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Wednesday, August 20, 2014

Rally To Fire Isiah 11am Today (Wed 12/19/2007)

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/19/sports/basketball/19garden.html?ex=1355720400&en=087dc892dd9b5fe1&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/2007/12/19/2007-12-19_art_nathan_to_present_worlds_largest_pin.html

It seems a local man has created a large pink slip to present to the Garden front office asking to fire Isiah Thomas. It’s going on today at 11am. If anyone goes, please comment here. Also if you take any pictures, email them to me, and I’ll publish them here.

UPDATE: Pictures can be seen here:

http://www.nysportspace.com/profiles/blog/show?id=873694%3ABlogPost%3A6490

34 comments on “Rally To Fire Isiah 11am Today (Wed 12/19/2007)

  1. ScottD

    Fire Isiah?

    Just remove their charter membership as an NBA franchise!
    I’ve played pickup ball at local gyms and seen better effort.
    I never thought that my favorite team to cheer for would leave me so down and out.
    Dolan,and Isiah have created the modern day Titanic,and as Michael Ray said…
    “The ship be sinkin”

  2. Ben

    I’m no fan of Isiah, but I think all of the criticism is misplaced. Do we really think that the problem is the coach, when Larry Brown and Lenny Wilkens also couldn’t right the ship?

    Our petition SHOULD be to Eliot Spitzer, asking him to destroy Cablevision, remove their license to work in New York State, take away their cable monopolies, audit their tax returns — basically use any legal means of harassment until the Dolans sell the Knicks to a public trust.

    Eliot needs to win the citizens back and this would do it. Until the Dolans are gone, what new coach wants to take Isiah’s job right now?

    Maybe Mara Altschuler could coach the team? Otherwise, we lose Isiah and get — WHO?

    Ben

  3. Roshi

    I agree…with Dolan in charge of this mess, any decent coach would have to have their head examined to take the Knicks job. Basically, with the current roster and lack of accountability, you are being set up for failure.

    It’s hard to argue that Larry Brown couldn’t right the ship. Given the state of the Knicks when he arrived, you can’t expect him to completely turn around the team in one year. Larry Brown’s model has always been to get the right type of players on the team…this takes time. Any coach that they hire beyond Isiah needs to be given time by the fans and Dolan to make the necessary changes. You can’t dump Curry, Crawford, Marbury, Randolph, and Q overnight.

    Ideally, David Stern, being a Knick fan, would be disgusted by the mismanagement of a premier NBA franchise and forcefully remove the team from Dolan. They could pay him for his troubles, then auction off the team. Or better yet, imagine disbanding the franchise, and restarting from scratch as an expansion team?

  4. Mr. Black

    So you get Isiah fired, then what? I dont see how a new coach will make Randolph share the ball, make Crawford try to get to the line, make Curry rebound, make Richardson hit a shot, make Marbury play with his best effort.

    After Isiah is gone, who will coach the team? Who is available that would be willing to jump on this train wreck?

    __________________

    On another matter, Yesterday Isiah siad that he still has “competitive fire” and that “changes may be on the way” for the team. He is on record as questioning the leadership from the point position.

    Does anyone else think that Isiah may be considering coming out of retirement to be a player coach? Now before you say, “Mr. Black, you are crazy”, hear me out.

    A few years back Jordan came back with the Wizards after a few “practice sessions” with the team. Recently Isiah has been “playing horse” with some players. Think about it.

    Also, think about how crazy this whole situation has been. The next logical thing for Isiah to do is suit up. I memory serves, Frank O. and Caleb have wondered if isiah is just trying to get fired. If that is true, what would be the best way to do that? he has already tried everything as a coach and GM to be shown the door. The only thing left is to suit up, put on the number 1, and insert yourself as the starting point.

    I dont think it would be a half bad idea. At best he would embarrass the team into playing harder. I dont think a bunch of 27 year olds want to be out done by a 42 year old that retired about 8 years ago. At worst, it would damn entertaining. Would Isiah break out those old tight, short shorts from the late 80′s? Would he still wear number 1? Would he also activate Mark Aguirre?

    Yes, it is crazy; but can any of you tell me that it is at all out of character for the way the Knicks are run? No it’s not. Is’nt that scary?

    have any of you seen a movie called “Short time” starring Dabney Coleman?

    plot summary: Nearing retirement, Dabney Coleman finds that he has a disease that will kill him within days. He then finds that his life insurance only pays off if he is killed in the line of duty. In order to leave something to his wife and children, Coleman becomes supercop, ignoring danger and trying his best to get killed. No matter what he does, he cant get himself killed in the line of duty.

    It think Isiah is doing the same thing. Remeber his “succed or die” quote? Kinda cryptic is it not? He has tried everything to get fired, the only think left to do is play on the team himself.

    You may go ahead and call be crazy, I realize that I have asked for it.

  5. Roshi

    Suits up, or is tarred, feathered, and paraded around the Garden.

    Speaking of Isiah suiting up as player/coach, Walt Frazier could be the first announcer/player.

  6. Alec

    IT is much smarter then we all think…he drove the CBA into the ground by accident. Wanting to make up this mistake, he is driving the Knicks in the ground because he will then move them to the CBA and restart that league. On a side note, could the Knicks even win the NIT right now?

  7. John

    So you fire Isiah, then what? Firing Isiah is the first step. You can’t do everything at once, isiahsexual moron.

  8. Mike K. (KnickerBlogger) Post author

    Just saw the coverage on the news. It was a small crowd, but they made it look big. On ABC they showed 2 guys who made good points. The first was a young man who said the problem is Dolan & referenced Larry Brown & Layden as well. The second was a lawyer who talked about how the Garden has a public tax abatement and that if the Garden suppresses free speech (removing people holding Fire Isiah signs) people should look to remove that exemption.

    Now I’m not a lawyer, so I ask the legal eagles – is this possible? Who would one petition for this removal?

  9. Roshi

    I just signed the petition at the garden. About 30 people there with a few news crews doing interviews. (wow what a great tongue twister). I’m impressed that the guy who organized it was able to get such press coverage.

  10. Marc R

    Getting a tax abatement does not make an entity a state actor for First Amendment purposes.

    Personally, I hope they remove all signs (no matter what they say), those idiotic noisemakers they pass out at halftime, and the cotton candy vendors. All of them get in the way of watching the court. People who bring signs just want to get on TV and call attention to themselves, not make any statement.

    By the way, don’t be impressed that this protest was able to get such press coverage. Rightly or wrongly, the media hates Isiah and Dolan so much that they seek out this angle.

  11. Alan

    You know why you fire Isiah? Because, unbelievable as it might seem, he still has the power to make things worse. If he was just the coach, I might be willing to keep him around and play for the lottery pick, but Isiah the GM has the power to trade that pick — or Lee, or Balkman or Chandler or one of the few items of value left on the roster — in an attempt to save his own behind with a short-term trade that might help the team squeak into the playoffs. I don’t even care who the interim/replacement coach is, just so long as the new GM isn’t someone worried about being fired without dramatic immediate improvement.

  12. JK47

    This team is not going to win for a while. Whoever comes in next is going to have to start from scratch. Keep absorbing the losses, pile up the lottery picks, try to move the bad contracts and above all, BE PATIENT. If you can’t move the bad contracts, just sit patiently and let them come off the books.

    It’ll take three or four years, but you gotta start somewhere. The longer Isiah stays in power, the longer it’s going to take for the next guy to clean up his mess.

  13. Frank O.

    Yeah, people lose sight of the fact that Isiah as GM assembled the Bricks are currently structured and he does Xs and Os.
    Not only has he assembled a crew of offensive black holes that don’t play defense, but he also fails to put his best players on the court.

    Dolan doesn’t select personnel. He approves recommendations from his GM. Dolan doesn’t design the defense, or pick starters or make substitutions, or teach basketball.
    It’s all on Isiah.
    And I have a deep suspicion that Larry Brown’s failure was in large part a result of Isiah’s assembly of misfits and the GM undermining of Brown with the players. It was widely known that Isiah created a situation where Marbury had a hotline to Isiah, enabling him to bypass Brown.

    Some folks here are rightfully critical of Brown, but I think the underlying causes for Brown’s erratic behavior was caused by a meddling GM.

  14. Z

    “Do we really think that the problem is the coach, when Larry Brown and Lenny Wilkens also couldn?t right the ship?”

    The problem is, and has been for years now, the General Manager. I don’t care who the coach is. Isiah, or Herb, or Jason Silverstein, or Eddie the Limo Driver can coach the team for all I care.

    I think that Alan’s fears are legit and the Knicks need a new GM asap. Even no GM is better than the one they’ve got now.

    “Fire the GM!”

    The coach can sink with the ship…

  15. Caleb

    ?Do we really think that the problem is the coach, when Larry Brown and Lenny Wilkens also couldn?t right the ship??

    We can hate more than one person at the same time! Plenty to go around!

  16. brian quinnett's left nipple

    jim dolan doesn’t give a fuck about white season ticket holders picketing outside his arena with a giant pink slip.

  17. Mr. Black

    I am still teying to figure out what John meant when he said: “You can?t do everything at once, isiahsexual moron.”

    What is an Isiahsexual moron? I could’nt find it on Wikipedia or google.

    John, could you shed some light that one?

    Isiahsexual, is that something you made up to be funny?
    Listen, if you need help coming up with something funny to post, just ask me. I’m pretty good with comedy.

    I’m here to help.

  18. Z

    Couldn’t help but notice our old friend D. Nichols has been designated to the D. League–

    Since Nichol’s dismissal from the roster in favor of Jerome James was the recipient of the 8 foot pink slip’s most recent move as GM, and his fireable offenses are on the table for discussion, I have a question to ask:

    Instead of releasing Nichols, why did Isiah not waive Randolph Morris? He has played a total of 5 minutes in the first 24 games. There is no way he is going to be a Knick next year. If Dolan refused to eat James’ contract, why chose Morris over Nichols? Nichols fills a more immediate need (outside shooting) and his rookie contract is longer and cheaper. Morris is a practice piece and nothing more.

    I don’t understand the way Isiah runs the team.

  19. Z

    When asked if Isiah the GM would fire Isiah the coach, Isiah responded: “ask me that again in two weeks. If we can’t turn this ship around in two weeks it’s a valid question” (not a direct quote).

    In two weeks the best the Knicks can be is 13-17 and that’s only if they win all their games. That’s worse than Lenny’s record as Knick coach when he was forced to resign.

    What exactly is the significance of the self-imposed two week time frame?

    Is he waiting for Jerome James to return before he can fairly evaluate the coach’s performance?

  20. Frank O.

    What’s saddest about this all is Isiah is probably waiting to see if the Knicks get blown out a bunch more.
    If the Knicks are competitive that will be considered improvement. Not winning. These are Isiah rules…

  21. PrezIke

    Amazing that Norman Siegel was there. Here’s my thing…

    I suggest that the focus should be on Dolan as an owner, and his philosophical approach more so than Isiah, who I see as an agent willing to enforce the mandate. The selltheknicks.com guys were onto something.

    Look at the history of this team since Cablevision has been in charge. From Checketts, to Layden, to Isiah, each has followed a policy which refused to take a real long term approach.

    I contend that this is the epitome of corporate run management in our current capitalist economic system. Pressures from major investment banking deals and stock market investment mean that short term gains practically always trump those over the long term. Earnings reports come out quarterly, so folks seeded in this mentality always think they can make quick fixes to satisfy investors or in the case of the Knicks, their fans.

    This is also fueled by the unbridled optimism that comes from both American culture and the economic success that seems to always be “around the corner” You rarely hear market experts (at least commercially) say the market won’t recover, and of course it’s the folks who have the least to lose who say this.

    The same goes for the Knicks ownership. Dolan hasn’t shown fans sincerity regarding change because Cablevision doesn’t need the Knicks or MSG to survive. Even with the terrible record over the nearly a decade Forbes lists the Knicks as the most valuable franchise in the NBA. They may lose millions, but Cablevision still makes a big enough profit from other investments that the Knicks losses are practically a drop in the bucket for them.

    Until we either see some sign that Dolan can show fans that he understands how Knick fans really feel, by willing to demonstrate a sincere effort to make real long term changes, or force him to somehow sell the team to folks who can do this, then I believe we will continue to suffer even longer.

    This isn’t about a sense of undeserved entitlement as New York fans, it’s about showing respect and responsibility to fans who have supported this team through these bad times. Other NBA cities see their fan base disappear when their teams lose, but many Knick fans have not. We have a history of strong support and love for our team and I say, we deserve our dignity back.

  22. Gorky

    Dolan has no incentive to become a better team, fire Isiah, or sell the Knicks. Remember, according to Forbes magazine, the Knicks are still the most valuable NBA team. They’re making money for Dolan every day regardless of sucking. The only solution is to start boycotting Knicks games. We have to hit Dolan where it hurts for him – the bottom line.

  23. Tom T

    Isiah need to go. The bottom line is that Isiah’s self interest is no longer aligned with the best interests of the Knicks.

    The Knicks need years of work before they can reach respectability. Isiah has months, not years to salvage his legacy. He has no incentive to do what the Knicks need, which is get rid of as many albatross contracts as possible. Nor does he have any incentive to get a high draft pick; any drafted players will not arrive in time to save his job. Nor is it in his self interest to give court time to let our young players develop. Unfortunately, it is in Isiah’s self interest to trade draft picks or expiring contracts for Artest or someone else who will nudge the team towards mediocrity and save his job with a win total in the high thirties.

    Right now the Knicks need to forget about this year’s wins and losses and adopt a long term plan. Why would Isiah make moves that will benefit the future knowing that if the team continues to suck, he won’t be arrowed to get credit?

  24. Chase

    What if Curry started taking steroids, practiced longer/harder (like Clemens*), stayed in the post mashing – on a night in and night out basis – anyone that challenged him, blocking shots, and the Knicks rode him to a winning season … then he got found out. Would we be happy then? and who would Curry be vilified like, Bonds or Clemens?

    As for the topic of this blog (Fire Isiah), maybe some of the fans should be fired – ever think about that?

    * Clemens is innocent until proven guilty – so is Bonds.

  25. JK47

    Pressures from major investment banking deals and stock market investment mean that short term gains practically always trump those over the long term.

    They may lose millions, but Cablevision still makes a big enough profit from other investments that the Knicks losses are practically a drop in the bucket for them.

    These statements seem to be contradictory. Which is it– Dolan wants to maxmize short-term profit, or Dolan doesn’t care if the Knicks lose money?

  26. jon abbey

    “What if Curry started taking steroids, practiced longer/harder (like Clemens*), stayed in the post mashing – on a night in and night out basis – anyone that challenged him, blocking shots, and the Knicks rode him to a winning season ? then he got found out. Would we be happy then?”

    I would.

    “As for the topic of this blog (Fire Isiah), maybe some of the fans should be fired – ever think about that?”

    I’m pretty sure any fans that are still paying attention all deserve big checks in the mail from Mr. Dolan for their loyalty.

  27. Frank O.

    holy shit, I agree with jon abbey on something.
    Those devoted fans still watching this crap ought’a get a stipend.
    If Curry used steroids, his heart would probably explode.

  28. Owen

    Some day I want to look at a boxscore and see that Curry had 5 blocks and 15 rebounds, with 4 assists, 2 steals, and 1 turnover….

    If steroids could make that happen it would be worth it…

  29. PrezIke

    JK47, you left out a key component of the argument:

    Optimism.

    Cablevision is a large corporation, and the Knicks still make money even with a losing team. Clearly losing potential profits is not what they like, but since the team is still the most valued franchise in the NBA they continue to take on the optimistic & short term philosophical approach to satisfying Knick fans, with big trades to excite them, like they are shareholders.

    They can keep losing millions of potential dollars that might be made if taking a different approach, but Cablevision was not really hurting enough as a business, financially, to support this philosophical change, which could happen, in part from public displeasure.

    Basically, to answer your question, I think it’s both…sort of.

    1) Dolan wants to maximize short term gains, which means may mean more about generating excitement about the potential of putting out a winning team or actually doing it via use of their practically unlimited capital, to try and make more money than they already are.

    2) Cablevision’s level of capital, the team’s value, and sources of profit are so high that they can clearly keep banking on this high risk approach, which is seeded in optimism, and assumption that the Knicks can buy their way to the top of the NBA.

    So they can risk spending and losing some more in wins and dollars because if they generate excitement that works for them, and then if the team actually wins the profits may be THAT high, as well what I suspect is the satisfaction of proving critics wrong, which is the personal factor, with Dolan and Isiah.

    This is like hedge fund investing, which is high risk, but can net incredible gains. Of course some of the big investment banks have lost out on hedge funds, and have thus been in some trouble.

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