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Knicks Morning News (2022.12.10)

  • Knicks’ decision to go big with second unit pays off – New York Post
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 4:17:00 AM

    Knicks’ decision to go big with second unit pays off  New York Post Knicks Swat Hornets For Elusive Third Consecutive Victory  Sports IllustratedKnicks 121, Hornets 102: Scenes from the new world order  Posting and ToastingHow will the Knicks replace Obi Toppin? Can Cam Reddish and Jericho Sims return to the rotation?  The AthleticJulius Randle stays hot, scores 33 as Knicks top Hornets 121-102  AMNYView Full Coverage on Google News

  • Former Knicks coach Larry Brown steps down at Memphis due to health concerns – New York Post
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 4:16:00 AM

    Former Knicks coach Larry Brown steps down at Memphis due to health concerns  New York Post

  • New York faces Sacramento, seeks 4th straight victory – The Associated Press – en Espa?ol
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 2:05:15 AM

    New York faces Sacramento, seeks 4th straight victory  The Associated Press – en Espa?ol

  • Knicks’ Jalen Brunson: Ekes out double-double – CBS Sports
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 1:39:36 AM

    Knicks’ Jalen Brunson: Ekes out double-double  CBS Sports

  • Bucks beat Mavericks 106-105 after Antetokounmpo fouls out – The Associated Press – en Espa?ol
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 1:00:00 AM

    Bucks beat Mavericks 106-105 after Antetokounmpo fouls out  The Associated Press – en Espa?ol

  • Knicks on the Court: December 9 at Hornets Photo Gallery – NBA.com
    [news.google.com] — Saturday, December 10, 2022 12:19:42 AM

    Knicks on the Court: December 9 at Hornets Photo Gallery  NBA.com

  • Knicks takeaways from Friday’s 121-102 win over Hornets, including shortened rotation delivering third straight win – Yahoo Sports
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 11:53:00 PM

    Knicks takeaways from Friday’s 121-102 win over Hornets, including shortened rotation delivering third straight win  Yahoo Sports

  • Knicks Register Fifth Straight Win Beating Blue Coats 113-108 – OurSports Central
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 10:32:37 PM

    Knicks Register Fifth Straight Win Beating Blue Coats 113-108  OurSports Central

  • WATCH: Clifford Post Game vs Knicks – Sports Illustrated
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 9:50:59 PM

    WATCH: Clifford Post Game vs Knicks  Sports Illustrated

  • Hornets vs Knicks Gallery – 12/09/22 Photo Gallery – NBA.com
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 9:47:09 PM

    Hornets vs Knicks Gallery – 12/09/22 Photo Gallery  NBA.com

  • Knicks Swat Hornets For Elusive Third Consecutive Victory – Sports Illustrated
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 9:31:05 PM

    Knicks Swat Hornets For Elusive Third Consecutive Victory  Sports IllustratedKnicks’ decision to go big with second unit pays off  New York Post Knicks 121, Hornets 102: Scenes from the new world order  Posting and ToastingCharlotte Hornets vs. New York Knicks: Odds, Injury Report, Prediction  Swarm and StingNBA Odds: Knicks-Hornets prediction, odds and pick – 12/9/2022  ClutchPointsView Full Coverage on Google News

  • A hectic Knicks experience forced Frank Ntilikina to grow up fast – Yahoo News
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 7:59:18 PM

    A hectic Knicks experience forced Frank Ntilikina to grow up fast  Yahoo News

  • New York Notes: Nets, Simmons, Claxton, Watanabe, Knicks – hoopsrumors.com
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 7:48:00 PM

    New York Notes: Nets, Simmons, Claxton, Watanabe, Knicks  hoopsrumors.com

  • Starting Lineups for Hornets vs Knicks – Sports Illustrated
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 6:39:48 PM

    Starting Lineups for Hornets vs Knicks  Sports Illustrated

  • Best New York Knicks Sportsbook Betting Promo Codes – New York Post
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 6:00:00 PM

    Best New York Knicks Sportsbook Betting Promo Codes  New York Post

  • Which of Knicks, Hawks and Other Average NBA Teams Are For Real? – The Ringer
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 4:21:10 PM

    Which of Knicks, Hawks and Other Average NBA Teams Are For Real?  The Ringer

  • A Tale of Two Thibs – The Strickland
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 4:18:05 PM

    A Tale of Two Thibs  The Strickland

  • Knicks “Watching” What Happens in Chicago, as Their Search for a Star Continues – bleachernation.com
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 3:47:42 PM

    Knicks “Watching” What Happens in Chicago, as Their Search for a Star Continues  bleachernation.com

  • ‘Nothing Like That!’: Cam Reddish Denies Asking Knicks For Trade – Sports Illustrated
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 3:00:00 PM

    ‘Nothing Like That!’: Cam Reddish Denies Asking Knicks For Trade  Sports IllustratedPredicting where Knicks’ Derrick Rose, Evan Fournier, Cam Reddish will be traded  Daily KnicksLakers and Knicks have talked about potential Cam Reddish trade  Yahoo SportsKnicks’ Cam Reddish says he hasn’t requested a trade, doesn’t know why he’s out of rotation  CBS SportsTrade Ideas to Save the New York Knicks’ Season  Bleacher ReportView Full Coverage on Google News

  • Obi Toppin’s injury is about more than numbers for Knicks: ‘Big absence’ – New York Post
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 2:40:00 PM

    Obi Toppin’s injury is about more than numbers for Knicks: ‘Big absence’  New York Post

  • NBA DFS Value Plays December 9: Mitchell Robinson Dominates for New York Knicks vs Charlotte Hornets – FantasyAlarm
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 2:25:12 PM

    NBA DFS Value Plays December 9: Mitchell Robinson Dominates for New York Knicks vs Charlotte Hornets  FantasyAlarm

  • Woj: New York Knicks Keeping Tabs on Chicago Bulls for Potential Trades – On Tap Sports Net
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 11:47:24 AM

    Woj: New York Knicks Keeping Tabs on Chicago Bulls for Potential Trades  On Tap Sports Net

  • Despite VIP Treatment by NBA Team New York Knicks, Frances Tiafoe Stays Loyal to His Favorite Washington Wizards – EssentiallySports
    [news.google.com] — Friday, December 9, 2022 9:30:00 AM

    Despite VIP Treatment by NBA Team New York Knicks, Frances Tiafoe Stays Loyal to His Favorite Washington Wizards  EssentiallySports

  • 117 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2022.12.10)”

    I watched the highlighs. Man, what an ugly court. What happened to the honeycomb parquet? I liked that one.

    RJ did not play PF but did very well. When the opposing team does not have a strong interior defense, he plays better.

    Back to .500 and on a 3-game winning streak we still don’t know if the new-and-improved defense is true or false.
    What we know is that a healthy Grimes is a much needed 2-way boost to our starters and Deuce a rotation player with bulldog mentality.

    Also, we have won 2 games with “bad” Brunson and we’re unbeaten with 30-plus Randle (5-0, all games where his numbers were real and not the stats stuffing he often does).

    The Kings will be a more meaningful test, w/o Fox (day-to-day for sunday game) they just beat the Spida-less Cavs.

    Grades:

    Brunson C +
    Another bad shooting night (5-27 in the last two) but 11 assists. He’ll get out of the slump, the sooner the better.

    Grimes B
    The numbers aren’t as shiny as the Hawks’ game but he was good. He looks like an above average BB-IQ player and I’m sure more good things will come.

    Randle A
    Like Grimes less impressive numbers than against the Hawks, but a very good game nonetheless.
    I’ve never been shy to criticize him when I felt he deserved it but so far, on offense, he has exceeded even my rosier preseason expectations and in the last few games he played some defense too.
    He still makes me mad at least three times a game, but his ratio of good games vs. bad games has been a net positive.
    We always knew he’s a good player when engaged, what we don’t know is how to keep him engaged, but we’re trying.

    Barrett B
    A rare appearance of the RJ Barrett that I expected at season’s start.
    Far from perfect but definitely playable, there’s still a lot of work to do on his outside shooting and the defensive committment is on-off, but a step in the right direction, let’s hope he continues.

    Robinson B
    A beast on the boards and a scary presence on defense, quiet on offense (3-7?).

    Quickley B-
    Some postgame rumors argue he’s shaken by the trade rumors, it can’t be easy to play serene with all those whispers swirling around.
    I liked his 4 assists.

    Mc Bride A-
    The patented fierce defense and a double figure! The malicious will say it’s because the Hornets were a G-League team, I strongly disagree but I’ll try to find a way to play our home games in Westchester.

    Hartenstein A
    18 minutes, 11 points (5-5 shooting), 8 boards, 2 assists, 2 blocks. Can you ask more from your backup center? Or was it backup power forward?

    Sims C
    12 minutes jumping around like a compressed spring, but he had a assist!

    Svi NA
    Contrary to the siberian exiles, he’s in Thibs’ Circle Of Trust (h/t Mike Axisa) at least in garbage time. Did you know he took 29 shots (15 3P) in 37 minutes during his recent trip to Westchester? Instant offense!

    Thibs B
    I give him credit for digging deep into the bag of tricks and he’s taking full responsability for his choices.
    The young guns’ energy help a lot on defense but I want more evidence that we’ve turned the corner, and our halfcourt offense often is still a painful slog.
    I don’t like his exile ways (it’s not a novelty, every year he has at least one, ask Rivers and Kemba) but that’s on me, it’s a matter of taste.

    Man, what an ugly court. What happened to the honeycomb parquet? I liked that one.

    I like that one too! 🙂

    I started the 3rd quarter and then fell asleep. I think we’re undefeated when i sleep through the 4rd quarter, maybe i should start doing it all the time, if we want to go for the championship. 😀

    I’m also happy that Deuce is getting his shot at proving he belongs, that Grimes is playing like we said he could, that Quick is getting great at his all around game and is a reliable shot away of being our candidate for breakout player of the season.

    Tomorrow is a great test, i think, and it’d be great if they could reach a 4 game winning streak. 🙂

    And now i’m going to get ready to support Portugal 🇵🇹, i hope it’s a great game and we can avoid a surprise. But hey, if it’s a surprise, at least Z-Man will be happy for his moroccan 🇲🇦 side. 😉

    I’m in an intense period on my latest book where I can’t always spare the time to watch the team, so I’ve missed nearly all of the last two games. Box score suggests Deuce is starting to look at least passable on offense, which is all we need. But how does he look? I saw the understandable game thread jokes about Charlotte basically being a G-League team without LaMelo. Was this the Deuce we’ve seen in those Westchester highlights? Or just someone whose outside shot isn’t quite as atrocious as it’s been for most of his time with the big club?

    Or just someone whose outside shot isn’t quite as atrocious as it’s been for most of his time with the big club?

    I’d lean on the second. The good thing is he isn’t afraid.

    He took his shots without hesitation and was cool on a buzzer beater to end the 3rd after a good effort from I-Hart.

    Small steps, good steps.

    So I watched the game on a plane using United Wifi. The feed would lag every 10 seconds or so and I came close to bagging it.

    “RJ Barrett for 3…….video freezes, 5 seconds go by….it’s good!”

    But at least I suffered for a win! (-:

    cyber, I must admit that my fandom for soccer is almost undetectable…so I am truly good either way! May the best team win! And if not, Viva Morocco!

    I agree with Max that Deuce isn’t playing with the same unbridled confidence he has in the G-League, understandably so. But I think knowing that he will play in every game is having a positive impact.

    The Kings are going to be a very good test, especially if Fox plays. They have a good record and they got screwed out of two more wins on bad calls. Fox will certainly test our defense. This is not the same Kings team.

    I do have to say that the shootout seems like an awful way to end games of this magnitude. I feel sorry for the guys that miss, how do they ever get over it? Do their home countries forgive them?

    I do have to say that the shootout seems like an awful way to end games of this magnitude. I feel sorry for the guys that miss, how do they ever get over it? Do their home countries forgive them?

    I don’t mind it now that they’ve gotten rid of sudden death in overtime. The way it’s set up, you basically have to actively choose as a team to get to shootouts, as you could totally sell out and try for a goal at all costs at the end of extra time (which might lead to them scoring a goal on you), but teams would rather take their chances at penalty kicks, and thus, it is like they are basically choosing it. The “Golden Goal” era was different.

    The Kings are going to be a very good test, especially if Fox plays. They have a good record and they got screwed out of two more wins on bad calls. Fox will certainly test our defense. This is not the same Kings team.

    Yep, if they shut them down with Fox, then we can really celebrate this new defense. Even if they shut them down without Fox, it’ll still be a nice statement. Odds are it’ll be without Fox, because this team has been oddly lucky that way this season.

    And honestly, Hubert…you wishing that I was driving drunk is beyond the pale.

    Sorry, man, but you’re kinda like RJ Barrett at this point. You both should be benched, but somehow you’re playing 40 minutes a night and leading the team in shot attempts despite missing pretty much all of them.

    And since we can’t expect Thibs or Brian Cronin to do the right thing and hold you accountable, we kinda have to root for an injury to get our worst player out of the lineup.

    I don’t want either you or RJ to be seriously hurt. I just want both of you to end up with like your arms in a sling for a little while, you know? That way RJ can’t dribble and you can’t type, we finally get to see how good things can be without you for a while, and you guys both completely heal eventually.

    The four of you should just be ashamed of hijacking a winning game thread as bad as any of our banned loser exes and making it intensely personal and extremely ugly and unpleasant for the rest of it. Yeah, all four of you, you know who you are and you’re all responsible for being, yeah, dickish. Just fucking stop. Don’t point fingers. You’re all grown-ass men, not triggered snowflakes (and this is the first time I’ve ever used either of those terms, but when the shoe fits…). Take responsibility. Don’t respond to each other. And just stop it.

    It’s Neptune-level ugly.

    Go back and read the thread. I literally didn’t do shit besides point out the obvious after I was called out by name for reasons that make no sense, and I don’t intend to drag it on either. Everyone saw what they needed to see.

    @Raven — +1

    Winning shouldn’t be seen (only) as a chance to settle scores in obscure online flame arguments.

    I’ve posted about the Narcissism of small differences before. It’s real and it’s unfortunate.

    Agree or disagree, I enjoy reading the analyses from all four of you folks.

    Now: Porto is down, so Cyber needs us.

    I’ll try not to take the bait.

    Take it? You laid it. It was trolling 101, and I was right to call you out. Ideally that’s what a moderator would do, but that’s too much to ask for here.

    @alan,

    I’d say Deuce still looks pretty bad on offense.

    Don’t remember all his points so I suspect a number came during garbage time. Arguably, the whole game was garbage time. Charlotte, or “CLT”, was that bad.

    Honestly doesn’t even matter with how he’s playing. It’s not like they’re leaving him wide open (yet anyways).

    “I’d say Deuce still looks pretty bad on offense.”

    He was passing up some open threes and even open twos, and also passing up what looked like open lanes to the hoop, but I’m okay with it for now. It doesn’t feel like Frank, more that he’s trying to keep the offense in a flow as the point guard (pay attention, RJ).

    Although I do think he’s also a bit nervous about continuing to miss shots. Hopefully as he keeps getting minutes he’ll find his moments in rhythm. Something to watch, and pray for…

    So sorry, Cyber. But Morocco played some truly beautiful counters. First African team in the semis ever. Wow.

    After last night, I’m officially skipping over Z-Man’s posts from now on. I’ve been leaning that way for a while now, but throwing that Molotov at the end of a positive, game-winning thread was f’d up.

    As for Grimes, I think he’ll settle down once he starts getting consistent minutes. I’m surprised just how much he’s changed the feel of this team… it’s great to see!

    I’ll be doing the same with Raven, arguably the prime enabler. That was the worst “both sides” argument I’ve seen since Trump talked about Charlottesville.

    As for the Knicks, things are looking up. If RJ can just regress to average we stand a good chance to reach exceptations this year.

    Hubert, Z-Man threw a funny, snide comment out, which walked that fine line, but I thought was amusing. Then he did it again, which crossed over the line and was prime trolling.

    But the three of you rose to the bait like fat, stupid carp to a piece of aluminum foil wrapped around an oversized treble hook. That you don’t recognize that you were entirely complicit in reducing yesterday’s enjoyment for the rest of us to ashes is both sad and telling.

    To ess and anyone else alarmed or offended, I sincerely apologize. I found some of the things said on the last couple of threads very triggering, but admit that my reaction was way over the line. I’ve been trying not to do that, and yesterday I failed. My bad.

    Raven, one of the people you claim is “equally responsible” for hijacking the thread isn’t even in the thread.

    I’m glad you thought his 7 consecutive troll posts, including the one that said “Hubert, go fuck yourself” managed to “walk that fine line”, but you’re not the judge.

    There was only one belligerent party last night, and it was plain as day. He literally admitted he was “targeting” specific posters. What more proof do you need than his own confession?

    You coming out here and absolving him of his guilt is a big part of the problem. The fact that he has several enablers is the only reason it continues. There should be unanimity against intentional belligerence, but guys like you can’t get your personal feelings out of the way and see what is right in front of your eyes.

    The back and forth between certain people here is about as enjoyable as watching Randle argue with the refs but last night was full-on 21/22 meltdown. I don’t need to go back and read the thread- I saw it in real time. If you want to flame each other go back a thread and do it there. Those kinds of back and forths ruin the site.

    cyber, sorry for yout team and country, great match that someone had to lose… hopefully I’ll be collecting on that bet sometime soon! I don’t know much about soccer but it seemed that Morocco’s defense is awesome and their goalie always seemed to be in the right place at the right time. Seemed like both teams missed some great opportunities.

    The back and forth between certain people here is about as enjoyable as watching Randle argue with the refs but last night was full-on 21/22 meltdown.

    I get you, Nicos. But what I would like you to get is that *every thread* is like that for the people he “targets”.

    For you, only the ones we respond to are unenjoyable, e.g. I let 9 out of 10 go by, and on the 10th time I reply you find it unenjoyable. But all 10 are miserable for his “targets”, that’s why so many of us leave the site for long periods.

    It’s on you guys to hold him accountable when he’s trolling. Early Bird did it, and so did ess-dog. I commend them both for that. If we could count on the rest of you to shut him up when he’s being a belligerent asshole, I promise you won’t have to ever read a back-and-forth. Instead we have people like Raven inexplicably trying to both-sides something that was about as one-sided as Charlottesville, Virginia.

    And if you don’t hold him accountable, all his “targets” will continue leaving the community like they have been, and eventually his target will be you, because he needs to have one.

    I am sure at some point I have made some posts I shouldn’t have, but I cannot fathom reading last night’s thread and thinking I was equally as culpable as, um, others. I firmly stand by my hypothesis as to what was really going on.

    Anywho…

    Definitely excited for the Kings game, which is not something I ever thought I would say. Seemingly out of nowhere they’ve got 5 rotation players with a .600+ TS% on mid-to-high usage and run a pretty democratic offense.

    Not sure what the path to victory is, but Deuce has to get 20+ minutes just due to Fox alone right? How Mitch holds up against Sabonis will be a big factor too.

    RJ is definitely on one of his “last X games” streaks but at this point I can’t be bothered to care. Wake me up when he’s good.

    A *do* think the Knicks’ vastly improved defense over the last few games or so is a trend worth talking about, because it can feasibly be attributed to rotation changes. Deuce and Grimes seem to make a real difference both by the eye-test and the way-too-early numbers.

    I think this team’s ceiling is something like being around 12th in both offensive and defensive rating, and for now I will avoid any triggering commentary on the bigger picture and just say that would be a team I could watch.

    Nobody gives a shit who started your latest fight you guys are collectively ruining this board.

    I’ve posted about the Narcissism of small differences before. It’s real and it’s unfortunate.

    I’ll just say I agree with what KBA: 44 said and with DRed:

    Nobody gives a shit who started your latest fight you guys are collectively ruining this board.

    Come on. Yesterday was a bad day for the site. I thought Portugal was playing in the World Cup and cited cyber. Obviously wrong and regret the post. Perhaps a few other posts in hindsight might be regrettable, allbeit not factually like mine. Take a deep breath, console cyber, thank Max for his synopses, Mike for keeping us talking despite the Vietnamese, Geo for being Geo, MBunge having more important sites to post, and the music aspect which I had no interest in, but must confess has got me intrigued.

    ***There was only one belligerent party last night, and it was plain as day.***

    Hey, now. I called you guys nice and normal and got told I was more annoying than Mike Bunge. Oof.

    Haha Donnie I didn’t say you were annoying, I actually love that you start every post with “didn’t watch the game, but…”

    Nobody gives a shit who started your latest fight you guys are collectively ruining this board.

    So sorry, Cyber. But Morocco played some truly beautiful counters. First African team in the semis ever. Wow.

    No worries, i just went for a quick 2.5 mile run and everything is good again. Morocco played a perfect game to take our team out of the game, and looks like our coach didn’t bother to do the same. If it was points, like in boxing, Morocco would still win. So congrats to Morocco, congrats to Z-Man, and best of luck for the next 2 games.
    Of course it’s a little frustrating to lose when you’re the favored team, and to add to that the goal was a blunder on our part (goalkeeper) and we went scoreless, which adds a new level of frustration. All in all, it was a bad day for us, it happens.

    I guess I must be a bad person b/c I actually chuckled at a couple of the comments last night.

    For the tedious ones, the ones like, “fuck you you said this”….”no, fuck YOU I said that” type ones that we see pretty much daily, there’s the scroll wheel on my mouse. My right forefinger is in great shape!

    But yeah, it would be nice for less “troll and respond” stuff to be cluttering up the threads.

    I do have to say that the shootout seems like an awful way to end games of this magnitude. I feel sorry for the guys that miss, how do they ever get over it? Do their home countries forgive them?

    Yeah, we forgive them and move on. I don’t even remember the players that missed penalties for Portugal and for my hometown team, in a shootout situation. Except 2 or 3 players that have the skill, the others are sent there for what i think is a coin flip situation, he can fool the GK or the GK guesses the side and saves the goal. Doesn’t make sense to get mad at the player.

    I love that the defensive midfielder for France, basically their Duece, just had one of the nicest goals in the tourney.

    Missing a ton of their best players and still with absurd talent to spare.

    And they have another Duece in Camavinga.

    Per Jake Brown on twitter: The starting lineup of
    Brunson-Grimes-RJ-Randle-Mitch is:
    – 76th percentile for pts per 100 poss.
    – 93rd percentile for TOV%
    – 61st percentile for opponent’s EFG%
    – +8.2 points when they’re out on the floor

    If the starters are even close to +8.2 at the end of the year they’re at least hosting a play-in game if not 6th.

    I will say one last thing on the matter and then drop it for good: before last night Z-Man never actually got in my nerves in a personal way. I thought he was a good dude who I vehemently disagreed with on whether Leon Rose’s vision for putting together a contending NBA team makes any sense and various other basketball matters, which, whatever, I have far more important disagreements with other people. Last night he made things bizarrely personal, which I think had something to do with his consumption choices but regardless was pretty unpleasant and should be avoided moving forward. Congrats on Morocco though, and sorry Cyber. Was an entertaining game.

    FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO UNDERSTANDABLY SKIPPED ALL THAT, THIS IS WHERE COMMENTARY POTENTIALLY RELEVANT TO THE NEW YORK KNICKS BEGINS:

    Watching my alma mater play NC State and Terquavion Smith is an interesting prospect who could be in one of our draft pick ranges.

    Last season he was a trendy sleeper pick, but he wound up returning to school. It made sense–he showed serious eye-test flashes as a freshman but his numbers were pretty ugly, at least partially owing to NC State being ghastly.

    This year the team has some more talent and he’s putting together a much better year statistically. He’ll be 20 on draft night so he’s not beating up on younger competition.

    His fit with us isn’t super clear because his fit anywhere isn’t super clear–he’s kind of a classic combo guard. But he’s athletic as hell and his jumper looks like it won’t be a big problem. The fact of the matter is if we actually make a pick, it’s going to be a player(s) with real flaws owing to our draft position. As of now Smith looks like he could be an interesting roll of the dice upside wise.

    Long way to go, but someone I’ll be watching.

    I thought Portugal was playing in the World Cup and cited cyber. Obviously wrong and regret the post.

    No problem at all, Bernie. I replied to you at the end of thread saying exactly that “You mean the World Cup? Portugal wasn’t playing today, only tomorrow.”. 😉 And i even think i ended the thread on a high note, too bad no one was there to read it. 😛

    “Believe it or not when I clicked I immediately got an ad for Clorox bleach”

    That’s really funny!

    Believe it or not when I clicked I immediately got an ad for Clorox bleach

    Jowles is behind it, i know it. 😀

    “Congrats on Morocco though…”

    Much appreciated, although ful disclosure it meant less to me than the Knicks win vs. CHA…just a fun time to be the ultimate fair weather fan!

    As to yesterday, I retract anything you felt was over the line with you, as I, like most here, hold you in high regard and genuinely enjoy debating with you. Definitely less so in the last couple of days, though. Still, my apologies.

    Minor factoid just stumbled upon: Julius Randle is third in the league in second-chance baskets (behind AD and Bane (!), and ahead of Giannis and Jokic).

    All kinds of ways to look at that, some not so flattering, but I guess it’s kind of a good thing…

    Broke: being excited about France

    Woke: being excited that Miami has got to be ranked after this

    France is missing some key players but they are a Final Boss

    Morocco v France would be spicy geopolitically

    But not over yet

    Kane missing the tying penalty. Oof. France had a very rough match on D to be honest.

    Minor factoid just stumbled upon: Julius Randle is third in the league in second-chance baskets (behind AD and Bane (!), and ahead of Giannis and Jokic).

    Hmm, is that just putbacks or anyone scoring after an offensive rebound- If Bane is second then it must be counting shots taken by guys off of kickouts. Randle is one of those guys where if you’re defense isn’t loaded up to stop him he’s really hard to guard so when defenses get scrambled off of offensive rebounds he’s going to make hay. Since the first couple of weeks of the season he’s been really, really good offensively. Over the last 18 games he’s put up a .612 TS% with 27.9 usage. Plus a 17.9 assist % against an 11.8 %. turnover rate. That’s all-star production on that side of the ball. He’s now tied with Brunson in obpm. Good Randle isn’t quite elite but he’s a really good offensive player. If the dip in turnovers is for real (he’s at a career low this season) that, plus a consistent effort level defensively would go a long way towards me wanting him here long term.

    cyber, should Morocco have a preference for an opponent in the semis?

    Lady Cyber was rooting for France because now Morocco can knockout France and the streets of Paris will be full of moroccans celebrating. 😉

    If Randle is able to keep up this level of play, that’s really huge for us of course. The starting lineup would have three good players in it, one effective glue guy with upside, and RJ. Still don’t have that superstar but that’s a pretty solid workmanlike team, and the bench isn’t a black hole either.

    There’s still not enough shooting here though, and I don’t know how you fix that with this current group of players. I’d be looking to move RJ for a similarly flawed prospect who has perimeter shooting as a strength. Even if Grimes turns out to be a reliable sniper that’s still not enough shooting.

    Good Randle isn’t quite elite but he’s a really good offensive player. If the dip in turnovers is for real (he’s at a career low this season) that, plus a consistent effort level defensively would go a long way towards me wanting him here long term.

    I still don’t know if i’d keep him or RJ, because i don’t think having both makes sense, but yeah it’d be very good if this is the Randle going forward.

    “Good Randle isn’t quite elite but he’s a really good offensive player. If the dip in turnovers is for real (he’s at a career low this season) that, plus a consistent effort level defensively would go a long way towards me wanting him here long term.”

    I am very impressed by what Randle is doing, particularly after the falling out he had with fans at MSG last year. It must have been hard to get that mess out of his head, and yet he did it in a way that suggested that he got the needed message. I just hope the success doesn’t go to his head again.

    He’s playing pretty much like I hoped he would when we acquired him…the 34% from 3 at highish volume isn’t great, but that was never expected to be his calling card anyway, so I can live with it if it keeps defenses honest. He’s still isolating but with better decisions on where to take his shots and less floundering around when the double-team comes, and it seems like that’s getting him to the line more than he did when he was taking lots of long 2’s.

    The defense is another story, but having him out there with Grimes, Mitch, IQ and Deuce seems to help, as there are fewer decisions to make where he tends to get caught in between.

    And yeah, he’s going to get some serious all-star consideration if this keeps up.

    “There’s still not enough shooting here though, and I don’t know how you fix that with this current group of players. I’d be looking to move RJ for a similarly flawed prospect who has perimeter shooting as a strength. Even if Grimes turns out to be a reliable sniper that’s still not enough shooting.”

    It’s definitely a glaring flaw, and not an easy one to fix because you don’t want to fix it with a Fournier-type, and legit two-way snipers (see: Mikal Bridges) are not the easiest thing to find.

    I guess the hope is that the current guys will improve….most importantly RJ, IQ and Deuce. Obi being legit would be a bonus, but he’s not going to see enough minutes to solve the problem anyway. It would also be nice if Randle and Brunson got up into the highish 30’s and stayed there…

    But it certainly matters less when you are beating teams up in the paint and keeping their 3PT% down like we have been doing lately.

    Cyber, this was the exact silver lining I pitched to my English friend.

    Great minds think alike! 😉

    Saw this on twitter I wonder what it will look like at the end of the season

    Highest Contested Rebound%:

    1. M Robinson: 71.0%—103 CRBS
    2. AD: 56.5%—153
    3. Poeltl: 56.3%—111
    4. Adams: 56.0%—141
    5. Duren: 55.1%—97
    6. Capela: 53.1%—155
    7. Zubac: 52.6%—162
    8. Hartenstein: 52.2—93
    9. Plumlee: 50.2%—120
    10. Sengun: 49.7%—95

    From what I remember from some podcasts (but I can be wrong), SoS is considered a “legit stat” even if it doesn’t take into account injured players and one of his main components (the “rankings”) are “subjective”.

    Anyway, I understand the need to acknowledge when other teams are missing players (and I always annoyingly point it out 🙂 ), you need to consider it when trying to extract some “truths” out of games.

    But the same Hornets’ lineup we beat came from two contested losses with Nets and Clippers and yesterday we dominated for long stretches.

    They’re bad but we managed them in the “right way” and at the end you can only beat who you’re playing.

    Players are missing everywhere (the Nets are without 8 players tonight in Indiana) but the Pelicans w/out Ingram and Herb Jones beat the Suns yesterday, the Pistons with Cunningham out beat the full strenght Mavs last week and so on.

    That said, I don’t know if we’re real or fake, eye test support the stats and suggest there’s some truth in our renewed defense, the Kings will be a good test.

    Looks like it was a good thing that I skipped out on watching the Charlotte game and got drinks with a friend instead, not even going to click on that game thread, lol.

    All I have to say right now is: we look kinda good! We play some ugly basketball, but, still, we’ve been pretty good lately. I’ll take it. Would love to beat the Kings at home tomorrow.

    I’ve liked Randle’s offensive play this year, and what’s interesting is he’s done it in a pretty unique way.

    He’s still not shooting much *at* the rim per se, but he’s traded nearly all of his long mid rangers for threes and shots in the floater range. His 3PT shot has been good enough (though a few more ticks up would be nice) and he’s nailing the floater range shots (50% from 3-10).

    If he’s tradable, and I’m still unsure because his fit on a contender is up in the air, it presents the front office with a conundrum. Trading Randle would give them an opportunity to do a reset of sorts that could change the calculus on trading Quickley, among other things.

    Occam’s Razor suggests they simply won’t do it because they’re trying to win as many games as possible and Randle is helping them do it, but it’s worth remembering their original plan sure seemed to be to trade him and start the guy they were salivating over in the 2021 draft (Obi). Obi’s injury complicates this but it’s hard to imagine they’d let a relatively short term injury have so much influence over a major decision.

    It’ll be interesting to see what they do at the deadline if we’re still around .500. Feels like there’s potential for some rather significant jiggering between Rose, Cam, Fournier, Quickley, and maaaaaaybe Randle…

    Pepper, not sure that accounts for the injuries. So for example it might be crediting us with beating Denver based on Denver’s play on the year rather than the Denver team we actually beat.

    not sure how legit this thing is…but given the perceived “we played alot of sucky teams and good teams with players missing”…this seems to suggest we have had it tough in the early going….

    http://powerrankingsguru.com/nba/strength-of-schedule.php

    The Knicks are .500 against the spread which is probably the best way to look at it since it takes into account players being out. So thoroughly mediocre. Let’s see if the difference Grimes and Deuce have made defensively is a real sustainable thing going forward, Brunson and Randle keep things going offensively, and RJ gets his head out of his ass on both ends then they might not be mediocre. Still, for me to genuinely excited about their long-term prospects either Grimes has to show another gear offensively by significantly upping his usage or RJ has to really turn it around- and not like second half of last season .530 TS, I mean like being actually good.

    I’d be shocked if they traded Randle. I just don’t think they can get commensurate value for him, so why bother? They will likely just stick with the plan that they had when you extended him…especially now that he’s shown more willingness to defer…

    personal attacks are a bridge too far…

    hopefully that’s a genie that can go back in to the bottle…

    scorched earth discourse is an indication of something…certain things should not come out…some of those things did…

    very disappointed to read some stuff someone shared in confidence here – thrown back in their face…

    there is no excuse fir that…none at all…

    we all have bad days, but…there needs to be some well of restraint to be drawn on…

    Also since no one took a stab at my question of who is second on the team in FG% 0-3 I’ll just answer it- Quentin Grimes at .793 (!!!). And 0-3 make up 31% of his shot attempts. Of course 30% of 9.3 shot attempts per 36 doesn’t get you too far but baby steps! He’s 22 and missed a bunch of his rookie year.

    my level of paranoia is pretty high…

    breaches of trust are no small thing…

    I know anger, I’m very familiar with rage…there has to be some ability for self restraint, not just physically, but verbally also…

    there just can’t be an anything goes mentality…I’ve seen it up close, in more than one person…

    it leads to hard times and ruin…

    Here’s another interesting factoid. In the last three wins, we’ve only lost one quarter (second quarter of Sunday’s Cleveland game, which still left us up at the half).

    I’m actually super impressed as the team has normally been hideously see-saw, going on runs, then giving up runs in ghastly stretches. We’re not doing that lately, and just slowly but surely grinding the other teams down, pretty much from the opening tip to the final buzzer.

    We play some ugly basketball, but, still, we’ve been pretty good lately.

    it was a fun game to watch…offensively, we still play like an iso half-court team; however – with deuce, grimes and quik guarding the perimeter and mitch guarding the rim, it’s fun again watching them play defense…

    deuce is getting after folks and throwing his body around in the paint on D…

    he seems to have solved the toughest riddle of all on defense – how to get around the screen…

    occasionally he’ll pick up the ball handler in the back court…it seems to be working for the moment…

    Did anyone ever answer the trivia question about RJ’s best comp? I know the answer was Tony Douglas (surprisingly not Starks), but I don’t recall if it got answered.

    speaking of coaches that should be gone – jeff monken…army coach…

    saw him berate a football player right before running in to halftime a couple of seasons ago…

    he started out real well, they changed their recruiting methods, used more analytics for that…got better athletes, used the run game…

    they’ve lost some good coaches from their staff (they won a bunch), this year started trying to pass and are 5 and 6 heading in to OT today…

    still, the way he spoke to that young cadet was way off…monken was consumed by the game and with winning…

    forgot this young man was there to train to lead soldiers, potentially in combat…

    anyways, go army…

    Also, let’s hope ISM makes it to the game tomorrow. Kings shot 48.5% from three yesterday…

    Although maybe with our three young wing nuts we can defend the line now…

    Geo, I appreciate your kindness, as always, but I brushed that one off rather easily. I love my son so much, I’m so blessed to have him, and frankly I’m proud of his origin story, too. His mother used to be like “what should we tell people?” and I always said “the truth, proudly, and with your head held high.” I know if we’re proud of it, he will be, too. So yeah, no one can weaponize that against me.

    Oh and the truth is he was conceived on thanksgiving, at one of those ones I used to throw for anyone who had nowhere to go. I started that tradition in 2008 bc I didn’t have a large family to celebrate with, I kept it up for ten years, and then it yielded the greatest gift of all! That’s as good as any love story between two people that’s ever been.

    I think you all know Patrick Ewing is my favorite Knick ever, and a big reason i am a Knicks fan. All this to say that lately i’ve been reading a lot here about John Starks awful game 7, but i don’t know if the young ones among you know how Starks played in game 6, and that if Ewing hadn’t gone 6-20 from the field (30%), we would’ve won a game we lost by only 2 points. So go check the stats for that game and please hold Starks higher in your opinions. Just wanted to clear this out, because i love Starks too and all that team from 1994. No one was to blame for the defeat, it was a valiant effort and we were really close but couldn’t finish it.

    Sad truth is that Hakeem was just better than Ewing. Almost identical supporting casts but the matchup that mattered most favored the Rockets. That said, I would have loved to see what Ewing’s career might have been without the knee issues. He was so athletic at Georgetown and by year five that guy was long gone.

    anyways, go army…

    @Geo
    way back when I did my mandatory army duty, my barracks weren’t far away from Aviano’s US/Nato base.

    On weekends, when off duty, we used to go there because it was like a “little America”, there were bars and restaurants where you could eat, have brunch, drink and watch sports as if you were in the USA, frequented mostly by military men and women.

    I happened to be there for some Army/Air Force/Navy football games and it was very fun… brawls, braggs and a lot of beer 😀

    awwww, a good friend of mine was stationed in aviano…she loved it there…

    I visited a friend who lived in vicienza (can’t remember the spelling)…after living in germany for a while, I was struck just by how festive everything seemed..

    @Geo
    There’s the Camp Ederle base in Vicenza if memory serves,
    many sweet natural places around there and nice cities close enough to pay a visit.

    Sad truth is that Hakeem was just better than Ewing. Almost identical supporting casts but the matchup that mattered most favored the Rockets.

    I actually believe we had a very big advantage in the supporting cast, but Hakeem beat Ewing bad enough to overcome it.

    If Patrick had just played Hakeem to almost even, we would have one.

    That’s not a knock on Patrick, though. Hakeem’s two title seasons were extraordinary. He wiped the floor with Shaq the next year, too. That was just an all time great at his all time best.

    And Cyber’s right about Starks. He was lights on in game 6. Hakeem got a finger nail on his would-be-game-winning 3PA, and I have no doubt if Olajuwon had cut his fingernails that day, John Starks would have hit that shot to win the title.

    As you can tell by the typos (“one”, “lights on”), now I’m the tipsy one. Good night, everyone! Merry Christmas.

    the nets are fielding a g league squad tonight…i guess because its a back to back…they are keeping it close…i wonder if the line took that into account, i.e,. do they announce that earlier in the day…

    Looks like Lord Sumner is torching the Pacers, so i’m feeling a little better, i thought he’d only play well against the Knicks.

    Does this qualify as Haiku?

    “Do you remember,

    When Mr. November

    Actually played well in December?”

    @Cyber — Starks is my all time favorite (see profile pic). Thanks for having his back.

    I work at a middle school and have to deal with stupid juvenile drama involving the students and yet they seem more mature than some of the stuff we’ve had to deal with on this site lately.

    1994 Knicks and Rockets supporting casts were virtually identical. Harper and Starks dominated Kenny Smith and Maxwell but off the bench Cassell and Elie did the same to Anthony and Davis. Horry was much better than Charles Smith but Mase was better than Herrerra. Oak and Thorpe was a wash.

    Did anyone ever answer the trivia question about RJ’s best comp? I know the answer was Tony Douglas (surprisingly not Starks), but I don’t recall if it got answered.

    Yep. There was a whole riff on what it was, exactly, that Toney Douglas did.

    “d-mar says:
    December 10, 2022 at 23:24
    I think the Warriors may well have Jayson Tatum’s number”

    And without Andrew Wiggins no less…although the Celts were without Horford…

    “Brian Cronin says:
    December 10, 2022 at 23:14
    The Bulls somehow scored over 140 points on the Mavericks. Bee-zarre.”

    The Mavs without Doncic….yikes.

    PS Frank with the 0-7 for 0 points. Some things never change!

    Damn, Uncle Steve is bonkers. That puts the Mets at something like $480M in payroll cost when you factor in the luxury tax. I guess if I had $10 billion and I was running the New York Mets, I’d probably do the same thing. Ten billion is a lot of dollars.

    Remarkably the Mets don’t really seem like they have upgraded all that much from last year, although they did win 101 games so that’s a high baseline. This is just what it was going to cost to compete at that level again because of the way the 2022 Mets were constructed, they had so many players in their walk year.

    Their starting pitching does figure to be a little better, because they’ll likely get more innings from Verlander than they got from deGrom last year, and Senga and Quintana are a good bet to replace Bassitt and Walker’s production. Peterson is probably a better pitcher than Carrasco at this point but either guy is probably the best #6 starter in the league. Their top 7 starters should give them a lot of good innings.

    Senga’s contract, in a vacuum, is pretty reasonable, they’re getting him for $15M AAV. The five years is a little long but I’m guessing Cohen has done the math here and doesn’t care whether he loses a few hundred million a year on the Mets for a while. This is a very strange feeling for me as a Mets fan, it’s like he’s going even beyond Steinbrenner-ian levels here. The OG Steinbrenner, that is.

    Yeah, it’s kind of hilarious that after all that spending they’re basically roughly as good as last year’s team. The joke, of course, will be that Verlander and Scherzer will both end the season with aching Achilles.

    It’s a big bill for the Mets but the fact both Max and Verlander are on reasonably short deals makes it feel pretty safe. It’s kind of a perfect solution.

    And I’d agree they were really good last year so paying to stay that way seems reasonable.

    Are those Mitch contested board numbers broken out by off and def? Mitch comes up with offensive boards I can’t believe all the time but I don’t feel that way on defense. Obviously it’s much harder when you are contesting so many shots.

    I was really surprised the Nets won. The Pacers had that gsme

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