Knicks Morning News (2021.10.22)

  • How to Watch New York Knicks vs. Orlando Magic Game Live Online on October 22, 2021: Streaming/TV Channels – The Streamable
    [thestreamable.com] — Friday, October 22, 2021 6:08:00 AM

    How to Watch New York Knicks vs. Orlando Magic Game Live Online on October 22, 2021: Streaming/TV Channels  The Streamable

  • China Cuts Celtics vs. Knicks Game Stream Amid Enes Kanter’s Comments – Fox Sports Radio
    [foxsportsradio.iheart.com] — Friday, October 22, 2021 4:30:00 AM

    China Cuts Celtics vs. Knicks Game Stream Amid Enes Kanter’s Comments  Fox Sports Radio

  • New York Knicks vs Orlando Magic: Injury Report, Predicted Lineups and Starting 5s – October 22nd, 2021 | NBA Season 2021-22 – Sportskeeda
    [www.sportskeeda.com] — Friday, October 22, 2021 2:29:19 AM

    New York Knicks vs Orlando Magic: Injury Report, Predicted Lineups and Starting 5s – October 22nd, 2021 | NBA Season 2021-22  Sportskeeda

  • Knicks news: Julius Randle fined $15K for antics after 2OT win vs. Celtics – ClutchPoints
    [clutchpoints.com] — Friday, October 22, 2021 12:43:32 AM

    Knicks news: Julius Randle fined $15K for antics after 2OT win vs. Celtics  ClutchPoints

  • Julius Randle-Obi Toppin combo gives Knicks new dynamic – New York Post
    [nypost.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 9:29:00 PM

    Julius Randle-Obi Toppin combo gives Knicks new dynamic  New York Post Knicks’ Julius Randle fined $15,000 for throwing ball into stands after win over Celtics  Yahoo SportsKnicks news: Tom Brady, Kevin Durant, Trae Young called out by NY fans  ClutchPointsWill Knicks Shoot for a Star or Roll With Current Roster?  The Knicks WallBoston Celtics: Top 3 performances in opening night thriller vs Knicks  Chowder and ChampionsView Full Coverage on Google News

  • Stephen A. Smith gushes over Iggy Azalea at the Knicks vs Celtics game – HITC – Football, Gaming, Movies, TV, Music
    [www.hitc.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 9:16:44 PM

    Stephen A. Smith gushes over Iggy Azalea at the Knicks vs Celtics game  HITC – Football, Gaming, Movies, TV, Music

  • Takeaways from Last Night’s Red Sox Loss // Celtics Fall to Knicks in Double-Overtime ? 10/21 (Hour 3) – 98.5 The Sports Hub
    [985thesportshub.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 5:05:00 PM

    Takeaways from Last Night’s Red Sox Loss // Celtics Fall to Knicks in Double-Overtime ? 10/21 (Hour 3)  98.5 The Sports Hub

  • Orlando hopes to continue home-opener magic vs. Knicks – CBS sports.com
    [www.cbssports.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:45:00 PM

    Orlando hopes to continue home-opener magic vs. Knicks  CBS sports.com

  • I Will Not Apologize For Knicks Fans Losing Their Minds Outside Of Madison Square Garden Last Night And Acting Like The Knicks Won A Championship – Barstool Sports
    [www.barstoolsports.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:37:05 PM

    I Will Not Apologize For Knicks Fans Losing Their Minds Outside Of Madison Square Garden Last Night And Acting Like The Knicks Won A Championship  Barstool Sports

  • NY Knicks: B/R questions if Kevin Knox belongs in the NBA – Daily Knicks
    [dailyknicks.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 2:32:00 PM

    NY Knicks: B/R questions if Kevin Knox belongs in the NBA  Daily Knicks

  • Obi Toppin uses his greatest strength to shine in sophomore debut – Posting and Toasting
    [www.postingandtoasting.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 11:00:00 AM

    Obi Toppin uses his greatest strength to shine in sophomore debut  Posting and Toasting

  • P.K. Subban Hits Knicks Game W/ Mystery Woman 10 Months After Vonn Split – TMZ
    [www.tmz.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 10:25:00 AM

    P.K. Subban Hits Knicks Game W/ Mystery Woman 10 Months After Vonn Split  TMZ

  • New York Knicks, LeBron James And The NIL Market: This Week’s Most Interesting Sports Business Stories – Forbes
    [www.forbes.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 10:00:00 AM

    New York Knicks, LeBron James And The NIL Market: This Week’s Most Interesting Sports Business Stories  Forbes

  • 2021-22 NBA season begins: Knicks top Celtics in double OT; live updates, scores, analysis from Night 2 action – The Athletic
    [theathletic.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 9:08:36 AM

    2021-22 NBA season begins: Knicks top Celtics in double OT; live updates, scores, analysis from Night 2 action  The Athletic

  • The Knicks Are Ready for a Sequel. The Good Kind. – The New York Times
    [www.nytimes.com] — Thursday, October 21, 2021 8:45:00 AM

    The Knicks Are Ready for a Sequel. The Good Kind.  The New York Times

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    63 thoughts to “Knicks Morning News (2021.10.22)”

    1. One more note from my trip to MSG Wednesday –

      The crowd REALLY responds to Obi. Literally every transition play the whole places stands up waiting for Obi to get the ball. It’s been written about a lot the last 48h but he really is just faster than everyone else, and on top of that really just plays hard every second he’s out there.

      I was really down on Obi during the winter last year – glad he’s finding his niche. Will be interesting to see how Thibs handles the rotations once Noel and Taj are healthy. There’s definitely a role for those Obi/Randle lineups – now they just need to maximize.

      Randle as a PNR ballhandler is so dangerous — hope they use that more. The Randle/Mitch PNR leading to Mitch slipping the pick and getting an easy dunk, and the Randle/RJ PNP were just beautiful. They have so many ways to score now. Still think Kemba PNRs with Mitch present a good way to get Randle easier shots (ie. open 3s or attacking closeouts off that action), give Kemba some possessions etc.

    2. Will be interesting to see how Thibs handles the rotations once Noel and Taj are healthy. There’s definitely a role for those Obi/Randle lineups – now they just need to maximize.

      Thibs seems flexible about his rotations in some ways, like how he tends to close every close game with whatever combo is playing best that night, rather than going with the same guys each time. But the larger experimenting mainly seems to come when guys are out with injury, as happened in the opener. And even then, Jericho Sims was his first choice when Mitch sat in the first half. I’d like to think he’ll be willing to go with Julius/Obi on nights when multiple centers are healthy but there’s an advantageous smallball matchup, but I don’t know if he’d be willing to abandon the rim protection if he doesn’t have to. (Though if Obi keeps blocking shots, that changes the calculus somewhat.)

      Really frustrated I can’t find a video clip of the “Obi! Obi! Obi!” chant from the fourth quarter. I almost cried, I was so happy both for him and for the fandom getting to have that moment.

    3. Embiid questionable with R knee soreness v Nets. Kyrie still out. KP stinks and Mavs get blown out. There’s too much schadenfreude for me to handle, not enough popcorn exists in this world.

    4. Let’s not get too smug, guys. We’ve only played one game. Things can and do change fast here in the Association.

    5. Frank: The crowd REALLY responds to Obi. Literally every transition play the whole places stands up waiting for Obi to get the ball. It’s been written about a lot the last 48h but he really is just faster than everyone else, and on top of that really just plays hard every second he’s out there.

      Totally. We are a completely different team with Obi on the floor. I mean like the Knicks have NEVER played this way (maybe Linsanity?). After years, decades really, of the Knicks being a half court pound and grind team, we’re finally getting “easy” buckets off the break — by design. JVG was speechless.

      And as much as I love Obi’s dunks on alley oops in half court sets, I love more, for example, when DRose hits him on the break with a long bounce pass, and Obi just outruns, outmuscles everyone to an easy hoop. While those plays may not be as useful at the end of game crunch time, everyone can see it’s how we caught the Celtics.

    6. The Obi-Randle frontcourt has been great so far, but I do think it’ll eventually get exposed. Randle & Obi may just be mobile enough to cut off drives even without blocking shots. Keep running it until someone figures out how to stop it.

    7. Most good teams have a “death” lineup they close with these days, and our Obi/Randle big tandem fits into that desire to have all shooters on the floor at certain points of the game. I’m glad that Thibs is willing to roll with it.

      If it ends up working, does that devalue Mitch? He’s still sort of the perfect rim-runner/shotblocker, so I’d love to keep him as our starting C, especially with weaker perimeter D this season.

      Our upgrade position is still probably at PG. I’m sure Rose/Kemba will play admirably, but I hope we see something out of Deuce this year (more of a Marcus Smart-type though) and Joku in Europe.

      I like our wings so far. Fournier/Barrett/Burks seems like a perfect combo and hopefully Grimes will come along soon. Quickley is perhaps an area of concern. Making him a PG is starting to feel like jamming a square peg into a round hole. Seems like he’s destined more for a “microwave” role, but that rule change really hurt his game.

      Miami looks really tough, and the Hawks have only gotten better. Along with the Bucks and maybe the Nets, I think that’s your top-4 teams. The Nets are still great, but they’re beatable. Griffin/Millsap/Aldridge is not going to get it done, and Claxton is still very raw. Same with the 6ers, but I think Maxey will surprise. They are still lacking though, and if Joel’s knees don’t hold up, that’s it.

      I agree that Morey should’ve moved Ben asap because now it’s a shitshow. Honestly, they’re still probably picking from the same few teams (SAC, IND) so just get what you can. They aren’t getting Lillard or Beal. Something like Brogdon and Warren would be a great haul if they can still get that.

    8. ess-dog
      October 22, 2021 at 9:33 am
      Most good teams have a “death” lineup they close with these days, and our Obi/Randle big tandem fits into that desire to have all shooters on the floor at certain points of the game. I’m glad that Thibs is willing to roll with it.

      If it ends up working, does that devalue Mitch? He’s still sort of the perfect rim-runner/shotblocker, so I’d love to keep him as our starting C, especially with weaker perimeter D this season.

      It’s a interesting point because as we’ve seen in the playoffs, rim runners/shot blockers tend to be faded out in favor of smaller lineups. Capela and Gobert come to mind. It’s how the league is now valuing shooting in crunch time. I’d think it would be wise for the Knicks to have an all shooting lineup when teams go small.

    9. So far Jason Kidd’s great innovation in Dallas is trying to turn KP into a Moses Malone-style post-up threat. So far it’s goink bad.

    10. Early Bird
      October 22, 2021 at 12:24 am
      JK47:
      Apparently KP looks dreadful in this game. Guess he’s still like working his way back from an injury or something.

      Unfortunately, sucking at basketball is an injury many NBA players never recover from.

      Ha, that was worth repeating

    11. Atlanta and Miami impressed me,
      the Hawks are deep as hell and the Heat attacked the Bucks like sharks in a pool.

      I think we can be very good, but the East is not a walk in the park anymore, we’ll have to fight for a top-6 spot.

      Losing in Atlanta is kind of predictable, but losing by 26 with Luka and the whole Knicks West playing like shit is not. Are the Mavs already feeling the Kidd’s effect?

      Curry with a fantastic game, but even without Leonard the Clippers never quit.

    12. #Also, there is a major tension this season between me wanting to see Luka do well and me wanting to see Jason Kidd fail as a coach.#

      Luka’s time will come.

      Barring injury, he figures to be a mainstay in Dallas for at least ten more seasons.

      Jason’s may not.

      He likely wears out his welcome there in two seasons – three, tops – as is his custom

    13. The Magic are putting a very youth-heavy team on the floor and appear to be one of the worst teams in the NBA. Need to put up an easy win against these guys.

    14. Count de Pennies:
      #Also, there is a major tension this season between me wanting to see Luka do well and me wanting to see Jason Kidd fail as a coach.#

      Luka’s time will come.

      Barring injury, he figures to be a mainstay in Dallas for at least ten more seasons.

      Jason’s may not.

      He likely wears out his welcome there in two seasons – three, tops – as is his custom

      According to an article in the Athletic, Kidd has changed, was a good soldier with the Lakers, and is making a major effort to bond with Luka. Be interesting to see if this change endures. I’m sure he knows this is his last shot.
      Off-topic: How in the world did Alec Baldwin get a prop gun with live ammunition?

    15. Two games in a row with the Magic, we need to sweep.
      Playing down to the competition was one of last season bad habits,
      I’ll be thrilled if they show me that we can chalk it as a thing of the past.

    16. The world champion Bucks lost by 42 last night.

      I suspect Dallas is not overly worried about losing one game on the road to a very good Hawks team that was an especially tough matchup. Hunter made life miserable for Doncic. When he did beat him Capela was there waiting. Trying to go inside with KP was equally problematical. It was also one of those nights when outside shots weren’t dropping. It’s one game.

      I said last year the Hawks were underrated going into the season. If anything they are a little underrated again this year. They were not 100% in the playoffs last year, have that experience under their belt now, and have a lot of young pieces that could jump up (Reddish being among them). As a Knicks fan I want no part of having to play those guys.

    17. I want us to sweep them, but it feels like sweeping home-and-homes is tougher than it looks, even against tanking teams like this. Meanwhile, some good news for Death Lineup fans: Taj is out again tonight, as is Noel. So we’ll definitely see some Julius/Obi. The question is whether Sims sees the court again.

    18. tough to say games 2 and 3 of the season are must wins…but…we should take advantage of what appears to be the OKC thunder of the east…i am predicting this to be the cole anthony game…

      I thinks Sims is going into the deep freeze…unless the small ball lineup gets exposed…

    19. I’m more worried about the Knicks having a letdown (or in horse racing terms “bouncing”) after such a tough emotional win than I am about the Magic beating us. So I’m counting on Thibs to not allow that to happen.

    20. Yes, Dallas can easily win the next two games (in Toronto and at home with Houston),
      I’m just a little surprised because:

      a. I was prepared for a nuclear face-off between Trae and Luka
      b. they’re a top ten team in almost every pundits’ team ranking

      Yesterday, Brunson being the exception, they played pretty bad.

    21. Looking at Orlando’s boxscore vs SA…. Our old friend Iggy Brazdeikis managed a -30 in 19 minutes. I think that takes skill and effort.

      Definitely gotta go sweep. East is tough, can’t give away games to teams that aren’t even trying to win.

    22. I didn’t realize that Gafford signed an extension. He is the same age and of the same status as Mitch Robinson. He also has identical career TS% and Block% to Mitch, which are Mitch’s two main areas of contribution. Gafford signed for 3/$40. Isn’t this what Robinson should expect from the Knicks? Is there anything for the two sides to even discuss, given the precision of the comp?

    23. Off-topic: How in the world did Alec Baldwin get a prop gun with live ammunition?

      just tragic, reminding me a bit of what happened to that young NHL player this summer during a 4th of july party (espn had a nice piece describing his friendship with one of his teammates)…ol’ tupac had it kind of right: i see death around the corner…sad and accidental…

    24. They are sort of close Donnie, but Mitch is a better lob threat on offense and can actually defend in space much better than Gafford, at least the pre-bulked-up version.

      I think Mitch can point to Jarrett Allen’s 20 mil per over 5 years contract and make a good case that he should get that, too, depending on if he can stay on the court (fouls, injury).

    25. Isn’t this what Robinson should expect from the Knicks?

      i’m going to guess mitch’s expectation are not that near to 13 or so million a year…i would imagine him and his agents right now are hoping for 20 million or so…

      if we could do 15 per year over three or four years that would be good…

      jinx ess-dog :)

    26. I don’t know. Allen is younger than Mitch and has played double the minutes thus far. He seems like a safer investment.

    27. I think the max we can extend Mitch for is something like 4 for 54, which I think they should do.
      Can’t imagine Mitch would say no given all the injuries. He’s “only” made like $5MM so far.

    28. The question of what exactly differentiates Mitch from [Rim Runner X] is a fair one, but my (biased as hell) opinion is he’s legitimately unique.

      He’s shown he can handle more usage than most of those guys without an efficiency drop off, largely because his range for lobs is “just throw it in the general direction of the hoop.” Maybe more importantly, his combination of quickness, mobility, and rim protection makes his defensive upside pretty special if you ask me.

      Having said that, Gafford is really good and may well also be in a different category. Very bizarre that the Bulls gave him away.

    29. I would say it’s a little disheartening that Mitch’s shot has not improved one iota since coming into the league. If anything his shot form looks worse and he slings a line drive at the basket.

    30. I think the max we can extend Mitch for is something like 4 for 54

      that actually seems like a pretty fair and appropriate price…hopefully that last year is at our discretion…

      i’ve given up any hope of mitch turning in to any kind of consistent threat from beyond six feet…

    31. ***the question of what exactly differentiates Mitch from [Rim Runner X] is a fair one, but my (biased as hell) opinion is he’s legitimately unique. He’s shown he can handle more usage than most of those guys***

      Gafford and Allen both have higher career usages than Robinson. So do Richaun Holmes, Robert Williams, Clint Capela, and Jakob Poeltl, all of whom also shot a higher percentage at the rim than Mitch last year. (What am I not understanding here?)

      [edit: sorry, I was reading a bad chart, I guess Mitch did shoot better than some of those guys at the rim last year, but they are all comparable, and the point still stands: how has Robinson separated himself based on usage?)

    32. how has Robinson separated himself based on usage?

      i was going to attribute his usage to his role and also – thibs…then i thought of taj out there chucking it from all over the court…

      hmmmm, maybe his particular value lays somewhere in his defensive contributions…

    33. I think Mitch is about 90% of Capela even now, with significant room to be better than Capela, who is making $18MM/year the next two seasons and I believe extended for two more years at $23MM/year. So 4 years 82MM.

      He’s certainly shown more and with longer sample size than Robert Williams (who is good), Wendell Carter (who is maybe good but maybe not). Richaun Holmes is much older (28) and so prob doesn’t have any upside left. He’s a better defender than Williams/Carter/Holmes/Gafford/Poeltl/Gafford/Allen already, although has a ways to go offensively beyond ORebs, lobs, etc.

      If we could get Mitch at 4/54 it seems a good contract IMHO. Has to be stuff off court / in brain that Leon is worried about, or else I imagine it’d already be done.

    34. It is a very fair question. Setting aside the fact that Mitch is objectively more awesome than any other player mentioned. No one blocks a three like he does.

      I have a soft spot for any decent player in this category and would love to know how they all grade out.

      Defensive impact seems to be the differentiating factor in terms of real value.

    35. I watched a replay of the double overtime and we were lucky to win that game. The Randall iso ball was ugly. The ball stopped moving and the rest of the team mostly just watched. We can be better than this.

    36. Gafford and Allen both have higher career usages than Robinson. So do Richaun Holmes, Robert Williams, Clint Capela, and Jakob Poeltl, all of whom also shot a higher percentage at the rim than Mitch last year. (What am I not understanding here?)

      Those guys have pretty much all gotten paid around Mitch’s max from an AAV perspective, and in Capela’s case a good amount more. Poeltl hasn’t, but he hasn’t demonstrated the ability to carry Mitch’s usage or efficiency, is older, and doesn’t have nearly the same defensive impact.

      I’m not sure what we’re arguing about as long as you agree 4/$54M is a no-brainer because I agree we’d have to think about anything more than that.

    37. pepper: yeah..it’s just Dolan’s money…wtf..

      The value of MSG is doing just fine, thank you, and Dolan is making plenty of money off of the team’s resurgence. Does Dolan deserve any credit for it?

    38. I’m in the ‘love Mitch’ and ‘sign him for 4/54’ camps, but playing devil’s advocate I also see where the team might be cautious about an oft-hurt, slightly flaky, no huge improvement (like say RJ in yr 2) guy who shot under .500 at the FT line last year, just added considerable weight and who they haven’t seen play for a good long while.

      Having said that, just sign him.

    39. We have all season to extend Mitch, and i think Leon is waiting for the trade deadline to do it, because Mitch makes little money and it can be interesting for a team, in case they’re above the cap, to get him for such a low value. It’s probably smarter this way, we keep our options open, and if there’s no trade to be made, we extend him after the deadline.

    40. I would give Mitch every penny I could. I’d still love to know how much surplus value his deal is generating.

    41. Raven, you would have thought that Mitch might have worked on his free throw shooting during all of his down time. Seeing him shoot free throws the other night was rather disappointing.

    42. DudeInKnicksTown: The value of MSG is doing just fine, thank you, and Dolan is making plenty of money off of the team’s resurgence. Does Dolan deserve any credit for it?

      that is an interesting question…i was thinking about how the knicks and rangers are or appear to be on an upswing and he has kind of removed himself (although the rangers fired their coach and gm and poho in the summer so he did step in there) for the most part…so I guess give him credit for that…but he is still an asshole

    43. I’m in for extending Mitch, for TimeLord money or slightly more.
      He gets his money, has a chance to be part of a really solid core and at the same time the contract is still movable in a trade.

      Allen is an overpay, but nobody wants to play in Cleveland (if not born in Akron)…

    44. I do feel like it’s a gamble on the extension, just because of injuries. I wish we could get through the season before making the decision. I know a lot of his injuries have been fluky but some guys just get hurt more then others. How important is his production to our success and how much does he raise our ceiling??

    45. I think it’s a must for the Knicks to resign Mitch, just from a salary cap standpoint. After RJ likely gets a max, or close to it, this team will be capped out for at least 3 years barring any big trades. I doubt they’ll be able to find another C as good as Mitch for the minimum or one of the exceptions. Just pay him, Dolan can handle the luxury tax.

    46. Looks like Robert Sarver is about to get the Donald Sterling treatment:

      @Schultz_Report
      Breaking: The NBA is preparing for a massive story accusing #Suns owner Robert Sarver of racism, sexism and sexual harassment in a series of incidents, sources say. With enough evidence to support such claims, there’s a real chance the league would forcibly remove Sarver.

    47. We have all season to extend Mitch, and i think Leon is waiting for the trade deadline to do it, because Mitch makes little money and it can be interesting for a team, in case they’re above the cap, to get him for such a low value. It’s probably smarter this way, we keep our options open, and if there’s no trade to be made, we extend him after the deadline.

      genius :)

    48. My daughter has a critical volleyball match tonight starting at 7:00 so I would appreciate some lively descriptive commentary from my fellow KBers!

    49. I don’t get how so many people want Klay Thompson to be in the top 75, he is not a leader on any list except maybe made three pointers, he was never either the best offenses or defensive player on his team, and while he’s an explosive player, it’s mostly off the catch.

    50. he was never either the best offenses or defensive player on his team, and while he’s an explosive player, it’s mostly off the catch.

      didn’t he have some game where he scored more points (around 30 I believe) than seconds in which he had possession of the ball…

      haven’t looked at the list, and given it much thought, but, top 75 probably not…he just barely makes top 5 warriors of all time…

    51. let’s see…wilt, steph, rick barry, KD – and then it’s between chris mullen, chris webber and klay for top five…with an always honorable mention to sarunas…

      unfortunately i don’t know enough about nate thurmond and joe barry carroll to include them in the list…

    52. Thurmond had five straight years scoring over 20 per game, and two years in a row getting well over 20 rebounds a game. Blocks weren’t recorded until toward the very end of his career, but the first two years they were documented he averaged 2.9 and 2.4 despite being old. Different era yadda yadda, but a pretty dominant big man, if perhaps not so efficient.

      And then there’s the other Nate…(Robinson…).

    53. geo:
      let’s see…wilt, steph, rick barry, KD – and then it’s between chris mullen, chris webber and klay for top five…with an always honorable mention to sarunas…

      unfortunately i don’t know enough about nate thurmond and joe barry carroll to include them in the list…

      You can keep Joe Barely Care Carroll out of the list :-)

    54. Knicks fans will be forever grateful to Mitch for providing us the lone ray of hope on those utterly dreary Knicks teams of his first two seasons.

      That’s worth an extra 2-3 million AAV over market, as far as I’m concerned. Give the man his money.

    55. thanks raven :)

      too funny max…if you don’t mind, question for you please – were you born in the states then moved to italy, or have you lived in italy the whole time?

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