clothes.
Man this is such a puzzle. I look at one side of it (the offense) and I’m like “WOW.” Then I think of Tatum switch-hunting KAT on every single play in the postseason and I’m like “gulp!” If Dallas played KAT off the floor, Boston probably will, too. We’re probably going to close a lot of playoff games with Brunson-Bridges-OG-Hart-Mitch. Which is fine; we were probably going to do that anyway before this trade. I think that is Thibs’ ultimate Go-To-War lineup, and this greatly increases the probability that Mitch is available.
This guy is a terrific follow on “X”.
He has made a lot of good calls.
https://x.com/Eye4Impact_NBA/status/1810817209557524816
Sorry, i’ll catch up with all the comments in a bit, but for now…
What did just happened? š± I guess i must start saving š° to go to NY in May/June in time to watch the Knicks in the Finals again! š§”š
I’ve been thinking about that since you first mentioned it. I think Mitch will end up taking a seat there.
KP (or Horford since there’s a 70% chance he’s hurt) is going to drag Mitch out of the paint and mostly neutralize him anyway. So why not run KAT out there, trust in your lockdown wings, and force Boston to defend 5 out on the other end.
I’m more than fine with Mitch as the backup and occasionally using Mitch/KAT together, but I think if it turns out we need some scoring or something else off the bench, Mitch is the most likely trade asset eventually.
Remove all the picks and just focusing on the team on the court we exchanged DDV and Randle for Mikal and KAT.
Is that an upgrade? I think so but itās not a huge net upgrade.
We didnāt have a backup PG this year, and this year we have two pass-first backup PGs, one of whom (Payne) can score a little. Towns is a good pick and roll player, and you could probably pair him with one of the backups and get some quality PnR possessions going when Brunson sits. Mikal of course can create some offense too. I donāt think we will miss Randleās shot creation all that much. We brought in some guys who can pick up that slack.
The real big winner in all this might be DaQuan Jeffries. He’s going to Charlotte in a sign-and-trade which will make up the salary difference to make the trade worthwhile. I’ve seen reports ranging from $3M to $8.5M. He stepped in doggy doo.
You left out I-Hart.
That comparison gets tricky though because we are probably shifting OG’s position and J-Hart will probably start.
So do we like I-Hart, Randle, OG, DDV, Brunson or Towns, OG, J-Hart, Bridges and Brunson?
I think Bridges is an all around upgrade from DDV and Towns is an all around upgrade from Randle, but with the position shift its J-Hart for I-Hart. To be honest, it’s close, but I think J-Hart may be the better player even though I loved I-Hart.
DDV, Randle, and Hartenstein for Mikal and KAT.
EDIT: strat beat me to it.
Zeroing in on the playoffs, we didn’t have Randle or Mitch. So in the unlikely event of having good health:
In:
– Bridges
– Mitch
– KAT
Out:
– Donte
– Hartenstein
mixed feelings. was more pessimistic about randle at the 5 than most. just don’t think his strengths exploit the advantages you need to press here (running him in delay or in pnr) to outscore the inherent rim protection weaknesses. towns gets almost twice as many rim assists and is a better pivot and short roll passer (but a much worse iso corner 3 passer), screen setter and spacer, and gets you more bang for your buck in 5 out.
but i also think towns’ decision making improvement have been somewhat overstated, and even surrounded by solid wings he’ll give quite a big back on defense at the 5. many possible opponents will find a way to make life pretty hard on jalen/kat trying to hold up in hedge and drop pnr defense over 40 playoff minutes.
and with donte gone along with almost all of our tradeable picks, the team is fairly brittle/thin to adversity. a single rotation injury could be enough to turn us into a dog in an early playoff series now. towns being pretty mercurial and having gone through wrist/calf/knee injuries plus his contract leave no alternative if he takes a bad turn. admittedly, a team like this one has to take a lot of risk if the goal is to maximize upside, but the abject disaster possibility is suddenly more visceral.
our best playoff lineup seems better than before. but, like randle, I’m generally wary of KAT’s value relative to his productivity. and our position feels a bit knife edge. still should be a very hard team to deal with when healthy with KAT at the 5.
Not sure who Haralabos is talking about here, Randle or Towns.
https://x.com/haralabob/status/1840077443161375085?s=46&t=0wqff4cNt-sCGcDs-uMExw
I think itās Towns and yeah, I just canāt shake the feeling of impending disappointment. Canāt argue with the move really but I am worried.
I think some of you are massively underrating just how good KAT and Bridges are.
Owen, heās talking about Randle.
High risk, high reward
1) DV is duplicative and depth we could afford to sacrifice once we acquired Bridges. He is probably at his ceiling – which is fantastically useful – and our best trade asset by far on his contract .
2) Randle is seriously underrated, but Towns is unequivocally better on offense and a wash on D at worst. Randle has a much better contract, but is due for an extension, and there’s no guarantee his shoulder holds up. He’s also a year older than Towns, and is not likely to be as good at center.
3) while we lose depth, we add top-level flexibility and options. Against Boston we use Towns at the 5, against Philly we use Mitch. We can play very big, sliding OG down to the 3 (and Bridges is a big 2), we can go small, we can run, we can go 5-out, we can build a wall in the paint. We are vulnerable to a major injury, but so are most top teams, even OKC and Boston.
TL;dr we are now legit contenders – albeit with more risk that we suffer an injury that derails our season. But so it goes for the teams at the top. Best of all, we have a long window of convention. In four years I can imagine people getting tired of OKC and the Knicks meeting in the Finals.
Edit: I should add that I’m still kind of bummed. I loved both players, and they gave us a lot of good memories. If I’m able to be at their return games, I’ll give them each a standing O.
I wonder if Leon has plans to address the bench. If we want to set the tone with energy, defense, and hustle around Brunson- then we obviously start Hart. That would leave a huge hole on our bench. I’d honestly rather see how Achiuwa handles starting next to KAT with Hart and Deuce playing starter’s minutes off the bench. But if we do that- it leaves Sims as our backup 5 until Mitch is back. What does Thibs do? Don’t know how many backup forward minutes we can reliably squeeze out of Mook. Maybe Okeke shows the promise that got him his 1st rounder status, or Dadiet somehow cracks the rotation as a rookie on that 2nd unit.
Apart from that, I think Deuce gets as many guard minutes as he can handle with Payne and Kolek filling in here and there. And I love that for him. But if Hart starts- that starting 5 will be ridiculously good. But that bench? Serious drop-off. Maybe Hayward unretires for a role on our 2nd unit? That could be useful- I think lol. Maybe one of Houston’s backup forwards shake loose? That might work also
E, if we had kept RJ out of the OG trade he would have had to have been the outgoing salary in the Bridges trade. That might have saved us a draft pick but there’s no way we could have had RJ and Bridges.
Regarding Rama’s standing O, this from Katz:
“Only a couple of days ago, a contingent of Knicks executives traveled to the Bronx to support what was a big day for Randle. The power forward ā the same one who chose New York when no one else wanted to, who extended for below his market value so he could commit to the organization long term, who grew into a three-time All-Star and two-time All-NBA performer under Thibodeau, who helped resurrect a once-crestfallen franchise thatās now made the playoffs three times in four years and enters this season a contender for the first time in decades ā was the man of the day at a construction site not far from Yankee Stadium.”
I wonder whether Brunson had any inkling that his $ sacrifice would lead specifically to Towns becoming a viable trade option. And how he feels about it now that he’s third highest salary while being clearly the best player. Is it correct to assume this wouldn’t have been an option if Brunson took all he could get this year?
Jacob Toppin must be pretty pissed.
From a viewing pleasure perspective, I’m not in love with watching either KAT or Randle. Divo I loved watching and rooting for.
I am intrigued to find out how special this team might be on offense. The ceiling seems pretty high.
What I see little of here is how much better the construction this team is, how money comes into play. And lastly, feeings.
The Knicks had some composition issues: 1) No real starting center 2) There were too many shooting guards and there was a potential minutes crunch 3) Too many starting-level players.
Additionally, Randle’s contract situation is coming up with a 2025-26 player option. He wasn’t given the “C”, Brunson got it. Randle probably wasn’t eager to take a hometown discount. Now Towns, OG, Brunson, Bridges, Hart, Robinson and McBride are all signed for this year and next. That’s a good, well-balanced core.
Take note that DDV, Hart, Deuce and Bridges are all, really SGs and I haven’t even mentioned Dadiet or McCuller. But also, when thinking about DDV, why was he excluded from the Brunson-Hart podcast? He may have been on that Nova team, but he wasn’t treated as an equal by Brunson and Hart. Maybe it was that he’s dull but maybe he just didn’t hang out as much with the other guys.
So now we have a center that can hit free throws with the game on the line, a more balanced lineup and a roster that is set for the next 2 seasons.
Leon Rose knows what he’s doing.
“Leon could’ve gotten the same player for less if he just Negotiated Harder” continues to be a take I find lacking in evidence. Sure seems like the 2022 draft was a bet on the value of picks increasing in general, intentional or not, that paid off.
First thought after reading your comments is that i’m finding it funny that all of you seem to agree that this trade makes us now legit contenders, and yet some of you are not sure if this was a good move. Those two things can’t be together, and i think we are legit contenders now. So everybody can go get the champagne from the fridge, we’re here and we’ll be here for at least 4 years, if not more.
What a time to a be a Knicks fan! š§”š
Even if the pick weren’t an inconsequential throw in (which it is), there is not a single sane person who would prefer KAT at $50M to Jalen Williams at $4.5M.
This is the saddest, least-earned victory lap anyone has ever tried to run. This is the Will-Ferrell-is-streaking-naked-in-Old-School of victory laps.
Frankly, I like the bench a lot and I love the balance.
I think that a bench of Kolek(at the 1), Deuce(2/1), Achiuwa(3/4/5), Morris(4) and Mitch (5)/Sims (5/4) is a pretty solid bench. It’s good both on offense and defense. Only 3 or 4 of them will be in the post-season rotation.
Payne(1), Dadiet(2/3), Shamet(3) & Okeke (4) is a serviceable emergency tier and they you have McCuller (2), Topin (3/4) and Hukporti (5) – a guard, a forward and a center are on two-way deals.
Sure they can – that was the whole point of my post. We traded certainty for upside. It’s a gamble, but one we had to make if we genuinely want to contend.
Before getting to the trade, i’d like to thank Randle for his time with the Knicks, he’s a polarizing player and i wanted him out after the thumbs down season, but the way he came back from that moment and how he always tried to take the team further, sometimes even having all the hopes for the team on his shoulders, man i have to appreciate that. And also how he was the one to believe in us, and the one that brought us from the shadows to the light.
For all that, a big thank you to Julius! #OAKAAK
As I’ve said a million times, obviously if you plug-in Jalen Williams as opposed to “the value of the 11th pick in the 2022 draft as it was understood at the time,” you can argue the pick was more valuable than 98% of players/assets in the NBA.
You can use the same logic to say the 41st pick in the 2014 NBA draft had more value than 100% of players/assets in the NBA. I don’t find any of it convincing.
About the trade, i think this guy sums up exactly what i think.
https://x.com/APachecoNBA
I really like this trade. I am sad to see Donte go but KAT is a huge upgrade from Randle.
I think we need to bring in a couple more people for training camp to fight for spots. I do not have a ton of faith in Morris, Shamet, or Okeke. We should bring in Waters III, Troy Brown Jr., Stanley Johnson, and Covington to compete for those last couple spots as well.
Also, Lonnie Walker IV is on an exhibit 10 with Boston. There is a good chance he doesn’t make the roster. If he doesn’t, I’d love to pick him up. In fact, I’d sniff around right now, he might be a good TPMLE candidate. I am not sure how exhibit 10 deals work but I’m sure Boston wouldn’t hold him hostage if there was little chance of him making the final roster and he had real money available from somewhere else.
I agree that the rotation can be thin, but only if we have guys on the injury list. And with OG and Mitch, yeah, that’s a very “viable” scenario. But if we’re healthy, and assuming the 7 main players TNFH pointed out: Brunson/Mikal/OG/KAT/Mitch/Hart/Deuce. We just need to add Payne and Precious and this is a typical regular season 9-man rotation Thibs’ style. š
No, he was talking about KAT.
KAT was on the court for 522 minutes, off the court for 247. The Wolves were flat when KAT played (+0.4). They were 13.1 points better when KAT was off.
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIN/2024/on-off/
A legitimate championship contender regularly benched KAT in the 4Q throughout the playoffs and then kinda salary dumped him in the offseason. That is a fact we have to reckon with.
About KAT’s defense:
The comments on this thread so far are Exhibit A for why it is the best blog by a mile for team specific basketball analysis. Kudos to Mike K and all the moderators.
Nice of the Knicks to take attention away from the pathetic final Yankees homestand of the regular season.
That is incorrect. Brunson’s salary was already set this year so we still could have done this trade.
What Brunson’s sacrifice potentially does is keep us under the 2nd apron next year when it kicks in.
https://x.com/YossiGozlan/status/1840070401856287149
i will not be upset due to truths being stated…they are simply truths…
i’m gonna almost always root for our laundry – from all i know of Karl Anthony Towns he is a good dude…plain and simple…quirky, we all are, but not a bad dude at all…seems like a fun guy, it’ll be good when we win…he is an offensive weapon…
costs a bunch and was not as good a value for the wolves as naz reid…
in a nutshell, here’s my feeling though:
– when it worked, julius was hella fun to watch; i was eager to see him potentially pair with hukporti; true physical domination at times in the paint, who knows with the shoulder though
– donte was a crazy gamer, with crazy hops and attitude; would have made our bench a solid plus each game
– i think we just got softer
– KAT is a good dude, but, not so smooth to watch play, he looks like he’s always falling…shooting = falling, rebounding = falling, defending = falling…if he’s moving, he’s falling, awkwardly
– i have to hope our locker room is strong enough: jalen, josh, mikal, deuce, precious, OG to keep KAT focused on winning; good and bad, thibs should know him
– so, the whole lotta enthusiasm i had to watch mikal bring his beautiful smooth and seamless basketball game to the knicks – now i gotta watch him play with stumbling/bumbling KAT…
go get buckets Mister Towns…
Gotta take some risks/swings if we’re not upleveling with draft players – based on a vision. One reason you do the trade is to compete better w/ the Celts on 3 PT shooting. Hart + Julius or even Julius + Ragu are worse collectively than KAT and Bridges at 3P shooting, even with the record year from Ragu. Knicks can put a credible starting line up with all ~40% shooters on the floor.
Finals – 3 pointers, Celtics vs Mavs:
Game 1: 16 of 42 vs 7 of 27 (Celtics win)
Game 2: 10 of 39 vs 6 of 26 (Celtics win)
Game 3: 17 of 46 vs 9 of 25 (Celtics win)
Game 4: 14 of 41 vs 15 of 37 (Celtics lose)
Game 5: 13 of 39 vs 11 of 37 (Celtics win)
Total: Celtics – 70 threes Mavs – 48 threes
3 Pters – Knicks vs Celts
C: KAT (42%, 2.2 per game) / Porzingis (38%, 1.9 per game)
PF: OG (39%, 1.8 per game) / Tatum (38%, 3.1 per game)
SF: Bridges (37%, 2.7 per game) / Brown (35%, 2.1 per game)
SG: McBride (41%, 1.6 per game) / White (40%, 2.7 per game)
PG: Brunson (40% / 2.7 per game) / Holiday (43%, 2.0 per game)
The only time Minny outscored Dallas in the 4th quarter in that series was game 5, which they lost by 21 points. Maybe they should have played Karl more.
āIāve always been a Knicks fan,ā Towns, 19, told Yahoo Sports in a phone interview. āI never was able to afford passes to the games. We were able to afford cable and got the MSG channel so I could watch every Knick game. It made me more of a fan because I could watch every big game.
āMy best friend was a Nets fan so it made for a cool rivalry. My favorite player for the Knicks is a tie between Walt Frazier and Patrick Ewing, but I liked Patrick Ewing a lot. But Iāve never been to a Knicks game. I could never afford to go there.ā
From Begley’s trade analysis column ā all of it worth reading:
https://sny.tv/articles/knicks-notes-karl-anthony-towns-donte-divincenzo-timberwolves-trade
Cyber, āif your numbers are right, Stan says this deal is pretty sweet. Stan, you know, Grossman.ā
I’m sad about including Bates-Diop. I would have rather thrown in Sims as the final salary.
Also, isn’t this too soon after the Bridges trade? I thought newly traded players couldn’t be aggregated with other salaries in trades.
I’m really going to miss Donte, he was a very fun player to root for.
So if the salary cap numbers are right at Spotrac:
https://www.spotrac.com/nba/new-york-knicks/cap/_/year/2024
Then we have 12 players on contract for $185,351,521. That leaves only $3,579,479 left under the 2nd apron.
That isn’t enough for even 2 non-2nd round pick minimum contracts. We could theoretically sign one of either Hukporti or McCullar Jr. to a standard contract starting at $1,157,153 which would leave enough for one vet at the minimum of $2,087,519 which would open one more 2-way spot but it would still lock us at 14 players on the main roster with less than half a million under our hard cap.
That could be a problem.
Silly me… I thought the reason Dallas beat Mn in five was because Luka and Kyrie put up 63, 52, 66 and 72 in their 4 wins with Conley and Edwards as the primary defenders.
In this thread we also learn the T Wolves are the paragon of slick management. Cool.
There are numerous ways to look at this, but I believe the Knick’s management must believe their talent on wing defense can be brought into play to ameliorate KAT’s defensive weaknesses. His offensive efficiency is inarguable.
This is why they play the season.
Do we know for sure that KBD and Jeffries are the only guys going out for cap purposes? Now that literally every dollar counts I wish we stashed Dadiet, which I assumed was the plan initially.
If it comes down to McCullar or Hukporti, I’d probably rather have an extra enormous guy on hand.
If there is one thing this FO is good at, it is bean counting and making salaries work. Iām sure theyāll figure out a way to field a complete roster of salaried players.
I think we have no choice but to convert one of Hukporti or McCullar Jr. to a standard contract starting at $1.1-1.5 million. I don’t see a way around it. We need at least 14 rostered players and we don’t have room for two minimum veteran contracts and there is no wiggle room barring another trade.
So that means we have room to sign one more player.
We brought in Okeke, Shamet and Morris to compete for that spot. Who should we keep? One of them or someone else? Out of those three I’d choose Okeke since he is a good defender and is the only one with any upside potential. I’d also love to see who shakes loose after roster cuts. If Walker IV is cut I’d choose him, Fultz could also be a decent flyer.
Okeke/Shamet/Morris is a legitimately tough call, though I will repeat I’m glad we’re choosing between bona fide fringe NBA players and not DaQuans and Duanes and Snoopy characters.
-Okeke: easily highest upside (which is to say not that high but the competition is Landry Shamet and Marcus Morris), but we might want to index more heavily on bankable NBA skills at this point.
-Shamet: Soup Kitchen Donte can definitely shoot, but does leave us thinner than I’d like upfront.
-Mook: I can see the argument that he can also definitely shoot and shore up the front court a bit, but I think I lean Shamet because Mook might just be completely washed and unplayable.
If Lonnie (I do first names with guys I went to college with) is cut we should scoop him up extremely quickly. Last year’s version would be our 8/9th man on the merits.
Morris is totally washed, probably would take Shamet because he has a legitimately valuable skill.
The reason I like Okeke more than Shamet or Mook is that all he is missing from being a rotation quality NBA player is consistency on his 3 point shot. He is pretty good at everything else and is a plus defender. He shot 39% on 229 3’s in college and is a 79% FT shooter so it seems possible that his outside shot could come around.
Mook and Shamet while both much better shooters are pretty poor defenders at this point. Mook because of age and Shamet because he’s always been bad. If we really want a proven vet then I think Covington is still available and while he’s also lost a step I think he has more left in the tank than Mook and is straight up better than Shamet.
Walker IV is my best case as well. But there might also be a couple other surprising cuts after training camp.
Well we waived Morris and Okeke
I guess Shamet is the winner!
I’m a mixture of excited and emotionally gutted with this trade. About the same feeling after the OG/RJ/IQ trade, honestly.
RIP Nova Knicks (2024-2024). I was looking forward to seeing what the power of friendship could do against the higher star power of the other top East teams. But at the same time, the Knicks going overnight from a playoff team with an intriguing underdog strategy to a real deal championship contender is an outcome I want.
It’s crazy that we added both Mikal Bridges and KAT in one offseason.
KAT was born in 1995, there were no big games for him to watch that he could possibly remember. Heās obviously a pathological liar and a sociopath. What has Leon done!?!
I suppose we could bring Mook and/or Okeke back on new Exhibit 9 contracts once the trade goes down, right? We just need to clear roster spots so we can briefly put guys like Duane Washington and Charlie Brown under contract before shipping them to the Hornets. There’s still only going to be one final roster spot, but maybe the 2Mook2Morris dream isn’t wholly dead already?
(Hi, it’s me. I’m the one always dwelling on our last two roster spots when there’s much more important stuff to talk about. I’m the problem. It’s me.)
Alan, you’re not the only one today who talks about Duane Washington Jr., but he’s actually playing in Serbia with Partizan Belgrade (Yes, he’s playing with Frank! And Poku too…), I think he’ll not be involved in the trade š
Anyway I’m pretty sure Brock and Leon have all the moves lined up to complete the move, just like they were with the Mikal trade.
Hollinger and a few others have pointed out that the Knicks could easily pay Partizan a buyout, give Washington a contract, send him to Charlotte, and then the Hornets waive Washington and he goes right back to Partizan. Apparently, they can only sign-and-trade players who were on the roster last season in a deal like this, so it has to be some or all of that trio, if we don’t want to trade a rotation player.
Though if it winds up being Sims, I wouldn’t be that sad.
I havenāt looked at all the details of KATās on/off.
However, I think KAT has more impact at C than at PF because of the way he spaces the floor for everyone else on offense. Also, next to Gobert he had less space for himself.
Iām not sure what the data suggests defensively, but I predicted heād have some issues defending from the PF position.
I thought the Gobert/Towns pairing was going to be problem. They wound up outperforming my expectations, but I still donāt think it was ideal.
I think Towns, OG, Hart, Bridges and Brunson is pretty solid even if not perfect. Maybe Towns will be a bit of an issue on defense, but I donāt think it will be a huge problem. I think the issue is more mistakes than ability. Iāve seen him defend really well against some of the best Cs in the league both inside and outside.
LOL
That’s the new Merriam-Webster Dictionary’s definition of gaming the system…
And yes, he has a 500K buyout clause in his contract, so maybe Brock isn’t only a magician, he’s an evil genius… š
https://x.com/CrumpledJumper/status/1839893932915970225/photo/1
On Macri’s pod they mentioned how beloved Donte became despite only being on the team for one year, which got me thinking about my own personal one year Knick power rankings (important caveat that I am one of Donnie’s Sociopaths–a big Knicks fan born in 1995):
1. Donte
2. Jeremy Lin
3. Shawne Williams
4. Chris Copeland
5. Ronny Turiaf
There have certainly been one-year guys objectively better than some on my list, but the vibes in the Phil and Mills eras were so cursed I have no positive association with them. Sorry Mook, but thanks for Quickley.
Thanks Alan!
According to the rumors Jeffries is almost a certainty, let’s see who are the next two.
P.S.
I think it’s a fait accompli that we’ll need to add a bunch of 2nd rounders for the trouble…
For me favorite 1 year Knick aside from DDV has to be the X-Man.
Just a thought, does Randle’s trade kicker get us closer to the $49 million? Because if that counts in the trade we would only need to move $1,825,524 to Charlotte which Jefferies contract would easily cover.
As for cutting Morris and Okeke, I don’t think it is a big deal but I really do not think that Shamet should be the answer. Okeke seems like a much more complete player with more positional flexibility and he can defend well. Also he has shot 39% from the corner 3 in his career and is a good free throw shooter so I think there is shooting upside. Shamet is not going to suddenly become a complete player. He is a poor defender and doesn’t really bring anything but a jump shot.
The perfect player would have been KBD it would have been great if we could have kept him. I would have rather moved Sims.
The Mets have figured out new and exciting ways to utterly ruin what was an unexpectedly entertaining season.
Never change, Mets. Never change.
Kris Pursiainen
@krispursiainen
The New York Knicks are receiving and taking calls on center Mitchell Robinson, their longest tenured player. Sources familiar with the situation say the likelihood of a deal is unknown but the team seems to be willing to make another move after the blockbuster add of Karl Towns.
Mets will sweep the doubleheader vs the Braves on Monday, the plan was always to clinch on the last day of the season.
Wow, it wouldnāt shock me if Mitch is traded for a solid bench player. I mentioned that as a possibility but I thought it was more likely at the deadline after he comes back. By then his value will be reestablished and weāll know what we need. Iāll be fine either way as long as I like the player coming back.
Having the best record in MLB since May then losing the last six games of the season and missing the playoffs is peak Mets
Well despite all my bitching and moaning over the past 3 months the Yankees are the 1st seed in the AL for the first time since 2012.
Astros are once again the only team in the AL that can stop them from finally getting back to the World Series, hopefully someone from the AL Central can miraculously beat them before they reach the ALCS.
I wouldn’t be all that confident in a series vs the Orioles.
They’ll beat the Orioles. Cole can pitch Games 1 and 4 on normal rest while Burnes I assume won’t start until Game 2. But they better win that series in 4 games cause I won’t like our chances beating Burnes in a Game 5.
Mets pitchers have struck out 18 Brewers through 8 innings, but they’ve also given up 6 runs, while the Mets have mustered only 2 hits.
What’s hard to watch about these last 3 losses is how totally noncompetitive their offense has been. They all look like deer staring in headlights.
I feel like every player weāve ever heard whispers of being shopped got moved eventually, so I afraid Mitch wonāt be here for long.
I am not emotionally ready to go that far, though. We have lost so much with Donte, Randle, and Hartenstein. Even IQ & Grimes felt like hard losses. I donāt know that I can handle more.
I am afraid this team will feel like a beautiful woman who got too much plastic surgery.
Only player that really matters is still a Knick and that’s Brunson. KAT, OG and Bridges will be here too next few years so I think this core we’ll be able to get emotional attached too for better or worse. I think it’ll definitely be for the much better.
Randle was an important player for us during his tenure, but thereās a pretty strong chance he never gets back to what he was after that shoulder injury, and he has also been quite frustrating at times. DDV and Hartenstein both had relatively short tenures here so I canāt get all that sentimental about them.
The core we have locked in now should be the core for the next 3-4 years, and I donāt think Iāll have any problem rooting for those guys. Iām perfectly happy going to war with this core of players, and I think we will probably see some roster stability with this group going forward.
If the perennially injured Mitch can be moved for a more productive and reliable piece, then you have to do it. I got on Leonās case a lot for being too risk averse, but he has proven without a doubt that he understands risk/reward ratio and win curve. He has earned his flowers.
Excellent, we have a 29-year-old Knick fan in the audience! Please tell us, young man, which ābig gamesā did you watch on MSG as a kid? (The credibility of the newest Knick depends on this:)
Surely Towns is talking about Mar 28, 2008, when Jared Jeffries scored a career high 21 against the Chris Bosh led Raptors in a loss
No wait, that was in Toronto. My bad.
So must be Apr 17, 2013, when Chris Copeland dropped 33 on the hapless Hawks