Knicks Morning News (2017.12.31)

Have been so busy lately that I’ve missed almost all the games recently, but I did happen to catch the last 5 minutes or so of last night. Great to see KP come up big in the clutch, and hey, if our guy can play Anthony Davis to a standstill, I’m pretty sure everyone here would sign up for that. Seriously – other than the 5 fouls, great line for KP – 30 points on ~26 shooting possessions, ZERO turnovers, 7 rebounds, 3 assists, 2 steals, 2 blocks, and a +7 –> that’ll do. If his 3-ball starts falling again…

Gotta watch the last play again to see WTF happened to give AD a wide open 3 to win the game. That is a major defensive mistake when the ONLY thing you can’t give up is an open 3. Oh well, at least it missed.

Great to see Noah exhumed and playing well. His screening and passing is still useful on the offensive end, and he’s about 100x better than Kanter on the defensive end. I’d like to see a little more time given to Noah, and really think we should try and move KOQ if at all possible before the trade deadline. It’s just not smart to tie up 4 roster spots with centers, especially when KOQ is expiring. He’s played great this year though.

I was shocked that with KP, OQuinn, and Kanter limited, Noah got all the minutes and none to Willy. WTF? He was starting just last yr!

Noah looked great. I hope he plays more. I’d love to see us deal Kanter and free up Willy.

Man, NO is just terribly constructed and coached. If I were them, I’d fire Gentry and look to deal Cousins or AD. That combo is just not suited for today’s NBA.

Enes Kanter and Joakim Noah are the best centers on the team.

Both are overpaid and Noah is untradeable, which is why I’d look to deal Kanter.

I’d also look to deal O’Quinn. Rolling with a KP/Noah/Willy trio at C would be fine by me. It’s a bit risky b/c KP and Noah are injury prone.

Last night’s win knocked a tread off the stealth-tank. If we beat SA at home, there’s probably no turning back, once Timmy is reactivated we are not going to be bad enough to win less than 32 games. At that point, might as well make a playoff run and hope we get lucky in the draft.

Man, NO is just terribly constructed and coached. If I were them, I’d fire Gentry and look to deal Cousins or AD. That combo is just not suited for today’s NBA.

When they made that move last year, I bet against NO in quite a few games and did fine. $$$

@8 Cousins is a 2-way player who theoretically should have way more trade value than Kanter. He’s a head case, but on the right team with the right coach he could be the best 2-way big in the league.

@12 I hope you’re wrong b/c I like Willy as a home grown product and would love to see whether he can develop. That said, it seems like 1-way bigs are pretty readily available (we have 3 of them!), so we probably wouldn’t miss him much. I just think that there are much better ways to spend $18+ million of cap space than on Kanter, especially now that Noah is showing signs of life.

Seriously, do we win that game if Kanter played instead of Noah? Noah’s playing chess out there while Kanter’s playing checkers.

Seriously, do we win that game if Kanter played instead of Noah? Noah’s playing chess out there while Kanter’s playing checkers.

Kanter is playing tic tack toe and losing to the chicken in Chinatown. Unless KP is on the court covering for him he’s a clear net negative because of his defense.

The problem is that we’ve needed more scoring on the court given that Jack is not much of a scorer and Lee is just OK. With Hardaway out it’s more of a problem. So we’ve needed Kanter to get OREBs and score in the paint.

If we had a legitimate two way scoring SF and Hardaway at SG, we could probably get away with starting Noah and Frank and have a pretty good team that would only get better as Frank improves his shooting and ability to create.

Cousins is a 2 way player? I thought he struggled mightily on D. I can think of a better 2 way big on the Pelicans.

I can imagine Frank leading the league in both steals and assists many times in the future.

I can imagine in a future in which 100,000 deluded NBA fans talk for decades about how Cousins could have been the best 2-way big man in the league if he had just played better on offense and defense like he totally could have but also refused to

I can imagine in a future in which 100,000 deluded NBA fans talk for decades about how Cousins could have been the best 2-way big man in the league if he had just played better on offense and defense like he totally could have but also refused to

It is amazing how player evaluation works. A 19-year-old Ntilikina gets written off one moment three months into his NBA career but there are still people holding hope that 27-year-old DeMarcus Cousins will figure out how to maximize his talent as the two-way centerpiece of a winning team after just ten years into the league.

Wow, Z-Man, doubling down huh? In science, guys that do that are usually wrong and thinking emotionally.

I don’t see how not playing a guy is a sign of a trade; rather, overplaying a guy to boost his per game stats is usually how it’s done (?oquinn?)

Frank is slowly improving his TOs and PFs like I said he would, but at an even faster rate than I expected. So the one thing missing at this point is making open 3s, scoring more efficiently, and creating for himself and others a little better. I don’t see anything broken in his shot. I don’t think he’s going to be like Rondo or Rose as a shooter. I think this is simply a rookie fighting through nerves, the speed of the game, getting used to better defenders etc. He’s going to get more efficient as a scorer and create better. The only question is how far he’ll take it. But if we have a player that’s an elite defender at PG and average as a play maker and scorer in a year or two, that’s already a really good player. If he gets beyond that in 3-5 years, we are all going to be very happy.

Do the rules allow the refs to call a personal foul on a the defensive player and a flagrant or technical foul on the offensive player on the same play? Baker fouled AD first on that dunk but AD clearly purposely swung an elbow at his head.

Man, NO is just terribly constructed and coached. If I were them, I’d fire Gentry and look to deal Cousins or AD. That combo is just not suited for today’s NBA.

The combo, the coach, everything about that team makes no sense.

Ntilikina’s ts% is definitely worrying, but Rondo for example is a guy who made a successful career with a .500 ts%, because he was a great passer and defender (when engaged).

I dont think Ntilikina will be as good as Rondo was creating shots in his prime because Rondo has a great handle, but he has all the tools that Rondo never had in terms of shooting skill. He has good form and should be able to hit threes consistently as he progresses, and for all we know he’s a model kid, a hard worker and overall good influence.

I’m still excited about him and I would like to see him starting, but he’s got to get a better handle and hit shots more consistently. If he ever does, he’ll be a very good player with a long prime.

KP needs Hardaway

https://elitesportsny.com/2017/12/31/new-york-knicks-kristaps-porzingis-needs-tim-hardaway-succeed/

The big issue with Frank is that any ball pressure just stops him dead in his tracks. Once teams actually start game planning for him- as they probably will once he inevitably moves into the starting lineup- he’s going to struggle until his handle improves. He’s drawn 7 shooting fouls in 700 minutes of play so he’s got to figure out a way to leverage his size into getting downhill if he wants to have long term success as a point.

@39 – this is what pretty much happened in the Chicago game — between Kris Dunn and Justin Holiday, the Bulls have pretty good on-ball defenders in the backcourt, and they just hounded Ntilikina and Lee in that 4th quarter and our guys couldn’t make them pay for over-pressuring. This offense really needs Hardaway back – someone who if he gets a step, will take it all the way to the rack.

ultimately – the backcourt combo of Ntilikina and Hardaway makes reasonable sense — they’re pretty complementary. Courtney Lee has played great this year, and he’s displayed way more off the bounce than I thought he had in his arsenal, but he just isn’t that attacking guard that we need right now.

Meanwhile how about this Trae Young character? he is freaking unreal.

Yeah I don’t get using Frank’s age as an excuse when he is barely younger than the other PG’s drafted in the Top 10. Plus shouldn’t the fact that he has been a professional for a few years give him an edge over the 1 and done college kids? Also Ball and Smith Jr have higher AST% and lower TO% than Frank.

I get the defensive factor though and it’s a huge one cause Smith and especially Ball are horrible on ball defenders and Frank truly is great at it already, I absolutely love watching him play D. Reminds me of the days when Harper, Starks and Anthony would give opposing guards headaches all game long with their defensive pressure. It’s awesome to finally see a Knicks PG play great D, we haven’t had that since the Ward/Childs days and even they had their issues at times vs bigger PG’s.

But you can’t minimize just how bad Frank has been on offense, it’s truly been awful.

As well as Frank’s skill deficiencies, confidence is partly innate. Aggressive offensive players have very short memories and aren’t afraid to miss a shot.
Frank is so young and inexperienced that it’s extremely difficult to tell what he’s going to become in a few years. And suppose he makes a giant leap, is the conversation going to be “he’s not worth max money”.
That’s why I like the idea of drafting players that are a little older with more experience. Hopefully, you get a more NBA-ready player, and more bang for your buck on day one.

I love Frank’s attitude, his work ethic, and his team-first attitude. He can play for my team any time, I just think we need to keep it real as to how he has done as a PG thus far.

People give Frank a pass cause he’s the least developed physically as well as his age.

@49 Frank is 9, 8, and 7 months younger than Ball, Smith and Fox. Is it really that big a difference that it’s OK to use his age as an excuse but not for the other 3? Frank played for a professional team in Europe for the past 3 years, shouldn’t that make him more polished and further along in his development than college 1 and done kids?

Frank is still incredibly raw physically compared to a guy like DSJr and Lonzo to a lesser extent. Fox is also very skinny at 170 so him and Frank have a lot of filling out to do.

Happy New Year everyone. Let’s give our neophyte a full year before worrying too much about him.

I just came here to wish all Knickerbloggers a very Happy New Year!

Young men develop at very different times and rates and nine months can be a huge difference physically at age 19. Some high school seniors have full beards and the bodies of grown men while others look like they are young kids. Frank looks like he hasn’t started shaving yet.

All the first year point guards deserve some slack as they learn and adjust to the NBA game. Frank seems to be improving over time. That’s good, and let’s hope that continues.

I never got into the argument here over whether Frank playing in French pro leagues is more or less tough than the NCAA. I really have no idea.

I do wonder, how many minutes did he play last year vs. the minutes guys like Ball and Smith played last year? Anyone know?

Also, how much PG did he play? I’ve heard not much.

I love Frank’s attitude, his work ethic, and his team-first attitude. He can play for my team any time, I just think we need to keep it real as to how he has done as a PG thus far.

I agree with this but I’d put it in a different order. You can’t argue he’s an all star or a lock to be one. He just hasn’t shot well enough or penetrated and created enough and he’s had some bad turnovers. But I do think there’s reason to be sanguine on his prospects. The team plays really well when he’s in there. His technique looks pure. His shooting form is good, he can make a range of passes, and other teams offenses operate much less well when he plays. We’ve seen that coach already trusts him in crunch time. I think coach is also seriously constraining the things he’s allowed to do, and the fact that he’s listening is why he’s getting minutes. A lot of times the play is for him to throw it to the big man at the three point line and then be a pressure release valve.

In some ways this reminds me of Michael Ray Richardson’s first year. He looked all kinds of bad and no one thought anything of him. His second year the coach set him free and he blossomed. Another player that comes to mind is Darrel Walker. He always looked gangly and horrible and only became a good defensive player. Hopefully, Frank is more Michael Ray (minus the extra curricular activities.) I do think he seems to be ahead of both of these players progressions in some ways.

What do you think of these comps Z-Man?

danvt,
I think Michael Ray was a naturally more gifted offensive player, but with a much lower b-ball IQ. I liked Darrell Walker as a hustle guy off the bench but see him as a worse than a worst-case for Frank.

Frank is a tweener right now. If he develops his PG skills to the point where he can be a legit starter on a contender, he’ll be more of a defensive combo guard; a good ceiling comparison is someone like Nate McMillan, or if he shoots better, maybe Terry Porter.

Frank is 9 months younger than Ball, 8 months younger than DSjr and 7 months yonger than Fox, does that really matter?

It matters a lot. Already Frank has dramatically improved his turnover/assist numbers in just 3 months of NBA play. By another 3 months, I anticipate he’ll be a far better player than he was when he started the season.