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Wednesday, November 14, 2018

Knicks Morning News (2018.02.10)

  • [NY Newsday] Knicks GM Scott Perry: Adding Emmanuel Mudiay does not reflect on Frank Ntilikina
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 10:03:56 PM)

    Scott Perry says the Knicks acquired Emmanuel Mudiay because they needed more talent, and that it was not an indication that they have lost confidence in rookie Frank Ntilikina.

  • [ESPN] Knicks’ GM: Adding Mudiay no shot at Ntilikina
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 7:03:11 PM)

    While the Knicks traded for point guard Emmanuel Mudiay, general manager Scott Perry said the team still has faith in rookie Frank Ntilikina. Perry believes the two can share the backcourt together.

  • [SNY Knicks] Ex-Knick Jared Jeffries believes Mudiay can take next step with Knicks
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 10:26:56 PM)

    Emmanuel Mudiay getting traded to the Knicks might have just saved his career if you ask former Knicks F Jared Jeffries.

  • [SNY Knicks] Perry notes addition of Mudiay is irrelevant to Ntilikina’s performance
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 5:52:53 PM)

    Knicks GM Scott Perry wanted to reassure everyone Friday that the acquisition of PG Emmanuel Mudiay was no knock on Frank Ntilikina’s performance thus far.

  • [SNY Knicks] Perry: No trade was made for C Joakim Noah
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 5:15:00 PM)

    Knicks GM Scott Perry confirmed that no trade has been made for C Joakim Noah, and that there is no plan in place for him to return to the team

  • [SNY Knicks] With Porzingis out, Knicks can dream of drafting potential impact player
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 2:00:00 PM)

    With the Knicks’ season lost after Kristaps Porzingis’ season-ending ACL injury, New York will have a better shot at drafting a potential franchise-changing player.

  • [SNY Knicks] After own ACL recovery, Knicks G Jack empathizes with Porzingis
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 12:30:00 PM)

    Knicks guard Jarrett Jack said he will try his best to help teammate Kristaps Porzingis through his torn ACL by talking to him about his own recovery process.

  • [SNY Knicks] Knicks rookie Ntilikina looking forward to working with Mudiay
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 11:30:00 AM)

    Knicks rookie guard Frank Ntilikina said he is looking forward to working with newly-acquired point guard Emmanuel Mudiay in New York’s crowded backcourt.

  • [SNY Knicks] Larry Brown says Mudiay will benefit from change of scenery
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 9:15:31 AM)

    Larry Brown believes that Emmanuel Mudiay will benefit from the change of scenery from his trade to the Knicks and that he can play with Frank Ntilikina.

  • [NYDN] Joakim Noah will remain away from Knicks ‘until further notice’
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 8:56:23 PM)

    The trade deadline passed and the Knicks are still in their game of chicken with the exiled Joakim Noah.

  • [NYDN] Perry says PG competition will help Knicks but it hurts Ntilikina
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 8:55:46 PM)

    Strap in because there’s lots of losing and roster “competition” ahead.

  • [NYPost] Knicks rookie finally gets his shot and refuses to waste it
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 6:55:23 PM)

    The Knicks’ controversial decision to trade a 23-year-old, All-Rookie first-team center selection for two distant second-round picks became clearer Thursday in Toronto. The 7-foot former Vanderbilt center Luke Kornet, who has spent the season with G-League Westchester, made his NBA debut a historic one at Air Canada Centre. He posted a double-double, adding four blocks…

  • [NYPost] Knicks GM reveals Emmanuel Mudiay-Frank Ntilikina plan
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 1:06:03 PM)

    Knicks general manager Scott Perry said the addition of young point guard Emmanuel Mudiay is part of the team’s “talent acquisition phase” and is no reflection on any disappointment with struggling rookie lottery point guard Frank Ntilikina. Thursday’s trade with the Nuggets for Mudiay, a lottery pick in 2015, gives the Knicks four point guards…

  • [NYPost] The shot that can take Knicks’ Emmanuel Mudiay to next level
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 8:46:55 AM)

    TORONTO – Jared Jeffries, the former Nuggets scouting director and ex-Knicks forward, told The Post that Emmanuel Mudiay desperately needed out of Denver before his entire career was shot. Denver had moved on with their 2016 first-rounder, Jamal Murray, and Mudiay, 21, was regressing. Jeffries, who helped draft Mudiay with the seventh pick in 2015,…

  • [NYTimes] On Pro Basketball: Cavaliers Clear the Air by Blowing Up the Building
    (Friday, February 09, 2018 3:43:30 PM)

    Deadline deals rarely lead to championships, but there is little precedent for the dramatic roster overhaul Cleveland engineered on Thursday.

  • 81 comments on “Knicks Morning News (2018.02.10)

    1. Max

      Nice words from Brown on Mudiay, hope he’s right,
      Burke weeks ago talked about his “coming of age” and how now he understand why he missed in Utah and Washington, maybe the same could happen with Mudiay.
      And interesting comments on why today so many first rounders are traded early.
      Alas we stink in the development department…

    2. Knick fan not in NJ at this time

      Those of you who are complaining about the WHG trade should think about the limited number of roster spots the Knicks have, and think about Luke Kornet. I watched the Toronto game on tape. Kornet had a better game than any game Willy had all year. And Willy did have several opportunities to have that good a game. The Knicks only have so many roster spots and, although I didn’t see Kornet and Willy in practice, I can believe they decided to give Kornet development time and trade Willy to make space. Willy wanted to get traded anyway. I agree that it’s unlikely to get a better player than Willy with a second round pick, but that’s the market now —The picks have more value in the market than the actual players they will probably turn into. So the Knicks should use the picks in a later transaction. But if they don’t they are probably still better off developing Kornet and drafting two more players than developing Willy.

    3. Max

      According to Begley the Knicks are extensively scouting top G-League prospects, looking to fill the empty roster spot.

    4. thenoblefacehumper

      1. Saying the Knicks could only have one of Willy or Kornet is a false choice, unless you’re super dedicated to Jarrett Jack’s roster spot.

      2. Kornet may have had a better game than Willy has had all year, but last year, which was the year Willy, you know, played, he had 13 games with a higher game score than Kornet’s (this likely would be much higher if not for inconsistent minutes).

      3. Even if you make the unfounded assumption that Kornet is better than Willy, that does nothing to justify trading Willy when his value was at rock bottom.

    5. Stratomatic says "It's tough being us"

      1. Saying the Knicks could only have one of Willy or Kornet is a false choice, unless you’re super dedicated to Jarrett Jack’s roster spot.

      The Knicks are building around Jack and Lee. :-)

    6. Knick fan not in NJ at this time

      Noble, of course there are others the Knicks could cut, but cutting their starting point guard? Anyway, maybe they don’t feel they need more centers under contract than they have.

      It’s true Willy had some better games last year, but he didn’t show much on defense or any sort of shooting from distance. I don’t think he’s worthless; in fact, I liked him a lot. But I do think there are good arguments for what the Knicks did, even without seeing them in practice. And the Knicks saw Willy in practice all the time and it didn’t change their minds. Another argument for trading him is that he was an unhappy player and asked to be traded. This is not irrelevant, if you are building team play and also if you want to be known as a reasonable place for free agents to go to.

      And as for value being at rock bottom, if Kornet was about to beat him out for playing time his value could go even lower.

    7. Z-man

      The Willy trade is annoying, but actually a reasonable transaction in this market, Future second round picks are overvalued right now, and are likely to be in the next 2-3 years. Although the most likely outcome is a non-rotation player, there is still the low-percentage unlimited upside aura about them that makes them desirable in trades. Think of all the transactions this year that hinged on second-round picks. In Willy, we had a player of a devalued genre taking up a roster spot. He is a one-way C with poor measurables who doesn’t shoot 3’s. Her’s an absolute cipher at all aspects of defense except rebounding. Nobody wants those guys anymore; see: Greg Monroe. It doesn’t make it right, but I seriously doubt that Willy ever would bring back much more than we got for him right now while on his current deal.

    8. Henry George

      I accept Hornachek’s meritocratic arguments regarding the vets, younglings, and playing. The kiddies gotta earn them jawn, otherwise they’ll get entitled, which hampered the 76ers process significantly. Their play, given copious amounts of undeserved playing time, degraded to streetball fairly quickly.

      You have to have vets on a young team to teach, model, and motivate the younger players to self-realize. And, as far as I’m concerned, Jack, Lee, Thomas, Beasley and OQ are up to that task.

      Honestly, I’m not worried. When KP returns, it will be to a better, more athletic team.

    9. Z-man

      Kornet can become an elite 3-point shooter. Anything else he gives you is dubious. Her had a good line vs. Toronto, but he’s not really a rebounder or defender. Not as bad as Novak, but probably not as good a shooter as Novak either.

    10. thenoblefacehumper

      Noble, of course there are others the Knicks could cut, but cutting their starting point guard?

      Yeah, why the hell not? We now have three young-to-youngish point guards we need to get a look at, why is Jarrett Jack still on the team?

      But I do think there are good arguments for what the Knicks did, even without seeing them in practice. And the Knicks saw Willy in practice all the time and it didn’t change their minds.

      This is, and always will be, a lazy argument. Teams way smarter than the Knicks make massive evaluative errors all the time. The Knicks themselves? Well, they’ve turned it into an art form.

      Another argument for trading him is that he was an unhappy player and asked to be traded. This is not irrelevant, if you are building team play and also if you want to be known as a reasonable place for free agents to go to.

      And as for value being at rock bottom, if Kornet was about to beat him out for playing time his value could go even lower.

      He very reasonably asked to either be traded or to play some basketball after being all-rookie first team last year. The Knicks’ decision not play him was their own, and definitely contributed to the stupidity of this entire situation.

    11. lavor postell

      @10

      Kornet was one of the better shot blockers/rim protectors in the country. Honestly the highest upside I’d imagine for him is a more average 3P shooting (35%ish) and better shot blocking version of Frye. Similar to Frye he’s not a great defensive rebounder, at least not in his past, and in extended minutes will get exposed in space and in PnR. It was nice to see he got after it on the glass in his debut, but I’m not expecting that to last. Shooting and shot blocking are what will make or break him.

    12. danvt

      #2 I totally agree. The trade was about Luke Kornet, plain and simple. The Knicks needed a roster spot. Getting 2 second round picks for your third string center who can’t see court time is actually a pretty good haul.
      Statements like this are ridiculous:

      Even if you make the unfounded assumption that Kornet is better than Willy, that does nothing to justify trading Willy when his value was at rock bottom.

      That Kornet is better is really not an “unfounded assumption”. Did the Knicks win a lot of those games with the fancy WHG piling up all rookie stats? Do you think Hornacek is going to deliberately undermine a team dedicated to making the playoffs by keeping a better player on the bench?

      The only thing I’ll say for the skeptics on this trade is Bargnani, etc. We’re the basketball fan equivalent of PTSD. If we do it, it must be stupid. Now, Wily becomes Marc Gasol for CHA. I get it. But, for another organization this is a footnote.

    13. thenoblefacehumper

      That Kornet is better is really not an “unfounded assumption”. Did the Knicks win a lot of those games with the fancy WHG piling up all rookie stats? Do you think Hornacek is going to deliberately undermine a team dedicated to making the playoffs by keeping a better player on the bench?

      You’re joking, right? No one who has read this blog for years would seriously make the “haha where are his Ws bro” argument about a guy putting up objectively good numbers on a terrible team, right?

    14. Stratomatic says "It's tough being us"

      There is nothing in Kornet’s record that indicates to me he’ll be anything more than a useful player off the bench once in awhile.

      I understand the logic of those saying that if management likes him as much or better than Willy, it makes sense to put him into Willy’s spot and get the 2 picks. I think the counterpoint is that Willy had more value last year. So by allowing him to totally rot on the bench, we reduced his value. Even if it makes some sense now given the situation, perceptions, and the market, we still blew it with Willy.

      I even understand the “merit” part of the playing time equation, but there were still chances and matchups to play Willy but he rotted on the bench.

    15. danvt

      Were the numbers defensive numbers? Do you really think we would have won more games this year with WHG playing and Kanter sitting? We all criticize Kanter for that reason. Good stats but bad p and r defense. WHG couldn’t get on the court and didn’t make us better, ever. That was my point. I get that W’s are a team thing, but the outrage crowd is blowing this thing up into something it isn’t. The guy was not a rotation player. Maybe you’re smarter than the Knicks coach and GM. Really maybe. I actually believe that might be the truth. That’s the state of my regard for this franchise. But if Greg Popovich or Stan Van Gundy does this no one thinks twice.

    16. danvt

      and STOP talking about driving his trade value up by playing him. Maybe you’re driving it down by playing him. Maybe you want to win an have someone who is better.

    17. d-mar

      why is Jarrett Jack still on the team?

      That is the $64,000 question. Hornacek is no longer coaching for his job, everyone up and down the organization knows that losing as many games as possible is the best option for the rest of the season. We don’t need “veteran leadership” or bull crap like that, I don’t care if Frank, Trey and Mudiay shoot 30% for the rest of the season, just freakin’ play them and let Jarrett Jack go play golf in Florida or something.

    18. Z-man

      If Willy played 1000 minutes this year at something around last year’s numbers, his trade value would still have been around what we got for him, mainly because he’s still a turnover machine, doesn’t shoot 3’s and is an objectively horrendous defender. It’s silly to assume that teams didn’t factor in his play from last year. Yet despite 10 teams or so saying that they were interested in him, the 2 seconds were the best offer. Again, see: Greg Monroe. He’s essentially Willy’s upside. Would anyone give Boston more than 2 second rounders for him, even if he were on a minimum deal for 2 more years?

    19. Stratomatic says "It's tough being us"

      Willy was all rookie last year and when he was playing in nationally televised games ex-players and coaches were talking about him as being a hidden gem and one of the steals of the draft. That doesn’t make anyone right, but perceptions around the league were high.

      This year the same people were asking what’s wrong with him that he can’t even get off the bench.

      All we had to do was play him on nights O’Quinn was struggling, when Kanter was out, and consistently in garbage time, and it would have helped develop him and keep him happy. It also might have maintained his value to the point where we squeezed a little more out of a trade if we were so hell bent on trading him.

    20. Max

      Four days of Willy’s talks are too much even for his mother,
      what if we declare a truce and start bashing the FO for Mudiay
      or one of many other topics (from global warming to KP’s injury to bad development of young players to their fixation with player’s option)?

      In the meantime finally free from the clutches of a bad coach (of which he probably banged the daughters) and an inept FO (of which he surely banged the wives) El Matador will have all his chances to show his value.

      If he’s good he’ll play, their front office has all the reasons to ask the coach to put him on the floor.
      There’s nothing we can do to change that trade and I doubt that anyone of us will change his opinions about it.

    21. Henry George

      Plain and simple: Jack is playing because he’s better than the other guys. That Frank and Burke are still getting burn reflects on what they’ve earned. If they want more they need to earn it. WHG couldn’t beat out Kanter, OQ, and Beasley, and that’s why he’s not here anymore.

      There’s this general misconception that just players improve merely off playing time. Improvement primarily comes off of If Frank, Burke and Mudiay want more burn, they do that at team practice, individual practice, and the off-season. They still need PT, but not as much as you’d think.

    22. hoolahoop

      Kornet can become an elite 3-point shooter.

      Here we go. He played one NBA game.
      Who’s going to be the first to predict Kornet will be GOAT.

    23. Max

      Perry release a statement declaring that Kornet’s playing time has nothing to do with his hot mom.

      Edit: BTW she work for Nashville NBC’s affiliate, it’s nice to have the media on our side once in a while…

    24. chrisk06811

      I wonder if we had made the Mudiay trade first, if we might not have done the Willy trade, because the Mudiay trade made Jack expendable, freeing up a roster spot

    25. chrisk06811

      My goal for this snowy weekend is to figure out where I can binge watch Jared Jeffries’ fishing show.

    26. Max

      Meanwhile down in Texas Morey gets Brendan Wright and Joe Johnson for free…
      So that’s why he didn’t trade for Lee, KOQ or Beas…
      Buyouts are bitches…

    27. Henry George

      Hoolahoop,

      Kornet did what he’s doing for years: hit 3’s (at +40%), block shots and play solid D (SEC All-defence).

      The guy that really intrigues me is Hicks. Even with a really bad case of the butterflies, he did some positive things on both sides, and at the SF no less. If he can develop a 3 shot, he’ll become even more than found money.

    28. Z-man

      Already read it, Brown is not a reliable source, and we have lots of stats saying that Mudiay is lousy. He’s young and may improve, but don’t bank on it. I like the deal, but don’t expect much.

    29. Silky Johnson, Fleet Admiral of the Tank Armada

      Hicks was great in college and he projected really well coming out. We should give him more burn. His issue is shooting from range but he checks all the other boxes (rebounding, defense, efficient scoring around the basket, a little bit of passing, solid free throw shooting)

      As a UNC alumnus I’m not biased at all :)

    30. kevin5318

      @IanBegley
      Jeff Hornacek says Emmanuel Mudiay is expected to play tomorrow vs. Indy. When asked about it, he suggests Jarrett Jack’s minutes will decrease going forward with Mudiay, Frank Ntilikina and Trey Burke in the mix

    31. bidiong

      Mudiay is one of those guys that you hope a change of scenery and a fresh shot with low expectations gets him going and turns him into a reasonably paid rotation backup. That should be the highest ceiling any of us should be hopeful for with bust the most likely outcome.

    32. hoolahoop

      Every once in a while, someone cracks their mental barrier. Size and skills are not Mudiay’s problem.

    33. Cock Jowles, Living through the Melo Era All Over Again

      This is, and always will be, a lazy argument. Teams way smarter than the Knicks make massive evaluative errors all the time. The Knicks themselves? Well, they’ve turned it into an art form.

      I don’t know how anyone can make an appeal to authority (outside of Popovich, who never makes mistake) when the Thunder traded James Harden to keep Kendrick Perkins. Did they just not watch Harden in practice enough? Motherfuckers made the fucking Finals and traded their 2nd-best player. Almost made me question whether jon abbey was secretly Daryl Morey, which was confusing because jon abbey was obviously an idiot.

      I hope everyone enjoys Mudiay helping the tank this year and next, and then also when he gets a 4/$50M extension and helps us tank halfway into the next decade.

      No matter what the scouting reports say about Mudiay, you have to remember that his career net Rtg is negative 19 in 4226 MP. He is the point guard Bargnani.

    34. swiftandabundant

      I find I frustrating that this blog is full of posters who want the Knicks to make trades for young players with upside who are low cost experiments/lottery tickets and then when the Knicks do that they turn around and say “yeah but he sucks. Look at his stats.”

      Mudiay is in his third year and came out of th draft having played a season (not even) in China. He obviously has the physical tools and some skills or else he would not have been a top ten pick. And PG is probably the hardest position in the NBA to learn and become good at. If he didn’t kind of suck ao far then he would not be up for a trade. That is how it works.

      It’s like people on this blog it’s want to crap on us for every move even when they make moves that align with the things people supposedly want us to do. I don’t get it. Mudiay is an amazing prospect and a great risk for us to take. And all we have up was McDermott and a second round pick. McDermott is older and up for free agency this year anyways and does not have the potential and upside Mudiay has.

    35. swiftandabundant

      Also considering the guard and wings are one of the areas we need to upgrade but this draft is top heavy with bigs…this move was a wise one. Plus the skill set that frank and Mudiay have right now could mpliment each other nicely.

    36. thenoblefacehumper

      No one really complained about the Mudiay trade outside of a few jokes about how he’s a pretty classic Knick. We complained about trading away a young player with upside who has actually been good in the NBA for two distant second round picks.

    37. DRed

      Kornet’s college stats were all over the place, but combined with his showing in the G league at least make him interesting. If he manages to keep attempting around 6 3’s per 36 I’d be optimistic.

    38. Z-man

      If Mudiay never played an NBA minute and we drafted him at his current age (21+) with the 2nd round pick we gave up (probably around #45 or so) you’d call it a reasonable gamble. So comparing it to Harden or Bargnani is just trolling, as those were high-stakes, franchise-crippling deals while Mudiay is a cheap flyer.

      But there’s no getting around that Mudiay has been terrible on both ends of the court in extended NBA minutes, improving ever so slightly this year but still sucking badly. Scouting reports from last year mean nothing. Neither does praise coming from Brown, Jeffries or anyone else. This happens every time a young, shitty player changes teams.

    39. Knick fan not in NJ at this time

      Of course Mudiay is bad in the sense that he has lousy stats. That’s why we could get him for McDermott. It could be what he wil be always, or he could improve with player development. I don’t have faith in the Knick’s player development, but that is because there is almost no data on the Knicks capability in that regard. Previous regimes got rid of young pkayers rather than develop them. So it’s hard to tell how this regime will do. We basically have two seasons of Porzingis development, a half season of Nilikina development and two seasons of Hernangomez development. Porzingis did get better and was recently showing signs of better shot selection and better passing. Ntilikina looks like he might be getting better at shooting, but his passing seems to be getting worse. I dont think Hernangomez imprroved much, but O’Quinn is much better than his first season. So of the little data we have, the signals are mixed.

    40. Cock Jowles, Living through the Melo Era All Over Again

      physical tools

      upside

      proven scorer

      Previous regimes got rid of young pkayers rather than develop them

      It’s funny that the way you wrote this would normally suggest habitual action (“got rid of”), but in the case of the Knicks, it means 100% of the time. They always get rid of young players, no matter who’s at the helm.

    41. Cock Jowles, Living through the Melo Era All Over Again

      If Mudiay never played an NBA minute and we drafted him at his current age (21+) with the 2nd round pick we gave up (probably around #45 or so) you’d call it a reasonable gamble. So comparing it to Harden or Bargnani is just trolling, as those were high-stakes, franchise-crippling deals while Mudiay is a cheap flyer.

      That’s true, but it shows that front offices can’t identify talent at either end of the spectrum. Harden was already great and on the path to become an MVP contender, and Bargnani was trash and was unavoidably trash. The powers that be couldn’t identify either. That’s damning, and it means we should not trust NBA executives unless they’ve shown (like Popovich and Stevens) that they can identify and retain talent.

    42. Z-man

      Re: Popovich, it’s not quite that simple. Popovich (and Brad Stevens, it seems) also makes players better than they would be on other teams. Is Dejounte Murray as useful of a player on another team? Is LMA posting a .200+ WS48 on another team? Is Rudy Gay posting a career high WS48 at age 31 on another team?

    43. Knick fan not in NJ at this time

      Jowles, you right about the way I wrote it. I couldn’t remember every draft, so I thought maybe its not 100%, it just seems that way; but is obviously close to 100% for sure, so I wrote it in a way it could be either 100%, or just close to 100%.

    44. ClashFan

      The Mudiay trade is fine. Yeah, he might continue to stink, but it is worth a shot. Let’s just be sure to play him and Frank alot, even together some.

      Even if he does stink, maybe next trade deadline the Knicks can move him like they did McD this deadline for another “lottery ticket” that a team is eager to get rid of. Why not try one of those every deadline?

      As for Kornett, I like the guy and am pulling for him. But the whole Willy situation this year stinks. And, it was never one or the other. Why not keep and play both, esp. with KP out for probably a year or more?

      Let’s hope they can resign OQ to something like 3/$18m or so. And that he stays in shape and continues to play like he has this year, in effect playing for his next contract. I doubt they’ll be able to retain him so cheaply (I’ll be shocked if he can’t get a midlevel type deal for up to 4/$40m). But I’d love to be wrong.
      :-)

    45. Sir Robin

      Regarding KP’s injury, Ewing himself had some trouble staying on the floor at times due to knee injuries. He also ruptured his Achilles and broke his wrist. Injuries are part of the game. He’ll come back, hopefully wirk harder, ice his knees after a game if he diesnt already, and wear kee braces on both knees going forward. Just as important is his mental approach to recovery.

    46. Z-man

      He was ancient when he hurt his achilles. He never had an ACL not a good comp.

      A better (and scarier) comp is Ralph Samson. Very similar frames and games (in today’s game, Ralph would shoot 3’s) but hopefully KP gets the benefit of 30 years of medical advances.

    47. ptmilo

      No one really complained about the Mudiay trade outside of a few jokes about how he’s a pretty classic Knick.

      well don’t worry there is still someone to wear the straw hat bc i actually don’t like the trade. i think the chances of mudiay becoming more valuable than a 2nd rounder are miniscule. it would be a miracle in my opinion for him to be an average pg by the middle of next year, and an average pg at the end of his rookie deal about to get FMV is worth…maybe a second round pick. look at what elfrid generated.

      i don’t buy the idea that mudiay “has all the physical” tools and just needs to get there mentally. it’s like saying jeff george had all the physical tools. some tools that are called mental are just as hard to improve as running faster, jumping higher or growing taller. mudiay has poor spatial awareness and can’t finish at all with his left. he has below average fine motor skills which hurts his touch inside. this is why he gets blocked more than 10% of the time he shoots. he has slow reaction processing which absolutely kills him on defense. as amar’e taught us, you can’t just find religion and learn this stuff. i’m not saying he can’t improve. but nobody at any age plays 4K minutes as ~the worst player in the entire league and becomes great. and short of great he’s just not worth much in NPV at this point, those are just the economics of the nba. i’d rather have the 2nd.

      admittedly it’s not a big deal because the clips 2nd rounder isn’t worth that much to begin with, but i thought i’d give the angry stat mob it’s first member.

    48. english_knick

      On a separate note, why is it everyone (media etc) seems so confident we’ll have loads of cap space in 2019? Even if we hold off on resigning KP until then, with our next 2 picks we’re only scheduled to have about $20m. That assumes we don’t resign KOQ or Kanter, use any of our exceptions, or sign any second rounders between now and then. If we use the MLE next year and resign Kanter for $10m we’re pretty much at zero.

    49. Henry George

      Scouting reports from last year mean nothing.

      I’ll save your lazy ass the trouble and summarize what a professional scout and talent evaluator (you know, someone that actually gets paid to do this) had to say about Mudiay:

      Strengths
      1. ISO-Facilitation for teammates. 99th percentile. 1.5 pts per possession.
      2. P&R Facilitation for teammates. 79th and 66th percentiles in the league in scoring efficiency when hitting the roll man, and cutter, respectively, out of ball screen action per Synergy.
      3. Guarding The P&R Ball Handler. 68th percentile in PNR defensive efficiency. He is especially adept at trailing his offensive man over the pick and getting back in front of him or forcing him into the defensive help. Mudiay is a strong defender in these situations. He uses his length and good anticipation to make it hard for guards coming off ball screens.
      4. One-on-one defense. 50th percentile. Improving his ISO and overall defensive game could give him the chance to become an elite level defender in the league.

      Weaknesses
      1. Transition Decision Making. 8th percentile in the league, averaging just .77 points per transition possession in transition, turning the ball over 35% of the time on the break as the ball handler.
      2. Catch and Shoot. Ranks in the bottom 25th percentile in the league with catch and shoot situations, converting 81 points on 66 possessions.
      3. Chasing Man through Screens. 22nd percentile when guarding in off the ball screening situations. At times falls asleep, allowing his man to get a step on him over screens.
      4. Handoff Defense. 13th percentile in the league in this category in dribble handoff opportunities (DHOs), allowing 29 points on 25 possessions, with shooting 60% in DHOs.

    50. chrisk06811

      OK, I think you guys wore me down. you’re right…..you can’t like the upside of the Mudiay trade and also be OK dumping Willie for two 2nds unless you really, really like 2nd round picks

    51. Z-man

      (you know, someone that actually gets paid to do this)

      Congratulations, you just posted the dumbest appeal to authority of 2018. Never mind that every terrible NBA transaction had, “you know, someone that actually gets paid to do this” as its mastermind. But you go right on thinking that a scouting report completed a year ago by a player evaluation specialist from a mediocre college basketball program is some kind of find.

    52. chrisk06811

      Z-Man…..got a bone to pick on that one. My kid goes to Temple, everything there is first rate, including their parent bill pay system.

      Seriously though……wouldn’t mind having Fran Dunphy as our coach.

    53. nicos

      Strengths
      1. ISO-Facilitation for teammates. 99th percentile. 1.5 pts per possession.
      2. P&R Facilitation for teammates. 79th and 66th percentiles in the league in scoring efficiency when hitting the roll man, and cutter, respectively, out of ball screen action per Synergy.
      3. Guarding The P&R Ball Handler. 68th percentile in PNR defensive efficiency. He is especially adept at trailing his offensive man over the pick and getting back in front of him or forcing him into the defensive help. Mudiay is a strong defender in these situations. He uses his length and good anticipation to make it hard for guards coming off ball screens.
      4. One-on-one defense. 50th percentile. Improving his ISO and overall defensive game could give him the chance to become an elite level defender in the league.

      This does make him sound salvageable if he can learn to finish at all. Elite as a passer out of iso’s and solid in the PNR as a passer. And not completely broke on defense as he’s an average iso defender and a plus pnr defender. But salvageable probably doesn’t move the needle much- as ptmilo said, Payton only was worth a high second round pick and Mudiay has a ton of improving to do to even get to that level. And he takes point guard reps away from Frank- I don’t think that’s a big deal this year because Frank is godawful offensively right now and needs an off-season of work on his ball skills but next year I’d like to see him get a real shot at playing point and Mudiay’s presence could make that less likely.

    54. Clyde's suit

      So wait, if Mudiay outplays Frank next year and wins the starting job, that’s a bad thing? Mudiay is a fairly young player so if he wins the job next season doesn’t he still fit the profile of what the team wants to be moving forward? It’s not like giving minutes to a fossil like Jack who certainly isn’t part of the teams future…

    55. JK47

      Has ever player ever totally sucked at finishing at the rim, then greatly improved? Usually guys who suck at finishing tend to stay sucky at finishing as far as I can tell. Maybe I’m overlooking somebody?

    56. Brian Cronin

      Wait a sec, so they didn’t swap second rounders for Mudiay? They actually just traded a second rounder outright?

      When it was just swapping picks, then it was Mudiay for essentially nothing (the Clippers’ pick versus Denver’s pick is negligible and McDermott wasn’t a part of the future of the team). But they gave up a current second round pick for him?

    57. ptmilo

      Yeah the swap stuff was wrong. We gave our 2nd rounder (which will be the clippers pick) to Denver and Dallas got Portland’s 2nd from Denver. Sad!

    58. Brian Cronin

      It’s not a huge deal, but yeah, it’s certainly not as good as it was when it was a pick swap between two teams not that far away from each other in the standings. That definitely makes the deal worse.

    59. Brian Cronin

      OK, I think you guys wore me down. you’re right…..you can’t like the upside of the Mudiay trade and also be OK dumping Willie for two 2nds unless you really, really like 2nd round picks

      That’s basically it in a nutshell, although I would drop the “unless” part. ;)

    60. The Glass Half Rebuilt

      There is nothing wrong with trading Doug McDermott and 2RP swap rights for Emmanuel Mudiay. Doug McDermott is a 25 year old basketball player who couldn’t take minutes from Lance Thomas. Mudiay may very well flame out or he might just turn on the gas a la Enes Kanter. Either way, Doug McDermott sucks and we turned him into something potentially useful.

      Mudiay’s problem when it comes to finishing around the basket is he falls way too much. He’s not going up strong and then when he falls he can’t get back on defense. Teach that guy to land on his feet when he drives and you might have a useful basketball player.

    61. The Glass Half Rebuilt

      You’re right, but that doesn’t make the risk franchise breaking. You’re basically giving up Doug McDermott, who has failed in his first three stops, and a mid 40s draft pick to take a 15 month look at a 22 year old point guard.

    62. Brian Cronin

      It’s not a huge deal, but yeah, it’s certainly not as good as it was when it was a pick swap between two teams not that far away from each other in the standings. That definitely makes the deal worse.

    63. The Glass Half Rebuilt

      I’m with you. A worse trade than what was thought/first reported isn’t equal to a bad trade, though. The Hernangomez trade was a bad trade even though I understand the reasoning behind it. He didn’t play because he’s objectively worse than KO and Kanter, and they wanted to ensure they had at least two picks in every draft. They still sold low and that’s annoying, but there probably wasn’t any room for Willy on this team anyway with KP needing to be a full time center.

      According to Berman, the Knicks plan is to lure a free agent to NY to play with TH2, KP, and our 2018 and 2019 lottery picks. I consider Berman and Begley as the two guys plugged into the Knicks’ FO’s thinking, so hearing that gives me hope. If we get Michael Porter Jr this year and RJ Barrett next year we might not even need free agency. This front office sees 2020 as the season to build towards, and that always needed to be the case. KP had to tear an ACL to get us here, but at least we’re here and now the Knicks are looking to add as much through the draft as they can to bolster KP when he gets back.

    64. english_knick

      @77 – yeah, but I ask again… where’s the 2019 money coming from for a young impact FA? We’ll almost certainly have to waive Noah and trade Lee for relief to get meaningful space…

    65. Sir Robin

      @58. z-man. With all due respect, Sampson is a good comp in terms of frame, etc, but a bad comp in other ways:

      Sampson hurt his left knee during the 1986-87 season but instead of staying on the sidelines he rushed his rehab and played on the bad knee. Sampson had very little cartilage in his left knee and his decision to return too soon proved to be an epic mistake. His game suffered from it and eventually curtailed his promising career.

      “I should have been out for a year but came back after eight weeks because I wanted to play the game of basketball and the sport that I love,” Sampson said. “I probably came back a little too early, but we had a chance to go back to The Finals with the team we had, and I wanted to go back with my teammates.”

      Sampson was never the same after his knee gave out. He started having back issues as well.

      Z, my point was not to find a true comp, but to point out that injuries are part of the game. Twenty percent of life is what happens to you, 80 % is how you react. And, yes, as Phil said before KP had even played 1 minute in the NBA, “he may be too big to play.”

      Let’s see how KP responds, reacts and grows from here.

      Let’s wait a little longer to see the recovery, prognosis etc. As Aaron Rodgers saud, “relax”.

      http://onemanfastbreak.net/the-big-hurt-how-injuries-destroyed-ralph-sampsons-hall-of-fame-career/

    66. Z-man

      @79 agreed for the most part. I do worry that KP plays a style of ball that will not be friendly to his knees, given his long legs and high center of gravity. And hopefully he’s come closer to reaching his full potential than Ralph ever did.

    67. Sir Robin

      Z. Agree. He needs to be broken down, even to the extent of not flailing his legs when he jumps. It’s up to him.

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