Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Sunday, August 18, 2019

NY Post: Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson dealing with knee injury at Team USA camp

Marc Berman freaks us all out:

According to a Team USA source, Robinson suffered a knee injury and missed the first two days of practice, beginning with an informal workout Sunday. He returned for two days, but re-injured the knee Wednesday.

Robinson was expected to miss Thursday’s set of scrimmages and practice. A member of the Knicks training staff is in Vegas with Robinson. According to a source close to Robinson, he’s been experiencing “just soreness,” and the team and his camp are being extra cautious after an MRI turned up clean. The scrimmages end Friday.

The Knicks were set to have a member on the main Team USA roster, but power forward Julius Randle was a last-second pullout, citing a family issue.

Robinson, after being named second-team All-Rookie in the spring, is coming off a solid summer-league showing in Sin City. Robinson played all five games and was named to the first-team All-Summer League.

Not dire, but certainly concerning!

By the way, I love the idea of the Summer League having a “First Team.” “Oh yeah, well, I was first team in the Summer League!”

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30 comments on “NY Post: Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson dealing with knee injury at Team USA camp

  1. Owen

    I really hope we won’t be reading an article in five years lamenting what could have been with Mitch….

  2. thenoblefacehumper

    Well I hope it was fun and he learned a lot because it’s time for Mitch to be done with the Team USA camp.

    Speaking of injuries, the Yankees currently have the best record in baseball with Cameron Maybin, Mike Tauchman, and Gio Urshela leading them in wRC+. Cashman plz seize the Knicks.

  3. Hubert

    Hey, not cocky at all but some of the comments here were so NY know it all because Mel Kiper sad so foolish weak sauce fan comments. If he makes the HOF its a bad pick because they didn’t trade down nonsense.

    1. I have no idea what Mel Kiper thinks about Daniel Jones.

    2. I will be thrilled if I am wrong and will gladly eat crow if that one drive (which seemed to be the Giants full first team against the Jets backups) is indicative of what kind of pro he will become.

    3. Did you see Josh Allen, the guy we should have picked at 6? Don’t tell me it’s nonsense that Daniel Jones alone is better than Daniel Jones and Josh Allen.

    4. Pray for Mitch

  4. Hubert

    But the ” if he makes the HOF as the 6th pick it is terrible” is just dumb.

    It’s a process v result argument, Bob. If you go to a casino and put your life savings on red, and it hits, does the result make it a smart choice?

  5. Farfa

    If you go to a casino and put your life savings on red, and it hits, does the result make it a smart choice?

    I don’t know, what is the take of the Austrian economists on that conundrum?

  6. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

    It’s a process v result argument, Bob.

    It’s hard to evaluate picking a guy way above where he probably would have been drafted.

    It depends how certain you are that everyone else is wrong about him and the risk that waiting or trading down could cause you to miss out on him. One of those variables is subjective and the other isn’t really knowable.

    If you are 90% certain he’s going to be a star and there’s no one else on the board you love, then maybe any risk of losing him is unacceptable.

    If you are 50% certain he’s going to be a star, there’s only a 5% chance someone will draft him ahead of you if you wait or trade down, and an alternative player is 40% to be star, the math is a lot different.

  7. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

    I don’t know, what is the take of the Austrian economists on that conundrum?

    Betting your life savings on anything other than a sure thing (or at least extremely close) seems like a bad idea unless of course your life savings is an amount you could easily recoup because it’s not that much. I once bet my entire life savings on a horse, but my life savings was only $200.

    Betting on “red” seems like a bad idea under any circumstances unless of course the wheel is located in Casablanca and everything might not be on the up and up. :-)

  8. alsep73

    I’m a Giants fan, and thus I will root for Gettleman to be right and the entire analytics world to be wrong about Daniel Jones. That said, it’s interesting to see a group of commenters defend the Jones pick when they are so often justifiably skeptical of decisions exactly like it. Gettleman falling in love with a guy with a completely mediocre college career because of one series in an exhibition game that the top prospects skip is the football equivalent of Kevin Knox being picked over SGA or either Bridges because of a 3-on-3 scrimmage.

  9. Farfa

    Betting your life savings on anything other than a sure thing (or at least extremely close) seems like a bad idea unless of course your life savings is an amount you could easily recoup because it’s not that much. I once bet my entire life savings on a horse, but my life savings was only $200.

    Betting on “red” seems like a bad idea under any circumstances unless of course the wheel is located in Casablanca and everything might not be on the up and up. :-)

    Thank you for being such a nice guy (I’m serious, it’s hard to find people whose opinions are in the minority keeping their cool on the web; my entry was obviously a very tongue-in-cheek remark). This blog is such a gem.

  10. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

    Thank you for being such a nice guy

    This blog is such a gem.

    Thanks. I really appreciate that.

    I know I’m not the most popular guy here and occasionally do turn into Satan, but I try to be nice even when I get frustrated or disagree with people.

    I should add one thing that some people may find amusing (or not). To fund my $200 bet on that horse, I sold my only real possession at the time. I owned a black Telecaster Deluxe I bought in my early teens by doing odd jobs and depriving myself of other things. We were pretty poor. So for me to save that much and buy a Telecaster was pretty amazing. I wanted to join my friend’s garage band and decided to get my dream guitar. I’d say that was in about 1973. When I decided I wasn’t as passionate about a music career as I was about the Daily Double, I sold it for $200 to bet on a horse. I’m afraid to look up how much it’s worth now, but I’m sure I didn’t win that much on the horse. I own a Strat and Ovation now, but my guitar playing is not very good. I’d say it’s a little better than Frank’s BPM corrected for weaknesses with defense. :-)

  11. alsep73

    That said, it’s interesting to see a group of commenters defend the Jones pick when they are so often justifiably skeptical of decisions exactly like it.

    Because it’s too late to use the edit button, I should clarify that I meant we’re so often skeptical of basketball (and/or Knicks) decisions exactly like it.

  12. Hubert

    occasionally do turn into Satan

    I can’t speak for another poster, but I am highly certain that you are not the person routinely refered to as satan.

  13. Hubert

    That said, it’s interesting to see a group of commenters defend the Jones pick when they are so often justifiably skeptical of decisions exactly like it. Gettleman falling in love with a guy with a completely mediocre college career because of one series in an exhibition game that the top prospects skip is the football equivalent of Kevin Knox being picked over SGA or either Bridges because of a 3-on-3 scrimmage.

    I actually understand Bob’s argument and agree with him to degree. It’s not so much about defending the pick as it is deriding the know-nothings who act like know it alls and just echo whatever the ESPN narrative is.

    In this case, though, Bob, I think you’re conflating me with other people you hear elsewhere. I actually like most of what Gettelman has done. I share alsep’s concerns about him being a little Phil Jacksonesque and anti-analytics. But he’s rebuilding the team from the lines and he’s doing a decent job at it. I loved the Barkley pick, i don’t mind the Beckham trade, I agree with not paying Collins.

    I just think he has a distorted valuation system and that’s going to creates holes elsewhere. For instance, if you love Jones, fine. But we need an edge rusher, too. We should have come out of that draft with Josh Allen *and* Phil Jones. His distorted valuation and unreasonable infuriation with a guy projected to go in the second or third round cost us a premier edge rushing talent. That’s a huge void that will cost a lot to make up for.

    Likewise with Collins, while it was smart to move on, he had value that could have been captured by trading him. He left a lot of value on the table there again.

    All the value he leaves on the table will come back to bite us, even if Jones is a decent QB.

  14. Bruno Almeida

    @13

    The drag queens have a fantastic expression for this: let the girl live her fantasy.

  15. alsep73

    It’s not so much about defending the pick as it is deriding the know-nothings who act like know it alls and just echo whatever the ESPN narrative is.

    Most of the ones I’m listening to, though, aren’t the know-nothings, but the analytics folks who have pointed out the extreme unlikelihood of a guy with Jones’ statistical profile in college suddenly turning into a Pro Bowl-caliber passer in the NFL. If he does, I will be as thrilled as I’ll be surprised. Football Outsiders’ QB model, for instance — which isn’t perfect, but which have argued correctly that most scouts were undervaluing the likes of Russell Wilson and Patrick Mahomes — “sees Jones as a moderate prospect and good value in the third round.” That is not someone you take with the sixth pick overall, especially when you’re desperate for edge rush help and a prospect the caliber of Allen is sitting there. If it means you have to mortgage some other picks to trade back up from 17 to get Jones, then fine. But even if Gettleman makes some wise moves, he generally seems oblivious to how the modern NFL works.

  16. JK47

    It’s not so much about defending the pick as it is deriding the know-nothings who act like know it alls and just echo whatever the ESPN narrative is.

    Mehhh.

    First of all, I have no dog in this fight, I don’t really care about the Giants and honestly I don’t care much about the NFL anymore. But there’s good reason to be skeptical of Jones getting selected at #6, for obvious reasons: he had pedestrian numbers in college, pretty consistently, over a large sample size.

    I tend to look at sports through a statistical lens, it’s my hobby I guess. The stats don’t really like Jones, and I don’t see any specific reason to disbelieve the stats here. So it ain’t “I just agree with the ESPN talking heads.” ESPN employed fucking Joe Morgan and Krukie for God knows how many years, and those guys spent many years pooh-pooing the “stats guys” who have now taken over the sport. So I don’t give two shits what anybody on ESPN says, trust me on this one.

    I do know how to read numbers though. And Jones’ numbers don’t scream “draft this guy at #6 overall.” They don’t even whisper it. He’s a day two pick most years who was selected as a reach because it was a thin quarterback class and for other non-logical reasons. It was a “gut” pick. Maybe it’ll work out, but he was bad value at 6.

    His ceiling looks like “competent game manager” to me. But what do I know. I’m a random dude on the internet.

  17. Hubert

    Most of the ones I’m listening to, though, aren’t the know-nothings, but the analytics folks who have pointed out the extreme unlikelihood of a guy with Jones’ statistical profile in college suddenly turning into a Pro Bowl-caliber passer in the NFL.

    I agree with you.

    There’s a common theme on the Internet:

    Person A says X.

    Person B has been hearing a lot of people say Y and it drives him crazy.

    Since X sounds a little like Y, Person B responds to Person A as if he said Y.

  18. GoNYGoNYGo - Dolan must sell

    Daniel Jones did a great job last night against a 2nd team defense. I’m happy for Giants fans, but it was like watching Ntilikina vs Tunisia.

    I was VERY impressed with Sam Darnold who was like a surgeon on the field and did things I didn’t see him do last year.

    BTW, coverage for the game was pure garbage. The Giant broadcasters barely knew who the opposition was. Their entire coverage consisted of interviewing Quincy Enunwa and that interview can be boiled down to “Do you think you’ll be healthy this year”. Complete and utter garbage broadcast from a Jets fan’s perspective.

  19. geo

    @13

    The drag queens have a fantastic expression for this: let the girl live her fantasy.

    oh, that’s some funny stuff right there…what would i do without you all…

  20. DRed

    Just pack Mitchell away somewhere safe until camp starts.

    Anyone see the highlight of Mitch rejecting de’aaron fox twice on one play? That was pretty cool

  21. bobneptune

    I’m a Giants fan, and thus I will root for Gettleman to be right and the entire analytics world to be wrong about Daniel Jones.

    I am curious how the “analytics world” quantifies performance statistically when he is playing Clemson with 3 #1 picks on the DL beating him up all day and his WRs have 4.9 40 speed and Clemson DBs have 4.55 average speed?

    I share alsep’s concerns about him being a little Phil Jacksonesque and anti-analytics. But he’s rebuilding the team from the lines and he’s doing a decent job at it. I loved the Barkley pick, i don’t mind the Beckham trade, I agree with not paying Collins.

    I just think he has a distorted valuation system and that’s going to creates holes elsewhere. For instance, if you love Jones, fine. But we need an edge rusher, too. We should have come out of that draft with Josh Allen *and* Phil Jones. His distorted valuation and unreasonable infuriation with a guy projected to go in the second or third round cost us a premier edge rushing talent. That’s a huge void that will cost a lot to make up for.

    He had the 6 and 17. He had his evaluation of all the players. I can only assume when he took Jones at 6 he had some reasonable fear that someone would trade up to 7-16 ( or Washington who absolutely needed a QB would nab him) to nab him and he didn’t want to take that risk. Whether he was right or wrong only depends how the player works out, This notion he “KNEW” Jones would be available at 17 or lower is just people’s opinions. His evaluation was he thought highly enough of Jones not to be willing to take that risk. He may be right or he may be wrong.

    Drafting like poker is a game of incomplete information. There were a lot of experts who thought Phil Simms was an awful reach at 11. 2 chips later Young was proved quite correct.

  22. JK47

    I am curious how the “analytics world” quantifies performance statistically when he is playing Clemson with 3 #1 picks on the DL beating him up all day and his WRs have 4.9 40 speed and Clemson DBs have 4.55 average speed?

    Oh so they played Clemson every week, cool

  23. bobneptune

    I was VERY impressed with Sam Darnold who was like a surgeon on the field and did things I didn’t see him do last year.

    Darnold looks to have a bright future but he made a mind numbingly awful throw on the first play. he never accounted for the weak side safety when he walked to the line of scrimmage and thew a gift wrapped pick six which was dropped.

    Jones was virtually flawless throwing into extremely tight windows with precision:

    Maybe most impressive was the accuracy Jones displayed on the drive, firing several passes into tight windows, including on the touchdown. Fowler had just 1.51 yards of separation on his two catches on the drive, according to NextGen stats. Latimer had 1.79 yards of separation on his two receptions. The league average last season was 2.82 yards.

    Maybe you supposed “advanced stats” guys should , I don’t know…. take note of advanced stats rather than Mel Kiper and the Greek Chorus’s opinions???

    Like I said, I never say the guy play a down in college, but he certainly looked virtually perfect in his debut. We’ll find out how good he is in the fullness of time with many vicissitudes along the way, but he certainly did nothing to disabuse a high first round pick last night.

    It’s a process v result argument, Bob. If you go to a casino and put your life savings on red, and it hits, does the result make it a smart choice?

    As someone who was barred from the Mirage for card counting in 2004 and plays 25 hours of NLH live poker a week winning 7BBS/hr over a large sample, I think I know more about advantage play in casinos tham most and the red/black analogy isn’t worth commenting on. Everyone is undefeated playing results…..

  24. bobneptune

    Oh so they played Clemson every week, cool

    I know smarm trumps facts here but he was playing with sub par athletes his entire career…. and that’s factorial.

  25. Grocer

    Fowler had just 1.51 yards of separation on his two catches on the drive, according to NextGen stats. Latimer had 1.79 yards of separation on his two receptions. The league average last season was 2.82 yards.

    So you’re saying that over time he likely to toss a lot of interceptions to questionable targets? I’m just pulling your chain, don’t care about football at all. One thing I do know is the Greek Chorus was a pretty reliable guide to how the play was gonna go down.

  26. Grocer

    he was playing with sub par athletes his entire career…. and that’s factorial.

    So he’ll be used to
    the kind of teammates he’ll have
    on the Giants, cool.

  27. 2FOR18, understands math

    I wanted Josh Allen at #6. I screamed at the TV when Jones was selected.
    I still think Josh Allen was the proper pick.
    I rewatched a couple of his games after the draft, including the Clemson game, and was shocked at how many dropped passes there were and how little time he had to throw. His accuracy, mobility and toughness were impressive. I saw all of the stats too, but when you have no OL and no WRs and no running game, you’d have to be a one man team like John Elway to have good stats as a QB.

    This is the age of extremes and group think and appeal to authority. The NFL is a league where the experts supported the selections of Heath Shuler, Akili Smith, Dave Klingler, Matt Leinart and Andre Ware as top 6 picks.

    So let’s see Jones play in the NFL before making any conclusions. He looked good in his first series, like he belonged. He looked nothing like the narrative.

  28. 2FOR18, understands math

    As someone who was barred from the Mirage for card counting in 2004..

    I went to this casino in Ocean City, MD recently. They reshuffle after every hand. You might as well just give them your money when you walk in and go back to the beach.

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