2016-17 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Bucks

The Knicks host the Milwaukee Bucks tonight in a game that they desperately need to win.

However, they will be playing without Kristaps Porzingis for the third game in a row and the Bucks have a guy who the Knicks match up poorly with defensively in Giannis Antetokounmpo. To be fair, most of the NBA matches up poorly with Giannis Antetokounmpo. Who can really guard Giannis Antetokounmpo? Kawhi Leonard, maybe?

The Knicks should still have a chance even if Giannis dominates, sort of like the Rockets game where they stayed in the game despite James Harden having one of the greatest individual games ever.

They really need to concentrate more on moving the ball on offense and, well, concentrating on defense period.

Let’s go, Knicks!

266 replies on “2016-17 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Bucks”

Brogdon was such a nice find, he’ll be a solid player in the league for quite a while.

and a 3 from Rose!!

Got to do whatever we can to limit their break opportunities because Giannis is unstoppable in the open court

got a feeling both these games against milwaukee will be blowout losses. It’s a terrible matchup for us.

Anyone here want us to try to get Brogdon? Sounds vaguely familiar-if you did, come take a bow

to be honest I didn’t pay attention to Brogdon coming into the draft, but right now? he’d be the Knicks best guard on defense already lol

I think the Bucks have problems guarding the 3 point line, so it sucks Kristaps can’t go. Maybe Kuz can light it up

the Bucks outside Giannis are really inconsistent, so this is a winnable game.

I’m just hoping we can keep this game close. These Knicks need a confidence game. It looks like they came out with energy but they are playing like a team that lacks confidence.

if the knicks can draft Josh Hart they will have a 2-guard version of Brogdon

brogdon isn’t anything special… he plays good D but his value is propped up by really good 3pt shooting(.431).. don’t think that’s sustainable.. plus he’s already 24…

Kuz needs a chance. Horny doesn’t give him enough of one since Thomas has been healthy.

Good move by Hornacek to give Kuzminskis increased playing time. He, and the entire team, needs to learn how to play defense without fouling.

I think the Bucks have problems guarding the 3 point line, so it sucks Kristaps can’t go. Maybe Kuz can light it up

Why do people even bother disagreeing with me?

No Rose, no Melo and we take the lead.

Of course, its contingent on us hitting an ungodly high 3 point percentage, but whateva.

Giannis gets good passing lanes just by being so fucking tall. He doesn’t even have to have particularly good court awareness

If Antetokounmpo ever gains consistency off his shot its all over for the NBA. It will be Jordanesque type domination on offense.

Melo is so washed up.

He’ll be gone just as KP and whoever we draft are starting to peak. It’s just unfortunate that we are wasting time and cap space to keep him happy when we should have built around KP and encouraged him to ask for a trade.

@30

yeah, that’s a huge advantage AND he also has good awareness

I mean, it didn’t even seem like he did much, and he ended the 1st half with 11 points 8 rebounds 2 assists and a block.

Strong first half by the Knicks. It’s really crazy how games between the current #4-12 seeds are basically a crapshoot whenever they play each other. Team A wins one against Team B who loses against Team C who loses against Team D who beats Team A.

I also recall seeing an interview with Hornacek saying KOQ’s minutes are pretty well based on match up. That said, he could be working back to match shape after a few games off.

If Boston is interested in Heyward we could definitely trade them Melo.

Well, if not for, you know…

Hernangomez didn’t play many minutes tonight either, which supports that Hornacek wants different matchups than some other nights

Fucking Jokic. I so wanted him.

He’s an amazing passer for a big man. Denver is doing a pretty good job of rebuilding after they foolishly blew up what they had built under Karl and started playing a different style.

I know that was a goal tend but the Freak came out of nowhere on that block on Lance.

If they would have simply shown up like this every night, they would have won another couple of games during this 10 game stretch,

The Knicks have only 6 turnovers and have been getting back on transition… that stops a lot of Giannis’ game, he’s still not able to be a force in the half-court game.

Video was unwatchable on league pass, I went to more illicit sources

For as long and athletic as the Bucks are they seem like a pretty good matchup for the Knicks.

I was really impressed with that dunk by Kuz. He looked out of position, but he still managed to get a very controlled dunk

I mean, it just shows that if you play defense a bit better and pass the ball on offense, you become a much much better basketball team.

Man, Milwaukee may suck ass at half court basketball but they are super fun to watch when they are forcing turnovers and running in transition. I would love to be a fan of a team like this. They would be frustrating as hell to root for but super fun to cheer when everything is clicking.

League Pass really sucking right now. Even when the video does come in, the sound is out of sync.

how is Jason Terry not playing one on one with Jarrett jack in a driveway somewhere

Malcolm Brogdon is better than Derrick Rose

…………………..

Brogdon is literally walking to the paint and getting there freely

That Giannis dunk from the free throw line into that floater block was hngggggggggggggghgadesgtysderhgbaszderhbaszdfrhh

there’s a max-worthy player on the floor right now, I’ll let y’all figure out who it is

hint: it’s the guy who looks as comfortable boxing out Noah as he does going coast to coast and dunking from the FT line

man, I once had such high hopes for Jabari Parker, but he’s so incredibly average.

lance has been quite good this game. Has kept Giannis somewhat under control

That last and-1 by Giannis was about 6 seconds in the paint. I guess they never call that but he was literally just standing under the rim for 6 seconds while Monroe was dribbling around.

After seriously watching Giannis in action for near a whole game I can explain his freakishness this way: he combines all of the strengths of a guard and center together on offense. He can move with the ball with freakish speed and handle from coast to coast while showing an adeptness in tight enclosed spaces near the basket only seen by talented big men. He is truly the first player I’ve ever seen in this generation who can play positions 1-5 at an elite level.

It’s nice to know that when Carmelo is cooking, Derrick Rose is there to drag the team down to where it belongs

I don’t know if can keep this up, but Giannis is having arguably a better age 22 season than Lebron did, which is obviously pretty amazing

Must they always make things so Knicksy. LTs brick and now Roses’s kick. Though Lee did get a nice o board in between.

Yeah why is Melo inbounding there when he’s the guy who should be getting the ball to shoot the FT’s.

I almost posted, “Good to see another team choking away a win,” but glad I held it back.

I mean that’s the shot you want him to take, but gott demmmmmmmmmmm

Couldn’t have played better defense there … but where was that for the previous 6 minutes

Noah looked pretty good at times.
Melo looked like he was shamed into passing the ball more, which is nice.
Derrick Rose is butt.

Not much more LT could have done on that last play. Good shot. Just sick of other teams having big moments at the garden against us.

@118 I said the same exact thing to my son before they inbounded the ball. That’s coaching 101. You call time out there, get your best FT shooters on the floor and run a set play, then call another TO if you don’t have a clear inbounds play. That’s totally on the coach.

The way this game was playing out it ends up being a bad loss. No taking a step back for perspective. We were mauling , they made a run , we almost broke bit didn’t , we took another decent lead with 4 min to go , and then we just failed in so many ways.

I don’t blame Rose for that inbounds play. Even Clyde said you don’t give the ball to a guy there up against the sideline, you call time out.

15 points on 18 FGA, 0 free throw attempts, 4 assists, 5 turnovers. That is one horseshit stat line from Derrick Rose.

The SS Ntilikina is cruising at full speed

The Knicks were wining all of these kinds of games early on, then Pythagoras reminded them that they are the Knicks.

to be fair when a top-5 player strips a top-200 player on a crucial play, you shouldn’t be all that surprised

the Knicks defended Giannis really well almost the entire game and limited transition baskets, but a superstar finds a way…

he clearly identified that the Knicks couldn’t really contain him without fouling if he went hard to the basket every time.

and then calling his own number in the last shot for the exclamation mark

Z man come on… you mean to tell me NBA professionals can’t at least inbound the ball without going over it with coach. I can understand the Noah piece, yes, but I’m sure he had his reasons …

Watched a vine of that last play-the ground covered on the turnaround by Giannis is insane. Also Rose makes a hillarious cameo with about 2 seconds left when he wanders into the frame about 4 seconds after his man cuts through the paint and just sort of jogs around aimlessly

a better coach would have probably spaced the floor with 2 guys in the back court on that inbounds but oh well. Also, i never seen Melo miss so many open jump shots as this year.

Don’t think we have a chance against Milwaukee at home after getting our backs broken

I’m still selling tickets to the SS Ntilikina, y’all better buy one rather sooner than later

me and silky will drive us to the promised land

Turns out trading one of your best players for a fucking terrible player is not the new market inefficiency

I’m a jeffy homer right now. But honestly. All these guys had to do was play normal friggen basketball…. nothing special. Just play the game they’ve been playing their whole life. And they couldn’t. There’s still a gaping lack of leadership on the floor. Think about the other alphas out there. They would have taken that inbound opportunity with so much gusto and made it happen … cause it’s just basketball.

Turns out trading one of your best players for a fucking terrible player is not the new market inefficiency

Believe in the stealth tank my friend.

Nothing like “containing” Giannis to the tune of 13 rebounds, 4 assists, one steal, 3 blocks, 27 points on 10-18 shooting, and a game winner

top 5 NBA player. If he keeps this up he should be a tier 1 MVP candidate right next to Harden, Paul, and Durant

Well guess we will juat have to wait until KP gains his skinny-man strength like Giannis

I think Hornacek was fine even though he bungled the out of bounds play

Hornacek seems like he’s not going to wow you like Kidd or D’Antoni might but he’s a stabilizing, competent, well-adjusted presence on the bench. Which is what this mess of a team needs, I think.

That means he’ll be fired by the end of the year.

yeah, if the Bucks end up getting home court advantage in the playoffs he’ll be right up there deservedly.

they probably won’t, and voters will stupidly shy away from Giannis because of this.

no shame in this loss…. i think we played pretty well…. melo played about as good as you could hope and hopefully the 7 assists is closer to the melo we’ll see…

noah just isn’t a defensive presence anymore… i think a large part of the woes on that side of the ball is because of him honestly and it showed this game…

KP may most probably gain strength but he’ll never have Giannis’ level of coordination and athleticism. This is fine of course because KP is taller, a better shooter and should be a more polished post player. But Giannis is a whole other level of freakish.

I think the Bucks could definitely get a top 4 seed. They’re third in the conference in point differential, and they’re only one game out of 4th place.

A loss like this is a good wake up call, guys. It shows how flawed this team really is. We were up around 15 points in the second half and lost this game. That’s what we are.

Continue the tank.

Although he deserves to be in the conversation with Westbrook, Harden, Durant and LeBron, no way in hell Giannis win MVP this year, even if he maintain this freakish level. Depending on the seeding, it will go to Harden or Westbrook (Russell, most probably, after being left to death in OKC by Durant). But maybe he makes an appearance at the starting Eastern team on the All-Star Game.

Yeah, I don’t think he’ll win, but he certainly deserves to consideration given his productivity, though that’s obviously not what the MVP award is always about (see: Derrick Rose)

@189

I think they might, Khris Middleton is coming back after the all-star break and he should provide this team with much needed 3pt shooting… they might be the one team to break away from the pack and guarantee the 4th seed.

and well, if Giannis does not start the all-star game for the eastern conference we might as well stop having all-star games.

DRose should know better how to create space and receive in-bound ball – no timeout because Horny surely knows the team can in-bound (or not)

This PJ Tucker trade rumour, who will go?

Don’t worry about the pg play because next year the Knicks will get another old stop gap PG but at least this time it will be Milos Teodosic.

I would like to see reub justify how we’re still a great team.

He’ll be back after the knicks win these next 4/5 games and then leave when they lose big against Toronto.

I didn’t have a problem with the defense on the final possession at all. Lance did a very good job of denying Antetokounmpo good position and forcing him into a fadeaway shot.

Loss aside, is it safe to say we are finally getting the Noah we expected? Last 5 games, he’s averaged 9/13/2.2 apg/1.4 bpg/1 spg. I don’t think we should have lost to Milwaukee, even without KP. But..man! Anetetokounmpo is one helluva ball player. Once they figure out an actual position for him, we may be looking at the second coming of KG. There’s nothing on the court that kid can’t do, except maybe shoot consistently from the perimeter. I’d like to see him settle in at the 4 so he can get more rebounding and block chances. If they ever get some shooters around him and let him work from that high post area, the Bucks will be really good.

If I was the Bucks I would continue to get tall athletic players with tons of length that will force turnovers with steals and blocks. They need to be in transition all game long with a player like Giannis on the court.

@212 Funny you mention that, just read on Twitter that Melo mentioned the same thing to reporters after the game.

I’m sold on Frank Ntilikina and if the Knicks decide they wanna ruin my hopes and dreams by winning too many games or leaving him on the board when it comes time to pick.

This season was very fun while it lasted but I think this gut punch (of course Lance Thomas was involved) might break the team’s spirits. I’d be very happy to tank and trade Melo to the Clippers where BG goes to Boston and we get picks and expiring contracts. It’s becoming more and more clear that the Milwaukee Bucks will be the class of the Eastern Conference with all of Parker, Antetokounmpo, Middleton, and Brogdon heading towards their prime years. We need to get KP some sidekicks like the French Wrench and Luke Kennard. I think I would prefer Frank and Luke to a 50 win season.

Good to see Melo and Noah have good games though. Maybe KP is that important to what we wanna do, huh?

Watched a vine of that last play-the ground covered on the turnaround by Giannis is insane.

I thought that as soon as he went up: “That looks so awkward, how far he steps back.” Unguardable.

When he took that step back and shot it I felt relieved cause I thought no chance in hell that was going in.

that was kind of like a kick in the nuts…speaking of nuts – looks like the clemson d likes to go searching for em…I had no idea that was going on, I thought they were mostly just spitting and kicking each have other in those scrums…

had to go focus on something else for a while…

good to see a little better effort on playing decent basketball: 9 steals, 26 assists, 46 rebounds…

same as ever though – 31 fta’s by the bucks, they shot 47% fg…what’s with all the fouling we do…need to take a closer look to see who on the team is doing all this groping and grabbing…

kuz is a legit nba scorer…I know lance plays some decent d, but looks like kuz could/should replace him in the rotation…

That article on Ntilikina has him ranked as the 6th prospect in this draft. I really want us to keep tanking. More Rose!

Sorry, but if you’re not watching the Warriors game right now, you just missed the layup of the year by Steph. Un-fucking-believable.

Also thought about the 5 seconds rule. I think Baker and Holiday were shouting it to the refs, who obviously swallowed their whistles on that last possession.

I hate that Boston gets Brooklyn’s pick. What a fleecing that was.

the one that really pisses me off is the Sacramento one the Bulls own

Sacramento traded their first for JJ HICKSON to Cleveland, which then traded it for Luol freaking Deng

now the Bulls get maybe a top ten pick for completely free

why can’t stuff like this happen to the Knicks for once

Wow, had completely forgot about JJ Hickson. The 2009-2010 Cavaliers, riding a historic season by LeBron James, had, on the trade deadline, the chance of getting Amar’e Stoudemire (then a full-fledged All-Star), but refused because Phoenix wanted Hickson in exchange. Come on, Cleveland played safe there, and they probably should (Amar’e probably wouldn’t resign there, and he was bad at D), but 4 months later LeBron took his talents to South Beach. And Hickson: is he still in the league?

Last, but not least: it’s 2017 and I still can’t believe in that Nets trade. That was one of the most unbelievably dumbest moves in history, even worse than the Eddy Curry signing and up there with the James Harden trade. u.u

Hickson is in China I think, it was the lockout season and he was waived by the Kings right after the season ended

the pick traded had so many protections that it lasted like five years but it’s unprotected now

The 2009-2010 Cavaliers, riding a historic season by LeBron James, had, on the trade deadline, the chance of getting Amar’e Stoudemire (then a full-fledged All-Star), but refused because Phoenix wanted Hickson in exchange. Come on, Cleveland played safe there, and they probably should (Amar’e probably wouldn’t resign there, and he was bad at D), but 4 months later LeBron took his talents to South Beach. And Hickson: is he still in the league?

This whole kerfuffle probably led to Donnie Walsh offering Amar’e Stoudemire a max contract, thinking that LeBron had to have been disappointed by Cleveland passing on Amar’e during the previous season, and that LeBron wouldn’t pass up a second chance to team up with Amar’e.

Whoops.

at least we had those months with young players looking promising and Amare getting mvp chants…

#231

It was a fun time to be a Knicks fan, rivaled in the past 6 years by only the Linsanity era.

BTW, I don’t think its a stretch to say that the most memorable stretch during Melo’s Knick tenure will be the Linsanity era. I don’t think many are going to look back at the 2013 team making it to the second round of the playoffs with as much fondness as many still and will look upon than small period of time.

just checked out Suns payroll, PJ Tucker + Knight can be traded for DRose (and change)

thoughts?

That loss really killed me. Not just because of how they lost, which was awful, of course, but the fact that they’re clearly just good enough (with a healthy KP) that they likely won’t be actually tanking. They’ll win just enough to have a shitty draft position. That’s where this team is heading. Which is the worst place to be in the NBA. And if they make the playoffs, even as an #8 seed, what are the odds that they extend Rose? It has to be very high, right? Ugh, this team.

By the way, I think Thomas in general is not a very good defender (he’s not a bad defender, but not a particularly good one, either – he’s just sort of there. Doesn’t hurt you but doesn’t really help you, either), so I should give him a lot of credit for his work tonight. He was very good on defense tonight. More like this, please, Thomas! Kuz, meanwhile, is not an NBA defender, which sucks, because he is so fun to watch on offense.

As for the final play. Yes, Thomas was great. However, I disagree that they played it as well as they could. With the clock running down, they could have doubled Giannis where he was (and they should have done that), which would have either caused a pass with very little time left on the clock or an even worse shot.

Lmao we lost this one wowwwww but i agree with richmond pleaseee !!! Bring back the game grading. I still go back and read the infamous drunk game grade thread.

Ps. I’m sorry Knickerbloggers I recently moved to Arizona so of course I attended the game and of course we lost and of course that was the beginning of this these terrible losses we’ve been experiencing. Another thing I’ll like to add is that I’ve been the BIGGEST Melo fan since he was in high school so when he was traded to the Knicks I was the happiest man in the world but damnnnn Melo WTF !!! We all know what you can do when you play smart so just fucking do it !!!! I’m tired of making excuses for you, I can’t even argue for you anymore. Tonight though wasn’t on you thankfully but next game might be unless you finally change your ways that I have been defending for too long now. Tonight was a good sign though besides the missed jumpers.

Go Knicks
Go Melo
Andddd
Go Reub
Go THCJ
I completely understand the both of you at all times lol the life of a Knicks fan.

That loss really killed me. Not just because of how they lost, which was awful, of course, but the fact that they’re clearly just good enough (with a healthy KP) that they likely won’t be actually tanking. They’ll win just enough to have a shitty draft position. That’s where this team is heading. Which is the worst place to be in the NBA.

The Knicks are 16-19 now, which is a 37-win pace. Everything about them screams 35 to 39 win team– their Pythag record, their actual W/L record, their Four Factors rankings, their SRS, their point differential, their offensive and defensive ratings…

And yeah, it’s a bad place to be. It’s pretty frustrating watching this play out in real time. It seemed like the Knicks were taking baby steps in the right direction with last year’s team, because that team at least had some roster flexibility, but the moves Phil made this offseason doomed us to mediocrity for years to come. I feel like he’s almost like a lame duck GM already. The core he has assembled isn’t going to contend, not even close, and he’s in year 3 of a 5-year contract and he’s old and this can’t be much fun for him.

I don’t really trust him to make further moves. I kind of hope he just lets the rest of this season putter on, then steps aside as GM with some sort of “spend time with my family” excuse or something.

The problem is that he’s now newly single, so he doesn’t really have any reason to not just finish out this contract. Besides, he has to stay long enough to lock in Rose for four more years and then give Melo an extension before his deal runs out. I think Melo’s extension will at least likely be under $30 million a year now due to Melo’s decline.

You guys are fucking nuts to think Phil wants to role with this shitty core years down the line. Hell, at this point Melo might just ask for a damn extension with the hate that is bound to come his way after another subpar season. Neither he, Rose or Hornacek seem content with the way this is all playing out. Something will have to be done.

If this team continues to suck like this, which is incredibly likely, there is just no way even the dumbest person in the world would extend Melo. I just can’t deal with yet another Melo contract. I will not allow myself to consider that he will be here beyond the 2018-2019 season, that is just too brutal to even contemplate.

I actually think things might sour enough here for Melo to exercise his ETO after next season and try his luck somewhere else. If this team wins like 36 games this season and then finishes with a similar record the following year why would everybody want to continue prolonging this misery?

Oh, I think its very possible that Melo at least continues to suck like this. No defense, lots of inefficient volume scoring, dumb turnovers. Its no secret he’s going to continue playing the same way he’s always played and its no secret his lift is gone. He’s not going to be resigned by Phil.

I’m basing this on Melo not playing quite this awful the rest of the season. Yes, if he continues to play just the way he has so far for the next year or so, obviously even a moronic GM wouldn’t extend him. That said, I don’t think Melo will ever leave on his own (unless the Knicks outright rebuild, which doesn’t seem to be in the cards, though).

I don’t understand why people just don’t get it – Melo is washed up. What we are seeing is what he is. His lift is gone, he’s perpetually injuring or hurting a part of his body, and his stamina won’t allow him to finish a full season.

Its only going to get worse from now on. Phil’s not resigning him unless it gets real desperate.

So much negativity…
We dominated the game against a good young team. We clubbed it in the last two minutes. Not so bad…with KP in the game we probably win.

Yes, if he continues to play just the way he has so far for the next year or so, obviously even a moronic GM wouldn’t extend him.

Melo’s play has been very consistent across all of the three seasons since he signed the MMM. His TS% over the last three seasons:
2014-2015 .531
2015-2016 .530
2016-2017 .529

His WS48:
2014-2015 .097
2015-2016 .121
2016-2017 .111

He has been nothing if not consistent in his mind-numbing mediocrity for the last three years.

LOL @ dominated the game. It was tied at halftime. We took a 16 point lead in the third and then gave it back in the fourth quarter to lose at home. We did this despite shooting an ungodly high 3 point percentage.

I’ll say this, if Melo is “washed up” I’ll take a washed up 30pts, 11 boards and 7 assists all day… his best game of the season.

This game should’ve been put away in the fourth quarter. With KP playing that probably would’ve happened.

30 points on 23 shots is not so hot bruh. He was also bailed out on some calls. The facts don’t lie: he has the lowest percentage of any 20+ ppg scorer in the league outside of Devin Booker. Dude is finished.

In any event, it sure makes me want to watch Friday’s game. Ultimately that’s all I want, is to have watchable bball from the knicks.

We’d probably have won with KP, assuming that he matched Kuz’s efficient scoring.

He shot 10-23, that’s it! He’s done. Washed up.

Rose went 7-18, you should lay the blame there. Got stripped by Gianni’s and then didn’t double him on the last shot.

Kuz was efficient. But he wasn’t on the court in the fourth where KP would’ve been.

Another positive note is kuz being a knockdown shooter for those stretches when kp and Melo are cold.

I lay the blame on both. It doesn’t change the fact that Melo is finished, playing farther and farther away from the basket.

Yeah, but Kuz’s 6-10 shooting was a major part of the reason we had a lead going into the 4th. He was playing because KP wasn’t, so the trade off in having KP play his minutes would have been exchanging better defense for very very efficient scoring.

I don’t think Melos done. I think he needs to become more of a facilitator. Like he did tonight since rose isn’t one.

How do you know kp wouldn’t be lights out in the 4th.
Yea we got a lead in part to kuz I’m saying Luz should be playing more especially with Kp

He’s done. He can’t facilitate as easily because no on respects his ability to breakdown defenses off the dribble anymore so guys are playing off him with his face to the basket. He’s becoming more and more of a jump shooter, less of an off the ball or post up threat.

As for KP, he’s a special player. But Kuz’s offensive efficiency is pretty tough to match. You can’t expect a player to replace 15 points in 19 minutes of play on 6-10 FG shooting coming off a two game break.

Melo’s 32 and he’s past his prime and he’s playing like it. He’s not “done” as in fall-off-the-cliff, can’t play anymore “done,” but he’s clearly a step below where he was in his peak seasons– the 54-win season and the final year of his original Knick contract. He has been a clear notch below that peak ever since the MMM contract.

People are still waiting for him to turn into Paul Pierce and show this great late blossoming all-around game, and he shows flashes of that at times, but he is what he is. He gives you .530 TS% type scoring on sky-high usage and doesn’t defend well. He is visibly less athletic and slower than he was a few years ago, and the statistics that serve as a proxy for overall athleticism reflect this. His free throw rate is down, his rebounding rate is down, his dunk percentage is down… None of this is unexpected. I mean, this is what happens to players as they progress through their 30’s. He’s usually playing through some sort of nagging injury– this is what happens when you’ve played 34,000 minutes in the NBA.

He’s done. Lets trade him too soon before its too late. Though I already fear its too late.

NTC. only elite players have them, KG, Timmy, Nowitzki, Kobe I think…. interestingly Melo is the only one without a ring

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