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	<title>Comments on: The Death Knell of David Lee as a Knick?</title>
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		<title>By: bfellow</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-254097</link>
		<dc:creator>bfellow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 15:07:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-254097</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This rumor would be true if Zeke was running the show and thinking whats for tomorrow&#039;s dinner.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This rumor would be true if Zeke was running the show and thinking whats for tomorrow&#8217;s dinner.</p>
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		<title>By: ben bow</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253575</link>
		<dc:creator>ben bow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 03:10:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253575</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[jesus christ. i&#039;m reading some other posts that are terrible as well. putting lee in the same category as monta ellis?? hell no. monta ellis is a frikin monster. he&#039;ll be an allstar soon. this season he scored over 20 pts a game, and had like a 53 fg percent as a sg. also, same category as al jefferson? thats really unlikely. you guys say stats dont matter, but if stats dont matter, just watching jefferson play he&#039;s alot better. he can actually post somebody up, unlike lee. i dont think i&#039;ve ever seen david lee post someone up, and he&#039;s like 6 10 or something. jefferson is a monster down low, way better then lee is. if we could trade lee for him, i&#039;d do it in a heartbeat, then build around jefferson and gallinari. can you build around lee and gallinari? hell no. lee isnt a franchise superstar kinda player. personally, jefferson is.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jesus christ. i&#8217;m reading some other posts that are terrible as well. putting lee in the same category as monta ellis?? hell no. monta ellis is a frikin monster. he&#8217;ll be an allstar soon. this season he scored over 20 pts a game, and had like a 53 fg percent as a sg. also, same category as al jefferson? thats really unlikely. you guys say stats dont matter, but if stats dont matter, just watching jefferson play he&#8217;s alot better. he can actually post somebody up, unlike lee. i dont think i&#8217;ve ever seen david lee post someone up, and he&#8217;s like 6 10 or something. jefferson is a monster down low, way better then lee is. if we could trade lee for him, i&#8217;d do it in a heartbeat, then build around jefferson and gallinari. can you build around lee and gallinari? hell no. lee isnt a franchise superstar kinda player. personally, jefferson is.</p>
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		<title>By: ben bow</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253570</link>
		<dc:creator>ben bow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 03:00:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253570</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[why the hell is everyone so against trading lee for felton????? lee is way overrated by all knicks fans, simply because compared to the rest of the team he is great. raymond felton is one of the higher class PG&#039;s in the league. this season he averaged 7.4 assists a game. that was seventh in the league. i thought one of our weaknesses was a need of a pass first point guard????? also, now that we have gallinari, we have a PF to replace lee, so its not a big deal. Finally, i&#039;ve heard many people say he hasnt improved over his time in the league. i disagree. his assist number has gone up each year he&#039;s in the league, and his fg percent has risen. i think that he will probably continue improving, and best yet, he&#039;s only 24, with a low salary of 3.3 mil. if we got felton, i would be a happy knicks fan.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>why the hell is everyone so against trading lee for felton????? lee is way overrated by all knicks fans, simply because compared to the rest of the team he is great. raymond felton is one of the higher class PG&#8217;s in the league. this season he averaged 7.4 assists a game. that was seventh in the league. i thought one of our weaknesses was a need of a pass first point guard????? also, now that we have gallinari, we have a PF to replace lee, so its not a big deal. Finally, i&#8217;ve heard many people say he hasnt improved over his time in the league. i disagree. his assist number has gone up each year he&#8217;s in the league, and his fg percent has risen. i think that he will probably continue improving, and best yet, he&#8217;s only 24, with a low salary of 3.3 mil. if we got felton, i would be a happy knicks fan.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike K. (KnickerBlogger)</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253415</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike K. (KnickerBlogger)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 13:43:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253415</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;If Lee is as good as you think he is (or will be as good as you think he will be) why couldn’t the knicks deal him on draft night? It’s not like they were asking for the world in return. Is the entire NBA that oblivious to his talents?&quot;

I found this in today&#039;s Post. 

&lt;blockquote&gt;&quot;I love David Lee,&quot; D&#039;Antoni said. &quot;I read someplace, he doesn&#039;t fit my style. Let&#039;s see, he averaged 10 rebounds, 10 points. He fits anybody&#039;s style. To be creative, he&#039;s the best we have to be creative. [But] the franchise will do their job of exploring every option. At the end of the day, I&#039;d be very happy to coach David Lee.

&quot;But again it&#039;s the business, it&#039;s the future and we&#039;re doing what you can within certain parameters. It&#039;s overblown because everyone that calls asks about him because he&#039;s the main guy. And it should be a compliment to him. It hasn&#039;t happened. I don&#039;t expect it to happen. If it did, it would have to be somebody good.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If Lee is as good as you think he is (or will be as good as you think he will be) why couldn’t the knicks deal him on draft night? It’s not like they were asking for the world in return. Is the entire NBA that oblivious to his talents?&#8221;</p>
<p>I found this in today&#8217;s Post. </p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;I love David Lee,&#8221; D&#8217;Antoni said. &#8220;I read someplace, he doesn&#8217;t fit my style. Let&#8217;s see, he averaged 10 rebounds, 10 points. He fits anybody&#8217;s style. To be creative, he&#8217;s the best we have to be creative. [But] the franchise will do their job of exploring every option. At the end of the day, I&#8217;d be very happy to coach David Lee.</p>
<p>&#8220;But again it&#8217;s the business, it&#8217;s the future and we&#8217;re doing what you can within certain parameters. It&#8217;s overblown because everyone that calls asks about him because he&#8217;s the main guy. And it should be a compliment to him. It hasn&#8217;t happened. I don&#8217;t expect it to happen. If it did, it would have to be somebody good.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Z-man</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253346</link>
		<dc:creator>Z-man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 01:17:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253346</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ben,

I&#039;m not suggesting that Lee needs to be a shot blocker as much that I am expressing a concern about his defensive play in general.  I don&#039;t think that any part of his defensive game is particularly strong for PF, especially post defense against tougher PFs.  

My instincts tell me that +/- stats are reliable for players playing major minutes on lousy teams.  This is not to argue that Jefferson is a good defender, he might not be at this point.  That being said, I think Jefferson is both beter right now and has more upside than Lee, so we will just have to disagree on that one (I do think most GMs would be on my side on this one.)  

That being said, like you, I would like to see Lee on the Knicks for another year to see whether his lack of development this year had anything to do with his injury in early &#039;07.  My guess is that it did not, and that he will not develop much more, but as a diehard Knick fan, I would love to be wrong.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not suggesting that Lee needs to be a shot blocker as much that I am expressing a concern about his defensive play in general.  I don&#8217;t think that any part of his defensive game is particularly strong for PF, especially post defense against tougher PFs.  </p>
<p>My instincts tell me that +/- stats are reliable for players playing major minutes on lousy teams.  This is not to argue that Jefferson is a good defender, he might not be at this point.  That being said, I think Jefferson is both beter right now and has more upside than Lee, so we will just have to disagree on that one (I do think most GMs would be on my side on this one.)  </p>
<p>That being said, like you, I would like to see Lee on the Knicks for another year to see whether his lack of development this year had anything to do with his injury in early &#8217;07.  My guess is that it did not, and that he will not develop much more, but as a diehard Knick fan, I would love to be wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben R</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253260</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben R</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 17:24:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253260</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Z-man - The only reason I mentioned Jefferson&#039;s team was he was the primary scorer on a bad offensive team. I think that reflects poorly on his ability to carry a team offensively.

I believe that shot-blocking is overrated. I think there are only two kinds of shot blockers in the NBA. Ones that impact the game with their shot blocking; Camby, Mutumbo, Mourning and those don&#039;t. While Jefferson is a much better shot blocker than Lee I do not believe the one extra blocked shot a game has a major impact. So I believe that Lee&#039;s below average shot blocking is not a big deal since PF&#039;s are rarely called upon to be a team&#039;s primary shot blocker. Also there are many good shot blockers that are bad defenders and bad shot blockers that are good defdenders. 

Also Jefferson is a terrible defender. I remember how much he struggled defensively in Boston and though I did not watch Minnisota play I looked at the plus minus stats for Jefferson and I was blown away.

I do not put a great deal of stock in plus minus, unless they are very lopsided, like +/- 6 or more. Jefferson makes Minnesota an unbelievable 12.1 pts per 100 possessions worse on defense. I have never seen a player have that major a negative impact. In fact in the 2917 minutes Jefferson was on the court Minnesota was out scored by 11.5 pts per 100 possessions, and during the 1027 minutes he was off the court minnesota actually outscored their opponent by 0.2 pts per 100 possessions.

After seeing these splits I actually would not trade Lee for Jefferson because those numbers put up huge red flags in my mind regarding Jefferson.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Z-man &#8211; The only reason I mentioned Jefferson&#8217;s team was he was the primary scorer on a bad offensive team. I think that reflects poorly on his ability to carry a team offensively.</p>
<p>I believe that shot-blocking is overrated. I think there are only two kinds of shot blockers in the NBA. Ones that impact the game with their shot blocking; Camby, Mutumbo, Mourning and those don&#8217;t. While Jefferson is a much better shot blocker than Lee I do not believe the one extra blocked shot a game has a major impact. So I believe that Lee&#8217;s below average shot blocking is not a big deal since PF&#8217;s are rarely called upon to be a team&#8217;s primary shot blocker. Also there are many good shot blockers that are bad defenders and bad shot blockers that are good defdenders. </p>
<p>Also Jefferson is a terrible defender. I remember how much he struggled defensively in Boston and though I did not watch Minnisota play I looked at the plus minus stats for Jefferson and I was blown away.</p>
<p>I do not put a great deal of stock in plus minus, unless they are very lopsided, like +/- 6 or more. Jefferson makes Minnesota an unbelievable 12.1 pts per 100 possessions worse on defense. I have never seen a player have that major a negative impact. In fact in the 2917 minutes Jefferson was on the court Minnesota was out scored by 11.5 pts per 100 possessions, and during the 1027 minutes he was off the court minnesota actually outscored their opponent by 0.2 pts per 100 possessions.</p>
<p>After seeing these splits I actually would not trade Lee for Jefferson because those numbers put up huge red flags in my mind regarding Jefferson.</p>
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		<title>By: Z-man</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253203</link>
		<dc:creator>Z-man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 08:07:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253203</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[While it has declined in importance league-wide (which I think has hurt the game) there are a number of NBA stars that seem to thrive on the mid-range jumper, such as Wade, Boozer, Bosh, Pierce, Anthony, J O&#039;Neal.

In Lee&#039;s case, considering he never takes 3&#039;s and is already pretty good around the basket (although I think he regressed slightly last year}, this is the area that has the most potential for improvement in his offensive game.

Ben R-  To penalize Jefferson&#039;s numbers for playing on a bad offensive team is unfair.  Maybe Jefferson is hurt by  being the only player the defense has to game plan for.  Maybe Lee&#039;s numbers are inflated by playing on a lousy team that misses so many shots, providing more rebound and garbage point opportunities, and that has played in so many blow-outs.

Lee also leaves much to be desired defensively. Where does he rank among top-minute PFs in shot-blocking?  He&#039;s 3 years into his career and has good enough ups, can&#039;t he get at least 1 per game?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While it has declined in importance league-wide (which I think has hurt the game) there are a number of NBA stars that seem to thrive on the mid-range jumper, such as Wade, Boozer, Bosh, Pierce, Anthony, J O&#8217;Neal.</p>
<p>In Lee&#8217;s case, considering he never takes 3&#8242;s and is already pretty good around the basket (although I think he regressed slightly last year}, this is the area that has the most potential for improvement in his offensive game.</p>
<p>Ben R-  To penalize Jefferson&#8217;s numbers for playing on a bad offensive team is unfair.  Maybe Jefferson is hurt by  being the only player the defense has to game plan for.  Maybe Lee&#8217;s numbers are inflated by playing on a lousy team that misses so many shots, providing more rebound and garbage point opportunities, and that has played in so many blow-outs.</p>
<p>Lee also leaves much to be desired defensively. Where does he rank among top-minute PFs in shot-blocking?  He&#8217;s 3 years into his career and has good enough ups, can&#8217;t he get at least 1 per game?</p>
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		<title>By: Duff Soviet Union</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253193</link>
		<dc:creator>Duff Soviet Union</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 05:50:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253193</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Owen, while I agree with your general point that a midrange jumper is probably the most over-rated skill in basketball, I think those 82games numbers overstate the case as they don&#039;t take fouls drawn or turnovers into account.  If it&#039;s possible to do a breakdown on that, I&#039;d like to see it.  I&#039;m pretty sure turnovers increase the closer you get to the basket and free throw attempts do the same.  Still, I bet that overall the mid range game is basically the dead zone of NBA offensive efficiency.  This should be easy to test if you have data breakdowns like 82 games does.  Just run a correllation between 2 point jump shots taken by team and offensive efficiency and the inverse numbers for defensive efficiency.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Owen, while I agree with your general point that a midrange jumper is probably the most over-rated skill in basketball, I think those 82games numbers overstate the case as they don&#8217;t take fouls drawn or turnovers into account.  If it&#8217;s possible to do a breakdown on that, I&#8217;d like to see it.  I&#8217;m pretty sure turnovers increase the closer you get to the basket and free throw attempts do the same.  Still, I bet that overall the mid range game is basically the dead zone of NBA offensive efficiency.  This should be easy to test if you have data breakdowns like 82 games does.  Just run a correllation between 2 point jump shots taken by team and offensive efficiency and the inverse numbers for defensive efficiency.</p>
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		<title>By: Z</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253189</link>
		<dc:creator>Z</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 04:57:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253189</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;RBIs are largely based on the hitters in front of a player. Rebounds are largely based on a player’s skill (not solely, but largely). What’s with the Lee threads that brings out the crazy in everyone?&quot;

Perhaps, but I think my point went a bit past that obvious contrast. I&#039;d say a small percent of RBI actually have an effect on the outcome of a game, yet it&#039;s a stat that builds hall-of-fame careers and multi-million dollar contracts. I think the same is true for rebounds. Rebounding, like run producing in baseball, is a team stat that individuals get too much credit for, and has become a false-idol of sorts when assessing individual players. 

This comparison has little to do with Lee or his value to a basketball team.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;RBIs are largely based on the hitters in front of a player. Rebounds are largely based on a player’s skill (not solely, but largely). What’s with the Lee threads that brings out the crazy in everyone?&#8221;</p>
<p>Perhaps, but I think my point went a bit past that obvious contrast. I&#8217;d say a small percent of RBI actually have an effect on the outcome of a game, yet it&#8217;s a stat that builds hall-of-fame careers and multi-million dollar contracts. I think the same is true for rebounds. Rebounding, like run producing in baseball, is a team stat that individuals get too much credit for, and has become a false-idol of sorts when assessing individual players. </p>
<p>This comparison has little to do with Lee or his value to a basketball team.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben R</title>
		<link>http://KnickerBlogger.Net/the-death-knell-of-david-lee-as-a-knick/#comment-253183</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben R</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 03:55:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.knickerblogger.net/?p=795#comment-253183</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Owen - Its nice to be on the same side of a issue. I remember all the Curry discussions we had.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Owen &#8211; Its nice to be on the same side of a issue. I remember all the Curry discussions we had.</p>
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