SNY.com: Sources: Knicks and Nets have done background work on potential trade target Zach LaVine

This story is actually older than the most recent Thibs hiring story, but all the other new stories are either hagiographies about how great the Thibs hire was or hit pieces about how bad the Thibs hire was, and I think we’ve already exhausted our debates about Thibs before COVID-19 even hit, let alone now, so I didn’t feel like posting any of those articles. So how about a “Should the Knicks trade for Player X?” article. Those are sometimes fun.

From the great Ian Begley:

Before Leon Rose took over as Knicks president, he was a top player agent at CAA. Because of Rose’s past role, there’s been plenty of speculation about the Knicks trading for a player with CAA ties.

The New York Post reported earlier this month that Suns star Devin Booker was the player to “watch out for most” as a potential trade target among Rose’s former clients.

Following Donovan Mitchell’s public frustration with teammate Rudy Gobert, there was fan/media speculation about Mitchell, a CAA client, getting traded to New York. But there are plenty of factors that suggest that neither Miller nor Booker will be traded anytime soon.

Mitchell is eligible for a max contract extension from the Utah Jazz this summer and would be a restricted free agent in the summer of 2021. Booker has four years remaining on his current deal in Phoenix.

Usually, a team doesn’t even consider trading a young star player until he gets close to free agency.

So if we’re speculating about potential trades, it’s more realistic to look at top players who are approaching free agency.

The 2021 free agency class is formidable. If you include players with player options for either 2020 or 2021, the list of free agents next summer (or fall) includes Giannis Antetokounmpo, Anthony Davis, LeBron James, Kawhi Leonard and Victor Oladipo. The potential free agent class of 2022 is strong, too. Players who could be free agents that summer include Paul George, Bradley Beal, Zach LaVine, Aaron Gordon and Jrue Holiday.

We bring that up because those players are more likely to be traded than a player like Mitchell or Booker. And it’s worth noting that both the Knicks and the Nets are among the teams who have been monitoring LaVine’s situation in Chicago. Per SNY sources, both teams have done background work on LaVine to be prepared for the possibility that Chicago ends up listening to trade offers on the 25-year-old guard.

LaVine averaged 25.5 points, 4.8 rebounds, 4.2 assists and 1.5 steals last season for the Bulls. He hit 38 percent of his 3-point attempts and 49.7 percent of his two-point attempts.

It’s fair to say that the Bulls, who have a new team president in Arturas Karsinovas, have yet to find a long-term solution on the coaching sidelines nor have they been successful in surrounding LaVine with talent in recent years. If that instability continues, would LaVine look to leave Chicago when he hits free agency? If so, the Bulls would probably be open to trading him instead of losing him for nothing.

This is what teams like the Knicks and Nets are keeping an eye on with LaVine and the Bulls. Beal and the Wizards, to a certain extent, fit the same profile. With regard to New York and Brooklyn, both teams have the assets to swing a trade for a young, talented player like LaVine.

The Knicks have seven first-round picks over the next four drafts and some young players who are attractive to opposing teams. The Nets have young players on team-friendly contracts (Caris LeVert, Spencer Dinwiddie, Jarrett Allen among them) and are believed to be in the market to trade for a top player to play alongside Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving. The New York Daily New previously reported that the Nets had internal discussions about Beal, a player who can test free agency as early as 2022. You can add LaVine to the list of players that they are monitoring.

It will be interesting to see how both New York teams approach the trade market in the coming months. Similar to free agency in 2019 – when the Nets signed Durant and Irving — they may find themselves competing for the same players.

No thanks on Lavine, but I’ll give Beal this much. He’s one of those guys who you could at least flip for good players if you ever did trade for him. In other words, he’s the type of player that every team could use. Because of that, he would cost too much for it to make sense for the Knicks (especially since they could just sign him in 2022), but I just want to note that there is a huge difference between Bradley Beal and Lavine. Studs like Beal are never going to be like Julius Randle where you acquire them and then it’s like, “Oh, I guess people didn’t actually want this guy, huh?”

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201 thoughts to “SNY.com: Sources: Knicks and Nets have done background work on potential trade target Zach LaVine”

  1. I think Cole will be better than some people here think he will be. I’d rather not draft him anywhere in the lottery but would rather have him than Killian Hayes.

  2. What do people think of Vassell? He seems like a pretty sure fire can’t miss prospect. High floor type player that would at least shoot well and play good defense. Would allow us to move RJ to the 3.

  3. Is there ANY player the Knicks should trade for at this time? I mean, aside from some ridiculous deal like Ben Simmons for Frank and two firsts. The Knicks suck. They’re going to suck for a while. Is there any reasonable move they could make to significantly alter that near future?

    Mike

  4. It doesn’t actually seem like there’s much here: Begley openly admits that he’s speculating and “have done background work” is about the least substantial support you could ever have for this kind of article; your average team has probably “done background work” on damn near every player in the league to at least some extent. That said, it will never not scare me to read an article about the Knicks thinking about making a trade that makes no sense for them based on their current status/position on the win curve.

    Also I just love the sentence “It’s fair to say that the Bulls, who have a new team president in Arturas Karsinovas, have yet to find a long-term solution on the coaching sidelines nor have they been successful in surrounding LaVine with talent in recent years.” Unhappy that the team is bad and they’ve had an unstable coaching situation? Not sure about the team’s direction under a new president? You might be interested in trying to get traded to…(checks notes) the Knicks?

  5. Yea..it’s a no for me. I think Lavine is good, he’s just not a winning player. I totally see him taking the ball away from RJ because he’s a 25 ppg scorer. But, like Randle- he’s not the guy you want as a #1 option. So..harder pass than a Mahomes to Hill deep ball in double coverage lol

    I wouldn’t mortgage the future for Beal either. Teams are asking ridiculous prices for their stars- especially after the Paul George deal. And I thought that was too much to give up for a guy who shrinks in crunch time more often than not. Booker I can understand trading for, but I’d still be leery about the asking price. When I think of “stars”, I think of them relative to the rest of the league- not whether they are the best player on their respective teams. Not every player is a star. A bunch of them are just talented guys with the green light, and sometimes it’s hard to discern who is a star and who’s not. I think Beal is definitely an under-appreciated star, and Booker is thisclose to being a star.

    So, I’d say keep the picks and trade Randle for a veteran leader who is still productive or for a better fit. If He can understand that the offense should run through RJ, I actually wouldn’t mind keeping him with Thibs as coach. He can be what Boozer was but with slightly better defense and rebounding.

  6. Is there ANY player the Knicks should trade for at this time?

    Guys who can shoot and/or defend on the perimeter. Not stars, but role players. Of course, those guys are all probably too expensive, asset-wise, so… dunno.

  7. Knicksy: jump into top 3, pick Cole Anthony despite him being projected to go #15, he is basically Dion Waiters, we all pray that MSG is hit by a meteor

  8. Cole Anthony could definitely become a good player, but I think picking him in the lottery would be sort of drawing on an inside straight. It could happen, definitely. But the odds aren’t great.

  9. Thibs’ hiring is official. Leon Rose quote from the press release:

    “Tom Thibodeau is a proven winner who gets the most out of the players and teams that he has coached. He will bring leadership, accountability and a hard-working mentality to our organization. We are excited to bring him back to New York.”

  10. I’m sorry, but I think Sabrina Ionescu is the most exciting thing in basketball right now. Have you seen her recent highlights? She looks like the whole package on offense: handle, passing, and shooting at every level. And she’s in NYC!

  11. I don’t pay much mind to rumors of us trading for a “star” like Booker or Lavine or whoever.

    The last few seasons there have been a bunch of these rumors and the Knicks have exercised patience and continued to build young assets and picks. They could blow it and make an ill advised trade where they give up picks and youth for a wannabe star or aging vet, but The Knicks haven’t actually done that in awhile. I don’t think they’ll do it for a Beal or Lavine or Booker.

  12. I’m not even sure I would take Cole Anthony with the Clippers’ pick so you can probably guess how I’d feel about taking him with our own.

    I’m sorry, but I think Sabrina Ionescu is the most exciting thing in basketball right now. Have you seen her recent highlights? She looks like the whole package on offense: handle, passing, and shooting at every level. And she’s in NYC!

    She is absolutely incredible. Was pulling off straight up Harden-esque moves last game. Whenever people are allowed to congregate again I look forward to going to MSG to see a competently assembled team on the upswing.

  13. I have to say that all the conversation about potential trades has convinced me that none of them are worthwhile. I’m ok with just drafting players and seeing what happens with everyone under Thibs and during the beginning of the season.

  14. FWIW, one of the beat writers told me that Rose will be part of the Thibs’ presser today at noon. As with the Breen interview, I expect at least 98% vague platitudes, but it’s always possible one or both men offer some hints of their team-building philosophy for this year. We’re not tanking no matter what, but there’s “Thibs develops the kids we have and gets help from a few veteran role players” and there’s “Mitch, RJ, and our lottery pick team up with a lot of 30-year-olds.”

  15. ***Whenever people are allowed to congregate again I look forward to going to MSG to see a competently assembled team on the upswing.***

    Wait, isn’t Isiah the chief executive of the Liberty??

  16. >>> I have to say that all the conversation about potential trades has convinced me that none of them are worthwhile. I’m ok with just drafting players and seeing what happens with everyone under Thibs and during the beginning of the season. <<<

    Making moves to win next season — a season that is going to be shortened, a season that no one really cares about, and one that has a significant chance of being canceled after it begins — would immediately dispel any notions I have that Leon Rose might not suck.

    I'll say this til I'm blue in the face… next season is the easiest punt of all time. Just let Thibs work with what he's got and make decisions in 2021.

  17. Whenever people are allowed to congregate again I look forward to going to MSG to see a competently assembled team on the upswing.

    Aren’t the Liberty playing at Barclays since Joe Tsai bought the team?

  18. Not a fan of LaVine or Cole Anthony. If Lavine defended at all, I;d be more open, but he doesn’t and I’m not so sure I like his attitude. there were some things going on in Chicago last year that had “pinhead” written all over them.

  19. I will laugh so hard if the Nets go into 2021 with Kyrie, LaVine and post-achilles Durant all trying to share the ball.

  20. Wait, isn’t Isiah the chief executive of the Liberty??

    Joe Tsai bought the team, so it’s a legit operation now.

  21. I agree that this should mostly be a punt year. I like Macri’s idea of drafting Avdija (or Vassell?) and bringing in Augustin to run the point for a year or two. I’m not against drafting LaMelo or Hali if those are options, but the Knicks may be better off waiting to find their future lead ball handler in 2021.

  22. The Honorable Cock Jowles:
    I will laugh so hard if the Nets go into 2021 with Kyrie, LaVine and post-achilles Durant all trying to share the ball.

    The Nets are going to be good no matter what if Durant is 95% and Kyrie is healthy. But it was probably a blessing that they didn’t come to the Knicks.

    Kyrie is great talent, but he’s a ball stopper and seems to have difficulties with teammates.

    Durant’s window is going to close fast. They may get some great basketball for a few years. but I’d be shocked if they win a championship.

    It’s not like I’m happy about the rebuild setbacks and bad moves the Knicks made over the last couple of years, but we are still positioned well long term. It’s more a matter of we could have been WAY further along if prior management wasn’t horribly incompetent at “basketball” and “management”. What we need is competence.

  23. ess-dog: Hali if those are options, but the Knicks may be better off waiting to find their future lead ball handler in 2021.

      

    I agree. We have so many needs, there is no reason to force a PG this year. We should rank the players within tiers and try to fill one of our needs within our draft tier. If there’s a PG available that we think can be the PG of the future, by all means draft him, But if not, we desperately need shooters and a stretch PF also. Let’s just hope we get lucky and are in the top tier.

  24. Shams:

    Former Knicks coach Mike Woodson is expected to join the Knicks organization in a capacity, sources tell @TheAthletic Woodson led the Knicks to a 54-28 record in 2012-13, which marks their most recent playoff appearance and highest win total since 1996-97.

    Meanwhile, at the presser, Perry said Thibs would have the autonomy to pick his own staff. So… fun!

  25. Briefly dipping into fantasy world….

    This isn’t saying much, but the Knicks probably have a better chance at Giannis than they had at Kyrie & Durant.

    It really doesn’t take much to attract a star to a big market. It’s a very low hurdle that we consistently fail to meet, but it still remains low.

    All these guys — LeBron, AD, Kawhi, George, Durant, and Kyrie — have shown that they will join a large market franchise as long as:

    1. You’re not a joke.
    2. They can play with another superstar, either immediately or within a year.
    3. There are a few low cost supporting players in place.
    4. You have the ability and willingness to get more.

    That is a really, really low bar. We can get there by 2021. I’m not saying Giannis will do what those other guys did, but we can get there by 2021.

    This is why it is so important to nail that lottery pick. Take a high floor, surefire NBA player. Do not go for the guy with the 2% chance of the highest upside who will probably suck. It’s really simple.

    By 2021, we could be offering the chance to play with RJ, Mitch, our 2020 lotto pick, and our 2021 lotto pick.

  26. I’m glad we have a new coach. I’m not thrilled with Thibs, but he’s had some time off to reflect on his coaching, so I’m very cautiously optimistic. I hope the Knicks just “tank” on whatever season happens this fall/winter.

    I wonder if Herman Cain’s death will have any effect at all on the remaining Covid deniers (I know of one, personally), mask holdouts, etc. Schools are starting up now here in East Tennessee, so we may get reports soon about ill students and teachers. I’m worried for my teacher friends.

  27. Struggling to see the benefits of Rose forcing Woodson onto the staff instead of letting Thibs pick his own assistants. It would be one thing if the Knicks were hiring an ace shooting coach or a young up-and-comer, but it’s friggin’ Mike Woodson. Just let Thibs hire his guys.

  28. I don’t hate this bit from the presser, as tweeted by Vorkunov:

    Leon Rose says the Knicks don’t have a time horizon in place for turning the organization into a playoff team.

    “We have not set a timeline. We’re taking it one day at a time. We felt that Tom is that coach that can take us from development to perennial winner.”

  29. Berman:

    Asked about Knox and Ntilikina, Thibodeau said players go through “growing pains” but doesn’t want to make further observations until he gets with them.

  30. Howard Megdal:

    “I think gametime is important also,” Thibodeau says of getting playing time for young players, adding the importance of utilizing the G-League for this as well

    That would be a bit of a shift in organizational philosophy, since the last couple of regimes seemed reluctant to send young guys on the main roster to Westchester to get more playing time and iron problems out.

    Also from Megdal:

    When asked for specific players who stood out based on film, Thibodeau specifically pointed out RJ Barrett and Mitchell Robinson.

  31. If you can get LaVine in some sort of salary dump, then sure, whatever. Plug him into the Bobby Portis salary slot. It’s not like we’re doing anything better with that cap space for a while anyway. Of course you shouldn’t give up any draft picks or promising young players for him.

    Cole Anthony is one of those players who looks terrible both in a box score and by the eye test.

  32. “I wonder if Herman Cain’s death will have any effect at all on the remaining Covid deniers (I know of one, personally), mask holdouts, etc.”

    It will have just as much impact as the fact New York has almost as many COVID deaths as Florida, Texas, California, Illinois, and Michigan COMBINED has on the slobberingly positive media coverage of Andrew Cuomo.

    Mike

  33. Knox, specifically, could desperately use reps in the G-league to work on his game and gain confidence (and learn to play at a high-energy level for a full 30 minutes).

    But everything sounds good in pressers. Fiz sounded like a badass. Let’s see how Thibs/Rose handle their first 10-game losing streak.

  34. I wonder if Herman Cain’s death will have any effect at all on the remaining Covid deniers (I know of one, personally), mask holdouts, etc. Schools are starting up now here in East Tennessee, so we may get reports soon about ill students and teachers. I’m worried for my teacher friends.

    I was going to say, “Come on, you know these people are too dumb for that,” but Mike did it more concisely.

  35. MBunge: It will have just as much impact as the fact New York has almost as many COVID deaths as Florida, Texas, California, Illinois, and Michigan COMBINED has on the slobberingly positive media coverage of Andrew Cuomo.

    This kind of non sequitir response is the kind of quality content we can count on from the off-brand neptune

  36. MBunge:
    “I wonder if Herman Cain’s death will have any effect at all on the remaining Covid deniers (I know of one, personally), mask holdouts, etc.”

    It will have just as much impact as the fact New York has almost as many COVID deaths as Florida, Texas, California, Illinois, and Michigan COMBINED has on the slobberingly positive media coverage of Andrew Cuomo.

    Mike

    When did most of NYC’s Covid deaths take place again? Oh, and which way are Covid deaths trending in Texas and Florida? Mmm… do you have any more of these delightfully half-baked gold nuggets to share?

  37. It will have just as much impact as the fact New York has almost as many COVID deaths as Florida, Texas, California, Illinois, and Michigan COMBINED has on the slobberingly positive media coverage of Andrew Cuomo.

    You ever gonna defend your guys Trump, DeSantis, Abbott, etc. or is the plan to just keep bangin’ the ol’ Cuomo drum?

  38. I love it when people bring up NY’s covid numbers as some indictment on failed liberal policies.

    NYC is literally the most densely populated city in the country. Its also the most global city in the country. Flights from all over the world come into JFK every day. Half of the city rides the subway every day. There was no way NYC (and thus NY state, NJ, CT, PA) were going to escape high covid numbers back in the Spring. It would have taken a miracle for that to not happen.

  39. Brian Cronin: I was going to say, “Come on, you know these people are too dumb for that,” but Mike did it more concisely.

    True, in the course of moving the goalposts, the question did get answered.
    :-)

  40. But everything sounds good in pressers. Fiz sounded like a badass. Let’s see how Thibs/Rose handle their first 10-game losing streak.

    Yup, I’m not getting too excited about anything so far. But having people who at least know the right things to say is better than having someone swagger in and declare it’s playoffs-or-bust this year, you know?

  41. I get the ball and then I go and play
    Like a superstar in the NBA
    The forwards, the centers, and all the guards
    The ones you see on the bubblegum cards
    Me and homeboy would go one-on-one
    ‘Cause playing the game is a lot of fun
    Sit by the TV and watch ’em all
    ‘Cause Kurtis Blow is rappin’ basketball

    oh yeah – they’re playing basketball…hopefully zion gets on the court today…the clips and lakers should be fun later tonight…

  42. >>> Asked about Knox and Ntilikina, Thibodeau said players go through “growing pains” but doesn’t want to make further observations until he gets with them. <<<

    I'm not saying it will make them good players, but Knox and Ntilikina will likely get more impactful coaching from Thibs in the first week of training camp than they both got combined in the previous two years under Fizdale and Miller.

  43. I like how you let the dumb version of Bob Neptune talk all he wants because you can easily dominate him, and his takes confirm to your bias of how stupid trump supporters are.

    But the guy who was actually intelligent and held his own and probably won ~50% of his arguments against the hive mind got banned because you couldn’t handle the disagreement.

    Pussies.

  44. Dink:
    Struggling to see the benefits of Rose forcing Woodson onto the staff instead of letting Thibs pick his own assistants. It would be one thing if the Knicks were hiring an ace shooting coach or a young up-and-comer, but it’s friggin’ Mike Woodson. Just let Thibs hire his guys.

    It’s probably not Rose. It’s probably Dolan. Dolan wan’t eyes and ears in the locker room. That will be Woodson’s job and eventual path to the head coaching gig if things don’t go as well as hoped over the next 2 years.

  45. Why do people think Mike Woodson is bad?

    I mean, I got frustrated at Woodson his last season for sure but when you think that Chandler was hurt a good portion of it and he had Bargs on the team (which he couldn’t just not play since he was the big acquisition), that team actually did ok and got their shit together at the end of the year, missing the playoffs by one game.

    The year before he coached a 54 win team. Year before that he finished the season 18-6.

    Before that, he coached Atlanta and took them from a young, non playoff team to a 50 plus win team. When you talk about development, Woodson in ATL is a good example of that.

    I do think its weird to put him on the staff if its not Thibs choice. But is Woodson a bad coach? What empirical evidence do we have of that other than “the east is big” memes?

  46. ess-dog: When did most of NYC’s Covid deaths take place again? Oh, and which way are Covid deaths trending in Texas and Florida? Mmm… do you have any more of these delightfully half-baked gold nuggets to share?

    Deaths are a trailing indicator sometimes as much as a month or more behind what is actually going on. To begin with it, it take several weeks to go from infection, to hospitalization, to ICU, to death. Then it sometimes take weeks before the death is actually reported and dumped into the total way later than when it actually occurred. Even cases are lagging badly because of testing turn around and reporting.

    The pandemic is basically close to end stage in Florida and Texas now (as it was in Arizona when the dummies in the media were still freaking out).

    The pattern is basically the same everywhere. There is exponential growth until the infection rate reaches about 5%-10% of the local population, then it flattens out and starts declining quickly. Once it gets to the 15%-20% range it start dropping rapidly and slowly turns into a trickle of new cases. That’s where most of NY is now. The details and exact percentages vary depending on specific factors in that area, but the pattern is the same. The HIT rate is WAY lower than the fear mongers and politically motivated have been suggesting. That’s the point where exponential growth stops and it starts slowing on it’s own.

    We are basically a week or two away from getting good news out of Florida and maybe a week or two more than that out of Texas even though are already getting better. The deaths and cases will keep being reported, but that’s a timing issue. The media and epidemiologists that have been wrong about everything and keep changing their minds just don’t know it yet. The people that analyze data do.

  47. But the guy who was actually intelligent and held his own and probably won ~50% of his arguments against the hive mind got banned because you couldn’t handle the disagreement.

    Pussies.

    I think most of neptune’s antagonists didn’t want him banned. Most of the people who wanted him banned were of the “I hate politics talk” variety.

  48. We are basically a week or two away from getting good news out of Florida and maybe a week or two more than that out of Texas even though are already getting better. The deaths and cases will keep being reported, but that’s a timing issue. The media and epidemiologists that have been wrong about everything and keep changing their minds just don’t know it yet. The people that analyze data do.

    This is the “Phil Jackson Was A B+ POBO” of COVID takes

  49. Swift, I think Woodson averages out as a replacement-level coach. He’s had good moments and really stupid ones, but his players seem to really like and respect him. The issues with him being on Thibs’ staff are twofold:

    1)It smacks of him, as Strat said, being a spy for Dolan and an easy fallback option if/when Thibs struggles. He’d basically be the new Herb Williams.

    2)While he’s occasionally ahead of the curve (the 2-PG smallball lineup of the 54-win team, the constantly-switching defensive scheme), more often than not he comes across as something of a basketball reactionary. And Thibs is already a guy with a reputation for relying on schemes and rotations that are outdated. You want to surround him with forward-thinkers, not guys who will only encourage his more conservative tendencies.

  50. hey hubie…if you need someone by your side, i’m your huckleberry…lord knows i watch enough cnn/msnbc/oan/fox to have a fair understanding of what kind of mess is happening on both sides…

    i will say reference bob and mike, doesn’t seem like much question that the tone and direction of this site has changed pretty dramatically over the last week or so…

    seems like we have a lot more folks comfortable to engage lately…it seems there were a lot of folks (particularly those not living here in the states with us) who didn’t appreciate the constant political vitriol and animosity…easy enough to turn the boob tube on to get that…

    personally, i’m thankful to get the chance to read all the different views on basketball and life…

  51. Why do people think Mike Woodson is bad?

    I mean, I got frustrated at Woodson his last season for sure but when you think that Chandler was hurt a good portion of it and he had Bargs on the team (which he couldn’t just not play since he was the big acquisition), that team actually did ok and got their shit together at the end of the year, missing the playoffs by one game.

    The year before he coached a 54 win team. Year before that he finished the season 18-6.

    Woody’s main thing was that he ran D’Antoni’s offense while not being D’Antoni, which was a major benefit at that point in time due to the Melo/D’Antoni feud (as Melo would only buy in once D’Antoni was gone). Then he quickly ran away from what worked in the 54-win season (as the team dropped from the 3rd best offense to the 11th, while also getting much worse on defense). I didn’t think he was doing much in the 54-win season and the 18-6 besides “not being D’Antoni so that Melo would do what D’Antoni kept asking him to do but wouldn’t do because he was feuding with D’Antoni,” and then he was really exposed the following season.

  52. stratomatic – come back to us…deeefense just doesn’t have the same pizzazz/cache…you built that stratomatic brand, you should enjoy it…

  53. >>> I think most of neptune’s antagonists didn’t want him banned. Most of the people who wanted him banned were of the “I hate politics talk” variety. <<<

    If that were true, Brian would have banned talking politics. But he didn't. He banned Bob Neptune.

    And y'all still talk politics, acting as if being liberal is some great human commonality like music, TV, sports.

  54. From the end of Berman’s account of the presser (which has longer versions of some of the quotes I used above), which is otherwise mostly about Knox, Frank, Mitch, and RJ:

    Rose has to make decision on whether to exercise team options on Taj Gibson, Reggie Bullock, Elfrid Payton and Bobby Portis. Maurice Harkless is an outright free agent. Gibson has played for Thibodeau before in Minnesota and Chicago and could be a candidate to return. Portis and Payton are expected to be goners.

  55. Portis and Payton are expected to be goners.

    I wonder if the Augustin speculation is based on something the front office is putting out there.

    And yeah, as I said the other day, I’d be shocked if they brought Portis back.

  56. >>> hey hubie…if you need someone by your side, i’m your huckleberry… <<<

    I appreciate it, geo. But I was rarely on Bob's side. Lord knows he came at me a lot. I just liked him, and thought the decision to ban him was pathetic and anyone who did have a part in it should be embarrassed.

    Watching the same guy who banned Bob toy with MBunge really just shows me what it was all about. Some people don't like opponents who are their own size, ones who can punch you back. They like to pick on the little guys instead, so they can feel dominant and superior.

  57. Alan:
    From the end of Berman’s account of the presser (which has longer versions of some of the quotes I used above), which is otherwise mostly about Knox, Frank, Mitch, and RJ:

    If we are going long term…I don’t see a need for any of those individuals to be on this roster…they are all well known commodities and easily replaceable…I guess you could argue that if we keep them at the expense of younger prospects then we lose less games (i.e., show we are not tankign) but we will lose our fair share with them on the roster anyway…

  58. just to clarify as I clipped off berman’s comment…i was referring to the guys with team options and/or free agents..

  59. The media and epidemiologists that have been wrong about everything and keep changing their minds just don’t know it yet. The people that analyze data do.

    Can you read some primary sources and tell me what exactly epidemiologists have been wrong about, outside of trolling about the mask issue that was dealt with months ago?

    New York had an explosion of cases due to its density and status as an international hub. Then we locked down, made masking widespread, and slowly suppressed the virus. Now we’re reopening some things safely but not being reckless with unnecessary indoor activities, and the virus isn’t gaining a lot of traction (*knocks on wood*). This is basically exactly what epidemiologists said would happen.

    Texas, Florida, and Arizona acted completely recklessly from the start and are now paying the exact price epidemiologists said they would eventually. California initially acted responsibly but reopened far, far too early and, well, same goes for them.

    There are a lot of people who have gotten everything wrong, but they’ve been the COVID contrarians like Alex Berenson and some guy who used to post here who went by “stratomatic.”

  60. Watching the same guy who banned Bob toy with MBunge really just shows me what it was all about. Some people don’t like opponents who are their own size, ones who can punch you back. They like to pick on the little guys instead, so they can feel dominant and superior.

    The decision to ban bob wasn’t mine and I said I wouldn’t have done it, but he derailed far more conversations than Mike. It makes sense to differentiate on that basis.

    Mike just kind of sticks his head in every once in a while, says the dumbest shit imaginable, gets owned, and vanishes for a welcome period of time.

  61. geo:
    stratomatic – come back to us…deeefense just doesn’t have the same pizzazz/cache…you built that stratomatic brand, you should enjoy it…

    And aptly, as the game stratomatic is an outdated relic that no one pays attention to any more.

  62. Hubert: Watching the same guy who banned Bob toy with MBunge really just shows me what it was all about. Some people don’t like opponents who are their own size, ones who can punch you back. They like to pick on the little guys instead, so they can feel dominant and superior.

    What a shallow, moronic thing to say. I wonder who would be dumb enough to post it….

    Oh, never mind.

  63. Pressers are all meaningless, but Rose starting there’s no timetable to compete is a welcome change.

    Berman reporting that Payton and Portis are expected to be let go signals a move in the right direction too. Even as a Payton fan, I’d much rather get a young guy in that position. My speculation is that the position goes to our 1st rounder (LaMelo?!).

    No mention of DSJr either which may signal that he’s on his way out.

    Again, pressers are meaningless but it’s fun to speculate.

  64. probably won ~50% of his arguments against the hive mind

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH DYING OF LAUGHTER AT MY KEYBOARD HERE HAHAHAHAHAHAH

    BOTH SIDES BAD HUBERT IS HERE TO SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT

  65. thenoblefacehumper: The decision to ban bob wasn’t mine and I said I wouldn’t have done it, but he derailed far more conversations than Mike. It makes sense to differentiate on that basis.

    Mike just kind of sticks his head in every once in a while, says the dumbest shit imaginable, gets owned, and vanishes for a welcome period of time.

    Yeah, I was one of those who mostly just scrolled past the posts. There were a lot to scroll through.

  66. Z-man: And aptly, as the game stratomatic is an outdated relic that no one pays attention to any more.

    I enjoyed Stratomatic Baseball in my college years, but soon moved on to Pursue the Pennant and then later Dynasty League, Haven’t pretty much all of those moved on to computers?

  67. i liked him too – he was a character…i kind of like to fuck with people, so, i appreciated bob’s skill at it…but, it became the bob show…i don’t know, maybe bob was just a little too good at being bob…

    i get what you’re saying reference the decision making process, however – if the end result is we get more: clash, bo, KFINJ, leonam, wetbandit, totes, KYK, raven, oakman cometh, TNFH, farfa, vincoug, jk, tsam, alan, early bird, raven, ras, dred, nick c, milo, dink, E, cdiggy, donnie, big blue, strat, latke, glass half, d-mar, grocer, djphan, z-man, bruno, THCJ, oaktrees, pepper, ess-dog, owen, count de pennies, swift, yourself and all the other folks i forgot…not a bad bargain…

  68. Unsurprising that Jowles thinks he batted 1.000.

    FWIW, I said 50% to be polite. He wiped the floor with you more often than not, you’re just too self-insulated to know it.

  69. I think the argument that Bob was a more effective troll has, um, some flaws.

    NBA season starts tonight! Stoked for that.

  70. >>> but, it became the bob show…i don’t know, maybe bob was just a little too good at being bob… <<<

    It became the Bob show because, despite there be 10,000,000 places on the internet to bitch about Donald Trump and his supporters, some people insisted on making this basketball blog number 10,000,001 and were shocked – shocked! – that not everyone has the same political bent as them.

    The obvious response would have been to shut down the political talk. Instead, you shut down the vocal adversary.

    This is now a community for Knicks fans who are democrats. You've made it very clear that a poster's right to constantly introduce liberal politics is unassailable, but a poster's right to consistently dissent is grounds for banning.

    That's an embarrassment to everyone in this community, whether you asked for Bob to be banned or not.

  71. Macri:

    Thibs, on the Michael Kay Show, mentions trying to generate corner 3’s specifically as a tenet of good offenses in the modern game, and then talks about how taking the wrong types of 3’s can feed into what the defense wants.

    and

    The Wolves, per @cleantheglass, were bottom 8 in frequency of corner 3’s during Thibs first 2 years, and climbed to 18th at the time he was fired in 2019.

    Old dog maybe understands need for new tricks?

    Also, MSG will follow the presser video with a Thibs one-on-one interview with Bill Pidto.

  72. Hey look, everyone — Hubert maybe took an extra tab of work drugs today and wants to start a fight on the internet! Me? I’m tickled.

    Yeah, the guy who gets most of his opinions from Tucker Carlson wipes the floor with me. You’re right. You’re so right, Hubert. You’re such a smart boy! Good job, here’s a gold star, you little smartie pants, you!

  73. This is now a community for Knicks fans who are democrats. You’ve made it very clear that a poster’s right to constantly introduce liberal politics is unassailable, but a poster’s right to consistently dissent is grounds for banning.

    I don’t think this is true. Some people are clearly not Democrat’s and are still posting here. I myself don’t like either party much and wish there was a better alternative. It’s always a shame when someone is banned, but in this case the forum immediately became more peaceful and more about basketball. I hope it stays that way.

  74. Hubert: That’s an embarrassment to everyone in this community, whether you asked for Bob to be banned or not.

    Funny how so few of us feel that way. Probably because Trumpism is not Republicanism or Conservatism. It is closer to constitutionally restrained (for now) fascism. It doesn’t take a whole lot of intelligence to see that. You don’t have to be a liberal to see that (see: Romney, Kasich, Schmidt, Scarborough, Bush, Flake, Corker, etc., etc.

    I’d be fine with a poster who incessantly spouted the most radical antifa/anarchist rhetoric being banned as well. Or not. I trust Brian’s judgment, and he’s the one who banned him. I guess he’s the pussy you’re referring to.

  75. TheClashFan: I enjoyed Stratomatic Baseball in my college years, but soon moved on to Pursue the Pennant and then later Dynasty League, Haven’t pretty much all of those moved on to computers?

    I was an APBA guy…never like Stratomatic…but once it went to computer based, i.e., no more dice rolling…seemed like it took all the fun out of it…

  76. I think the definition of an internet pussy is “one that calls others pussies without having to come face to face with those so called pussies”

  77. I registered Democrat in 2017, so maybe I’m just one of those pussy-come-latelys just looking to pile onto the unfairly-maligned Orange Man.

  78. I can see how some may have viewed bob as “winning” some of those exchanges because it’s just plain tedious to have to repeat things like “actually bob, Breitbart isn’t a good source” or “actually bob, everyone was taught that the Democratic Party used to be racist and bringing it up in defense of everything Trump does is not actually a defense of Trump” or “actually bob, there’s a lot of hard data on the existence of structural racism” over and over and over again.

    So eventually a lot of people just started telling him to fuck off, basically. I guess Hubert views him as having “won” those exchanges.

  79. pepper: I was an APBA guy…never like Stratomatic…but once it went to computer based, i.e., no more dice rolling…seemed like it took all the fun out of it…

    I played APBA too, when I was in my teens! Many many years ago. I liked the “Advanced” Strato with the lefty-rights splits, but moved on to PtP as soon as I heard about it. PtP was great and developed into Dynasty League. I still have some DL cards around here, but haven’t played any tabletop baseball games in many years.

  80. Neptune “won” the arguments why exactly, because Trump is so kickass? That was his main thrust.

    Dude didn’t win shit. He mostly embarrassed himself by incessantly licking the ass of a president who is an abject failure and who is about to get his ass kicked by a dude who is barely even campaigning.

    I mean the fucking guy thought that maybe it was plausible that Trump was just “inspecting” the bunker. Libs owned again!

  81. I’ll just say for my part that I had to stop coming to this website for a while because of the incessant politics discussion, 99.9% of which centered around bob. Maybe it’s unfair to put the exclusive blame for that on him when there were plenty of people on the left side of the spectrum who were taking part, but it seems to me that banning him solved the problem as I see it. Yes, there’s still politics chatter but it’s relatively in line with the normal volume of OT chatter on other topics and the vitriol has been dialed down back to a reasonable level.

    Is it fair to look at a 5 on 1 fight and conclude that the easiest way to stop fighting is to just get rid of the 1? Nope, but I will say that most of the people that regularly engaged bob from the left also are regular posters about, you know, basketball and the Knicks and stuff like that, and by the end it sure seemed to me like bob was exclusively posting about politics and always looking to provoke a confrontation. I don’t know if he was intentionally trolling but any troll would’ve been proud of the work he was doing here. Fairness aside the site was in danger of being ruined in my eyes, so something had to be done.

  82. As a long time (like since 2011 or so) lurker/occasional poster, I will say that about the only thing that ever made me uninterested to read this blog was megathreads of political poop flinging, and I think it’s fair to say bob had a disproportionate role in relentlessly hijacking threads to argue politics. It’s probably also fair to lay blame at the feet of his sparring partners, but, from my perspective as someone who mostly reads the blog rather than actively posting, I’m not sure it’s such a bad thing that he’s gone.

  83. well then, allow me to retort:

    fucking bob did win – all the time, thread after thread, day after day, week after week – every single time someone replied to some of the disingenuous crap he said…i really don’t think bob believed half the shit he wrote – he most definitely knew which buttons to push though…

    talk about marshmallow test failure…interesting individual, he wasn’t all that appetizing though…it wasn’t like he was a beautiful blonde with big tits and an ass that tastes like french vanilla ice cream…he was just old man bob who lived in florida, liked gambling and lenjoyed messing with folks…

  84. Can you read some primary sources and tell me what exactly epidemiologists have been wrong about, outside of trolling about the mask issue that was dealt with months ago?

    1. Fauci is on record early on saying the United States had nothing to worry about

    2. Fauci initially did not think it was essential to close off the US when the virus started spreading out the US.

    3. Fauci is on record saying masks are not essential and may even pose some health risks and then did a complete turn around. The latest is that we may need goggles too.

    4. They were all wrong about the IFR. It was initially estimated to be 3.4%, but it’s closer to .5% -.7% and perhaps lower

    5. Virtually every model created by epidemiologists to make projections about cases, deaths, etc.. (also used by the white house) has been laughable wrong throughout and keeps getting modified to avoid embarrassment. The most significant being the original British one that caused the world wide panic, lock downs and closures.

    6. Virtually every mainstream epidemiologist is using a herd immunity model that is apparently wrong. Those models assume everyone is equally vulnerable and equally likely to spread it. That suggests exponential growth almost indefinitely until you reach herd immunity. However, all the evidence indicates that not everyone is equally vulnerable and not everyone is an equal spreader. That changes the math dramatically and suggests that each location would get exponential growth for a period of time, then it would flatten, then new cases would reverse and start declining long before the 70%-80% their models suggested. That’s exactly what’s happening all over the world. It was a couple of stats guys WITHOUT a background in epidemiology (climate scientists that looked at the data) that first suggested that. Now other data guys are agreeing, continued…

  85. I will say that on my old Blogspot site, sometime during the 2008 presidential campaign, I had to put in a No Politics rule, because it became clear that every single comment thread would be ruined the second someone on mentioned anything even vaguely political. It wasn’t always the most elegant solution — and I had to violate it myself whenever I wound up writing about shows that were dealing with political material, like The Wire or 24 or SNL — but banning the subject from the comments (and deleting anything by people who didn’t abide by the rule) more or less kept the conversation healthy, friendly, and on-topic for years after. (Including when I moved on to a new site.)

    I think it’s impossible in American life in 2020 to never talk about politics, if only because the pandemic that’s affecting all of us has been made political. So I don’t think that a similar rule by Mike K. or Brian would make as much sense here as it did for me a dozen years ago. But I have to admit that I hate seeing threads here turn political, and the site had become pretty unreadable for a while. Bob was the primary instigator, but the fact that nobody could resist taking his bait just made everything worse. Since Bob got banned, the comment threads have been vastly more readable and Knickerblogger-y, even when we’re arguing about things have nothing to do with this team or this sport.

    But this thread is starting to turn into one bringing back memories of those unpleasant final Bob weeks, and, to quote Joe Girardi, it’s not what you want. Everyone’s obviously free to post about what they want to, but I’d ask people to consider that not ever perceived attack requires a defense. And if we can’t all come to an agreement on the idea that Phil Jackson was a hopelessly incompetent POBO, there’s no way we’ll ever convince one another to change our stances re 45. So maybe restraint in that area is a good thing?

  86. When this pandemic started, people would express personal views starting like this.

    “I’m not an epidemiologist, but I think XYZ”

    They would do that to downplay their expertise, but still offer an opinion based on the data they were seeing.

    Now they should start their comments, “I’m not an epidemiologist, so there’s a chance I’m actually right about something because I’m looking at data”.

    lmao

  87. don’t mind me, i’m just making a list, cuz, making lists makes me happy…

    clash, bo, KFINJ, leonam, wetbandit, totes, KYK, raven, oakman cometh, TNFH, farfa, vincoug, jk, tsam, alan, early bird, raven, ras, dred, nick c, milo, dink, E, cdiggy, donnie, big blue, strat, latke, glass half, d-mar, grocer, djphan, z-man, bruno, THCJ, oaktrees, pepper, ess-dog, owen, count de pennies, swift,

    ugh, how could i forget the all seeing eye thing…which reminds me of another interesting pic: knickerbloggerpower something something…

    add: mike h, knickerpowerblogger, bc, mike k, hubie, mike b…47 and counting…i know one of you weirdos must have a spreadsheet on all of us already :)

  88. Haha thanks for the shout out geo! Seriously, though, Uncle Geo rambles are easily one of the top three best things on the internet. You, sir, are a knickerblogger treasure.

    Re: politics, would a weekly containment thread maybe work? I’ve seen that be effective elsewhere, where there’s a dedicated post each week for people to take each other to the cleaners over politics with the expectation that it be kept out of the normal threads.

  89. That’s not a bad idea, Mike, though IIRC, Mike K. tried that once earlier this year, with mixed results. For a while, the subject was contained there, but pretty soon it bled back into the main discussion. That we often go days at a time without a new thread(*) doesn’t always help matters.

    (*) This isn’t a knock on Mike K. or Brian, by the way. This site is a side thing for them, and also it’s been a very slow time for Knicks news, even with the Thibs hire. And we’re a chatty group. Brian only posted this new thread this morning, and it’s already up to 100+ comments.

  90. TheClashFan: I played APBA too, when I was in my teens!Many many years ago. I liked the “Advanced” Strato with the lefty-rights splits, but moved on to PtP as soon as I heard about it.PtP was great and developed into Dynasty League. I still have some DL cards around here, but haven’t played any tabletop baseball games in many years.

    I can’t remember why my buddy and I were against Stratomatic…we just really loved APBA..we spent our entire summers playing that……our parents hated that game so much..because we never left the house…

  91. Who the fuk is KYK geo?
    This smells like a provocation!
    Don’t make it political!

  92. I wonder if it might be more effective sans bob, though? Also we’d probably have to at least consciously try to keep politics in the containment thread, which as you mention might be too much to expect from a blog in the position we’re in.

  93. It’s the offseason. I don’t see why politics should be banned so we can discuss Julius Randle for the 5,692,718th time. We’re a pretty eclectic group that talk about whatever comes to our minds. I like that about this blog.

  94. Hubert, I’m someone who lands in the okay side of things with Bob’s ban. Not that he was consistently foolish (Strat just compared epidemiologists unfavorably to those who ‘do analysis,’ while showing an extraordinarily ignorant lack of understanding about how virus spread occurs — but I kind of appreciate his nutcake hot takes); but he did two things that were unforgivable. He was non-stop offensive — not an occasional blow-up like drinking bleach, but constant, un-ending insults and degradation of his opponents. It was a non-stop barrage of personal invective and name-calling. But it was really the second that cemented it for me — the fact that he delighted in hijacking this site just to hear his own voice. It often felt that every other post on a 400-post thread was Bob insulting someone. I’m fine with someone like

    – Mike

    popping in, saying something I disagree with, and maybe providing a response to a response. It’s the taking over of Knickerblogger for an endless Bob-fest that I took offense at. As others have said, the tone of this site has changed dramatically since the ban. We’re still a cantankerous, insulting bunch, but it’s back to being a dialog, not one old bastard bashing his keyboard as fast as he can, all day and all night.

    Frankly, if I had 200 posts in a 400-post thread extolling the virtues of Haliburton, I probably should be banned, too.

  95. zion is playing tonight, albeit limited minutes. the pels have actually been a damn good team with zion and favors healthy, in a smallish sample. every game is huge for them. would be nice if playoff teams like utah had any incentive to win games.

  96. 1. Fauci is on record early on saying the United States had nothing to worry about

    2. Fauci initially did not think it was essential to close off the US when the virus started spreading out the US.

    3. Fauci is on record saying masks are not essential and may even pose some health risks and then did a complete turn around. The latest is that we may need goggles too.

    I explicitly said not to troll about shit that some people got “wrong” prior to having new information about a brand new virus, and it seems like you got both 1 and 2 from Trump’s factually incorrect drivel. Shocker!

    4. They were all wrong about the IFR. It was initially estimated to be 3.4%, but it’s closer to .5% -.7% and perhaps lower

    Who is “they?” IFR is very population specific, and has changed (i.e. lowered) as treatment has improved. This is incredibly stupid.

    5. Virtually every model created by epidemiologists to make projections about cases, deaths, etc.. (also used by the white house) has been laughable wrong throughout and keeps getting modified to avoid embarrassment. The most significant being the original British one that caused the world wide panic, lock downs and closures.

    *Yawn*

    The Imperial College model projected what would happen absent the very lock downs you’re condemning. Look no further than how the virulently anti-lockdown states are doing right now if you think it was hyperbolic. We’re at 150,000+ deaths with no end in sight with a lot of mitigation, you really think 2.2 million was out of the question if we did nothing?

    6. Virtually every mainstream epidemiologist is using a herd immunity model that is apparently wrong. Those models assume everyone is equally vulnerable and equally likely to spread it.

    Who is saying this?

  97. (Strat just compared epidemiologists unfavorably to those who ‘do analysis,’

    Strat’s intention was to compare epidemiologists unfavorably with Strat

  98. “oh shit…sygnómi agapité mou fíle…”

    :-)
    As long as you avoided calling me KGB or KKNOX it seems political correct!

  99. Having said all of that, and as a regular offender (though usually in response to someone else), I do agree with Alan that while an all-out ban is too heavy handed a good-faith effort to avoid politics is probably for the best. So in light of that:

    I think Cole will be better than some people here think he will be. I’d rather not draft him anywhere in the lottery but would rather have him than Killian Hayes.

    This is an incredibly stupid basketball opinion!

  100. thenoblefacehumper:
    Having said all of that, and as a regular offender (though usually in response to someone else), I do agree with Alan that while an all-out ban is too heavy handed a good-faith effort to avoid politics is probably for the best. So in light of that:

    This is an incredibly stupid basketball opinion!

    Typically twerpy.

  101. I play Diamond Mind at imagine sports, its an incredibly fun historical baseball simulation. Much better than What if Sports. Has many owners who talk about playing stratomatic and Bill James baseball back in the mail order days, Im not old enough to have participated back then but Im sure I wouldve. Ive been playing online at imagine sports since 2007, also has a great community with different message boards. They have an off topic board where people can talk politics but anytime someone comments on the general or advice board about politics they are immediately told to take it to the off topic board.

    But anyway if someone is looking to play an online simulation baseball game definitely check it out.

  102. I’m SO perverted that I’d prefer to watch a meaningless shitty knicks game right now instead of an LA derby but I’ll turn my heart to stone and suffer patiently…

  103. Out Of The Park Baseball (OOTP) is the GOAT of baseball simulations. I’m an avid player and I shudder to think how many hours I have sunk into that particular black hole.

  104. I know its often compared to the ESPN Bill James version but again I wasn’t around back then. I know Diamond Mind was created by Tom Tippett, for me its just a real fun online community of baseball fans.

  105. Geo, it’s false to assume that more people were turned away by Bob than by the posters who come on here injecting political talk where it doesn’t belong. How many wetbandits are there who are solid posters but just don’t want to deal with the vitriol tossed at them if they’re not liberal?

    Raven, I hear you, but Bob was no less offensive than Jowles or Z-Man, and those two hijack an equal amount of threads with petty nonstop personal arguments. The three of them are equal across the board. So why was Bob banned but the other two permitted to carry on with their daily insults and mindless political garbage? Pretty obvious, if you ask me. They’re liberal. It’s ok to be a cunt here as long as you agree with the political leanings of the moderators.

  106. quality of play has been pretty high so far under the circumstances. zion low key does some really stupid shit on defense.

  107. It’s very illiberal of Knickerblogger to ban someone because they have differing views. That only shuts people off from dialogue.

  108. it’s false to assume that more people were turned away by Bob than by the posters who come on here injecting political talk where it doesn’t belong.

    Ah yes, the ‘silent majority’.

    Come on man, less frequent posters like Mike Honcho, Raven, and thenamestam already chimed in to say that bob was the main problem with the political discussions. Let’s take them at their word.

  109. ***Bob was no less offensive than Jowles or Z-Man, and those two hijack an equal amount of threads with petty nonstop personal arguments. The three of them are equal across the board.***

    I’m sure you’ve read enough of this site to know that Jowles and Z-Man actually discuss basketball here a vast majority of the time. Bob did not. On a basketball team’s fan site, the three are NOT equal across the board.

  110. i get what you’re saying reference the decision making process, however – if the end result is we get more: clash, bo, KFINJ, leonam, wetbandit, totes, KYK, raven, oakman cometh, TNFH, farfa, vincoug, jk, tsam, alan, early bird, raven, ras, dred, nick c, milo, dink, E, cdiggy, donnie, big blue, strat, latke, glass half, d-mar, grocer, djphan, z-man, bruno, THCJ, oaktrees, pepper, ess-dog, owen, count de pennies, swift, yourself and all the other folks i forgot…not a bad bargain…

    Aww thanks geo for the shout.
    FYI – I wasn’t around to witness the whole bobneptune thing, so I have no dog in that fight.

    Funny how so few of us feel that way. Probably because Trumpism is not Republicanism or Conservatism.

    Now I agree 1000% on this. Trump’s followers are fans; as much as I supported Obama, I believe there is no politician that should be followed fanatically. No politician should be above reproach or should have people go far beyond the realm of logic to make excuses for.

    And listen, I’ve tried to see if there is something I’m missing with Trump supporters. I’ve gone on pro-Trumpers’ Twitter accounts (the one’s that were real people) to read their arguments and viewpoints. The other day, I found myself on an Evangelical site where the SINGLE, SOLE argument for voting for Trump is end abortion rights. Oh, and the excuse they give for supporting him despite his antics is that “sinners have been chosen by God to lead” in Biblical times. That’s it. It’s beyond appalling, and I’m a Christian. In fact, it’s downright scary to me.

    Maybe it’s hard for some to grasp b/c who knew we’d see this kind of thing in modern times, but we’re at a point where folks from all parts of the political spectrum can see Trump is hurting the country “bigly”.

  111. Trump supporters are probably having too much sex with demons and witches in their dreams.

  112. ***why was Bob banned but the other two permitted to carry on with their daily insults and mindless political garbage? Pretty obvious, if you ask me. They’re liberal. ***

    Strat posts his world view and deranged opinions here freely. Nobody has ever called for him to be banned for them. In fact, he went so far as to beg for Brian to ban him(!), which Brian did not do. Because, for as odd as his stances on most things are, he presents himself with decorum. And because he does, his posts are easy to skip over.

    Bob did not present himself with decorum, and the only way to skip over his posts was to avoid the site altogether. Why would somebody who actively drives traffic away from a site be welcome? You can ask JonAbbey that question, btw, if you really think political opinion is what gets you banned from KB. But I think you can probably see this pretty clearly. I am surprised you are belaboring this.

  113. I’m more than happy for this site to ban any liberal who spouts their mouth off all the time. In fact, I’ve advocated for it before when a poster would instigate bad faith political discussions apropos of nothing.

    Hubert, you seem like you’re trying to get banned to prove yourself right. But unlike Bob, I don’t think you can keep this up for multiple 1,000 post threads.

    I don’t care, there’s actual basketball now and a Thibs presser for me to watch.

    And yeah, Cole Anthony sucks. I remember watching the highlights of one of his first games. Cole couldn’t get by anyone. He settled for step back jumpers after getting shutdown on every drive. He sucks by the numbers, he sucks by the eye test.

    I’m not sure why anyone wants Cole except for his high school hype. But there’s plenty of high school stars that get exposed in college. Cole is no exception.

  114. As for the upcoming draft, sign me up for a “high floor” rookie whose physicals may not be drool-worthy but has a lot of bball intelligence and guile (oh and can shoot too). We have enough players who are the opposite (and started from a very raw position).

  115. I am in a scoresheet league after doing a private simulation for a couple. It’s pretty good.

    I could not be more excited about the return of Zion.

  116. Ingram’s growth has been incredible. Must be nice.

    Hart is also super solid. Lakers should’ve drawn the line there.

  117. Trump supporters are probably having too much sex with demons and witches in their dreams.

    Stephen Miller’s wife is pregnant.

    Demon seed is real.

  118. I’m more than happy for this site to ban any liberal who spouts their mouth off all the time. In fact, I’ve advocated for it before when a poster would instigate bad faith political discussions apropos of nothing.

    And this is illiberal.

  119. Donnie Walsh: Strat posts his world view and deranged opinions here freely. Nobody has ever called for him to be banned for them.

    Strat gets trampled all the time. Like I said in the beginning, you guys like having the midgets around to pick on. The problem with Bob was that none of you could get over on him, even when it was 12 v 1.

  120. quality of play has been pretty high so far under the circumstances.

    maybe it’s just wishful thinking, but i noticed that during the scrimmages there seemed to be less whistles…the 1st half between the pels and jazz was amazingly smooth…

    i think the whole production has been outstanding…

  121. “ingram is like a cross between durant and richard hamilton”

    This is good content

    I read the whole Economist issue on illiberal liberalism. I am now ready to watch basketball. Kawhi better not be managing his load tonight.

  122. zion’s load management schedule might be an accidental window into the optimal use of julius randle. let him play at full throttle for random 3-4 minute bursts where you can run 80pct of the plays intended to get him the ball curling around the elbow or in the mid post and let him shoot nearly every time. by the time he leaves the other team is full of fouls and thigh bruises and never really got around to exploiting his defense or doubling him into his whirling point guard imitation mode.

  123. The problem with Bob was that none of you could get over on him, even when it was 12 v 1.

    Look, again, bob’s main theme was “Donald Trump is awesome and infallible” with such sub-themes as “hydrochloraquine roolz, suck it libs,” “I dunno, maybe Trump really was just inspecting the bunker” and “there’s no such thing as racism.”

    If you think he was pwning the libs with all of that, think again.

    I used to get into Facebook debates with a conservative friend of mine (ex-friend now) who was a lot like bob. Intelligent, sure, but mostly thought he “won” debates by never backing down or conceding even one tiny little point, and making sure to always, always, always get the last word. I eventually had to block homey from my Facebook page and tell him to fuck off because he’d make NEW threads on my page, continuing debates that I had abandoned. This guy considered it a badge of honor and thought that he had “won” the debate when somebody would block him (it wasn’t only me). He confused being extremely irritating and persistent with “winning” whatever debate we were having. Kind of like bob!

    I know I keep going back to the bunker thing, but it says a lot about bob I think. He wouldn’t acknowledge that Trump’s “I was inspecting the bunker” line was a ridiculous lie. That’s how I knew he’d never give ANY ground in any debate, and thus wasn’t engaging in good faith.

  124. i got to be honest hubie, this reminds me a bit of the other day when i was a little pissed at you all for having these phenomenal visual memories…like it was y’alls fault for being able to recall shit so well…i may have even gotten weird about it…

    i wasn’t really mad at anyone specifically here – it just seemed good at the moment to take some frustration out at the group…

    what was really bothering me though was i got stupid and lazy watching my health, now i got to deal with it; and, work was overwhelming me…took me a couple of days to puzzle that out…

    hmmmm, just confessed…must be time for a new thread soon…

    there’s always why’s…figuring out those why’s can be useful…

  125. That was nice. I like the new bench situation but they need to go further. It’s time for the NBA to go with the full FIFA race car seat bench deck.

  126. geo, characterizing your wistful humblegrumble as lashing out is itself a dispositional humblebrag and that will not be tolerated

  127. Sick Zion pass.

    Bob once said, and I quote, “99% of blacks aren’t good with black men marrying white women.” I asked him for a source for this ridiculous claim and he posted this link. He made sure to tell me “google is your friend” while doing so.

    So yeah, instead of a drawn out response about why one person’s blog post from what looks like the early aughts isn’t evidence of such a claim I just called him a clown and moved on with my day.

    I guess Hubert thinks bob wiped the floor with me there because I didn’t bother substantively responding to that shit.

  128. functional strength: the inverse delta of mean limb dispersion of brandon ingram taking paint contact less kevin knox taking paint contact

  129. sadly, you see me milo…it’s not easy being this cheesy, you know…

    i’m pulling for the pels this game, but – 100% wanna see the grizz in the playoffs…

    i get why they got to play eight games each; but, seeding doesn’t mean anything (other than piped in crowd noise), and i don’t think any of these “extra” teams are gonna make it in, i don’t even want any of them to make it in…

    ha, just saw there’s a wiz versus suns game coming up soon…yeah, no thanks…

  130. I’m interested to see how Thibs uses Knox. Knox will still suck but I still think it’ll be interesting to see if he plays him at SF or PF, where he thinks his defensive strengths are, etc. A lanky “athlete” like Knox should be decent on defense. Basically I think it’ll be hilarious how people will continue to call Knox an athlete despite struggling to guard anyone under one of the best defensive coaches in the NBA.

  131. ah…i love playing the “guess what word triggered moderation” game…

    i’ll tell ya milo – it’s not easy being this cheesy…

    i’m pulling for the pels this game, but – 100% wanna see the grizz in the playoffs…

    i get why they got to play eight games each; but, seeding doesn’t mean anything (other than favorable recorded crowd noise), and i don’t think any of these “extra” teams are gonna make it in, i don’t even want any of them to make it in…

    ha, just saw there’s a wiz versus suns game coming up soon…yeah, no thanks…

  132. Hubert: Pussies.

    Hubert: It’s ok to be a cunt here as long as you agree with the political leanings of the moderators.

    Is there a quota for misogynistic posts by a single poster in a given thread?

  133. I guess they were just totally lying about the minutes limit not being strict because otherwise this makes no sense

  134. The fake fans are so freaking weird, they actually move!

    i missed if they mentioned it – but – are the fans themselves streaming in their image???

  135. Just tuned in, exciting! And weird, very weird. Are they still going to Secaucus for replays?

  136. Anybody watch the MSG broadcast of the Thibs presser? If so, any takeaways that weren’t clear from the tweets or other stories?

  137. It’s definitely weird to have no fans, and it definitely takes away from the experience but so far the production for these games is good

  138. Also, whoever is writing 2020 continues to be pretty on the nose, what with Gobert winning the first game back from the shutdown that he caused.

  139. “Also, whoever is writing 2020 continues to be pretty on the nose, what with Gobert winning the first game back from the shutdown that he caused.”

    hahahaha

    Spot on

  140. Z-man:
    Is there a quota for misogynistic posts by a single poster in a given thread?

    Sadly not that unusual in the world of male-dominated sports forums, at least from my experience. That and homophobia.

  141. I just tuned in to check out how weird this all was going to be. Caught the social justice video and the anthem. I liked what they did, and I liked seeing the players faces, who were obviously feeling empowered and moved. BUT, Doc couldn’t quite make it through the anthem, and I’m sure a bunch of the other guys were thinking “holy shit, taking a surgically reconstructed knee on a hardwood floor fucking hurts!”. (I think that football grass and padding went a long way for Kaepernick).

  142. TheClashFan: Sadly not that unusual in the world of male-dominated sports forums, at least from my experience.That and homophobia.

    No biggie, I get called pretty much every name in the book every day. And that’s before I leave for work in the morning…

  143. Alan:
    Anybody watch the MSG broadcast of the Thibs presser? If so, any takeaways that weren’t clear from the tweets or other stories?

    I did, and nah, all predictable happy talk. I got the sense that everyone except RJ and Mitch are on thin ice…if I were one of the other young guys, I’d definitely take notice.

  144. I feel like I stumbled upon a local affiliate airing the Albany Patroons vs the Rapid City Thrillers.

  145. Donnie Walsh:
    I feel like I stumbled upon a local affiliate airing the Albany Patroons vs the Rapid City Thrillers.

    Yes, the ambiance is decidedly G-League-ish.

  146. I don’t have a particularly strong rooting interest but JR Smith winning two championships as a rotation player after Phil Jackson needlessly slandered him would not be a bad outcome, to me

  147. if i told you in december that jr smith dion waiters and joakim noah would be playing in a full court game at disney in july with no fans you wouldn’t be particularly surprised

  148. They showed a caption of newer Lakers JR Smith And Dion Waiters. It just feels like Waiters played for us once upon a time – like he’s a perfect candidate for “former Knick now playing for a better team somehow” lol.

  149. Cdiggy, it’s probably a flashforward to when we trade Randle, both Dallas picks and Kenny Wooten for Zach LaVine

  150. ***if i told you in december that jr smith dion waiters and joakim noah would be playing in a full court game at disney in july with no fans you wouldn’t be particularly surprised***

    If ptmilo came on here and said “I’m voting for trump, you should too”, I think I’d seriously consider it, I embrace everything out of his (or her) mouth that freakin’ much.

  151. Owen:
    I took a moment to watch Edwin Diaz and, well, someone should check on JK47

    Sewald limited the pain, stranding the bases loaded. But yeah, Diaz faced 5 guys and only retired one of them… His mechanics are a total mess.

  152. i’m thinking about posting a recording of a deeply personal karaoke medley of several jd and the straight shots covers and you should, too

  153. Why are Vogel and Doc Rivers dressed like they’re the trainers? If they’re faking the fans, and faking the noise, all in the name of continuity, why not fake the suits too?

  154. ***i’m thinking about posting a recording of a deeply personal karaoke medley of several jd and the straight shots covers and you should, too***

    You had me at karaoke medley.

    (And lost me at jd and the straight shot. Can’t I vote for trump instead?)

  155. All I care about re: the Mets is:

    1. Wilpons sell team
    2. New owner fires Brodie

    I’ll start paying attention when those things happen.

  156. I missed the Lakers-Clippers game because the Yankees game had a long rain delay and didnt finish until close to midnight. Just have to say I absolutely love Aaron Judge.

    Also since people have chimed in on the ambiance in the NBA games, definitely felt a bit weird watching the Pelicans-Jazz game. Felt like I was watching one of those pre-season college basketball tournaments in the Bahamas. Watching all the MLB games hasn’t felt strange at all because they are all in their regular stadiums. Sure when balls go into the stands it looks odd with empty seats but for the most part it feels like I’m watching a regular MLB game. Not sure these NBA games will ever feel that way but should still be entertaining.

  157. This guy is a good follow for people that don’t want to be mislead by incompetents and politically motivated scumbags in media that are putting an election above truth when it come to Covid data. He may not always be right, but he’s analyzing the data without bias or broken bad epidemiologist models.

    https://twitter.com/MLevitt_NP2013

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