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Thursday, October 2, 2014

Marbury Poll

Ahhh I’m really enjoying using this polling feature. So the next question to my readers is regarding Stephon Marbury. Marbury has averaged a whooping 38.7 minutes per game over his career. The last 5 seasons have looked like this:

38.2
38.9
40.0
40.2
40.0

Assuming that he doesn’t get traded before the season starts, how many minutes will he average in a Knick uniform & why?

23 comments on “Marbury Poll

  1. KnickerBlogger Post author

    There’s a lot to think about here. The discussion of Marbury moving to 2 guard. Whether Larry Brown can stand Steph’s defense for 40 minutes.

    Personally I think since he’s the Knicks best player he’ll get more than 35. Nate Robinson’s summer and unique physical ability might mean he’ll be ready to get minutes early on, which could facilitate Marbury’s move to the 2, or at least reduce the Knicks’ dependency on Marbury to run the point (no Jermaine Jackson). So I’ll say his minutes will reduce, but he’ll be in the 35-37 range.

    Also I’m curious if we can go a comment thread without mentioning a certain defensive stopper from Texas. ;-)

  2. Ricky

    If Bruce Bowen were on the Knicks, he’d average 30 minutes because he’s such a good defender which is supported by his PER which is the be all and end all of measuring a basketball player’s worth.

    Seriously, I think Marbury’s minutes will decline (to the extent that a combination of Crawford/Robinson backing him up will be better than Moochie Norris/Jameson Brewer). Also he could wind up as one out of 4 shooting guards all of whom are starter material or close to it.

    I was in favor of moving Marbury to the 2 a few months ago when trading Quentin’s uninsured back for Kwame Brown was an option, but now with Larry Brown coaching, I believe there’s a good chance that Marbury’s game will evolve into that of a more traditional point guard.

  3. Jeff

    I voted for 37.5-39.9 because I think his move to the 2 guared will slightly reduce his minutes but not by much.

  4. dave

    I foresee a substantial decline in Marbury’s minutes (I say below 35) for a number of reasons.

    1. Marbury will see many of his minutes at the SG and fewer at the point, even if that doesn’t become an official position switch. The team has better replacement options at SG in the defense first Ariza (whom I see becoming a Brown favorite) and Crawford than at PG.

    2. The team will swing a minor deal for a point and the backup minutes will go to Nate Robinson.

    3. Marbury won’t protest. The late season fatigue and lingering knee problems from the past two seasons will convince Marbury that fewer minutes is in his and everyone else’s best interest.

  5. dave

    While I’m still thinking about Marbury’s presumed move to the SG…

    As critical as I have been about the aspects of his game that are perhaps overlooked in the traditional measures (e.g., his defensive loafing, his insane gambles for steals when he is actually playing defense, etc.) I must admit that he moves really well without the ball. He’s not been asked to play without the ball much in NY but the times he has I have been impressed with his ability to get himself open in high percentage areas. Remember, as a 6’4″ SG Marbury is a bit undersized.

    Since Houston has been injured the Knick halfcourt offense has been very stagnant overall, and way overdependent on the screen roll. At least some of that would change by putting Marbury at SG.

  6. Kevin Broom

    I’d be surprised if Marbury’s minutes decline. He played Iverson a ton of minutes, and I see the same for Marbury. I suspect that what Brown will quickly learn is that the Knicks aren’t as good with Marbury on the bench. He’ll probably try to modify Marbury’s play by whining at him all the time, but I doubt he’ll take him out of the game for a significant number of minutes.

  7. Greebo

    I said somewhere in the 39 range, but I think it could easily become 40-42, depending on how quickly he takes to Larry Brown’s defensive philosophies.

    Make no mistake, Isaiah and Larry both agree that Larry’s main job is to turn Stephon into the type of player that makes everyone better, because they think that’s what he can become. And they’re right. I don’t buy the whole “moving to the 2″ argument… with a little work and a few pushes in the right directions, Steph could become the best point guard in the game (for real), and you just don’t sacrifice a talent like that for a shooting guard. I think he might see some minutes at the 2, but he’ll spend significant minutes at the point learning Brown’s system.

  8. Eddie

    I think his minutes will be in the 37.5-39.9 range because Brown will realise quickly that the team is a lot worse with Marbury on the bench. I think the Knicks should trade Marbury because they need him to change but it won’t happen. Contrary to what is often said Larry Brown did not change Allen Iverson or Chauncey Billups. In fact Billups took more shots and had a higher usage rate in Detroit than anywhere else he played. The key in Detroit was that, unlike other places he played in, they didn’t ask him to change. They just accepted his strengths and weaknesses and found players to complement him. The Knicks don’t really have any players that complement Marbury. Unless they can rapidly find them they should trade him, preferably for a more “traditional” point guard and/or a good defensive/rebounding big man.

  9. wallace

    I believe the coaching staff should start to limit his minutes in and around the 35 mpg range due to his degenerative knee condition that was brought up towards the end of last season. It would be the prudent thing to do because the last thing the Knicks need is another max player sitting on the bench in a suit. I say this in hopes he will be logging those extra minutes come playoff time, if the Knicks reach that plateau. Also with the drafting of Nate Robinson as well as the proposition of playing Crawford at the point should allow the Knicks to get by for stretches during games

  10. Don

    Under Larry Brown I think Steph will become one of the best guards in the league. He may not enjoy it now (Just as Iverson didn’t) but in 10 years, he will tell you what a better player Larry brown made him.

  11. Gabe

    I see no real reason why Marbury’s minutes would decline from their previous rate (37.5-39.9). All this stuff about Brown’s philosophy impacting his minutes is all just conjecture at this point. Let’s take a step back here.

    First, Marbury is a superstar in a league that glorifies and promotes superstars. He’s the Knicks’ best player, regardless of who you put as #2 through #12.

    Secondly, he’s playing in NYC. When the NBA has those montage commercials, they always show a NY player making a neat little move, and since he’s NY’s best player, he’s going to appear on those montages, and be further promoted.

    Thirdly, Isiah LOVES Steph. LOVES him. Thinks he’s the heart and soul of the team, and is living vicariously through him. No matter how strong of a personality Larry Brown is, Isiah is still his boss, and will insist on playing Steph generous starter’s minutes.

  12. McDaddy11

    My opinion is that he will play around 39 mins per game, if he finds a way to fit in Larrys style. That could only help him in his career, and I hope he will do that, cause he is great talent,but he isnt a leader, maybe he can stop being distruction in lockeroom now.

  13. Jim K

    I too think we’re exagerrating any secondary role Marbury might take under Brown. He will play 37-39 if the Knicks have any depth, and over 40 if they do not — for all this talk of moving Marbury to the 2, who would then be the point guard? Crawford? Robinson? Marbury has issues, but he is one of the better point guards in the league, and so far better than anyone else on the Knicks current roster that it seems unlikely he’ll get below 38. He might play “2″ in that they might have 3-guard rotations with both him and Robinson, but I think he will be running the team as much as Billups did in Detroit; Marbury is a better player than Billups–Billups may be more flexible, this we shall see. But unless he’s traded, Brown has little choice with the current roster but to try to build them around Marbury’s strengths, as opposed to trying to reconfigure Marbury’s game so he can fit in better (?) with Trevor Ariza and Crawford (???) — I like Ariza, but I don’t see him getting that many minutes away from Richardson and Crawford and all those other undisciplined talents that (we hope) Brown will harness. He may be more of a role player than 30 minute man…so, anyway, I think Marbury will pretty much do what he’s always done, but perhaps be more effective with his first real coach in a few seasons…

  14. Andy

    I entered in the 35-37.5 range just because I think Marbury will have to start taking it easy if he wants to make it through the season uninjured. All last season I was having nightmares of Stephon getting injured and the Knicks clinching the Number 3 pick after Atlanta and New Orleans. For all the personnel moves Isaih has made, Stephon is still the only superstar on the team. I think this argument about being a ‘true’ point guard, shooting guard, or shooting point guard is pointless. Hands down the only other guard in the same class as him is Iverson, regardless of all star votes. He has consistently been a leader in points and assists in a way that no one else can match up to. I remember watching his first home game as a Knick against the Rockets (the Knicks got blown out) and he was about 3 moves ahead of everyone else in a Knicks uniform. Also, last year vs. the Spurs at home he went on a 1 person 14 pt. rampage with like 3 minutes left in the 3rd. Trading him would be a huge mistake.

  15. Ted

    I hope Marbury’s minutes come down a little so he can be fresh and healthy all year, I think 40 mpg is too much for anyone. Nate should help because he is probably at least a better back-up than Marbury had all last year. He should be good off the bench, but I have questions about whether he can run a team for long periods as a rookie. Crawford might be able to handle some minutes at the point, but the biggest knocks against him last year were that he shot too much and settled for jumpers instead of driving: not the traits you look for in your quarterback. Marbury is clearly the Knicks best player at this point and one of the best PGs in the league, so his MPG will probably (and should) still be in the high 30s.

    People seem to forget that Marbury himself has tremendous skills creating for others with the ball in his hands. Also he took less shots per 48 minutes (and only 2 more shots per game) than Tony Parker took on a much better team, but somehow Parker is your prototype “pure point” and Marbury is a selfish SG. He will have to change his game to play for LB, as will almost every Knick, but I don’t see any benefit to moving him off the ball fulltime considering that if he learns to play in a system he has as much skill with the ball in his hands as just about any player in the league. Also, if Crawford steps his game up I think he and Marbury complement each other well in the backcourt.

    I read in one of these posts that while the Pistons were built with players to complement Billups, the Knicks have no one who complements Marbury. Are you kidding? The Pistons are built around defense, I would guess offense was a secondary concern in putting them together. Around Marbury you have a combo guard to complement him in the backcourt (Crawford and maybe Nate and/or Penny, too), shooters he can kick it out to (Crawford, Q, and TT, and maybe Houston and/or Penny), a few low post scorers (Sweets and Mo Taylor and maybe a little less so JJ and Frye), hustle guys (Ariza, JYD, Rose, Lee) and a big man with a J for him to pick and role with (Frye). This team is completely built around him.

    The Pistons were also built on undervalued players that Joe D could acquire easily, none of these guys, before Sheed and McDyss (although even they had questions marks), were seen as slam dunks when they were acquired (according to the media Grant Hill for Ben Wallace was supposed to be completely one sided in the other direction and Jerry Stackhouse was supposed to help MJ get the Wizards into contention Rip was not supposed to help Billups get the Pistons into contention, just as no one thought the Spurs were getting much when they took Parker or Manu or signed Bowen) yet people are so quick to jump on Isiah for acquiring players who have flaws and are not LeBron James or Tim Duncan or bad players with expiring contracts.
    You can criticize Isiah for taking on salary (not unusual for the Knicks), ignoring defense, and getting unmotivated players, but all that any GM can do is get the best players he can acquire with what he has. We have to wait and see whether Zeke has done this, but history suggests that, despite all his flaws, Zeke can evaluate talent: if the Raps had stuck with his core they could have had T-Mac, Doug Christie, Damon Stoudamire/Kenny Anderson, Marcus Camby and the opportunity to draft Jamison, VC, Dirk, Paul Pierce, or Larry Hughes. The way Zeke has built is interesting because he had the luxury of spending and the need to rebuild overnight so he acquired 15 players who could potentially make the rotation on a good team, all we need is for half of the guys Zeke got to pan out under LB and our team could be pretty good. This shouldn?t be too hard now that they have a coach who can put in place a system and assign his players roles that emphasis their strengths and hide their weaknesses and also because for the first time in a while the majority of Knicks look to have a brighter future than past.

  16. Zach

    I think he will get round 35, even thpugh i think switchin marbury to the 2 guard is a horrible decision if this were to happen. marbury gets about 8 assists a game and robinson doesnt have the experience or size to be a starter yet. i say u go marbury at point, crawford at 2, Q at 3, and then sweeteny 4 and james 5. tim thomas is a better back up than starter as proven and ariza doesnt have the shooting touch yet to start. i think robinson will be fine if he gets about 5-10 minutes a game the first half of the season and go from there, frye should be a legit back up to james who if he plays up to isiahs standrads will be getting about 30 minutes a game. and rose is a waste of time, get rid of him even its for trash, hes a undrsized player which is the last thing the knicks need but brown is gonna love him and play him every chance he gets…

  17. Andy

    I think the last comment was a little unfair to Rose. He’s a defensive spark, has a decent offensive game (18 pt. season high with knicks), rebounds, has leadership qualities and cares about winning, as seen by him kicking a hole in the scorers table after their double OT lost to Seatlle. I really didn’t like the Rose trade at the time, I thought the Knicks needed Nazr but it basically made Kurt tradeable because Rose can do a lot of things he did. So are Kurt and Nazr worth Rose and Richardson now that they have JJ and Frye? I guess we’ll have to wait 3 long months to see.

  18. Ted

    “rose is a waste of time, get rid of him even its for trash, hes a undrsized player which is the last thing the knicks need but brown is gonna love him and play him every chance he gets?”

    First of all Rose is a leader and I believe he’s the only Knicks with a championship ring. He’s not going to put up 20 a game, but he’s a solid role player who knows how to win. Considering how well Larry Brown has done everywhere he’s coached, I think he’s earned the right to play whomever he pleases (whether it’s Rose or not).

    “So are Kurt and Nazr worth Rose and Richardson now that they have JJ and Frye?”

    How about are Kurt and Nazr worth Rose, Richardson, Nate Robinson, David Lee, and a first next year?

  19. rat-tata-tat

    I think Marbury is going to get traded.Wait till the midseason trade deadline.The NY press will unite to drop him.They’ll send him like Ewing to the corner of the world.Yeah,he’ll get his dough,but he’s “trade baitwalking.LB will backthe decision so Zekewon’t look to bad when he get’s rid of him.The Knicks want Garnett.They are planning for him.Just wait and see.Also on their radar? Some very talented Euro players-but they have to improve.The name of the game is in 2 parts- Beating the Heat and The Pistons.Checketts signed bad deals based on “relationships” (Houston)-They have to wait it out-ride the wave of bad deals.Get rid of Hardaway -You know something-I miss the fight in them-Teams were always scared of Oakley,LJ,and Ewing..and Ward,childs(remember Kobe fight?).Van Gundy was a great passionate coach-a little to much- Maybe one day he’ll come back after Cablevision sells the Knicks.But Marbury? He’s a hog,big ego,big mouth,nasty to his teamates.The press have his number-it’s all politics He’s an NBA journeyman on his way to another team.You guys have delusions if you think he can work with LB.No way.Watch..when they start losing again.Then he’ll fake some recurring knee injury and then they’ll start winning without him-he’ll comeback and then the losing starts over-remind you of somebody? Ewing!!! Then he’ll blame it on the fans.Jeeeezzz!!!! I don’t know if you know this, but a few years back at the garden people who sat on the floor used to scream “NOoooo!” everytime Ewing got the ball after 97-98 season.True! He hated that.THat’s whats going to happen 2 Marbury.Sorry to be such a downer dudes.Remember….Garnett..I said it here 1st.You’ll see..out

  20. Jesse

    I definitely think his minutes will decrease, but for positive reasons. Marbury had no choice but to play big minutes last year in particular. Given that he had no backup of any skill level other than Crawford, who had no backup at the SG position.

    I think Richardson will start at the 2, which gives Crawford backup minutes at the 1 and the 2. Plus Brown will give Robinson minutes if he earns it in practice.

    All these factors will lead to less minutes for Marbury, which will lead to a better year for both him and the Knicks.

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