106 thoughts to “2014-2015 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Magic”

  1. Yeah, Jah really wants to be the new Bargnani.

    Vucevic must have had this game circled on his calendar…

  2. It seems like Galloway at 6’2 is the best rebounding 2 guard the knicks have had in a while.

  3. Well, its the start of the 4th and I’m mildly entertained. Really like what I’ve seen from young Mr Galloway

  4. Yeah, it’s a low bar for me. If there are a bunch of guys out there I have never heard of working their butts off i’ll watch I guess.

    Giancarlo Stanton in the audience, he good….

  5. It’s mind boggling that they’re playing Melo 40 MPG despite having the worst freakin’ record in the league.

  6. God Fisher is boring…..

    I don’t think he wants “league’s worst record” on his first year resume…

    This Payton guy is fun to watch. At the free throw line especially. How many guards in the NBA have ever shot in the 50’s from the line?

  7. It’s really for the best that they lose this game. But honestly, I don’t mind them winning a little bit until Melo gets shut down for the year. Just losing him alone should tip them over the line to losing most of these games. So they’ll likely be right in the hunt for the worst record.

    In other words, go for it, Knicks!

    I want some more clutch treys from Galloway!

  8. That’s two games in a row where Gallo has hit a clutch 3.

    Hence it becoming my thing. ;)

  9. JR 7-11 from three and Shump 2-2. And it seems like LBJ may have taken some go-go juice while out…

  10. I want a top pick as much as anyone but I can’t root against these guys….

    Very entertaining game….

    Got a little of that Linsanity feeling tonight….

    Langstonity?

  11. Hope the Knicks have enough cap space to be able to re-sign Thomas and Galloway to max contracts.

  12. Sixers lost 86-91. If we win tonight we’ll be tied with them at 8 wins apiece. T-wolves have 7.

  13. Thomas had one decent season out of 4. He probably stinks. Galloway might actually be a bit of a player.

  14. I work with a Duke homer…. He loves Thomas’ hustle. Says a knick fan would appreciate it…. I don’t mind it

  15. 1) it’s easier to route for guys playing basketball. No matter how shitty they can be… Lack of expectation is nice… Lack of deadbeats on the team also helps
    2) you’re on this site because, in your heart, in your right mind, you would never try to lose … It’s not natural

  16. Looking at Orlando: I feel Stanley Johnson would fit right in with them. Payton, Oladipo, Johnson, Gordon, and Vucevic will be a nice nucleus. Even if they keep Harris because he is basically like a 4 yr rookie in age. They can really go best available but I think Johnson would be their best choice if he is there when they pick.

  17. 10 day contract guys seem to bring effort whereas Bargs just count his money and doesn’t give a damn, Knicks need another big aside from Jason Smith.

    good game to watch – Prigs committed stupid turnover towards the end

  18. It’s hilarious how extending Jason Smith’s range by, what, a foot?, makes him a much more valuable shooter. Why hasn’t he done this before?

  19. As I said before, while they would have been better off losing this game, I don’t mind them playing a little better before they shut Melo down. They’re going to lose a lot more games once he gets shut down. Now if they don’t shut him down (which they haven’t definitively say they will do yet), then yeah, fuck these morons.

  20. Wroten most likely out for the season, the Knicks with three game win streak- are the treads coming off of the Knicks’ tank?

  21. So long as they shut Melo down, I think they’re still right in the mix. But yeah, they really need to shut him down.

  22. The Chandler and Smith/Shumpert deals look better and better with each passing day. Three solid rotation players on short-term contracts for a second round pick and trade exceptions — really, genius stuff. Goddamn team can’t even lose when it’s supposed to.

  23. Hawks 29-2 over their last 31. If you’re going to put money on a team to win the NBA title, that’s the one to put it on. caw caw

    I wonder if we could have traded Steve Novak, a 1st round pick and, I dunno, 2 seconds for Kyle Korver 2 years ago. I bet we could have.

  24. korver landed in the perfect situation and i’m happy for him…. he would not have done as well here…

  25. No, he wouldn’t have. But he would have been a metric fuckton better than Bargnani, and actually would have fit in the Novak role (and done it even better). I wouldn’t have liked that trade at the time, but it would have been the Knicks trying to improve what they were good at doing, rather than improving our defense and rebounding by trading for a person who was terrible at rebounding and playing defense.

    It’s interesting that we smoked the Magic on the boards even with Vucevic’s monster game. Langsanity!

  26. The big question mark with Atlanta is can Teague keep playing like a top 5 point guard- he’s putting up a .214 ws when his career mark is .117. Maybe he turned the corner at 26 but I think it’s more likely that he comes down to earth at least a little bit.

  27. Soooo, Klay Thompson’s having himself a little game of throw the ball in the ocean from the beach…
    I can’t remember how many people I argued with over that silly Kevin Love non-trade to GS. It was pretty much me-against-the board. Yay me!

  28. It’s possible that the whole non trade revolved around how they felt it would affect the defense. Love’s never been even close to an average defender. And Klay is actually above average, not elite or anything, but he’ll make you work on defense.

  29. Klay Thompson is an elite defender. Did you watch him shut down Harden? And every other guard they put him on this year? Thompson is the beginning of GS’s #1 defense (and Bogut is the end of it). They have a really, really well constructed team.

  30. Anyone know why Basketball Reference abbreviates the Charlotte Hornets as CHO? Why not CHA?

  31. And on the whole Knicks tanking, the team with the worst record hasn’t won the lottery since 04, right?
    They’re going through a relatively easy stretch of games here. Pelicans w/o Davis or Holiday, Sixers in tanking mode for 2 straight seasons and a really young Orlando team. The Knicks are perfectly capable of going on another 15+ game losing streak.

  32. And on the whole Knicks tanking, the team with the worst record hasn’t won the lottery since 04, right?
    They’re going through a relatively easy stretch of games here. Pelicans w/o Davis or Holiday, Sixers in tanking mode for 2 straight seasons and a really young Orlando team. The Knicks are perfectly capable of going on another 15+ game losing streak.

    A. It’s not about necessarily the top pick, it’s about giving yourself the best odds for one of the top three picks (the worst record has about a 64% chance of getting a top three pick). Although, sadly, the Knicks sort of need either #1 or #2, as I don’t trust them once Towns and Okafor are off the board.

    B. The worst record has had bad luck with getting the top pick, but it’s still better to have the best odds, even if the best odds are not particularly great

    As for their chances of going on another losing streak, I think the key is losing Melo. Hopefully that happens soon. If it doesn’t, I think they’re going to rise in the standings.

  33. @Brian, it probably has something to do with how they stored them when they were the Bobcats. As to the reason behind the change I don’t know, but likely it’s database look up related. The CHA abbr. works for all Bobcats years before this one, and CHH works for the previous iteration of the Hornets.

  34. Count me amongst those saying GS should have pulled the trigger on the Thompson/Love trade. Tonight aside (even though…wow), GS looks like they made the right call. If Thompson continues on as he has all season, and there no reason to think he won’t, that might go down as the best non-trade of the decade. Not that Love isn’t worth trading almost anyone else for, but this

    Thompson is the beginning of GS’s #1 defense (and Bogut is the end of it). They have a really, really well constructed team.

    matters.

  35. That, sadly, is a worry. There really is a realistic chance that Melo waits until the offseason to get his surgery. In which case the Knicks probably do win enough to rise above the top three. I don’t think that it will happen, but it is a realistic worry.

  36. D’angelo Russel is growing on me more and more now that I can see him as a PG. His size is almost the same as Jeremy Lamb was when he came out as a sophomore which was not good for a two guard. I could live with a 6’5 180 lbs 19 yr old PG though. After Okafor and Towns I would be okay with him.

    TS% FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
    .602 .470 2.9 6.4 .453 .785 5.2 4.9 1.8 0.2 2.9 2.0 19.3

  37. I like Russell a lot, as well. I wouldn’t take him with the #3 pick, though. I’d trade it to move down. Stanley Johnson might be my next pick after Okafor and Towns and I don’t think Johnson would go #3 if the Knicks don’t take him there. So they can afford to move down. I think Mudiay is the clear #3 pick right now.

  38. If they fall out of the top 2 picks and they can move down and pick up a Russel or another player on their board then that would be great but who would move up for Mudiay?

  39. Mudiay seems like the type of guy lots of teams could talk themselves into, so I don’t think it’d be too hard to find someone for him.

  40. I do, too, but I also think he can be had a bit lower than #3.

    Johnson also has the “problem” of playing the position they want Melo to play.

    Quotes because they sure as fuck better not be using Melo as their determiner in this pick.

  41. Mudiay seems like the type of guy lots of teams could talk themselves into, so I don’t think it’d be too hard to find someone for him.

    In most year I would agree but most teams have a Pg already is the problem I was thinking. LAL, NY, Bos, and Sac are the only teams I can think of that need PG help. LAL has to hope that they have a top 5 pick or it goes to Phx and they would not move up for a pg. So the list could get smaller.

  42. Oh yeah– he’s also the best defensive 2 guard in the league. Cool.

    He’s not even the best defensive 2 guard on his team. Iguodala is. Klay’s having an MVP caliber season, but he’s a good defender, not a great one.

    Did you watch him shut down Harden?

    Earlier this week? Harden had 33 points on 18 shots. And half of that was in the first half, when the game was competitive. GS has a great defense. Klay is part of that-he’s definitely a good defender. But Bogut, Green and Iggy are all probably better better defenders than him.

    He’s had a really interesting season on offense. You know how I’m always like “If so and so would just stop shooting stupid shots he’d be a much better player”. That’s what Klay’s done. I don’t know if it’s him, or Kerr, or someone else, but he’s significantly reduced his long 2’s and replaced them with shots at the rim. His FTr is way, way up (presumably because he’s going to the hole instead of shooting long j’s). It makes you wonder why more guys don’t/can’t do that. Intellectually it seems pretty simple, but it seems to happen so rarely.

  43. What Langstan is doing so far is pretty amazing. This is not some guy who has played years in the DL/overseas, he is only an undrafted rookie FA. He is showing great signs defensively and on offense. I realize that Oladipo is a young pup too but he can be a handful at times and Galloway gave him fits.

    I hope he keeps it up and Phil gives him a 3 yr deal partially guaranteed.

  44. If no one mentioned it yet, Simmons posted a great hypothetical for Knicks fans– would you trade Amare’s expiring for Derrick Rose? I say no, but I’m not sure,

  45. Earlier this week? Harden had 33 points on 18 shots.

    4 days before that Harden was 4-13 for 11 points in 33 minutes against Golden State (in Houston).

    I think most people who follow GS closely would happily argue against your claim that Thompson is not an elite defender. (In fact, I know they would– see Ric Bucher and others).

    You are most likely basing your opinion on his advanced stats and not the “eye test”, which I am not going to say you’re wrong to do. But I think we both know that individual defensive stats paint an incomplete picture. Thompson is a huge, huge part of that #1 team defense.

  46. How do you tell, using the eye test, the difference between a good defensive player (say, top 15 or so at his position) and an elite defender (say, one of the top 3 at his position)?

  47. I would trade anyone on the Knicks for Klay Thompson, and I was probably wrong about the Kevin Love trade.

  48. How do you tell, using the eye test, the difference between a good defensive player (say, top 15 or so at his position) and an elite defender (say, one of the top 3 at his position)?

    I don’t really want to get into an eye-test is best conversation, because those conversations have sort of run their corse over the years here. And I’m on the stats-side for the most part.

    But to answer your question, I think that the important stat is the team D-rating. So the Warriors are an elite team defensively. They are #1. So it makes sense that the top contributors to an elite defense could be elite defenders.

    With GS, the front-line, anchored by Bogut and Green, is in many ways responsible for the team’s defensive success. But as we Knick fans saw during the Tyson Chandler years, an elite rim-protector doesn’t do much good if opposing guards can get into the paint freely. So I think Thompson and Curry deserve a ton of credit for the defensive team Golden State has been this year.

    And the eye-test confirms that Thompson stays in front of his opponent, fights through screens, and harasses shooters into bad percentage shots, which is reflected in Golden State allowing a league best eFG% against.

  49. i never really put much weight into perimeter defending… for years guys like rondo, pierce, bowen, ginobilli had reputations of being great defenders but i think ppl were just underestimating how important KG and duncan were to a defense… it’s easy to play very aggressive when you’re confident that they’re not gonna torch you to the basket…

    whether it’s bogut or green in GS’s case i think we are seeing the same thing… and bogut was probably as good as gasol when he’s healthy…

  50. But Bogut hasn’t played in 1/3 of the games this year and the Warriors still lead the league in defensive efficiency and eFG% allowed. So there must be something to Golden State’s perimeter defense, no?

    (And I really don’t see how you can argue that perimeter defense is overrated after watching Tyson Chandler attempt to play defense alongside Ray Felton and JR Smith)

  51. Yeah, GS has a lot of good defenders. Bogut is the lynchpin, but Green, Barnes, Iggy are all long, versatile defenders. If you want to artgue Klay is a good defender I can’t say you’re wrong. But best in the game? I don’t see the support for that one.

  52. well like i said… we’re probably looking at bogut and green’s effect on GS’s defense… i mean david lee basically got replaced by green and we all know how david’s not the best defender in the world…

    when i say perimeter defense is overrated… i mean guys being labeled ‘shutdown’ defenders… no i don’t care how good you are.. you are not shutting down guys like harden, melo, lebron, curry et al… without help.. and it starts and ends with an inside presence…

    one exception is the bulls but they had a whole team of long very athletic very versatile defenders that swarmed everywhere but also could be very physical… they were able to do it with pippen and jordan taking more of the defensive load but they wouldn’t have been great defensively without grant or rodman, cartwright or longley…

    to be more precise.. i think your pf/c are responsible for 65% of the defense and the rest 35%… and you don’t have a top defense without EVERYONE defending of course…

  53. Because the pick n roll spread offense is such a huge part of the league how the big men hedge and recover or decide when to double the ball man is such a huge part of the defense. Therefore big men even have a big responsibility on defense on the perimeter and are even more valuable. We have seen the worst of that with Amare. A lot of that is good coaching too and what separate guys like Thibs etc from other coaches in the league. They are great at coaching this particular action and the rotations that come after.

  54. If you want to artgue Klay is a good defender I can’t say you’re wrong. But best in the game? I don’t see the support for that one.

    Yeah, I said the best in the league, and that obviously puts the burden of proof on me. I’m not sure if it’s true, because I believe individual defensive ranking is tricky (and subjective), but both Thompson and Curry deserve a lot of credit for the Golden State defensive machine. Tony Allen is probably the gold standard at the 2 guard. But even by individual D-rating, Thompson is in the top 4 behind only Allen, Sefolosha, and Harden. So I think there is data behind Thompson being an elite defensive guard. And time will tell, but perhaps making an all-defensive team this summer would boost his case?

  55. @ 87 – with Rose’s injury history and unable to play in 10 straight games plus the fact that he is due 20m & 21m (the next two years), I just cant see how you can make that trade if you are Phil. I doubt even the biggest Rose fans still believe that he can get back his pre injury athleticism. And without that athleticism he is no longer an MVP type player. He still has a chance to be an all-star but I would not want to take that chance knowing that one injury could end his career. Sad but true.

  56. I know I would make that trade immediately. Potentially 2 picks in the top 7. Sign me up! I wonder how everyone else feels.

  57. There was roughly a gazillion percent chance that Scott and Lin would be a bad fit. It’s pretty hilarious just how obvious all of this was going into the season.

  58. Lakers only own their pick if it’s top 5. And if they do, in fact, get to pick, they can’t trade it until the pick is made.

    Oh yeah, and Dolan wouldn’t do it anyway, no matter how beneficial it was to his team.

  59. @ 105 – thanks for update & you’re right about Dolan but I wonder if Phil would (if it was possible)?

Comments are closed.