Knicks Morning News (2017.03.09)

  • [NY Newsday] Knicks unable to stop onslaught by Bucks’ Giannis Antetokounmpo
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 11:55:38 PM)

    MILWAUKEE — Carmelo Antony says he wants to play six more seasons, but there are times when he plays like he can’t wait for this one to end.

  • [NY Newsday] Knicks’ Derrick Rose not bothered by being benched during game
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 9:42:00 PM)

    MILWAUKEE — Derrick Rose said he was not upset that he didn’t play at all in the fourth quarter in the Knicks’ win over Orlando Monday night, calling it the coach’s decision.

  • [NY Newsday] Carmelo Anthony wants to play 20 seasons in NBA
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 2:52:00 PM)

    MILWAUKEE — Carmelo Anthony has nothing but admiration for the Mavericks’ Dirk Nowitzki, who scored his 30,000th career point Tuesday night.

  • [SNY Knicks] Antetokounmpo, Bucks too much for Knicks
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 10:41:02 PM)

    The Bucks beat the Knicks in Milwaukee on Wednesday night.

  • [SNY Knicks] Tonight’s Game: Knicks at Bucks
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 6:29:04 PM)

    The Knicks go to Milwaukee for a matchup with the Bucks at 8 p.m.

  • [SNY Knicks] Anthony eyes 20 years in the NBA
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 4:25:00 PM)

    Knicks F Carmelo Anthony would like to play 20 seasons in the NBA, a total that would take him to his age-39 season.

  • [SNY Knicks] Player development represents glimmer of hope for Knicks
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 11:25:06 AM)

    While this season has been a disappointment for the Knicks, the team’s ability to develop its young players represents a glimmer of hope for the franchise.

  • [NYTimes] Bucks 104, Knicks 93: Knicks Lose a Third-Quarter Lead and Fall to the Bucks
    (Thursday, March 09, 2017 5:30:15 AM)

    Derrick Rose sank 13 of his 16 shots from the field, and Carmelo Anthony scored 16 points in his return from a one-game absence. That wasn’t enough.

  • [NYPost] ‘This is like home’: Milwaukee intrigues free-agent-to-be Derrick Rose
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 10:21:58 PM)

    MILWAUKEE — The Bucks need a starting point guard. Derrick Rose considers Milwaukee the closest thing to Chicago. And Rose grew up watching Bucks coach Jason Kidd dazzle. Seems like a possible match come July when Rose can become a free agent — even if the Knicks point guard isn’t exactly the premier playmaker Kidd…

  • [NYPost] Knicks step closer to lottery after ‘The Greek Freak’ show
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 5:45:18 PM)

    MILWAUKEE — “The Greek Freak’’ took flight. There was just one superstar on the court Wednesday — and nobody mistook him for Carmelo Anthony. With Milwaukee native Latrell Sprewell watching from a baseline seat close to the Knicks bench, Giannis Antetokounmpo and the Bucks ran the ball down the sloppy Knicks’ throats in the second…

  • [NYPost] Carmelo Anthony ponders NBA shelf life and hitting 30K points
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 10:14:02 AM)

    MILWAUKEE – In the aftermath of Dirk Nowitzki’s milestone achievement, Carmelo Anthony has set a goal of playing 20 seasons. Nowitzki, the Mavericks star, entered the 30,000-point club Tuesday and has said he plans on playing one more season, making it an even 20. Anthony, who is set to return to the Knicks lineup Wednesday…

  • [NYDN] Greek Freak haunts Knicks again in loss to Bucks
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 8:15:40 PM)

    The loss dropped the Knicks’ record to 26-39.

  • [NYDN] Carmelo can join Dirk in 30K-point club if he reaches season goal
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 8:09:55 PM)

    Carmelo Anthony plans on sticking around long enough to make a run at the same exclusive club that welcomed Dirk Nowitzki this week.

  • [NYDN] Knicks’ Derrick Rose still has eye issues from injury 2 years ago
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 4:41:09 PM)

    Derrick Rose is still experiencing swelling near his left eye

  • [ESPN] Thursday’s Knicks News: Too much ‘Greek Freak’ in loss to Bucks
    (Thursday, March 09, 2017 4:58:34 AM)

    Thursday’s Knicks News: Too much ‘Greek Freak’ in loss to Bucks

  • [ESPN] Nets to honor The Notorious B.I.G. vs. Knicks
    (Wednesday, March 08, 2017 7:26:01 PM)

    Nets to honor The Notorious B.I.G. vs. Knicks

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    Mike Kurylo

    Mike Kurylo is the founder and editor of KnickerBlogger.net. His book on the 2012 Knicks, "We’ll Always Have Linsanity," is on sale now. Follow him on twitter (@KnickerBlogger).

    109 thoughts to “Knicks Morning News (2017.03.09)”

    1. most of this to-do list has been mentioned in previous threads, but I agree wholeheartedly with this entire post at CBS.

      In a nutshell:
      1) let Rose walk

      2) have an adult conversation with Carmelo, explaining what the plan is and how he (doesn’t) fit in

      3) commit to the triangle fully or let Hornacek run whatever he wants, then get players that fit whatever the plan is – rather than this half-in-half-out debacle

      4) stop with the signing of old expensive vets

      5) do whatever it takes to make Kristaps happy, both on and off the court

      6) fix the Oakley situation so it isn’t a huge PR cloud over the organization

      7) concentrate on hitting singles/doubles (Willy, Holiday, Lance, KOQ, Baker, Kuz, Randle), consider trading Lee/Lance/KOQ to get younger/more assets.

    2. Dirk Nowitzki hits 30,000 and Melo says he’d like to play 20 seasons to make a go at 30,000. I would love to get 20 in, I could do 20. I could do 20. I’ve done a great job taking care of my body. I’ll continue doing that. No severe injuries. I could see myself going for 20.

      Well, if you don’t even try on defense, I suppose that’s a great way of preserving your body. But more ominous, Dolan may have observed the Dirk landmark and started to envision a Melo ceremony at MSG in 6 years. Melo opting out at end of next season and receiving a 5 year deal takes him to 20. Ugh.

    3. It’s remarkable to me that someone as talented at basketball as Carmelo Anthony remains so oblivious to what makes for winning or losing basketball. When he says after last night’s game that he doesn’t understand how a team with these players keeps losing, it suggests he has no idea about the importance of defense (which at one point in his career he was capable of playing decently, and at times better than that), ball movement, not continuing to shoot when you don’t have it that night, etc.

      Off the court (especially these last couple of years), he’s comported himself incredibly well, but man is it hard not to roll my eyes at him a lot of the time.

    4. @3

      Sadly, I don’t think Melo’s unaware. He’s too smart for that. I believe he doesn’t care, which is even more insulting.

    5. In the post-game comments last night, Melo specifically and repeatedly said he doesn’t understand how they are losing with the players on this roster.

    6. I don’t think most people fully grasp that they keep score for the other team or choose to ignore that and cost opportunity ie: efficiency.

    7. He’s overly narcissistic… in his mind he is winning, poor kid from the pjs now a household name worth 100 million. He is winning.

      Games and team concept are secondary.

    8. In the post-game comments last night, Melo specifically and repeatedly said he doesn’t understand how they are losing with the players on this roster.

      Melo’s full of shit. He sees the exact same footage as we do and scrutinizes it many more times in team meetings. Anyone can see this team does not play defense or team offense, beginning with him. People have to realize that he’s a conman selling the Knicks fandom a bullshit bill of goods when he says things like he doesn’t know or is committed to winning. He’s already counting the days until the offseason.

    9. Dirk Nowitzki hits 30,000 and Melo says he’d like to play 20 seasons to make a go at 30,000. I would love to get 20 in, I could do 20. I could do 20. I’ve done a great job taking care of my body. I’ll continue doing that. No severe injuries. I could see myself going for 20.

      Well, if you don’t even try on defense, I suppose that’s a great way of preserving your body. But more ominous, Dolan may have observed the Dirk landmark and started to envision a Melo ceremony at MSG in 6 years. Melo opting out at end of next season and receiving a 5 year deal takes him to 20. Ugh.

      Well, if Jackson has total control over the organization, which Dolan keeps insisting he does, then Melo better not opt out next year. Instead, he would be better off letting the deal expire so that he and Jackson are both expiring contracts, at which point he could sign a new 4-year deal with whoever gets hired to replace Jackson.

    10. It’s remarkable to me that someone as talented at basketball as Carmelo Anthony remains so oblivious to what makes for winning or losing basketball. When he says after last night’s game that he doesn’t understand how a team with these players keeps losing, it suggests he has no idea about the importance of defense (which at one point in his career he was capable of playing decently, and at times better than that), ball movement, not continuing to shoot when you don’t have it that night, etc.

      Off the court (especially these last couple of years), he’s comported himself incredibly well, but man is it hard not to roll my eyes at him a lot of the time.

      Six years of Melo have shown us that you basically cannot listen to a word he says either way. It’s all just gobblygook.

    11. Me-lo and those of his AAU ilk have won.

      You get paid in the NBA for POINTZ, not winning. He must look at Tim Duncan as some sort of chump for playing team ball at a discount for years and not monetizing his “brand”!

      Me-lo doesn’t “get” it and he never will. He has already the important contest to him…. making the most money and being famous. Rose will never get it, Cousins will never get it. After watching Durant in the playoffs last year, I’m not completely sure he gets it.

      Wade and LeBron both get/got it. Clyde got it. Pearl got it. Duncan/Manu/Parker/admiral/et al got it

    12. Six years of Melo have shown us that you basically cannot listen to a word he says either way. It’s all just gobblygook.

      And this is precisely why that constant little smirk of his rubs so many people the wrong way. You absolutely know he is as full of shit as a Christmas turkey and laughs at running his jive past everyone.

      I’m completely sure Phil would just love to grab him by the throat one time an bang his head into a desk screaming, “you little shit…. you could be so much better!

      Interestingly enough, he seems like a pretty decent fellow other than his myopic view of his actual profession.

    13. In the post-game comments last night, Melo specifically and repeatedly said he doesn’t understand how they are losing with the players on this roster.

      How sick is that line of thinking if he actually believes it… yep it is the coaching that holds us back, not my/our lack of effort on the other side of the ball and some of our inability to play team ball.

    14. 7) concentrate on hitting singles/doubles (Willy, Holiday, Lance, KOQ, Baker, Kuz, Randle), consider trading Lee/Lance/KOQ to get younger/more assets.

      Trading these guys for value picks would be fine, but none of them is an impediment moving forward and they are all players capable and willing to play team ball, so they are not problematic. Sure, in a perfect world, would I like to trade in 27 to 32 year old players for picks that match KP and WHG’s chronology, sure….but not for the 53rd pick in the draft.

    15. And this is precisely why that constant little smirk of his rubs so many people the wrong way. You absolutely know he is as full of shit as a Christmas turkey and laughs at running his jive past everyone.

      What’s weirder to me is that while yes, some of his statements are obviously BS on the face of them (the whole “Winning is the most important thing to me” stuff when he re-signed with a shitty team for by far the most money he could have made a few years back), a lot of them I think he might honestly believe what he’s saying when he says it, but none of it makes any sense and it is rarely consistent, either. It’s just like word salad. You can’t gain any real insight into what he is thinking at any moment because he just spouts nonsense all the time.

      But yeah, when it comes to off-the-court stuff, he’s much more consistent and eloquent, to boot. But when basketball comes up, just nonsense.

    16. Melo seems like a stand-up guy off the court and a good guy in the locker room (other than during the D’Antoni/Linsanity era) but my lord on the court he’s infuriating

    17. He’s really not that hard to understand. He’s a family man interested in making money. So, New York is important, money is important, and his brand is important. Winning would help things, like money, but is secondary. PR is important for the above reasons, so he has to say “winning” a lot.

    18. I mean, basketball analysts who have played / worked in the league for decades are completely oblivious still as to why teams win or lose, I don’t get why someone would be surprised Melo is too.

      it was just 3 nights ago that Mark Jackson, legendary player, coach for 3 years and analyst for many now, was saying how he thinks Rose is a top player… its been ever since Melo came to the Knicks that most of the fan base and the analysts keep searching for whatever reason this team sucks other than Melo, and yet he’s the only constant.

      it’s just stupidity rewarded by even stupider owners / basketball decision makers / media moguls that keeps this circus going.

    19. it was just 3 nights ago that Mark Jackson, legendary player, coach for 3 years and analyst for many now, was saying how he thinks Rose is a top player…

      He was just auditioning for a job by kissing ass.

    20. Maybe I’ve been sheltered in my line of work, but it’s still amazing to me how large, successful corporations can still function while giving big-time jobs to idiots who kiss ass.

    21. Why do people persist in believing players or coaches are honest when talking to the press?

    22. Re: Melo – I think he honestly thinks that if he’s on a team and is doing his thing, that team is going to be good. And why wouldn’t he think that? Awesome in high school, led team to national championship in college, playoffs in first 10+ years in the NBA, all doing his thing.

      But man — Charley Rosen is right. He has no legs left. Sure, when he is freed up he can still jump, but watching him close out on guys is just so ugly. He has no ability to recover at all when guys attack his closeout. One can only hope for his sake that it’s a result of playing the Olympics and not getting much time off, but I can’t imagine he’s going to last 20 years.

    23. Melo is monumentally unaware. He’s a very low basketball IQ player.

      He thinks the best players are the one that have special talents and skills on offense that other players do not have. He has no understanding that you win or lose based on how you translate your skills into extra possessions for your team, fewer for the opposition, more efficient scoring for your team and less efficient scoring for the opposition.

      He asks.

      How could a team with Melo and Rose not be kicking ass. We can do so many things that other PGs and SFs can’t do?

      He’ll never understand why we’d be better with Jae Crowder and Patrick Beverly.

    24. Next season Melo will say he’s “in the best shape” of his life, and that he “really took care of himself in the off season,” and that he’s “really looking forward to playing again now because there were no Olympics,” and that he’s really “ready to buy in” and do whatever Phil and the team need.

      WTF do we do? Rinse and repeat. Knicks.

    25. Bruno hit the nail on the head. Most guys involved in the business are completely unaware. Last night, Mike Breen went off on a tangent re: the ROY race. He praised Brogdon, he praised Dario Saric, but did not utter one word about Billy.

      This sort of egregious shite makes basketball unwatchable.

    26. I think Saric will win ROY for that very reason, that his profile is higher than Brogdon since Saric is currently the featured player on the Sixers and people are blinded by stuff like that.

    27. the Willy thing irritates me so much too.

      those people are the ones that keep saying basketball is “all about the little things”, the intangibles or interactions or whatever dumb preconceived idea of what good basketball they have is, and yet are completely fine with ignoring metrics that they could learn in 10 minutes reading a website which are far more valuable than “grit”, “ability to hit home runs” or “breaking down the defense”.

      they are the ones who endlessly praise Melo when he jab steps 8 times and pulls up for a shot… when it’s a shot that literally every single NBA player could take, yet most won’t do it because they’re either smarter, less famous or told by their coaches to not do it.

    28. ROY should be Willy Hernangomez. He may not be the most talented player or have the most upside, but he’s the most productive now. His younger brother is not far behind.

    29. @25

      Next season Melo will say he’s “in the best shape” of his life, and that he “really took care of himself in the off season,” and that he’s “really looking forward to playing again now because there were no Olympics,” and that he’s really “ready to buy in” and do whatever Doc Rivers, CP3 and the team need.

      Fixed that for you.

    30. It’s funny, right after I made my comment about Saric, I got an e-mail from one of those sites that does sports odds and it was about how Saric was now the odds-on favorite to win the award. :) He’s at 1/2 while Brogdon is at 3/1, with Embiid third at 15/1.

    31. An off season trade to the Clippers makes a lot of sense. They like Lee as a replacement for Reddick, so we can throw him into a deal with Melo to sweeten the deal for them. I’d take back contracts like Crawford to get as many future firsts as possible. My goal would be to get the ones a few years from now when CP3 and Melo are both in their mid 30s. Get that 2021 and 2023 first round pick from them unprotected if possible. They are as win now as any team out there and Melo (if they kept Blake) would give them an absolutely lethal starting 5.

      We’d suck the next few years but we’re gonna suck anyways. So we have good draft picks of our own. And hopefully by the time we start getting decent with KP/Willie H and whatever young dudes we draft, we find ourselves in a Boston like situation where we have top picks coming to us from a declining Clippers team. Imagine adding a top 5 pick in 2021 and 2023 (plus our own first round picks to a core of Zinger, Willie H, 2017, 18, 19, and 20 first round picks. Zinger and Willie H at this point are still only about 25 years old.

      THAT would be how you rebuild long term.

    32. Are we really surprised about Willy not winning ROY though? Jokic didn’t come close to winning the award last season either and now he’s poised to the best player of that bunch with a playoff birth in the West. I would be very happy with Willy developing along those lines.

    33. Last night for the first time I was yelling at my TV for Hornacek to take KP out. He was out of it on both ends of the floor last night. GA was embarrassing him regularly, but he also looked very low energy like he’s burnt out. I’m feeling pretty lost about what his future holds. It’s hard to tell how much of the problem is related to the way we run our offense and the fact that’s he kind of a tweener on defense and how much is simply his lack or progress and possible regression. I’m not buying the injury rationale. It bothered him for a few games, but it has not been a persistent problem. He just has not been very good for several months.

    34. I think Embiid should be ROY. Even though he only played less than half a season, and on a minutes restriction at that, the impact of his long stretch of franchise player-level play on the conversation around the NBA, and about Philly’s future specifically, is so far above any of the other rookies that I think if makes up for his getting injured. Even if he wasn’t the top player statistically or durability-wise, he was the most exciting and dominating. I totally get feeling otherwise, but to me, it’s like a guy getting called up at the all-star break and playing out the rest of the season at a higher level than anyone else.

    35. I just wanna say..
      I’ve been following this blog for a very long time. The wayhow I post has gotten me where I am. And now advanced stats are askin me to change the wayhow I post but all I know is the wayhow I post. So now I gotta learn it and apply it to the wayhow I post to make it better. Now excuse me while I go swallow some Vaseline.

      LOL. Levity?

    36. Last night, Mike Breen went off on a tangent re: the ROY race. He praised Brogdon, he praised Dario Saric, but did not utter one word about Billy.

      Similarly, the Bucks’ color guys were talking about how Derrick Rose was playing excellent basketball all season and how lucky the Knicks are to have him. These people don’t know what they’re talking about.

      1) Brogdon should be ROY based on minutes/production.

      2) Willy would have been ROY if his coaches weren’t idiots who buried him in the beginning of the season.

      3) Embiid is not worthy of ROY mostly because he played 786 minutes this season. Also his turnovers and fouls are horrendous, but I doubt people like Z-man care too much about turnovers. “Fake stats.”

      4) Saric is terrible and is one of the worst rookies in the league, which is impressive given how many terrible rookies there are this year. If he wins, it’ll be a clear sign that the greater NBA community is still thinking like cavemen.

    37. That clippers trade is a dream come true…

      I would even trade melo for deng and a pickat this point

    38. Yea..this year’s rookie class is..well..you know it sucks when the best candidates for ROY are Domantas Sabonis, Yogi Ferrell, and Malcolm Brogdon. By default Saric is in there too, but he’s been not nearly as good as advertised so far.

    39. I hope Phil gets the message that haggling over cap space is secondary to getting rid of Melo and gaining draft picks. He outsmarted himself with that Rubio trade trying to get Belejica and ended up with nothing. Should Doc offer two unprotected first round picks in the early 2020s, then we shouldn’t haggle over Jamal Crawford.

    40. Saric does have potential and talent, but his production level is really bad… ROY should be a title that takes into consideration production, not potential future performance like it generally does.

    41. 2) Willy would have been ROY if his coaches weren’t idiots who buried him in the beginning of the season.

      The same is true of his brother. There are players ahead of him in Denver’s pecking order that should not be getting more minutes than Juan. I think there’s some kind of unwritten code that you have to slowly earn the respect of the coach and other players before they will jump you ahead of a veteran.

    42. They like Lee as a replacement for Reddick, so we can throw him into a deal with Melo to sweeten the deal for them.

      I don’t know if that’s true, though. The most recent buzz was that they have wink wink nudge nudge deals already in place with all three of their big free agents, Redick included. Don’t get me wrong, I agree with that trade idea in general. The 2021 and 2023 first rounders have always been my dream of any Clippers deal. Just noting that I don’t think that they see Lee as replacing Redick. I think they would consider Lee on top of Redick, though (with Lee basically taking Crawford’s spot and Melo taking Luc Mbah a Moute and Wesley Johnson’s minutes, with Johnson and Crawford both headed to the Knicks in the deal for cap purposes). Crawford averages 24 minutes a game and Mbah a Moute/Johnson average about 35 minutes. So plenty of minutes for Lee and Melo.

    43. Sabonis is probably the worst player in the league. .478 TS%, below-average shooting volume, awful rebounding, high fouls. If anyone gives him a ROY vote they deserve to have their voting privilege taken away.

    44. the fact Juantcho is behind in minutes to Barton, Chandler and all those dudes in Denver should be a crime in all states.

    45. You would think that at least Mike Breen would recognize Willy’s talent.

    46. You would think that at least Mike Breen would recognize Willy’s talent.

      There is a person here who doesn’t even think he’s better than Cole Aldrich.

    47. i’m not really sure what stat to look at – but, it sure seems like KP doesn’t pass the ball very much…

      I see his assists at 1.3 per game, and it looks like we are a plus 4.7 in assists while he’s on the court – but, from what i can tell, unless he’s standing at the top of the key swinging the ball, if the ball comes to him – he’s shooting, whether he’s in a good position to score or not……

      looking at the “passes” portion of nba.stats…it looks like almost all his passes are back to the point guard or melo…hardly any to his fellow big men…

    48. I see his assists at 1.3 per game, and it looks like we are a plus 4.7 in assists while he’s on the court – but, from what i can tell, unless he’s standing at the top of the key swinging the ball, if the ball comes to him – he’s shooting, whether he’s in a good position to score or not……

      This is one of those things that I’m willing to chalk up as a product of our god awful roster construction. Between Rose and Melo, the pickings are truly slim for everyone else. Porzingis wants to shoot a certain number of times per game so he feels like he needs to take advantage of the relatively few times he gets the ball. It will definitely be more concerning if it continues if/when we take out the trash.

    49. I’m surprised Sabonis is so bad. He was a productive player in college– he averaged 17 and 12 for the Zags as a sophomore and had a .662 TS% over two seasons. Got to the free throw line a lot in college. I thought he had a pretty good statistical profile coming out of college. But man has he been brutal in the NBA.

    50. KP has to learn to position himself closer to the basket and get easier, higher percentage shots. This would greatly improve his game.

    51. OT:Wow, the Browns taking on contracts and gaining picks like NBA teams. I think I found my new favorite GM candidate for when Phil leaves.

    52. OT:Wow, the Browns taking on contracts and gaining picks like NBA teams. I think I found my new favorite GM candidate for when Phil leaves.

      Paul DePodesta is a genius. He helped to retool the Mets organization with no money. I am a major fan.

    53. Love that football trade between the Texans and Browns — definitely Hinkie-style. Texans dump Osweiler and his $16MM contract + a 2nd round pick onto the Browns for nothing. Meanwhile the Browns now have 7 picks in each of the first 4 rounds in the 2017 and 2018 drafts. And still have the lowest payroll and the most cap space.

      Maybe DePodesta should run the Knicks.

    54. I haven’t followed the Knicks at all this season, and have only followed the league peripherally. Cool that Hernangomez has been productive.

      Regarding KP, looks like of the 4 breakout rookie bigs last year (Towns, Jokic, Turner, and Porzingis), he’s the only one that hasn’t made a big statistical step in his follow up season.

      It seems easy to blame a new coach/cast, but Towns and Turner are also playing for new coaches in retooling systems.

      Are KBers feeling less bullish on KP these days than they were at this time last season? (Forgive me if this has been discussed a lot here– I haven’t been around:)

    55. De’Aron Fox has such great speed and length and is so team oriented that if he showed even a little bit of shooting prowess I would probably select him with a pick between 6 and 11.

    56. Is there any sensible way we could still pull off a deal for Rubio in the off season even though we won’t have Rose as a trade asset?

    57. @59 I read something about doing a sign and trade with Rose and sending him to the Wolves for Rubio. I’m not sure exactly how this is accomplished since they can just sign him themselves.

    58. Is there any sensible way we could still pull off a deal for Rubio in the off season even though we won’t have Rose as a trade asset?

      If you are willing to send a 1st to Minny for Rubio we can get him.

      So the answer is no.

    59. Re: KP – I’m amazed by how little of a plan he seems to have when off the ball. Occasionally he makes a really nice basket cut, but a lot of times he’s just wandering around no man’s land. When he sets a pick, he seems to rarely cut hard, mostly meanders around the paint. it looks like he’s rolling into a post-up, but he doesn’t really establish position.

      And then when he’s along the baseline, he literally hangs out 2-3 feet inside the 3 point line. I can’t imagine that’s where he’s supposed to be?

    60. We will be under the cap without Rose’s salary. So we could trade them anyone, for example Ndour, for Rubio. They obviously won’t accept that, but we could, say, offer KOQ, which might be a fair deal.

    61. I think that Teodosic might be a better player than Rubio and would probably cost about $7 mil per year.
      Sign Teodosic, draft the BPA such as Fox, Bridges, Isaac, Tatum, Ntilikina or whoever Phil fancies, sign PJ Tucker and we’ll still have money left over and be on our way to greatness.

    62. OT:Wow, the Browns taking on contracts and gaining picks like NBA teams. I think I found my new favorite GM candidate for when Phil leaves.

      Great trade for the Browns. Picks and they can let Osweiler go at the end of the season when he sucks. $16mil and picks for a guy you can let ride the pine and come off the books at the end of the season isn’t bad at all. Kind of like what we should have done with Rose.

      Are KBers feeling less bullish on KP these days than they were at this time last season? (Forgive me if this has been discussed a lot here– I haven’t been around:)

      Mate you have missed out on some very polarising discussion on this topic ha ha. The only real consensus is that KP has plateaued this year, which is concerning but the sky isn’t falling yet.

      Finally ESPN had a great article about Kenny Atkinson and Sean Marks. http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/18848217/all-backfires-how-brooklyn-nets-rebuilding-nothing

      Give it a read if you have a spare 10 minutes. It looks like they are really getting their shit together. Makes you wonder what is going on in our inner sanctum.

    63. @57 KP is not a good player right now. Blindly supporting him just because we want him to be a good, productive player is only setting ourselves up for disappointment. I’m hoping he turns it around, but at the moment, there is no statistical evidence that he improved his game from last year.

    64. 3) Embiid is not worthy of ROY mostly because he played 786 minutes this season. Also his turnovers and fouls are horrendous, but I doubt people like Z-man care too much about turnovers. “Fake stats.”

      Oh silly boy, you totally garbled my point, which is that based on production, it’s Brogdan or Willy, but based on justifiable hype and impact on discourse (and supported by a reasonable WS48. second only to Willy for players that played at least as many minutes) , it’s pretty clearly Embiid.

      In other words, ROY is similar to MVP in that it isn’t about the best player, but about impact on the league in that particular year. Otherwise, LeBron should have 10+ MVPs by now.

      In Embiid’s last 20 games, the team went 11-9, got onto the EC playoff hunt, and the talk became about how Hinkie’s plan was finally bearing fruit, and how if his foot held up, Embiid was playing like a future franchise player…or even a current one. This was almost entirely due to Embiid. He changed the whole conversation about the Sixers future.

      And it’s really silly of you to cite fouls and turnovers in criticizing him, since rookie big men who protect the rim are expected to struggle in those two areas.

      But I think that ROY should go to a guy who played the most like a rising star in the league and who most affected the discourse around the league. For me, it’s clearly Embiid.

    65. Tankathon now has us selecting Monk with the 8th pick over both Fox and Bridges. They show Ntilikina going 7th to the Kings.

    66. KP is not playing well right now, no doubt about it. And I might be his biggest fan here. I’d be lying if I said that I wasn’t a little bit worried.

      He just seems to be lacking some things in the fast-twitch dept. He has trouble beating people to his spots, trouble grabbing the ball in traffic, trouble finishing, trouble not getting stripped, trouble avoiding reach fouls.

      He seems to over-dribble and funnel himself into tough shots rather than taking what the defense gives him.

      He seems like he’s trying to perfect 10 go-to moves at a time, like a jack of all trades, master of none. He should work on mastering ONE go-to move a la sky hook, dirk step-back, dream shake, and then build off of that.

      Towns, Jokic and Turner all seem much more comfortable in their bodies and seem to have better motors than KP, who looks totally gassed half the time.

      Anyway, that’s the best I can do for an objective take. I still believe in him, but he has a long way to go.

    67. And it’s really silly of you to cite fouls and turnovers in criticizing him, since rookie big men who protect the rim are expected to struggle in those two areas.

      You call it “struggle,” while I call it “the worst turnover rate for a big man of any age since the league started tracking turnovers.”

      But hey! They’re expected to struggle.

    68. KP has definitely improved. Overall he is a better defender even though our atrocious perimeter defense makes him look bad by forcing him out of position, plus he has improved his shooting near the basket from 58% to 70%. He is forced to create his own shot too often and forces up long jumpers which is a bad habit that hopefully will improve with a better offensive scheme.

      As for looking less comfortable in his body he is less comfortable. Physically he is still very much a work in progress and it is why he was labeled as a long term project. I think he is not injured but is breaking down a bit. He is so physically outmatched all the time it wears him down. Once he get’s stronger he will be able to maintain position in the post and will be better in that 3-10 foot range.

      He shows a lot of great flashes but judgement needs to be reserved until year 4. As for being a bad player he is not. Right now he is overall a pretty average NBA starter but by no means a net negative.

    69. Ntilikina and Isaac are two guys that I believe will rise in the draft the closer we come to the actual draft, so yes, finishing in the top six would be a very big deal.

    70. Paul DePodesta is a genius. He helped to retool the Mets organization with no money. I am a major fan.

      He got so much unfair BS when he was the Dodgers GM. So much of it was snide, anti-intellectual shit. So it’s good to see him getting his fair due years later.

    71. You call it “struggle,” while I call it “the worst turnover rate for a big man of any age since the league started tracking turnovers.”

      So how do you explain that his turnover% is so much lower than his turnovers/36? See the following:

      http://bkref.com/tiny/xdEA3

      OH WAIT, HE PLAYED TO A USAGE OF 36.1% (HIGHEST FOR A ROOKIE!!! EVER!!! HIGHER THAN JAMES HARDEN AND ALMOST AS HIGH AS BOOGIE!!! ) AND HAD A TS% OF .584!!!!! NO ONE HAS EVER SHOT AT THAT TS% AT THAT USAGE% EVER!

      HE AVERAGED 11 REBOUNDS, 3 ASSISTS AND 3 BLOCKS PER 36!!!!! NO OTHER ROOKIE HAS DONE THAT!!! EVER!!!

      Oh sorry, my all caps key was stuck.

    72. I just watched this video of Ntilikina playing in the National Basketball Champions playoffs from about 2 weeks ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no8VUpK3H78

      He is very impressive. If you watch it, just watch from the 10 minute mark to the end of the first half. He barely took a shot in the 2nd half for some reason. He’s long, will be strong, has a really nice 3 ball shot (with an excellent pump fake to set it up), drives with either hand, reads the court and never holds the ball, totally ambidextrous with his dribble, an avid and willing rebounder (even on the offensive glass), runs out hard to close out the three ball on defense and plays defense with his feet, raising his arms and doesn’t jump or reach (hint to KP). This guy, while lacking the speed of Fox, can become a total force on offense, defense and rebounding. He could be a triple double machine in just a year or two. I’m sold.

    73. It’s pretty amazing that in his 700 rookie minutes, Joel Embiid became one of the greatest high-usage scorers ever. If you lower the usage bar to 33%, the following names appear above Embiid on the TS% list: Durant, Isaiah Thomas (this year), Harden (this year), Jordan (2X) LeBron, Yao, and Bernard King.

      All that while being to only 11reb-3asst-3blocks per 36 rookie ever.

      And you want to give the ROY to Brogdan who????? A guy that might not ever be the 5th best guy on a good team?????

      And you want to give the award to

    74. BTW, I totally understand the lack of qualifying minutes argument. The fewest minutes played by a ROY ever is 1558 (Kyrie) and Embiid doesn’t even have half of that. But the drop-off to the next candidate is pretty stark. If there should be an exception in any year, this is it.

    75. His OBPM is 0.1 for a reason, Z-man. He balances his historic usage/efficiency with his historic turnover rate.

      This year, Harden and Westbrook will set records for TOV/possession.

      Here’s the list of the top 20 seasons in TOV/100p.

      Harden (PG)
      Westbrook (PG)
      Robert Pack (PG)
      Embiid (NOT A PG)
      Darrell Walker (PG/SG)
      Ray Williams (PG)
      Jeremy Lin (PG)
      Gary Grant (PG)
      Westbrook
      Cousins (NOT A PG)
      Pack
      Westbrook
      Wroten (lol)
      B.J. Tyler (PG)
      Darryl Dawkins (NOT A PG)
      Grant
      Spud Webb (PG)
      Rich Kelley (PG)
      Westbrook
      Smush Parker (PG)

      Why are you in denial about how bad turnovers are, especially at a position that doesn’t often turn the ball over?

    76. Knicks, 2016-17 turnovers:

      Rose 136
      Carmelo 133
      [Embiid 117]
      Jennings 107
      Porzingis 95
      Willy 73
      KOQ 62
      Holiday 51
      Lee 47

      All of those players have played significantly more minutes than Embiid. I mean shit, Carmelo has taken almost 3 times as many shots as Embiid, and has just 16 more turnovers. How do you ignore this shit? How?!

    77. @80 Very impressed with what I saw. Has great vision, doesn’t force passes but also doesn’t drive much to the rim. Could definitely see him being a good triangle PG similar to George Hill. His jumper looks really good as well.

      When they switched him onto bigger guys he offered pretty much no resistance because of his weight so that’s something that should improve with more strength. Needs to be a little more aggressive chasing guys through screens but the defensive I.Q was definitely there.

      Probably needs to play with another playmaker if we draft him.

    78. Turnovers have been a huge problem for Embiid but even with them he is dominant. He probably shouldn’t be rookie of the year because of minutes played but his dominance on the court is not really disputable. The 76ers are 4 points better on offense and 10 points better on defense when he is on the court. They outscore their opponent by 4 points when he is playing and get outscored by 10 when he’s not.

      I know +/- is a noisy stat but when the difference is that substantial it is noteworthy.

    79. @72 Ben R

      As for being a bad player he is not. Right now he is overall a pretty average NBA starter but by no means a net negative.

      With all due respect, if you remove his brilliant start to the year he has been a NEGATIVE player for a few months on just about every model out there. On some he is barely positive or slightly negative even if you include the great start.

      We are all Knicks fans.

      When people feel passionately about something they become emotionally invested in it. Their brains then tend to filter out or rationalize anything that conflicts with what they want to believe. It’s called cognitive dissonance. We all want to believe that KP is going to be a real star. He could very well become one. But if you objectively look at his play, both statistically and visually, right now he is playing worse than he did last year, let alone at the start of this year. He’s a negative player. That’s the reality. We don’t know the future, but I’d feel way better about it if he had spiked forward like Jokic, Towns, and Turner.

      Spot on Z Man @70)

    80. Turnovers have been a huge problem for Embiid but even with them he is dominant.

      Its actually why he hasn’t been dominant. That and his inability to stay healthy. He’s a tremendously promising player, and in a lackluatsr year for rookies it wont be outrageous if they give him ROY, but the TOs were a big problem

    81. I just found out the Hernangomez brothers have a 16 year old sister that plays basketball. She’s 6′ 3″. Let’s draft her in the 2nd round.

    82. Z man and Stratomatic. Agree totally about KP. He is obviously not fast-twitch. Comparing him to Towns, Jokic, Giannis, Embid is inaccurate. It is why his most obvious comparison is another giant who was not fast-twitch, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. That is whose game he should model. Right again Z, he should develop a go-to, unstoppable move. Sky hook redux. I think KP has the touch around the basket to make it work. And, again, a big man coach to work on his footwork and positioning.

    83. Frank: fascinating discussion on another thread about your recommendation to change the lottery model by instituting a “switch” day. 2 records kept. I heard Mike Greenberg on Mike&Mike recommend a “playoff” of the lottery teams during the week off after the regular season. The winner of the lottery tournament would get the #1 pick. Great idea also. I feel that the NBA is about to change the lottery rules. Adam Silver is too smart to let the talk of ‘tanking” dominate the discussion of quite a few fanbases for far too long. And he moves quickly, so I expect change. On another topic, someone (I forgot who, apologies, cuz it was a great idea) recommended taking distant future picks from the Clips in exchange for Melo. I love the though process but have second thoughts: (a) too much deferred gratification; and (b) if Silver does change the lottery rules, the value of those picks may change considerably.

    84. I’m all for the KP skyhook. I actually sent him a message through twitter a few months ago and included video of Jabbar destroying opponents with his hook shot. Maybe KP never got it?

    85. @87 You have to include his hot start. It’s part of his season. I think you can make an argument that he has not been a net positive on offense but I really don’t think you can on defense. Even at his most worn down he has been a positive defensively. His hot start this year wasn’t simply a hot streak shooting the ball. He started his rookie season well and faded just like this year. Until he gets stronger he will continue to get worn down. Maybe he never gets strong enough to be durable, that is a possibility and I think his biggest obstacle to stardom but if he does then the sky is the limit.

      @88 – This is the problem at just looking at individual stats. Embiid’s turnovers are a huge problem but I don’t think it’s debatable that Philly is a different team with him on the floor and the difference is staggering. That is the definition of dominance.

    86. @19 and @20: Bruno & Philmelo. you’re both so right. And it’s why I love Jeff Van Gundy. Never afraid to speak his mind: at the top of the broadcast- “Porzingis is nowhere near matching Giannis’ intensity level” and then later asks Breen: “Mike-is the problem that KP is disheartened from the sideshow the Knicks have become?”. Breen of course punts, but JVG comes back with “I don’t know the answer to the question Mike, I’m asking you!” I wish he had never resigned as Knicks coach, and I think the owners are making him pay for it.

    87. @88 – This is the problem at just looking at individual stats. Embiid’s turnovers are a huge problem but I don’t think it’s debatable that Philly is a different team with him on the floor and the difference is staggering. That is the definition of dominance.

      Just like it’s stupid to refuse to give the MVP to the league’s best player with the worst teammates, it’s also stupid to give a player an award because his backup is terrible.

    88. @91 – thanks, glad someone read it!!

      I really think it’s a good system. You have to not only take away the incentive to tank, but also GIVE incentive to win. It’ll never happen but it’s food for thought at least.

    89. In terms of turnover%, Embiid is not far removed from Ewing, Shaq and Mourning, and had a higher TS% at a MUCH higher usage%. He combo shot-blocked/passed/rebounded better than any of them. He was just getting in his groove when he hurt his knee and was shut down.

      He turned the basketball over too much, that is indisputable. But he dominated in nearly every other facet of the game to an historic degree for a rookie center. Considering that he hadn’t played competitive basketball at any level for nearly 2 years, I’d cut him some slack as a rookie.

      IMHO, the only legit reason not to give him the ROY is because of the lack of minutes/games.

      The Sixers were 13-18 with him in the lineup and above .500 in his last 20 games. They are 10-22 without him. Did any rookie theoretically make as much of a difference to his team?

    90. @96 wasn’t his backup for much of that time Nerlens Noel? (no snark intended, actually curious…)

    91. wasn’t his backup for much of that time Nerlens Noel? (no snark intended, actually curious…)

      Jahlil Okafor

      Noels only played 2 games in the first 29 games of the season.

    92. He turned the basketball over too much, that is indisputable.

      This is an understatement, and that’s indisputable.

    93. Now that we seen the NFL make a NBA type trade will we ever see two NBA teams do a Ricky Willimas type deal? Would the team drafting 1st or 2nd this year make a trade with the Kings if they were willing to give up the 4th and 7th, 34th pick, WCS, and a 2020(top 6 protected) 1st?

      If by some Miracle the Knicks got the 1st or second pick would you be okay with Phil passing up Fultz or Ball for that haul(above)? The Knicks could potentially come away with Isaac, Ntilikina, and Hart plus WCS.

    94. The final minute of regulation of Sixers-Blazers was one of the biggest shit shows I’ve ever seen.

    95. @106

      If anything that’s a bigger incentive for teams on the bubble to tank and further increases the parity problem in the NBA considering there’s pretty much no way for the worst teams to get better since FAs won’t come (especially under the new CBA) and their owners/GMs are likely not very good.

      I like the wheel model i.e. Picks are assigned basically 30 years in advance regardless of record–completely eliminating the need to tank. The only perverse incentive left for losing is to keep your cap space open by only hitting the salary floor to make a play for FAs in the offseason. What sucks about this model is that not all drafts are created equal, but that’s a problem with any system.

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