There are so many rumors flying around, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the Knicks just end up doing nothing but make their pick (unless Rose wants even more 2023 picks, of course).
Let’s hope that something cool happens!
There are so many rumors flying around, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the Knicks just end up doing nothing but make their pick (unless Rose wants even more 2023 picks, of course).
Let’s hope that something cool happens!
370 replies on “The Basketball Gods Owe Us One: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread”
Just watched megadeth’s new single with the prophetic (?) Title “We’ll be back”
Let’s see..
Feels like picking 11th is the least likely thing we do. Still think end game for Leon is to push to move up and get Ivey, but not sure we can get it done. If he can’t get it done, I think we move back pending who is on the board at 11.
Like I said the vibes for this one feel off.
4th in!
My wife ran me out of the living room, so I have to watch in the bedroom…she said she’s not going to hear me yelling at the TV again when the Knicks do something stupid.
Jaden Hardey’s outfit makes me think he’s going to ask me to donate to his mega church.
another w for the prop line
Is there a way to not have the picks spoiled by Woj/Shams, but still learn of the trades? It’s pretty annoying they’ve basically tanked the viewing experience with this shtick of theirs.
Based off of the pregame family cat-walk, I like Jabari Smith and Mathurin. Everybody else looks terrified.
Don’t know about that purple suit. Banchero trending down.
Chet has major Herro energy. Love it.
Astros as usual embarrassing the Yankees so I guess I’ll stick with the NBA draft tonight.
Here’s my last-minute board I threw together in 5mins. I’m sure it will make the object of ridicule for many years to come:
1. Chet Holmgren
2. Jabari Smith
3. Keegan Murray
4. Dyson Daniels
5. Tari Eason
6. Jaden Ivey
7. Shaedon Sharpe
8. Paolo Banchero
9. Kennedy Chandler
10. Josh Minott
11. Johnny Davis
12. Jalen Williams
13. Tyty Washington
14. Benedict Mathurin
15. Jake Laravia
16. Malaki Branham
17. Jeremy Sochan
18. AJ Griffin
19. Ousmane Dieng
20. Dalen Terry
21 EJ Liddell
22. Blake Wesley
23. Jaden Duren
24. Mark Williams
25. Walker Kessler
26. Jaden Hardy
27. Christian Braun
28. Gabrielle Procida
29. Ryan Rollins
30. Ismael Kamagate
Bonus:
31. Jaylin Williams
32. Ochai Agbaji
I still think a trade down with a very underwhelming payoff, then a selection of a low ceiling but playable dude when the Knicks do eventually pick
WOJ Bomb!
I feel even better about Chet now that I know the Magic are passing him.
Just remember how excited Knicks fans were when they drafted John Wallace!
Woj always wins.
What the hell is this suit. Looks like some version of a green screen CGI outfit
He called this like 5 minutes before, but earlier in the day he said Smith-Chet-Banchero was basically locked in so it’s a bit of an L for him too.
conflicting leaks for number 2 this draft is off to a killer start
Oh interesting, missed the WOJ bobble.
I don’t see Paulo as a #1 but we will see
He looks like he was going for Prince, but ended up as the Purple Riddler.
Wow, curveball already…
Chet’s dad is not small. This was the right pick.
Poku and Chet is going to be hilarious.
So I read in RealGM “The Los Angeles Lakers have acquire the No. 35 pick from the Orlando Magic for a future second round pick.” How did they do this? Did the Magic just “incinerate” their pick or did the Lakers give something more than a future second?
So much suspense for pick 3….
(Please be Ivey to throw a wrench in everything)
Here we go!
#4
Love Jabari’s suit. Love that he can shoot threes. Don’t know if I am buying the defensive rep but I think he works out better than Banchero.
Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
The Kings are focused on Iowa’s Keegan Murray at No. 4, source tells ESPN.
Can the Knicks get #5?
Kings making this pick?
Ivey’s mom at the top of my big board
Woj has been very diligent about saying “atop their board” rather than “have chosen”.
Pretty wild top 5 so far
I guess I’m not surprised the Kings picked someone an analyst just called the most “nba-ready” player available.
Kendrick Perkins, not sure how I feel about him being the new guy. He is on PTI a lot. He’s ok I guess.
damn…i’m crying watching murray’s dad crying…
The ABC coverage has Jalen and Stephen A fyi. I can’t stand Perk.
Murray was really good in college, I think that was a pretty solid pick. Maybe Ivey has more upside but Murray is a legit prospect
DRed, I see where you are coming from. Quite plunging that décollatage.
I would’ve taken Ivey 4th, but Murray is a very solid prospect. How he fits with Sabonis is another story. Personally, I would not have accounted for Davion Mitchell at all while making this pick. Sounds like Ivey basically ghosted them though.
Stephen A is hard for me.
These Ivey clips are nice. I get it. But I like Murray too.
Yeah, I don’t mind Murray over Ivey at all. Ivey has way more bust potential than Murray.
Stephen A and Kendrick Perkins are both impossible to watch.
So Portland at 7 is the next team that could move their pick. Doubt we have what they want to complete a deal.
uhhh don’t blink
I’m on ESPN. I’ll take Perkins over Stephen A.
Offensively, Murray and Sabonis is going to be a great duo to watch. Defensively, the other team will also think they’re a great duo to watch.
MATHURIN!
Love that suit.
Mathurin best dressed so far
Jake Fischer: Knicks still looking to acquire Ivey
BRB need to redo my big board
Yeah that’s a great look
Kendrick comping him to Manu is causing a storm of emotions.
those french canadians have the “je ne sais quois” with fashion..
Knicks: Hey could we get Ivey?
Detroit: lol nah
Knicks: please?
Lol I can’t even begin to imagine what Detroit would ask for to trade Ivey tonight.
I’m not buying that as serious.
What do we have that the Pistons would want?
They are young and up and coming. They just selected a young player that’s a good prospect that will fit.
Next
Knicks: But, we’ll include Randle!
Detroit: *click*
Wow, Sharpe going to Portland. There’s no way they keep this pick, right?
We really need to trade down a few spots
Didn’t realize Sharpe was Canadian. Seems like a reasonable lotto ticket.
“Jake Fischer: Knicks still looking to acquire Ivey”
And the Knick rumors become more and more absurd…..
Just Stop Already – none of this made up shit is attached to reality
Supposedly DET is interested in Duren who we could draft at 11.
Begley also reported the continued interest in Ivey. DET may just be looking for leverage. DET may not seriously entertain it. I don’t know.
There goes Sharpe. I guess we just went from exciting to Blah
This has gotta be a trade for Portland, Sharpe is all well and good value wise there but he does nothing for Dame in the short term.
This is a depressing draft so far. Teams are making good picks and not trading them to the Knicks.
And with the 11th pick, the NY Knicks draft “Incinerate Pick”
Although, I guess a trade for Ivey is still possible, assuming it depends on who is available at 11. If I were Detroit id want to know that before closing the deal.
Well, Ivey’s mother has competition
I would’ve drafted Dyson Daniels just so his mom could attend all the games.
It’s ironic that he gets this and yet still rebuilding eludes him.
Why would they want to hold on to all those 19 & 20 year olds who will take 7 years to develop when we can offer them Alec Burks, Julius Randle, and a host of veterans who can catapult them into contention?
I already forgot more than you know. To a man with only a hammer, everything looks like a nail. I want to use a tool box.
Detroit will probably be really good in 5-6 years if all their young players improve enough and they can keep them all long enough.
From Twitter scuttlebutt it does sound like if we draft Duren there’s the possibility of completing a deal. Probably Duren and a couple 1sts?
If we wanted ammo to make an enormous trade up, we needed more and better assets.
Guessing SA takes Sochan because that’s such a SA pick
Not sure who the woman emceeing the telecast is but she does a good job.
I would have been happy with any of these guys. But our 37 wins? Will never forget those.
Do you think the Mavs would accept 11 and their 2023 first for Ntilikina, or would we have to throw in IQ?
And now a beat writer for the Pistons says they’re keeping Ivey. Unsurprising.
‘This is a depressing draft so far. Teams are making good picks and not trading them to the Knicks.”
1
I guess either Davis or Griffin to the Knicks if they don’t trade down?
Sochan coming off the board from the team I thought would save us from Duren is a gut punch…
Good call on Sochan.
Every team is making picks that I think are great fits for the players. Lots of these guys are going to maximize their values.
spike backstage talking to Ivey
To be clearer, we have several good young players, but we don’t want to give any of them up to add a different young player that will take us backwards in the short term and maybe forward in the long term. We want to use pick power to add a higher quality young player and move forward short and long term. I don’t think Detroit is a prime candidate for that kind of trade, but I could be wrong on that. Sac and Port were more in that category because we could toss in some players that might help them now without hurting us much, but even that was a longshot.
Guessing AJ is the pick
I remember the first draft that I realized all the picks were younger than me. Now I’m realizing all the picks’ moms aren’t even within my Bumble preferences anymore.
If you’re on Twitter you now know who is available. Won’t spoil WAS pick.
This really isn’t rocket science. Since we haven’t had particularly high picks, none of our players are all that appealing to other teams in this kind of trade and since we’ve decided to shoot for .500 every year our future picks aren’t all that appealing either. We can’t bully teams into accepting our pupu platters. Relying on other teams to deliver us a superstar was always a bad plan.
Pretty much the nightmare 1-10 for the Knicks.
Looking like Aj Griffin. Sigh.
Knicks going AJ at 11 maybe?
i can be talked into AJ Griffin if he is the pick
Shams says it’s Dieng.
Oh dear I hope we’re trading down
Looks like Dieng is the pick?
Vecenie on Dieng:
If the Knicks select Duren that could mean a trade is coming.
Very long wing, had slow start to Australian league season. Finished much better. Probably a bit of a project.
Eventually can pass, shoot, and defend. Has all the tools, it’s a question of if it comes together in the NBA.
WOW
trade down?
Woj: The Knicks are trading the No. 11 pick to OKC, who will select Ousmane Dieng, sources tell ESPN.
Oh thank god
I won’t lie, I wouldn’t mind picking Tyty here. I’m a big believer that Calipari is a terrible coach who holds back his players.
RJ is not the future of this team. But hopefully Ousmane is.
When have we ever gone wrong with a French draft pick?
If you wanted high-ceiling, Dieng is high-ceiling.
Trade!!!
He’s a very OKC player
Who is Dieng and why Dieng??
Trade down hell yeah
Woj says Knicks are getting back MULTIPLE first round picks going forward! I am a fan!
What? Oh, a trade.
We’re supposedly getting multiple 1st round picks back? I didn’t know we were allowed to do that.
@Woj, multiple picks coming back. 1sts rders
A trade for future firsts is what I’m hearing
Dieng is a great prospect. OKC is a great fit for him. Raw but really improved for NZ in the back half of the year.
I wonder how “multiple” the multiple first round picks are. But at first glance this looks like a solid move. This might turn out pretty good
Since we’re not getting the 12th pick, I wonder if we traded out of this first round altogether. Trading down from 11 to 30 feels kind of dumb unless we’re getting a bunch of future picks.
Are we back?
Anyone know what the worst picks OKC is owed? What are the chances those are the picks we’re getting?
I need details
okay then, let’s see what comes next for us…
Unless they have two players in mind they like a lot, I’m going to guess that one of the 1st rounders they get back is a future pick. I have a hard time thinking they are going to add TWO young rookies to this team unless they are absolutely in love with two of them or know they are going to move a few players in deals to come later and open slots.
Very interested to see what picks. OKC has like 4 or 5 next year, but I think there are protections on some of their picks in the next two years.
Rumors are going crazy right now with the Knicks and Pistons.
what the fuck is going on
Duren to the Knicks?!
https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/1540143756216881155
Hey guys, anyone have a clue what the hell is going on? I don’t like the sound of this but it seems very plausible:
are we somehow flipping duren plus for ivey?
Ivey still in play?
Looks like he’s going to Detroit?
>Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
The Pistons are acquiring Jalen Duren at No. 13 in a trade, source tells ESPN.<
That's the trade I speculated on if the Knicks took him. It will be interesting to see what that's about. The Pistons wanted Duren.
WTF is going on?!?!?!
Guess: Duren DAL pick, OKC pick & Duren for Ivey. No idea what CHA gets?
I love how this shitty-ass team is always “too good” for all the players on the board. Give me a fucking break.
is it a replay of last year where we traded our current picks to future picks????
Come on KB, stay with us!!!
Somebody explain what’s going on!!!
We used the fucking 13th pick to dump Kemba’s $9M???? That’s worse than incineration
Kemba to Pistons?????
Lol!!!!!!! We are getting picks to dump salary to sign overrated free agents to get to the lottery to get more picks to dump the salary of that free agent. The cycle continues 😀
They did want a center. Maybe Mitch really is re-signing and Ayton too expensive.
Cap relief… we got cap relief…
Sounds like we essentially used the pick to dump Kemba’s contract plus get back some other unknown draft assets in future years. Looks like another year of “let’s burn assets to get out of failed free agent contracts so we can sign new free agent contracts that are sure to work out differently.”
I love how this has led to a lot of tweets that will look foolish in retrospect about how the Knicks trading for Duren means they’re done with Mitch, when the deal actually seems to be meaning the exact opposite.
I will wait on the details but this smells fucking DUMB
No. Fuck no we didn’t. Don’t fucking say that.
can’t figure out what we had to give to get detroit to take kemba
Presumably they acquired Duren with some of the picks they got for number 11? That’s depressing.
Well, I guess we’ll see how this all shakes out but yeah, this doesn’t look super promising.
Are they clearing cap to try and get Kyrie? I mean, Dolan’s Razor and all
OK, now I’m lost.
Woj and Sham are saying different things or each is only telling us half the story.
No idea what just happened good job NBA reporters
Using a lottery pick to dump the 1/$9M left on Kemba’s contract would be right there with anything all of the other fucking schmucks did
detroit gave a first to charlotte in the deal. the question is what did we have to give in addition.
Per Woj:
Tremendous coup for Detroit GM Troy Weaver to land two of his top targets in this draft: Jaden Ivey and Jalen Duren — with the cost of only a future first-round pick.
So we got a future first in the Kemba Duren trade I think?
Edit: ah nvm Charlotte gets it. What is going on
Smells like Leon’s Big Move is coming !
I didn’t think the Knicks could screw this up but hey, they are creative.
It seems impossible to me thought that we moved this pick just for 9m in cap space. They can’t be that stupid.
I got excited about Ousmane Dieng for a second.
The only two times we’ve gotten fair value for trading down under Rose has been with OKC. I get the sense that Presti just doesn’t fuck around and offers fair value up front so he can get a quick yes.
No, I’m pretty sure the future first is going to Charlotte. We’re obviously missing a ton of details.
We now have about $15M free when we waive Taj. Trade just Burks or Noel and we’re under.
We got two 1sts for OKC’s pick so hopefully we’re holding onto one.
It should be seppuku.
Rockets selecting Eason smh
i’m guessing we gave a bunch of seconds
That’s the way I would interpret it.
I’m kind of lost on what the Knicks actually have at this point. I’m not sure Sham is right about any what he’s saying about Kemba etc… but I still don’t think the Knicks are looking to add TWO young players this year. I do think they have other moves in mind in trades/FA. I’m a little shaken, but we’ll see who is right about what.
Are we lighting picks on fire again? What is happening?
So wait, are we still two 1sts up? I don’t hate that.
Calm down… wait for detials… *fails at meditating*
I agree it is bad, but it is hard when you’re reliant on what the teams are telling you and you want to break news ahead of the other guy.
Have a terrible feeling we’re trying to get Kyrie
My “underwhelming trade down” prediction is looking pretty good
#Can it be seppuku?#
It can be almost anything
Yeah, I assume Woj & Shams just don’t know but want to get info out. I’d rather know we made a move than think we still had Dieng.
We are absolutely trying to get Kyrie.
I remember the first draft that I realized all the picks were younger than me. Now I’m realizing all the picks’ moms aren’t even within my Bumble preferences anymore.
story of my life 🙂
I know some people who know Kyrie it turns out and they all say he is a great guy in person but he has major Marbury energy.
Jabari has mastered speaking about himself in the third person.
I think Mark Williams will have a long successful career.
And yeah, Eason to Houston is a tiny gut punch
I’m keeping MULTIPLE from all this mess and waiting for the splash
I have no problem with that if it’s true That often their best use. We had a huge surplus and were never going to draft and keep all those 2nd round players.
From what I’ve been able to decipher this is all about signing Brunson.
I think this is all we know for sure:
1) We traded 11 for “multiple firsts” from OKC
2) We somehow got 13 from Charlotte, I would presume we used some or all of those OKC picks to do so but we don’t know that
3) We sent 13 and Kemba to Detroit
Com on Leon!
Surprise Us!
Once again!
Bring the Messiah!
I would have thought Kemba would have been the easiest contract to unload.
Maybe a future 1st from DET so we’re even? please
Assuming this is true, then the net is likely we gave up our 11th pick and used part of the proceeds to acquire Duren and move him to Detroit along with Walker. So we have one future first round pick we didn’t have before and we got rid of Walker in return for our 11th pick. If the first we got is decent and the available bodies at 11 were very meh, this could be a reasonable outcome. I wouldn’t be surprised if they used that new first rounder to trade for someone.
Does anyone know what future picks we’ve received yet?
Charlotte’s getting four 2nds. I would imagine most are coming from us.
Kemba should have been kidnapped and sent to Ukraine instead of burning a pick to unload himbut…
>Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
Kemba Walker and the Pistons are expected to discuss a contract buyout that will allow him to become a free agent, sources tell ESPN. Walker landed with Detroit as part of three-way trade with Charlotte and New York.<
This does not sound good. We'll see what it cost.
Withholding judgment until we have details but putting a lot of draft capital into the opportunity to sign Brunson to a massive deal would be a mistake. Good player but looks to me like he’s going to be more than fairly compensated by the market and we’re not at all in a position to get excess value from that contract.
If only we weren’t required to spend all our cap space every year. We wouldn’t be using draft capital to dump 1 year contacts ?
It’s an interesting question. It seems hard to believe it would be all of them, right? Since otherwise they could have just drafted Duren at #11 and traded that to Detroit with Kemba, right? But why would Charlotte trade #13 for just one of the picks the Knicks got from OKC? There has to be another shoe that hasn’t dropped yet. We know Charlotte got the Milwaukee future first rounder in 2025 in the deal. That shouldn’t be enough on its own, but maybe it was and the Knicks just threw in second rounders?
If the Knicks are making moves like this, they better have a signed and sealed agreement on something pretty darn good over the next week plus. I can’t wait to see the cost and ultimate return to see whether I should be upset and how much.
Yeah, that’s really the rub. A lot of it will be in the details of what comes next. I don’t like trading out of #11, but I do like that Rose has seemingly come to the conclusion that it makes sense to clear cap space to sign someone and then re-sign Mitch. I just don’t want it to involve first round picks to do so.
They had 15 too. Maybe didn’t feel the need for both picks that close together in a weak draft. May feel better about next year’s draft or another draft.
I doubt we gave anything to DET since they got their guy in Duren. If anything I’d expect we got more. Dumping Kemba is a cheap price for giving them a coveted draft pick.
Elephant in the room is by dumping Kemba alone…we still do not have close to the space to max Brunson. We have around $13M, give or take depending on the final cap number.
If it cost a lottery pick to dump Kemba, we’re looking at the statue of fucking liberty for the other bums.
Of course Memphis gets Jake Laravia. Continue to be the best drafters.
Weird that no one has even reported the actual trade yet. The pending feeling of getting hosed is hard to shake, but here’s to hoping for the best.
I don’t see it that way. I see that we acquired at least two first round picks and sent out at most one first round pick. So we gained at least one future first round pick. We got rid of Walker’s contract without taking a player back in return, so we gained cap space. Of course, it matters exactly which first round and second round picks are involved, but the net of all the deals doesn’t sound like it has to be a disaster.
Trading a first to dump 9 million in salary is pretty fucking stupid
And I’m not going to evaluate the moves under the assumption that we are going to blow the new first round pick on something stupid or clear cap space that we don’t end up using. That hasn’t happened yet.
“Trading a first to dump 9 million in salary is pretty fucking stupid”.
I can’t imagine that’s what happened. If so, I’d fire Rose on the spot.
If this is all for Brunson, is he really even close to worth it? I know he’s a good young player and would only get the mini-max as a 4th year guy, but isn’t that still a pretty large overpay?
Wouldn’t be the first time we did something I didn’t even list in my worst case scenarios because I couldn’t fathom it in advance
We need to find out what future 1st rd picks from OKC the Knicks still have assuming they traded some type of future draft pick compensation to Detroit.
Duren went to DET. The 1sts would’ve gone to CHA.
It is, but we don’t know what other spinach is in the deal yet. Remember that all the second round picks going to Detroit for Grant took a day or so to come out in the news.
Anyway, at least this draft is giving us stuff to talk about. Just drafting Dieng and nothing else would be pretty boring. And on the plus side, Knicks management seems to agree with the KB hive mind that the teams above us picked the interesting players and didn’t leave much that was exciting.
hate me for it but i say berman would have had the terms by now
2023 DEN 1st
2023 NYK 2nd
2023 Utah 2nd
2023 DAL/MIA 2nd (most favorable)
2024 Knicks 2nd
As per CHA beat writer. So we’re down three 2nds.
***Does anyone know what future picks we’ve received yet?***
Pick-axe to the head.
Ice-pick in the eye.
And a lottery-protected toothpick under the fingernail.
We should forget about Pedestrian Draft Nights with innocent fan hopes on our first rounder.
Leon turned them into Complex Progressive Calculations on How to Maintain your Temperature while shocking your temper.
We are on the same page. I’m just going to explode if they are doing this on speculation they can sign someone and then he rejects us like all the rest.
I really have no opinion on these draft selections. I haven’t seen any of them play at all. My only opinion is this is already a young team plus a handful of teacher’s pets and mentors. I don’t think they wanted to add another young players unless he had a chance to be an all star. They are mostly looking for someone young in a trade/FA, but more advanced than these 19 year olds. Then they can sign Mitch. If it’s Brunson and they get him, I’ll be shocked unless they overpay a lot. And then we can whine about that.
I don’t think it is as bad as it looks. I think the trade of #11 just looks confusing in context of the trade for #13. My bet is that they used multiple seconds to acquire #13 so that they could use it to dump Kemba’s salary. I don’t think many of us would mind using multiple seconds to dump Kemba. I mean, I don’t like it, but I don’t really mind it, either. So the #11 trade was likely something totally separate, just a desire to get future picks because they didn’t like who was at #11 and wanted to save the money they would need for #11 (not signing #11 freed up another $5 million to go with Kemba’s $8 million).
I’m not saying that I agree with punting on #11, but it’s different than trading a first rounder to dump Kemba’s salary. I do not believe that that is what happened here.
Now looks like the Knicks only traded a couple of future 2nd rd picks for Duren then traded him to Detroit along with Kemba? So the Knicks basically punted on the 11th pick this year, got future 1st rd picks and are banking on signing Brunson and re-signing Mitch.
If we get Brunson for essentially three 2nds. That’s a good move. Not clear at all what other moving parts there are. I’m holding out hope we got something from DET. Kemba is a low price to give them Duren.
@rodboone
Sources: #Hornets compensation for Jalen Duren:
2023 Denver 1st round pick
2023 Knicks 2nd round pick
2023 Utah 2nd round pick
2023 Dallas/Miami 2nd round pick (most favorable)
2024 Knicks 2nd round pick
10:02 PM · Jun 23, 2022·Twitter for Android
that denver first implies that we got the bucks 2025 pick from detroit and gave charlotte a denver 2023 first we got from okc?
If that’s it, no problemo. We were never going to use all those picks and keep those kids. Now it’s one to what we are going to do with the space. That’s the scarier part.
That would be the implication, yes.
Three conditional first round picks from OKC. I wonder which ones?
This has nothing to do with the Knicks but AARON HICKS!!!
@popper: Adam Silver announces it’s 3 conditional first round picks that the Knicks got from OKC. Expecting the exact numbers soon – OKC has a LOT of picks coming up (4 next year – minus Denver 1st Knicks are getting and sending out to Charlotte)
So we got 3 future conditional 1st round picks for the 11th pick?
I guess not only did we not want more than 1 young player out of this draft. We didn’t want any.
We are all about the trades and free agency this year. That should cost some people some sleep.
If the news is broken by Adam Silver…
Maybe Knicks too busy to talk to Woj/Shams lol
it’s possible we got three firsts from okc and traded one to charlotte but then got the bucks first from detroit. plus all 4 of those seconds out (i think those were all ours).
Yeah, those picks were definitely acquired to be traded, no doubt about that.
oh fuck morey got melton
I’m pleased with myself for figuring out the general trade details before they broke. 🙂
I’m so confused as to what is actually happening
Thoughts and prayers PT.
I think Kessler will be a solid pro too.
I am too confused to opine.
Also Popper—
“Here is the only math that makes sense – Knicks get 3 future 1sts for No. 11. Send 1 of those – along with 2 2nds – to get rid of Kemba salary. Add in no 1st this year on cap and they are in the Brunson sweepstakes.”
This ends with Kyrie Irving cashing game checks from a super max salary and playing 0 minutes
So as of our current understanding, were up two 1sts and down three 2nds. Maybe a third 1st if we got MIL’s 2025?
*Somethings happening here, what it is ain’t exactly clear*
Why do we think we’re getting the Milwaukee first? All the reports were that it’s going to Charlotte. Why would we be getting any first for dumping Kemba?
On the face of it that is a reasonable deal for Dieng.
And I agree, they are likely trade fodder for us to acquire someone.
IIRC, one of OKC’s first round picks next year is like top 15 protected….I wonder if that’s one of the ones the Knicks got?
I gotta say I still hate using literally any first to dump a 1/$9M contract. Maybe this goes from an F- to an F.
You were better than my “expert” Twitter feed.
Odds we end up with TyTy somehow? 10:2?
Seems like a lot to just get rid of Kemba’s salary.
Currently looks like we turned 11 and a few 2nds into 2 future “firsts” of uncertain quality and conditionality while dumping Kemba. Not bad tactically depending on what the deal is with those picks but still very much questioning the strategic direction here as I kind of think Brunson is just a guy.
Crossing my fingers for Kennedy Chandler to get taken before the end of the round.
Because the reports currently don’t have it going to Charlotte, so that makes people think the Knicks swapped the 2023 Denver one for it. They would only be getting a first by virtue of trading a different first.
Kemba or Schroeder?
hmmm…
Ok, I guess I’ll wait until the details tomorrow because I’m still very confused lol.
This plus the Kyrie rumors are, at first glance, not optimal to say the least… but I guess we have to wait until we can be properly angry.
Ok, but I would assume that means the Milwaukee pick isn’t involved at all.
My rating went from very confused, to confused, to they better have something very good in store next week or my head is going to explode.
Could they be so crazy they are speculating they can get Brunson by maxing him and making the tax burden on the Mavs so onerous they just can’t keep him. Then we can all go crazy about how we came out of this without another solid rookie and overpaid for Brunson.
Shams:
Sources: The draft picks that New York acquired from OKC in the No. 11 Ousmane Dieng trade:
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Detroit
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Washington
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Denver
Our FO can’t possibly be dumb enough to trade #13 to clear a 1 year contract for $9M… They can’t possibly, I don’t care what the other moving pieces are.
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Detroit
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Washington
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Denver
Sources: The draft picks that New York acquired from OKC in the No. 11 Ousmane Dieng trade:
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Detroit
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Washington
– 2023 protected 1st rounder via Denver
It seems unlikely that Detroit got Duren just for taking Kemba’s salary. Trading a future first and taking on Kemba’s salary makes more sense, I think. Don’t get me wrong, if the Knicks traded a first and multiple seconds just to dump Kemba’s salary, then yes, that would be ungood.
Duren alone should fetch more than Kemba. That’s why I think they sent a 1st to the Knicks.
Lotto pick to dump a $9M contract would be insanely dumb.
These picks have to be a package for a trade, I really don’t see any other explanation, specially if they’re all lottery protected. I’m officially scared.
Protections on those picks:
2023 first round draft pick from Detroit
Detroit’s 1st round pick to Oklahoma City (via Houston) protected for selections 1-18 in 2023, 1-18 in 2024, 1-13 in 2025, 1-11 in 2026 and 1-9 in 2027; if Detroit has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Oklahoma City by 2027, then Detroit will instead convey its 2027 2nd round pick to Oklahoma City [Detroit-Houston, 11/24/2020; Houston-Oklahoma City, 7/30/2021
2023 first round draft pick from Washington
Washington’s 1st round pick to Oklahoma City (via Houston) protected for selections 1-14 in 2023, 1-12 in 2024, 1-10 in 2025 and 1-8 in 2026; if Washington has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Oklahoma City by 2026, then Washington will instead convey its 2026 2nd round pick and 2027 2nd round pick to Oklahoma City [Houston-Washington, 12/2/2020; Houston-Oklahoma City, 7/30/2021]
Not horrible, they eventually whittle down to top 9 and 8 protected.
So as I understand it, we flipped 2023 DEN for 2025 MIL? That one is just top 4 protected.
Those picks are so heavily protected I may not be alive to see them convey
Knicks should sign Aaron Judge.
Judge is a fucking winner
Ok
Now Let’s get Steph Curry!
But it was Charlotte’s pick, not ours.
Here are the protections in those picks.
Washington’s 1st round pick to Oklahoma City (via Houston) protected for selections 1-14 in 2023, 1-12 in 2024, 1-10 in 2025 and 1-8 in 2026; if Washington has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Oklahoma City by 2026, then Washington will instead convey its 2026 2nd round pick and 2027 2nd round pick
Detroit’s 1st round pick to Oklahoma City (via Houston) protected for selections 1-18 in 2023, 1-18 in 2024, 1-13 in 2025, 1-11 in 2026 and 1-9 in 2027; if Detroit has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Oklahoma City by 2027, then Detroit will instead convey its 2027 2nd round pick
Denver’s 1st round pick to Oklahoma City protected for selections 1-14 in 2023, 1-14 in 2024 and 1-14 in 2025; if Denver has not conveyed a 1st round pick to Oklahoma City by 2025, then Denver will instead convey its 2025 2nd round pick and 2026 2nd round pick
At least we have the Yankees
if we traded kemba and 13 to detroit what did we get in return?
I dunno, 3 pretty heavily protected firsts, like heavily protected enough that two of them may not even convey, seems like bad value for a lottery pick even in a weak draft.
You might even say we…
Maybe it’s Brunson to the Knicks and Kyrie to the Mavs in a trade. He put the Mavs on his list. That would be fun. I can imagine Luka’s face when Kyrie starts acting up. lmao
DET should be very good in the near future… should be
Would trade all the knicks players to all detroit players in a heartbeat
Dumping Kemba’s salary. That’s what it sounds like to me.
those picks are going to be nice for whoever takes over for Leon Rose……
Zach Lowe:
Clarifying: The Knicks will also be acquiring the Bucks 2025 first-round pick in the Pistons-Knicks-Hornets trade, per league sources. The Pistons got that MIL pick from Portland in the Jerami Grant deal yesterday.
Told y’all
Cronin running circles around these guys.
Btw, since Jayden Ivey went one pick after the Kings pick, he just punched his ticket to the NBA Hall of Fame
Yeah, that was clear when the Charlotte return no longer mentioned that pick. However, do note that that it was clear that the 2025 pick was considered worse than the Denver 2023 pick.
Not incinerated. Singed, maybe?
So we traded Kemba, a 2023 pick and a couple seconds for a 2025 pick?
So we traded 13 and Kemba for a 2025 MIL pick? That still doesn’t seem like good value, but it’s much less ridiculous.
KC is still out there. Go get him, Leon!
So we traded the 11th pick, the 13th pick, four future 2nd round picks, and Kemba Walker for two heavily protected future 1sts and a bottom 6 1st next year. I give up, fuck this team.
Looks like:
In:
-2023 first rounder from DET that’s 1-18 protected through 2024, 1-13 in ’25, 1-11 in ’26, 1-9 in 2027
-2023 first from WAS that’s 1-14, 1-12 in 2024, 1-10 in ’25, 1-8 in 2026.
-2025 first from MIL that’s 1-4, otherwise extinguished
Out:
-11th pick
-Kemba
-Four 2nds
Meh. C-. I think a savvier front office goes further than this with a lottery pick.
We need these picks to trade for the Cam Reddishes of tomorrow
I probably would have just drafted Tari Eason, but I imagine we are going to use these picks to shed guys we signed last year to get space for a free agent who isn’t going to sign with us
So that should be full deal:
Knicks in:
– 2023 DET 1st with protections
– 2023 WAS 1st with protections
– 2025 MIL 1st
Knicks out:
– 11th pick
– Kemba Walker
– 2023 NYK 2nd
– 2023 DAL/MIA 2nd (better of)
– 2023 UTA 2nd
– 2024 NYK 2nd
So in total:
– Up 2 likely(?) 1sts
– “Down” Kemba
– Down four 2nds
No, you can’t combine the #13 pick with the #11 like that. It’s instead the 11th pick, four future 2nd round picks and Kemba Walker for two heavily protected first round picks and a top-four protected first round pick in 2025 (and losing Kemba’s salary and the #11 pick salary).
Not saying that that makes it all that much better, but it does make it better. 😉
Leon’s thinking 3-4 years ahead of you guys. The Knicks could be loaded with picks in 2025 or 2026!
🙂
It will all make much more sense when they max Brunson. 🙂
So did the Knicks really get four modest first round picks and get out of Walker’s contract for Dieng? By modest, I mean definitely in the second half of the round. I agree all the new picks project to be worse than number 11, but it still seems to put us in a better position for trades and like we got reasonable value for our pick.
Think about it this way. San Antonio says it wants four picks for Murray. If we just traded all four picks for him then we would have gotten Dejounte Murray and gotten rid of Kemba’s contract for the 11th pick this year. Does that seem like a reasonable deal?
Everyone else is playing chess while Leon Rose is playing Parcheesi.
The only person more confused than us will be the arbitration guy for Judge tmw wondering how 17 to 21 million is the range.
I don’t see how it makes it better. I’m so fucking sick of this team.
And yes, in general, I am incredibly underwhelmed so far and while I believe those future firsts were acquired with the intent to deal them, I doubt you’re getting, like, a star for those picks. But obviously, we have to give them some time before we completely tear into it.
There’s still a chance that Kyrie opts in, the Knicks trade for him, he protests something and misses most of the season and then leaves after one season.
But seriously, there’s still moves that are coming after this. We just have to see what they are before we can judge this result fully. But yes, ain’t looking great so far.
Even if the conditional 1sts both convert as 2nds, we at worst moved two 2nds to dump Kemba.
Looks like another night where the aggregate in -> out equation is going to come out looking pretty good but you’re still left wondering what the actual plan is here.
Who knows maybe we just traded Willie Caulie Stein and Josh Jackson for future picks 😀
No, we got 3 very “modest” first rounders for 11, including 2 that might not even be first rounders. The Spurs would get a restraining order against us if we offered them for Murray.
No, were getting 3 picks. And two of them are highly protected so there’s a good chance they turn into 2nd round picks.
Owen the arbitration case is strictly based on 2021, everything Judge has done so far this season is supposed to be completely irrelevant to this case. I still assume they will settle before actually going in front of an arbitrator.
You’re forgetting that we traded the 11th pick this year kicking everything off.
It’s been a long night already and we still need to wait to see who we trade #42 for
I think you guys are miscounting. We got three first rounders from OKC and one from Detroit. That’s four picks not three.
We have an unrestricted 2025. And the 11th pick in a weak draft has less value than it sounds.
These picks are probably to ditch Burks & Noel. So we traded the 11th pick to get rid of Burks, Noel & Kemba
We then moved one to CHA
BBA – I know but it’s still ludicrous. Although not as ludicrous as his strike zone. I speak as a Mets fan who owns him in a fantasy league.
I’ll have the bleach on the rocks please
Make it a double
Fuck this team and all of the time I waste on being a fan
They traded the best one of the firsts they got from OKC to Charlotte for the Detroit first (which is Milwaukee’s 2025 first).
We only need to dump one of them to clear $25M. It shouldn’t cost a 1st.
I guess we can always root for Giannis to get injured.
This is what it comes down to at the end of the day. We will probably use the 11th overall pick to dump a bunch of contracts we never had to sign in the first place, to pursue a player it doesn’t seem is wedded to us by any means.
Knicks baby
It doesn’t make sense to me that we sent all those seconds to Charlotte and a first round pick too. I want to see the news tomorrow to confirm that.
I can see the handwriting on the wall.
1. The Knicks offer Brunson the max and he rejects it.
2. The Knicks use their extra 1st rounders to clear off some combination of Randle, Noel and Burks and then strike out on everyone else they targeted.
3,. The Knicks sign Emmanuel Mudiay, Trey Burke, Mario Hezonja, and Bobby Portis to 2 years contracts with a player option.
Almost unrestricted. Top 4 protected.
Well, like someone once said, you gotta spend the cap space on something!
We got Jalen Duren the #13 pick for a future 1st & four 2nds
We then moved Jalen Duren & Kemba Walker for MIL’s 2025 1st
We did, but they sent a first back to us. We gave them a slightly better first to sweeten the pot, basically.
“No, we got 3 very “modest” first rounders for 11, including 2 that might not even be first rounders. The Spurs would get a restraining order against us if we offered them for Murray.”
I don’t know how you get that. We got one that’s top 4 protected, another that eventually becomes top 8 protected, and another that eventually becomes top 9 protected.
1. Seems likely that ALL of the picks would convey to me. You think DET / WAS are going to be bottom 8-9 teams for five years in a row?
2. I’m not sure “very modest” is so fair either. The average first round pick is a 15th pick, which is about where you’d expect the DET / WAS picks to convey at some point. The MIL one is probably very modest assuming Giannis is healthy in 2025, but there’s also a small chance it’s a lotto pick at least.
Excluding Kemba because he’s pretty irrelevant, if we traded #11 and four future seconds for two eventual future firsts around #15 and an eventual #25 pick, I think that’s a good trade. It’s not exciting and also not likely to end well because we’ll use them as ammo for a vet trade, but in isolation it pencils out I think.
KnickFanInNJ, here’s the summary:
Overall we got 3 first from OKC. We traded one of them for the Bucks 2025 and also traded a bunch of 2s.
Giannis will still be Giannis.
But Jrue, Middleton & Lopez could slow down. It won’t be great but it might not be terrible.
I assume we’re still going to make pick #42?
We’re probably trading that pick +Fournier or Noel sometime soon
Brunson is worth more than Kemba & two 2nds. It’s gonna depend on what it costs to unload Burks or Noel.
Giannis might be in.LA by then
What about protections?
I thought Detroit contributed the future first. It makes more sense that way. They are the one getting Duren. We’re just getting off of Kemba’s contract.
I wouldn’t rule it out!
In all seriousness you do make good points. 3 mediocre firsts for 11 in a weak draft isn’t a catastrophe, though I also don’t think it’s particularly impressive. I just don’t have a lot of faith we’re doing anything interesting, with these firsts or in general.
Then we do have four firsts.
No dude, we traded 11 for 3 firsts. Then we traded one of those firsts for a different first. That leaves us with 3! Multiple reporters have the details by now.
Yes, Detroit gave up the 2025 first to the Knicks, while the Knicks gave up a first and the four seconds to Charlotte. Charlotte wanted the 2023 Denver pick over the 2025 Milwaukee pick.
No.
The 2025 MIL pick was owned by DET. The pick DET sent was the MIL 2025.
We got:
1. MIL 2025
2. WAS 2023
3. DET 2023
DEN 2023 came from. OKC but immediately went to CHA. We do not have that pick.
Then we do have four firsts.
click all the squares with bridges
No. We traded
• Charlotte: Denver 2023 FRP (lottery-protected) via OKC, 4 2nds
• Knicks: Detroit 2023 1st (protected 1-18) via OKC, Washington 2023 1st (lottery-protected) via OKC, Bucks 2025 1st (protected 1-4) via DET
• Thunder: Pick #11 (Ousmane Dieng) from NYK
• Pistons: Pick #13 (Jalen Duren) from CHA, Kemba Walker from NYK
Hahahaha
My relationship to captcha did change markedly when I realized that I needed to find exactly three sets of traffic lights.
I trust you on this.
If I understand it all, there are two trades to evaluate.
Did we get good value from OKC for the #11? (3 future protected 1st round picks)
Was it worth some 2nds (that we were probably never going to use) and swapping one of those OKC picks for a somewhat lower quality 1st round pick to move kemba?
That 1st round pick swap was the cost to move Kemba (and not have to pay a 1st round selection this year) and is now the cost to try to overpay Brunson.
is that correct?
The way I see it, we can’t evaluate this decision until we see how they use the space. Like I said before, they better be pretty damn sure they can use it effectively this time or someone has to go.
Look, Leon Rose is playing 5-dimensional chess. He’s just losing.
FWIW, I think 2023 DEN and 2025 MIL is pretty much a wash. The Bucks are better, but the pick is two years further out which adds some uncertainty. For that reason I view the cost of dumping Kemba as four 2nds.
Well, it’s definitely a move for someone. Perhaps it isn’t Brunson. But yes, otherwise, you’re correct (and you might be correct on that point, as well).
Where is the first that was reported that Detroit sent us?
Kennedy Chandler is going to Memphis. Tyus Jones isn’t a bad backup plan to Brunson.
If you’re trolling us, I have nothing but respect for you
That’s the 2025 MIL first. We gave them the 2023 DEN first we got from OKC in the same deal. So it’s still 3.
At this point though, I encourage 4 firsts trutherism.
What would be the dumbest thing that could happen?
Probably Leon using the newly acquired picks to dump some of the mercs, then whiffing on his main FA target and signing a bunch more pointless mercs. That’s what Dolan’s Razor says will be the outcome.
I’m sure we’re doing something silly with this pick…but Minott, Brown, Liddell, and Rollins all could be there.
I mean if we don’t know where Jalen is going, Rick Brunson needs to be fired immediately.
So Brunson, Barrett, guy traded for 3-4 1st round picks, Randle, Mitch is the tentative starting lineup?
Why do I keep getting the whiff of deep, dark, moist, loamy, flat earth…
I have to think they KNOW they can sign Brunson given their close relationship to his father and that his agent and son work for CAA. If not they are on drugs. Or as you said, they KNOW they can sign someone else they have in mind. Otherwise they are definitely on drugs.
I am still confused. The first trade, three future firsts for Dieng seems reasonable and we all agree on it. But in the second trade we apparently gave four seconds and a first for the number thirteen pick. I guess that’s in line with the first trade trade in terms of how this years picks are valued. But if I understand correctly, then we supposedly used the the 13th pick basically just to off load Kemba. That seems expensive to me.
Either Lidell or Minot wouldn’t be bad at 42
We’re up next in theory. We’ve moved 5/7 picks we started draft noght with under the Leon regime
We’re up. Minott still on the board
Kendall Brown here?
Guessing we draft a stash or kick it to the future
Trevor Keels, on the off chance we keep him. Wouldn’t have been my guy, but 19th in Pelton’s model FWIW. Stop me if you’ve heard this before but a big “if he learns to shoot” guy.
Serious question. Is Brunson better than FVV? Just trying to get a gage on where he stands in the current pantheon of good but not all star players.
Keels, solid pick at this point in the draft
No, but FVV is really freakin’ good. Brunson has shown more when he doesn’t need to defer to Luka. So there’s still some upside there.
Keels is pretty uninspiring. Oh well, we’ll get ’em next year
From the athletics anonymous scouts:
anytime you can get a fat guard who can’t jump or shoot you have got to do it
We came away from the night with 3 future protected 1st round picks, no Kemba, no #11, and minus some 2nds.
Instead of worrying about all the details of 1st round pick usage, I think the best way to evaluate it is to look at the 3 1sts we have now instead of that #11, whether you are reasonably comfortable with that, and just understand that one of the picks we have now is of lower quality than we originally got from OKC. That and the 2nd rounders were the cost of moving Kemba so we have a chance to overpay Brunson.
Keels per 40:
15.2 pts
4.6 rebs
3.6 ast
1.7 TO
1.6 stl
0.1 blk
.312 3P%
.670 FT%
19 by season start
As Hollinger says, fat is just potential in disguise
I’d say FVV is a better defender and better all around player. but Brunson is a bit younger and improving. If we land Brunson, we are probably going to overpay him.
So if I now understand the trade correctly, the Knicks gave up four second round picks and exchanged a well protected 2023 Denver first round pick for the 2025 Bucks first round pick in order to get off off Walker’s contract. I guess the Milwaukee pick might be a better trade chip than the Denver one but Denver is good and their pick is likely to convey next year. So this this still seems expensive to get off of Walker’s contract.
Thanks. I think I understand now. My last post crossed with yours.
https://nypost.com/2022/06/23/2022-nba-draft-knicks-eye-jalen-brunson-with-kemba-walker-trade/
Ahead of the trade, Smith tweeted a video explaining why he was skeptical about the Knicks’ decision-making in the draft.
“Why the hell should I look forward to the draft? The Knicks have the 11th pick. Am I supposed to believe they’re going to get that right?” Smith asked. “Am I supposed to believe we’re going to get an impact player? Am I supposed to believe that the New York Knicks are going to be better this season than they were last season?
“Maybe they might be, but that would be because they couldn’t get much worse. I’m trying to be hopeful. I’m trying to be nice. I’m trying to be in high spirits, thinking that it’s going to finally work out for me for me with these damn Knicks who haven’t given me a damn championship since 1973. I was five years old. Ima be cool. I’m gonna try, but I just don’t know.”
Leon Rose really takes the fun out of draft night.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1540156813470859264
Incinerate me daddy
If the Knicks use one or two of those firsts to move Randle all is forgiven.
You know, I’ve had the experience at various jobs interacting with executives. They may agree with the news you bring them, but then do something you didn’t expect at all based on that information. The current Knicks management reminds me of this. If you look at the big picture, they seem to agree that a mediocre first round pick wasn’t going to improve the team much. Did they do what we would expect based on that information? No. Instead they traded for trade chips and make us worry they don’t know what they are doing.
Yeah, there are a lot of possible moves that could be coming. I’m going to wait until we see what happens when the dust settles. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not at all confident at it working out, but I have to still give them the chance to prove themselves first. This is the time for Rose to prove he’s got what it takes.
So would you guys rather go after Murray or Brunson?
Brunson, definitely. Murray’s the better player, but he’s an odd fit here and he’s not so good that you just build the roster around him. Plus, I don’t think the three future firsts they acquired would be enough to get him, so it’d be other good players/picks involved.
Brunson could be as simple as just trading Burks to a team that has cap space, ya know? And then signing Brunson outright, re-signing Mitch and trading the picks with somebody for another interesting player.
I hate this team. It is pure trash. If we wanted to move Kemba it could have been done for far less than a lottery pick.
Then there were opportunities to move back into the draft to get Washington who fell far, or Chandler, or Minott, or Brown.
The first trade was fine especially considering we were able to trade back into #13. That’s where we should have stopped instead we threw it away to clear $3 million in cap space (we could have saved $6 million by simply stretching him).
Let’s wait until we need the cap space before we give away lottery picks to clear it.
Murray is better AND gets paid 1/2 of what Brunson could end up signing for over the next two years. He’s, like, the hot date who just wants to eat burgers and drink beer with you. Gotta lock that up.
That’s true in the abstract but the team might have made a personal commitment to Walker after we stopped playing him that we would find some way to enable him to play somewhere else.