Knicks Morning News (2017.01.01)

  • [NYTimes] Rockets 129, Knicks 122: James Harden Scores 53 as Knicks Drop 4th in a Row
    (Sunday, January 01, 2017 4:22:45 AM)

    Harden 53 points, 17 assists and 16 rebounds for his second straight triple-double against the short-handed Knicks.

  • [ESPN] Knicks enter 2017 at a crossroads
    (Sunday, January 01, 2017 1:32:16 AM)

    Knicks enter 2017 at a crossroads

  • [ESPN] Sore Achilles sidelines Porzingis vs. Rockets
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 7:01:00 PM)

    Sore Achilles sidelines Porzingis vs. Rockets

  • [NYDN] Carmelo Anthony’s knee injury won’t keep him off court for long
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 8:41:32 PM)

    Anthony’s 19 minutes were defined by bad shots, bad fouls and a limp.

  • [NYDN] Knicks fall to Rockets as James Harden has historic night
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 8:40:37 PM)

    The Knicks took the ‘Maybe we’ll get them next time’ approach prior to tipoff.

  • [NYDN] Kristaps Porzingis out for Knicks against Rockets
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 2:12:24 PM)

    The Knicks chances of beating the Houston Rockets are even slimmer now.

  • [NYDN] Here’s why the Knicks can’t move on to 2017 fast enough
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 9:51:00 AM)

    Another miserable year is in the books for the Knicks. To sum up 2016, in a word, “Yuck.”

  • [NYPost] James Harden lights up Knicks as Carmelo exits with knee injury
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 6:10:27 PM)

    HOUSTON — The depleted Knicks were trying to pull off a New Year’s Eve miracle without Carmelo Anthony and Kristaps Porzingis, but instead it was James Harden who pulled off a miraculous triple-double. With the Knicks within three points late in the fourth quarter Saturday night, Harden wouldn’t let the upset occur as his 3-pointers…

  • [NYPost] Sore Kristaps Porzingis will watch 82-game goal slip away
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 2:28:52 PM)

    HOUSTON — The end of the year did not end on a good note for the Knicks. Kristaps Porzingis missed his first game of the season in Saturday’s 129-122 loss to the Rockets with left Achilles soreness, but is not expected to get an MRI exam. Porzingis said he started feeling pain in his Achilles…

  • [NYPost] Knicks injuries are revealing Jeff Hornacek’s costly weakness
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 1:06:39 PM)

    HOUSTON — This is not a Knicks team with any margin for error. It has been proven if one of their top four starters is injured, the Knicks collapse like a house of cards. Coach Jeff Hornacek hasn’t pressed the right buttons when the team isn’t fully healthy, which could grow into a problem. Shooting…

  • [NYPost] Phil Jackson bolts, Greg Bird explodes and more 2017 predictions
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 12:20:28 PM)

    This is the best day of the year to be a sports fan (well … unless you are a Jets fan. Then every day since Jan. 12, 1969 has been varying degrees of painful, awful or brutal. But we digress …). Every year, as a new day dawns, as a fresh destiny beckons, you can…

  • [NY Newsday] James Harden scores 53 in triple-double to beat Knicks
    (Sunday, January 01, 2017 12:08:08 AM)


  • [NY Newsday] Kristaps Porzingis has to sit out with sore left Achilles
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 9:53:01 PM)

    HOUSTON — Kristaps Porzingis’ goal of playing every game this season ended Saturday night because of soreness in his left Achilles. Now he hopes that’s the only game he misses.

  • [NY Newsday] NBA Insider looks back at 2016 and ahead to 2017
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 6:57:48 PM)

    As we turn the page on another year, we look back at 2016 and ahead to 2017 for the Knicks and the NBA.

  • [SNY Knicks] Harden’s triple-double, 53 points too much for Knicks to handle
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 10:22:01 PM)

    James Harden and the Houston Rockets were too much for the Knicks to handle Saturday night in a 129-122 loss.

  • [SNY Knicks] Porzingis, Lee and O’Quinn out against Rockets
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 7:16:53 PM)

    The Knicks will be without Kristaps Porzingis (achilles), Courtney Lee (wrist) and Kyle O’Quinn (flu) on Saturday against the Rockets.

  • [SNY Knicks] Knicks look to get back on track against Houston
    (Saturday, December 31, 2016 2:56:01 PM)

    Houston will host the New York Knicks (16-16) on New Year’s Eve.

  • 153 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2017.01.01)”

    At this point, would you:
    give up ‘Melo

    and take on Austin Rivers’ + Jamal Crawford’ combined $24m in contracts (for the next 3 years)

    for 3 Clippers first rounders and Brandon Bass?

    Things that scare me:

    1) taxes
    2) clowns
    3) Melo’s defense

    Really, Melo has even stopped trying to look like he cares on defense, that’s ridiculous

    Re: Melo’s D… Ryan Anderson was Melo’s matchup? If so, he got absolutely torched.

    The should rest Melo for a week or so. Playing through pain Melo is always the worst version of Melo.

    It’s been a tough stretch of games for our boys. I do hope they come out for the new year with a renewed determination to defend. If for no other reason so I won’t have to read the self congratulatory posts from the genius that is JK who rarely posts at all when the team is playing well. Whatever…

    Lets go Knicks!!!!

    Happy New Year!

    Melo has the NTC, so he’s not going anywhere unless he wants to do so. If he really is hurting, he needs to sit some b/c his defensive effort is awful.

    If the Knicks were brave, they’d have Melo come in off the bench at the 4. A more willing defender starting at the 3, like LT, would balance the starting unit. And if that hurts his ego, maybe he’d waive the NTC?

    I’d trade Melo for anything that gets me out from under his contract so long as it doesn’t involve giving assets away. He’s not a good player anymore and probably hurts us whenever he’s on the floor.

    But yeah, I’d pull the trigger on that Clippers trade in a second. Melos never leaving NY though because Phil is a moron who gave him an NTC. If that NTC didn’t exist and we had a competent GM, we’d have Brooklyn and Boston’s pick in this upcoming draft. If you’re rational, you better hope that the Knicks go on a massive losing streak in the next two months so Melo waives his NTC for the trade deadline. Because if we have Melo on our team next year we’re blowing our cap in the offseason on some mediocre aging veteran and we will be stuck in purgatory until KP’s (and Willy’s) new contract, when we’ll have to max him.

    C’est la vie

    That’s the wonderful thing about the Knicks: No matter how awful your current GM is, Isiah Thomas is always lurking, ready to take the GM job again when Dolan gives him an opportunity to do so.

    But yeah it’d have to be Mills, Houston, or Thomas if Phil were fired. Unless a miracle happened and Dolan hired Ujiri. What a franchise.

    I’ve always wondered how that negotiation with Melo’s agent went. Was the NTC really a deal breaker? Did they threaten to bolt for Chicago if they didn’t get it?

    And of course, we’ll never know how much Dolan was involved, because if he was, there’s no doubt he’s giving Melo whatever he asks for.


    Holy shit Harden did what?

    Harden played against the Knicks’ defense and without Courtney Lee or Porzingis.

    Just another all-time game against New York’s backcourt

    Seriously, Calderon was no worse a defender than Rose or Jennings. But at least we got a one year rental, a late second round pick, and the privilege of signing Joakim Noah to a four year deal!

    With all the justified focus on Harden’s ridiculous game,how about Giannis last night against the Bulls?

    35 points, 13-19 FG, 9 rebounds, 7 assists, 2 steals, 7 blocks.

    That is what you call filling up a box score.

    53 points in 26 shots… how can this be even possible.

    tear down this team while some of those crap players still got any value

    by the way, Giannis is a top 10 player in the NBA and i’m not backing down from this statement.

    Giannis is probably a top 5 player in the NBA.

    I’ve seen this Melo act one time too often to fool me. He’s in “things aren’t going so well so it’s time for me to feign an injury I would normally play through” mode. I’m sick of this guy. I don’t care how talented he is. I don’t care how many games he can win single handed because his shot is dropping. He’s a loser.

    When things aren’t going well he sulks.

    When he doesn’t get his way he creates conflict with other players or the coach.

    He only plays defense when he’s in the mood.

    He makes way too many ridiculously stupid decisions at important times in close games.

    His shot selection and style of play is destructive to “team”.

    Some people find ways to win when things don’t look so good. Melo finds way to lose and avoid blame. I’m so sick of it I would literally sweeten the pot just to get rid of him. George Karl was too nice. Amare was too nice. D’Antoni was a saint. The man is a loser. The Knicks will never be a serious team until he’s either coming off the bench or gone.

    Solution is simple: have Melo leading the second unit, don’t let him play a single minute in the 4th quarter and he will beg for a trade. We can probably net a couple of picks for him.

    I’d much rather suck with cap space and younger players instead of with Melo

    Hill is more than worthy if he’s healthy. Teague not so much, but he’d be a top 3 player on our team (KP, KOQ, and….not Melo) if he were signed. Mills should probably be our target if the front office wants to be short sighted and blow its cap.

    Agree they should rest Melo and have him skip the ASG if he somehow makes it.

    his scoring has been within his usual week/week variation but his defense has really been god-awful. like worse than even his usual. he can’t move at all. he can’t even begin to get out on shooters and then recover if they attack his closeout – he just jogs to a stop somewhere near the scorer’s table.

    there’s more than enough “shot creation” with Rose on the floor.

    Harden was obviously amazing last night but I wish they would get rid of that ridiculous foul where as soon as a guy’s arm comes near him he throws his arms into it creating a 3 shot foul. that’s not good offense, that’s just taking advantage of officials. Poor Justin Holiday got caught on that, what, 4x last night (=12 points!)

    That’s my major problem with Harden – he plays for fouls, even dumb ones. it’s efficient and effective but it’s not fun to watch.

    Melo just looks slow and earthbound. He’s aging in pretty much exactly the way you would expect him to age. If you look at his B-R page and look at the way his WS48 has risen and fallen with age, it makes perfect sense. The hope that he would find some Paul Pierce-like second act to his career where he would become a more mature all-around player was wishful thinking. He is what he always was, just older.

    I don’t know what’s more cringey, 76er fans defending Jahlil Okafor or Knick fans defending Melo.

    I really want Noel, a young Dynamo next to KP… Ah that Noah contract irks me more than Melos

    @25, Teague or tragic dragic?
    Who’s better?

    I think mills would take a pay cut to stay with the Spurs , idk

    Other things that scare me:

    1) bedbugs
    2) Donald Trump’s hair
    3) wacky rotation adjustments by Hornacek

    I mean, the guy was doing just fine when he settled into the euro mob+BJ unit (plus giving some serious burn to KOQ), why is he fumbling many of his rotation choices right since a few weeks ago? Are we sure all those minutes given to Sasha didn’t cost us a win or two, for example?

    Other things that scare me:

    1) bedbugs
    2) Donald Trump’s hair trigger temper
    3) wacky rotation adjustments by Hornacek

    I mean, the guy was doing just fine when he settled into the euro mob+BJ unit (plus giving some serious burn to KOQ), why is he fumbling many of his rotation choices right since a few weeks ago? Are we sure all those minutes given to Sasha didn’t cost us a win or two, for example?

    4) Every opposing PG

    (fixed #2 for you)

    Totally agree with Sasha, I’d rather see baker play, he gives us some more positivity …. There was a brief stretch where hornacek gave him minutes and he produced. Got to the rim, knocked down shots.

    Since we are stuck in pergatory maybe we have to move KP, I’m not going to gain any popularity with that comment but it’s worth discussing. Can we get cousins for kp and Noah and a first?
    On second thought, I wouldn’t do that trade.

    Whether it’s the Knicks or elsewhere, Melo’s best value is at PF. KP’s not quite ready to move to the 5 full time, and you can’t put he or Melo on the 2nd unit- probably Noah too- so the logical option is to move Melo. Problem is, you can’t showcase him at his best position because of KP. It’s quite the catch 22.

    You want to move Melo to a contender because he’s vetoing any other team, and also out of respect for him. Of all the contenders, Cleveland is the most logical. San Antonio wouldn’t want or have a need for him- unless he wants to become a super sub a la Vinnie Johnson. GS doesn’t have the room for him, and even if they did- he’s not versatile enough at this stage nor does he move the ball enough for them to add him. The Clips would probably take him, but I’m not sure taking on Crawford’s salary would be worth it. It would also be hard to put a package together centered around Redick without adding long term salary of players we wouldn’t want. Maybe OKC would take him, but that would mean giving up some of our young pieces and probably taking Kanter. Even if Cleveland says yes to a Melo trade, you probably need to find a 3rd team to swing Love to because he and KP bring too much of a similar skillset. Remember Marbury and Francis? This team is in a tough spot that Phil probably isn’t gonna be able to get us out of it unless he orders the team to tank the season and add another young guy to build around via the draft. He’s just not experienced enough and that is compounded by his stubborn vision, lack of adaptability, and the fact he really doesn’t have the requisite tools at his disposal to to make a good trade or 2 to balance the roster.

    This is more like a catch-22 million because this team can be really good

    if the Knicks trade KP for anyone less than Giannis, Harden, Gobert, Durant, Kawhi, Curry or LeBron I would move to NYC and start breaking stuff in front of MSG.

    KP is untouchable beyond the league’s top 10 players.

    He may never break .200 WS/48 in his career but he will be a regular all-star and would have massive trade value in the last year of his rookie contract and the next contract. If you trade him, you do so in 4-5 years. Not now for Demarcus Cousins, the most overrated player in the league.

    But I’d hold onto him forever. Also Teague is better than Dragic I’m pretty sure.

    I forgot Davis yeah, but I want to see if Embiid can stay healthy before I put him there, and KAT is debatable to me.

    Gobert is already the best defensive big man in the league at age 24 and he’s under a long term contract that will look like an absolute steal after the next CBA happens

    This year/last year
    eFG%: 24th/28th
    TOV%: 12th/11th
    ORB%: 5th/18th
    FT/FGA: 25th/16th

    So, in terms of the Four Factors, this year’s Knicks are vastly improved in offensive rebounding and slightly improved in offensive eFG%, although the latter number has been dropping precipitously. This has offset a decline in FT/FGA.

    eFG%: 11th/9th
    TOV%: 25th/30th
    DRB%: 27th/18th
    FT/FGA: 26th/13th

    So here we see what we all know to be obvious– defensive rebounding and defensive FT/FGA have fallen off badly. Why has the defensive rebounding been so bad? Joakim Noah leads the team in this regard, but we have seen a dropoff in DRB% from Melo and Porzingis, and even the starting backcourt is getting fewer rebounds this year– Afflalo and Calderon both had a DRB% of 11.0, while Rose and Lee are in the single digits.

    Could it be that this team is sorely missing Robin Lopez’ box-out ability? And could it be that the Knicks’ strong offensive rebounding numbers are actually hurting the defense? If you’re crashing the offensive boards all the time, that means you’re making transition defense less of a priority. This could end up manifesting itself in poor defensive FT/FGA numbers.

    I don’t know the answers to these questions, I’m just throwing it out there. This team seems to have better defensive personnel than last year, so it’s surprising that the defense is so much worse.

    Jokic and KAT are on the same level of KP for me… specially KAT is more NBA ready, and it might be a bit of homerism but I think KP has a higher ceiling if he figures everything out.

    Cousins at center allows us to put melo at the 4. We’d be set for a deep playoff run

    I would definitely say no to Cousins.

    he’s already full of antics and refuses to play defense for long stretches, if you put him in the NYC spotlights together with Melo and Rose the defense would be horrible and the antics insufferable.

    besides KP already allows the Knicks to play Melo at the 4, but then who’s the SF? Lance? Holiday starting? no thanks

    I like holiday as our three, he plays defense and hits threes. Or you move Lee to the three.

    Cousins is Carmelo plus three inches. Remarkably similar in how people overrate them.

    Let me know when he breaks 60% TS like the rest of the elite scorers in the league (LeBron, Durant, Curry, Harden). Until then, he’s the centerpiece of a 35-win team with lots of pretty and creative ways to shoot the basketball.

    Let’s make more “win now” moves and trade away any good young players we have. This team is not Knicksy enough.

    Cousins is a good rebounder, I’ll give him that, but I agree with jowles here… he’s Carmelo with an infinitely worse attitude

    I love KP, I WOULD NEVER TRADE HIM. But look at the matchup against the cavs;
    Lebrun / LT or holiday
    Rose/ Kyrie
    Melo/ love

    That’s a good playoff series.

    No to Cousins especially if it means having Lance “pigeon” Thomas as our starting SF.

    I look at his attitude as more of a Rasheed Wallace type, eccentric. He might benefit from big time change of scenery and a playoff run. A lot if incentives to clean up his act along with melo, neither has made any noise in the postseason for their careers.

    Cousins is similar to melo, I agree but The two might be a killer one two punch which we lack right now. The idea is preposterous since KP is the player to build around but since we are stuck in “pergatory” for the remainder of Melos contract it is an option, obscene and heinous as it seems.

    There is no fair matchup for Lebrun unless your throwing out Kwahi, what’s so funny?

    what’s funny is that LeBron himself makes that matchup so lopsided that there’s no way the playoff series could be good for the Knicks… a useless ofensive player that will allow Lebron to play zero defense and a poor defender that can’t possibly hope to keep LeBron under wraps…

    not many players can bother LeBron, but few are as incapable as Lance Thomas would be

    Kyrie kills us but thinking with all optimism the inside out game between melo and cousins may level the playing field.

    All at the cost of KP my favorite player. I wouldn’t do it. Even with the unprotected first round pick

    are you really comparing Love and Melo, Cousins and Thompson to be as lopsided as the best player in the fracking NBA and the tenth best player in the .500 Knicks?

    come on.

    Ok it’s a stretch… But I envision lance ” dancing and prancing” lmao, I can’t even finish the sentence…

    I do think that melo would dominate love in a playoff series, same for cousins over Thompson. But not to the extent that lebron would make lance do his dishes as punishment for trying to guard

    Why the fuck are we talking about trading the only potentially great player we’ve had in 30 God damned years for Demarcus Cousins? Like, for real? Are we really entertaining the notion of trading the one good thing this franchise has done this century for a chance to mayyyyybeee make the playoffs and then possibly get past the first round and then, if we’re lucky, take a game off of Cleveland in the 2nd round?

    Jesus save us from fans who think like this. This could very well be the dumbest idea of the year, and it’s only the 1st!

    yeah, im kind of an optimist in the sense that I don’t intend to give up on the Knicks anytime soon… but they keep testing me

    If Isaiah didn’t break us nothing will.

    I said I wouldn’t do the trade!

    But don’t tell me the idea of having a cousins in the middle doesn’t intrigue you.

    It’s almost having KP is a luxury we can’t afford, that the perspective I’m coming from. Such is the life of “these type of knick fans”.

    I’m not for it, but tell ya what though..
    If Phil makes a Melo for Love swap and Hornacek figures out rotations and the team starts playing winning basketball, I will gladly sing ?Love lift us up where we beloooong? lol

    But don’t tell me the idea of having a cousins in the middle doesn’t intrigue you.

    It doesn’t. It really really really doesn’t.

    That’s interesting but I think the cavs say no….why mess up a good thing mentality.

    In What reasoning does Love make sense for us with KP?none.

    I don’t think Phil thinks cousins doesn’t make a lot of sense

    I’m afraid you may be right on this one.

    can we talk about how everyone said that Melo’s contract would look good under the new cap instead? 😉

    Tell me why you don’t like this cousins guy… He could be a head case, I get it. What else?
    He would be our most dominating player in 30 years.

    Think about how much the middle opens up for us…melo is walking thru the park sniffing daisies, in an ideal world he and melo are the perfect pair with Rose and Jennings as the beneficiaries of this “love” affair… No pun intended

    Cousins might thrive only where there is already an established winning culture. That means not here.

    Cousins is a high volume shooter who’s not very efficient and can’t be bothered to play defense.

    no thanks

    It’s not so much about Cousins (though I do think he’s terribly overrated), it’s more about trading KP for him. If we got him for Noah or something? Or Melo in some 3 team deal? Ehhh…sure, why not? But for KP? Over my dead body.

    @ 79

    I disagree wholeheartedly ..I… It’s true that Cousins dominated the league right?!?
    I appreciate this may be a point of contention, however. My feeling is that he would dominate even more so in nyc being the grand stage that he would have to share with Melo.

    My point is that if he were to come here as our “savior” he would have no where to go but down.

    Inefficient high usage moody volume scorer who stuffs the stat sheet but doesn’t play defense and turns the ball more than almost anyone in the league

    Seems perfect to pair with Melo and Rose

    My whole argument is based on the idea we are in pergatory with Melos contract and that we can’t move him and his NTC. So moving KP would be another “all in ” move by the Knicks brass which always fails and I think Phil would consider the move out of desperation which no one including myself approves of.yes I’m arguing both sides of the fence however I’m preparing myself for the worst.

    I don’t think cousins would be a disaster in the short term, I think it would reap benefits that should be addressed. I think long term it would hurt. But I don’t think, based on our history, it’s inconceivable we move KP.

    Like I said earlier, KP may possibly be a luxury we can’t afford.


    You’re dreaming if you think melo will go. Even in a three team trade. His NTC limits him to the cavs and that’s it.

    @ Mase

    If all you’re saying is you think it’s a possibility, then sure. I don’t think it’s a likely one as KP has become a fan favorite and proof positive that Knick fans would tolerate a rebuild provided we had good young players to be excited about.

    But if you’re trying to say there might be some positive so such a move, then I must vehemently disagree. A possible first round win isn’t anywhere near a good enough return to then watch KP become Dirk or Durant with elite interior defense for another team for the next 12+ years.

    Silky that’s negative… Defense is all its about. He can play defense but he doesn’t want too in Sacramento where he has reached his peak, there’s no motivation.


    You’re dreaming if you think melo will go. Even in a three team trade. His NTC limits him to the cavs and that’s it.

    I’m not. All I was saying is that would be one of the few trade scenarios I would be ok with. Not that I think it’s a possibility. Really, my point was more about not trading anything of value for Cousins, and less about moving Melo.

    Demarcus Cousins is a taller Melo? Melo at his peak is comparable to Cousins this year. Melo today is a league average player with an insanely high usage rate and an insanely high salary, and it’s insulting to compare his shit production with Cousins’.

    Possible first round is not good enough I agree…. But you’re looking at the pot half way, Cousins could eliminate the advantage of the Celtics interior game. It is possible we beat them in a 7game series.

    Demarcus Cousins is a taller Melo? Melo at his peak is comparable to Cousins this year. Melo today is a league average player with an insanely high usage rate and an insanely high salary, and it’s insulting to compare his shit production with Cousins’.

    Cousins now is Carmelo in ’09-’10. In a few years, he’ll be Carmelo to a T: never won anything of note, just a bunch of postseason awards for his volume scoring, only makes the playoffs with a bunch of underrated, high-production players around him, is on a massive, bloated contract that fans will either defend to the death or be thoughtfully cynical about.

    They really are the same player, narrative-wise. Even Zach Lowe jerks him off, despite the middling (for volume scorer) efficiency. One of those guys who “needs a winning culture to put it together,” but really just tops out as a 2nd-round perennial loser. He’ll never win a title. Not even with a quality org. like the C’s.

    Like I said earlier, KP may possibly be a luxury we can’t afford.

    Porzingis is what, 21? He’s under team control for many years and the new CBA makes it easier for teams to hold onto guys they drafted. Trading him for Cousins would be sub-Isiah levels of stupidity. Hitting yourself in the face with a ball peen hammer is a better idea than trading Porzingis for Cousins.

    The addiction to the “win now” mentality is just hilarious with this fan base.


    There’s no deal unless all parties are happy right?!?

    Whether or not you agree Cousins has real value. It seems likely that we have to give up value for his services.

    It’s blatantly obvious we need a player who can draw defenses to him… Rose and melo are the only ones who come to mind in that regard. A third player like Cousins accomplished that goal. Yes or no?

    I don’t want to see KP go either. But currently he our only chip. No one else Is a chip. No one.
    We are are “all in” right unless Melo waives his NTC

    If the Knicks do end up making a big trade, I hope its for anybody but Cousins. Anybody but.

    He’s an overrated cancer.

    I’ll just keep hoping that Melo decides to waive his NTC for a trade to the Clippers or Celtics. Then we’d have to hope that that team actually wants him… I realize that all this is highly unlikely. And, yes, I would trade him to the Celtics.


    You’re arguing my point,this is a ‘win now team’, isn’t it?

    Trading him for a 26 year old franchise player like Cousins makes sense, like it or not, because holding him doesn’t jibe with the culture ?

    what about the history of the knick makes you think that KP is ‘unavailable’ …. In my opinion absolutely zero!

    the thing about the guys who just need a winning culture around them is that they are probably some of the main culprits their team doesn’t have a winning culture in the first place.

    Dallas, Cleveland and Golden State were always shit teams with no winning culture whatsoever and when they got the stars the so called winning culture simply started happening all of a sudden.

    real stars establish winning cultures, that’s all.

    and if Cousins is a franchise player, hes a good stats on shit teams franchise player

    Phil bets on players like cousins as cornerstones… Melo for example.

    was curry golden states franchise player? Not sure, he wasn’t dominating his first few years in the league.


    Like Marburg a franchise were… Which argues point that ny is a win now culture which views KP as a luxury they can’t afford ….dolan doomed basketball. ” don’t shoot the messenger”

    You’re arguing my point,this is a ‘win now team’, isn’t it?

    It’s a “win now” team that is a game under .500, in other words an extremely horeshit win now team. You want to double down on this strategy and cripple any chance this team ever has of being watchable, even in the future when Melo and Noah and Lee and Lance and extended Rose come off the books.

    For what? For the completely deluded hope that Melo, Rose, Noah and Boogie are going to win a chip?

    I think they think boogie has a better chance at winning a chip because KP doesn’t fit in with for the next few years when his deal expires. So why not compete now?

    It doesn’t make any sense to compete for a bubble playoffs spot when the core is signed long term, KP for cousins seems inevitable

    Trading KP after year 4 doesn’t equate because his value is at its lowest, you’ll have to find a team to max him.

    This talk of trading KP is beyond moronic. Its fucking offensive. Just stop. Not even Isaiah Thomas would entertain such stupidity.

    Isaiah would trade the pick that got KP, he would not trade KP at this juncture in his career. Don’t be stupid. And don’t be stupid enough to propose a trade scenario you think Isaiah would endorse.


    There’s no deal unless all parties are happy right?!?

    Whether or not you agree Cousins has real value. It seems likely that we have to give up value for his services.

    No we don’t. We could simply not trade our future franchise player for an overrated locker-room bonehead. I don’t really care if the Kings’ side of the equation is happy since that’s not a trade I would ever entertain. I’d hang up on Vlade on the spot if he called asking for KP.

    We are NOT a “win now” team, because “win now” teams actually have a chance to, y’know, win. Making moves to “win now” is beyond stupid. Shit like this is why I laugh everytime some announcer describes Knick fans as the smartest in the league.


    You think this team is not winnow? That’s a joke !

    Locked into center St and sf for the next three years,

    The ironic part of this stupid KP-Cousins trade proposal is that it would still leave us as a lottery team. Melo and Noah aren’t getting younger. We’d have no one to surround Cousins with. He’d be stuck in the same losing hell he faced in Sacramento with an even more critical media market ready to pounce on his every misstep.


    Oh yeah!

    The guy who traded first rounds for curry , went all in for Francis and and penny after marbury didn’t work!


    You think this team is not winnow? That’s a joke !

    Locked into center St and sf for the next three years,

    That’s correct. We’re not a win now team. Just because we have a bad roster doesn’t mean we need to compound the issue just to get marginally better (maybe, I have my doubts that Cousins moves the needle much more than KP does) in the short term while giving away our long term future. Stop being stupid, please. You put forth an idea, and it got shot down. Move on, stop trying to defend what would obviously (to everyone but you it seems) be one of the worst trades of this century.

    Y’all are arguing with someone who thinks that Cousins is an actual star, so what makes you think his trade ideas are going to be smart in any way at all?

    The guy who traded first rounds for curry , went all in for Francis and and penny after marbury didn’t work!

    Didn’t I just say he’d trade the draft pick not the promising 2nd year player? So why are you giving me an instance where he trade a pick as a counterexample? Can you carefully read or do you simply chose not to?


    Give me a break,!

    Cousins would make more sense than keeping KP and you know that.

    Why would people buy tickets to see a bubble team when they could have a 26 yr old force and perennial playoff contender… We knick fans are idealistic to think that.

    Fair enough. I don’t see the rebuild happening around KP. De facto I seeCousins making sense in a universe where nothing makes sense ….

    Why would people buy tickets to see a bubble team when they could have a 26 yr old force and perennial playoff contender…

    If having Cousins makes for a perennial contender then why aren’t the Kings one?

    the knicks would absolutely not be a perennial playoff contender with Cousins

    Things that are true:
    1. The Knicks team, as currently constituted, is not even close to contention. They’re probably something like the 18th to 22nd best team in the NBA.
    2. Removing Kristaps Porzingis and adding Boogie Cousins does not leapfrog them over like 15 teams. They still wouldn’t be a contender.
    3. Boogie has one more year on his contract after this season. So if you want to re-sign him, you’d be paying him $30M+ per season. There’s not even really any guarantee he’d re-sign with the Knicks when that contract expires in 2018. You could very well be trading many years of a controlled Porzingis for a year and a half of Cousins.
    4. Cousins’ career TS% is .530. That SUCKS for a big man. His career WS48 is .113. Last year it was .122. Those numbers also suck. The big one. You don’t need to spend $30M+ per year to find production like that.
    5. This whole conversation is moronic.

    Cousins is destined to be a Knick. He, Rudy Gay, Nick Young. It’s inevitable. But let’s not ship out KP to make it happen.

    I honestly don’t want to start 2017 by even remotely considering it.

    mase isn’t seriously saying “Hey, let’s trade KP for Cousins,” he’s just saying that if you follow the whole “win now, even if we’re not actually going to win now” mentality to its “logical” conclusion, then that ultimately means trading KP for a veteran star.

    I don’t believe that that is true, as I think KP is already good enough now for a team to consider him a big part of their “win now, even if we’re not actually going to win now” movement, but it’s different from him saying that he would trade KP for Cousins. In fact, he’s specifically said that he wouldn’t do that trade. He’s just throwing out moves he could possible see Jackson making in the pursuit of his ridiculous “Win now, even if we’re not actually going to win now” approach.

    it honestly boils down to how you perceive Cousins as a player.

    In my opinion his antics would maybe be worth if he was a great player, which he’s not… he’s a mediocre player who takes a billion shots every night and thus has good per game numbers… Cousins is second in the NBA in field goals attempted, which shows a lot about his game.

    apart from the obvious fact that inserting the guy who shots the 2nd most in the season in a team that has Carmelo and Rose wouldn’t work, I’m with owen in this one: it’s destined to happen someday. I just hope KP finds happiness away from this mess of a franchise if it does somehow happen.

    The Kings aren’t the Knicks, replacing kp with cousins completes win now mode…. Again I’m not for it. Currently as the roster stands we are one cousins shy of being perennial playoffs contenders. Lee, koq melo and cousins puts us above everyone on the bubble. A secondary move for a pg in the offseason makes us top three.

    What’s wrong with you guys?
    This team is good.
    Despite the losses.

    LOL Cousins for KP does not make this team a playoff contender. It would have no defensive capability, not to mention a lack of depth when Melo/Rose get injured.

    melo is a shorter, slightly more polished (personality wise) version of cousins…ugh, that really sucks jowles…

    I don’t get it though – doesn’t the Olympic “experience” count for something…isn’t that the total team concept teaching point…how could he have not figured out “winning” by now, and what his team role needs to be…

    coincidently enough ‘ol boogie wears the red, white and blue…

    is it the insanely high usage of melo that makes him such a detriment…you can’t just focus on melo’s defensive failings – the whole team sucks…is it a “me” first type team “player” mentality that affects other teammates…is it because he’s playing out of position…

    is he a bad “fit” for this particular team/city…

    all the potential trade mental masturbation in the whole workd ain’t wishing him away anytime soon…

    I do see boogie as a bit of a “loser” though who’ll never help his team win much despite his individual impressive stats…

    thinking about those two players mirroring each other – yikes…I sure hope not…

    how’s the saying go – ‘hope in one hand and shit in the other, then see which fills up first’…

    latke made a real good point reference trying to stick with consistency – you have to have a good young (read: cheap, plus talent) base, with the “right” mixture of vets…

    it seems a lot of folks here feel like losing melo isn’t really going to cost us too many wins in the here and now – but, will pay off in another year or two…

    I hadn’t really thought about it myself in that regard – but, melo = boogie…

    hopefully the magic game will help us put all this stark realism to the side for awhile (a day, two maybe…)

    and a very safe and happy new year to you all…hell, the red sox and cubs pulled it together this millennium- why not us…

    Thanks for clarifying Brian !

    I wan 5’kps on my team, every day all day. Versatile and dominating, height aside.
    My feeling being saying that ” he is a player we can’t afford to keep ” bodes with the contracts and direction phil and the team brass has demonstrated.

    My point is more along the lines of how can we afford to keep him, as I would like too. A melo trade is not possible. Not as far as I can see…. I don’t want love nor do I want jamal Crawford.
    I want love in my life but that’s besides the point.

    Bottom line is that Phil went ‘all-in’ for melo and he not tradable now or in the foreseeable future. What’s the only option, playing devils advocate, is to make KP available.

    I can see Cousins making the most sense for the kicks brass since our history of trades have been short sighted.

    Would he make sense for us?
    No one likes the idea for two reason, one he is a lousy player with good stats on a shitty team. And two we lose KP who in my opinion is the best player in the deAl on a rookie contract…. I wouldn’t be surprised if that deal was discussed before the deadline.

    We need more Kuz. NDour was actually a plus 8. Willy a plus 4. We played without 3 of our starters plus Oak. No Lee to guard Harden either. We played very hard under difficult circumstances and that’s very encouraging going forward.
    Trust me, this team is good. And getting better every day.

    Just to add, I don’t think any team trades a gobert or Davis for KP because franchise players are far and few between… We may be the exception to the rule as history dictates and because we might have painted ourselves into a corner.

    Trust me, this team is good. And getting better every day.

    Record in last 9 games: 2-7

    KP isn’t going anywhere.
    Neither is Phil, thankfully.
    We’re going in the right direction with draft choices going forward and promising young players. Chill.

    2 of my worst memories as a knick fan…

    that game six against houston where riley refused to make starks the ball handler and harper the primary shooter…

    and, the ewing trade – to his credit ewing admitted it was a mistake on his part also…

    reub – how can you just chill with the thought that melo = boogie…

    which sounds like more of a curse than a stray observation…

    is melo, his inefficient playstyle and grim NTC the weight that will keep this team at the bottom of the association for the next few years…

    is “out of position”, ball hugging melo killing our team…

    the yankees have won 7 (???, i’m not even sure), championships, the giants 4…

    and all I can vividly remember fron the last 40 something years of following sports is that harper’s shot looked like it was smooth and true and starks looked so spooked – i thought he believed he had less a chance at making a shot than I thought he could…

    and yet riley was incapable of making an adjustment…

    Noah was on point when he said Knicks have 3 scorers, but need to be better defensively – that Rockets game got close to 3 point difference but just ended up giving Anderson and Harden the 3s.
    For a defensive assigned coach, Rambis doesn’t seem to be vocal nor animated in the sidelines. Time to move on from him

    Can’t wait for this blog to go full panic mode when we lose to Orlando tomorrow night

    Can’t wait for this blog to go full panic mode when we lose to Orlando tomorrow night

    KP and 3 future, unprotected, 1st round picks for Cousins!

    You know, we complain a lot about our back court, but we have 2 perfectly complementary PG’s – one who can score but can’t pass, and one who can’t score but can pass.

    If we could only fuse them into one player, a la Brundle-fly, now you’re talking!

    KP and 3 future, unprotected, 1st round picks for Cousins!

    There has to be some way to work swap rights into that deal

    It’s a new year. Show some optimism. We’re getting better and our future is very bright.

    Wow, that was an amazing win by the Hawks. It’s crazy how far Mike Scott has fallen. He was sent back to the D-League for the third time this season.

    If Trump appoints Woody Johnson (the majority owner of the New York Jets) to be the ambassador to the U.K., Johnson will allow his brother to run the franchise.

    Our mission as Knicks fans is to use the time we have left to make Trump appoint Jim Dolan as the ambassador to a country so he can give control of the team over to somebody else.

    Our mission as Knicks fans is to use the time we have left to make Trump appoint Jim Dolan as the ambassador to a country so he can give control of the team over to somebody else.

    This is Jim Dolan we’re talking about here, whoever he would ever appoint to run the team in his absence would be just as bad as him. Hell, odds are decent that it’d be Isiah.

    Interesting post by Alan Hahn

    ” At what point would it be reasonable to consider bringing him off the bench?

    Before you dismiss such blasphemy, give the idea a chance to marinate. Melo at this point in his career is more effective as a “stretch” power forward than at the small forward position, where he struggles to guard athletic wings and has a hard time closing out three-point shooters. With Noah’s emergence lately — 9 points, 11 rebounds 1 block in 27 minutes per game over the last 6 games — the Knicks are better defensively with Noah flanking KP in the frontcourt.”

    If you view him as a mouthpiece for Knick management, then his floating the Melo off the bench idea may be viewed(one would hope) as the start of a campaign to push him towards adopting a Paul Pierce type of role. If read together with Horny’s comments about lack of effort, which clearly applies to Melo on the defensive side, perhaps a signal is being sent.

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