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Wednesday, August 20, 2014

This Year the Knicks Will Finish… 41-25? Part I: Games 1-33

“I can’t play three days in a row! I can’t have sex three days in a row!” — Charles Barkley, 1998

 

Look, we get it. Our schedule sucks. But you know what? So does everyone else’s. Thanks to the lockout, every team can count at least one back-to-back-to-back in their condensed 66-game tour. Ten teams – including Atlantic rivals New Jersey and Philadelphia – will do it twice. Thankfully, the Knicks will be spared this slight.

As is the nature of a shortened schedule, the Knicks will most certainly find themselves faced with difficult stretches and situations. All the while, our mettle promises to be tested by a much-improved conference crop, stacked as it is with young athleticism,  a smattering of high-ceiling rooks and sophs, and an intact vanguard — Boston, Miami, Chicago — still looking down at us from the top. On the other hand, we won’t be seeing as much of the Western Conference as we have in seasons past, as the NBA chose to first sacrifice part the inter-conference schedule .

With that, here’s how I see the entire season shaking out, game by game. But first, a handy key:

*=Back to back

**=Back-to-back-to-back

***=David Stern hates us and takes great pleasure in our suffering

N = Nationally televised game (TNT, ABC, ESPN, Oxygen)

 

 

Games 1-33

(N*** ) 12/25 vs Boston: Aided by an Amar’e Stoudemire pick / leg sweep of a trailing Ray Allan, Toney Douglas hits a buzzer-beating game-winner from the left wing. Knicks 87, Celtics 85 (1-0)

(N) 12/28 @ Golden State: Despite losing Renaldo Balkman to a Tenderloin opium den, the Knicks rally behind Carmelo Anthony’s triple double. (32 points, 10 rebounds, 15 blocks). Knicks 112, Monta Ellis 95 (2-0)

(N*)12/29 @ LA Lakers: A balanced attack from the Bockers isn’t enough to stop Kobe Bryant, Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, John Hamm, Justin Bieber, George Mikan, and Luke Walton. Lakers 109, Knicks 98 (2-1)

12/31 @ Sacramento: Already harried by having to spend New Year’s Eve in Sacramento, the Maloof Brothers’ “Throw Silver Dollars at the Knicks Night” promotion proves strangely effective. Kings 102, Knicks 97, Maloof Brothers +$10,000 (2-2)

1/2 vs Toronto: After a rough West Coast swing, the Knicks find solace in the familiar confines of MSG, unleashing Josh Harrelson – fresh off a week stuffed without food and water in an over-sized locker – on a helpless Andrea Bargnani, whom the Knicks tell their rookie is food. Knicks 115, Raptors 93 (3-2)

1/4 vs Charlotte: Unable to afford to fly his team to New York, Michael Jordan flies himself, scores 22 points, loses, reveals noticeable bacon neck in postgame presser. Knicks 231, Michael Jordan 22 (4-2)

1/6 @ Washington: The Knicks capitalize on a JaVale McGee injury – a neck strain sustained while planking on top of the rim after a dunk – and ride Amar’e Stoudemire’s 33-point night to their third win in a row. Knicks 111, Bullets 103 (4-2)

1/7 @ Detroit: Led by Jonas Jerebko’s 35 points (37 of them on Stoudemire), the Piston’s make a furious fourth quarter comeback, only to fall in the final seconds to a Chauncey Billups 26-foot fast break pull-up three that utterly delights the crowd. Knicks 97, Pistons 94 (5-2)

(N) 1/9 vs Charlotte:  Able to pay money to fly his team to New York (he’d bet the over on 34 Jonas Jerebko points the night before), the Bobcats pounce on a Knicks squad not fully recovered from the previous night’s Andy & Landry Show taping, which featured a team laser tag bout: Bobcats 115, Knicks 109 (5-3)

1/11 vs Philadelphia: This is just a weird night, between Stat’s line (11 points, 11 rebounds, 1 jersey numeral), and three prospective Sixers mascots having a  halftime triple knife fight for the job. Knicks 111, Sixers 100 (6-3)

(N*) 1/12 @Memphis: The Old Miss’s methane musk clearly takes a toll on the Knicks, who squander a 25-point, 9 dunk performance from Iman Shumpert (he also announced his candidacy for President at halftime) Grizzle 95, Knicks 91 (6-4)

1/14 @ Oklahoma City: The Knicks show that light blue and light orange are for $@&!$%. Knicks 121, Seattle Supersonics  115 (7-4)

1/16 vs Orlando: Pau Gasol’s and Andrew Bynum’s combined 56 point, 15 thousand tear performance isn’t enough to stop a suddenly streaking Knicks squad. Knicks 104, Magic 95 (8-4)

1/18 vs Phoenix: Remember that really ugly Martin Luther King Day game against the Suns last year? This one will be just like that. Suns 125, Knicks 119 (8-5)

1/20 vs Milwaukee: Stephen Jackson becomes the first player in NBA history to [intentionally] punch out his own teammate. Does it really matter which teammate? Fine, it was Delfino. Knicks 109, Bucks 83. (9-5)

(N*) 1/21 vs Denver: Danilo Gallinari scores 39. That’s it. That’s the joke. Knicks 109, Nuggets 98 (10-5)

1/24 @ Charlotte: Michael Jordan loses Charlotte’s arena the night before in a game of Oxford Stud; Bobcats forced to forfeit. (11-5)

(*) 1/25 @Cleveland: Did you know this city’s main river once caught on fire? Knicks 103, Cavs 88 (12-5)

(N) 1/27 @ Miami: The Knicks realize that a stretch featuring Phoenix, Milwaukee, Denver, Charlotte, and Cleveland can give one a false sense of security, and fail to find a groove in the midst of a classic Miami “Red Out”… My assistant has just informed me that those are, in fact, seats. Heat 108, Knicks 98 (12-6)

(***) 1/28 @ Houston: Playing their fourth game in five nights in four different cities, the Bockers succumb to the Rockets on Vernon Maxwell Bobblehead Night (now with fan-punching action and secret herpes compartment!) Rockets 95, Knicks 87. (12-7)

1/31 vs Detroit: This was the only game I got to see at MSG last year, and Timofey Mozgov (43 points, 35 rebounds, if I remember correctly) insists in an extremely well written blog somewhere that his brilliance carry over with grade pride and vigor. Knicks 115, Pistons 101. (13-7)

(N) 2/2 vs Chicago: Derek Rose’s “Skittles and Pineapple Cleanse” backfires horribly, as Carlos Boozer, Joakim Noah, and “vincecarter” are forced to bear the brunt of a hot-shooting Bocker unit without their leader and reigning MVP. Knicks 123, Bulls 103 (14-7)

(N*) 2/3 @ Boston: I’ll most likely be attending this game with my Celtic-fan wife, and she’s a much better person than I am. Celtics 95, Knicks 91 (14-8)

(**) 2/4 vs New Jersey: Unfazed by “Inferiority Complex Night”, the Nets take advantage of their cross-river nemeses playing their third game in three nights. Nets 109, Knicks 100 (14-9)

2/6 vs Utah: Derrick Favors responds rather negatively to Josh Harrelson hitting him in the head with a Vida Blue fastball falling out of bounds, and the two’s subsequent brawl stalls a late Jazz comeback. Knicks 109, Jazz 104 (15-9)

2/8 @ Washington: A lengthy tour of various D.C. Jewish heritage sites by Amar’e Stoudemire inspires the Bockers (out of guilt, mostly) who weather Chauncey Billups’ two sprained ankles — sustained on the same John Wall crossover — for the W. Knicks 108, Wizards 91 (16-90

N 2/10 vs LA Lakers: Despite downgrading from John Hamm and Justin Bieber to Deavean George and Smush Parker, the Lakers continue their Gordian Knottish vexing of the Knicks. Lakers 100, Knicks 87 (16-10)

(*) 2/11 @ Minnesota: Propelled by the pastoral beauty and charm of Minnesota in February, the Knicks go all Fargo on the Wolves’ asses (insert wood chipper joke here) . Knicks 113, Wolves 95 (17-10)

2/14 @ Toronto: A vicious winter storm socks in much of Toronto, and the two teams are forced to play in front of 75 fans…. What’s that? It was 40 degrees and sunny? Oh. Knicks 129, Raptors 112 (18-10)

(*) 2/15 vs Sacramento: Jimmer Fredette starts at point guard. Knicks 120, Kings 65. (19-10)

N 2/17 vs New Orleans: This one just feels like beating up on the kid whose dog just died, and is in no way satisfying. Knicks 99, Hornets 80 (20-10)

N 2/19 vs Dallas: In their first matchup against the defending champs, the Knicks capitalize on the momentum of J.D. and the Straight Shot’s halftime debut of new single “Smokin’ Cubans,” riding Toney Douglas’ 29 points and festively patchy “winter beard” to their fifth consecutive win. Knicks 103, Mavs 96 (21-10)

*2/20 vs New Jersey: Toney Douglas goes o-11, but Stat and Melo pick up the slack with a combined 50 points to even the season series with the soon-to-be Brooklyn Lopezes. Knicks 115, Nettes 97 (22-10)

2/22 vs Atlanta: The Hawks snap the Knicks’ six game winning streak on a buzzer-beating and totally uncalled for corner three from Josh Smith, who’s really gotten into shape, you guys.  Hawks 95, Knicks 94 (22-11)

 

So that’s how I see the first half of the season shaking out. The takeaway? Mainly that the Knicks will be 22-11. Also that I have an overly active imagination, made all the worse by a prolonged dearth of actual Knicks news to report. That should change quickly tomorrow with the simultaneous start of training camp and free agent signings.

Either way, stay tuned for Part II!

224 comments on “This Year the Knicks Will Finish… 41-25? Part I: Games 1-33

  1. Frank

    So…. now that Battier has signed with the Heat, they should get serious preseason consideration for Greatest Defensive Team of All-Time. Wade, Lebron, Battier, Bosh, Joel Anthony – that is SCARY. Battier is perfect for them – can guard 2-3 positions, career 38% from 3, smart and tough team defender, and couldn’t care less about his offensive #s. Ouch.

  2. Frank

    never mind on my last comment. They’re about to sign Eddy Curry so that takes them out of GDTOAT consideration. He’s liable to eat one of the Heatles which would definitely decrease their defensive potential.

  3. Alley-Oop

    I don’t read a lot of sports blogging, actually, this is the only site I read in that world. So I don’t don’t know if I am an authority or anything of the sort, but your post rock, especially this one. Keep ‘em coming.

  4. PC

    The Post is reporting that Knicks are close to signing Grant Hill. Is he our “poor man’s” Battier (thank Sheridan for putting that phrase in my head)?

    At first glance I like it. Mainly because I think Landry is the type of kid to embrace Hill and learn from him. Anyone who thinks about defense is a nice addition to Amare and Carmelo.

  5. Z-man

    I don’t think of either Bosh or Joel Anthony (or Carmelo, for that matter) as great defensive players.

  6. PC

    Z-man,

    I agree on both your points. At of all our Knicks, Amare will be most affected re the “arm swing” non-shooting foul. However, I think in general, the Knicks as a team will benefit from it. The rules seem to help control guys like Durant and Kobe and Wade from constantly getting to the free throw line to stop momentum.

    As to the Heat – they’re a solid defensive team but aside from Wade and Lebron (and I wouldn’t be surprised if Wade begins to slow down a bit this year) the other guys are not that special. Battier has been living off the defensive specialist rep for a long time now, but he too struggles guarding younger more athletic players. He has a few tricks up his sleeve, but he doesn’t scare me. To put it another way, if Battier checks Melo, Melo will be very happy.

  7. Frank

    WTF – Ken Berger just tweeted that multiple “sources” say the Knicks are in the lead to land Tyson Chandler. Say what?
    I assume that would be amnesty on Billups? WTF?@?!?#

  8. Frank

    “@KBergCBS: Multiple league executives say the Knicks are now in the lead to land Tyson Chandler, jumping in front of the Warriors.”

    “@KBergCBS: If the deal goes through, the Knicks use amnesty on Chauncey Billups and move Ronny Turiaf to make room for Chandler, sources say.”

    !!!!!!!!!!

  9. steveoh

    Matt Steinmetz of CSN Bay Area (he covers the Warriors) is reporting that our Knicks “are very much in the mix for Chandler, although it might take them using amnesty on Chauncey Billups to get him.”

    That would be interesting. I guess we would sign him to a one-year deal with a wink-wink to resign or extend as an incentive to bring over Chris Paul with some magical pot of money I can’t explain.

    http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/warriors-talk/post/Chandler-has-offer-from-Warriors-in-hand?blockID=608184&feedID=5882

  10. John Kenney

    My mind is literally exploding right now. We’re trading Turiaf and amnestying Billups to get Chandler??? now THIS was unexpected. Madness. I love it. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THIS TEAM NEEDS. Amar’e and Melo taking shots, Toney D, Shumpert, and Chandler holding it down on D.

  11. Frank

    John Kenney:
    My mind is literally exploding right now. We’re trading Turiaf and amnestying Billups to get Chandler??? now THIS was unexpected. Madness. I love it. THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THIS TEAM NEEDS. Amar’e and Melo taking shots, Toney D, Shumpert, and Chandler holding it down on D.

    And one Steve Nash to come for the MLE next year to bring it all together.

  12. jon abbey

    wow, this would be the most exciting NY development since I can’t even remember. please please please happen.

  13. Frank

    this is totally ridiculous. A Nash, Shump/TD/Fields, Melo, Amare, Chandler team is a serious title contender.
    yowza.

  14. John Kenney

    Just to be clear, this means we are forgoing signing Dwight, CP, and Deron Williams in free agency.

    All of those trade scenarios where we trade melo or amar’e suddenly seem more possible…

  15. Frank

    LOL – twitter makes me laugh:

    “@netw3rk: RT @MattDotRich: @netw3rk anonymous sources state knicks request injury settings to be turned off”

  16. Frank

    @17 – sure why not? TChandler would not be taking any of the MLE. Grant Hill and Melo point-forwards for SSOL? Why not? The WORLD IS UPSIDE DOWN.

  17. ess-dog

    I can’t imagine it’s a one year deal; it’s probably a 4 year deal. Maybe then we trade Turiaf and Douglas for Sessions? We can still sign Hill too. I just wish Chandler was a little younger. But he’s exactly what we need.

  18. Mike Kurylo

    Remember when the Knicks were pursuing Eddy Curry, and I suggested that we grab Tyson Chandler instead and lots of people mocked me with taunts of 8 points per game?

  19. John Kenney

    tweets indicate it’s for four years starting at 14mil aka all of our cap space. but then we could use bird rights on landry, toney d, etc right? so this move is done with the knowledge that we get to keep all of our guys and use MLE to add a PG. and perhaps with the knowledge that we can’t get another max contract, OR with the sinister intention of trading melo or amar’e.

  20. alsep73

    But who plays point guard this year? TDWTDD? Has the staff suddenly gone crazy gung-ho about Shumpert as Westbrook 2.0? Are we just in a holding pattern until Nash is available next year? And what’s Plan B if Nash stays in Phoenix?

    On the one hand, Chandler is EXACTLY what this team needs in terms of interior defense and rebounding. On the other hand, how do you run the D’Antoni offense and get Stat the ball where he needs it without a playmaking point guard?

    Craziness.

  21. Nick C.

    Mike Kurylo: Remember when the Knicks were pursuing Eddy Curry, and I suggested that we grab Tyson Chandler instead and lots of people mocked me with taunts of 8 points per game?

    That would be great to see a link. I hope I was on the smart side of that argument. At any rate, I have been totally apathetic to basketball since the lockout, but Tyson Chandler has just kicked me out of hibernation.

  22. jon abbey

    It is a lot easier to get guards than frontline players, a frontline of Chandler/Amare/Melo would be insane.

  23. alsep73

    True, Jon, but D’Antoni’s offense is more predicated on having a strong playmaker than some others might be.

    Here’s the question: Since a Chandler signing would all but guarantee that Paul and Williams don’t come here next year, would you rather have Chandler and an iffy PG position (maybe an aging Nash next season, maybe not, and a puu-puu platter in the meantime) or have CP3/Deron and an iffy center position?

  24. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    On the one hand, Chandler is EXACTLY what this team needs in terms of interior defense and rebounding. On the other hand, how do you run the D’Antoni offense and get Stat the ball where he needs it without a playmaking point guard?

    Craziness.

    Not for nothing, but Douglas did a far better job getting Amar’e the ball where he needed it than Billups, so maybe they really do think Toney is ready.

  25. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Wouldn’t this suddenly make Melo very much available in a Paul deal? Especially since Paul has been telling everyone that signing Chandler would make him very happy.

  26. ess-dog

    This would send out a lot of ripples afterward, especially re: Paul. GS would pretty much be out any chance to resign Paul b/c there will be no Chandler. The Lakers might make due with the amnestied Billiups and bow out of the Paul race. Paul might seriously consider an extension with Boston and the Clips now. Really interesting.

  27. JK47

    Wait a minute.

    Is it even possible for us to amnesty Billups? I thought only the team that issued the original contract could amnesty the player. It would be better if we could do a sign-and-trade with Billups, thus holding onto our amnesty in case we need to use it on Amar’e.

    Or better yet, sign-and-trade Billups for Chandler, then flip Amar’e for Paul. BOO YAH

  28. Z

    Wow. I think we may all be stuck inside of Cock Jowles’ head while he’s having a wet dream. Look out!!

    Seems like the table is set to offer Amar’e for Chris Paul, now, right?

  29. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Wouldn’t an under-the-cap team sign Billups before he hit the open market?

  30. John Kenney

    Issue with trading melo for paul – the obvious move- is that large part of lure for CP3 appeared to be chance to play with Melo, his friend. Are he and Tyson close enough that it would still be the same for him, AND he’d be ok stabbing Melo in the back?

    Regarding Billups, new tweets say that he could be sign and traded for chandler, with a team with lots of cap space helping us out.

  31. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Is it even possible for us to amnesty Billups? I thought only the team that issued the original contract could amnesty the player. It would be better if we could do a sign-and-trade with Billups, thus holding onto our amnesty in case we need to use it on Amar’e.

    No, so long as the team has the player at the start of the new CBA, they can do the amnesty. Teams just can’t deal for players now and amnesty them.

  32. JK47

    This ish is just crazy. Tyson Chandler had a .697 TS% last year. He ripped down 12.1 REB/36. He is one of the best defensive centers on the planet. He had a higher WS/48 than Dirk Nowitzki. He was a key player on a championship team.

    This is craziness. Please please please make this happen. Even Jowles would have to be psyched about this.

  33. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    PG Chris Paul
    SG Landry Fields
    SF Carmelo Anthony
    PF ???????
    C Tyson Chandler

    But wouldn’t

    PG Paul
    SG Fields
    SF Hill (the Knicks would still be able to sign Hill with the MLE)
    PF Amar’e
    C Chandler

    make more sense?

  34. ephus

    JK47:

    The Knicks could amnesty Billups. The requirements are: (1) the player be signed to a contract before the new CBA and (2) the player is on the team that held his rights before the lockout. A team cannot trade for a player now and amnesty him (which would have created real value for Arenas and Rashard Lewis)

  35. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Marc Stein.

    Source close to Tyson Chandler talks just told http://t.co/Ir9HrM0O: “It’s 98 percent sure that Tyson is going to wind up with the Knicks.”

    Hole-e crap. This is insane. Not only is Chandler awesome, but if Paul came over for Melo (or Amar’e, but Melo makes more sense from a roster construction position)….wow. This would be the greatest offseason for the Knicks since Ewing was drafted!

  36. ess-dog

    I still don’t see Amare for Paul happening, but you never know I guess. So yes, sounds like a 3rd team would get Billups in this deal. Sacto would be odd. A contender would make more sense.

  37. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    John’s probably right, though, that it’d probably have to be Amar’e for Paul, just because of the whole “pals with Melo” thing. But hopefully he’s even greater pals with Chandler! I mean, Amar’e for Paul would be fine, but Melo for Paul would work out so much better from the way the Knicks’ roster is set up, as well as the fact that Amar’e would be the best post player Paul has ever played with and Amar’e needs a guard like Paul to dominate as a scorer.

  38. John Kenney

    Just suggested Mavericks would be amenable to a sign and trade with chandler, since getting Billups would still let the Mavs keep their ’12 cap space

  39. Matt Smith

    Let’s slow our horses on some of these post-Chandler trades – am I the only one who thinks a 2012 lineup of Chandler/Amare/Melo/Hill/Nash would be better than all of those? Or is Nash out of the picture if this goes down?

  40. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Nash would get offers for more than the MLE next season.

    And I’d rather Paul/Fields/Hill/Amar’e/Chandler this season and next than Nash/Hill/Melo/Amar’e/Chandler next season.

    The first lineup could definitely win a title this year.

  41. PC

    Melo for Paul would work out better?

    I doubt that. The injury risk on our team would be so high. God forbid Amare and Paul go down – we quickly become the worst team ever constructed.

  42. Matt Smith

    Agreed – I’m not trying to give up either for Paul, but certainly not Melo. We could quickly become the Blazers.

  43. flossy

    I’m sorry, but Tyson Chandler has had like 3 good seasons out of 10?

    That’s worth 4 years $60 mil??

  44. mase

    is.paul/melo/chandler is better than paul/amare/chandler?…i think melo sells more tix than amare but amare has a more fundementally sound game..

  45. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I doubt that. The injury risk on our team would be so high. God forbid Amare and Paul go down – we quickly become the worst team ever constructed.

    They’re getting Tyson Chandler. They clearly don’t care about injury risks.

    And yes, if both star players got hurt, that would be bad. But it’s not like they wouldn’t also be screwed if just Paul got hurt.

  46. New Guy

    flossy:
    I’m sorry, but Tyson Chandler has had like 3 good seasons out of 10?

    That’s worth 4 years $60 mil??

    And two of them were in contract years. I remain worried about him.

  47. tastycakes

    WELL THIS IS JUST SWELL. Now I’m going to be refreshing ESPN and Knickerblogger all afternoon. Dammit, I’m trying to be productive over here!

    I am definitely in favor of signing Wilson Chandler to the maximum for 15 years under the Rick DiPietro exception.

  48. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    My bad, I was off a year on Chandler. Yeah, New Guy, you’re right that both of his best seasons in the NBA did come during contract years.

  49. John Kenney

    I actually kind of hope now Chris Paul gets traded to the Lakers. Amar’e has done a lot for this franchise and I would feel guilty about CAA bringing paul, melo, and chandler together at his expense. I think if you have Amar’e and Melo as your offensive players and Chandler +two defensive guards as defensive players, you’re a very competitive and intriguing team.

  50. tastycakes

    I like Paul + Stat + Tyson better than Paul + Melo + Tyson but either works better than Melo + Stat + Tyson with no real point guard in tow.

    I do think the odds of Nash signing next year in that scenario are pretty good, though.

    BTW, who exactly is running the Knick front office right now? I realize that around here that’s like not knowing who the Secretary of State is, but… I like the Chandler idea very much. Of course, I would not be remotely stunned to see Dallas swoop back in at the last minute and retain him.

  51. New Guy

    You’re right, John Kenney. And the irony is none of them would want to be here if Amar’e hadn’t made the team relevant again. It would be a cold, cold, move. Doesn’t mean I wouldn’t make it, though.

    I don’t think Paul has anything to do with this, tbh. I think it’s straight up for Chandler.

  52. JK47

    Tyson Chandler is very consistent at the things we need him to do– rebound and play defense. We’re a bad rebounding team… very bad, in fact. Our shooting guard is our best rebounder at the moment. Outside of Dwight Howard, there isn’t a single NBA player who fits our needs better than Tyson Chandler. The upgrade of Tyson Chandler over the likes of Ronny Turiaf and Jared Jeffries is immense. Fear not.

    For all the people lamenting the Melo trade, look at where we are now. Amar’e, Melo and Billups are ASSETS. We are in a position to make moves for Tyson Chandler and Chris Paul. We’re on the verge of converting a poo-poo platter of Wilson Chandler, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov, Ray Felton and a #1 pick into GOLD.

  53. John Kenney

    I think it’s straight up for Chandler, but I worry if Paul doesn’t find a situation he likes, the knicks office will be tempted to start making that next move. Hopefully new orleans is scared of amar’e's injury history.

  54. New Guy

    tastycakes:
    I like Paul + Stat + Tyson better than Paul + Melo + Tyson but either works better than Melo + Stat + Tyson with no real point guard in tow.

    You may be right, but the starting PG’s in this year’s NBA finals were Mario Chalmers and a washed up Jason Kidd. Toney Douglas isn’t ideal but he could do the job for 66 games until Nash got here.

  55. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    For all the people lamenting the Melo trade, look at where we are now. Amar’e, Melo and Billups are ASSETS. We are in a position to make moves for Tyson Chandler and Chris Paul. We’re on the verge of converting a poo-poo platter of Wilson Chandler, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov, Ray Felton and a #1 pick into GOLD.

    Amar’e was on the team before the trade. How is Billups an asset here? He’s an expiring contract, that’s all. And yes, Melo is certainly an asset, but he better be when they traded half their team for him.

  56. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I like Paul + Stat + Tyson better than Paul + Melo + Tyson but either works better than Melo + Stat + Tyson with no real point guard in tow.

    Definitely.

  57. John Kenney

    i think Paul is so good that that statement is true, but not having a real point guard in tow is not really a problem.

  58. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Actually, it is kind of funny. My argument pre-trade was “I’d rather they save the assets to trade for Chris Paul and then sign a center like Tyson Chandler.” And if they deal Melo for Paul, that would pretty much be what they’d end up doing. My scenario did not have Chandler making this much money, though. $14 million a year is a lot.

  59. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    i think Paul is so good that that statement is true, but not having a real point guard in tow is not really a problem.

    Oh yeah, it is the “Paul is so good” part that I’m stressing. I actually have plenty of faith in Toney as a starting point guard. And like I mentioned earlier, Douglas is actually the best remaining Knick in terms of getting Amar’e the ball in the right places.

  60. Jafa

    @66, I totally agree. TD is capable of doing the job, which will be play great defense, bring the ball up and give it to Melo, and hit open 3 pointers. Why can’t we run the offense through Melo? Why can’t he play P&R with Amare and Chandler and cause havoc that way? I think he has what it takes and just needs to embrace the role to make the team work.

  61. New Guy

    Isn’t anyone worried that the Super-Chandler we saw last year may not be the Chandler we get for the next 4 years? Would love it if someone more statistically inclined than me (i.e. anyone) could demonstrate whether or not that contract year was an aberration. I mean, the dude got traded for Erik Dampier’s contract before the season started. People weren’t exactly lining up for Tyson Chandler based on the first 9 years of his career.

  62. tastycakes

    New Guy, good point about Chalmers & Kidd. Toney Douglas certainly can do a passable job with those guys.

    What I love about bringing in Chandler is that he complements the existing players. It may be one of the best possible off-season acquisitions the Knicks can realistically make.

    I think the Knicks won’t trade Melo because Dolan has some creepy attachment to him, whereas they’ll have some difficulty moving Stat because of his knees. But who knows? You have to be a bit ruthless in this biz if you want to compete with the likes of the Heat.

  63. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Chandler has always been one of the best defensive players in the NBA. That’s been true his whole career. And he’s always been a tremendous rebounder. His problems have always been on the offensive side of things, and they seem to be mostly issues with injuries. When he’s healthy, he’s only had one bad year in his last seven, and even that year (his last in Chicago) wasn’t that bad. He had two unhealthy years in a row, which was why no one was exactly clamoring for him last season. They wanted him to show he was healthy first.

  64. Robert Silverman

    Upon reflection, I don’t think NO would want a pissed-off Amar’e or Melo. It’d have to be a 3-team deal.

    But something about Chickens and hatching and counting comes to mind. Let’s see if this Chandler thing actually happens first. It’s been what, two hours, and all we have are twitter rumors

  65. tastycakes

    He won’t exactly be an offensive liability given the guys he has around him.

    Re: injuries, sometimes you have to take chances on guys with injury history. It can drive their price down / scare off competition for otherwise quality players. I’d have been scared to death of signing Marcus Camby post-Knicks-tenure, and yet he managed to stay reasonably healthy and efficient as a defensive player. Then you have your Antonio McDyess situations… I like this particular gamble. He’s not even supposed to be a #1 or #2 player on the team, which means he’s a lot easier to replace if he does break down. And clearly you can win with Chandler as your second best player… it just happened last year!

  66. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I feel bad for Dirk. He made a comment along the lines of, “I guess I didn’t take enough of a pay cut.” I am sure he meant it in a joking fashion, but still… ouch.

  67. njasdjdh

    I’m indescribably excited right now. Imagine if you will, needing some defensive stops and being able to put a Chandler, Douglas, Shumpert, Jeffries and STAT or Melo unit on the court for stretches. I need this to be official. I’m so happy I’m willingly inserting Jared Jeffries into my dream lineups.

  68. New Guy

    So if we pulled off a sign and trade for Chandler, we’d still be able to use the MLE on Hill and re-sign Shawn Williams bc of his bird rights, right?

    A roster of

    F Amar’e
    F Melo
    C Chandler
    G Douglas
    G Fields

    F/G Hill
    F Williams
    C Jordan
    G Shumbert

    Looks pretty sweet to me.

  69. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Yeah, it would have to be a sign and trade for the Knicks to be able to keep Extra E, etc.

  70. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I’m indescribably excited right now. Imagine if you will, needing some defensive stops and being able to put a Chandler, Douglas, Shumpert, Jeffries and STAT or Melo unit on the court for stretches. I need this to be official. I’m so happy I’m willingly inserting Jared Jeffries into my dream lineups.

    Wow, that really is impressive.

    I love the idea of just adding defensive players until D’Antoni is forced to play them all.

  71. BigBlueAL

    Looks like Paul to the Lakers, Gasol to Houston and Scola/Martin/picks to NO looking real possible.

    How about we stop already thinking about who to trade Melo and Amar’e for and just be pretty excited about the current team with Chandler?? Melo/Amar’e/Tyson is one helluva front line. Plus Chandler brings some nastiness and toughness we havent had since Kurt Thomas.

  72. tastycakes

    Re: Billups as an asset. Under the new CBA you can take back a lot more money in a trade, right? So instead of amnesty’ing him, you trade him for pennies on the dollar.

    Hold the amnesty in case Amar’e ends up needing microfracture again. (Or something equally disastrous happens to Melo). Not sure if the Knicks are gonna be so far over the cap that it won’t matter…

    I’m not gonna do the work to actually calculate the viability of these things, but can the Knicks amnesty Stat to sign Paul next year?

  73. njasdjdh

    tastycakes: I’m not gonna do the work to actually calculate the viability of these things, but can the Knicks amnesty Stat to sign Paul next year?

    I believe so…though that would be really cold. A team with Chandler and STAT signed to big deals should probably hold on to the amnesty at all costs. A team adding CP3 should still hold on to that, if possible, as well.

  74. art vandelay

    My guess is they trade billups via sign-and-trade and not amnesty to hold onto MLE and bi-annual exceptions this season….and billups goes to dallas, which may then flip him to another contender for an asset of some sort. If Dallas knows we want/need to S&T him rather via amnesty, though, they may ask for more than billups, which I fear.

  75. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I love me some Pau Gasol, but I don’t get why Houston would give up Scola, Martin and picks for him.

  76. tastycakes

    Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin):
    I love me some Pau Gasol, but I don’t get why Houston would give up Scola, Martin and picks for him.

    Because Daryl Morey is a tremendously overrated GM?
    But seriously, I don’t get that either. It wouldn’t get them out of the first round… I get that 3-way for LAL and NO, but not for HOU.

  77. Tony Pena

    Plus, keeping all 3 wont absolutely take them out of the running for CP3 right? Paul could end up getting traded to another team this year, and just sign with us for the vet’s minimum when his contract is up. Is it possible with the new CBA that all 4 rework their contracts next year? If it is that would be the move if the real motto is to “win”. 50 million split between them and 18 for role players sounds fair. And a crazy team.

  78. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Is it possible with the new CBA that all 4 rework their contracts next year?

    No, they are not allowed to restructure their contracts.

  79. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Chandler would not be amnesty-able if they signed him. It’s only on pre-existing contracts.

    Yep. Same with Paul.

  80. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I get that it helps fans feel close to the players, but boy, the Twitter feed for NBA players that ESPN has is bee-roo-tal.

  81. New Guy

    I can’t believe this might happen. I’m giddy.

    And yeah, forget spinning Melo or Amar’e. Ain’t gonna happen. Wouldn’t need it, either. We’d be good enough to win title as is.

  82. njasdjdh

    Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin):
    I get that it helps fans feel close to the players, but boy, the Twitter feed for NBA players that ESPN has is bee-roo-tal.

    I actually really enjoy it. Not as much as I enjoy their NBA reporter feed’s continued censorship of Larry Coon’s last name though.

  83. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I do. You always trade two B+ players for one A-. Gasol’s better than Amar’e or Melo.

    Agreed, but I wouldn’t trade Scola, Martin and picks for either of those guys, either. Chris Paul, I would, though. So it makes sense in that regard.

  84. BigBlueAL

    Caron Butler to Clippers for 3 yr/24 mil. Interesting.

    BTW I guess Im the only person here excited as shit about a Melo/Stat/Tyson front line lol

  85. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Question – if the Knicks have to make a deal first to pick up Chandler (whether by trading Billups to another team with cap space or signing and trading him to Dallas), why are they leaking the news before hand? Won’t that just make it more difficult for them to get this done?

  86. JK47

    This is going to cut into Jorts’ playing time.

    I’m not worried at all about Tyson Chandler’s production, because when it comes to the things we need– interior defense and rebounding– Chandler is very consistent. He’s a 12 rebound per 36 machine. Rebounding was a serious problem for us last year with the likes of Ronny Turiaf, Amar’e Stoudemire and Jared Jeffries manning the 5. Now, with Chandler in the lineup, we figure to be a strong rebounding team. Chandler is a very good rebounder, Amar’e is not bad for a PF, Melo holds his own and our wings are quite proficient on the glass.

    Rebounding was a major reason why our defense sucked last year. We were 26th in defensive rebounding. That is going to improve by leaps and bounds with Chandler in the fold. We were 23rd in eFG% allowed– expect that to greatly improve as well.

  87. Robert Silverman

    Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin):
    Question – if the Knicks have to make a deal first to pick up Chandler (whether by trading Billups to another team with cap space or signing and trading him to Dallas), why are they leaking the news before hand? Won’t that just make it more difficult for them to get this done?

    I think they’re going to end up amnestying Billups. Doubt anyone (save possibly Dallas) wants to help the Knicks get Chandler. Especially when they know if they wait it out, he can be signed for a LOT less than 14mil.

  88. tastycakes

    [q]Caron Butler to Clippers for 3 yr/24 mil. Interesting.[/q]

    Did they also resign Loy Vaught?

  89. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    Did they also resign Loy Vaught?

    Yeah, seriously, what a freaking bizarre move.

  90. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I think they’re going to end up amnestying Billups. Doubt anyone (save possibly Dallas) wants to help the Knicks get Chandler. Especially when they know if they wait it out, he can be signed for a LOT less than 14mil.

    The problem is that they do not have enough money to sign him right now even if they amnesty Billups. They’d have to trade Turiaf and one other player while renouncing every remaining player. Doesn’t it sound more likely that they have some kind of sign and trade worked out (perhaps a three-way deal, with Sacto getting Billups)?

    Or, in the alternative, have they announced this way too soon?

  91. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    @104 Actually, for their positions, Amare is an awful rebounder but Melo is above average.

    True, the Knicks would have two of the best rebounders for their positions with Melo and Chandler.

  92. art vandelay

    I feel like the Zuckerberg character at the end of The Social Network…constantly refreshing my feed, looking for confirmation of this signing going down for chandler and awaiting word on its domino effects…

    click…click…click!

  93. Robert Silverman

    I can’t believe the Knicks are about to roll out a lineup of:

    C TYSON FREAKING CHANDLER
    PF STAT
    SF Melo
    SG Fields
    PG DWTDD

    And a bench of Hill (Maybe), Shump, Jorts, and TBD

    Effing awesome. 7’2, 6’10, 6’9″ across the frontline. We’re big n’ mean again.

  94. nfr213

    art vandelay: I feel like the Zuckerberg character at the end of The Social Network…constantly refreshing my feed, looking for confirmation of this signing going down for chandler and awaiting word on its domino effects…click…click…click!

    the truest statement of the morning so far.

  95. Jake S.

    I know we’re getting ahead of ourselves here, but who would run the point for this team? Toney? Jamal Tinsley? Sedale Threat?

  96. nicos

    I like Chandler, though I think clearing room and making a decent size- say 10 million- one year offer with a team option for a second year to Greg Oden might make more sense- if he’s healthy, he does everything Chandler does plus has the potential to be a better scorer. Huge health risk but if you’re putting 4yrs / 60 million into Chandler I’m not sure that’s any safer. If Oden flames out, you don’t pick up the option and you still have cap space next summer. If he’s healthy, he’s probably a top 5 center with the potential to be number 2 after Howard.

  97. Frank

    Here’s an idea that everyone should like:

    3-way trade with appropriate filler as necessary

    NYK gets Chandler
    DAL gets Kaman (center to replace TC, can still play, expiring contract)
    LAC gets Billups (veteran who is badly needed in the backcourt, also expiring)

    Who says no?

  98. Jake S.

    Any chance the Cavaliers amnesty Baron Davis? If they did, would the Knicks get a crack at him, or is he likely to be picked up by another team under the cap?

  99. Jim Cavan (@JPCavan) Post author

    Robert Silverman: Effing awesome. 7’2, 6’10, 6’9? across the frontline. We’re big n’ mean again.

    If Melo’s 6’9″, I’m Rita Hayworth.

    But I echo your sentiments!

  100. JK47

    Saying “Greg Oden is a huge injury risk” is like saying “Charlie Sheen is a huge drug abuse risk.”

    He was drafted in 2009. He has played 82 career games.

  101. Spree8nyk8

    JK47:
    Saying “Greg Oden is a huge injury risk” is like saying “Charlie Sheen is a huge drug abuse risk.”

    He was drafted in 2009.He has played 82 career games.

    We could prolly get Sheen for the min!

  102. Jim Cavan (@JPCavan) Post author

    Spree8nyk8:
    Welcome to Knickerblogger Rita!

    What’s really amazing is I glossed right over the “Tyson Chandler is 7’2″ part…

  103. Frank O.

    From the ContraCosta Times:

    Warriors Lose Out On Chandler … Up Next?

    By Marcus Thompson
    Thursday, December 8th, 2011 at 12:46 pm in Uncategorized.

    Sources confirmed the Warriors are all but out of the Tyson Chandler sweepstakes. Golden State loses out on their top free agent target, as he choses another

    The Knicks outbid the Warriors at four years, $60 million according to one source. As for Golden State’s offer, another source said they did not get that high. The Warriors’ offer was closer to four years, $52 million, with a willingness to maybe get up to $56 million.

    They might’ve reluctantly matched the Knicks but it never got that far, per one source, because Chandler preferred the Knicks. Once they made the offer he liked, game over. Even if the Warriors had matched, Chandler would have chosen New York, the source said. Better situation. Bigger market. You know the story.

    It all adds up to the Warriors losing out again. But that is not the worst thing to some members of the organization, who were hesitant to make Chandler the Warriors highest-paid player. Golden State does prefer Chandler, but the price tag was getting to an uncomfortable level. The Knicks, in essence, saved the Warriors from overpaying.

    So what do the Warriors do now? DeAndre Jordan represents their most feasible next move. Nene is commanding $15 million per year, a price tag Golden State would prefer not to pay. They’d love Marc Gasol, but every indication is Memphis will match any offer.

    That leaves Jordan, who too is a long shot. The Clippers want to match, and have reportedly offered a five-year, $40 million deal. That leaves a window in which the Warriors may be able to jump higher than the Clippers while still staying in their comfort zone. Since L.A.’s second team still has designs on Dwight Howard, they may let Jordan go.

  104. Ben R

    I am really excited about this news. I actually think Douglas is a great fit at PG. We need defense from the PG more than offense and with Douglas and Chandler on the court we have great defenders at the two most important defensive positions. Douglas is a great shooter as well so while he is not a great passer he does everything else we want and with Melo taking playmaking pressure off Douglas I think he is just fine.

    I actually don’t think we should go after Hill, he is a great player but SF and SG are our deepest positions. Even with Chandler we could use more help upfront, or a good backup PG for Douglas, Shumpert I think is more of a 2.

  105. BigBlueAL

    Interesting question being brought up on Twitter, should Knicks make a run at Nene instead of Chandler?? Chandler is the much, much better rebounder and defender though.

  106. Spree8nyk8

    mase:
    thats potentially baron/hill/melo/stat/tyson… whos better than that?!?

    It’s not even just that, we would still have douglas, fields, shump, extra E, and bill walker on the bench as well so I mean we really seem to be forming an actual team

  107. art vandelay

    It is arguable that going with melo-stat-chandler frontline with a serviceable PG is better than trading stat for cp3….getting a decent point may be easier than finding a replacement for stat….and having that frontline, possibly best in the league, might be preferable to going after stud PG….not sure…it is debatable.

  108. mase

    136
    i agree about skipping out on hill, there will be options after players are amnestied and our need is a pg if tyson happens. players will be fighting eachother off to play for us even if its one year

  109. Spree8nyk8

    mase:
    136
    i agree about skipping out on hill, there will be options after players are amnestied and our need is a pg if tyson happens. players will be fighting eachother off to play for us even if its one year

    We’ll still have an MLE to use for that, Hill was coming for a min contract as far as I know.

  110. Robert Silverman

    Jim Cavan (@JPCavan): What’s really amazing is I glossed right over the “Tyson Chandler is 7’2? part…

    Tyson Chandler is twelve feet tall, and possesses Mr. Fantastic’s elastic body, giving him a one hundred-foot standing reach, Rita.

  111. Robert Silverman

    BigBlueAL:
    Interesting question being brought up on Twitter, should Knicks make a run at Nene instead of Chandler??Chandler is the much, much better rebounder and defender though.

    No. Chandler’s a much better defender/rebounder and doesn’t have two surgically repaired knees (like Nene)

  112. Jim Cavan (@JPCavan) Post author

    Spree8nyk8:
    Do we get to call Jim Cavan “Rita” for the whole season now?

    As soon as you line Melo and Chandler up against a 7-11 door.

  113. Frank O.

    I go away for just a little bit and suddenly chandler is our center and Billups is “irate” about possibly being amnestied.
    Someone said their head was spinning. Me too.

    So if they sign Chandler for 58 million, and the contract is set up as a V and I am seeing on twitter, and they are dropping Billups, do they have the space or the pieces to add Paul?

    complicated.
    And if they don’t get Paul, who is the point?

  114. John Kenney

    It’s ok if Melo’s not 6’9 because Amar’e just tweeted the work on his back has stretched him out to 6’11. Yowzas.

    Just a note: if we sign Hill, he’s starting over Landry. 100%.
    I love that our subs are all young and energetic tho. Throwing TD and Shump out there together on D is gonna be great.

    Jim Cavan (@JPCavan): If Melo’s 6’9?, I’m Rita Hayworth.

    But I echo your sentiments!

  115. New Guy

    Frank: Ok. Still I say keep Chandler/Stat/Melo. Maybe a trade next year to get Paul. Or not.

    Donald Sterling when he sees what Chauncey is making

  116. njasdjdh

    Frank O.: So if they sign Chandler for 58 million, and the contract is set up as a V and I am seeing on twitter, and they are dropping Billups, do they have the space or the pieces to add Paul?

    Does anyone know how this renegotiate and extend rule is going to work as far as cap space and how many players you can do it with? I have a dream of renegotiating and extending STAT, Melo and Chandler and squeezing Paul’s contract in.

  117. yoda4554

    If we get Chandler, I would think we actually have to trade Stoudemire. With Chandler’s man near the basket and basically free to double-team–with additional help if necessary coming from Melo’s nearby midrange defender–Amar’e's ability to dominate offensively will be limited to from outstanding to merely good, which when combined with his poor defense and otherwise average play makes him something of a liability, at least at his price.

  118. New Guy

    Frank:
    Here’s an idea that everyone should like:

    3-way trade with appropriate filler as necessary

    NYK gets Chandler
    DAL gets Kaman (center to replace TC, can still play, expiring contract)
    LAC gets Billups (veteran who is badly needed in the backcourt, also expiring)

    Who says no?

    Donald Sterling when he sees what Chauncey is making

    *That’s what I meant to reply to!

  119. Frank O.

    yoda4554:
    If we get Chandler, I would think we actually have to trade Stoudemire.With Chandler’s man near the basket and basically free to double-team–with additional help if necessary coming from Melo’s nearby midrange defender–Amar’e’s ability to dominate offensively will be limited to from outstanding to merely good, which when combined with his poor defense and otherwise average play makes him something of a liability, at least at his price.

    With all due respect, this hits me as poppycock. :)
    I mean, last year, Amare for more than half the season was probably one of the best power forwards in the game, virtually unstoppable, and who was his center? I mean, Mosgov, Jeffries?
    Chandler still has mad hops and can finish around the hoop. No one is leaving him alone around the paint because he’s going to break the damn rim.

  120. xduckshoex

    yoda4554:
    If we get Chandler, I would think we actually have to trade Stoudemire.With Chandler’s man near the basket and basically free to double-team–with additional help if necessary coming from Melo’s nearby midrange defender–Amar’e’s ability to dominate offensively will be limited to from outstanding to merely good, which when combined with his poor defense and otherwise average play makes him something of a liability, at least at his price.

    I don’t see how that’s more of an issue than when he was playing with Turiaf, Shaq or Robin Lopez.

  121. Frank O.

    The only limit on Amare is that the Knicks will have more scoring options, and a ball magnet like Melo.
    Chandler doesn’t need the ball, and is a formidable defender and rebounder. He made Dallas what they were. He elevated that team with his power and presence.
    the only possible downside is his health. Last year, he played almost a full season for the first time, so maybe he’s figuring out how to stay healthy.

  122. BigBlueAL

    Chandler lead the NBA in TS% last season. He may not have post moves or anything but if teams wanna leave him alone at the basket it will be fine with me.

  123. xduckshoex

    I’m just really wary about offering big money and 4 years to a guy whose main claims to fame less than a year ago were his inconsistency and tendency to be injured. I hope it works out but I’ll believe it when I see it.

  124. Frank

    Can someone explain to me the timing of “under the cap” and MLE eligibility? So here’s the situation that I see coming:

    Amnesty Billups, trade Turiaf for sandwich. Our payroll goes to ~$42.5 so we are WAY under the cap.

    Does that mean at this instant we are under the cap so we are eligible to bid on amnestied players?

    When we sign Chandler for ~$15M and surpass the cap, do we then regain the use of the MLE?

    If we sign him for an amount that takes us just under the cap, do we get both the “room exception” AND the MLE once the use of the room exception takes us over the cap?

    These are Larry Coon type questions but I imagine his twitter account is getting bombarded.

  125. Frank

    xduckshoex:
    I’m just really wary about offering big money and 4 years to a guy whose main claims to fame less than a year ago were his inconsistency and tendency to be injured.I hope it works out but I’ll believe it when I see it.

    4 years, big $$, and no more amnesty! Lots of risk, but if you want to win big, you need to push your chips in.

    The good news is that Amare, Melo, and TC all expire after the 14-15 season as far as I can tell. So we can blow the whole thing up and start over that offseason if necessary.

  126. xduckshoex

    I guess that’s a good thing; if it’s a disaster, it’s not one that gets worse every year like the Isiah Thomas disasters.

  127. Robert Silverman

    Chris “Shawne Williams is a poor man’s Jamal Crawford” Sheridan thinks the Tyson Chandler signing is a foolish move.

    Yep. That confirms it’s a great move.

  128. Spree8nyk8

    yeah, I lost almost all respect for Sheridan when I read that. What a dufus. I mean i still say that the biggest thing being overlooked in all of this is that we go from potentially being a team with 3 players needing to sign a roster of min guys next year to having a fairly complete team with the ability to still add and tweak over the next few years with exceptions. None of the contracts are particularly awful. And we start competing right away instead of basically tossing a year away waiting for next year. Not to say we’ll win it all this year, but I think we are a lot closer than we were yesterday.

  129. Ben R

    The best thing about this move is it shows the Knicks are building to win now. Not wait another year while the team is torn apart by trade rumors.

  130. Ben R

    Spree8nyk8:
    yeah, I lost almost all respect for Sheridan when I read that.What a dufus.I mean i still say that the biggest thing being overlooked in all of this is that we go from potentially being a team with 3 players needing to sign a roster of min guys next year to having a fairly complete team with the ability to still add and tweak over the next few years with exceptions.None of the contracts are particularly awful.And we start competing right away instead of basically tossing a year away waiting for next year.Not to say we’ll win it all this year, but I think we are a lot closer than we were yesterday.

    Yes! I totally agree. Look at us trying to build a cohesive team. Rather than chase the big 3 pipedream. Who would have thought.

  131. nfr213

    the three way HOU LAL NOH trade has picked up traction in the last few hours, thoughts? I dont really see the play from an LA side, would it ever allow for a play at Dwight Howard at some point?

  132. Robert Silverman

    For all those KB-ers questioning this deal, think about this…

    How many teams since Bill Russell showed up have one a title without a good starting center? (And I’m defining “good” as the 3rd best player on the team/a borderline all-star)

    One. The Bulls. Because of Michael Jordan.

    The worst centers on a title winner would be Clifford Ray on the ’75 Warriors – a plus shotblocker/rebounder/defender, Jack Sikma an underrated player, and Bill Laimbeer a nasty defender/rebounder/spot up shooter and the foul, black heart of the late 80′s Pistons.

    It looks like (knock on wood) we just got one in Tyson Chandler. Whether or not CP3 ever arrived, the Knicks would still have needed to get a legit+ center. As far as scarcity goes, that’s harder to get than a PG, even an all-time great like Chris Paul.

    How many legit centers, one you can win a title with, are there in the NBA now?

    Howard, Noah, Chandler, Duncan (maybe), Bynum (when healthy), both Gasol brothers, Bogut (when healthy) and…that’s it.

    That’s why you do this deal. Next year, if you want to bring our old friend Ray Felton or possible even Steve Nash, great. You can get a decent PG for the mid-level exception.

    Smile, guys. The Knicks front office made possibly the smartest move they’ve made since the Camby-Oakley/Spree-Starks trades in ’98.

  133. Spree8nyk8

    Yeah, they are building a real team, fully equipped with pieces that can actually be moved around if things don’t quite fit. Not sure they can ask for much more than that.

  134. MKinLA

    Why isn’t anyone talking about how this impacts us v. the Heat?

    Mike D better be watching tape of the finals last year right now. The blueprint for stopping LeBron and Wade is right there and now we have the center-piece necessary to actually pull it off.

  135. yoda4554

    Frank O.: With all due respect, this hits me as poppycock. :)
    I mean, last year, Amare for more than half the season was probably one of the best power forwards in the game, virtually unstoppable, and who was his center? I mean, Mosgov, Jeffries?
    Chandler still has mad hops and can finish around the hoop. No one is leaving him alone around the paint because he’s going to break the damn rim.

    When Amar’e was actually dominant last year, he was his own center. That was the point–Felton, Gallo, W. Chandler, and Fields camped out at the three-point line, and he got everything inside all to himself. No one could guard him one-on-one, and teams trying to double gave him plenty of time to kick out to open shooters and cutters. This even worked with Turiaf, who played on the perimeter because he’s a greater perimeter passer and his only offensive skill is the high pick-and-roll. It was less effective with Mozgov, but still worked because Mozgov could hit an open 18-footer. (Things worked similarly with Lopez’s baseline j in Phoenix; the Shaq-Amar’e pairing never really had time to jell.) It didn’t work when Jefferies and Melo were starting in the front court, during which time help defenders could double-team Amar’e right at the basket, cutting off his passing options and killing his scoring efficiency in one swoop. That’s why T. Chandler’s not a great fit with Amar’e–Chandler’s ability to finish at the rim is useful when you have an ace pg who opens up the court and can fire in lobs to him, but it’s not going to help him receive the ball from an average passer like Amar’e who’s getting choked off right at the hoop. If Amar’e could kick out to him for a jumper, that’d be one thing, but Chandler can’t shoot.

  136. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    The Mike Dunleavy signing in Milwaukee was smart. Just $7.5 million for two years. That’s a team that could use his offense. I didn’t know Battier got a three-year deal from the Heat. Good for him. I thought he was mostly going to be in the one-year deal era of his career.

  137. flossy

    Robert Silverman: How many teams since Bill Russell showed up have one a title without a good starting center? (And I’m defining “good” as the 3rd best player on the team/a borderline all-star)

    One. The Bulls. Because of Michael Jordan.

    Ahem, Kendrick Perkins? How soon we forget.

  138. flossy

    yoda4554: the Shaq-Amar’e pairing never really had time to jell.

    Amar’e killed it in Phoenix playing next to Shaq to the tune of 29ppg on like 17 FGA.

  139. Garson

    I like the fact that its easier to find a PG on the MLE then a center… Anyone have any thoughts in particular?

    Dont think Felton would be an option after what we did to him last year?

  140. Robert Silverman

    flossy: Ahem, Kendrick Perkins?How soon we forget.

    Good catch. Kendrick would be on my list, but he (before his knee exploded) was comparable to Laimbeer (better defender, worse shooter)

  141. Spree8nyk8

    Garson:
    I like the fact that its easier to find a PG on the MLE then a center… Anyone have any thoughts in particular?

    Dont think Felton would be an option after what we did to him last year?

    I wouldn’t say that really, I mean the fans loved him, the team loved him. I think getting traded for Melo is no slap in the face.

  142. BigBlueAL

    Im glad in a way, let the Lakers reload and not anyone else in the East. Plus we can forget about stupid CP3 trade rumors. Let us enjoy and build around our great frontcourt now.

  143. Spree8nyk8

    BigBlueAL:
    Im glad in a way, let the Lakers reload and not anyone else in the East.Plus we can forget about stupid CP3 trade rumors.Let us enjoy and build around our great frontcourt now.

    Why? If the Lakers land Howard we cannot beat them. It will be over. What is the point of making a team that can win the East but not win the title? I don’t care if the Lakers get Paul, but if they get Howard I’m gonna lose my shit.

  144. BigBlueAL

    Let the Thunder and Mavs worry about the Lakers, we still have our hands full with the Heat, Bulls and Celtics.

  145. Spree8nyk8

    BigBlueAL: o

    Like I said, does no good to reach the finals if you can’t win. If orlando is that fucking stupid then screw the NBA. I am really hoping now that Odom is gone that LA just doesn’t have enough left to get Howard but at this point I really don’t know.

  146. John Kenney

    Although..does anyone else think this makes Knicks-Lakers a much easier game for us? we drowned in their length last year. Now we can stack up melo amare chandler against bynum and…who else down low? I like it.

  147. tastycakes

    Whatever, the Lakers now are super thin up front and Kobe is in decline. Getting Howard would be scary as hell, of course, but is Orlando going to move him now?

    The real thing is… really, this is the best that New Orleans can do? Pau and Odom are on the downhill slope!

  148. Dan Panorama

    Find it really difficult to imagine Orlando making a Bynum/Howard trade unless Howard pulled a complete 100% Melo. But don’t think he has that kind of leverage since Lakers capped out of offering a big contract next year, no?

  149. TDM

    The deal being reported is Chris Paul to Lakers, Gasol to Rockets and Odom, KMart, Scola to NO. However, the salaries don’t match if I’m looking at this correctly. It would be an extra $8.5 M to NO that they cannot absorb.

    Assuming this is the deal, are there any scraps in NO or HOU worth trying to trade for?

  150. daJudge

    I love CP3, but this would be unbelievable. This is getting an excellent position player that we desperately need. It’s reasonable and sensible. I have been pining for a 5 that can rebound, defend, set a damn pick, block a shot, throw an outlet, play some D, etc.. for many years. Just looking at that front line makes me think that we can compete with anyone in the NBA–and Spree, that includes the Lakers with Howard and even Paul. This team will go deep into the playoffs and will be nasty dangerous. Our front three may be better than Reed, Dave D. and Bradley. I’ve been following this story at work and it made my day. There is also some talk about picking up a nice point guard. Stay tuned. Stay optimistic. Stay pumped.

  151. Dan Panorama

    Also, seriously Billups? This is just unprofessional — you’re a massively overvalued expiring contract who didn’t exactly have a monster year with a Knicks team where you have no clear future whatsoever. Shit happens!

  152. Robert Silverman

    TDM:
    The deal being reported is Chris Paul to Lakers, Gasol to Rockets and Odom, KMart, Scola to NO.However, the salaries don’t match if I’m looking at this correctly.It would be an extra $8.5 M to NO that they cannot absorb.

    Assuming this is the deal, are there any scraps in NO or HOU worth trying to trade for?

    It works if NO releases its cap hold on David West.

  153. TDM

    Robert Silverman: It works if NO releases its cap hold on David West.

    They could amnesty Okafor. 3 yrs / $12 M.

    Looks like Baron Davis is being amnestied by the Cavs. Not a big shocker.

  154. d-mar

    Can someone explain what happens to our cap situation if the Chandler deal goes down and we amnesty Billups?

    And I know CP3 is an otherwordly PG, but I’m almost starting to like this move better. Our front line would just be ridiculous.

  155. JK47

    What about cap issues for the Lakers? How do they fit Paul, Kobe and Howard together under the cap without some haircuts taking place?

  156. Frank

    Robert Silverman: It works if NO releases its cap hold on David West.

    In other words, Gasol + Odom for CP3 and West (on the mini MLE)? Although I have to think West can get more than 3M per.

    Meanwhile there’s no way the Lakers have enough assets to get Howard. AFter this trade they’ll have Bynum and that’s it. And Bynum’s contract expires after next season. No way Bynum agrees to an extension with that putrid roster in ORL. I think this is it for them. They just have to hope that Bynum stays healthy and that some desperate/reasonable PF/C type is willing to come for the mini mid level.

    I guess we are REALLY lucky that we’re playing the Lakers while Bynum is on suspension. If all these trades go through, it’ll be our frontcourt of Chandler, Amare, and Melo against Derek Caracter, Luke Walton, and World Peace. And a new coach/system.

  157. Shad0wF0x

    tastycakes:
    The Lakers should amnesty Kobe.Or trade him for D-Ho.Now THAT would be mercenary!

    That would be really kind of Kobe and it’ll also cement him in my mind as a person who just wants to win.

  158. Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin)

    I have no problem with Billups’ agent trying to scare teams away from picking him up on the amnesty waivers. However, how phony is “he thought this would be his final destination.” Srsly? You thought that this would be your final destination, Chauncey? Give me a break.

  159. Garson

    I read that hornets get odom, scola , Kevin Martin and some picks?

    Woow sounds like a fantastic deal for a guy they knew was leaving.

    Jack, martin odom scola okafor is a half decent , balanced lineup

  160. Robert Silverman

    Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin):
    I have no problem with Billups’ agent trying to scare teams away from picking him up on the amnesty waivers. However, how phony is “he thought this would be his final destination.” Srsly? You thought that this would be your final destination, Chauncey? Give me a break.

    You misunderstood the quote. Wen his agent said, “His ‘Final Destination’” he meant the film, Final Destination. As in, “Chauncey would have gotten worn to the ground trying to push the tempo under M’DA and it would have killed him.”

    Chauncey’s agent just meant his client had cheated death, that’s all.

    Totally harmless

  161. danvt

    I guess, once it became apparent that Paul was not coming, this became a really great option. Once they found a landing spot for Turiaf, it was all over. Chauncey probably joins Miami when the dust settles, and then he’ll relish the opportunity to come and kill us, which he might succeed in. We may not be ready for the finals until we make one more big move, but I’m feeling really good. I think 40+ wins is a possibility.

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