[ESPN] – Mon, 08 Apr 2024 19:27:00 GMT
- Knicks fined $25,000 for violating injury reporting rules
- Knicks fined $25K for violating injury reporting rules
- New York Notes: Knicks, Robinson, Watford, Clowney
- Knicks fined for violating injury reporting rules regarding Mitchell Robinson
- NBA fines Knicks $25,000 for violating league injury reporting rules
[New York Post] – Tue, 09 Apr 2024 00:56:00 GMT
Knicks’ Jalen Brunson was in disbelief over John Calipari news
[Yahoo Sports] – Mon, 08 Apr 2024 19:18:26 GMT
Caitlin Clark’s WNBA future, the Bucks’ problems & the Knicks’ playoff path with Monica McNutt
[New York Post] – Tue, 09 Apr 2024 00:28:00 GMT
- Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson still navigating rust after lengthy injury absence
- After ankle surgery, Mitchell Robinson’s defense is back before his rebounding: ‘I’ve just been trusting what the doctors have been saying’
- Mitchell Robinson Upgraded To Available – NBA News | Fantasy Basketball
- Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson sits out against Thunder with sprained left ankle
- Mitchell Robinson (ankle) questionable Tuesday for Knicks
[The Athletic] – Mon, 08 Apr 2024 13:53:12 GMT
- Despite losing skid, Bucks have ‘belief’ in what they have and what they can do
- A heaviness has been hanging on the inconsistent Bucks all season
- Monday Morning Media Roundup: The Milwaukee Bucks remain inscrutable, and more
- NBA Rumors: Doc Rivers Held Film Session to Allow Bucks Players to Speak Their Minds
- Central Notes: Bucks, Middleton, Cavaliers, Donovan, Pistons
[New York Post] – Tue, 09 Apr 2024 01:16:00 GMT
- Breaking down Knicks’ complicated playoff possibilities with most seeds still in play
- Ranking First-Round Matchups for the Knicks
- First quarter woes send Knicks spiraling with playoffs in jeopardy: ‘Our margin of error is very tight’
- Knicks playoff picture: Breaking down New York’s seeding scenarios in 2024 NBA bracket
- Knicks’ upcoming week: April 7-13
[New York Daily News] – Mon, 08 Apr 2024 16:30:24 GMT
Jalen Brunson’s ascent to MVP candidacy continues with another masterclass against Bucks
[Daily Knicks] – Mon, 08 Apr 2024 21:00:00 GMT
Jalen Brunson reveals the hilarious secret behind Knicks’ elite chemistry
[Heavy.com] – Tue, 09 Apr 2024 03:12:00 GMT
Knicks $20M Trade Prize Could Be Scratched From Playoff Rotation
95 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2024.04.09)”
Given the magic number is 1 against Philadelphia and Miami, do the Knicks clinch the 6th seed with a win tonight?
Yup, since they own the tiebreakers vs Miami and Philly a win tonight guarantees the Knicks avoid the play in. It would also match last season’s win total.
I don’t get the gnashing of teeth with Zach Edey. He is huge, has great hands and footwork, a real post game where you can throw the ball into the post and he can punish people, and he seems perfectly willing and able to pass it back out.
His college numbers playing in a tough conference are video game like. BMP 16.8, Ts% 65.9, Usage 33.4%, Ws/48 .336 Per 39.8.
How many guys put up 37 in the championship game efficiently where he’s the ONLY offensive option on the floor?
He is 100 times more skilled offensively than Mark Eaton who was glacially slow with not 10% of Edey’s offensive skill set and he had a fine career.
With two picks around 20 I’m taking him 100 out of 100 times if he’s on the board. I can take a flyer on the next athletic workout king later.
I like Edey as well, but I guess any “gnashing of teeth” about him surrounds a couple of things: 1) his lack of mobility on both offense and defense and 2) he doesn’t shoot 3s…….like, at all (1-for-2 in 138 college games). Not sure that works in today’s NBA unless you’re Andre Drummond…….but then again, I wouldn’t mind having *him* on our bench, either. Maybe we could pick Yves Missi out of Baylor with one of our first-rounders and get much of the same thing as we’d get with Edey. But he’s only played one season in college, and is much more of a project than Edey.
One thing is for sure, though: If we *do* want Edey, we’re going to have to take him in the first round.
Yes, I know that neither IHart nor Mitch shoot 3s, either. But it would be nice to have a big man who does shoot one every once in a while. Like Naz Reid, Myles Turner, or……..dare I say it…….Bobby Portis.
Respectfully (I.e., not rhetorically): Did you watch the game last night? If he’s getting abused by the likes of UConn, imagine what defending at the nba level will look like for him. On offense he can’t actually pass , with a sub 1.0 AST/TO ratio (though it’s hard to tell his actual ability here given how heliocentric he is.) Luka Garza also had video game numbers at Iowa and imo had a more projectable NBA game and he’s a third string center at best. Edey’s college record is better than Garza’s, but I think his ceiling is a good version of Boban, which is not the sort of player who can be a starting center on a good team.
I like Edey in the 2nd round partly as Mitch or I-Hart insurance and to give the bench a different look when the offense gets tough. I am not expecting him to learn to pass, shoot the 3, or move in space however. He would be a waste of a first rounder in my eyes.
To be clear, I wasn’t saying that I think that we *should* pick him in the first round. I more meant that if the Knicks brass decide they want him they wouldn’t be able to wait until the second round and still expect to get him.
Doogie,
I think that’s right. If we want him, he’s probably outplayed our early 2nd just enough such that we would have to trade into the late first to acquire him. I don’t think the juice is worth the squeeze at that point, though I can see mileage varying depending on what you think of the other guys available in the mid/late first round.
Edey will dominate the Australian League for the next decade….
I kid. I think he will have a decent NBA career as a bench big eventually.
Thanks BBA.
@BrunsonPeroneusLongus
Pretty much everything you said was also true of Jahlil Okafor and he’s been out of the league for 3 years now. Edey’s worth a taking a flyer on in the 2nd round but he could just as easily be out of the league in a few years.
Ok so apparently just a win tonight doesn’t clinch because of a possibility still remaining of a 3 way tie for 5-6-7 at 47-35 between the Knicks, Magic and Heat which for some reason would mean Knicks finish 7th.
FWIW I watched the Bucks game Sunday with a friend of mine who is a Purdue alum and watched most of their games. He wants absolutely nothing to do with Edey at the next level, and would be shocked if we drafted him. “Total waste of a pick,” was his assessment.
A couple of the toughest remaining games to predict are on the schedule tonight: Orlando at Houston, Boston at Milwaukee.
Our game seems pretty easy to call… no fucking way we lose twice to these guys.
Edey should be able to score in the NBA. Yeah he’s bigger and stronger than everyone in college but he’s also going to be bigger and stronger than everyone in the NBA too. I don’t watch much college ball anymore but what I have seen of him he looks really slow. He’s like a better version of Boban?
Zach Edey is 6 inches taller than Luka Garza and Jahlil Okafor (each, not combined)
That is correct. Although we have the tiebreaker against Miami, they have the tiebreaker against Orlando and so they’d be division champions and 5th place. Then we have the non division champions, and Orlando owns the tiebreaker against the Knicks.
Except for 5 inches in height and 5.5 inches in wingspan.
And not even in the same galaxy statistically:
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/zach-edey-1.html#all_players_advanced
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/jahlil-okafor-1.html
he (edey) reminds me of Poeltl…i thought Poeltl would be a bust and he carved out a niche…but I think that’s his ceiling…he’s bigger/taller but slow AF….
I would imagine there’s a long career for Edey in the NBA, either as a solid backup (he would just destroy bench mobs) or as a limited starter. You think of the centers out there now who mostly start — Vucevic and Valenciunas can hit threes but they’re slow as molasses, and then there’s Kessler, Zubac, Adams and Nurkic. Edey has a significant size advantage on all of them.
thanks BPL, I couldn’t remember the name of the player he reminded me of – mark eaton was it…
stiff…
They’re not? Are you sure we’re looking at the same numbers? Because Okafor’s numbers as a freshman are far better than Edey’s as a freshman and Okafor’s eFG% and TS% would be the best and 2nd best of Edey’s college career.
As freshman, Okafor has better ORB%, AST%, STL%, TOV%, WS, WS/40, and BPM. Edey has better DRB%, TRB%, and BLK%.
Edey’s career will be fascinating to observe because to succeed as anything more than a depth big he’ll basically have to upend the offensive paradigm in the NBA. He can probably diversify his offensive game a bit, but it’ll always be post-up dominant. That’s obviously a major issue in today’s NBA…but is it possible he’s simply good enough to justify a ton of post up touches? I wouldn’t rule it out. There aren’t many NBA centers I can think of who could defend him one-on-one, and he’s pretty good at finding open shooters and cutters.
Defensively he’ll always be something of a liability against teams that can pull him out of the paint, but as a rim protector I think he can be pretty disruptive.
I don’t know what it all amounts to, I could see a range of outcomes spanning from CBA legend to borderline NBA all-star. I’d think about drafting him after the top-10 or so in this draft.
The fact that Edey’s free throw shooting makes him decidedly unhackable is a pretty important differentiator between him and some of the common cautionary tales.
Okafor specifically was also totally uninterested in rim protection and passing, and was simply not enough of a post threat in the NBA to justify sending help. I don’t think any of that will be true of Edey, but it’s possible NBA defense still renders his post-ups inefficient and then the whole idea crumbles.
Geo… you can call Mark Eaton a stiff because he didn’t shoot 3’s and wasn’t skilled at all offensively, but Utah was 30-52 the year he arrived, yet made the playoffs 10 consecutive years where he was DPOY twice, runner up twice and third once in an era with David Robinson, Hakeem and Ewing and played 79 plus games 10 consecutive years, averaging 28.8 mpg. We could use a stiff like that.
Someone needs to teach Edey not to swipe at the ball when trying to block shots. Going straight up is formidable enough.
I know one thing… at 7-4 with a 7-10.5 wingspan and 290 lbs, you aren’t guarding that little jump hook with Marcus Smart (like he stopped early KP) or 6-6 Draymond. He has major touch in the 8 foot area.
And, as you stated he has shot 70% on almost 1,000 college free throws so he can be on the court anytime and is “unhackamitch”
A stiff like that is a lot more useful in a league where there are like 40 players who can actually shoot. The league shot .336 from deep in his final season in 1993 and every single team this year is well over that mark.
Edey looks like a good gamble. Count me in.
Especially since we’re unlikely to re sign Hartenstein. He is now a top 15 player in EPM rankings and he’s poised to have a great playoff run with all the JB trapping and this new offense thibs is running. With no Randle, RJ and IQ, – this is no longer iso heavy offense. First it was DDV & now iHart is thriving offensively showcasing dormant passing and scoring skills.
Once again with Hartenstein, yesterday’s overly pessimistic Pagliacci take becomes tomorrow’s Knickerblogger consensus. He is as good as gone, and at this point every good thing he does is bittersweet because we’ll never have this team at full strength.
I even saw a thread on OKC’s subreddit where those little fuckers are plotting to steal him specifically.
The prospect of drafting the next Boban Marjanovic is pretty cold comfort. We really should have secured his Bird rights, the signs were there in his Clippers stint that he could break out. Sigh.
Thanks BBA and Cyber. The possible 3 way tie sucks. Alright, let’s see them win tonight and go from there.
Backup C is not a huge priority.
We have two Cs that can start and a couple that can be 3rd string.
It was an issue for a few games this year because both Mitch and I-Hart were out, but it wasn’t a major debacle.
It will become an issue IF one of Mitch or I-Hart is gone next year, but I just read that I-Hart said he wants to get extended in NY and hopes they can work something out in the off season because he loves it here. He wants to stay and I have to think management realizes he’s a better fit with our current starters than Mitch. I doubt he wants to go to OKC.
Unless they trade one of the two (which imo is more likely to be Mitch), we need to focus on long wings and backup PGs.
I don’t think so.
The primary paradigm today is shooting 40% from three is better than 50% from 2. Generally, the PnR is used to get the defense switching and running around to find an open 3 ball shot.
If you have a guy who demands a double team in the post, you get the defense running around that way. He can pass out of the double team over the top of the defense at 7-4. He has as good an NBA ready post games as good as anyone not named Jokic.
There is more than one way to skin a cat. I agree his out comes are wide.
You mentioned Boban again just before I was about to do the same. Boban can seemingly score in the low post with ease whenever he’s on the floor…….but he’s such a liability otherwise that he can never get on the floor.
Lol, y’all are wild. Isiah isn’t leaving. We’re one move and a healthy team away from contending for a title and he’s our starting Center. He’s not going to the fucking Pistons. He loves it here. The team will figure out a way to keep him.
Mark Eaton probably wouldn’t be real playable in the modern NBA. There are just not any slow-footed defense-only players in the league anymore. He was an effective player in his time but that type of player has gone the way of the dodo bird.
Edey of course is not a defense-first player, the hope with him is that post-up centers are so rare that maybe you’d have some kind of market inefficiency with him, and that he’d be difficult to stop for the simple reason that there are no more Mark Eatons in the league to slow him down. Most likely Edey will be a situational player— against some opponents he’ll probably be able to score almost at will, to the point where it outweighs his slow-footedness on defense. Against teams that have mobile bigs who can stretch the floor he might not be playable. I don’t see him as a 35 MPG workhorse in the NBA.
Every free agent player says their #1 choice is the current team. He’s worth $27M+ entering his prime age 26-30 and we can only pay him ~$17M. Add NYC taxes and base case probabaility scenario says he’s as good as gone with sign and trade option off the table.
That high? I know we should go BPA in the draft, but we have other needs and i don’t think we’ll regret not taking on Edey more than not solving those needs.
None of these things affect Hartenstein’s bottom line. He has never had a big NBA contract and may not have another shot at one.
If the Pistons offer a $100m bag he’ll laugh all the way to the bank. This is a job for these guys, they aren’t Knick fans who have pined for a title run for 50 years. None of us would pass up $10m/year to stay at a job we like, this is pure copium and wishful thinking.
Didn’t check it thoroughly, but i think we’ll clinch the 6th seed if we win and the Heat lose in Atlanta. So it’s possible to clinch it tonight. 😉
I remain cautiously optimistic about iHart, but the Hornets scare me. If they let Bridges walk they can make a $20M+ AAV offer, and I don’t really see why they wouldn’t.
However, since they didn’t trade Bridges it would be mind boggling if they let him walk, hence the cautious optimism.
I just don’t see it for the other cap space teams.
Philly: breaking the bank for a pure backup to an MVP caliber player would be unwise. Sure, the injury insurance would be great, but if Embiid gets injured they’re going nowhere anyway.
Detroit: most plausible on this list, but should probably spend the money elsewhere with Duren being one of their more solid players.
Orlando: I don’t think they’ll spend $20M+ AAV to improve their 2nd ranked defense.
OKC/San Antonio: again, paying $20M+ for premium backups is just not the MO of most teams.
Raptors: Poeltl signed at $20M AAV through 2027.
Utah: only project to be a cap space team if they don’t renegotiate + extend Markaten.
My optimism remains cautious because it only takes one and there are always wild card possibilities like another team opening up space, but 4/$72M is a higher bar to beat than the iHart pessimists seem to think.
Wemby and Chet are both mobile and shooty enough to play the 4. These defenses would be all-time great.
iHart/Chet/Jalen Williams/Giddey/SGA is a Celtics-level starting 5.
You act like the choice for him is being paid 20 million a year vs. 5 million a year by us. We can offer him like 16 million to start.
We’RE the ones who took a chance on him and gave him the opportunity to grow into the player he has become.
There’s so much more than pure money at stake and he can make up a lot of that money playing for a winning team in NYC through endorsements and opportunities.
Re: Edey, he was visibly winded a few times last night. Yes, he played most of the game, but I don’t think he can physically hack starter’s minutes in the NBA. That’s not a diss, it’s just very demanding.
He could be great for 20 minutes a night if he can 1. get back on defense and 2. become a successful outlet passer. I think it’s reasonable to think he can achieve these things, but I still don’t know if it should be a priority for us.
Re: iHart, yes, it’s a bummer that he might leave. I’d say it’s probably 50/50 right now. But as good as he’s been, let’s not forget about Mitch. He’s still a very good—yet different—player. I have no doubt he’ll get back to full strength and be a top-10 starting center again.
BUT… I DO think we might be looking at Embiid this summer (maybe along with Giannis) as our all-in star trade. He’s not going to be happy with an early exit this year, and honestly the Sixers are probably better off rebuilding at this point.
Obviously we all have our reservations about him, but it could be on the table amid the whole “losing iHart” scenario, just sayin…
But they don’t scare anyone in the league. Cause they are god awful.
Money is important but dude would be walking away from starting for one of the better teams in the league in a truly global city to play for a dumpster fire team in Charlotte. No offense to Charlotte. It’s a perfectly fine city. But I find it hard to believe a dude would actively choose to play there.
This isn’t like the old days where we suck and we’re trying to justify some free agent coming here because of the “allure of NYC.” We’re talking about a guy who is already here, playing for a VERY GOOD TEAM, that can give him a very good contract this summer and he gets to keep playing and starting for a team in New York City.
He’s probably worth upwards of 25, and NYC is one of the highest tax environments in the country as Strat astutely noted. He could easily get an offer that doubles his effective take-home pay.
Great, and we got more than our fair return via his stellar play on his current contract. We fucked up by not securing his Bird Rights, and he doesn’t owe us a massive pay cut to fix that mistake
Funny how this NYC endorsement thing has never, ever, ever enabled us to sign a major piece below market, eh?
Swift there’s a snowball’s chance in hell iHart passes on substantially more money elsewhere because the offering team is worse than the Knicks. I can’t think of anyone seeking their first major payday who did something like that. It doesn’t happen. He’ll take the most money, and he should. I just think there’s a ~65% chance that brings him back to the Knicks.
Cyber the NBA officially put out all the clinching scenarios for tonight. Knicks clinch with a win and Miami loss or if the Knicks lose they still clinch if Miami and Philly lose plus Orlando wins.
I wouldn’t dismiss them so easily.
I think it’s more like 95/5, with the 5 representing our chances of engineering a sign & trade or making cap-clearing moves so we can pay him FMV.
This season has shown that iHart is a significantly better than Mitch. He is close enough on defense and the board and massively better on offense, where Mitch is the worst player in the league outside of offensive rebounding. As much as I love Mitch, it’s clear his FT shooting is a fatal flaw that even blunts his greatest strength on offense — you can just nullify any offensive rebound he gets in a high-leverage situation by fouling him, and turn it into a 35% TS possession. He somehow sucks now at finishing through contact, or finishing in general. On top of that, the guy makes OG Anunoby look durable. If trading him is the price of keeping iHart I’d jump at it.
Sorry but this just isn’t realistic. The Sixers are really going to trade Embiid to a division rival? For a still-injured Julius Randle and a bunch of mid-late first round picks? That’s the value of a perennial MVP candidate and the greatest scoring big man since Shaq?
And the Bucks are gonna trade us Giannis after they threw 40m at his preferred coach and went all in with Lillard, who they will be paying 60m+ in 2027? Come on….
They just drafted Mark Williams who put up a very efficient 17 and 13 per 36.
They already have Wendell and Bitadze too
Here’s a red flag. Poeltl sucks and a IQ/RJ/Barnes/iHart lineup seems pretty good
When was the last time a Center who’s been in the NBA for 6 years with career averages of 6 pts and 6 rebs per game got a contract worth 25m per year????
I can’t tell you what he’s worth, but I have a tough time believing someone is going to offer 27m. He’s good and fits our team when healthy, but he not a scorer. I’m seeing the number 13m thrown around from supposed league sources. Split the difference and call it 20 vs. 17, imo you’d have to be nuts to leave NY for OKC or some scrub team over 3 million you won’t ever need when there are greater opportunities here, your wife loves it here, and you’ve been gushing about how much you love it here.
But we can also pay him. We just can’t pay him like 20 to 25 million a year. But I think it would be pretty insane for most teams to offer iHart that money. I just don’t see the few teams that can offer this money doing that for him. He’s good but is he worth 25 million for 5 years good?
So the way I see it, we might have a team outbid us by a few million per year, in which case I don’t see him taking that in order to play for a much shittier team.
Timofey Mozgov got a deal starting at 16m/year in 2016 with worse numbers, which was a similar percentage of the cap.
I’m actually becoming more concerned about OG’s free agency than iHart’s. The concern isn’t so much that he’ll bolt but that we’ll pay him too much. How much is this guy really worth? With his injury record, I’d be hesitant to
offer him 4 years, $120mm. But it seems like he’s expecting a lot more.
iHart would’ve had to been incredibly dumb to take a 3rd year at his current pay. No way was a 3rd year ever on the table.
“He is close enough on defense and the board and massively better on offense, where Mitch is the worst player in the league outside of offensive rebounding.”
Really? Mitch is the worst player in the league on offense? He’s worse than Taj Gibson, Jericho Sims, and Robin Lopez? I really don’t think so.
Yeah OG is getting way more than 4/120.
A 3rd year would enable us to offer him all the gold in Dolan’s money bin if he showed out. Why bet on yourself if you’re going to limit the payoff?
Fine, the worst rotation player except Alec Burks.
Hasheem Thabeet was a 7’3” center that dominated in college and ended up being unplayable in the pros. And that was before Steph Curry rendered traditional centers irrelevant. After the Thabeet bust, teams have largely avoided that archetype in the draft and for good reason. Those who can’t do, teach. And those who can’t teach, teach size.
Thanks, BBA. I guess we’ll keep an eye on several games then. 😉
Isn’t that crazy, though?
I love OG Anunoby — we all do — but we’re going pay him like he’s Paul George in his prime? How’s that not gonna kill us?
Come on… Thabeet averaged 13.6 ppg on 7.7 fga/g with 19.0 usage. Thabeet was FIFTH in USAGE on that 2009 team.
Edey averaged 25.2 on 13.9 fga/g with 33.4% usage. They have as much in common as I do with Robert Redford.
Well… they are both tall….
I find it so peculiar that in what felt like the blink of an eye we went from arguing that we’re way down here on the win curve so doing this-that-and the other thing was ridiculous, to arguing whether we might be the second-best team in the East with a puncher’s chance for the finals even without our two-time All-NBA power forward.
I think we keep iHart for reasons (tallied above by various posters), but I’m with Pags that Giannis and Embiid are lovely but indisputable pipe dreams. As for OG, it’s a risk, but he’s also the special sauce that seems to take us from a scrappy bunch of street urchins to something amazing. Pay the dude, roll it back next year with the All-NBA guy back on the roster. Next season might be the Celtics’ year for injuries.
150m will be the price and we will pay it because losing him for nothing after giving up Quickley would be catastrophic.
And yes, it very well might kill us. 🙂
I mean Boban Marjanovic puts up numbers not far from that in the actual NBA, but he still has more of a role in the John Wick movie series than he’s ever had with an actual NBA team. Unplayable is unplayable.
These are the centers making more than 17.5M in 2023-24:
1. Jokic, 28, 55.2M
2. Embiid, 29, 53.3M
3. Gobert, 31, 41M
4. AD, 30, 38M
5. Ayton, 25, 33.2M
6. Bam, 26, 32.6M
7. KAT, 28, 31.6M
8. Brook Lopez, 35, 24M
9. Capela, 29, 22.9M
10. Myles Turner, 27, 20.5M
11. Jarrett Allen, 25, 20M
12. Vucevic, 33, 20M
13. Poeltl, 28, 19.5M
Where would iHart land?
It will not kill us to pay OG $150mil/4 years. Unless he has a catastrophic injury, it will completely be worth it. I’m comfortable with that bet.
As for iHart, I think there’s better than a 50/50 chance he’s back. I think we’d match $100mil/4 years if we could, and that could be signaled to his agent so that iHart would sign a 1+1 with a player option, with the implied subsequent deal being at least that or more once he opts out. But I think the chance that he gets an offer like that isn’t high; his counting numbers are low (and many execs are still idiots), and the Achilles means he probably can’t play 36mpg–two seasons in a row of problems means he’s a 30mpg player. Who’s gonna pay that player $1 mil/minute? Again, there aren’t many reasonable options. Like Swift, I agree that if it’s $16mil AAV here and $19mil AAV elsewhere, he’s staying. It will take $25mil AAV, and there are few teams that would do it for a position most feel is the least valuable on the floor.
Valanciunas will be available, would you prefer to spend 25M on iHart or less than 15M on JV? Or another scenario, would you rather spend 25M on iHart and not on another position (C is the least valuable position right now), when you have super cheap options like Theis, Plumlee, Drummond, Wood and Bryant? They’re not iHart of course, but you’ll save money to spend on another position that is probably harder to fill on the cheap.
the list of teams lining up to pay more than 25 million a year for a guy who averages 25 minutes and fewer than 8 points per game is getting longer and longer
He is easily better than anyone #8 or below on that list, as well as Ayton. I’d call him a top 10 center in the league pretty confidently.
BPM thinks he’s the 8th best center.
EPM thinks he’s the 3rd best center and 15th best player!
If you buy his recent play, he’s better than:
Vucevic
Poeltl
Capela
Lopez
Ayton
Allen
Turner
Maybe a couple others
He’s not as good as Brook for the Bucks. Brook got range, and that’s valuable to them. So the others make 23M or less. And it’s only ONE player, the rest make 20.5M or less. He’s definitely taking the 17M the Knicks can offer above some 20M offer from a team he doesn’t know if he’ll fit in as good as he fits the Knicks.
And when was the last time Leon didn’t either trade or re-signed a player?
The difference between those amounts over a 3yr deal is equal to his whole salary this year.
The difference between those amounts over a 4yr deal is roughly equivalent to his career earnings before this year.
No way does Hartenstein turn down $3M per year. No player fits a team better than a $9M check fits his bank account.
This is a pure hindsight take.
No athlete ever wants their first contract to be smaller. And if he wanted to bet on himself, he would have taken a starting job instead of a backup.
3 years was never on the table for him because it would have been a huge overpay at the time.
good call EB on the raptors being a possible landing spot for isaiah…not sure how the money works, but yeah – poeltl isn’t so great…isaiah can run…
This is irrelevant. He’s going to make way more than he’s made for his career so far in either scenario.
I love to point out things Leon did wrong but I can’t kill him on this.
iHart was about to take 2 years, $13mm to go back to the Clippers. Then they gave that money to John Wall, and he took our 2 year, $17mm offer.
That was the market for a backup center who no one other than ptmilo expected to break out.
Leon’s got to be thinking: if I give him two years, I get his early bird rights… what are the odds this guy is going to outplay 175% of the last year of his deal?
That’s the right call. The third year would have just been very expensive insurance for something extremely unlikely.
(BTW it’s worth noting and it bodes well that iHart was willing to take less money to stay with the Clippers.)
All of this iHart hand wringing really reminds me of everyone freaking out about us “losing Mitch for nothing” a few years ago.
It worked out then. Why not trust that it will work out now? We took a chance on him. We can offer him 16 or 17 million a year, which is more than a lot of starting centers make. He’s starting for a really fucking good team and he lives in one of the best cities to live in. NYC offers way more opportunities for his brand, his wife’s brand, investment opportunities, endorsement opportunities (especially if we keep winning) than fucking Toronto or Orlando (is he going to shill for Disney?) or Detroit or Charlotte.
I mean, yeah we could lose him. But we’re not going to.
This assumes Hartenstein values $9 million the same whether it’s the difference between $3 million and $12 million, or the difference between $72 million and $81 million.
The Raptors could just draft hometown hero Edey.
But yes, more than 20 mil per for iHart seems kinda of crazy, so maybe he stays? It only takes one team though…
And as for Embiid, I don’t think it’s such a pipe dream. His clock is ticking, and Morey sure as hell wants to get max value for him. And ok, other teams could beat our offer… but would they? Embiid is an injury risk, and 53 mil is a serious cap hit. Not every team will think it’s worth it.
We will have lots of picks, expirings, and a good young player or two to offer.
Again, I’m not saying we should do it, just that it isn’t off the table.
…and remember, no one thought the Raps would EVER deal with us again, yet they did. I’m sure the Sixers would.
#Spoelstra has had a legitimate 8 seed roster these last two years and he made it to the Finals.#
When Spoiledstra stops having future Hofers and allnbaers in his Riley made rosters and starts showing his coaching balls he’ll get my respect. Till then let my doubts have some fun!
“Lucky Spo’s got Jimmy Butler, who has Thibs ever had?” is a pretty ice cold take.
IF Spo ever leaves Miami and makes anything coaching worthwhile I’ll believe in his value.
Till then he’s got my Riley-Puppet of the Year Award
Exactly
We are operating with a certain level of ignorance about his priorities, especially because he’s so young. But there’s a monumental difference between 3m and 12m vs 72m and 81m when you throw other important things related to your happiness into the equation.
I’d take 72m and the ability to live where I want, enjoy my co workers and boss and have a happy wife over 81m and less happy circumstances any day of the week. 3m vs. 12m is a different story. I’d be willing to make a one time sacrifice in quality of life to get to 12m, and then leave.
He’s putting up pretty much the same numbers this year as he was in LA, this year’s numbers might actually be worse, and we’re talking about him signing for $25M/yr. Why would he sign for $9M over 3yrs?
Because it would have been $10mm (158%) higher than his next best offer and he’d never made anything more than the minimum in the NBA.
Hartenstein signed a 2 year deal to be the backup center on a 37 win team after his own team decided they didn’t want him for even less than that. It took Jalen Brunson making an unimaginable leap and Mitchell Robinson getting hurt for almost a whole year for him to get to this position. It seems far fetched to think he turned down a sum that was twice his career earnings to date because he had the foresight to know all this would happen and he’d cash in.
Also seems pretty far fetched to kill Leon for not upping his offer (which was already the best on the market) by an extra 158% just in case.
I am in Chicago visiting my daughter. She got us tickets for tonight. Guaranteed win!
Not killing Leon, but I think it is valid as a mild critique. Why not throw a 3y team option on there if we already had the best offer? I would go for this on every 2y contract because Bird Rights are so much better than Early Bird, really for both parties.
You have a great daughter, gkhenman! Enjoy the win 🙂
Boban is Ghorge Muresan with a cleaner accent and a better sense of humor. He can’t run at all. Just observing his facial bones and hand thickness without examining him, I bet he has acromegaly. You can see the difference between Boban and KP or Edey. They are all equally tall where Boban’s brow is much thicker as are his hands. This is caused by excess GH production after the closure of the epiphyseal plates. Both KP and Edey are far more athletic than Boban. A bad , lazy comparison.
So his life expectancy is reduced by ~10 years or so? I’m already sad about it. 🙁
Gk,
I’ll be at the game as well with some friends! Enjoy 🙂