Knicks Morning News (Sunday, Jan 08 2012)

  • [New York Times] Knicks 103, Pistons 80: Mike Bibby Leads Knicks to Win Over Pistons (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:20:17 GMT)

    Iman Shumpert started the game in the backcourt, but the journeyman Mike Bibby was the key player in the Knicks’ easy road victory against the Pistons.

  • [New York Times] Heat 101, Nets 90: James Returns to Lead Heat Over the Nets (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:20:17 GMT)

    With Dwyane Wade out for the third straight game, LeBron James, returning from an ankle sprain, scored 32 points against the Nets.

  • [New York Times] The Sixers Are Lovelorn in Philadelphia (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:20:17 GMT)

    The Sixers, a middling team with no discernible on-court leader and few fans, made the playoffs last season, but they are overshadowed in this city by a love for the Eagles and the Flyers.

  • [New York Times] N.B.A. Roundup: Josh Smith’s 25 Points Help Hawks End Bulls’ Winning Streak at Six Games (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:20:17 GMT)

    Chicago, who at 7-1 was off to its best start since going 12-0 in 1996-97, saw its winning streak snapped at six games.

  • [New York Times] Spurs Edge Nuggets to Keep Division Lead (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:53:50 GMT)

    The San Antonio Spurs built a big lead over the Denver Nuggets but were forced to hang on for a 121-117 win on Saturday.

  • [New York Times] Griffin Scores 22 to Lead Clips Over Bucks 92-86 (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 06:30:09 GMT)

    Blake Griffin had 22 points and 14 rebounds, Caron Butler scored 20 points against the team he suffered a season-ending injury against last January, and the Los Angeles Clippers beat the severely undermanned Milwaukee Bucks 92-86 on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] Hayward’s Late Free Throw Lifts Jazz Over Warriors (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 06:12:12 GMT)

    Gordon Hayward made a go-ahead free throw with 11 seconds remaining, lifting the Utah Jazz past the Golden State Warriors 88-87 on Saturday night for their fourth straight victory.

  • [New York Times] Mavs Win 4th Straight at Home, 96-81 Over Hornets (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 05:03:59 GMT)

    Vince Carter and Ian Mahinmi had 13 points each to lead the Dallas Mavericks to a 96-81 victory over New Orleans on Saturday to hand the depleted Hornets their sixth consecutive loss.

  • [New York Times] Green Scores 24 Points, Spurs Top Nuggets 121-117 (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 04:21:01 GMT)

    Danny Green scored a season-high 24 points to help the San Antonio Spurs beat the Denver Nuggets 121-117 on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] Durant Comes Up Big as Thunder Beat Rockets 98-95 (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 03:45:12 GMT)

    Kevin Durant hit a jumper with 22 seconds left and nailed two free throws to give the Oklahoma City Thunder a 98-95 win over the Houston Rockets on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] 76ers Beat Raptors 97-62 for 4th Straight Win (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 03:33:08 GMT)

    Andre Iguodala had 14 points and 10 rebounds, and Jrue Holiday also scored 14 points to lead the Philadelphia 76ers to their fourth straight win, 97-62 over the Toronto Raptors on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] James Dominates in Return, Heat Beat Nets 101-90 (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 03:21:02 GMT)

    LeBron James returned to the lineup and scored 22 of his 32 points in the first quarter, and the Miami Heat rolled to a 101-90 victory over the New Jersey Nets on Saturday night despite playing without Dwyane Wade.

  • [New York Times] Knicks Rout Pistons 103-80 After Big 2nd Quarter (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 03:12:08 GMT)

    Amare Stoudemire scored 22 points and Mike Bibby added 16 to lead the New York Knicks to an easy 103-80 victory over the Detroit Pistons on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] Hibbert Leads Pacers to 99-77 Win Over Bobcats (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 02:48:08 GMT)

    Roy Hibbert scored 20 points to help the Indiana Pacers beat the Charlotte Bobcats 99-77 on Saturday night.

  • [New York Times] Smith Scores 25 to Lead Hawks Over Bulls 109-94 (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 02:30:19 GMT)

    Josh Smith scored 25 points, Joe Johnson and Vladimir Radmanovic each added 17 and the Atlanta Hawks beat Chicago 109-94 Saturday night to snap the Bulls’ six-game winning streak.

  • [New York Times] Off the Dribble: Knicks Rookie Shumpert to Start Against Pistons (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 07:33:15 GMT)

    Coach Mike D’Antoni announced that Iman Shumpert would start in place of the struggling incumbent at point guard, Toney Douglas, on Saturday night against the Detroit Pistons.

  • [New York Times] Off the Dribble: Kings Hope Change Is for the Better (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 04:48:16 GMT)

    The Sacramento Kings are regrouping under Keith Smart, who talked extensively about the challenges in front of him.

  • [New York Times] Off the Dribble: For the D-League, Improving Grades (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 04:53:06 GMT)

    With more veterans playing for the D-League, its annual Showcase takes on new importance.

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks thump Pistons with ailing Anthony (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 09:51:14 GMT)

    The Knicks finally made the switch. Mike D’Antoni turned the ball over to rookie point guard Iman Shumpert, putting Toney Douglas on the bench Saturday night. Shumpert helped Knicks to a 103-80 win over the Pistons at the Palace of Auburn Hills.

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks’ Shumpert shows right stuff in proving coach wrong (Sun, 08 Jan 2012 06:05:42 GMT)

    Chris Bosh, Jarrett Jack and Derrick Favors all had Paul Hewitt’s blessings when they left Georgia Tech for the NBA as underclassman. Iman Shumpert, however, was different. With an NBA lockout looming and the chance to be a lottery pick in the 2012 draft, Shumpert was advised by his college coach to stick around one more year.

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    Mike Kurylo

    Mike Kurylo is the founder and editor of KnickerBlogger.net. His book on the 2012 Knicks, "We’ll Always Have Linsanity," is on sale now. Follow him on twitter (@KnickerBlogger).

    55 thoughts to “Knicks Morning News (Sunday, Jan 08 2012)”

    1. How about Bibby? His shot finally didn’t look flat. Seems like he might be our best 2, offensively. Was his defense passable? Did that look better?

    2. Didn’t get to watch the game until late last night, but we needed a victory like this. Yeah, the Pistons are bad, but we’ve had a tendency over the last year to play down to that caliber of team (see: Toronto, Charlotte). Both the offense and the defense looked much better, guys seemed to be communicating more (although having 500 people peppered throughout the Palace stands probably made this more audible), and Shump continued to impress and play within himself.

      I agree with the poster on the previous thread that, with Bibby playing serviceable ball, it might behoove D’Antoni to sit Douglas for a game — get his head right. For as tough as he’s been on the court, the last couple of games have clearly shattered his confidence.

    3. Mike bibby was money, and I agree that Douglas should sit at least a game. It’s pretty easy to see that the whole team plays worse right now when he is on the court, especially on defense. I feel like opposing point guards know that they can easily penetrate on him and take full advantage, and our whole defensive gameplan (switch switch switch) is shattered as a result. Hopefully he can get himself back together on offense but I really think he is more of a liability on defense anyways.

    4. not to say bibby or landry are world leaders on defense, i think landry has a rep for giving up a lot of points to shooting guards as well and thats why you see guys like ben gordon and gerald henderson trying to light him up. I think landry can probably adjust but for now he is a target for opposing offenses

    5. scogg888:
      landry has a rep for giving up a lot of points to shooting guards as well and thats why you see guys like ben gordon and gerald henderson trying to light him up. I think landry can probably adjust but for now he is a target for opposing offenses

      Gordon had 12 pts, 9 of which came in the first few minutes, and 9 turnovers. Presumably Fields adjusted.

    6. I don’t mind the idea of Bogans. Low-usage guy, plays hard-nosed defense, can shoot the 3.

    7. Bogans is honestly an awful player. I watched the Bulls a lot this year and he was without a doubt their worst player in every game he played. That being said, he at least knows how to play off the ball intelligently and can defend decently, so he’s not a bad replacement for bill walker at least, who might have the lowest basketball IQ of any player on the Knicks, and most of the league in general.

    8. If these 2 are really that intent on playing together, I think they end up together in Dallas. No way Jersey going to brooklyn is going to capitulate by putting Deron in Orlando for scraps to team up with D12, the player they have been fawning over and attempting to trade for over the past few months.

    9. Besides Anderson Orlando couldn’t offer anything of substance to make a deal happen for Deron…if they had cap space that would be one thing because then they might generate a bit of leverage….but as is, can’t see a trade going down between those 2 teams that lands Deron in Orlando.

    10. Personally, I think with Redick and Anderson emerging, Orlando is a really good team. If Hedo and Jameer can hold it together, they could do some damage in the playoffs. They’re not a contender, but they’re close.

      The problem is Howard is positioning himself in the ear of Otis Smith. I feel like a big part of his rethinking his trade demand is a result of Smith offering to listen to him more in regard to trades and acquisitions. That’s a recipe for some poor decisions. Although I guess Otis is already such a bad GM that Dwight can’t be much worse.

    11. How “brilliant” does that Deron Williams trade look now? Not very.

      For starters, Deron is playing like absolute dog crap. TS% of .467, eFG% of .394. Nice juicy WS/48 of .008. Career worst 6.9 assists per game to go along with a career worst 4.4 turnovers per game. Including the 12 lousy games he played for them last year, he has given them 20 games of pretty horrid basketball.

      So now they’ll probably have to trade him, and they’ll be lucky to get anything close to what they gave up. The way it’s looking now that is going to turn out to be a disastrously awful trade.

    12. While I’m Shump’s biggest fan, I was impressed by Chris Singleton the other night. Mean looking dude, looked big when standing next to Melo. He started today and played 40+ minutes, not a great stat line but he looks like a player.

    13. How “brilliant” does that Deron Williams trade look now? Not very.

      I don’t think anyone thought that the trade was all that brilliant (at least not here), since they gave up a ton of assets for a guy they had no real idea if he was going to stick around.

    14. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin): I don’t think anyone thought that the trade was all that brilliant (at least not here), since they gave up a ton of assets for a guy they had no real idea if he was going to stick around.

      I think what JK47 was referring to was that certain NBA writers contended at the time that the brilliant and dynamic Prokhorov had once again upstaged the Knicks. Sort of like all that BS about the Nets scintillating presentation to LeBron vs. Donnie in a wheelchair.

      I do think the Nets had to roll the dice with D-Will, mainly because of that new arena, but if he leaves, that franchise will be set back for years to come.

    15. Fair enough. They definitely did seem to try to push the “Prokhorov is a genius who is going to change everything!” angle a lot.

    16. They should be able to get at least something back for him, so it was a reasonable gamble.

    17. Oh, definitely. I just think most of us saw it as that – a reasonable gamble. Now had the Knicks got him, that would have been a brilliant move, since they would know he would stick around. Imagine D-Will and STAT together? D-Will would be the best point guard STAT had since Nash and STAT would be the best big man that D-Will has ever played with (especially above the rim).

    18. Great photo of Stat and Shump soaking up the NY atmosphere. Shump seems like a great guy on top of the hustle and talent. He’s the biggest dose of fresh air we’ve had in some time. I hope he’s as good as he seems like he can be – shutting down other stud 2 guards and alley oopin’ on both ends for years to come. A nice good bye from Mr. Walsh.

    19. JK47: How “brilliant” does that Deron Williams trade look now? Not very. For starters, Deron is playing like absolute dog crap. TS% of .467, eFG% of .394. Nice juicy WS/48 of .008. Career worst 6.9 assists per game to go along with a career worst 4.4 turnovers per game. Including the 12 lousy games he played for them last year, he has given them 20 games of pretty horrid basketball.So now they’ll probably have to trade him, and they’ll be lucky to get anything close to what they gave up. The way it’s looking now that is going to turn out to be a disastrously awful trade.

      I find it quite amusing that no one talks about how bad Williams has been in NJ, nor have I heard anyone consider the idea that it was Jerry Sloan’s flex offense that allowed him to thrive…..

    20. ruruland: I find it quite amusing that no one talks about how bad Williams has been in NJ, nor have I heard anyone consider the idea that it was Jerry Sloan’s flex offense that allowed him to thrive…..

      Considering that idea requires ignoring how good he has been in all-star games, playing for team USA and playing in that Turkish league.

      I would think it also requires never having seen him play.

    21. xduckshoex: <P all-star games, playing for team USA and playing in that Turkish league.I

      You’re kidding, right?

      If you want to talk about Team USA, you ‘ough to understand that it was Melo in 2006 who led the team past Italy… Melo was widely rcognized as the best player on that 2006 team, while DWill was basically an afterthought.

      I’ve watched a lot of DWill, undoubtedly more than you have given my years as a Nuggets fan. Have you seen him play in New Jersey?

      He has very good skills, but the flex offense was an ideal fit for him. It took him quite some time to master it, and it really opened up his scoring because of all the cross and down screening leaving the middle of the floor open.

      Some of it is a lack of talent in NJ, sure. But that offense inflates everyone’s numbers.

    22. Why are you talking about Melo? I’m just pointing out that Williams has played well everywhere he’s been except Jersey. Either Jersey is the only team he’s ever played on that didn’t run the flex offense, or the flex offense is not the reason for he thrived.

      The idea that Williams thrived for any reason other than his skills is ridiculous.

    23. I haven’t seen D. Williams much this year, but every time I see him play I wish the Knicks got him instead of Melo. Dwill is a team player who plays to win, not to score.
      I’d trade Melo for him in a NY second.

    24. xduckshoex: Why are you talking about Melo? I’m just pointing out that Williams has played well everywhere he’s been except Jersey. Either Jersey is the only team he’s ever played on that didn’t run the flex offense, or the flex offense is not the reason for he thrived. The idea that Williams thrived for any reason other than his skills is ridiculous.

      Dwill played his entire Jazz career in the flex offense, which prior to Sloan’s dismissal was always one of the most efficient offenses in basketball, and had been for years and years.

      I’m not really sure we can get very far in such a discussion given that you didn’t know that.

    25. hoolahoop: I haven’t seen D. Williams much this year, but every time I see him play I wish the Knicks got him instead of Melo. Dwill is a team player who plays to win, not to score.I’d trade Melo for him in a NY second.

      You’re a great fan of your team… and really hard to beat this kind insight.

      The Nets aren’t that far away. Maybe you should switch teams until Melo is gone?

    26. Boozer was also a surefire 20-10 guy that looked like a legit number 2 playing in the flex offense for Jerry Sloan. Now? Not so much, but since so many people try to pretend that statistics can be analyzed independently of context, players from some Jerry Sloan or Gregg Poppovich teams tend to become “worse” when they don’t have a system perfectly suited to their strengths, regardless of any change in the player’s skillset. Even Tyson Chandler, who last year played on a team with very complex and intelligent defensive systems, suddenly doesn’t seem like the unbeatable rim defender he was just 6 months ago in the finals. There’s no objective way to analyze the impact of coaching but it still has a major impact on both a team and individual level.

    27. Juany8: Boozer was also a surefire 20-10 guy that looked like a legit number 2 playing in the flex offense for Jerry Sloan. Now? Not so much, but since so many people try to pretend that statistics can be analyzed independently of context, players from some Jerry Sloan or Gregg Poppovich teams tend to become “worse” when they don’t have a system perfectly suited to their strengths, regardless of any change in the player’s skillset. Even Tyson Chandler, who last year played on a team with very complex and intelligent defensive systems, suddenly doesn’t seem like the unbeatable rim defender he was just 6 months ago in the finals. There’s no objective way to analyze the impact of coaching but it still has a major impact on both a team and individual level.

      Agree. Coaching and scheme is big but the congruency between players is also huge, all interdependent in some respects.

    28. Juany8:
      since so many people try to pretend that statistics can be analyzed independently of context

      just wanted to repeat this, always mindboggling to me.

    29. D-Will is a team player that’s helping his team win by shooting .346 and turning the ball over 4.5 times per game. His teammates are also inspired by his sulking, hangdog body language and widespread rumors that he’s phoning it in and planning on bolting the team after the season. A real winner, that guy. I’m sure New Jersey is PSYCHED they gutted their roster to get him.

    30. JK47: D-Will is a team player that’s helping his team win by shooting .346 and turning the ball over 4.5 times per game. His teammates are also inspired by his sulking, hangdog body language and widespread rumors that he’s phoning it in and planning on bolting the team after the season. A real winner, that guy. I’m sure New Jersey is PSYCHED they gutted their roster to get him.

      well said

    31. ruruland: Dwill played his entire Jazz career in the flex offense, which prior to Sloan’s dismissal was always one of the most efficient offenses in basketball, and had been for years and years.

      I’m not really sure we can get very far in such a discussion given that you didn’t know that.

      I’m well aware of that, nothing I have said has even implied anything to the contrary.

      What I am saying is very simple: New Jersey is the only place Williams has struggled. If the flex offense is the reason he thrived, then they must have been running it everywhere he played before he got to New Jersey.

      That’s not the case. That means that the flex offense is not the reason he thrived.

    32. xduckshoex: I’m well aware of that, nothing I have said has even implied anything to the contrary.What I am saying is very simple: New Jersey is the only place Williams has struggled. If the flex offense is the reason he thrived, then they must have been running it everywhere he played before he got to New Jersey.That’s not the case. That means that the flex offense is not the reason he thrived.

      WHat are you talking about? Illinois, Turkey…All Star games? You can’t be serious.

    33. Juany8:
      Boozer was also a surefire 20-10 guy that looked like a legit number 2 playing in the flex offense for Jerry Sloan. Now? Not so much, but since so many people try to pretend that statistics can be analyzed independently of context, players from some Jerry Sloan or Gregg Poppovich teams tend to become “worse” when they don’t have a system perfectly suited to their strengths, regardless of any change in the player’s skillset. Even Tyson Chandler, who last year played on a team with very complex and intelligent defensive systems, suddenly doesn’t seem like the unbeatable rim defender he was just 6 months ago in the finals. There’s no objective way to analyze the impact of coaching but it still has a major impact on both a team and individual level.

      Boozer’s per-36 minute numbers his last year in Utah:

      20.5 points, 11.8 rebounds, 3.3 assists.

      Boozer’s per 36 minutes last year in Chicago:

      19.8 points, 10.8 rebounds, 2.9 assists.

      His numbers have dipped a bit since leaving Utah, nobody would deny that. The point that is being argued is whether or not the flex offense is the reason these players thrive, and in Boozer’s case the difference is small enough that it’s clear he’s a great offensive player in his own right. He thrives because he’s a talented player.

      Nobody is saying that coaching doesn’t make a few differences here and there with stars and huge differences when dealing with role players, but saying Williams is one of those cases requires ignoring a lot of his history.

    34. ruruland: WHat are you talking about? Illinois, Turkey…All Star games? You can’t be serious.

      Why can’t I be serious?

      Did he play in those games? Yes.

      Was the flex offense run? No.

      Did he play well? Yes.

      Does that prove he can play well without the flex offense? Yes.

    35. xduckshoex: Boozer’s per-36 minute numbers his last year in Utah:20.5 points, 11.8 rebounds, 3.3 assists.Boozer’s per 36 minutes last year in Chicago:19.8 points, 10.8 rebounds, 2.9 assists.His numbers have dipped a bit since leaving Utah, nobody would deny that. The point that is being argued is whether or not the flex offense is the reason these players thrive, and in Boozer’s case the difference is small enough that it’s clear he’s a great offensive player in his own right. He thrives because he’s a talented player.Nobody is saying that coaching doesn’t make a few differences here and there with stars and huge differences when dealing with role players, but saying Williams is one of those cases requires ignoring a lot of his history.

      what history? Please, tell me.

    36. Don’t get me wrong, it’s obvious that D-Will is a talented player. But his whole time in New Jersey, it seems like his attitude is “wake me when we get Dwight Howard.”

      So far it has been a trade of biblically bad proportions for New Jersey. The Jazz got Devin Harris and a potentially dominant frontcourt of Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter out of the deal and they have another first round pick coming from Golden State. If New Jersey had simply held onto all of those assets they’d be a very intriguing young team– wouldn’t you like to root for a team with Marshon Brooks, Favors and Kanter as building blocks? Instead you get a half season of Deron Williams going through the motions before you trade him to a contender for pennies on the dollar because his contract is expiring. Horrible, horrible trade.

    37. xduckshoex: Why can’t I be serious?Did he play in those games? Yes.Was the flex offense run? No.Did he play well? Yes.Does that prove he can play well without the flex offense? Yes.

      Do I really need to tell you why looking at an NBA players performance in a b-quality international league is virtually meaningless, or all- star game for that matter?

    38. JK47:
      Don’t get me wrong, it’s obvious that D-Will is a talented player.But his whole time in New Jersey, it seems like his attitude is “wake me when we get Dwight Howard.”

      So far it has been a trade of biblically bad proportions for New Jersey.The Jazz got Devin Harris and a potentially dominant frontcourt of Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter out of the deal and they have another first round pick coming from Golden State.If New Jersey had simply held onto all of those assets they’d be a very intriguing young team– wouldn’t you like to root for a team with Marshon Brooks, Favors and Kanter as building blocks?Instead you get a half season of Deron Williams going through the motions before you trade him to a contender for pennies on the dollar because his contract is expiring.Horrible, horrible trade.

      That’s kind of how I see Williams too. I don’t necessarily think it’s a conscious thing on his part, he’s not playing at half speed or anything, but some players really do have trouble giving it their all when there doesn’t seem to be anything to play for. It also doesn’t help to play 6 games in 8 nights on a team plagued by injuries when you’re banged up yourself.

      The Nets as a whole are shooting terribly, it’s not just Williams. Jordan Farmer is actually the only player on that team with an NBA history that has not experienced a significant drop off in scoring efficiency. There’s obviously something going on there that’s bigger than “Williams is playing in the wrong kind of offense”.

    39. xduckshoex: That’s kind of how I see Williams too. I don’t necessarily think it’s a conscious thing on his part, he’s not playing at half speed or anything, but some players really do have trouble giving it their all when there doesn’t seem to be anything to play for. It also doesn’t help to play 6 games in 8 nights on a team plagued by injuries when you’re banged up yourself.The Nets as a whole are shooting terribly, it’s not just Williams. Jordan Farmer is actually the only player on that team with an NBA history that has not experienced a significant drop off in scoring efficiency. There’s obviously something going on there that’s bigger than “Williams is playing in the wrong kind of offense”.

      there was that whole last year thing, too. 36% from field with Lopez.

    40. ruruland: You’re a great fan of your team… and really hard to beat this kind insight.

      The Nets aren’t that far away. Maybe you should switch teams until Melo is gone?

      If your friend came up to you and said, “I think I’m going to try crack,” would you say back to him, “Great idea! I love you and support all of your decisions!” I doubt it. Supporting a team doesn’t mean you have to support every decision that team makes. As a fan of the Knicks, I want them to make smart moves. If Williams was available for Anthony, I would support that trade.

      As far as the flex offense goes, there are certain systems that benefit certain styles of play, but the flex offense doesn’t exist in some alternate dimension. Systems in the NBA are not all that unique. The triangle says, “start the offense in the post,” so good post players with some passing skill are going to have success (hello Pau). SSOL says run the ball, spread the floor, and create chaos with the PnR. As a result, good PnR players, roll men, and quick guys that can shoot the 3 have success.

      The flex offense is a PnR offense that encourages a lot of player motion. Once again, a good PnR PG and roll man are going to have success. Likewise, smart players who can find openings in the defense without the ball have success.

      Nash would be pretty useless in the triangle since he thrives in the pick and roll. Pau Gasol would lose a great deal of his value if he were trying to play pick and roll all game and never in the post.

      The point is, Deron Williams’ effectiveness under Sloan was a result of Sloan’s PnR based offense. In NJ, his best big men are Kris Humphries (offensively challenged) and Mehmet Okur (old, and a perimeter player). The rest of the team the team has been awful. By far the most likely explanations for DWill’s struggles are his awful teammates and consequent disinterest.

    41. continued…

      That doesn’t make him limited. The pick and roll is the bread and butter of basketball offense. Nash, Paul… All the guys who thrive off of their passing skills would struggle on the Nets right now. There’s no one to pass to.

    42. I could talk about how the flex offense enhanced Williams’ game and point out that it’s his scoring that has been the most dismal aspect of his non-flex game, not his passing. The flex gave him scoring opportunities he doesn’t get now. Instead, I’d rather focus on my amusement: the lengths you go to defend Williams — a player on a rival team– and the reflexivity with which you disparage Melo (a player on a team you purport to support).

      Melo is better statistically, has a better career record, has a better record as a finisher, and has been more impressive than Williams on the teams he’s played on with Wiliams.

    43. Don’t get me wrong, it’s obvious that D-Will is a talented player. But his whole time in New Jersey, it seems like his attitude is “wake me when we get Dwight Howard.”

      So far it has been a trade of biblically bad proportions for New Jersey. The Jazz got Devin Harris and a potentially dominant frontcourt of Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter out of the deal and they have another first round pick coming from Golden State. If New Jersey had simply held onto all of those assets they’d be a very intriguing young team– wouldn’t you like to root for a team with Marshon Brooks, Favors and Kanter as building blocks? Instead you get a half season of Deron Williams going through the motions before you trade him to a contender for pennies on the dollar because his contract is expiring. Horrible, horrible trade.

      I totally agree (well, maybe not totally, as I am no Marshon Brooks fan). I was just taking issue with the “‘brilliant’ trade” line, since I thought that you were suggesting that it was portrayed as such here, which I didn’t think that it was. But as someone else pointed out, you’re right that the media did certainly downplay the riskiness of the move.

      An interesting side question, though, is while we have all debated the pros and cons about whether the Knicks would be better off with D-Will than Melo, can you imagine Melo on the Nets right now? Ugh, how depressing would that be to watch? At least D-Will will likely be on his way after a season – Melo would have been locked in for four years!

    44. ruruland:
      I could talk about how the flex offense enhanced Williams’ game and point out that it’s his scoring that has been the most dismal aspect of his non-flex game, not his passing. The flex gave him scoring opportunities he doesn’t get now. Instead, I’d rather focus on my amusement: the lengths you go to defend Williams — a player on a rival team– and the reflexivity with which you disparage Melo (a player on a team you purport to support).

      Melo is better statistically, has a better career record, has a betterrecord as a finisher, and has been more impressive than Williams on the teams he’s played on with Wiliams.

      Carmelo Anthony WS/48 career: .128 || best year: .157
      Deron Williams WS/48 career: .139 || best year: .177

      Carmelo Anthony PER: 20.4 || best year: 22.8
      Deron Williams PER career: 18.9 || best year: 22.1

      Carmelo Anthony WP/48 last five years (average): .073
      Deron Williams WP/48 last five years (average): .180

      So of the three most widely used metrics, Deron Williams is better in two. In one of those two, he has contributed about 2 1/2 times as many wins.

      Add to that the fact that Stoudemire has a track record of real success with pick and roll point guards, and a short but disconcerting record of mediocrity without them, and it’s hard to make any logical argument that Deron Williams wouldn’t be better for this team. Don’t get me wrong, Anthony has been great this season, but for now I trust his performance in the other 591 games he’s played over these 8.

      As far as my “reflexive” criticism of Anthony, I ask you, who is being reflexive here? The one who is looking at the facts or the one who seems adamant that everyone should blindly praise # 7 as our savior?

    45. I would’ve preferred Deron Williams to Melo, just because we would have get a more balanced team.

      Right now, Deron is in a very bad team, and has little to play for. Besides, he is more of a team player and can’t take over games launching 30 shots like Melo is able to do. NJ would be more respectable with Melo taking over in large stretches… they can win in a given good night, or good matchup for Melo. Deron doesn’t have anyone to pass the ball to, so he’s stick with just half his game.

      I wouldn’t trade Melo for Deron right now, because i like the feeling of the team right now, they really look like they’re together in this, and are committed to it. I think the best thing that can happen to this team is just to play together for the years to come.

    46. ruruland:
      I could talk about how the flex offense enhanced Williams’ game and point out that it’s his scoring that has been the most dismal aspect of his non-flex game, not his passing. The flex gave him scoring opportunities he doesn’t get now. Instead, I’d rather focus on my amusement: the lengths you go to defend Williams — a player on a rival team– and the reflexivity with which you disparage Melo (a player on a team you purport to support).

      Melo is better statistically, has a better career record, has a betterrecord as a finisher, and has been more impressive than Williams on the teams he’s played on with Wiliams.

      This is the second time that you’ve brought up Melo in response to a post that has nothing to do with him. Who is the one being “reflexive” here?

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