2016-17 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Hornets

Pulling this completely out of my ass, but I would think that it would have to be beneficial to be the home team in the first game of a home and home series. Doesn’t that just seem like it makes sense? You have the better chance of winning the first game and then you’re playing with a game in hand for the next game. So I think it is a good thing that the Knicks start tonight’s home and home at MSG.

Home and homes are weird, by the way. I don’t get the purpose of them. It’s not like the Knicks play the Hornets a lot, why burn through two of the games right away?

Anyhow, the Knicks host the Hornets tonight. They will get Joakim Noah back tonight, so it will be interesting to see how they work him into a rotation that looked pretty darn good with Porzingis at the 5 and Melo at the 4 for most of the game. Hopefully he works in well. I really like Noah a lot, and I’d hate for him to be in a weird situation where the team looks better without him. So hopefully they win tonight and he gets 53 rebounds and 17 blocked shots.

Let’s go, Knicks!

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319 thoughts to “2016-17 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Hornets”

  1. I got a color TV, So I can see,
    The Knicks play basketball…

    psyched to listen to Clyde and Breen call the game…

  2. Porzingis chasing Kemba all over the court and forcing him into a last second bad shot. Amazing for a guy his size.

  3. I like that KP is not just giving up those defensive boards to noah…noah needs to focus on getting his old ass to the other end of the floor…

  4. The team runs much better with O’Quinn in the lineup over Noah. Why did DRed campaign so hard for JoNo?

  5. Is it my imagination, but when Rose gets beat, he always seems to turn and yell at the nearest Knicks like it’s his fault??

  6. I know I should be happy about Melo cooking, but I have no faith that these step back jumpers will keep falling.

  7. After Jennings cramped up in the last game he never returned. Could it still be bothering him? We’ll know soon if he doesn’t come in.

  8. read somewhere that had Ewing saying he wish he could have took back the trade to seattle…the worm definitely felt like it turned after that trade…not in a good friendly buzz kinda way either…

  9. Kaminsky is definitely legit.

    Rose on defense? definitely not.

    Melo is feeling it, which is nice, but KP will have to show up cause those jumpers are not going to fall the whole night.

  10. Hard to believe Kaminsky is an average NBA player. Did not see that coming.

    Excellent finish from Holliday and fantastic finish from Melo to end the quarter

  11. That’s the best quarter I’ve ever seen Melo have. No iso or bully ball, tough D and great shooting.

  12. Is it my imagination, but when Rose gets beat, he always seems to turn and yell at the nearest Knicks like it’s his fault??

    Its not. He yelled at KP after he committed a foul beyond the perimeter.

  13. You know what really bothers me? The fact that people forget just how good Ewing was. I think the fact he played in an era with Jordan, Shaq, Dream, Admiral, and Duncan unfortunately overshadowed how much of a monster he was on the court. I really wish he could have won one chip in NY. He just wasn’t unique with all the great big men he faced

  14. Oh man, that second Holliday cut and then the Porzingis three for 30 feet. I am in dreamland.

    And then that jumper!

  15. I’m just happy we do not have the privilege to pay 22+ million to Batum every year.

    the Noah contract, tho… that one will hurt.

  16. I think Willy’s presence is keeping KOQ on his toes. He doesn’t wanna lose his spot to a euro rookie. I wonder how they would look as a C/PF tandem on that 2nd unit

  17. Bobcats are extremely talented on offense and hitting high rate of contested and uncontested jumpers.

    Hopefully that evens out because Knicks outplaying them.

  18. Knicks have good energy defensively. They’ve had breakdowns, but Bobcats are an excellent offensive team making shots.

  19. this team proves exactly why the “energy” or “effort” on defense is sometimes fool’s gold.

    everybody, specially Holiday, moves their feet a lot and generally seems to be alive, but they are so fundamentally bad on defense that stupid runs like this still happen.

    I don’t know if it’s a coaching thing or just having bad defensive players, but this is just terrible.

  20. How the heck is it that Rose can make crazy ass shots like that drive but can’t hit open jump shots.

  21. everytime Anthony gets matched up with a rookie or an inexperienced player he does the same thing, he got matched with Kaminsky, dribbled and shot a stupid 3 with a 7 footer on his face… I hate this attitude so much.

  22. I thought the same thing Bruno, especially when he looked to be doing it again on the next possession, and then he threaded a beautiful pass to Noah.

  23. Melo’s second quarter wasn’t his best ever.

    Who had a good half? O’Quinn, Holiday and one quarter of Melo. That’s it.

  24. the effort is there … charlotte has hit some tough shots against us… it’s just there’s a breakdown a handful of times a game…

  25. @78 yeah, it really bothers me, specially since he’s capable of such great passes…

    I hate to criticize melo when he had such a great 1st quarter, but this kind of shit needs to go if this team has any chance to be really good.

  26. They are setting double high screens leading to some defensive breakdowns on our part. Noah is too slow to provide much rim protection when it’s needed.

  27. Ya know..it really does seem like we’ve been cursed by the basketball guards after dumping Mark Jackson and Rod Strickland. That’s probably why I’m rooting so hard for Jennings and Rose. Plus I’m biased to PG’s..that’s hands down my favorite position an the most important position in my mind. Just think of how good Rose can be if he plays better D and takes to faciliating the way Jennings has. It’s clear that he’s still very talented and athletic. As far as this game goes, I really wish Melo would recognize that they hafta get KP going tonight and make more of an effort to get him the ball

  28. Jeez, Noah played 13 minutes and had 8 rebounds (3 offensive) and you guys act like he’s the reason we’re getting beat.

  29. Walker has 6 points and the knicks are losing by 8… that’s a terrible sign…

    edit:well, make that 8 I guess…

  30. As far as this game goes, I really wish Melo would recognize that they hafta get KP going tonight and make more of an effort to get him the ball

    There is no way in Hell or Heaven above that Melo would do that after all the media hype about this being KP’s team. He’s on a mission to score the most points.

  31. If Horny refuses to take Rose and Noah out of the game in lieu of better players then the loss is on him

  32. Is this literally the 5th time we have played a “desperate” team and/or they just got someone back from a long absence that kills the Knicks. It’s just remarkable

  33. d mar, Zeller is 6 for 6 shooting.

    Most of that because Rose is getting beat and Noah is going to help and leaving Zeller.

    But you’re right, Noah is the main reason we’re getting our ass kicked.

  34. Not Rose’s finest minute. He gets beaten badly backdoor, loses the handle then when team gets the ball back misses a jumper.
    Naturally, he makes a driving layup for a three point play while I type.

  35. Willy H is a nice young player but he needs to cut down on the turnovers. He has had turnover problems all season and he has another 4 TOs tonight.

    Seems like a fixable problem once he fully adjusts to NBA speed.

  36. Omg another delicious pass by Jennings to Lee. If only Jennings could shoot. Then again if he could he wouldn’t have been available. Still he makes passes that make me smile.

  37. Melo is ballin.

    Billy Ball would be Derrick Favors if he stopped turning the ball over.

  38. i don’t think you can blame the run on noah…. it was right around when we put melo at the 4 when we went on that huge run…

  39. In 2 of Noah’s last three games the team went on huge runs as soon as Noah sat down. And now again.

  40. Charlotte is honestly not a great team, as they have been showing right now, but it’s nice to see Jennings running the team on offense… I wish he would start, honestly.

  41. @175

    still think the same.

    in basketball 2 points is always worth 2 points, if he played the earlier possessions better, the Knicks wouldn’t even have needed his last 2 shots.

  42. I know what you’re thinking. Leave my guy Billy alone; that was a terrible call.

  43. That possession is indicative of Melo’s career. KP was right open enough for the pass.

    Whatever – he earned his big shot.

  44. Yeah, I can’t get too mad at Melo for not making that pass considering the game he has had. That was the standard end-of-game contested elbow jumper tho.

  45. Breen nearly wet his pants as KP came through the lane and Melo held the ball. KP was practically clapping for the ball for a second there off the left block with noone within two feet of him. Nonetheless, a friendlier roll and it would have been “so what. “

  46. Charlotte beats themselves by missing 10 free throws, Marvin Williams is out and Zeller is playing limited minutes, and this is still an overtime game… how can we be happy?

  47. Has anyone noticed how all these high scoring point guards aren’t scoring much against us? I wonder why?

  48. Porzingis blocks way too few shots for all the ones he changes but that was tremendous.

    Whoever made that crack about Batum’s salary should be suspended for the next game…

  49. It seems like all game, just when things start looking good, they aren’t, and then they are again. Lather rinse repeat.

  50. Thanks Carmelo Anthony, this win is on you!

    seriously a game the Knicks should have lost, but Melo and the Hornets made it possible.

    now let’s double it up!

  51. !!!!! YES !!!!!

    Big OT win! Melo & KP=Batman & Robin!

    Interesting that Kuzminskis was in there at the end.

  52. Fantastic game.

    One of the best of the season, from any team.

  53. and KP is showing that he can still contribute and be a key player down the stretch even on a terrible night!

    stealing a win like that is something that doesn’t happen often to the Knicks, that’s great.

  54. Kuz was 0-6 but got lots of late play. He looked to be playing pretty good D, and Holiday was hurt.

  55. Love it. How many blocks did we have at the end? It was just great defense.

    KP ate Kaminsky’s soul

    Melo erased a Kemba layup

    DRose for the win

  56. Great team win. Melo played great and Rose wasn’t terrible. BJ has to be a better shooter though.

    I don’t like that the starters (not named Joakim Noah) played so many minutes, though. I also hate how tired KP looked when he sat out a lot due to foul trouble, but dammit I’ll take this win. If we can go get the W tomorrow night I’ll be jumping, but I just don’t want us to get blown out.

  57. Billy and The Cheese are keepers. Between them and KP its nice to have Euros who don’t suck ass.

    I feel like Spurs East over here.

  58. noah’s fine… i think we’re settling into a 3 big rotation splitting it around 18-20mpg for each….

    we need more of the melo at the 4 and kp at the 5… that has been really torching teams so far…

  59. Boston lost. Toronto in a dog-fight in Milwaukee. Inching closer to the top of the Atlantic. When was the last time the Knicks were leading the conference after Thanksgiving? Was Ewing playing?

  60. What A FUCKING GAME!!!!!

    This was a total team win. In every facet. Every single player played a key role. I would def look to get picks or something g for Noah

  61. Great overtime win. This was the the kind of game the Knicks have always lost over the last couple of years.

    Great effort on defense tonight especially at the end. Also, another game where a good PG did NOT torch the Knicks. I’m loving this!

    These guys are learning how to win together. Very very encouraging!

  62. we need more of the melo at the 4 and kp at the 5… that has been really torching teams so far…

    Yeah, it is such a great look. They should have been doing this, like, all of last year. I bet they would have been close to a playoff team last year if they had only done that (not necessarily a playoff team, but closer). Anyhow, that was an amazing win tonight. Yay, Knicks!

  63. KP has played amazing defense in the clutch the past two games. All of his blocks are coming with the game on the line. I really feel as if its been the most overlooked part of the past two games. Much props to Melo for pointing it out.

  64. We can easily get a 1st round pick from a contender for Joakim Noah if it came down to that. Noah would be a perfect fit on a team built to win right now like Toronto. He makes a ton of sense on the mid 50 win teams that are competing with GSW and CLE. He makes sense for us, too. I’m cool with 18-25 minutes of Joakim Noah when his back ups are as good as Hernangomez and O’Quinn.

  65. We can easily get a 1st round pick from a contender for Joakim Noah if it came down to that. Noah would be a perfect fit on a team built to win right now like Toronto.

    Or Golden State. I bet they would love to have him.

  66. Yo golden state for real tho. Idk how they would match salaries tho. Iggy?

    Can we dump Lance Thomas on them too?

  67. Very weird how a disciplined team like Charlotte self destructed in the 3rd quarter, but very glad they did.

    One of Melo’s finest games as a Knick.

  68. I honestly think that Plumlee would be at least as good as Noah is. Only more mobile with a better shot.

  69. I honestly think that Plumlee would be at least as good as Noah is. Only more mobile with a better shot.

    I was going to say this, but that’s pretty dismissive of a man who was the DPOY only two years ago.

  70. My favorite two plays of the game were the Melo/Hernangomez PNRs. Melo made two sharp passes and Hernangomez converted each time. If they keep running that play, it will free up lots of great looks.

  71. Golden State would have to give up Iguodala in any trade for Noah. If they have a first round pick it’s non-negotiable; we need that.

    I’d definitely try to push Noah on some desperate team like Washington, though. If they’re around .500 by the deadline and want to make a playoff push, I’d offer them Noah for their 1st and Gortat or something.

  72. Guys Noah gave us 6 points and 8 rebounds in 18 minutes. That’s 12 and 16 per 36. There is no way the Plumlee kid can do that for you.

  73. Noah to Boston for one of their 1st rounders plus one of their interchangable guards? Horford tends to prefer playing PF, and it’d be a Gators reunion.

  74. @248 I think the Knicks were in first or at least over .500 @ January 1 when Marbury made his “I feel like I am the best point guard in the NBA” comment.

    Edit: the 54 win team probably.

  75. Guys Noah gave us 6 points and 8 rebounds in 18 minutes. That’s 12 and 16 per 36. There is no way the Plumlee kid can do that for you.

    His rebound totals are a bit inflated. He vultures lots of boards. I am more concerned with his atrocious defense. He doesn’t protect the middle of the pain anywhere as elite as I hoped he would this season.

  76. Why are we talking about breaking up the team? Are you the enemy? Team stays as-is. Their performance has a lot to do with the trust and chemistry. It’s nice having a lot of guys that can be trusted at the end of the game.

    Do you all realize we have 5 rookies and 2 are solidly in the rotation?

  77. Noah shot 3/5, grabbed 8 rebounds in 18 minutes, had a steal and assist and no turnovers.

    He came into the game leading the Knicks in BPM and +/-.

    The Knicks should continue to run Melo and KP together at the 4 and 5, but Noah is still really good, and he’s still going to help the Knicks win a lot of games this year.

  78. You guys do remember the Knicks won 54 games and were the 2nd seed in the East just 4 years ago, it hasn’t been that long since the Knicks were actually good.

  79. His rebound totals are a bit inflated.

    I call BS on this. He had a number of key offensive rebounds! Noah was a monster on the boards. He got winded and, as Hornacek just said, both teams played a smaller lineup.

  80. I really like the way Hornacek integrates the rookies into the rotation, even in crunch time. It’s gonna be invaluable experience for them as the season progresses and we get hit with inevitable injuries to starters.

  81. Their performance has a lot to do with the trust and chemistry.

    Our chemistry sucks when he’s on the floor because our spacing his garbage. I wouldn’t mind as much if it wasn’t for the fact that his defense has been meh.

  82. 3 offensive boards and 5 defensive boards in 18 minutes. And if he’s a rebound vulture it’s better those rebounds get in his hands than in the opposite team’s hands.

  83. Because Noah has been a detriment. This team seems to explode every time he sits down. Hopefully he improves but trading him would improve us too. And I like Plumlee also.

  84. Guys when Joakim Noah is playing 28 minutes a game you’ll see how good we will be.

  85. That was a GREAT game!! Playoff intensity. Charlotte is fun to watch, very smart, unselfish team. I think they’ll fall back to the pack (they already have) but still a nice young team.

  86. Man, the Greek Freak looks like he’s traveling to me on so many of his fast breaks to the basket.

  87. Anybody who would rather have Plumlee playing over Noah should not be taken seriously.

    How about Willy?

  88. Trading Noah for a very good player or for high draft picks sounds intriguing
    but hating his game without even letting him be a steady part of the rotation is premature imo.

  89. Rose has been great on defense these past few games. He’s been holding opposing PG’s in check since Rambis took over the defense.

  90. I’m saying that I’d rather have Plumlee as my fourth big than Noah as my first. KP, Kyle, Willy and Plumlee are excellent while Noah has hurt us and could be traded for a good asset, possibly a SF so that Melo can move to the four where he’s better.

  91. This would have been an awful loss. Now we’re playing with house money tomorrow, Still would be nice to get a win.

  92. In a perfect world it’d be Noah for Iggy + Looney or something of the sort.

    Then you have a starting five of Rose Lee Iggy Melo and KP

    With a big rotation of Willy KOQ and Looney.

    Noah’s better than many of you are giving him credit for however

  93. we were fortunate to win…. they were having a field day in the paint and at the line… and they didn’t hit their ft’s….

  94. You go in to these things hoping for at least a split, but by winning tonight, the sweep is possible, which would be ay-may-zing!

  95. Beating a pretty good team-good
    At home, in overtime, because they missed a bunch of free throws and shot poorly from 3- less good

  96. Yeah, but come on, I mean, I get it, the Hornets played poorly, but that’s often how you win games, ya know? It’s not like they played without Walker. This was a good win. Winning tomorrow night, though, would be amazing.

  97. Caveats for why we beat a good team are lame. They missed free throws. So what? That’s on them and that’s part of the game. We turned the ball over a lot so that’s on us but we still won.

  98. Opponent FT % in last 4 Knicks losses:

    Washington 16/18, 88%

    Toronto: 33/38: 86.8%

    Boston: 34/43 79.7 %

    Utah: 30/35, 85.7%

    Am I doing this right, Dred? Please advise

  99. Melo becomes 4th Knick with at least 35 points, 14 rebs & 5 assists in a game over last 30+ years- and first such game by a NYK this decade.— Tommy Beer (@TommyBeer) November 26, 2016

    Melo with one of the best Knick performances in many years.

  100. We lost to the Raptors by 11 and the Celtics by 28, so no you’re not doing so fucking good. Washington wasn’t a bad loss-on the road, on a back to back and they shot 3s really well in that game. Sometimes you play okay and you lose, sometimes you play okay and you win.

  101. “Caveats for why we beat a good team are lame. They missed free throws. So what? That’s on them and that’s part of the game. We turned the ball over a lot so that’s on us but we still won.”

    A lot of unforced turnovers, and with KP/Melo leading the offense the Knicks should be very efficient in that regard.

    DRed seems to think that teams simply play to their averages each game.

    Charlotte could have won this game with better free-throw and 3-pt shooting. The Knicks could have won handily if they were less careless with the ball, everything else being equal. You can go on like that for every game a team plays.

    Things that Knicks fan should be very pleased with as of late.

    1. Rebounding. Knicks came into the game 12th in rebound deferential, and were +9 tonight, including 13 offensive rebounds. the Knicks came into the game ranked 5th in orb%.

    2. Passing. The Knicks finished with 26 assists on 45 made baskets. Jennings, Rose, Noah and improved KP has made the offensive significantly more diverse and harder to defend.

    3. Defense. The Knicks finished with 9 steals and 8 blocks. Charlotte is a very good offense (finished 9th in ORTG last year, and sits at 12th this year), and is going to generate good looks, but the Knicks were active even after they’d been beat.

  102. We lost to the Raptors by 11 and the Celtics by 28, so no you’re not doing so fucking good.”

    Knicks were down 4 points with 34 seconds left.

  103. i think that sort of brings up a concern in the offense and why we’re only about middle of the pack…. we are dead last in FTA rate… and it’s across the board…. melo is sitting at .244 which would be a career low for him and kp has regressed these past handful of games in that dept…

    we are top 5 in orb% which kind of lessens the sting from it but if we move to a smaller lineup our offense could just crater if we don’t get to the line more….

  104. FWIW: Since Carmelo Anthony came into the league, he’s had the most go-ahead FG in the final 5 sec of any player.

    Melo 14
    Dirk 12
    Kobe 12

    Per ESPN

  105. That’s because he takes every shot attempt he can within the last 5 seconds. No one else shoots then.

    Superstar game by Mega-Max NTC, by the way. Actual superstar game.

  106. 6’9″ forward Omri Casspi is available. He’s had a few good years up until this season with Sacramento. Last year he shot 48% overall and 41% from three. His WS/48 has consistently been above .09 which is pretty good. 28 years old. Is he worth taking a chance on?

  107. “i think that sort of brings up a concern in the offense and why we’re only about middle of the pack…. we are dead last in FTA rate… and it’s across the board…. melo is sitting at .244 which would be a career low for him and kp has regressed these past handful of games in that dept…

    we are top 5 in orb% which kind of lessens the sting from it but if we move to a smaller lineup our offense could just crater if we don’t get to the line more….”

    The Knicks came into the game with the 11th most attempts in the league inside of 5 feet. They keep winning, they keep scoring inside, they will start to get a better whistle.

  108. i’m not sure if that’ll happen… i mean i’m sure there’s some small sample bias so i think things will improve but i don’t think it’ll be dramatic… we get the 3rd highest percentage of our pts from mid range… and we also lead the thing in attempts from 10-14 ft…

    there’s definitely something going on and i hope things turn around there…

  109. That game winning shot by Melo was pure. ISO heroball, but game winning swish.
    He had a great all around game, came up big on the boards, and had some really good passes down the stretch

  110. They ran so much Triangle down the stretch of the 4th and in OT. Rose/Melo running two man game with KP standing at the top of the key or opposite corner is pretty tough to defend.

    Melo played like a superstar tonight.

    WillyBilly is much better than advertised. Him and Kuz are giving the Knicks some much needed depth, youth, energy and flat out athletic ability.

    This team seems to have quite a bit of firepower.

  111. My only issue with Willy so far is his sky high turnover rate, but I figure that will get better with time.

    Kuz is a gem at his price, especially if his stroke stays consistent (his D is better than advertised as well, though not world beating.)

  112. Really good game to win. Amazing game by Melo. Solid work all around, especially on the boards. Too many fouls though, again, and shot distribution bad once more after a few promising games. Still, good win. Does kaminsky always take so many 3s?

  113. had to watch the second half of the game on nexus 5x with my son and I huddled together.. good game sp

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