Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Sunday, December 16, 2018

Knicks v. Raptors or Jurassic of this season

Knicks host Toronto tonight with NYC going for their 8th home win. Going for the 8th home win and 12th overall tonight during the final game of February. Wow.

Just 6 six weeks to go.

Mase Mase.

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76 comments on “Knicks v. Raptors or Jurassic of this season

  1. Kahnzy

    Yeah, me too. I like watching them play hard and compete, but ultimately they still need to lose.

    Agreed. It sucks to want them to lose, but it’s really our best hope for the future.

  2. Kahnzy

    Well, at least Minny is winning. First I root for the Knicks to lose, then I have to turn around and root for KG? Blech, next season can’t come soon enough.

  3. Zanzibar

    Time to play the correlation or causation game. Reason(s) for 2 game winning streak:

    (1) Phil’s tweet? Correlation or Causation?
    (2) Calderon’s injury? Correlation or Causation?
    (3) Shevd’s arrival? Correlation or Causation?

    Answer: All correlation. The real reason: the handiwork of the new Patron Saint of Underdogs. You know who I mean.

  4. Brian Cronin

    We are sort of living the nightmare many of us had, which was that Bargs would get just hot enough to fuck them out of a top pick. Blech.

  5. JK47

    “With the fifth pick in the 2015 NBA draft, the New York Knicks select Kristaps Porzingis, power forward from Ventspils, Latvia.”

    His strong suit is shooting mid-range jumpers, so he’ll be a “great fit” for the triangle.

  6. Thomas B. Post author

    Time to play the correlation or causation game. Reason(s) for 2 game winning streak:

    (1) Phil’s tweet? Correlation or Causation?
    (2) Calderon’s injury? Correlation or Causation?
    (3) Shevd’s arrival? Correlation or Causation?

    Um (4) Thomas B. game threads. Hello!

  7. Zanzibar

    True. Thomas must be stopped!!

    DRed must be banned from this site unless he agrees to post in all game threads for the rest of the season.

  8. swiftandabundant

    Honestly I want a top pick but rooting for the team to lose is gross as a fan. We’re gonna get a top 5 pick and the number 5 pick could be just as much of a star or bust as the number 1 pick.

    Anthony Mason just died. We should all be happy for our players that they won a game tonight.

  9. hoolahoop

    “With the fifth pick in the 2015 NBA draft, the New York Knicks select Kristaps Porzingis, power forward from Ventspils, Latvia.”

    His strong suit is shooting mid-range jumpers, so he’ll be a “great fit” for the triangle.

    Can’t say we didn’t know it would happen.

  10. Brian Cronin

    Honestly I want a top pick but rooting for the team to lose is gross as a fan. We’re gonna get a top 5 pick and the number 5 pick could be just as much of a star or bust as the number 1 pick.

    If they fall to #3, which is very much a possibility right now, they very well not even finish in the top five. Losing is not gross when it helps them get the best odds at a top three pick, especially when the top three picks are all awesome.

  11. hoolahoop

    . . . the number 5 pick could be just as much of a star or bust as the number 1 pick.

    We play poker Wednesday nights. Send me your email. I want to invite you to our game.

    Honestly I want a top pick but rooting for the team to lose is gross as a fan. We’re gonna get a top 5 pick and . . .

    I want what’s best for the NY Knicks. Losing!

  12. SJK

    Everyone is so reactionary. A 2 game winning streak against the Pistons and a reeling Raptors team is not going to sink our tank efforts.

  13. stratomatic

    Early in yesterday’s game I would have set the under/over for the rest of the season at 4 more wins and bet the under. I’m note sure what to think about this. These guys are terrible, but they are playing so hard and so together, they are only bad. Bad teams can win some games. I agree with Hahn. There’s a bench being developed right now. There are also some very likable players that are easy to rot for here.

  14. hoolahoop

    If they come in third to last (a very real possibility), they have less than 50% chance of getting a 1st – 3rd pick, and can conceivably wind up with the sixth pick.

  15. hoolahoop

    If the knicks finish in last place:
    25% chance of getting first pick
    46.5% chance of getting first or second pick
    64.3% chance of getting first – third pick

    35.7% chance of getting fourth pick

  16. hoolahoop

    These guys are terrible, but they are playing so hard and so together, they are only bad. Bad teams can win some games. I agree with Hahn. There’s a bench being developed right now. There are also some very likable players that are easy to rot for here.

    What does that say about the original cast of highly paid starters?
    That’s one of the big drawbacks of a rookie coach. Does he have the balls to call out his big-name players for more effort?

  17. Brian Cronin

    That’s one of the big drawbacks of a rookie coach. Does he have the balls to call out his big-name players for more effort?

    And the upside of trading every name player except your injured ones, you don’t have to find out! :)

  18. swiftandabundant

    Yes let’s break down the exact stats for good players vs. busts for number one picks vs. number five picks and when we find out that number five picks are 4 percent less likely to be stars than top picks let’s use that marginal stat to prove that in wrong for being happy that we won on the day Mase died.

    Teams become successful in many different ways. Maybe we pick the fifth pick and that player turns into a really good role player but one of these scrubs you guys crap on every night keeps improving and also becomes a valuable piece on this team next year and the confidence that kid is gaining now is part of the foundation of our future success. Or maybe we keep losing, draft Okafor and he ends up a bust and none of the players we have now turn out any good either.

    I just hate this attitude that its a zero sum game where any decent player or team play now is bad bc it hurts our chances at a top pick.

  19. lavor postell

    It’s pathetic that people can’t take any joy in one of the few wins this team is going to have the rest of the year on a day in which Anthony Mason, lauded for his balls to the walls and win at all costs mentality, passed away.

    This team is going to suck the rest of the way, Bargs is going to Bargs soon enough and everybody can go back to shitting on Phil Jackson for being a fucking moron, but if you’re pissed tonight because the Knicks got a win then I really don’t know what to say. We still have the worst record in the league and we probably still will have at least the 2nd worst record come the end of the season. You don’t need to lose every single game to have the worst record in the league.

  20. pistol pete

    I don’t know I’m happy. Tanking may result in better odds of rebuilding but creating a losing culture is definitely not a good way to build a franchise. I think the best case scenario is we go on somewhat of a run at the end of the year so free agents see “hey maybe fisher knows what he’s doing and the Knicks have built up something of a supporting cast.” We still get a decent draft pick and that player ends up backing up Wesley Matthews/kawhi Leonard for two years before becoming our new franchise player.

  21. pistol pete

    Also winning for Mase makes me feel great, that guy poured his heart and soul into the knicks he deserves to have them win on the day he dies.

  22. pistol pete

    I don’t know. I also feel like getting led to victory by second round draft picks and cast offs was the perfect way to honor Mase.

  23. Will the Thrill

    I kind of want the second pick anyway. That way we aren’t tempted to pick Okafor and just go after Towns.

  24. JK47

    Tanking may result in better odds of rebuilding but creating a losing culture is definitely not a good way to build a franchise.

    “Creating” a losing culture? This has been a losing culture for a long, long time. This team hasn’t won jack in 15 years, and a few meaningless wins by Langston Galloway, Lou Amundson, Lance Thomas and the rest of the 15th-Man All-Stars isn’t gonna change the fact that this organization is a laughing stock. I’d rather have the ping pong balls.

  25. pistol pete

    I mean two years ago we had a 54-win team that could have reached the finals had our starting center not gotten a neck injury at the end of the season (we beat Miami 3-1 in our season series). If we finish with a terrible record, we might get the chance of drafting a better player but who will we sign with us if nobody thinks our coach is worth a shit and that we have no half-decent players on our roster. I’m just saying if Fish can get THIS squad to win some games we might be better off with our efforts rebuilding through free agency. of course assuming Phil doesn’t overpay one decent player with superstar money and handcuff us for the next couple years

  26. Farfa

    We should be happy we won, we need some wins here and there. Too early to worry about the tank, and anyway, the only tank I want to see is one full of effort and scrappiness. If said effort and scrappiness bring us victories, so be it. This is our effing team, and we have to support it ESPECIALLY when it wins as a clear underdog. Ping pong balls will come plenty anyway.

  27. lavor postell

    We should be happy we won, we need some wins here and there. Too early to worry about the tank, and anyway, the only tank I want to see is one full of effort and scrappiness. If said effort and scrappiness bring us victories, so be it. This is our effing team, and we have to support it ESPECIALLY when it wins as a clear underdog. Ping pong balls will come plenty anyway.

    Agree 100%

  28. Brian Cronin

    It is not “our” team. It is a bunch of players who won’t be here next year. If they were players who were going to be a big part of the next Knick squad, I’d say sure, let ’em win. Like Minny. If Minny wins, I get it. They have actual good young players. There is something to be gained by seeing Wiggins/Dieng/Rubio play well together. The Knicks don’t have good young players. Bargs having a good game is meaningless. All it does is hurt their odds of getting a top three pick. That’s it. It doesn’t help next year. It doesn’t help anything.

    That said, sure, a win here and there isn’t a big deal. They just better not start stringing them together. Like the Lakers. That team is outright fucking themselves by winning, since they lose their pick if it is not in the top five.

  29. Brian Cronin

    In addition, it is silly to try to give any sort of odds on picks working out based on past drafts, since such odds would have to presuppose that the talent level is equal in every draft, which we obviously know is not the case. Andrew Bennett not working out says nothing about the value of the #1 pick in a good draft like this one. Okafor, Towns and Russell (and to a lesser extent, Mudiay) are about as close to sure things as you’re going to get. Missing out on them because, “Hey, Kwame Brown wasn’t that good so having a top pick doesn’t mean much” doesn’t make sense.

  30. d-mar

    I think we can assume that other teams are going to rest starters against the bottom feeders, like Toronto with Lowry last night, so I’m sure Philly and Minny will get a few wins here and there.

    I’m torn just like everyone else, I know we need to lose, but it is nice to hear the MSG crowd into it and see the players have smiles on their faces for a change.

  31. lavor postell

    Losing as many games as possible this season is the best thing for our team. Why not root for that?

    Root for it. I’m rooting for the Knicks to have the worst record too, but in the off chance they win a game here and there and show some effort and desire in the process I think it’s a little crazy for the reaction to be of utter disappointment. Again, we don’t need to lose every single game by 20 to have the worst record in the league and last I checked we’re still on pace to do exactly that.

  32. Farfa

    Yeah, well, I agree with the tanking strategy. I just think we are awful enough that we should fully enjoy our wins while they are here, since our chances to see another string of wins is super slim. Oh, and I expect Thomas, Amundson, Galloway, Early and THJ to be here next year so yes, this is our team.

    Sleep safe, Knicks people, we still have the worst record.

  33. lavor postell

    Nobody is showing “utter disappointment” when the team wins one or two games. Most of the comments I have read are tongue-in-cheek or outright jokes.

    I disagree with that but whatever

  34. Will the Thrill

    Early should not be in the NBA at all. It’s crazy how bad he’s been thus far.

  35. johnno

    Unlike most of you, I don’t think that next year’s roster is going to be completely different from the current roster. I think that 8-10 of the current guys will be back. And I think that that will be a good thing. The new guys will be Antetekuompo, the draft pick, two expensive free agents and a cheap free agent. The guys currently playing 30 minutes will play 15 next year and the guys playing 15 now will be “street clothes guys.” I think that one of the guys who will be back is a tall Italian guy and I’m going to now commit a KB capital crime and say that I think that that is also a good thing. I think that he can be a valuable 15 minute guy.

  36. Farfa

    I agree Johnno, I’d like to see Gallo back :-)

    Let’s wait a few more games to see if Bargnani has a chance to stay here for the vet min. He’s still awful on defense.

  37. Brian Cronin

    How frustrating this season has been for OKC. Just when it looks like they’ve put their issues behind them and will clearly make the playoffs, then Durant gets hurt again and then Westbrook gets hurt again. What a weird team.

  38. thenoblefacehumper

    I think that one of the guys who will be back is a tall Italian guy and I’m going to now commit a KB capital crime and say that I think that that is also a good thing. I think that he can be a valuable 15 minute guy.

    I’ve gotta hand it to Bargnani. No one else could be demonstrably awful for a decade and still have people think he’s good. Dude is doing something right.

  39. Brian Cronin

    Antetekuompo

    It is crazy how I had no idea if you spelled that correctly or not (the second E is supposed to be an O and you missed the second N that’s right in front of the M, but I only know that from checking, so I am not knocking your spelling at all). I will have to make sure I learn how to spell it by next season. I know how to spell Sienkiewicz and Mazzucchelli by heart for my comic book work. ;)

  40. Brian Cronin

    I agree Johnno, I’d like to see Gallo back :-)

    I love Gallo and all, but I think he might be done. That injury just ruined him.

  41. Alecto

    I know how to spell Sienkiewicz and Mazzucchelli

    Shoutout to Asterios Polyp. I was an intern at Random House two years ago and got to work on Chris Ware’s Building Stories. It was awesome.

    Re: Winning–I think winning here and there is good but it’s also perfectly fine to be upset given how precarious our draft position is. Though it is nice for our youngish players to get some wins under their belt (and maybe improve their trade value *coughHardawaycough*) I think the focus should be on losing and losing aggressively.

  42. Will the Thrill

    If Bargs is on the team next year I will know that Phil has no idea what he’s doing and know that I won’t have to watch for another few years.

  43. lavor postell

    I think the focus should be on losing and losing aggressively.

    Safe to say this is where the focus is looking at the roster

  44. Brian Cronin

    Shoutout to Asterios Polyp. I was an intern at Random House two years ago and got to work on Chris Ware’s Building Stories. It was awesome.

    Both of those books were #1 on my Top Ten Comics in their respective years! :) Building Stories – good lord, that was an amazing book.

  45. Owen

    “I’m going to now commit a KB capital crime and say that I think that that is also a good thing.”

    Heresy!

  46. Unreason

    I can’t get behind tanking. I’m not judging anyone who does, it just holds no interest for me. Gaming the system is always smart in a certain sense but seldom good for the system as a whole. So choosing to drag down the league’s product for the sake of our future picks just feels wrong: Tragedy of the commons etc. etc. I’m happy these guys are trying their best and earning some Ws with their D. I’m also excited that some new defensive metrics e.g. http://grantland.com/features/department-of-defense/ http://www.sloansportsconference.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/SSAC15-RP-Finalist-Counterpoints2.pdf are being developed. And I hope these and others will start to shift everyone’s attention away from what seems like an excessive focus on offensive efficiency.

    Anthony Mason, you brought me much joy. Thank you.

  47. JK47

    You can’t really fault Phil Jackson’s tanking game. He is all in on the tank. These players really stink. If they fight hard and play tough D and win a few games, you really can’t be mad at anybody. It’s just kind of a Murphy’s Law thing when it comes to the Knicks. Nothing ever really goes right. If the Knicks go on some pointless winning streak and end up losing out on the lottery and picking like sixth or something, and as a result miss out on guys who turn out to be perennial All-Stars, it will just be an incredibly Knicksy outcome. That’s the kind of shit that just happens all the time around here.

  48. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, I definitely don’t begrudge Jackson for this. It’s just bad luck (if it keeps up, that is. Hopefully it doesn’t).

  49. Brian Cronin

    Spring 2008, the Knicks end the season (a season in which they lost 59 games) on a 3-3 stretch, including three wins in a row. Three more losses would have moved them from the fifth-worst record to tied for the second-worst record. They end up picking sixth, with the #4 pick being Russell Westbrook (picked by the team with the second-worst record) and the #5 pick being Kevin Love (picked by the team with the fourth-worst record).

  50. Brian Cronin

    And there, obviously the biggest thing was the dumb luck that had Chicago get the #1 pick with less than a 1 percent chance of doing so. But just a slightly worse record would have had the Knicks in better position to deal with that bad luck.

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