The Reddit 20 Points, 10 Assists and 5 Rebounds Challenge

This has been going around the interwebs, so I figured it could be a fun diversion here.

If you had a chance to play 82 games in the NBA, with a guaranteed 20 minute per game, with the ultimate goal of scoring 20 total points all season, get 5 total rebounds all season and record 10 total assists all season, at which point you would receive a $250 million contract, but if you fail, you’d die (and the players don’t know that you’d die if they didn’t help you, so they won’t help you), would you take the challenge?

I say no way in heck am I gambling my life on that. Scoring a single point in the NBA is ridiculously hard. The other two things could be achieved through luck over the season, but scoring 20 points? That takes some legit skill and I don’t think I’d be able to do it. I certainly wouldn’t be confident enough to bet my life on it. Go to Spring Break during a pandemic? Sure, that’s worth betting my life on it, but not this.

How about you folks?

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302 thoughts to “The Reddit 20 Points, 10 Assists and 5 Rebounds Challenge”

  1. It depends on people knowing about the deal. If they don’t and they just treat me as an incompetent Earl Boykins I’m fairly confident I’ll drain 7 threes in 1640 minutes.

  2. It depends on people knowing about the deal. If they don’t and they just treat me as an incompetent Earl Boykins I’m fairly confident I’ll drain 7 threes in 1640 minutes.

    Yeah, they just think you’re an incompetent Earl Boykins. That’s it exactly. Do you really think they’d still keep giving you the ball? And could you get your shot off even over these guys? I’m not saying that you couldn’t, of course, but I don’t think I could. Heck, now I’m starting to doubt the assists aspect of it all, too.

  3. Considering I never scored a bucket in my HS career outside the paint, no, I don’t think I would take this challenge.

    250 million sounds nice though….

  4. Bo Nateman:
    Z Man
    I do not know if this would be helpful to the demographic of your student population but I will post it here anyway ( I voluntarilytutor students from my former school which is 99% Title 1)
    “As of Monday, March 16, Spectrum is offering households with K-12 and college students free WiFi access and broadband (high-speed internet) for the next 60 days. But this only applies to households who do not already have a Spectrum WiFi and broadband subscription.

    To enroll, or to ask for more information, call 1-844-488-8395 or go to spectrum.com.

    Installation fees will be waived for new student households. For most new customers, self-installation is an option and free professional installation is also available.”

    Thanks Bo. I think we’re on it via the district and our school newsletter but will doublecheck.

    We loaned out devices to about 15% of our community yesterday…most had access but needed devices for multiple kids at home.

  5. Re: Reddit, It’s such a dumb proposition that I can’t even. If you didn’t play at least high-level D-3 college basketball and aren’t in your athletic prime, every team you played on would essentially be playing 4 on 5. You’d probably get run over and seriously injured at some point. In my prime (’80’s) I played in games/leagues with some just below pro-level talent and it was a joke to imagine myself or nearly everyone I’ve ever played with/against in an NBA game.

  6. I’d probably blow my back out around the 15th minute. If we’re playing with no injuries — oh man I’m tempted. From the human element what opposing team/teammates won’t allow me to score a few points here and there to save my life?

  7. wait what, am I me or am I earl boykins…I don’t understand…

    this should be called the lance thomas challenge…not sure I’ve ever seen another player so consistently in love with keeping a clean box score…

  8. Re: Reddit, It’s such a dumb proposition that I can’t even. If you didn’t play at least high-level D-3 college basketball and aren’t in your athletic prime, every team you played on would essentially be playing 4 on 5. You’d probably get run over and seriously injured at some point. In my prime (’80’s) I played in games/leagues with some just below pro-level talent and it was a joke to imagine myself or nearly everyone I’ve ever played with/against in an NBA game.

    Well, playing 4 on 5, 20 minutes a night would lead to extensive garbage time and a team that stops caring if I shoot the ball. I just broke my arm, but if not, I think I would do it, :P

  9. Assuming you’re young and fit enough to run up and down for 2000 minutes you’d get the rebounds and assists pretty easily, the points would be the problem. If you could shoot at all from longish range you’d get it done off shots from random long rebounds

    I suppose the assists could be a problem if nobody on your team ever gave you the ball, which they might not do.

  10. Yeah, I’d probably get injured badly in the first game, I don’t think there’s any way a normal person can play relevant minutes in the NBA without getting destroyed physically in a couple of games.

  11. I think the only real play is to endear yourself enough to the other garbage time players that they give you a few pity possessions every night. Bar that, I don’t see them acknowledging my existence on the court.

  12. If it takes Frank Ntilikina 2 months to get 20, 10, and 5, how the hell am I supposed to do it in a year?

  13. I’d jack up circus shots in transition and eventually make a few of them. My teammates would hate me, and the fans would hate me even more, but no one would blame me.

    Also Z-man, you’re older than dirt — smart to sit this one out.

    ; )

  14. I don’t need the money, I already scored a touchdown on the play-any-possition-you-like for 20 minutes a night in the NFL.

  15. Frank’s played 1100 minutes and has 121 rebounds. Now, most of us aren’t 6’5″ with a 7′ wingspan, so we’re going to miss out on a few of those boards, but if you’re not completely immobile and can track a ball in the air you’ll get unconstested perimeter rebounds. 5 rebounds is by far the easiest part of that challenge. if you can run up and down the court and you have hands you can get 5 rebounds in 1600 nba minutes

  16. 20 points, 10 assists and 5 rebounds over the course of a season?* If I’m guaranteed to play all 82 games for 20 minutes, I think I can stumble into 5 rebounds and 10 assists pretty early in the season. The 20 points will be the tricky thing. I was never much of a scorer even in my “prime”. And old man 6’2″ post player with limited vertical is an archetype that does not translates well to the NBA, so that’s a major strike against me. Granted my young man 6’2″ slasher type with modest vertical “prime” isn’t much better. Maybe if I cherry pick? I can probably pick and pop out to 17-18 feet now a days so maybe in garbage time when it’s been established I’m not really an offensive threat, I could rack up a couple quick baskets when players sag off.

    For 250 mill, yeah I think I convinced myself to take the bet.

    *Note* – At first I read that as average 20, 10 and 5 and was like what idiot would take that bet. There’s only 6 people ever that’s done it. And 3 of them were in the past 4 years

  17. Yes. I’d split the winnings with my teammates and the other team.

    And if that isn’t allowed, a helpful coach would get me the 20 points. It could be on technical free throws. Besides you’d probably get some wide open looks, because the other team would cheat off you. Maybe a fastbreak here & there.

    The rebounds would just be a matter of pure luck. I think with enough court time, 5 is completely doable.

    The assists — that would be killer. I think I’d easier get 10 rebounds than 2 assists.

    So if everyone is honest about it, there’s no way you’re getting 10 assists without some serious skills.

  18. I think as long as your passes are accurate you can get an assist or two every 3 games or so. Getting the ball to your best shooter coming off screens should be able to get you 10 assists over say a 40 game period. Ideally, you’ll get your assists early in the challenge, before it’s scouted that your offense is limited. You can also stumble into some fast break opportunities. If you get the ball where people like it, which you should be working at in practice, getting the assists shouldn’t be too difficult.

  19. The points would be by far the hardest.

    How about some anecdotes about the closest thing to a pro game you have ever played in? I played in a winter league at Asphalt Green with teams that played in the Rucker League in the summer. My team had some college level players and we still got blown out in all 8 games. I was once matched up against Rod Strickland’s brother. He showed up late and we could have taken he forfeit. We opted to play and the ref chuckled “you guys shoulda taken the forfeit, that’s Rod Strickland’s brother, he’s gonna go for 50 against y’all.” I locked him down and held him to 49.

  20. Seriously, it would also depend on whether the opposing players had any skin in the game one way or the other. Would they set screens for you? Would they box you out on rebounds? Would the ref call fouls your way or let you get the beating you deserved?

    I think the Corona is getting to us…

  21. I’d do it.

    The points are the easy part, I think. Everybody is double-teamed except for me, so there will be plenty of shots early on. If I can bag a few wide open shots early in the season, I can stop shooting and facilitate. The problem would be missing a lot because I’d need my teammates to pass me the ball so that once my points are secure, I can get assists. Assists are the hard part because if I just jack up shots every time I get the ball, I’ll be iced out, and, unlike points and rebounds, it’s hard to fight for assists. But over 1600 minutes, even though I’ve lost a foot off my vertical leap, I’d manage. (So would the rest of you, I think.)

  22. I also think that we just don’t really get how far superior the typical NBA player is physically and athletically. Just making a simple pass from the point to the wing is a totally different animal, these guys anticipate stuff so well and cover so much ground. Having typical NBA players to reckon with (something like a 6’6″ guy with a long wingspan, a 36+” vertical, and talent and instincts that put him above all the G-League and foreign players) and seeing how many of them can’t even get off the bench because they suck compared to rotation players makes the scenario so far-fetched as to be nonsensical.

  23. Seriously, I’d like to hear from someone who played in a game with mostly professional-level players, especially if you were the outlier on the low end.

  24. Yeah, the particulars matter. Whether your teammates care and whether the other team cares about stopping you.

    I have told my Dan Gadzuric story before here but yeah, NBA players are like the monsters in Space Jam.

  25. Points wouldn’t necessarily be that hard if you just hung out by the opposing basket. My team wouldn’t want me gumming up the works on defense anyway. If everybody else boxed out for me I could do rebounds once I had the points in the bag and you only need 5. Assists would require me to be involved in a useful way, and 10? I’d need all inbound plays to be designed just to get me assists. Seems unlikely. Can I split the pot with the statistician? That’d help a lot.

    Wouldn’t be able to get anything in garbage time, since everybody else is also playing for a contract in that situation.

  26. Mostly I’ve played from time to time in games with one or two serious players…most recently with a 4-year player on Wisconsin. I also played with a few Rucker legends, a Euro player who was in Celtic Pride, and a guy who had a tryout with the Washington Bullets. But never a legit NBA player, let alone a court full of them.

  27. not to be too weird (yeah, a little late for that) – but, super happy to read your words bruno…been wondering how you were doing down there in brazil…hopefully staying as safe and healthy as possible…

  28. The step up in talent level from a typical D1 college player to any player in the NBA is huge.

    You guys might know this story already, but Brian Scalabrine was in a gym a few years ago and got challenged by some D1 college players to play one on one. He completely destroyed them, barely giving up any points.

    And that’s Brian Scalabrine, who looks like he never lifted a weight in his life.

  29. Can I split the pot with the statistician? That’d help a lot.

    Yeah, I could imagine getting ten cheap handoffs that lead directly to threes called assists over the course of the year with a friendly staticision.

  30. The other thing to consider is the pace of the game…just getting up and down the court with world-class athletes must be a bitch…

  31. I’ve played next to, and along side future and past NBAers (never an active player I don’t think). Anybody with any mobility can probably cobble together 10 garbage baskets over 1600 minutes. And 5 rebounds too. It’s the assists that’s the killer. It’s easy to end a possession. It’s a lot harder to keep one going, as we’ve seen countless times as Knick fans:)

    (Btw, my favorite basketball moment was when I was playing in a pickup game in Philadelphia. Winners stayed on and I looked over to see who was stepping on the court and it was Dr J, who was 48 at the time. We exchanged baskets for most of the game. I won, and when we shook hands, it was then that I realized he was wearing flipflops. It was one of the cooler days of my life:)

    (Also, the best player I ever played on a court with was in high school when I faced Wayne Turner in a tournament in Boston. He was a freshman, and it was quite apparent he was way too talented for our league. He went on to lead Kentucky to two national championships and is now an assistant coach there. Not sure why he wasn’t able to make it in the NBA, but it goes to show just how incredible you have to be to play at that level. He was way better than the taller, scrubbier dudes I’ve played with who made NBA teams based on height and height alone).

  32. Btw, my favorite basketball moment was when I was playing in a pickup game in Philadelphia. Winners stayed on and I looked over to see who was stepping on the court and it was Dr J, who was 48 at the time. We exchanged baskets for most of the game. I won, and when we shook hands, it was then that I realized he was wearing flipflops.

    oh, that is just beautiful :)

  33. showed up to work today and the parking lot was empty (governor put out a stay at home thing last night)…

    looks like i’ll be coming to work though for a while longer at least…hard not to think of those folks working in stores or at a health care facility…that’s a seriously heavy dose of exposure to others…

    i’m very thankful for the income…i need though to get smart today and make sure i have a wash up and disinfect plan for when i get home…god daughter is already in the house, and gonna pick up one of my god sons this weekend to stay with me for a while…

    i’m the only one really going in and out of the house – so, i need to have a good protocol for cleaning up when i get home, or, if the kid’s mom or god daughter’s boyfriend visit…

    still making my way through all my drawers and cabinets now…

    i live in a pretty safe and nice area, but, had to let the god daughter know to make sure to keep the garage door closed (normally no big deal keep open)…theft is no doubt about to be on the rise…

  34. not looking too great for toilet paper over the long haul…my level of civilization ain’t so high, so i ain’t got no bidet or hose to wash my booty…starting to wonder though if i can make a spray bottle work???

  35. I would argue that the assists would be the most challenging. Facilitation at that level is an absolute nightmare outside of the top athletes with the complementary skill sets (as clearly shown, or not shown, by our beloved Knicks). You can luck into 5 rebounds and 20 points in 2000 minutes. Anyone who has been to game close to the floor is usually in awe of how fast these guys are, but the strength is often overlooked.

    I remember getting a few D1 offers from E. Tenn. State/Seton Hall/Boston College but chose to go to UF as I knew basketball beyond that would never be realistic. I step onto the practice court (accidentally went to the sports complex instead of the student gym. I looked the part and someone buzzed me in) got picked up to run a few games with the main team as they thought i was a recruit (it was the summer of 02′). I took a spin move elbow to the chest from Haslem and flew back at least 10 feet. Ended up playing on the practice squad for 4 years with guys like Brewer, Noah, Lee, Horford, and the like.

    I’ve been fortunate enough to play against some great players even at the high school level (Keyon Dooling, Ed Nelson, Travis Daniels, Akil Lewis, STAT). I’m good friends with an NBA trainer so i get to play some pretty decent games down here in S. Florida with Wade/Haslem/Jeff Green, but at 36 its a real struggle.

    I suppose my best basketball story would be when i was 15 in NY. i was shooting around at Stuyvesant High School gym on Chambers. Steve Nash walks in and asks to shoot with me even though i was the only person in the gym. Him and i shot and chatted for about an hour. Very cool moment and probably a 90% shooter. Unreal.

    With the nonsense that’s happening in the world, and being a man with no children, I would absolutely take that bet and it probably wouldn’t matter either way.

  36. >>>>I would argue that the assists would be the most challenging. Facilitation at that level is an absolute nightmare outside of the top athletes with the complementary skill sets (as clearly shown, or not shown, by our beloved Knicks).>>>>

    <<>>

    We’d get to play against the Knicks at least twice, right?

  37. I’m still in decent shape and crafty/dirty as a mfer, but yeah, this is way past my old ass…

    Considering that they were still underhand-tossing balls into fruit bins when you learned to dribble, yeah, I’d say so.

  38. The Honorable Cock Jowles: Considering that they were still underhand-tossing balls into fruit bins when you learned to dribble, yeah, I’d say so.

    Listen sonny, you try dribbling a ball with laces. Or climbing up and down a fucking ladder to get the ball out of the peach basket. Or running a fast break in moccasins. And where do you think the expression “no harm no foul” came from?

  39. The assists would be the hardest, probably, because if you can shoot free throws you can convince you teammates to let you shoot technicals and stuff like that. But assists, you could bring the ball up and just pass it instantly for someone to chuck a 3, but the other team would figure it out fast and press you full court so that would never happen.

  40. Still mulling it over myself, but just want to point out that I think the ‘and a few fast breaks’ is about the most nonsensical thing said so far. I set a bunch of sprint records in middle and high school, but I can’t imagine any NBA player who couldn’t stay with/catch me if I was dribbling, and wouldn’t reject me into the rafters if I was stupid enough to put up a shot. I might be able to get an assist if I had a trailer, but not a layup. If I was going to score at all, it’d be on a couple of 18-footers when I was left alone. Although if my teammates don’t know about the bet (and that’s how Brian posited it above), I can’t imagine them putting up with me on the court for 20 minutes. You think they froze Frank out…

  41. And where do you think the expression “no harm no foul” came from?

    I’m young enough to believe this came from the CIA’s post-9/11 torture program.

  42. Do I get an offseason to spend all my time with a shooting coach and a trainer?

    Because still no.

  43. I’d take it.

    For the 20 points, I’d just basket hang on every possession. I literally wouldn’t leave that end of the court. Teammates would be playing 4 on 5 on defense, but whenever they got a stop they’d throw a football pass to me for a layup. If I’m guaranteed 20 minutes per game, that strategy would add up to 10 buckets eventually.

    The same strategy could work for assists. Once you receive the football pass, just wait for a teammate to come sprinting down the court and kick it back to them. It would be terrible basketball, and my passes would get picked off half the time, but it wouldn’t take that long to pick up 10 assists.

    20 min x 82 games x 2 offensive possessions/min = 3,280 possessions. You only need 20 of those 3,280 to go right (10 baskets + 10 assists). If you’re basket-hanging and not trying to play actual basketball, you could do it.

  44. It’s Easier to Fool People Than to Convince Them That They Have Been Fooled’? – Mark Twain

    https://www.beliefnet.com/columnists/attheintersectionoffaithandculture/2020/03/an-antidote-to-coronavirus-panic-the-facts.html

    Do yourselves a favor, take ten minutes, read this, think on your own a little and then lets discuss how it going to look on other end. We have an “I” now…but not for long. Will the recovery look like an “L”, “U”, “V” or “W”? I’m calling fora double dip “W” type recovery.

  45. yes, god helps those whom help themselves…totally agree…i’m not sure what the point of the article really was though…

    was it to say: thank goodness my fellow filthy human inhabitants of this planet are finally washing their dirty, stinking, nasty bodies – or, don’t do nothing and it’ll all work out about the same…

    i get it…i mean really, why even worry about toilet paper when your ass is just gonna get dirty again later…

  46. Do yourselves a favor, take ten minutes, read this, think on your own a little and then lets discuss how it going to look on other end.

    Every single time you come on here, you spew bullshit even dumber than the time before. You’ve done well not to break your streak. Thank you for that fucking useless article. Now go self-quarantine yourself before you vomit all over this website again.

  47. seeing how we have some serious music aficionado’s here…maybe not now – but, at some point i’d love to hear some of your favorite lyrics of all time…

    never really been big in to poetry, but, always getting blown away when i dig in to different artists’ lyrics (maybe not exactly huey lewis and the news), but, there’s so many good ones out there…

    was you tubing the killer in me by alice in chains yesterday (from their unplugged performance) which got me thinking about this…i know though a lot of you have much broader and greater knowledge of music than myself, which made me wonder…

    no doubt though, many times the lyrics of a song can stand on their own just fine as exceptional art…

  48. Jowles, you’re such a bully. Certainly I wish we would run into each other one day…only shared it because most here are smart enough to look at statistics, data and recognize real from hype. Whether its danger, talent, intelligence, – its all the same.

    perhaps, this is playing out at a massive scale…

    The people, having heard of the weaver’s abilities and the cloth’s fictious properties, were amazed and offered thunderous applause to the now beaming Emperor. None of them were willing to admit that they hadn’t seen a thing; for if anyone did, then he was either stupid or unfit for the job he held. Never before had the emperor’s clothes been such a success.

    While expressing admiration at their Emperor’s new “invisible” clothes, a small boy cried out… “But the Emperor has no clothes!”

  49. My pro vs experience came against Cory Joseph (I want to say it was his second year in the league) and Antonio Daniels (he was out of the league for a year at least but still definitely in playing shape) while I was living in San Antonio. The game was quick and I was matched up against Antonio for the most part. He didn’t absolutely murder me, though I think he was more mentoring Cory at the time. He definitely took some time to give him tips and pointers. Kyle Anderson was there too, but he didn’t run in the game I played in. Anyway, my team didn’t get destroyed, we didn’t win either, but it was semi competitive. Being on the floor against them as a release valve for the point guard and passing on target is a role I’m actually pretty comfortable with since most of the time I wasn’t the primary or even secondary option for scoring. If I have time to know the plays and the options off the plays, and if I have a really competent big man to dump off to.

    My other kinda pro game was versus Jerome James back in college. That’s trickier because he was so much bigger than us. Scoring against him was…difficult to say the least. This was the year before he led the NCAA in blocks. Now granted, I didn’t think he was polished enough to get to the league, but he had decent defensive reactions. I think I scored once or twice while he was patrolling the paint. I’m sure he sent back at least a dozen shots that game. That’s why I think assists will be easier. Passing to actual NBA athletes will probably net better results.

    I do need to be honest with myself though. If I wanted to have a real shot at this, I would have to get back into actual playing shape. I’ve not been even pickup game ready in quite a few years now.

  50. oops…make that the killer is me…i’m so embarrassed…

    jerry actually played this at his show at the pico union project…i had heard it before, but, until then had never really paid that close attention to it…live it was eerie and magic…

    Don’t need a gun
    Pointed at me
    Don’t need to run
    Killer is me

    Insane the mind
    In the name of me
    Can’t find the time
    To let things be
    Insane the mind
    In the name of me
    Can’t find the time
    To let things be
    Let things be

    Oh yeah
    Can I start over?
    Oh yeah
    Can I start over?
    And get over it

    So the sun
    Shines upon me
    Havin fun
    Killer is me

  51. I locked him down and held him to 49.

    Just like The Glove! (Not the regular kind, just a lace glove. Very dainty, but full o holes.)

    The best I can say is playing on 4th Street back in the day. And I played one-on-one against George Clooney, who beat me, but only because I was worried that if I played hard I might hurt him and never have lunch in that town again. But never with pros, or even close.

    My father, however, played semi-pro, once playing against Wilt – it’s a funny story about that game, as he was the 6’4″ power forward and realized that they had no chance whatsoever – and my sister was on the Olympic team – the one in 1980 that didn’t go to Russia. Bummer for her. But she held a lot of college records for a long time. I felt bad that the WNBA finally came along and she was in her 30s. Oh well. Maybe I was lucky to have the least athletic talent in my family.

  52. most here are smart enough to look at statistics, data and recognize real from hype. Whether its danger, talent, intelligence, – its all the same.

    you don’t need to be a statistician to recognize that there are over 7 billion of us stripping away the resources and destroying the environment of this fragile little pebble in the sky we all live on…

    however, the only story that really matters at the moment is the one that bob shared a week ago about his friend succumbing to this virus…that’s not hype…

    jim was absolutely correct: no one does get out of here alive, but, heck – let’s do all we can to hang on to those we love and care for…

    it was tough today when a bunch of the workers here were sent home…warehouse folks that can’t work from home…broke my heart…they weren’t worried so much about the virus, but how they were going to take care of their family…they got some really tough choices they’re about to be faced with…some really tough choices…however…

  53. “Don’t get duped, chumps!” said the guy who literally joined this website trying, and failing, to convince us that he was in fact a woman.

    Now granted, I didn’t think he was polished enough to get to the league, but he had decent defensive reactions.

    I love stories like this. Also, it’s important to keep in mind just how good these guys are. Until my leg injury, I played pickup against a bunch of guys who had clearly played D2 and D3 ball, a couple underachiever-type JuCo players in there too. The talent gap between them and the weekend warriors was stark to say the least. Then you realize that they would get blown out by 50 against an average D1 team, and then even the Brian Scalabrines of the world would wipe their asses clean over 48 minutes.

    I had a guy pull up from the logo on me something like 4 times in a row, hitting each one. I bet he played community college ball, tops.

  54. In a forum with as much musical knowledge and talent as this, I am the Frank Ntilikina of guitarists.

    I suck. I know it. But I still think there’s hope. :-)

    I think I mentioned a few weeks back that was trying to learn the introduction to Jimi Hendrix’s Little Wing. That’s by far the most difficult song I ever tried. To be honest, it was quite a bit over my head. But I love that style of playing off the chords so much, I want to be able to do it competently eventually. Yellow Ledbetter is another example of the style and like and Feels like Rain by Buddy Guy also has some of that in the intro.

    Well, I am 7 weeks into this personal challenge. I’m happy to report, while I can’t get through the whole intro cleanly every time, I can and do get through it cleanly some of the time.

    So next time Frank goes 1-8, with 1 assist, and 1 rebound, in 25 minutes, remember, “Where there’s will, there’s a way”.

  55. okay strat, is there though a particular song/lyrics that really touches you or that you really connect with?

  56. I’m sort of with Nassim Taleb on this.

    Personally. I actually think the medical danger of coronvirus is being slightly exaggerated. I think panic is going to exacerbate the problems by causing a depression level contraction over the next few quarters.

    HOWEVER, when the downside risk is so extremely large, you are WAY BETTER OFF panicking and preventing the worst case scenario from occurring than assuming everything will be fine and potentially inviting that worst case scenario. Some risks are so difficult to assess and predict and have so many unknowable consequences, the default value HAD TO BE shut it all down.

    I feel like my own personal panic and lock down is having a positive impact on the result because I am doing way less actual and potential damage.

  57. Personally. I actually think the medical danger of coronvirus is being slightly exaggerated.

    What medical danger are we talking about? The mortality rate with normal treatment, or the mortality rate — for COVID-19 or any other severe respiratory illness — when respirators are unavailable due to extreme shortage?

  58. okay strat, is there though a particular song/lyrics that really touches you or that you really connect with?

    I’ve always been more into music than lyrics.

    Depending on the day and my mood, some music can generate a euphoric feeling in me that goes beyond anything I’ve ever experienced from alcohol or in my limited use of drugs.

    Freddie Mercury and Brian May have put me in that special place a few times. Sometimes “Don’t Stop Me Now” does it for me, but not always.

    Many years ago I saw Roy Buchanan live and he had me in another universe when he played “The Messiah Will Come Again”.

    I’m mostly into rock and blues, but sometimes a good ragtime song will get me there.

    Sometimes a good bluegrass song will do the trick.

    Sometimes some deep dark blues song from the 30s will do it.

    But I have different reactions to the same songs on different days. So it’s not just the song and lyrics alone. It’s also the timing, my mood, and probably even my brain chemistry at that moment in time.

  59. I’m mostly into rock and blues

    Have you heard about this band JD & the Straight Shot? Opened for some pretty big acts….

  60. >What medical danger are we talking about? The mortality rate with normal treatment, or the mortality rate — for COVID-19 or any other severe respiratory illness — when respirators are unavailable due to extreme shortage?<

    Both are obviously an issue.

    The health risk of COVID-19 for a relatively healthy person with a normal immune system and/or good treatment is probably not as high as the general perception right now.

    The health risk from hospitals being over capacity, shortages of respirators, exhausted medical workers etc.. is the kind of long tail risk that people don't see coming until it actually happens. That's why it is best to panic to avoid the things you can't see yet.

    There may be more things coming we aren't prepared for, including the downsides of a staggering economic contraction and borrowing/printing trillions of dollars to stop the bleeding, to go along with the additional healthcare risks I'm not smart enough to see.

  61. The health risk of COVID-19 for a relatively healthy person with a normal immune system and/or good treatment is probably not as high as the general perception right now.

    What’s the general perception? People are staying inside because they’re afraid that they will get their loved ones sick, or they will infect someone who will get an elderly person sick, and so on. I don’t know anything about this “general perception” that you speak of. It’s a wisp, a fiction.

  62. The Honorable Cock Jowles: What’s the general perception? People are staying inside because they’re afraid that they will get their loved ones sick, or they will infect someone who will get an elderly person sick, and so on. I don’t know anything about this “general perception” that you speak of. It’s a wisp, a fiction.

    In talking to family and friends, I think you underrating how scared a lot of people are.

    Of course, most of my friends are in their late 50s or early 60s, some have health issues that the youngsters here don’t have yet, and quite a few have parents in their 80s they don’t want to lose (myself included). The risks are higher among my circle of friends and family.

    What I am seeing may not be applicable to your circle.

  63. The Honorable Cock Jowles: Every single time you come on here, you spew bullshit even dumber than the time before. You’ve done well not to break your streak. Thank you for that fucking useless article. Now go self-quarantine yourself before you vomit all over this website again.

    lol this is the guy who tries to calm me down from time to time…

  64. This is my favorite guitarist no one ever heard of. He plays a combination of Jazz and Blues. He posts short videos of his practice and songs on Facebook all the time, but there’s a lot of stuff of his on the internet.

    Roberto Restuccia

    Here’s just one

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCGX-2ejisk

  65. thanks strat…i’ll take a look (not getting a ton done today at the office, still trying to adjust mentally to what’s happening) at the vids…

    i need to take a break from my usually depressing 90’s rock tunes…

    been taking my temperature a bunch the last week or so…forget a fever – i barely break 97 degrees ever…

  66. Strat, are you into Curtis Mayfield’s playing? He kind of invented that “Little Wing” style of chord comping.

    Once you learn a few of those chordal licks you can kind of play them all. “The Wind Cries Mary” by Hendrix is a good simple place to start, that’s like the 101 course of that Curtis Mayfield style. “Castles Made Of Sand” is like the final exam. There are some good YouTube tutorials out there that I’m sure you’re aware of.

    Now that I have some free time I might go back to my dad guitar hobby: learning Steely Dan solos. I had learned “Kid Charlemagne” and the intro to “Don’t Take Me Alive” but I’m a little rusty on both.

  67. Strat, you’d probably also dig Isaiah Sharkey, he plays with D’Angelo and the Vanguard and he’s one of my favorite guitarists ever.

  68. I think you underrating how scared a lot of people are.

    Truthfully, I’m scared shitless about being able to go out and shop, getting sick, getting my medicines, taking care of my mom and brother without exposing them or myself etc.. I’m overwhelmed.

    after reading what you wrote the other day i said fuck it – and, went home :)

    that’s exactly how i felt inside at the moment: over fucking whelmed…

    seriously though – thank you for being so honest and open…you have no idea how many folks connect to what you say…

    you are a unique individual sir…i’m glad you’re here…

  69. Isaiah Sharkey is also in the Drumhedz, with Chris Dave, one of the best drummers alive. Sharkey is a genius.

  70. Also it’s fun to listen to and study Jimi, but he’s also one of the most creative and wildest talents in rock history. It’s like picking a reproduction of “Guernica” as your Oil Painting 101 final project.

    I recommend playing easier stuff well than harder stuff poorly.

  71. I’m somewhat more into music than lyrics myself. The song that moved me most deeply from a lyrical perspective is Don McLean’s Vincent. I just read the wikipedia page and it said this: “The song was a particular favorite of the rapper and actor Tupac Shakur, and was played to him in the hospital just before he died.”

  72. When I was in my mid-twenties, I played with Tom Riker and Reggie Carter both of whom had cups of coffee with the Knicks. I was still in reasonable shape ( playing multiple times a week). Riker is 6’10” and obliterated everyone in a half-court game. Carter, who was about my height played at 1/2 speed for most of the game. His friends were watching and woofing, if I scored on him or stopped him on D. When that happened he turned it up and made me look like Bobby Portis playing interior D.

  73. folks, Any death is a tragedy but tens of thousands of people die every year from “the flue”. It may be sad but its natural. if mortality rate is one in a thousand, then what did we just do but panic? (C-19) is not a a new virus all together but a new strain. We discover around 100 new strains every year. This too is natural.

    Play it out. Wuhan scientist folks got so excited of what they found, that they convinced their Chinese govt to stick a thermometer in the forehead of everyone that moves. All of the sudden, Wuhan is on the getting worldwide attention. They tested same way as everyone did, only the sick and the dead. Those imagines went viral all over the world. That was the seed. Xi panicked, Orange-ton closed border to Chinese and avalanche is formed. Politics is a copy cat league.

    Right now in Milan, NYC or Wuhan, if you tested positive and you fall of the balcony while singing the lyrics of JD and the Straight Shot, – you show up on the CDC list in 48 hours.

  74. Now I understand
    What you tried to say to me
    How you suffered for your sanity
    How you tried to set them free.
    They would not listen
    They did not know how
    Perhaps they’ll listen now.

    whoa…beautiful song…i had no idea what it was about though until now…

  75. Bo Nateman: When I was in my mid-twenties, I played with Tom Riker and Reggie Carter both of whom had cups of coffee with the Knicks.

    Vaguely remember both guys…nice!

  76. my favorite

    Desperado, why don’t you come to your senses?
    You been out ridin’ fences for so long now
    Oh, you’re a hard one
    But I know that you got your reasons
    These things that are pleasin’ you
    Can hurt you somehow
    Don’t you draw the Queen of Diamonds, boy
    She’ll beat you if she’s able
    You know the Queen of Hearts is always your best bet
    Now, it seems to me some fine things
    Have been laid upon your table
    But you only want the ones that you can’t get
    Desperado, oh, you ain’t gettin’ no younger
    Your pain and your hunger, they’re drivin’ you home
    And freedom, oh freedom, well that’s just some people talkin’
    Your prison is walking through this world all alone
    Don’t your feet get cold in the winter time?
    The sky won’t snow and the sun won’t shine
    It’s hard to tell the night time from the day
    You’re losin’ all your highs and lows
    Ain’t it funny how the feeling goes away?
    Desperado, why don’t you come to your senses?
    Come down from your fences, open the gate
    It may be rainin’, but there’s a rainbow above you
    You better let somebody love you (let somebody love you)
    You better let somebody love you
    Before it’s too late

  77. i get what you’re saying giana…had the flag never been raised initially – would anyone had really taken notice of the increase in flu cases and the deaths caused by it…maybe then the world’s economic structure wouldn’t have been cratered…which may lead to even more grief and chaos than the virus itself…

    seems though that the transmission rate here is abnormal, and the lethality amongst certain groups is increased over the regular ‘ol flu…to be honest though – i’m not even that sure what the regular flu actually is…

    should of, would of, could of…it did happen, we do all know now…just like kp ain’t never gonna suit up again in a knick uniform – there’s no going back…

    who knows though, the actions we take now could have a huge impact on our future…for when that next pandemic strikes…

  78. folks, Any death is a tragedy but tens of thousands of people die every year from “the flue”. It may be sad but its natural.

    You are a fucking moron.

  79. desperado – 1973…i remember when i was young taking notice of the song…even though i was young and couldn’t really relate to what the lyrics were saying…i liked the melancholy and introspective way it made me feel…

    around that same time in my life to how:
    People,
    People who need people,
    Are the luckiest people in the world
    We’re children, needing other children
    And yet letting a grown-up pride
    Hide all the need inside
    Acting more like children than children

    and
    To think that only yesterday
    I was cheerful, bright and gay
    Looking forward to who wouldn’t do
    The role I was about to play?
    But as if to knock me down
    Reality came around
    And without so much as a mere touch
    Cut me into little pieces
    Leaving me to doubt
    Talk about God in His mercy
    Who if He really does exist
    Why did He desert me?
    In my hour of need
    I truly am indeed
    Alone again, naturally

    would make me feel…

  80. Let’s see how these “it’s just a flu” morons are feeling in a couple weeks when the hospital hallways are filling up with people gasping for air and breathing their last breaths in agony. Or when they catch the disease themselves and they’re lying in a bed intubated, with no anesthesia because it ran out.

    For once in my life I really hope the stupid fucking assholes are right and I am wrong. It doesn’t usually work out that way.

    Reub is a real piece of shit.

  81. I read about half of Black Swan years ago and Nassim Taleb may be great at math but he is also fucking idiot.

  82. Ive played in a few adult leagues with real good ex-college players and over seas pros with only 1 former NBA player who played one season, Tim Hardaway Sr!! I was by far the least athletic player on the court and all I could do was spot up from the 3pt line.

    With the shorter 3pt line I think I could get 20 pts cause people would automatically leave me open and I can shoot a bit but I’ve shot from the NBA 3pt line and its ALOT harder than the old college/HS 3pt line. Rebs I can definitely get 5, my “career high” was 8 and I’m only 6ft and like I mentioned unathletic but with some hustle you can get the rebs. I agree with everyone who said assists, it is HARD as hell to make just a simple pass with good athletes playing defense, I can only imagine NBA level athletes. Plus dribbling against them?? Forget about it. I’d prefer if it was 10 rebs and 5 asts.

    But yeah man pretty sure none of us could pull this off lol.

  83. But yeah man pretty sure none of us could pull this off lol.

    yeah well, i’m pretty sure i could do it…you know, the power of positive thinking and all…hell, if i can get in the habit of washing my whole hands, and, not just my fingertips – i believe i can do anything :D

  84. I’m somewhat more into music than lyrics myself. The song that moved me most deeply from a lyrical perspective is Don McLean’s Vincent. I just read the wikipedia page and it said this: “The song was a particular favorite of the rapper and actor Tupac Shakur, and was played to him in the hospital just before he died.”

    McLean was a heck of a lyricist. His song, “Empty Chairs” was the inspiration for “Killing Me Softly With His Song.”

    Now we just need to have someone write a song inspired by “Killing Me Softly With His Song” to keep the strong going.

  85. most here are smart enough to look at statistics, data and recognize real from hype.

    This is amazing considering the source.

    tens of thousands of people die every year from “the flue”.

    motherfuckers are getting stuck in them bitches ALL THE TIME. Stop trying to be Santa Claus people!!

  86. geo….also…when I hear those songs it puts me back in the school bus with the old am radio going….I didn’t get those desperado lyrics either…the first time I heard it was when i was about 9 yrs old on vacation with the family in san francisco and this women was playing it on the streetcorner trying to get some cash …every time I hear it …I think of that one time she was playing it…

    how about this one…

    Hello? Hello? Hello?
    Is there anybody in there?
    Just nod if you can hear me
    Is there anyone at home?
    Come on now
    I hear you’re feeling down
    Well I can ease your pain
    Get you on your feet again
    Relax
    I’ll need some information first
    Just the basic facts
    Can you show me where it hurts?
    There is no pain you are receding
    A distant ship smoke on the horizon
    You are only coming through in waves
    Your lips move but I can’t hear what you’re saying
    When I was a child I had a fever
    My hands felt just like two balloons
    Now I’ve got that feeling once again
    I can’t explain you would not understand
    This is not how I am
    I have become comfortably numb

  87. I d like to mention that reading lyrics without listening to their music alongside ain’t the best way to feel them but if it works for you that’s fine with me…

    Ain’t a lyrics guy too but after so many years of listening to music i was touched by a few. First that come to mind:

    Time by Pink Floyd
    Blowin in the wind by Bob Dylan
    I see a darkness by Bonnie ‘Prince’ Billie (Will Oldham)

  88. I’ll tell you one thing about COVID.

    People in Italy aren’t dropping like flies because COVID is super deadly by itself. People here are dying because our amazing (go look at it, this is not patriotism talking) national health system simply can’t handle the sheer number of guys who get that terrible pneumonia all together. In the city of Bergamo it’s esteemed that at least 50 people die *per day* without even leaving home because hospitals won’t accept them. In Italy. Stop saying bullshit about this illness. It can and does bring a nation to its knees simply by having the best TS% in 100 years at getting you VERY sick. I’m still young and I’m scared shitless because there’s a chance that if I get it I might not get the help I’d need because a lot of dumbfucks still roam the streets saying “yeah it’s just a bad flu”. STOP BEING SO DUMB

  89. second on blowin in the wind….it was inserted nicely into the Watchmen movie …forget what scene it was…

  90. “I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    And just for that one moment I could be you.
    Yes, I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    You’d know what a drag it is to see you.”

    Hard to top that one IMO

  91. Farfa’s a bright paisan but take him with a grain of salt…it’s not like he’s MENSA or anything

  92. of all the music i listen to at work – hands down – pink floyd is by far the best to focus and work to…

    AXS tv plays a lot of those artist and album docs…i am always blown away by just how smart and skillful that band was…

    what they did was amazing, and, it was all just so well thought out and executed…

    it’s amazing how at times people allow themselves to becoming so incredibly vulnerable by exposing some of their deeper, intimate and sometimes darker feelings…

    when i was a kid my folks were always splitting up…i remember one year going to like four different schools…stayed with a lot of family and friends…pretty much homeless for a few years…

    lived in frisco for about a year, i was in the 3rd grade and had to take like a bus and trolley just to get back and forth to school…i remember getting a skateboard for my birthday and sitting on it and riding down the hill the house i lived in…it’s a miracle i survived those hills and that skateboard (little tiny board that had an image of a knight and “blacknight” written on it)…not quite as dangerous as when i first started driving (i was an absolute lunatic), but, if i ever saw one of the god kids playing like that i’d have a heart attack…

  93. Saying it’s like the flu is a special kind of stupid. Stop trolling.

    My friend who has it in Spain still hasn’t recovered, has pains in her chest, and may have to get an emergency c-section. She’s not in critical condition but it’s extremely unpleasant.

    And yeah, just imagine if you need critical care right now for something else. You will be shit out of luck in NYC.

    The truest thing I have read about public health is that you get no credit for doing your job perfectly.

    If we do manage to contain this, somewhat, we are still guaranteed decades worth of bullshit about how it was never really that serious. You can book it. We all just have to accept that now.

    All that said, I think the question about how far we can go down this path is very real. I don’t think America, and its economy, can take more than a couple weeks of this. People are hurting.

  94. “I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    And just for that one moment I could be you.
    Yes, I wish that for just one time you could stand inside my shoes
    You’d know what a drag it is to see you.”

    that is some brilliant writing and savage stuff right there…

  95. i’ve never had long hair, and, i blend in pretty well (except when i open my mouth)…but, these lines stick with me a bunch…maybe cuz i moved around so much as a kid, and, never really felt like i fit in:

    Well you walk into a restaurant,
    Strung out from the road
    And you feel the eyes upon you
    As you’re shakin’ off the cold
    You pretend it doesn’t bother you
    But you just want to explode
    Most times you can’t hear ’em talk,
    Other times you can
    All the same old cliches,
    “Is that a woman or a man?”
    And you always seem outnumbered,
    You don’t dare make a stand

    that in the fact that as much as i love individuals…never been that big a fan of “people”…

  96. Dylan can do so many different things with lyrics. He has to be the GOAT lyricist just in terms of sheer volume of quality.

    Leonard Cohen at his best was untouchable though. For sheer poetry and imagery I’d give him the nod over Dylan. Had a much shorter peak though, and didn’t have Dylan’s incredible versatility.

    Lou Reed is also on my lyricist Mount Rushmore. Not sure who would be the fourth.

  97. my dad and his buddies would hang out in the basement listening to floyd and either eat shrooms or drop acid an and smoke weed or some combination of the above and I didn’t realize to later on why there were all so happy listening to that strange music….

  98. although i do like lay lady lay, i’m generally not too big a fan of his voice…

    You’d know what a drag it is to see you.

    that though makes me wanna dig more in to his lyrics…i just love how he put that together…so clever…

  99. I loved you in the morning
    Our kisses safe and warm
    Your head upon the pillow
    Like a sleepy golden storm
    Yes, many loved before us
    I know we are not new
    In city and in forest
    They smiled like me and you
    But now it’s come to distances
    And both of us must try
    Your eyes are soft with sorrow
    Hey, that’s no way to say goodbye

  100. i can’t light no more of your darkness
    All my pictures seem to fade to black and white
    I’m growing tired and time stands still before me
    Frozen here on the ladder of my life
    It’s much too late to save myself from falling
    I took a chance and changed your way of life
    But you misread my meaning when i met you
    Closed the door and left me blinded by the light
    Don’t let the sun go down on me
    Although i search myself, it’s always someone else i see
    I’d just allow a fragment of your life to wander free
    But losing everything is like the sun going down on me

  101. For lyrics:

    Dylan: Mama, You’ve Been On My Mind; Masters Of War; Pawn In The Game; Mr Tambourine Man; Idiot Wind; Dear Landlord; Jokerman.

    Marley: Redemption Song.

    Robertson: The Weight; Stagefright; The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down; Broken Arrow.

    Stills: Helplessly Hoping.

    Young: Southern Man; Trasher; Old Man; Ambulance Blues.

    Prince: Ballad Of Dorothy Parker.

    Morrison: Street Choir; Into The Mystic

    George: Long Distance Love; Fat Man In The Bathtub.

    Knopfler: Romeo And Juliet.

    Simon: America.

    Gershwin: I Loves You Porgy.

    Byrne: Life During Wartime; Once In A Lifetime.

    Seger: Against The Wind.

    Wonder: Big Brother.

    Hornsby: End Of The Innocence.

    John: Madman Across The River; Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters.

    Taylor: Fire And Rain.

    Mitchell: Last Time I Saw Richard; Woman Of Heart And Mind; Case Of You.

    Springsteen: anything off his first three albums, or the Ghost Of Tom Joad record. Notably: Incident On 57th Street; Lost In The Flood; Jungleland; Straight Time. Also: The Wrestler; My City Of Ruins; Brilliant Disguise; Stolen Car.

  102. Tangled Up In Blue is a song i can listen to over and over.
    Breaking the Girl always gets me especially after breaking up.

  103. seger – turn the page…night moves

    dylan – just like a woman

    prince – erotic city

    ac/dc – highway to hell (for these current times)

  104. “Tears of Rage” and “I’d Have You Anytime” are great Dylan lyrics done better by more talented crooners (Manuel and Harrison)

  105. Rush…baby…

    There are those who think
    That they were dealt a losing hand
    The cards were stacked against them
    They weren’t born in Lotusland

    All preordained
    A prisoner in chains
    A victim of venomous fate
    Kicked in the face
    You can’t pray for a place
    In heaven’s unearthly estate

    You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice
    If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice
    You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill
    I will choose a path that’s clear
    I will choose freewill

  106. As for betting my life for 2- 50 Mil
    Haven’t decide it yet haven’t still
    My heart yells: just do it!
    But my body says: chill
    Can i do it? Maybe…
    But Why? Ain’t Real!
    Do i wanna be rich?
    Or just pay the bill?
    Aaaah ! Fuck it…Anywise the League is ill !

    Lyrics by Knew Your Knicks
    All rights reserved

  107. Knew Your Nicks:
    As for betting my life for 2- 50 Mil
    Haven’t decide it yet haven’t still
    My heart yells: just do it!
    But my body says: chill
    Can i do it? Maybe…
    But Why? Ain’t Real!
    Do i wanna be rich?
    Or just pay the bill?
    Aaaah ! Fuck it…Anywise the League is ill !

    Lyrics by Knew Your Knicks
    All rights reserved

    Imagine it by the Beastie Boys

  108. Nina Simone’s cover of “Just Like A Woman” is the one you want.

    Usually I like Dylan’s versions of his songs best but not that one.

  109. pepper:
    i thought it was 50 cent or beastie boys until you owned up to it…

    Dylan’s spirit possessed me for a monent !!!

  110. “Nina Simone’s cover of “Just Like A Woman” is the one you want.

    Usually I like Dylan’s versions of his songs best but not that one.”

    I like Richie Havens’ Just Like A Woman above the others, myself.

    Simone owns Just Like Tom Thumbs Blues.

    But, most of the time, I agree, prefer to hear Dylan play with his own words than most anybody else. (The Band aside, of course:)

  111. For songs that make for an awkward car ride with your mom try the album version of The End by The Doors.

  112. at my son’s bar mitzvah…for the obligatory slide show I had them start it with dylan on the obligatory “forever young” and then transitioned to U2 “Walk on” …underrated song…

    chrissie hynde does a good rendition of forever young…

    need some bruce though….

    The highway’s jammed with broken heroes on a last chance power drive
    Everybody’s out on the run tonight but there’s no place left to hide
    Together, Wendy, we can live with the sadness, I’ll love you with all the madness in my soul
    Woah, someday girl, I don’t know when
    We’re gonna get to that place where we really want to go and we’ll walk in the sun
    But till then tramps like us, baby we were born to run

  113. I’d say buying a bootlegged Dire Straits CD during high school definitely helped me become a better appreciator of music.

  114. “Just the flu?”

    Folks you are making it sound like it’s nothing. Flu or influenza is serious sh*t that kills one in a thousand and tens of millions in US get it every year.

    We try to vaccinate people at risk, teach to was hands, stay away from places that are germ cesspools, etc. all great measures and more should be done.

    This strain is highly infectious but there no proof that it’s deadlier. If it’s not deadlier, then we have overblown it by a factor of 1000.

  115. pepper: for the obligatory slide show I had them start it with dylan on the obligatory “forever young”

    I played and sang this at a funeral service for a dear friend who would kick all of your sorry asses with her ferocious dignity. Hardest song I ever did in public, mostly sobs and choking up.

  116. Dylan’s the GOAT for sure. Listening to all the different versions of tangled up in blue is just crazy. He completely rewrites the song every time he plays it. The guy can squeeze more out of one song than anybody. The blood on the tracks version is perfect but it’s cool hearing what he does with it on real live. The version on the 75 live bootleg is amazing too

  117. I manage a supermarket in Ct and it’s been a rough few weeks. Employees have been absolutely incredible throughout the whole mess. Most of them make less than 12 bucks an hour and have honestly been through some shit (while putting there own health at risk)

    Today the company announced that they were going to give everyone an extra 2 bucks an hour going forward. It was a good day!

  118. There is no denying that this virus is a somewhat more lethal version of the flu. What makes it so potentially deadly is the lack of a vaccine and lack of residual immunity from prior similar viruses, hence the “novel” moniker. The typical flu season without a vaccine or residual immunity would probably not be all that much less problematic.

    But who cares? If circumstances are all that make this virus demand the extreme measures we are taking, semantical arguments about whether it’s inherently more deadly than the flu or not are not relevant. It’s all about saving folks who wouldn’t die during a typical flu season. This shit could go all logarithmic on our collective asses and all hell could break loose in our hospitals.

    I have a kid with asthma who gets a flu shot every year to not potentially wind up on a respirator. Fucking scary.

  119. a classic…green day did a good cover of this one…

    As soon as you’re born they make you feel small
    By giving you no time instead of it all
    ‘Til the pain is so big you feel nothing at all

    A working class hero is something to be
    A working class hero is something to be

    They hurt you at home and they hit you at school
    They hate you if you’re clever and they despise a fool
    ‘Til you’re so fucking crazy you can’t follow their rules

    A working class hero is something to be
    A working class hero is something to be

    When they’ve tortured and scared you for 20 odd years
    Then they expect you to pick a career
    When you can’t really function, you’re so full of fear

    A working class hero is something to be
    A working class hero is something to be

    Keep you doped with religion, and sex, and T.V.
    And you think you’re so clever and classless and free
    But you’re still fucking peasants as far as I can see

    A working class hero is something to be
    A working class hero is something to be

    There’s room at the top they are telling you still
    But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
    If you want to be like the folks on the hill

    A working class hero is something to be
    A working class hero is something to be

    If you want to be a hero well just follow me
    If you want to be a hero well just follow me

  120. Taupin wrote some great lyrics, and Elton played and sang the shit out of them. What a combo.

    Two of the great lyrical rock albums of all time are Bowie’s Ziggy Stardust and Tull’s Aqualung. Lady Stardust is a towerinng masterpiece, even more so given the homophobic climate of the day. Every song on Aqualung crushes it.

  121. I’m actually going on a podcast about Dylan pretty soon (each episode talks about a different Dylan song). We’re going to talk “It Takes a Lot to Laugh, It Takes a Train to Cry.” If anyone has any thoughts about that one, maybe I’ll work it in there (in its original version, when it was called “Phantom Engineer,” it was the closing song in Dylan’s iconic “gone electric” set at the Newport Folk Festival).

  122. Fetch: I manage a supermarket in Ct and it’s been a rough few weeks. Employees have been absolutely incredible throughout the whole mess. Most of them make less than 12 bucks an hour and have honestly been through some shit (while putting there own health at risk)

    Today the company announced that they were going to give everyone an extra 2 bucks an hour going forward. It was a good day!

    Great story.

  123. this is some good reading :)

    okay, my personal fave opening verse:
     i got a sixty-nine Chevy with a 396
    Fuelie heads and a Hurst on the floor
    She’s waiting tonight down in the parking lot
    Outside the Seven-Eleven store
    Me and my partner Sonny built her straight out of scratch
    And he rides with me from town to town
    We only run for the money got no strings attached
    We shut ’em up and then we shut ’em down

    there’s another verse later in the song though that always touches me a bit more:

    I met her on the strip three years ago
    In a Camaro with this dude from L.A.
    I blew that Camaro off my back and drove that little girl away
    But now there’s wrinkles around my baby’s eyes
    And she cries herself to sleep at night
    When I come home the house is dark
    She sighs “Baby did you make it all right”
    She sits on the porch of her daddy’s house
    But all her pretty dreams are torn
    She stares off alone into the night
    With the eyes of one who hates for just being born
    For all the shut down strangers and hot rod angels
    Rumbling through this promised land
    Tonight my baby and me we’re gonna ride to the sea
    And wash these sins off our hands

  124. If it’s not deadlier, then we have overblown it by a factor of 1000.

    your beliefs and thoughts are your business and choice…think about what is actually taking place throughout the world in terms of healthcare…

    I realize you are not alone in what you think…the challenge there being we’re all stuck on the same planet…

    what’s happening to health care systems around the world has got nothing to do with anything but this virus…this thing was never going to be anything but what it has become…

    oh well…see the world as you wish…

  125. alright..last one…going to pass out on the couch now…

    I hear the train a comin’
    It’s rolling round the bend
    And I ain’t seen the sunshine since I don’t know when
    I’m stuck in Folsom prison, and time keeps draggin’ on
    But that train keeps a rollin’ on down to San Antone

    When I was just a baby my mama told me
    “Son, always be a good boy, don’t ever play with guns”
    But I shot a man in Reno just to watch him die
    When I hear that whistle blowing, I hang my head and cry

    I bet there’s rich folks eating in a fancy dining car
    They’re probably drinkin’ coffee and smoking big cigars
    Well I know I had it coming, I know I can’t be free
    But those people keep a movin’
    And that’s what tortures me

    Well if they freed me from this prison
    If that railroad train was mine
    I bet I’d move it on a little farther down the line
    Far from Folsom prison, that’s where I want to stay
    And I’d let that lonesome whistle blow my blues away

  126. “Dylan’s the GOAT for sure. Listening to all the different versions of tangled up in blue is just crazy… The blood on the tracks version is perfect but it’s cool hearing what he does with it on real live.”

    Dylan recorded all of Blood on the Tracks with just guitar and bass in New York. He then went to Minnesota and re-arranged them with his brother (hence the title). What he created is, to me, the greatest album ever. But the crazy thing is that if he had never re-arranged the songs and had just released the original minimalist album, it STILL would be my favorite album ever. The songs are that fucking good.

  127. It Takes a Lot to Laugh, It Takes a Train to Cry is one of several throw-away blues riffs off of Highway 61 Revisited that I glossed over when I started devouring Dylan back in high school. It wasn’t until I saw the Allmans sing it with Tom Petty and Bruce Willis (on harmonica) at the Greek theater in 2009 that I realized the song had concert staple potential. (But it takes a special group of musicians to pull that off:)

    Cool that you’re doing a whole show devoted to it, Brian. Interested to see what you come up with!

  128. But now there’s wrinkles around my baby’s eyes
    And she cries herself to sleep at night
    When I come home the house is dark
    She sighs “Baby did you make it all right”
    <<<<<>>>

    When Springsteen met Ron Kovic at a motel in Phoenix, he left him the Darkness album with a note attached: “if this album can affect you half as much as your book affected me, I’ll have done my job.”

    Not sure if he affected Kovic that much or not, but he affected everybody else!

  129. This is probably heretical but I don’t really like Dylan. That’s probably because my dad used to listen to the same five Dylan songs on loop all day with the volume cranked to the max, but his voice is just like nails on a chalkboard to me.

  130. you all are like that old vh1 behind the music series…

    there’s always so much more than what you know…

    very cool to learn more about stuff you really love a lot…

  131. “This is probably heretical but I don’t really like Dylan.“

    I totally respect this opinion, and I wouldn’t force him on anyone. In fact, if I’d have come to him as an adult, I probably wouldn’t have been as deeply influenced by him, because my ear had changed and I had started listening to black singers and tone and control started to matter :)

    In fact, ill call your Dylan and match you with this: I don’t care for the Beatles in the least. They do nothing for me. (Ack!)

  132. When i was younger i respected Dylan’s writing but thought that other artists were covering his songs better than his originals.
    Byrds, The Band, Hendrix, Neil Young, Guns N Roses and Manfred Mann’s Earth band had played their part on that belief by making great covers of some of his top ones.
    Plus the fact that i was more into rock than blues and folk.
    Especially the track “Father of night” by Manfred Mann’s Earth Band had become a 10 minutes Prog Rock Classic and probably the band’s most famous one.
    Hadn’t listen to the original until recently when a cd copy of Dylan’s album New Morning fell to my hands.
    Dylan’s version is 1min and 28″.
    And…
    It’s A fkn Beast!
    A gospel one. And i ain’t a fan of the genre.
    Melodically Powerful and Lyrically open to interpretations.
    It instantly became my fave Dylan track.

  133. Conor McPherson’s new musical, Girl From the North Country, uses a bunch of Dylan’s New Morning tunes, which makes sense, since Dylan started that album as a musical originally (I believe “Father of Night,” “Sign on the Window” and…one more track are from the musical, which was going to be about the Devil and Daniel Webster. I don’t think it was “Went to See the Gypsy”…or maybe it was? Perhaps it was “New Morning” itself?).

    It’s a decent show (jukebox musicals are never going to be that good, but it comes as close as you can get).

  134. But the crazy thing is that if he had never re-arranged the songs and had just released the original minimalist album, it STILL would be my favorite album ever. The songs are that fucking good.

    I prefer the New York versions of pretty much all the songs, and I actually think “Blood On The Tracks” would have been even better if it was just those versions.

    The other thing that’s crazy about that album is that it’s in a very specific melodic space, there are a lot of songs in the key of E and he uses the same voicings on a lot of the songs. Like he uses the A over B chord a lot on this album as a passing chord, he does it on several songs.

    This was the only album he wrote in this particular harmonic/melodic universe, and as a result it’s like a real outlier in his career. It’s such a specific little sound world. It’s even more obvious when you hear just the NYC versions.

  135. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ9KIO1eXTA

    Got it from another forum, a Harvard talk summarized by original poster below:
    Notes from Dr. Xihong Lin’s talk on Wuhan’s strategy to combat corona
    Lockdown with traffic ban and home quarantine changed R0 from 3.88 to 1.25, but that’s not enough.
    Family to family transmissions still occurred
    Infected cases couldn’t seek care because of the traffic ban
    Stay at home was hard to enforce because people were allowed to go grocery shopping, which allowed them to infected others
    Here, if you’re infected, you will get the people you live with sick, and if you try to get help (go to doctor, go to pharmacy, etc), you can infect everyone along the way
    Solution: Centralized Quarantine [Suppression]
    Take all people that are sick or presumed sick, and move them out of home/away from family
    Test positive -> go to new field hospital
    Suspected cases -> go to designated hotels
    Have fever -> go to designated hotels
    Close contact with confirmed cases -> go to hotel or dorm
    If any of these groups go from unconfirmed to confirmed, move to the field hospitals
    Move from field hospital -> standard hospital if they need ICU treatment
    Timely medical care prevented mild cases from being severe.
    For everyone else: Stay at home, government handles grocery delivery.
    Free housing for healthcare workers so they are isolated from general population
    R0=0.33.
    60% of infected cases not ascertained, often asymptomatic, still infectious. [wuhan had a shortage of testing kits as well]
    Workers went door to door to find all suspected individuals.
    Healthcare workers are by far the most vulnerable group at risk of infection, highlighting the need for the proper protective gear.
    Tufts university is preparing dorm rooms to contribute to house people here [preparing for central quarantine, or just off-loading some patients?]
    As of March 16, all patients are out of field hospitals
    As of March 18, no new cases in Hubei

  136. For songs that make for an awkward car ride with your mom try the album version of The End by The Doors.

    I remember being in the car with my mom and NIN “Closer” came on the radio, and I said, “oh, this song is pretty great.” That got real awkward.

  137. No one’s talking about later Dylan stuff! Time Out of Mind is one of my favorite albums. Love and Theft, Tempest and Modern Times all have at least a handful of good songs… Here’s my personal top 10 (in no particular order) of the last 25 years for Dylan:

    * Things Have Changed
    * Workingman’s Blues #2
    * Roll on John
    * Make You Feel my Love
    * Tempest
    * Must Be Santa
    * It’s All Good
    * Cold Irons Bound
    * Mississippi
    * Highlands

  138. good stuff joinone…whoa, that’s the solution huh, not just “stay at home”, but, process the population…saw they’ee setting that up now in washington state…

    sounds like wise words to be sure…

    holy cow…kind of sounds like we may be behind…yeah, probably should have set up manufacturing, distribution and processing locations a while back…

    uncle sam takes care of food distribution…

    that’s going to be a challenge to get to that level of “organization” in a very short period of time…

    changed R0 from 3.88 to 1.25

    – what does that mean?

  139. Went to see the Gypsy is about him meeting Elvis for the first (only?) time.

    Yeah, that’s precisely why I assume it probably wasn’t one of the songs from the musical. ;) But then I figured, “I don’t get how ‘New Morning’ fits with a musical about the Devil and Daniel Webster, either.”

  140. No one’s talking about later Dylan stuff! Time Out of Mind is one of my favorite albums. Love and Theft, Tempest and Modern Times all have at least a handful of good songs… Here’s my personal top 10 (in no particular order) of the last 25 years for Dylan:

    “Not Dark Yet” is one of my favorite Dylan songs period.

    I also dig how there are, like, five versions of “Mississippi” and they’re all good in their own way.

  141. – what does that mean?

    How many people get sick based on each sick person they come into contact with (3.88 means that roughly 4 other people get sick for every 1 new sick person). You want to get it under 1. Once you do that, you mostly have it under control.

  142. that’s bc…

    I wonder what the Ebola after action “playbook” looked like…can’t imagine it was this…I feel for these governors…what a job at such a critical time in history…

    thank god for doctors birx and fauci standing up there and telling the truth…

    I know there’s a lot of good people working really hard in DC, but damn are we getting fucked at the top…

    haven’t checked, but, I wonder how much involvement of the military was necessary in south korea and china to get a handle on the situation…

    it feels like there’s some kind of timer going off, just not sure what it is…guess that depends where you are though…

  143. From what I’ve seen, there are some military involvement. Military doctors took control of several hospitals as they were overwhelmed. Some field hospitals too. They probably helped with food supply and patient transfer once the city was locked down.
    Locking down communities was mostly social workers and local police though.
    If the situation gets to that point I presume the US military could be relied on.

  144. >>Strat, are you into Curtis Mayfield’s playing? He kind of invented that “Little Wing” style of chord comping.<<

    I haven't heard any of it that I'm aware of. That will give something to do this weekend. Thanks.

  145. JK47:
    Dylan can do so many different things with lyrics. He has to be the GOAT lyricist just in terms of sheer volume of quality.

    Leonard Cohen at his best was untouchable though. For sheer poetry and imagery I’d give him the nod over Dylan. Had a much shorter peak though, and didn’t have Dylan’s incredible versatility.

    Lou Reed is also on my lyricist Mount Rushmore. Not sure who would be the fourth.

    Does Bowie get a look for that fourth spot or am I just basic?

  146. pepper:
    my dad and his buddies would hang out in the basement listening to floyd and either eat shrooms or drop acid an and smoke weed or some combination of the above and I didn’t realize to later on why there were all so happy listening to that strange music….

    I have that scheduled for quarantine day 10. Can’t wait.

  147. My biggest problem with self quarantine hasn’t been boredom. I guess I miss my long walks around the neighborhood, but not much else yet. It’s my nerves. I have all this time and some ideas, but I can’t sit still and concentrate on anything. I could easily be playing my guitar trying to learn new licks, binge watching “Better Call Saul”, doing some horse racing database work etc.. but I can’t. When things were normal I wished I had more times for that. Now I have the time but my body, nerves, and mind won’t cooperate.

  148. Good lyrics thread.

    But where’s the Don Fagen love? I’d put the best of Fagen/Steely Dan up there with any another of the great songwriters. Nobody threads the needle between heartbreak humor like he does.

    ‘Black Friday’ has been my anthem these past 2 weeks.

  149. >I read about half of Black Swan years ago and Nassim Taleb may be great at math but he is also fucking idiot.<

    He has even worse interpersonal skills than our president does with the media.

    The math is obviously way over my head.

    I try to look past the way he treats people because I think he has very important things to say. From what I gather, it was a paper he sent to DC that contributed to closing off China early when Trump was getting advised by WHO and the "intellectual yet idiots" (that's a Taleb joke) that what was going on in China posed no threat to the US. He was also publicly clamoring for other strong actions related to closing off the Europe, schools etc.. earlier than anyone else I saw. He was saying it in January.

    He basically probably is the smartest guy in the room when it comes to understanding the mathematics behind risks like these.

    So imo, you have to put up with the extreme arrogance and crude behavior just to get the right answer.

  150. “however, the only story that really matters at the moment is the one that bob shared a week ago about his friend succumbing to this virus…that’s not hype…”

    Definitely not hype if you get ill.

    When John Brennan died 10 days or so before that he was at a party with 27 people at the Fusco family. The mother died, two sons (Carmine and Vinny) died and daughter Maria is at deaths door. two others are in the hospital and I know not of their condition.

    So….. it is easily transmissible through casual contact or close proximity. And if you get it there is a fair chance you are fucked. The fusco boys were around 50 and big kids that were healthy as horses working outside all their lives. They had no underlying health problems. I sold my last racehorse to Carmine when I retired from horse racing in 2017.

    As I said 10 days ago, the ONLY thing to do is go full Issac Newton and close yourself off from every human on the planet. I haven’t been out of the house for 17 days and I finally convinced my wife to do the same 10 days ago.

    Publix still delivers to homes so I’ve got a 3 weeks supply of food in house and a month’s supply of lentils and olive oil in case of the zombie apocalypse.

    I recommend y’all do the same.

    And don’t touch money….. use only your own plastic.

  151. >And don’t touch money….. use only your own plastic.<

    The few times I was forced to use cash and got change I washed the money and change when I got home and went as far as spraying the inside of my pockets with Lysol.

    At a large family gathering there was bound to be a lot of hugging, kissing, hand shaking etc.. So if Brennan was coughing or sneezing at all, it was going to be a major problem because he probably engaged in one of those activities with every person there. Some of the sneezes and coughs had to be in close proximity to others. Maybe he even shared the same car with a few driving to the party. A few were destined to get infected.

    What's strange to me is that his family seems to have been hit especially hard in terms of the severeness of the illness and death toll.

    It's hard to understand all the official data because things like symptoms and deaths are trailing actual infections and the rates are also dependent on knowing how many people were infected but remained asymptomatic.

    However, when you look at all the known celebrities and sports figures that have tested positive (including Tom Hanks and his wife), they are not all young athletes, but they seem to be fine.

    The patient zero at the conservative convention was supposedly shaking hands and doing selfies with a lot of people. I think a few came back positive, but I haven't heard of any serious illnesses or deaths.

    This is a wild intuitive guess from the guy that knows nothing about this field, but it would not shock me if there are multiple strains or that certain genetic attributes determine how likely you are to get very sick and die over above age, existing health condition, etc.. I saw one article out of China that suggested blood type might be an issue. People with O blood were doing better. Certain things like that would tend to run in families.

  152. >There is a screen in the middle of the RCP home page showing world wide mortality and any objective person would say we are doing quite well relative to almost every other country:<

    I've been tracking some data myself to keep my mind occupied (perhaps a bad idea).

    Our death rate is very low relative to total confirmed infections so far, but we have a huge backload of "not recovered yet" relative to some countries that are ahead of us in the curve because we are just ramping up testing. So there may eventually be a spike in deaths as the data catches up and some of our sick people lose their battle. Also, we have no reached the Italy stage where we are running out of hospital beds, ICU beds, and needed medical equipment to keep the very sick alive. If we get to that point where hard choices are being made based on age and general health like in Italy, that will spike the death rate also.

    There are military medical ships destined for NY and CA with 1000 beds that can do surgeries and other serious medical care etc.. for non corona patients. That will ease the problems as the hospitals. But it takes time to maintain and staff them. It will take about 3 weeks for them to get to their destinations. They can't get here fast enough.

    That said, it's still encouraging that the death rate is low in the US so far.

  153. 3M
    @3M
    To fight #COVID19 & support healthcare workers, we have doubled our global output of N95 respirators to an annual rate of over 1.1 billion per year, or nearly 100 million per month. Read more: https://bit.ly/396lRgR

  154. Stratomatic: Frequently wrong, but never in doubt:
    My biggest problem with self quarantine hasn’t been boredom.I guess I miss my long walks around the neighborhood, but not much else yet.It’s my nerves.I have all this time and some ideas, but I can’t sit still and concentrate on anything.I could easily be playing my guitar trying to learn new licks, binge watching “Better Call Saul”, doing some horse racing database work etc.. but I can’t. When things were normal I wished I had more times for that. Now I have the time but my body, nerves, and mind won’t cooperate.

    Have you ever listened to Alan Watts? You might enjoy him. Here’s a starting point (ignore the silly title of the link… it says “how to never worry again”, but everyone worries; it’s more about how to let worry pass without harm or damage):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CmgzjJMzTY

    As for the answer to “but how do I quiet my mind?”, it takes practice. I like to recommend the headspace app for those who have never practiced meditation. Try the basic (free) version, and if you can stick with one exercise to its completion, the premium version is worth the upgrade.

  155. Our death rate is very low relative to total confirmed infections so far, but we have a huge backload of “not recovered yet” relative to some countries that are ahead of us in the curve because we are just ramping up testing.

    There’s a lot more around that too. We don’t have a good death count for the US. CV kills via secondary infections like pneumonia for a lot of people. Lack of testing means plenty of folks outside the recognized hotspots could have died early on and been missed. And we’re nowhere near an accurate count on confirmed cases, we just can’t test enough people.

    Also the death rate isn’t the top line figure here. It’s the big things we don’t know, number infected and rate of spread. We’ve been lucky so far – the people around the first cases here mostly self-quarantined, as opposed to say SK where they tried to hide and act like nothing had happened. But we’re finally starting to get testing capability ramped up and our new cases curve looks worse than everyone else’s did at this point. The headline numbers should be scale of infections and rate of transmission – those are the forward looking projectors – and we simply do not have the data yet.

    We’re also not doing much to limit the spread beyond voluntary and state-based measures which is silly. We should have temperature monitoring of all passengers at airports like every other country of means has, but nope! There’s a whole list of shit like this that we’re not doing.

    There are military medical ships destined for NY and CA with 1000 beds that can do surgeries and other serious medical care etc.. for non corona patients.

    There’s one moored in Brooklyn now. They’re waiting for actual orders that let them do shit.

  156. Kenny Rogers died yesterday. He had some good songs.

    Leonard Cohen at his best was untouchable though. For sheer poetry and imagery I’d give him the nod over Dylan. Had a much shorter peak though, and didn’t have Dylan’s incredible versatility.

    I don’t really think of Dylan as being versatile, but then I don’t actually like Dylan and it all kinda sounds the same to me so.. Cohen’s peak wasn’t all that short, but his ratio of hit to filler is not so great.

  157. I guess I miss my long walks around the neighborhood, but not much else yet.

    Unless you’re in state-mandated lockdown or trying to walk down a congested city street, there’s no reason you can’t go on a walk while maintaining a healthy distance from other people.

  158. New Lyrics from a Chinese blog. They go to the tune of Bohemian Rhapsody

    Covidian Rhapsody

    Is this a real cough
    Is this just half a sneeze
    Tired of this lockdown still no
    Covid-19 vaccine
    Don’t touch your eyes
    Just hand sanitize and breathe

    I’m just a young teen
    I need no quarantine
    Cuz I’m feeling good
    Feeling fine
    Not immune compromised
    Everywhere the planes go
    Everybody splatters on me
    On me

    Mama, just killed a man
    Didn’t stay inside my bed
    Walked right by him now he’s dead
    Mama, Covid’s just begun
    Gonna leave a million dead by end of run

    Mama, oo-oo-oo-ooh
    Didn’t mean to make them die
    If I’m not back in bed this time tomorrow
    Carried on, carried on
    Cuz everybody splatters

    Too late, my fever’s come
    Sends symptoms down my spine
    Lungs are coughing all the time
    Goodbye everybody, I’ve got the flu
    Should have stayed inside my bed and rode it through

    Wuhan, flu-u-u-u
    I don’t wanna die
    Sometimes wish I’d never been out at all

    I see a spittle spill-oo out-oo of a man
    Got a sploosh, got a sploosh
    Didn’t cover with his elbow
    Send out an expectorant
    Spray with disinfectant now

    Gotta lay low (gotta lay low)
    Gotta lay low (gotta lay low)
    Gotta lay low if I go (don’t let me go oh oh oh)

    I’m just a poor boy, nobody helps me
    He’s just a poor boy, from a rich country though
    Sell him his drugs for quadruple the quote

    Dizzy head, queasy cough, will you let me live
    No health care
    No we will not let you live (let him live)
    No health care
    We will not let you live (let me live)
    No health care
    We will not let you live (let me live)
    Never let you live (let me live)
    Never, never, never let you live
    Oh oh oh oh oh oh oh
    No no no no no

    Oh my corona my corona (my corona let him live)
    The CDC has a vaccine set aside for me, for me, for me

    Only you can prevent this from spreading too wide
    Only you can prevent this by staying inside
    Oh baby, can’t go out tonight, baby
    Just gotta stay in
    Just gotta…

  159. This is probably heretical but I don’t really like Dylan. That’s probably because my dad used to listen to the same five Dylan songs on loop all day with the volume cranked to the max, but his voice is just like nails on a chalkboard to me.

    I think Pink Floyd, Frank Zappa and King Crimson were wildly talented acts and I also have no desire to ever voluntarily listen to them

  160. Hubert,

    Thanks.

    I joined a Queens public library guided meditation club a few months ago and loved it. Unfortunately, that’s cancelled now. I also used some of the Youtube guided meditation videos and like them also. But they seem to have a shelf life for me. If I listen to the same one more than “x” times, I eventually can’t focus at all and my mind continues racing. So I have to keep switching up looking for a new one I like. The woman at the library was a little “out there” if you know what I mean, but she was really good.

  161. I asked Mrs. Z-man for her greatest song lyrics ever. She thought for a second and came up with “The Impossible Dream.” Pretty hard to top that one.

  162. Songs of Love and Hate came on my machine’s album shuffle yesterday, hadn’t listen to that in years. Some really great songs on that one. Are they any other songs about the love between a fire and the woman being burned at the stake?

  163. >Unless you’re in state-mandated lockdown or trying to walk down a congested city street, there’s no reason you can’t go on a walk while maintaining a healthy distance from other people.<

    NY is in a lockdown, but going out on walks is OK. My girlfriend tells me it's OK every day when she comes back from her walk and I attack her and the doorknobs with Lysol. lmao

    I used to walk 2-3 miles every a day, even in the cold weather. I would have no problem keeping a healthy distance in my neighborhood now. It just feels like every time I go out I might be taking some infinitesimal risk I don't know about yet.

    My only trips out in the last 2 weeks were for extra groceries, a trip to the bank for extra cash (both 2 weeks ago), 2 trips to an almost empty laundromat early this week so I zero dirty clothes, and a quick in and out to an empty post office yesterday to mail a letter (10 seconds). I also went out to my car to just start and run it a little. I always went out with disposable rubber gloves and Lysol wipes.

    I'm not in the best of ways mentally right now and I'm coming from a less than ideal starting point. lol

  164. so, I’ve replaced espn with all these different news channels…I try to make it a point to check through each…

    I’m always amazed by just how crazy america one news (AON) is…I keep expecting alfred e. neuman to show up on screen…

    had forgotten just how much I love rachel maddows…what a crazy sharp person she is…anderson cooper is alright, but, really a big fan of don lemon…dude is just so smooth and relaxed…

    chris cuomo can be painfully preachy at times – but, him and his brother are such new yorkers it’s comforting to hear their voices…

    trying to see whom on fox is the most reasonable…it’s tough to watch though, a lot of their guests are just way over the top…

    I like watching the bbc feed…it always strikes me how visually different the cameras/broadcast look…I like hearing the different accents and watch a less US politically biased show…

    i bring all this up to say – i can’t take my eyes off of fredricka whitfield’s neck, forget today’s briefing…lord but that woman has a sexy neck…

    This ain’t no party, this ain’t no disco,
    This ain’t no fooling around
    No time for dancing, or lovey dovey,
    I ain’t got time for that now

  165. Yesterday our crawlspace dehumidifier was serviced (I made the appointment over a month ago). When I went out to greet the guy, he reached out his hand. I was surprised and hesitated, but shook it, then when I went inside, I immediately washed my hands with soap and water. When he was finished under the house and I went back outside to pay, he reached out his hand again. Same deal.

    The more I think about it, the more annoyed I’m getting. Shouldn’t businesses be instructing employees dealing with the public to NOT make physical contact?

  166. >>Shouldn’t businesses be instructing employees dealing with the public to NOT make physical contact?<<

    IMO, YES!

    And I would advise that next time you not worry about what anyone says or thinks when you refuse to shake their hand. I'd explain the risk.

  167. Strat,
    May I recommend two things that I have been doing:
    1. Every day I do a 5 mile run ( more like an Eddie Curry rumble) on Randall’s Island while listening to music. Even with a 20 % increase in human traffic, it is easy to avoid human contact. The exercise releases endorphins, which combats depression and anxiety. It also diverts my mind from CoVid-19. From a risk-reward perspective, it is an easy decision.
    2. I hate talking on the phone, but since I have been isolated at home, I have taken to calling at least one person, who I have not spoken to in a while ( in some cases 10 years). Since most of us are stuck at home, everyone I have called so far is very appreciative. We have the types of conversations one would have in a bar or restaurant and try to steer clear of the pandemic and stick to topics that make us both laugh. IMO it is important to socialize even if it’s not face to face.

    IMO, the absence of sports to divert our attention from the events in our lives that are negative in nature makes it even more important that we find something to keep us from perseverating on the virus. To that end, this site is part of my own self-therapy. The depth of knowledge and sophistication across so many areas makes this the best read on the internet right now.

  168. I’m not in the best of ways mentally right now and I’m coming from a less than ideal starting point. lol

    actually, the fact that you are self aware enough to recognize the situation – is a really good sign…

    the real issue comes when you reach a level of illness wherein you’re unable to recognize you’re having issues…

    had a skull fracture and brain surgery in my early 20’s…rattled my thoughts and emotions for months – my leg just wouldn’t stop shaking for a long time…I had no clue what was going on for a good while…failed probability and statistics and physics that semester…did do airborne school though the following year…

    during my 30’s my thyroid went kaput and unfortunately got mis-diagnosed 3 times over about a 10 year period (I thought I was experiencing a nervous breakdown)…I just gave up at the end and accepted that this was how I was (basically no working thyroid means your organs go on strike – including your brain)…got lucky while down in Mexico (puerto escondido) on vacation and some vacationing doctor walked up and told me I was ill and that there was something wrong with my kidneys or thyroid…

    yeah, when your mind isn’t quite right, life can get wierd…

    just knowing there’s an issue means you have a good chance at finding a solution…

    which I’m sure you already know…most of those situations will be helped by: physical exertion, mental distraction, spiritual enhancement, medicine, therapy…

    trump just came on, so long fredricka’s neck…time to turn the channel…

  169. Stratomatic: Frequently wrong, but never in doubt:
    >>Shouldn’t businesses be instructing employees dealing with the public to NOT make physical contact?<<

    IMO, YES!

    And I would advise that next time you not worry about what anyone says or thinks when you refuse to shake theirhand. I’d explain the risk.

    Strat, what I wish I would have done is come out to greet him and cough loudly, then see what he’d do. I know he was just try to practice friendly “customer relations,” but…

  170. no clash fan…when dealing with strangers, always best to lead that dance…people are crazy…try your best to not let them spread their insanity…

    I refer to the wit and wisdom of one George Carlin:

    think how dumb the average person is, imagine now that half of them are stupider than that

    DON’T TOUCH ME!!!

    I am a hugger though for those close to me…gonna miss that for a while…

  171. still watching the briefing, thankfully trump has stuck to his script so far…

    I’m not sure why though he likes to hover over the right shoulder of the different speakers…that would annoy the hell out of me…

    I mean what the fuck – are you about to grab my ass or try to steal my wallet or something…back the fuck up please…

  172. I like the way Gov. Cuomo hosts his briefings…everyone sitting down…makes no sense to squeeze everyone on to that tiny space and keep them standing…

  173. I took a long walk around the city the other night starting around 730. It was amazing how desolate it was. I would often go several blocks without seeing another person.

    Definitely ok to take a walk I think as long as you don’t touch anything or talk to anyone.

  174. Anybody right now, and yesterday, anybody that needs a test gets a test. And the tests are beautiful. They are perfect just like the letter was perfect. The transcription was perfect. Right? This was not as perfect as that but pretty good.

  175. I took a long walk around the city the other night starting around 730. It was amazing how desolate it was. I would often go several blocks without seeing another person.

    Definitely ok to take a walk I think as long as you don’t touch anything or talk to anyone.

    trying to imagine what it would have felt like in december to peek just a few months forward through the wormhole and read only this post.

  176. >actually, the fact that you are self aware enough to recognize the situation – is a really good sign…<

    With me it's an anxiety issue. I've had anxiety issues on and off for 15 years (mostly off). 99% of the time it's very mild, lasts a shot time, and gets triggered by work stress or a death in the family.

    I was under incredible stress at work last year. I finally called BS on everything and retired before I actually wanted to. I was in the "recovery period" from that nightmare when I got hit with some other extremely stressful personal issues in January. Now this.

    So basically it's very difficult for me to relax, sleep, concentrate, not overreact, maintain my appetite etc… But as long as I have my meds I won't have a panic attack. When I'm OK, I can go years without any meds, but now is not one of those times for sure. Right now I am under medicated.

  177. I don’t think Trump is that hard to figure out,

    On one level imo Trump thinks it’s his job to prevent people from panicking, giving them faith that he’s handling the problem, and that everything is going to be OK.

    On another level, everyone with an IQ higher than a rock can see he’s full of shit most of the time and that causes less confidence.

    The reality is that he’s dumb, but he’s probably not as dumb as he appears to us.

  178. Strat, when I get stressed sometimes it helps me to step back and think that it’s my job to deal with whatever is stressing me and that the stressful situations is something to be expected and thus not a jolt to my emotional system. It’s like traffic. If I choose to drive into NYC from NJ I know there is going to be traffic, especially at the tunnel. Once I’m just dealing with the traffic and it’s something I expected to have to deal with then it is much less stressful.

  179. On one level imo Trump thinks it’s his job to prevent people from panicking, giving them faith that he’s handling the problem, and that everything is going to be OK.

    This is true, but he’s generally way more focused on optics— making it seem like he’s handling the problem— than in actually handling the problem.

    My friend who works as a healthcare lobbyist in DC says that Trump simply doesn’t listen to experts in the healthcare field, thinks he know everything based on his gut, and simply ignores everything that doesn’t make him look good in some way. Trump missed the window to do something meaningful here because in his gut it wasn’t going to be a big problem, the experts were full of shit, and everything would work out.

    It’s a massive, colossal failure of leadership. Now he has to go into turbo salesman mode and sell everybody on the idea that he took it very seriously all along.

  180. >This is true, but he’s generally way more focused on optics— making it seem like he’s handling the problem— than in actually handling the problem.<

    Absolutely. And that's why so many people can see through him. He's basically President PT Barnum.

  181. “My friend who works as a healthcare lobbyist in DC says that Trump simply doesn’t listen to experts in the healthcare field, thinks he know everything based on his gut, and simply ignores everything that doesn’t make him look good in some way”

    Pardon me for thinking the English translation of this is, “That POS would give my client the “favorable” piece of legislation my industry is used to getting…..

    Give facts not anecdote please.

  182. didn’t trump become a born again disciple of doctor norman vincent peale at one point in his life…

    talk about trying to speak stuff in to existence…

    it comes across as some kind of wierd tic when he does it over and over and over again…

  183. Right now I am under medicated.

    I’ve noticed I’m consuming copious quantities of both cannabis and choc-o-late the last week or so…

    thankfully I’ve been able to lay off the xanax…I have it ready just in case though…

    I need to figure out a way to process what’s going on…cleaning, organizing, reading and watching movies are helping a bit…

    need to take a walk today…no kids this weekend, still debating whether to drive and pickup more edibles today or tomorrow…

    still thinking about the guy yesterday who I asked (shortly before he was about to be sent home) if he had a chance stockpile supplies…

    I asked him like it was a fucking game…his response that he hadn’t the money to do so, and he had no idea what was coming next sure sobered me the fuck up…

  184. If you want to know why the virus spread isn’t under control look at the results of this ABC poll from last Friday (the polling was done 3/11-3/12):

    “But overall, relatively few Americans have changed their behavior since the coronavirus has landed here.

    “Only 3% said they are now working from home due to the coronavirus. And while about one-quarter of Americans said their lives had been disrupted in some way, either by canceling going out to dinner, taking a vacation, or opting to not vote in person, among other options, 73% have not canceled or postponed activities or events in their daily lives.

    This ABC News/Ipsos poll was conducted by Ipsos Public Affairs‘ KnowledgePanel® March 11-12, 2020, in English and Spanish, among a random national sample of 502 adults. ”

    “The fault dear Brutus is not in our stars…. but in ourselves, that we are underlings…” Wm. Shakespeare.

  185. bobneptune: Pardon me for thinking the English translation of this is, “That POS would give my client the “favorable” piece of legislation my industry is used to getting…..

    Translation: “I will self-righteously defend everything Trump says and does no matter how blatantly ignorant, dishonest and self-aggrandizing it is because I hate liberals and fake-news media everything they stand for.”

  186. in the spirit of the lyrics theme…this is what I think when i see these press conferences he gives:

    Day after day
    Alone on a hill
    The man with the foolish grin is keeping perfectly still
    But nobody wants to know him
    They can see that he’s just a fool
    And he never gives an answer
    But the fool on the hill
    Sees the sun going down
    And the eyes in his head
    See the world spinning ’round
    Well on the way
    Head in a cloud
    The man of a thousand voices
    Talking perfectly loud
    But nobody ever hears him
    Or the sound he appears to make
    And he never seems to notice
    But the fool on the hill
    Sees the sun going down
    And the eyes in his head
    See the world spinning ’round
    And nobody seems to like him
    They can tell what he wants to do
    And he never shows his feelings
    But the fool on the hill
    Sees the sun going down
    And the eyes in his head
    See the world spinning ’round
    Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh
    ‘Round and ’round and ’round and ’round and round
    And he never listens to them
    He knows that they’re the fools
    They don’t like him
    The fool on the hill
    Sees the sun going down
    And the eyes in his head
    See the world spinning ’round
    Oh
    Oh

    lennon/McCartney

  187. But they seem to have a shelf life for me. If I listen to the same one more than “x” times, I eventually can’t focus at all and my mind continues racing. So I have to keep switching up looking for a new one I like.

    This is what is good about the headspace app. Endless topics and variations, and they’re cumularive.

    For instance, you may choose a topic like “worrying”, and there’s a 30 day meditation course for it that’s different every day. And then after that you pick a different course. And so on and so on.

  188. My intuition from earlier in the thread may have some merit.

    Nassim Nicholas Taleb
    @nntaleb
    When you hear that the virus killed 4 members of the same family, you can bet that there is something genetic. When you see the family is Italian, something becomes both clearer and scarier.

    Gabish?

    2/ In other words, these people MUST have something in common that makes them susceptible to the virus: 4 is too yuuuge to be dismissed as a coincidence. (Conditional probabilities are low for healthy and young, so a few draws are <10^-4).
    Hidden comorbidity is too explanatory.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/18/nyregion/new-jersey-family-coronavirus.html

  189. So wait, bobneptune says that Trump DOES listen to experts, DOESN’T simply rely on his gut, and IS interested in things that don’t necessarily make him look good?

    Those are some extraordinary claims.

  190. If you want to know why the virus spread isn’t under control look at the results of this ABC poll from last Friday (the polling was done 3/11-3/12):

    Right, it has nothing to do with the Trump Administration’s utter lack of preparation or proactive response once it became clear that this was a potential crisis.

    1/22: “We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China.”

    2/2: “We pretty much shut it down coming in from China. It’s going to be fine.”

    2/24: “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA… Stock Market starting to look very good to me!”

    2/25: “I think that’s a problem that’s going to go away. They have studied it. They know very much. In fact, we’re very close to a vaccine.”

    2/26: “We’re going very substantially down, not up.”

    2/27: “One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear.”

    2/28: “We’re ordering a lot of supplies. We’re ordering a lot of, uh, elements that frankly we wouldn’t be ordering unless it was something like this. But we’re ordering a lot of different elements of medical.”

    3/2: “You take a solid flu vaccine, you don’t think that could have an impact, or much of an impact, on corona?”

    3/6: “I like this stuff. I really get it. People are surprised that I understand it. Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president.”

    3/10: “It will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away.”

    3/13: [declares national emergency]

  191. all we need is to superimpose his face on the army cadet guy in Animal House in the parade scene trying to tell everybody to stay calm…and then circulate that meme…i predict we will not even need to superimpose his face as in about two weeks he will be doing that standing in the street in front of the white house…

  192. Momentary break to talk about that basketball sport thing — regarding Brian’s question about playing in the NBA — nice Duncan Robinson podcast on Ringer (the JJ Redick podcast). Fun to hear about a kid who came from nowhere suddenly successful in the pros. Doesn’t change my mind about whether I could do it (I know I can’t hit 45% from 3, even at my athletic peak, even all by myself in the gym).

    Sad to hear about how good the Miami development program is, though. Sigh.

  193. “Right, it has nothing to do with the Trump Administration’s utter lack of preparation or proactive response once it became clear that this was a potential crisis.”

    Just to ruin your day Jowles:

    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/20/poll-majority-of-americans-now-approve-of-trumps-coronavirus-management-138570

    And I’m curious if Governor Cuomo gets the blame for 2/3rd of all the new C/V cases in America today coming from NYS??????????????????????????????????????????????? Nah……

  194. Yeah, the most depressing thing about this is that it’s going to get Trump re-elected.

    That and having Paw Patrol on in the background. Equally disturbing.

  195. bravo pepper – fool on the hill

    oh man, if he was just a fool (see the second bush) things wouldn’t he so bad…sadly he’s a narcissistic megalomaniac, with no moral compass – at all, who got put in charge..

    the word: public servant is the antithesis of what our current potus is…

  196. “Translation: “I will self-righteously defend everything Trump says and does no matter how blatantly ignorant, dishonest and self-aggrandizing it is because I hate liberals and fake-news media everything they stand for.”

    Well….. let’s just say I’m not assuming anything coming out of a lobbyist’s mouth as factual and unbiased.

    And as to hating liberals (what unadulterated tripe) I’m married to a lifetime ultra liberal Economics professor at CUNY…. sorry about your narrative…..

    While I certainly do not hate liberals…. they sure as hell make me giggle more than occasionally.

    But keep the personal invective flowing instead of looking at facts.

  197. And I’m curious if Governor Cuomo gets the blame for 2/3rd of all the new C/V cases in America today coming from NYS?

    it’s been reported that they are testing more than other regions…hence more known cases…

  198. Just to ruin your day Jowles:

    Yeah, and as a former bandmate once mused, McDonald’s makes the objectively-best cheeseburger because they sell the most of it.

    Hate to break it to you, but you’re an easy fucking mark.

  199. “Day after day
    Alone on a hill
    The man with the foolish grin is keeping perfectly still”

    Well you are certainly right about one thing….. I have been keeping myself perfectly still for the past few weeks. If that turns out to be “foolish” well….. we will find out in the fullness of time.

    I’d rather be proactive and control what I can control in my life rather than piss and moan and blame everyone but myself for my shortcomings.

    Miniver Cheevy, born too late,
    Scratched his head and kept on thinking;
    Miniver coughed, and called it fate,
    And kept on drinking.

  200. those people in that poll were probably the same ones that thought Kevin Knox was a ROY candidate after the two week summer league cuz he dunked on some stiffs…once the real season started …reality settled in…the real season has not started yet dude…once those folks or their families get sick…their tune could change real fast….

  201. I love trump supporters who demand people focus on the facts.

    It’s like Dolan supporters asking people to judge the Knicks success not on wins, but on the chants from the crowd.

  202. ” but you’re an easy fucking mark.”

    You opinion is duly noted…. thanks for adding to the conversation.

  203. “it’s been reported that they are testing more than other regions…hence more known cases…”

    Do we have a citation for that?

    And, of course if you have 8 times the cases of say, Florida, I’m guessing there might be a lot more testing. Chicken or egg?

    Maybe he should have been more aggressive after they had the first outbreak in New Rochelle? Nahhhhhhh….. he’s on team D so he can do no wrong…. but the Orange menace

  204. Yeah, the most depressing thing about this is that it’s going to get Trump re-elected.

    This is definitely the kind of situation that would normally lead to an easy re-election with any other president, what with Americans being desperate for a serious daddy to tell them everything is going to be okay. But Trump is so deeply unserious, and so ridiculously self-regarding and lacking in empathy that it seems inevitable that he’ll fuck it up. Couple days ago he gave a sober speech and the DC brigade were falling all over themselves to declare him ‘presidential’ at last, and the next day he was back to his same old bullshit. It’s not going to be that hard to pin his own incompetence on him.

  205. If Musicphiles Aliens attacked the earth and i were the President of our Planet and had to choose our best music stuff to send to them in order to save the planet I’d definitely choose the Pink Floyd.
    Probably the only band that every earthling but also alien can relate too.
    Intergalactic Eternal stuff.

  206. There is no sense going round and round with this… the pathway is clear…… use the nuclear Issac Newton strategy and minimize you exposure to other humans as close to zero as your circumstances allow until some medical breakthrough occurs.

    I may drop dead a week from next coming Tuesday from this but I have dominion over my own life and I’m going to do what I think is best and not waste an erg of energy on non-productive crap.

    There will be plenty of chance to extract revenge on Lord orange the first Tuesday in November…..Just get the Xanax ready when you are disappointed once again.

  207. Do we have a citation for that? And, of course if you have 8 times the cases of say, Florida, I’m guessing there might be a lot more testing. Chicken or egg?

    The thing to note here is that bob neither seeks out information nor does he recall it once he’s acquired it. The rest of us are all aware of the shortage of tests, and that much of the blame for that lies with the administration who refused the blueprint from the WHO when it was offered back in January, and failed to use gov resources, namely but not exclusively the CDC, to ramp up testing capability because “more numbers will make me look bad” – that’s a quote from Trump. We all know this. Bob has seen this information, but ignores and dismisses it. He focuses on the metrics that put a rose-colored shine on the situation, so that his revered authoritarian figure looks better. Namely, death rates, which appear low. Nevermind that we don’t know what the death rates are for anywhere outside of China and South Korea and the chinese numbers are suspect. Nevermind that we don’t even have an accurate death count for the US since we didn’t have enough tests to check everyone dying of what was potentially covid-19. The numbers are low, some would say perfect.

    NY cases are exploding, because we’ve finally started to get the testing capability ramped up. NY has run 45,437 tests, out of 182,697 nationwide. Over half of those tests have happened in the last few days. 10,356 postitive cases, out of 23,203 nationwide. I think there was a press conference with higher numbers, but there are the most recent published ones.

  208. That’s a pretty cool presidential one!
    By The Psychedelic Furs
    President Gas

    You have to have a party
    When you’re in a state like this
    You can really move it all
    You have to vote and change
    You have to get right out of it
    Like out of all this mess
    You’ll say yeah to anything
    If you believe all this but
    Don’t cry, don’t do anything
    No lies, back in the government
    No tears, party time is here again
    President gas is up for president
    Line up, put your kisses down
    Say yeah, say yes again
    Stand up, there’s a head count
    President gas on everything but roller skates
    It’s sick the price of medicine
    Stand up, we’ll put you on your feet again
    Open up your eyes
    Just to check that your asleep again
    President gas is president gas again
    He comes in from the left sometimes
    He comes in from the right
    It’s so heavily advertised that he wants you and I
    It’s a real cowboy set, electric company
    Every day is happy days
    It’s hell without the sin, but
    Don’t cry, don’t do anything
    No lies, back in the government
    No tears, party time is here again
    President gas is up for president
    Line up, put your kisses down
    Say yeah, say yes again
    Stand up, there’s a head count
    President gas on everything but roller skates
    It’s sick the price of medicine
    Stand up, we’ll put you on your feet again
    Open up your eyes just to check that your asleep again
    President gas is president gas again
    President gas
    Oh, president gas
    Whoa, president gas
    Oh, president gas
    Whoa, president gas
    Oh, president gas
    Whoa, president gas

  209. Which is a whole other thing: we don’t even have particularly accurate numbers within the US right now, mostly because there’s been no coordinated response on the federal level. Trump fired most of the experts and replaced them with sycophants.

    Here’s another fun thing: my friend just flew into JFK this afternoon, on what was the last Emirates flight apparently. He’s been in South East Asia for the last few weeks. Every airport he’s been through has had temperature screening at the arrival gate and before your allowed into the terminal, and they quarantine people with fevers for testing. Except in the US, where they don’t check temps, don’t check where you’ve actually been, just wave you on through with the standard questions. But sure, Trump shut the borders and kept us all safe. GTFO.

  210. Bob,

    I read an article about a Louisiana couple who thought that the virus scare was basically fake news or some sort of plot until the husband got the virus and had to go to the hospital. Then they believed it. The wife reluctantly posted the news on Facebook and then their friends and community (their church group I think) also changed their minds and also believed the virus is a real threat. If a person thinks the virus news is fake and the threat tremendously overblown then there is a good chance they think Trump is handling the situation well. Since most of the country probably hasn’t come in contact with actual cases yet, your político link isn’t totally surprising. But it’s very depressing. If we have to wait for everyone to actually know someone sick for them to believe then it’s going to be very very bad. The time to prepare for disaster is before it happens. We’ve had ample warning, and the president has way more information available to him than to us. The senate had more information too. Some senators sold stock and bought shares related to elearning and saved themselves from losing a lot of money, but did they do anything to argue with Trump about the virus? No! It makes me really angry. If you like that kind of leadership I just can’t understand it.

  211. Do we have a citation for that?

    One of the links posted earlier (from Politico) shows cases tested and numbers of positive tests by state. NY has tested over 45,000 people, Washington State is next with 23,000 and after California with 12,000 tests conducted and all the other states with less. So yes there is a citation.

  212. bobneptune: And as to hating liberals (what unadulterated tripe) I’m married to a lifetime ultra liberal Economics professor at CUNY…. sorry about your narrative…..

    Whatever “arrangement” you have with your wife is your business. I only know you through your posts here, and the shoe I described fits you like a moccasin. Wear it with pride, asshole!

  213. South Korea is on the same timeline as us, they got their first cases at the same time, but they took it seriously, got a testing program together quickly, and their healthcare system didn’t get overwhelmed.

    That probably ain’t gonna happen here. But hey, some people still believe in Mr. “I Take No Responsibility.” What a fine leader. The buck stops elsewhere. The tests are perfect. Like a miracle it will all go away.

    It must be exhausting trying to defend that flaccid blob of Velveeta.

  214. And I’m curious if Governor Cuomo gets the blame for 2/3rd of all the new C/V cases in America today coming from NYS??????????????????????????????????????????????? Nah……

    It’s definitely donald Trump’s fault that Cuomo waited til yesterday to order people to work from home. Also Trump’s fault that this city’s bars and restaurants were overrun with people Friday, Saturday, and Sunday *after* a national emergency was declared. Everything is the president’s fault, we get it. No one else is responsible for their actions. We need the president of the US to tell us what to do in an emergency.

  215. For the record, I believe that deBlasio and Cuomo were both unforgivably slow on the draw. Nowhere near as slow as Trump, though. The quotes THCJ listed are not fabricated, not emanating from a liberal lobbyist, not even representative of his corrupt inner circle’s advice. They encapsulate the world as he, alone, saw it at that time, and he owns each and every word.

  216. People do listen to the President and he did say all the things quoted above. It’s his job to provide leadership and he did it in the wrong direction at first. It’s also his job to run the federal government too, and the CDC seems to have been run so badly that state governors are looking outside the country for help. If he says one thing first and another thing second it’s not surprising people aren’t taking the threat seriously.

  217. It is indeed possible that Trump is a truly venal and despicable lump of shit AND Cuomo is a dick. What I love about Bob is that he refuses to accept the blindingly obvious truth of the first, and thinks that people who do believe it somehow think Cuomo is a god. The first is willful ignorance at the most astonishing level, the second is spectacularly pathetic straw-man building.

  218. De Blasio = complete and utter moron and incompetent

    Cuomo = Impressive and presidential in front of the cameras but moved way too slow in NY and only after Trump called him out to do more

    Trump = PT Barnum character, made a smart and tough political move closing China early, 1-2 weeks late closing Europe and then an extra week late on UK/Ireland, very large long term error shrinking down the infectious disease group to save money in the short term, moved at least a week late getting needed medical supplies and tests from private sector, and is an ass clown 24 hours a day dealing with the press.

    WHO – Dumber than a huge fucking pile of rocks was saying it was a non issue in late January and mislead the entire world

    CDC – well intentioned bureaucratic mess with rules designed to protect us that wound up slowing us down badly and doing more harm than good. negatively impacted the approval of testing kits and ramping up production in the private sector etc..

    All that said, this was going to happen no matter what. It’s just worse than it would have been if competent people were in government.

  219. It is indeed possible that Trump is a truly venal and despicable lump of shit AND Cuomo is a dick. What I love about Bob is that he refuses to accept the blindingly obvious truth of the first, and thinks that people who do believe it somehow think Cuomo is a god.

    Projection is an amazing thing.

  220. Stratomatic: Frequently wrong, but never in doubt: CDC – well intentioned bureaucratic mess with rules designed to protect us that wound up slowing us down badly and doing more harm than good. negatively impacted the approval of testing kits and ramping up production in the private sector etc..

    Trump cut their balls off, just like the EPA, State dept, Dept of Ed, etc. and he didn’t respect a thing they said early on. Any prior president would have listened to them early on.

  221. >South Korea is on the same timeline as us, they got their first cases at the same time, but they took it seriously, got a testing program together quickly, and their healthcare system didn’t get overwhelmed.<

    To be clear, this is not a defense of our own lack of preparedness.

    Asia has had a few of these outbreaks already and that partly explains why the region was more ready and more experienced handling the issues that would come up. The other being that some of the things they are willing to do in other countries would not be tolerated in the US. The press and citizens would go nuts.

    That said, a competent country should have tried to learn from the Asian experience and been better prepared anyway. It should have been considered a national security issue. We could even be attacked this way. How could we not be better prepared?

  222. Not to mention actually paying attention the confidential mid January CIA report that said the Wuhan situation represented a serious threat of a global pandemic that should be addressed. As I mentioned above, Trump had more information than we did and he still didn’t take action.

  223. You can’t really compare us to South Korea unless you use some sort of per capita number. They’re going to have less cases and be able to control it better because they have less idiots to deal with.

    Now my opinion, you don’t have to agree and don’t trash me for it: I actually put a bit of blame on the hospitals too. Our hospitals are majority for profit businesses that make a lot of money, a lot. Why wouldn’t they have some sort of mask supply on hand? Like, I don’t know, maybe enough to at least cover half of your staff?

    The reality is we all know government does shit slow which is why I can’t understand the obsession with socialism, they aren’t going to shit out 100 million masks in a week.

  224. That said, a competent country should have tried to learn from the Asian experience and been better prepared anyway. It should have been considered a national security issue. We could even be attacked this way. How could we not be better prepared?

    $24 Trillion in debt. Wouldn’t it be great if we didn’t have debt and could do something like a $10 trillion stimulus?

  225. >Trump cut their balls off, just like the EPA, State dept, Dept of Ed, etc. and he didn’t respect a thing they said early on. Any prior president would have listened to them early on.<

    I mentioned shrinking the infectious disease group (that was a short sighted disaster), but that's not what I'm taking about with the CDC.

    The CDC apparently has rules kind of like the FDA where you can only use approved testing kits (to protect us from the evils of the private sector). The problem was that the CDC only developed a low quality testing kit, with slow turnaround, and not enough of them. When much better private sector tests were developed and getting ready to be ramped up, those private companies were forbidden to do so because they weren't approved. So there was a delay until the Fauci and administration could basically say F the rules, we need testing kits. Somehow they bypassed or fast tracked the approval process so private companies could ramp up. But that cost us a week or two of delays.

  226. So there was a delay until the Fauci and administration could basically say F the rules, we need testing kits.

    So…you just said it yourself. This was yet another failure on the part of Trump, who made it very clear that he valued the “numbers” more than the actual public health crisis. He, as the head of the executive branch, could’ve told the CDC to ditch those regulations at any time. He dragged his feet because that would’ve led to more testing, and thus higher “numbers.”

    It’s difficult to describe the way Trump has handled this without sounding like a conspiratorial kook. He wouldn’t be a believable villainous President in a movie about a pandemic, because he’s so fucking vain and incompetent it would come across as cheesy writing. I mean Marvel movies make their villains more complicated than this guy. He is a moron who thinks he’s a genius who truly only gives a shit about himself.

  227. I’m not a trump defender; I think he’s been terrible on this. You can’t applaud his call to shut travel from China and ignore that he should have done the same with Europe once italy broke out. Hell he inexplicably left the UK open even after he shut down europe. He has no idea what is going on and should cede the floor to the experts like W did in 2008. At least W knew he wasn’t smart and let Paulson and Bernanke speak. Trump thinks this is a TV show and he’s the star so the doctors are his supporting cast. He’s awful. I would hope even Bob can see this.

    But ffs…. There’s a reason every elected official at every level in both parties has failed pretty spectacularly on this: no one wants to destroy an economy (and that is what we’re doing) until it’s beyond 1000% clear that they have to.

    And also, people suck. Maybe not here, this is a bright group that knew what was going on for a long time. But the people who live here don’t listen to anyone or anything. There are — right now — way too many people out in NYC. Maybe it’s dead by you but go to a park or the river, it’s jam packed like a spring Saturday. And all those idiots I told you that were out in the city last weekend, they’ve all been taking flights to Florida, California, or whatever cool place they think they can ride this out with their quarantine crew. 20% of them are probably positive and asymptomatic. So wait til all those idiots start infecting more areas. That shit ain’t a politician’s fault.

  228. My decision to sign a lease for a tiny but relatively expensive East Village apartment due its proximity to NYU’s campus and neighborhood nightlife was the John Wall contract of apartment rentals.

    Arguably defensible at the time of the signing, but disastrous in hindsight…

  229. There still isn’t effective testing of airline passengers, unlike almost every other country in the world.

  230. There still isn’t effective testing of airline passengers, unlike almost every other country in the world.

    A friend just flew into JFK this afternoon from Dubai. He’s been in SE Asia working. He said every airport outside the US is testing everybody arriving and departing for fevers, and holding those who have one for a coronavirus test before they can go anywhere. The US has no testing for international arrivals, no screening for people who’ve been at other hotspots, and certainly no preventive measures for anything domestic. Trump didn’t shut down travel from China. He just made everybody who’d been in China come back to spread it around. It’s insane, and incredibly irresponsible.

    all those idiots I told you that were out in the city last weekend, they’ve all been taking flights to Florida, California, or whatever cool place they think they can ride this out with their quarantine crew. 20% of them are probably positive and asymptomatic.

    It’s unconscionable that there is no testing in place to screen people before they travel. Massive failure.

  231. The guy can’t even read a teleprompter without fucking up. I don’t know why we expect him to solve the greatest health crisis of the 21st century.

  232. The US has been testing foreign travelers coming into the country as far back as February. I know this from personal experience. I presumed there is a constitutional reason they didn’t test US citizens (how can you not let someone back into their home country based on their temperature?).

    The domestic flights present a similar problem. It’s blatantly discriminatory. I know it’s for safety but it seems really hard to legally deny someone their ability to get from point A to point B based on their temperature.

  233. Don’t want to support Trump but …
    Boris Johnson the UK prime minister followed more crrriminally policy on the COVID-19 situation till one week ago by allowing public gatherings and even live concerts of 25.000 people attending with the sceptic of the herd immunity to kick in.
    These decisions are not taken by the governments imo.
    Look like experiments composed by scientists after billionaires’ orders.
    Politicians seem like the conductors of these fatal symphonies.
    Trump of course ain’t only a politician….

  234. Always great being enlightened by the “fake news” police! You know, the guys that rail against media bias? From the Western Journal Wikipedia page:

    “Western Journalism was founded in 2008 by political consultant Floyd Brown, who also founded the Political Action Committee Citizens United[2] and served as executive director of the Young America’s Foundation.[3]

    The site was acquired by Liftable Media, Inc. in 2014,[4] which also owns the political opinion websites Conservative Tribune and Liberty Alliance,[4] and the human-interest website Liftable.com.[5] It also owns and provides content to dozens of conservative Facebook pages.[6]”

  235. More:

    “In February 2019, The Western Journal published an article which alleged “Climate Change ‘Heat Records’ Are a Huge Data Manipulation.” Scientists criticized the article, saying it was deceptive and that it contradicted existing research. The Western Journal subsequently retracted the article.”

    This is the kind of feces that mouth-breathers like bob injest to justify how bullshit the nytimes is. What a fucking moron.

  236. thenoblefacehumper:
    My decision to sign a lease for a tiny but relatively expensive East Village apartment due its proximity to NYU’s campus and neighborhood nightlife was the John Wall contract of apartment rentals.

    Arguably defensible at the time of the signing, but disastrous in hindsight…

    Bad luck, tnfh. Keep your chin up, it will all even out, especially for a bright young guy like yourself!

  237. “Always great being enlightened by the “fake news” police! You know, the guys that rail against media bias? From the Western Journal Wikipedia page:”

    Was the information factual or not???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

  238. I dunno, is anything on msnbc factual? Or CNN? Or in the NYTimes? What’s the fact-to-fiction ratio?

    Typically, someone like yourself will take some random misstatement from MSNBC and lo and behold, it becomes MSLSD, never to be trusted again, But when the publication/outlet he is brainwashed into thinking is more “fair and balanced” spouts vomit that a jackass would kick you for repeating (e.g. the global warming “hoax” referenced above) it is glossed over, as is the veracity of a scumbag president who has told 20,000+ verifiable lies.

  239. Dear Bob,

    Please go crawl back under your rock. In normal times your stupidity degrades humanity but only in tiny, hard-to-specifically-quantify stages. Right now, you echo the perspective of cravenly corrupt sociopaths who are leading us into the millions of deaths scenario. Go away. Please. Don’t come back.

    Everyone else, i recommend we ignore anything else Bob posts (although I think that we can make fun of him if it’s about basketball). It’s just not worth it. It’s like having Kyrie Irving on this site, arguing about how flat the earth is.

    Except much worse.

    Sincerely,

    Not Mike

  240. Raven:
    Dear Bob,

    Please go crawl back under your rock. In normal times your stupidity degrades humanity but only in tiny, hard-to-specifically-quantify stages. Right now, you echo the perspective of cravenly corrupt sociopaths who are leading us into the millions of deaths scenario. Go away. Please. Don’t come back.

    Everyone else, i recommend we ignore anything else Bob posts (although I think that we can make fun of him if it’s about basketball). It’s just not worth it. It’s like having Kyrie Irving on this site, arguing about how flat the earth is.

    Except much worse.

    Sincerely,

    Not Mike

    Funny as hell, but a bit rough. I don’t think bob is a sociopath, just a garden-variety asshole. See bob? I got your back!

  241. Enjoyed the song lyrics discussion, everyone.

    Here’s one of may favorites. Can someone name it without looking it up?

    “And the world is busting at its seems and you’re just a prisoner of your dreams holding on for life. You work 9 to 5 but somehow you survive until the night”

  242. Sorry, didn’t mean to suggest Bob’s a sociopath. Just that he’s defending them.

    And apologies if I was a little rough. My mom’s as good as dead right now. She’s in a home in NY, and she’s in the hospital every few weeks for something. The next something, be it a UTI or whatever, will almost certainly be her death knell, as she won’t get help for something that’s otherwise fixable but if not it will kill her, and god forbid if she does go in. Roach motel.

    I’ve somewhat lost patience with people who defend really bad, indefensible people. it’s not cute anymore.

    Doesn’t mean we can’t have a good discussion about who’s to blame. I think recent parts of this thread have been really interesting. I wouldn’t have looked at hospitals as anything other than victims until the post about why didn’t they get ahead of the curve, knowing what was coming and how unlikely the federal government was to support them. Not sure I accept the point, but it’s worth a good mull.

  243. It’s unfair to complain about Bob’s post of the Western Journal article. I read it and it seemed apolitical and probably factual. I didn’t know that sites reputation until you guys complained about it. But a simple google search shows other sites, for example CBS news, reporting something similar. So I think he was being helpful and maybe he’s owed an apology for some of the comments on that particular post.

  244. The US has been testing foreign travelers coming into the country as far back as February. I know this from personal experience. I presumed there is a constitutional reason they didn’t test US citizens (how can you not let someone back into their home country based on their temperature?).

    It’s just “fill out a questionnaire,” it’s not actually testing anyone. As if travelers are going to be honest about their symptoms. A foreign national dealing with Trump’s CBP? Lie every which way in hopes of not ending up in one of the camps. And it’s not don’t let citizens back in, it’s keep them isolated until they can get tested if they have indicators. I can’t think of any constitutional reason. The US has done similar things in the past during epidemics. We did that exact thing with the cruise ship.

  245. Was the information factual or not?

    Since the source are proven liars the only rational assumption is ‘no’.

  246. KnickfaninNJ:
    It’s unfair to complain about Bob’s post of the Western Journal article.I read it and it seemed apolitical and probably factual.I didn’t know that sitesreputation until you guys complained about it.But a simple google search shows other sites, for example CBS news, reporting something similar. So I think he was being helpful and maybe he’s owed an apology for some of the comments on that particular post.

    lol

  247. Ev’rybody’s talking about
    Bagism, Shagism, Dragism, Madism, Ragism, Tagism
    This-ism, that-ism, is-m, is-m, is-m
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    C’mon
    Ev’rybody’s talking about Ministers
    Sinisters, Banisters and canisters
    Bishops and Fishops and Rabbis and Pop eyes
    And bye bye, bye byes
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    Let me tell you now
    Ev’rybody’s talking about
    Revolution, evolution, masturbation
    Flagellation, regulation, integrations
    Meditations, United Nations
    Congratulations
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    Ev’rybody’s talking about
    John and Yoko, Timmy Leary, Rosemary
    Tommy Smothers, Bobby Dylan, Tommy Cooper
    Derek Taylor, Norman Mailer
    Alan Ginsberg, Hare Krishna
    Hare, Hare Krishna
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance
    All we are saying is give peace a chance

  248. Grocer, it’s not just “fill out a questionaire. On Feb 28 they stuck a thermometer in the mouth of a Thai national who I am dating. She had a mild fever and they wanted to send her either to Thailand or quarantine. She got her company’s lawyer to come get her into the country. She then quarantined herself for 14 days.

  249. If we’re going to discredit articles because the owner of whoever published them has a political agenda and has once had to recant a story, what exactly are we left with?

    Bloomberg is my go to, and it would fail that test horribly.

  250. “And the world is busting at its seems and you’re just a prisoner of your dreams holding on for life. You work 9 to 5 but somehow you survive until the night”

    dolly parton: working 9 to 5…

    hope your mom stays well raven…I understand…cuz I’m in and out of my house all the time still, can’t really go hang out with mom…

    couple of more on the more seasoned side family members with some serious health stuff going on that got me worried…

    worried about the young kids…this just ain’t a good time to have any kind of health situations going on…

    real scary thinking that there’s a good chance 50% of the population may become infected…

  251. Greek press writes about strict obligatory quarantine on the students who returned to Greece recently from Uk.

    Greek TV News showed a few of them yesterday saying on the cameras that the questionnaire wasn’t obligatory, noone checked their temperature and noone forced them to quarantine themselves but they will voluntarily do it by themselves….

  252. “It’s unfair to complain about Bob’s post of the Western Journal article. I read it and it seemed apolitical and probably factual.”

    Of course it it…. but does that even matter? I simply posted a piece that I read that quoted a study from American Journal of Gastroenterology. I posted it is a public service to those that didn’t know GI symptoms often PRECEDE CV lung symptoms.

    Note no one disputed the veracity of the piece itself…. they were just triggered by the source.

    And, by the way, I spent the greater part of my adult life in a barn so do you actually think being called names by people in the internet is going to bother me in the least? I’m pretty un-triggerable.

    It just shows some people’s lack of argument. Not a single person has disputed factually anything I posted today and I have assiduously refrained from invective and God knows I’m justified to do so.

    Cliff’s notes:

    Trump has picked up 10 points to a majority position in polling in a week as to his handling of this mess…
    If you have GI symptoms be extra on guard for C/V. Deal with it fellas…..

  253. oh yeah, everyone knows – ain’t them conservatives you gotta be wary of here in knickerblogger/new yorkish land – dem liberals are out for blood right here…

    really wish we had a candidate with half that passion and fury running for office…

    as far as I can remember ma was big in to the civil rights thing…she’s a “typical” new yorker…makes z-man seem somewhat shy and gentle…

    it’s funny, when I visit and the channel hits cnn or msnbc – she yells at the tv, in agreement, and a shared hatred for trump – no question it is a clear hatred…

  254. ““And the world is busting at its seems and you’re just a prisoner of your dreams holding on for life. You work 9 to 5 but somehow you survive until the night””

    Bruuuuuuuce.

    (ps— I did include this song way back in the 9:15pm post from last night)

    (pps— why aren’t these posts numbered anymore?)

  255. if I absolutely had to put pen to paper and write down all the lyrics to a Bruce song: spirit in the night

    I do this weird thing sometimes where i’ll listen to the same song 5 or 6 times in a row…sometimes more than that and often while staring at the lyrics…

    I got a leaky mind though, I usually lose it quickly…

  256. The article bobneptune posted seems fine, and possibly even useful. So thanks for that bob, no snark.

  257. bobneptune:
    FYI….

    https://www.westernjournal.com/study-finds-unexpected-coronavirus-symptoms-first-sign-infection-digestive-issues/?utm_source=Email&utm_medium=conservative-brief-WJ&utm_campaign=dailypm&utm_content=western-journal

    My take away after reading the original news release is below:

    Seven patients with COVID-19 presented with digestive symptoms but no respiratory symptoms.

    This bit was eliminated in the article which is weird.
    So about half of the 200 or so patients have digestive symptoms, mostly alongside with respiratory symptoms but there is a small chance that only digestive symptoms show up.

  258. made it through the fridge and most of my food, cleaning and medical supplies…

    let’s share secrets…

    so, I’m a fairly well intentioned individual…generally neat, maybe not the absolute biggest fan of actually cleaning stuff though…

    the kids visit, but, it’s just me in the house, my general cleaning strategy is just avoid making a mess…I know I should get a cleaning service, but, just not a big fan of strangers, even more so not having them going through my home…

    point of the story – it would seem over the course of some years I’ve accumulated quite a bit of cleaning supplies which were purchased, but sadly never used…I’m good on cleaning stuff, for a good while…

    went through and checked expiration dates in the kitchen…didn’t have to toss too much…oldest item was some boxes of cup of noodles (way in the back) that had 2014 on the box…

    nothing from 2018 or 2019, but, a few more items with 2017 on them…

    right now still got everything out all over the house (like items with like items :), gonna just empty every cabinet throughout the house and figure out how to re-stock…

    need to hit the closets and garage afterward…probably do more working from home the next few weeks…try to sneak a little home maintenance in to my schedule…that’ll make me happy…

    two items I came up short on: toilet paper and lysol disinfecting spray…not too bad overall, still a lot of work to do…

    been thinking about those “doomsday” prepper people a bunch the last few days…I gotta imagine they’re laughing their asses off and thinking: we told you

  259. D I actually have to go back and search for all the times bobneptune criticized an article solely on the basis of emanating from “lamestream media liberal bias?” That’s the point I’m trying to make. bob is a cheerleader for the “don’t believe what’s said because it emanates from the Fake News” crowd. Let’s see him swear to never criticize a factual report because he doesn’t trust the source, He evoked liberal lobbyists earlier in the thread.

    Put another way, it isn’t about whether the point made in the article was true or not, it’s about how hypocritical conservatives are when on one hand, they criticize everything reported by the “mainstream media” and on the other hand they assume everything published in dogshit conservative media outlets (and Western Journal is pretty typical of this genre) is more valid.

  260. “if I absolutely had to put pen to paper and write down all the lyrics to a Bruce song: spirit in the night”

    If I had to, I could probably go from Blinded By The Light all the way up to something off the Rising album, from memory, without stopping. Maybe I’d get a word wrong here and there, but not many:)

    (btw, my kids think I’m a magician because they put the Springsteen xm radio channel on and watch as I sit there calling out the next song before it even starts. They’re like “how do you do that??”, and I’m like “it’s all in the Akashic Records, just open your minds….”

  261. Grocer, it’s not just “fill out a questionaire. On Feb 28 they stuck a thermometer in the mouth of a Thai national who I am dating. She had a mild fever and they wanted to send her either to Thailand or quarantine. She got her company’s lawyer to come get her into the country. She then quarantined herself for 14 days.

    That’s good to hear, in a general way, no offense to your friend. Runs contrary to everything else I’ve read and heard so it makes me think the regime is haphazard, at best.

    The article bobneptune posted seems fine, and possibly even useful. So thanks for that bob, no snark.

    If it turns out to be accurate that’s great, but given the mass amounts of disinformation and outright lies rolling around right wing media outlets everyone’s initial response should be distrust. No one should default to trusting consistent liars, even if they try to play the victim afterwards.

  262. “If it turns out to be accurate that’s great, but given the mass amounts of disinformation and outright lies rolling around right wing media outlets everyone’s initial response should be distrust. No one should default to trusting consistent liars, even if they try to play the victim afterwards.”

    This is really silly.

    The link I posted had the headline: Study Finds Unexpected Coronavirus Symptoms That Could Be the First Sign of Infection: Digestive Issues.

    Even the slow boy could divine this wasn’t a right wing hit piece with the smallest modicum of intellectual curiosity. It directly quoted and linked that other world famous entity of the vast right wing conspiracy The American College of Gastroenterology.

    Sometimes when you check your so called brain at the door and indulge in knee-jerk reactions you end up kicking yourself right in your posterior

  263. “D I actually have to go back and search for all the times bobneptune criticized an article solely on the basis of emanating from “lamestream media liberal bias?” That’s the point I’m trying to make. bob is a cheerleader for the “don’t believe what’s said because it emanates from the Fake News” crowd. Let’s see him swear to never criticize a factual report because he doesn’t trust the source, He evoked liberal lobbyists earlier in the thread.”

    The first thing they taught you 50 years ago when you were studying a science discipline is to always take into account the biases of the examiner. If a cigarette company pays for a study it is possible it might be factual, but I’m looking really hard at it. It’s essential advice when looking at research papers and good advice in general. I do that as a matter of course.

    Now … if you are going to try to tell me the MSM has covered themselves with glory in their “news” reporting the past few years and deserves the benefit of the doubt, I’ve got a bridge in Brooklyn I’m interested in selling you.

    I mean CNN and MSLSD put the creepy porn lawyer on 100 times as some sort of expert and actually thought he would be a great candidate for president…. so yeah…. I question their objectivity a little bit. But if they say something and can back it up with facts, I’m happy to listen.

    They just haven’t done much of that the past few years.

  264. “Put another way, it isn’t about whether the point made in the article was true or not, ”

    Ummmmm… it actually is……… good attempt at backtracking from an untenable position…. shift the goal posts a bit more, Please!

  265. “The article bobneptune posted seems fine, and possibly even useful. So thanks for that bob, no snark.”

    As I often say to my wife, “I live to serve!”

    But seriously…. when I read it I thought it might be useful if someone on this list happens to have GI symptoms without a cough, not to JUST assume it was the clams casino you had last night, that C/V presents that way sometimes.

    But unfortunately it triggered a bunch of people……

  266. The link I posted had the headline: Study Finds Unexpected Coronavirus Symptoms That Could Be the First Sign of Infection: Digestive Issues.

    Even the slow boy could divine this wasn’t a right wing hit piece with the smallest modicum of intellectual curiosity.

    Because what really matters is the headline. This is why you’re the sucker. It’s as if you think the moral of “The Boy Who Cried Wolf” is that we need to take all claims of wolves seriously at all times no matter who the information comes from. Please.

  267. Here’s an example of what actual responsible governance can achieve, with a comparison to a governor who was following Trumps lead. And to forestall, Cuomo and de Blasio should have acted far sooner.

  268. Has anyone considered that such a player would be probably the most widely hated player in NBA history, both among your teammates and the general public? I don’t think it’s worth it, even for millions.

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