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Warriors 126, Knicks 113: On E in Cali. – Posting & Toasting
Jalen Brunson Injured, Latest Updates on Knicks Star’s Ankle and Status for Warriors Game – BleacherReport
NBA midseason grades for every East team: Celtics in ‘A’ tier, Knicks, Cavs, Hawks trying to find footing – CBS Sports
Knicks waste early double-digit lead, can’t slow down Warriors in 126-113 loss – SNY
Mike Brown Rips Knicks for ‘Worst’ Loss to Kings After Jalen Brunson Injured – BleacherReport
Knicks Bulletin: ‘I thought we played good in stretches’ – Posting & Toasting
Knicks Injury Tracker: Landry Shamet available vs. Warriors – SNY
Warriors prove Kuminga ‘not a distraction’ in win over Knicks – ESPN
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Can The Knicks Land This Sleeper Wing Bucket In A Trade?! – Knicks Fan TV
NEW YORK, WE HAVE A PROBLEM | Are we still contenders? | Redwood Empire Whiskey – Knick of Time
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53 replies on “Knicks Morning News (2026.01.17)”
Continuing from last thread, and Rama saying MB is doing ALL that we asked for (most of the time he is, i agree) and we shouldn’t complain. It’s with this last bit that i disagree. Of course i want the coach to explore different approaches during the season, and to not “tariff” the starters with a lot more minutes than they should, like Thibs would. Also, i still stand for the “we should do it even if it costs us a game here and there”, but that’s where MB is completely wrong because he didn’t understand the “here and there”. If the team is struggling, we should play like it is game 7 and like Thibs would do, maximing our chances to win. You should never let the team get in stretches where they win 2 games out of 9, because during that negative period, everybody (players included) will start to have doubts about everything, they can start blaming others (everybody else in KAT’s case, and KAT in everybody else’s), and generally things will start to look bleak.
So yeah, “pretty please with lots of sugar on top” i ask MB to treat the next games as a game 7 for us to get out of this funk.
And i see we have a new member of the community – thelibrary – so… Welcome and i hope you stick around, all opinions are valid, including when Strat says that Brunson is the problem! LOL
You have to give more than half a season. Last year at this point the Pacers were barely .500 and in a low position
Meant to post this here…
Thibs has a higher floor but I think also a lower ceiling. Brown may have a higher seeling but a lower floor. We shall see.
“Thibs has a high floor but I think also a lower ceiling. Brown may have a higher seeling but a lower floor. We shall see.”
This is the hope, and the reason that both the firing and the hiring were made, but it is quite possible that Thibs had both a higher floor and ceiling than Brown.
“You have to give more than half a season. Last year at this point the Pacers were barely .500 and in a low position.”
At this point last season (1/17) the Pacers were 23-19 after winning 8 of their last 10 games. They went on to win 50 games. The teams were clearly heading in opposite directions at this point. So sure, they hadn’t peaked, but they were showing signs after an injury-riddled start.
There was also no question about the quality of their coach.
And the argument isn’t really about Mike Brown, is it? It’s more about the roster. The real question is: is this roster good enough for any coach to hit some theoretical ceiling of a finals appearance?
We shall see.
The roster may be a bit unbalanced. The hope is Brown gets them to play right.
The two guys I keep my eye on are Bridges and KAT. I’m not sure either does what we really need for a full season
I’ve pointed this out before, but the main problem with our roster is a lack of elite size/athleticism. That’s not something a coach can fix. 36yo Jimmy Butler destroyed us without breaking a sweat and laughing as he did it. 35yo Draymond Green stopped KAT in his tracks in a single-team. We’re losing because we can’t keep up.
Brown (or Thibs or whoever) can jimmy rig schemes to minimize the detrimental effects over the course of a game, or a playoff series, but it is quite possible that a foolproof fix simply doesn’t exist. At some point you have to be able to guard, and someone other than Brunson has to be able to consistently shake loose.
jaylon tyson is really not a secret at all
okay then, in my continuing quest to fill tv time with some stuff while Fallout season 2 fills out i have now started in on Pluribus…
this is just so unexpected…
JK this isn’t stats vs Joe Morgan.
This is about using stats correctly.
Those are two distinct control groups with a key variable and you’re aggregating them to get the result you want.
It’s like I’m saying smoking causes cancer, look at the results when you separate smokers vs non smokers. And you’re combining the two groups to make the impact of the variable disappear.
I agree that the results would not be as stark over 31 games but I firmly believe they would not even out. There would still be a considerable gap.
And the reason is the Yankees swing at shit.
The difference between them and the Dodgers (and I broke this by swing rate before) is when the Dodgers didn’t hit the Blue Jays, they forced them to throw strikes. When the Yankees didn’t hit the Blue Jays, they were swinging at shit no one can ever hit.
The Dodgers’ approach will deliver random results. The Yankees’ approach will deliver predictable ones.
What do you think geo? I have mixed feelings about the show, although mostly positive…
It kind of is, because the Fire Joe Morgan crowd fervently denies any “playoff impact” at all.
So if the Yankees swung at garbage against the Blue Jays in the playoffs, unless that can be confirmed by the Yankees also swinging at garbage against the Blue Jays in the regular season (*), then the Yankees swinging at garbage agalnst the Blue Jays in the playoffs, the argument goes, was nothing more than random chance.
It’s kind of a strange stance, when you think of it, to insist that no phenomenon exists in the world other than those that can be confirmed by the tools and methods of statistical inference. It writes out human emotion, for example, entirely out of the human condition and human pursuits.
(*) And/or swinging at garbage more generally, including in the regular season, not against the Blue Jays.
does it worry anyone that embid is averaging 26 per game over his last five
finding a way to get danny wolf wouldnt be a bad thing if we cant get sharpe
just started episode 4 ess-dog, I don’t know what to make of it…
I’d be pretty amazed if there’s a season 2…
i’m enjoying it myself due to the high quality production of the show + rhea seehorn…
it’s some kind of social satire, not sure the exact point yet…mostly just enjoying the audio/visual nature of the thing and following along with the plot…
what do you think/feel about the thing ess-dog…
I’ve pointed this out before, but the main problem with our roster is a lack of elite size/athleticism.
if we could go back in recent history and pluck just one non-star (say, zero all-star teams) player to best hit our particular weak spots, who are your candidates? ibaka maybe. size, athleticism, help at the rim for KAT without killing spacing. and he brings some bonus toughness (don’t think he’d have been quite as excited as half our team, our coach and kat’s own dad were get in line to dap up draymond after he tried to grab kat by the ankle embiid style and bitch him out for being upset by it).
https://media4.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExMGR1NHVpM2ZwZDkybGUyYjR6bXA5OHE4M3M2YTJwNzJkNmljM3RyNiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/W038TiB3SHLIBAnkYM/giphy.gif
Hubert, I think the firmest ground you have to stand on is that the Yankees optimize for WRC and ignore other important elements of the game, so that when their hitting is putrid they can’t make up for it in other ways.
But the Fire Joe Morgan crowd is definitely right about this.
I don’t know, maybe having played tens of thousands of backgammon matches against mostly inferior players makes this super obvious to me but losing 8 straight playoffs is absolutely nothing for a sample size.
when did westbrok learn to shoot 3s 6 of 9 last nite
That would show up in the first order numbers though, both playoff and regular season.
The major source of “randomness” in baseball is sequencing. That’s the primary reason we consistently see something like a 12-game swing between pythag and real wins. You could know to the exact number how many runs a team will score and give up in a season and you still won’t be able to guess how many wins they’ll have within something like six in either direction.
You can sign a 10 WAR player and he can deliver 10 WAR to a team where everything else around him stays the same, and you can still win fewer games.
I just went to Baseball Savant, and they have team rankings for chase rate.
Guess who ranked #2 in all of baseball with the lowest chase rate in 2025? Guys, you’ll never guess!
Actually they tied for #1. Hint: it’s the team that “swings at garbage.”
Did they “swing at garbage” in the playoffs though? Or against some particular team in the playoffs?
If so, the fact that they didn’t swing at garbage in the regular season makes the playoff SAG rate even more pronounced and meaningful.
does it worry anyone that embid is averaging 26 per game over his last five
yeah, although he still looks really rough on defense. imagine current lebron was your center (actually just imagine ayton). still, he’s an offensive force and they have a lot around him now so if embiid and pg just look like they do now, philly won’t be an easy out. i still think both boston, with tatum returning, and orlando are even more concerning. orlando has looked shitty but they’ve barely played with their best four and if suggs can somehow be healthy for the playoffs, i’m pretty confident they’ll be formidable. the emergence of black and maybe even penda and the return of mo has changed the nature of their depth if they have everyone else available. and someone mentioned tyson on cleveland plus they’ll have strus returning to help mitigate hunter and lonzo being so disappointing. they still have a garland inconsistency problem. but the east isn’t all that friendly right now.
Now THIS is correct. Sequencing does play a large role. This is how Toronto had a higher wRC+ than the Dodgers in the World Series and still lost. If you win a game 2-1 it counts the same as if you won 10-0. This is one of the many things that skew the numbers in short series and that tend to even out over larger sample sizes.
Also, PITCHER variance is massive in a short series. I mean look at Max Fried. He’s an elite pitcher who had a terrible game. The correct takeaway from that is not “Max Fried can only beat bad teams.”
Well, the argument being made here (which I’m sure I will be told is not the actual argument) is that the Yankees are systematically built in a way that fakes its way through the regular season scoring hella runs but can’t actually hit good pitching because they swing at everything.
Somehow this is a team that over a 162 game sample makes the best swing decisions in MLB, against the same pool of pitchers that everybody else faces, yet that is some sort of a mirage because only in the postseason do the “real” pitchers emerge, at which point the Yankees turn into a pumpkin and become a lineup of nine Javy Baez clones.
I guess that’s a more comforting narrative to some fans than “Trey Yesavage had a good game and beat us.”
Does Baseball Savant or any other source have the actual empirical answer re playoff chase rates?
Just as a general principle, a significantly higher chase rate in the playoffs than the regular season would be interesting and meaningful to me. For the reasons you say, I have my doubts that it exists, but would still be interesting to know one way or the other.
pt, to be honest, I don’t think an answer to that question exists. We sort of have that base covered with OG, Mikal, and to a lesser degree, Mitch and Deuce. You can improve those guys on the margins, but any improvement might put those players over the top in the all-star sense.
To me, the problem is two-fold. First (and by far biggest), our 1-2 punch is extremely unathletic in the context of this conversation…KAT via slow-twitch lumbering and Brunson via short, stumpy, slowish, below-the-rimming. Second, the supporting cast is full of guys who possess at least one very significant and exploitable flaw.
So sure, you can replace OG or Mikal or even Mitch, Hart, or Deuce with Ibaka, but how much marginal utility do you get from that, in the sense that it mitigates the first flaw?
And there’s the rub. There are two non-all-stars on this team who cost an all-star haul and who are making all-star salaries. That would be okay if our two actual all-stars were more well-rounded (i.e. two-way) players.
So when you combine the price paid for Mikal and the ill-fit of KAT, you have the conundrum we are in right now. It doesn’t help that we drafted Kolek (who clearly was not a plus athlete) and Dadiet (who clearly was two years away from being two years away) rather than guys like, say, Dunn and Shead who at the very least are plus defenders with some kind of elite athleticism. It also doesn’t help that neither Clarkson nor Yabu have shown any “plus” athletic ability.
So yeah, Ibaka et. al. would help make us deeper, but not all that much better, especially since he’d be getting paid $30-40M AAV in this market and you’d have to factor in who he’d be replacing.
“yeah, although he still looks really rough on defense. imagine current lebron was your center (actually just imagine ayton)”
Or KAT???
While I hope we get over the top this year, and will be rooting hard for us to win every game we play until we either win a championship or are eliminated, I think it’s fair to ask: what should Leon do if we fall significantly short of the hoped for outcome, i.e a second-round loss or worse?
My current hot take is:
Plan A: Acquire Giannis, preferably for KAT and one other starter other than Brunson i.e OG, Mikal, or Hart, plus whatever filler in picks or scrubs it takes.
Plan B: Unless something totally unexpected presents itself, forget about chasing a championship via all-in moves. Salary dump KAT and one other starter (again, either OG, Bridges, or Hart). let Mitch go at any price over $12M AAV. We will likely have our own first, a top second, and a mid-second. Draft a a super-athletic defensive wing (i.e. can play D in the NBA right now) and a lightning-quick PG with some size who lacks a consistent perimeter shot but can get to the rim and has a high b-ball IQ. Even if Huk develops, find a solid defensive C in the second round. Then hope that Brunson is still super-elite in 3 years at age 32.
I never really believed this team was constructed in a way that could win a title unless Leon acquired a true superstar, and I still feel that way. It’s just very difficult if not impossible to win a chip without a Steph-Joker-Giannis-SGA type who racks up 10 BPM and can just take over a playoff game. Brunson is very nice but I don’t think he can be the best player on a championship team.
This is still a good team, but it’s not a title contender, not really. And we’ve mortgaged an awful lot to get this far.
“So yeah, Ibaka et. al. would help make us deeper, but not all that much better, especially since he’d be getting paid $30-40M AAV in this market and you’d have to factor in who he’d be replacing.”
serge ibaka retired three years ago not sure who is being referenced here
I was very happy with the trajectory of the team until the Bridges trade. For all of his warts, Julius was very good and we had the assets to snag the kind of superstar that would complement Julius and/or Brunson if one shook loose, as Giannis seems to be shaking loose right now. I don’t think the KAT trade was bad value-wise (although not a steal by any stretch) but it has not panned out as hoped by his bigger fans here, and clearly it wasn’t Thibs that was holding him back. But if we acquired KAT at the same price and filled Mikal’s role with whatever was available for, let’s say, 2 unprotected picks instead of 5 and a swap), I’d be much more optimistic about our current position.
“serge ibaka retired three years ago not sure who is being referenced here”
Can you possibly have made a more stupid comment? Oh wait, it’s Doogie, never mind.
twasnt doogey twas me not stupid at all as u mentioned a player who would make us deeper even tho hes not playing anymore
Not team Doogie but I did also struggle with Ibaka
We do need a healthy Giannis to be a real contender.
I am fine with what we are now though. It’s a good team and very watchable, though not lately.
Owen, ptmilo brought him up as a theoretical player-archetype from the past. If that was too hard for a reader to ascertain from a reading close enough to merit a response, that reader is indeed stupid.
(and I’m assuming that you didn’t read back far enough to understand why I was put off by doogie’s comment.)
Speaking of stupid, I’ve been pondering this take for a while, so I’ll put it out there for others to dismiss dismissively.
A lot of electronic ink has been spilled recently about various faults related to our players. I agree with most of those positions, but the thing that I wonder about is how you can do the same with virtually every other NBA player out there. Almost no player comes without a thermal exhaust port — too short, too slow, can’t go left well, etc. There are a few (for some reason Maxey comes to mind, and of course Jokic, who in fact has a whole long list of failures, none of which seem to matter even a bit).
If that’s true, then it seems the problem is two-fold. One is finding a system where players’ faults are minimized and their strengths are maximized. I don’t think Brown’s come close to that yet. The other is the oddly dispirited play of late.
On the last, watching OG ‘try’ in the fourth quarter of the last game really brought that home to me. Why wasn’t he ‘trying’ all game, and why weren’t the other players ‘trying’ in similar fashion?
Outside of Brunson and Deuce, we don’t have a lot of ‘try all the time’ players. But while you can argue that’s a fault of theirs (and it is), I tend to circle around to the coach. Because ‘try’ is largely a motivational aspect and a coach is supposed to help with that.
And I don’t think Serge Ibaka would help in this regard.
Hart is now questionable for tonight with soreness on the same ankle he sprained that forced him to miss 8 games.
howdy raven, been meaning to ask you this totally unrelated to anything happening here question…
also watching now will smith’s latest nat geo series…really enjoyed the first 2 series he was involved with…
you are about the most outdoorsy type person i’m aware of…do you have a fave explorer/naturalist you like to watch…
I’ve enjoyed this latest will smith work…just finished the episode where he goes to bhutan in search of the recipe for happiness and visits some super happy people living high up on the side of this super cold and windy mountain…what i would consider: “living rough” doesn’t even begin to describe their situation…
it was neat, point of the thing was that pleasure is biologically designed to be temporary and the key to sustained joy comes mostly from group harmony…having a good support system (like you guys 😊)…
there are some really great youtubers making excellent outdoor content…of the network type stuff, albert lin is probably my fave…
just wondering if there are any particular folks doing that type work that you like to follow…
I did not read back that far, correct.
“Almost no player comes without a thermal exhaust port — too short, too slow, can’t go left well, etc. There are a few (for some reason Maxey comes to mind, and of course Jokic, who in fact has a whole long list of failures, none of which seem to matter even a bit).”
Obviously no player is perfect in every regard. However, there’s a difference between imperfections and exploitable weaknesses. For example, Michael Jordan was not a great 3pt shooter but was that a weakness defenses could exploit? No, because he would eat up any space you gave him and score efficiently anyway…like, say, SGA, but unlike, say, Josh Hart. who
There is also the balance between the magnitude of the strengths and weaknesses. For example, Jokic is a weak rim-protector and is not fleet-of-foot, but when you are as ridiculously dominant of an offensive player, and not Enes Kanter on D, the balance falls so far on the positive side of the ledger that the negatives are easier to patch up with other players. Maxey has flaws but he is so explosive in his movements that any crack in the defense looks like a superhighway to him, and if he’s hot from 3 he can singlehandedly make the game too fast for everyone else on the court (although to be fair, he’s closer to Brunson and KAT than he is to SGA and Jokic.)
The problem with Brunson and KAT is that their weaknesses compound each other, and this compounding effect works to expose the weaknesses of their supporting cast. Complementary players are best when they can stay in their respective lanes. On the Knicks, OG, Mikal, Hart, Deuce, and Mitch are all being asked to expand their roles in ways that accentuate their weaknesses.* They can get away with that vs. lesser teams, but sooner or later they will run into a team and coach that has an answer for all of the workarounds.
*for example, OG is being pushed to drive more, and that’s great except when he gets cut off in the paint and then proceeds to cough up the possession. Smart teams know how to lure him into those situations.
I like that Brown isn’t putting lipstick on his KAT.
I am also always astounded by how enormously fond of titties I am.
zman my perspective is that while no non-star is going to cure our many imperfections, there are two classic nba flaws with impossibly steep gradients to overcome (1) having zero excellent creators (2) having zero rim protection. adding athleticism or perimeter defense or tertiary creation to a team without a legit rim protector is like the bailing water canard.
obviously we have mitch. and towns and country has always been the dream to raise our defensive ceiling. and in some ways it still is. but it’s looked maybe a bit clunkier and more exploitable than hoped on both ends, plus you have the hack a mitch issue. the ibaka that was regularly near the top of the league in blocks making first team all d would make the sort of difference to our jalen/kat defense that literally no perimeter defender could, and without clogging up the offense. in this sense i think he’d be a lot more valuable to this team’s ceiling than players who are not ostensibly worse than him in vacuum, like josh, mikal and deuce (i think i’m likely one of the bigger josh boosters here when it comes to his utility for our particular team, but i still think it pales in comparison to what a genuine spacing rim protector would bring). and it probably wouldn’t hurt that he’d add a lick of toughness to team podcast.
and thus ends my secret argument to make a crazy deal for jjj and pray the rebounds fall into friendly hands. just kidding, sort of. definitely wouldn’t be bringing those ibaka hands with him.
please to say i’m back up in san jose visiting bestest friend to geo…
3 hours of bumping uglies this morning mister clarence…I am back on the partnering up train baby…
Clarence, you are large, and contain multitudes.
Z-Man, don’t really disagree with you, but if you look at that list of complementary players you wrote out, that’s a fine group of defensive-minded people surrounding our two all-stars who struggle defensively. And while they’re being asked to expand their roles, that’s also part of being a professional athlete (or should be). Deuce has ‘learned’ to shoot and is learning how to drive to the basket successfully or pull up for mid-rangers. Even OG the driver, while agreeing that’s often a mess, he’s clearly recently stopped trying to lay it up every time which was a disaster, and now largely dunks it, which actually works.
So I guess my point is it’s a long, 82-game season, lots of narratives with question marks on them at this point. I think I’m firmly in the camp that these pieces CAN be fit well enough together to take us all the way. WILL they? Time, and Brown, will tell.
And Geo, weirdly I only watch nature specials when I randomly stumble upon them (and not even then, sometimes — some part of me reacts to them the way an accountant might when faced with a show about tax law…). Been to Bhutan, possibly the most beautiful landscape I’ve ever spent time in. Will go look up this Will Smith thing, though — thanks for that.
Pretty sure Hart was saying that the medical staff wasn’t happy with him returning so soon and, if the Knicks hadn’t been mired in a losing streak, he would not have returned yet.
Well after tonight Knicks next 2 games should be easy regardless who plays then they only have 1 game in 5 days so there’s time coming up to rest and heal up a bit.
“the ibaka that was regularly near the top of the league in blocks making first team all d would make the sort of difference to our jalen/kat defense that literally no perimeter defender could, and without clogging up the offense. in this sense i think he’d be a lot more valuable to this team’s ceiling than players who are not ostensibly worse than him in vacuum, like josh, mikal and deuce (i think i’m likely one of the bigger josh boosters here when it comes to his utility for our particular team, but i still think it pales in comparison to what a genuine spacing rim protector would bring). and it probably wouldn’t hurt that he’d add a lick of toughness to team podcast.”
In response to this (and to Raven as well) I would agree that prime Ibaka (doogie, you follow?) would be an upgrade over any of our other role players because of his combination of rim-protection and floor spacing. I suppose he’d be a 80% overlap with OG, who is a great defender but not really a shot-blocker, and if I might use a bit of eye-test/memory data, a bit more wooden (not John) in his moves than Serge…but again, not sure if he moves the needle, either on the floor with OG or instead of him…unless he replaces KAT, which would be sort of marginalizing a $60M player.
And to Raven’s point, it’s not just that our guys have flaws…it’s that they even have “micro-flaws” within the stuff that they are good at. OG’s pedestrian rim protection is an example of that, as is Mitch’s very good but no longer DPoY-candidate defense. We saw last year that Mikal is only good but not elite at PoA defense and can be physically bullied when defending up or blown by when defending down. Those microflaws add up and compound the more glaring ones.
And what makes things worse is the colossal flaws once you get past our top 7, especially when you need a defensive wing to hold the fort. Maybe that’s why Diawara is so tantalizing, he at least looks the part of what we sorely need.
Oddly, the roundest “theoretical” peg out there for that defensive hole might be someone like Ben Simmons. I just don’t know how where we can find a long, athletic, rim-protecting wing with what we have to offer.
Not exactly on topic, but Derrick White might be the best 30+ year old to have never made an all star team. He’s so under-rated he doesn’t even make the reddit list of best players to have never made an all star team, losing out to guys like Damon Stoudemire, JR Rider, Keith Van Horn, smh
Brunson and Hart both out tonight, might be worth skipping this game…
Maybe I should skip, but it’s Sunday morning here, instead of the morning of a workday, so I can really pay attention. I hope it’s not too depressing.
To make matters more annoying Booker, who missed Suns last game in Detroit, will of course play tonight.