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Monday, April 21, 2014

Knicks Morning News (Friday, Jul 05 2013)

  • [New York Times] Sports Briefing | Basketball: Sparks Defeat Liberty to Stay Unbeaten at Home (Fri, 05 Jul 2013 02:00:09 GMT)
    Kristi Toliver tied her career high with 29 points, going 12 of 17 from the floor, and the Los Angeles Sparks led all the way in defeating the Liberty to improve to 7-0 at home.    

  • [New York Times] AP Sources: Pelicans, Blazers, Kings Make Deal (Fri, 05 Jul 2013 00:52:44 GMT)
    New Orleans, Portland and Sacramento have agreed to a three-team trade sending guard Tyreke Evans to the Pelicans, center Robin Lopez to the Trail Blazers and guard Greivis Vasquez to the Kings, people familiar with the deal said.    

  • 209 comments on “Knicks Morning News (Friday, Jul 05 2013)

    1. Vinny L.

      So the Knicks really aren’t going to give us a serious upgrade at the Point Guard position……Nobody else even wanted the 36 year old Prig and the Knicks give him a multi-year multi-million dollar contract!

      Fans will really have to ask themselves during and after the next season: Why was Prigioni and the injury prone Bargnani chosen over Chris Copeland and the proven Brooklyn Nets killer Nate Robinson?? And why did the Knicks treat the latter two players with utter contempt during the free agency process?

      Cope should not be made to feel guilty one bit if he goes to Indiana. In fact, as a frustrated New Yorker, i’m praying for Cope to go to Indiana, and for Nate to join Chicago, Miami or the Nets. In the case of Nate, this guy can’t seem to catch a break no matter what he does! This little big man DESTROYED the Brooklyn Nets IN THE PLAYOFFS!!! In the PLAYOFFS!! Knicks could’ve got him!!! But they waste their mini mid-level on some guy named Prig…

      No way we’re getting Nate now. Prig would infringe on Nate’s minutes which would be ludicrous given Nate’s performance on the big stage.

      If Melo decides to Bolt from the Knicks and work out something with King James, this New Yorker will not be criticizing him AT ALL. Melo asked for an extra scorer, and the Knicks had the chance to add a more improved, more explosive, more composed Nate Robinson, but they sign some unthreatening guy named Prigioni?

      The Knicks need a young, fast, back up point guard. Prigioni cannot pick up the pace when Miami starts “running and gunning” against the Knicks. The Knicks need a PG who can put defenses on their heels. And NO, that Point Guard is NOT Sebastian Telfair.

    2. CaptainB

      We already got your point when you made this post…in the other thread already.

    3. Z-man

      If Nate is so good, why is Chicago not anxious to re-sign him? Why isn’t any rushing in to sweep him up?

      I would have not had a problem with bringing Nate back, but a) not sure he takes what we could offer, and b) we still have part of the MMLE to sign an above vets-min guy, which could make the difference with the better ones like KMart or EBrand. Pablo is a very solid backup PG. I also think he will help bring AB along.

    4. MJG1789

      I used to know a girl who was convinced she was going to marry one of the members of Atlantic Starr. Vinny reminds me of her.

      Incidentally, if you look at other boards, there was interest in Prigs. The Spurs, for example. They just signed Bellinelli after Prigs committed to NY.

    5. danvt

      Thanks for this. I love this blog for the well thought out and carefully researched posts I find. I also love the badly thought out and badly researched ones and love to watch them get corrected.

      My favorite thing is watching self satisfied egotists like THCJ “research” themselves into absurd conclusions like.

      “The Knicks will win 45 games this year”
      ” I’d trade Carmelo Anthony for Tiago Splitter”

      Z-man: If Nate is so good, why is Chicago not anxious to re-sign him? Why isn’t any rushing in to sweep him up?
      I would have not had a problem with bringing Nate back, but a) not sure he takes what we could offer, and b) we still have part of the MMLE to sign an above vets-min guy, which could make the difference with the better ones like KMart or EBrand. Pablo is a very solid backup PG. I also think he will help bring AB along.

      MJG1789: Incidentally, if you look at other boards, there was interest in Prigs. The Spurs, for example. They just signed Bellinelli after Prigs committed to NY.

    6. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      danvt: My favorite thing is watching self satisfied egotists like THCJ “research” themselves into absurd conclusions like.
      “The Knicks will win 45 games this year”
      ” I’d trade Carmelo Anthony for Tiago Splitter”

      Well, I correctly “concluded” that the Knicks would win 36 games in 2012 and I think 56 in 2013, so, you know, whatever.

      We’ll see what happens without Wins Produced machine Jason Kidd this season. I said 45 wins, so let’s see what happens.

    7. flossy

      I think every single Knicks fan in possession of at least a couple of brain cells to rub together is a fan of Prigioni, who was probably the best back-up PG in the NBA last season and the only rookie in NBA history to go undefeated in his first 13 starts.

      He’s the quintessential pass-first PG, he excels in the pick and roll, he doesn’t look for his own shot but can punish teams for ignoring him behind the 3 point line, he’s our most disciplined and savvy backcourt defender and the only one of our PGs who can seem to keep his man in front of him.

      I cannot fathom anyone not appreciating that, particularly to the extend that they’d need to post over and over and over about it.

    8. Frank

      Re: Prigioni – we weren’t just competing against other teams like the Spurs but also against Europe. He could’ve just taken his ball and gone home. He doesn’t need this. I guess we could’ve really held his feet to the fire saying we won’t offer you any more than the minimum, but then you let SA come in and steal him with part of their mini-MLE like we did so he can go play with his buddy Manu. Overall I think it’s a great move, although I wish we didn’t have that partial guarantee in 15-16 — hopefully it’s a small amount. Probably tradeable though.

      This Dwight Howard thing is pretty interesting. So many potential scenarios between outright FA signing and S&Ts, especially with the Warriors apparently willing to dump just about everyone for peanuts to get the cap room to sign him. If I’m the Lakers, I try to get at least Klay Thompson (or Barnes) + Bogut + a 2014 1st (prob need to get a 3rd team involved) for him. Lin/Asik + picks is ok too but I’d rather have Klay+Bogut. Nash, Klay, Kobe, Bogut is still a pretty good (non-contending) team, but you maintain your flexibility since Bogut expires and you get another pick in the stacked 2014 draft.

    9. bidiong

      flossy:
      I think every single Knicks fan in possession of at least a couple of brain cells to rub together is a fan of Prigioni, who was probably the best back-up PG in the NBA last season and the only rookie in NBA history to go undefeated in his first 13 starts.

      He’s the quintessential pass-first PG, he excels in the pick and roll, he doesn’t look for his own shot but can punish teams for ignoring him behind the 3 point line, he’s our most disciplined and savvy backcourt defender and the only one of our PGs who can seem to keep his man in front of him.

      I cannot fathom anyone not appreciating that, particularly to the extend that they’d need to post over and over and over about it.

      Pretty much.

    10. Frank

      So what’s our rotation right now? Figure only 9 guys can get any sort of regular minutes, keep 1-2 vets for emergencies, then have the remaining 4 slots for developmental guys?

      Guys that will definitely get minutes:

      PG: Felton, Prigioni
      SG: Shumpert, JR
      SF: Melo
      PF: Amare, Bargnani
      C: Tyson

      For the 2 veteran spots, I figure we need one more swing-type who can play either SG or SF (mostly the 3 I guess). Need one true big that can credibly play PF or C to back up Tyson/Amare. I think an extra PG is probably a luxury.

      I think Delfino, Francisco Garcia, or Dorell Wright would be great pickups for the swing spot. Brand would be ideal for the PF/C but I’d take Kenyon back if Brand won’t come.

      Then for the developmental spots I’d think:
      1) TH Jr
      2) CJ Leslie
      3) Jerome Jordan
      4) some point guard – if a vet then has to be someone who doesn’t mind sitting on the bench for the whole year. Otherwise I’d take a flyer on a euro PG like Bobby Brown, a D-league guy like Toure Murry, etc. ie someone who would be happy just to be in the NBA like Cope was last year. Someone like Telfair would be great as a 3rd emergency PG but you have to figure he’d get more minutes elsewhere.

    11. Loathing

      Frank:
      Re: Prigioni – we weren’t just competing against other teams like the Spurs but also against Europe.He could’ve just taken his ball and gone home. He doesn’t need this.I guess we could’ve really held his feet to the fire saying we won’t offer you any more than the minimum, but then you let SA come in and steal him with part of their mini-MLE like we did so he can go play with his buddy Manu.Overall I think it’s a great move, although I wish we didn’t have that partial guarantee in 15-16 — hopefully it’s a small amount.Probably tradeable though.

      This Dwight Howard thing is pretty interesting.So many potential scenarios between outright FA signing and S&Ts, especially with the Warriors apparently willing to dump just about everyone for peanuts to get the cap room to sign him. If I’m the Lakers, I try to get at least Klay Thompson (or Barnes) + Bogut + a 2014 1st (prob need to get a 3rd team involved) for him.Lin/Asik + picks is ok too but I’d rather have Klay+Bogut.Nash, Klay, Kobe, Bogut is still a pretty good (non-contending) team, but you maintain your flexibility since Bogut expires and you get another pick in the stacked 2014 draft.

      Make it Klay n’ Lee and you got yourself a deal. Lee’s healthier, the money matches better and Lee can do the things Pau can’t.

    12. Igno-Bot 3000

      What’s the story with Jerome Jordan at this point? Is there a chance he can actually contribute? I really know nothing about his game

    13. Garson

      Given where we were 3 years back, I couldn’t be happier on our plan right now.

      1. We have a contending roster for the next 2 season. Not a championship roster… but a team we can root for on night to night basis and get deep into the playoffs
      2. We have some great expiring contracts coming up…
      3. Shumpert in my opinion has the ability and work ethic to improve into THE top defender in the NBA. He is already top 10. His offense has also shown rapid improvement with limited usage.
      4. If all goes to shit… We can blow it up in 2015. Rondo, Marc Gasol , Love etc all become available.

      The only drawback is …other then shump and prigs , the roster is not one that is so called “rootable” after watching a team like the spurs function so smoothly, I am not looking forward to the style that we play. Im not saying its not efficient or effective… its just not pleasing to the eye.

    14. d-mar

      Garson:
      Given where we were 3 years back, I couldn’t be happier on our plan right now.

      1. We have a contending roster for the next 2 season. Not a championship roster… but a team we can root for on night to night basis and get deep into the playoffs
      2. We have some great expiring contracts coming up…
      3. Shumpert in my opinion has the ability and work ethic to improve into THE top defender in the NBA. He is already top 10. His offense has also shown rapid improvement with limited usage.
      4. If all goes to shit… We can blow it up in 2015. Rondo, Marc Gasol , Love etc all become available.

      The only drawback is …other then shump and prigs, the roster is not one that is so called “rootable” after watching a team like the spurs function so smoothly, I am not looking forward to the style that we play. Im not saying its not efficient or effective… its just not pleasing to the eye.

      Not sure the Spurs were that pleasing to watch, a lot of their offense was dumping the ball to Duncan, and his post game, while generally effecti

    15. d-mar

      Sorry about that…iPad hiccup

      effective, is not exactly scintillating to watch. For all the crap we get for being Iso Melo, I could watch him hit sweet pull up jumpers all day long.

    16. Frank

      Garson: The only drawback is …other then shump and prigs , the roster is not one that is so called “rootable” after watching a team like the spurs function so smoothly, I am not looking forward to the style that we play. Im not saying its not efficient or effective… its just not pleasing to the eye.

      when the offense was good last year I thought it was beautiful to watch. in the playoffs it was a different story, but that was more a function of the defenses we were playing — even Miami looked like it was playing in molasses against Indy.

      overall I’m happiest that there will finally be some continuity on this team. The overall rotation should be basically the same as last year, minus a few minutes here and there from Novak and Cope (with Bargs probably taking all those minutes). If we can get continued improvement from Shump (honestly, I’d take playoffs Shump even without improvement), a return to 2011-12 Tyson, and any sort of efficient productivity out of Bargnani, I think this will be a very good team vying for a top 4 seed in the East. With how strong the top of the Eastern Conference is, I think that’s a good and reasonable goal.

      Igno-Bot 3000:
      What’s the story with Jerome Jordan at this point? Is there a chance he can actually contribute? I really know nothing about his game

      Draft Express wrote that they thought he was the best non-affiliated player (ie. not under contract with an NBA team) in the D-League last year. Averaged 17p/10r/3.2 blocks per 40 with a TS of 63-65 last year. hard to argue with that. Sounds like he wants to play for us too.

      http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/228191/Jerome-Jordan-Envisions-Role-On-Knicks-Next-Season

    17. Garson

      d-mar: Not sure the Spurs were that pleasing to watch, a lot of their offense was dumping the ball to Duncan, and his post game, while generally effecti

      I make sure to watch the spurs any chance I get.. the post up Duncan seemed to be exclusively vs Heat as that was their only matchup advantage.

    18. Brian Cronin

      I think with Prigs they did what they had to do, but the weird thing about it is what does this do to the mini-MLE money? If they’re paying him $2 million out of $3 million, then the remaining $1 million is basically useless, right? Because the vet minimum for everyone but really new players is more than a million.

      In addition, this means that Cope can be signed away by any team who signs him to an offer sheet over the vet minimum, right?

      Again, I think that they had to do it and I’m fine with it, just checking to make sure that this pretty much means that they’re done with the mini-MLE now.

    19. flossy

      Igno-Bot 3000:
      What’s the story with Jerome Jordan at this point? Is there a chance he can actually contribute? I really know nothing about his game

      The story is he’s 26 years old and he sucks.

    20. alsep73

      Brian, Zwerling and others have said we still have about $1.75 million of the mini-MLE to play with. Hopefully Brand or another decent backup big is willing to take that. That’d give us the rotation Frank described above, plus a few young developmental guys at the end of the bench (Hardaway, Leslie, Jerome Jordan, maybe Toure Murry) who have the chance to become more useful than Flight White ever was.

    21. Brian Cronin

      How does that work, though? Is it something like they only take out of the mini-MLE the difference between what they could normally pay Prigs and the $2 million? If that’s the case, then yeah, $1.75 million sounds right.

      I find it hard to believe that Brand can’t get a full mini-MLE offer out there.

    22. alsep73

      The math gives me a headache. All I know is what’s been reported by multiple people.

      With Brand, it’s not a question of money, as you’re right about what he can likely be paid elsewhere. It’s whether he wants to play on a team with at least championship aspirations versus staying with a bad team like Dallas (albeit one that could get good in a hurry if Dwight somehow chooses them), or going to some other lousy team that has cap space, money to spend and need of a veteran presence. I’m not banking on him coming here, but I don’t think the idea is completely ridiculous. Unlike Cope or Matt Barnes or Nate, Brand doesn’t need to make money the primary motivator.

    23. Caleb

      Tough to make predictions, until the roster fills out. I’m not so excited about Prigs but we needed him bigtime, and it’s not that high a price.

      At this point we are most desperate for another big, who can defend – even if Chandler is healthy. With Stoudemire and possibly Chandler on restricted minutes, we are in serious need of someone to soak up time.

      Brand would be great. I’m not super-optimistic, but who knows – he’s made well north of $100 million in his career and he’s a smart guy so he can afford to look beyond cash, if he wants. He’s also a NY area kid, probably has family here, and he’s in the film biz so NY isn’t a bad place to set up shop.

      K-Mart would be fine but I know we have stiff competition from the Nets. Not sure what else is out there.

      Beyond those guys you really have to squint… in our price range you’re looking at seriously flawed options. Desagna Diop… I saw Ronny Turiaf might be looking… Some have said Brandan Wright might be available, because of his injury history. Barnes is a good player for the money, but a) he can probably get a better offer; and b) we really need someone, anyone, who can defend the paint (besides Chandler).

      Jordan isn’t a project at this point – like flossy said, he’s 26, and he is what he is. But it’s not farfetched to see him as a contributor for 15 mpg. He was good in his mini-NBA minutes, and in the D-League.

      Anyway, I think you have to throw your resources at another big.

      We could definitely use another swingman who can shoot, and someone like Dorrell Wright would be great, but we already have Hardaway Jr. on the roster. It’s probably better to hope that he can play NBA minutes, and use our money on the frontcourt, than to spend $$ on our 9th swingman and make Bargnani play minutes at center.

      Given that Prigs is 36, we could also use a 3rd PG, but that has to be a lower priority. Look for Shump and JR to spend some time bringing the ball upcourt, in January and February.

    24. alsep73

      Caleb, I could also deal with some of the previously-discussed options like Aaron Brooks or Will Bynum if they’re the third point guard, rather than if they were replacing Prigs. There will definitely be someone we can get for the vets minimum, or else perhaps we can catch lightning in a bottle again with someone like Murry or Bobby Brown. It’ll definitely be easier to find someone to fill that role than it will to find a good backup big if Brand and KMart both go elsewhere.

    25. Brian Cronin

      With Brand, it’s not a question of money, as you’re right about what he can likely be paid elsewhere. It’s whether he wants to play on a team with at least championship aspirations versus staying with a bad team like Dallas (albeit one that could get good in a hurry if Dwight somehow chooses them), or going to some other lousy team that has cap space, money to spend and need of a veteran presence. I’m not banking on him coming here, but I don’t think the idea is completely ridiculous. Unlike Cope or Matt Barnes or Nate, Brand doesn’t need to make money the primary motivator.

      It is just that if Brand wants to play for a contender, most other contenders still have their mini-MLE available, ya know? So it is not so much that Brand wouldn’t be willing to take the paycut but more that he could play for a good team while making the mini-MLE, so it seems unlikely that he’d sign here for less than the mini-MLE. If the other teams all use up their mini-MLE, then that of course would changes things. Currently, though, I think Chicago is the only contender that has used their mini-MLE, right? Or did the Spurs use a mini-MLE on Marco Belinelli?

    26. ess-dog

      I like the idea of Shump playing third string pg, but we might need him at sf when we play small ball.
      It sounds like the Knicks wa t him to work on pg skills a lot this summer though, so maybe we are in the market for another 3?
      I like Brand but I think I hate the idea of Kmart going to the Nets even more. I hope we get one of those two…

    27. Brian Cronin

      As for Brooks, I just don’t see him being happy with being the third string point guard. Talent-wise, it is a no-brainer for him as a third-string PG, but I think they might be better off having a guy who would settle into the role better.

    28. Loathing

      Anyone think Devin Harris is gonna get a decent paycheck or can he be had for the min?

    29. alsep73

      Also, someone on Posting & Toasting raised a name I’d forgotten about: James Singleton, whom we almost signed at season’s end, then couldn’t because he couldn’t get out of his China contract for another few weeks or something. As I recall, people were excited (relatively speaking) about what he could do for us backing up both forward spots.

    30. alsep73

      Oh, and should we be assuming Chris Smith is a lock for the opening day roster as part of the unofficial JR negotiations, or will the Smith family be satisfied with another summer league spotlight?

    31. Vinny L.

      Air Prigioni!

      Born: May 17, 1977

      2013 PLAYOFFS Statistics:

      4.5 PPG 38% FG
      3.2 APG
      1.50 RPG
      +7.45 EFF
      1.3 STL
      0.1 BLK

      Nate Robinson!

      Born: May 31, 1984

      2013 PLAYOFFS Statistics:

      16.3 PPG 44% FG
      4.4 APG
      2.70 RPG
      +13.33 EFF
      1.0 STL
      0.2 BLK

      J.R. Smith!

      Born: Sep 9, 1985

      2013 PLAYOFFS Statistics:

      14.3 PPG 33% FG
      1.4 APG
      4.70 RPG
      +9.00 EFF
      1.00 STL
      1.8 BLK

    32. Zanzibar

      All you cognitive dissonants and pessimists out there – in the final 8 minutes of a playoffs game I would be more than happy putting a lineup of Prigs/Shump/Melo/Amare/Brand up against anyone. Excellent perimeter D, rim protection, 38%+ 3 ball, 3.5 shot creators, 3 post players, 4 mid-range shooters, PnR capability, and so on. Most important, all of these players have shown they won’t wilt in the playoffs. In his 3 playoffs, Brand’s posted WS/48 of .227, .131, and .135. Brian’s right that prospects of landing Brand are looking bleaker – why wouldn’t Clippers pay him their 3m mle? If we don’t sign him it won’t be due to lack of effort – all I’ve read the last couple of days suggest Brand may need to take out a restraining order against GG. If we don’t land Brand I’d throw our tmle money at Zaza (solid defender/rebounder able to hit 15-20 ft shot).

    33. Vinny L.

      Uhh Prigs played most of the 4th Quarter game 6 vs Pacers. Got abused by Stephenson, West, and George on picks and switch offs. ZERO offense ZERO assist in that Quarter. By contrast, the so-called coach sits Shump, Cope and Felton during that do or die quarter.

    34. Juany8

      I think Prigs is getting overrated by this board just a tad, let’s keep in mind that early in the season he looked terrified of having to actually take a shot. I like his game and think he’s a fine backup point guard, but he’s not a point guard you can rely on to make plays on the ball, so you have to play him with several other players who can. Felton actually had a pretty good playoffs other than a stink bomb or two, he can actually make some plays if the defense is set on taking other options away, and when Chandler was healthy last year a lot of those “bad” Felton shots were getting rebounded and put back in. It made the pick and roll even more effective than it looked like on paper, since Chandler doesn’t get that open near the rim without the defense sagging off a little bit. But then he got injured and was terrible in the playoffs…

    35. Juany8

      Zanzibar:
      All you cognitive dissonants and pessimists out there – in the final 8 minutes of a playoffs game I would be more than happy putting a lineup of Prigs/Shump/Melo/Amare/Brand up against anyone. Excellent perimeter D, rim protection, 38%+ 3 ball, 3.5 shot creators, 3 post players, 4 mid-range shooters, PnR capability, and so on. Most important, all of these players have shown they won’t wilt in the playoffs. In his 3 playoffs, Brand’s posted WS/48 of .227, .131, and .135. Brian’s right that prospects of landing Brand are looking bleaker – why wouldn’t Clippers pay him their 3m mle? If we don’t sign him it won’t be due to lack of effort – all I’ve read the last couple of days suggest Brand may need to take out a restraining order against GG. If we don’t land Brand I’d throw our tmle money at Zaza (solid defender/rebounder able to hit 15-20 ft shot).

      Lol the hawks are so boring I had forgotten that Zaza existed. I’d be more than happy to have him if Brand isn’t available.

    36. Vinny L.

      “cognitive dissonants”? LOL!

      Dude. Step away from the keyboard for a minute and relax.

    37. Vinny L.

      Errr uhh

      Regular season stats don’t mean jack in the playoffs, as JR Smith has shown us.

    38. Ted Nelson

      Brian Cronin: So it is not so much that Brand wouldn’t be willing to take the paycut but more that he could play for a good team while making the mini-MLE, so it seems unlikely that he’d sign here for less than the mini-MLE.

      The difference is a lot of money, but really marginal compared to what the guy has made in his career. If he’s on the Iverson/Toine life plan, maybe he takes every cent he can get. If he’s actually been responsible with his money, though, I would expect him to just pick the team he wants to play for rather than worry about a few hundred thousand or a million bucks (as sick as that is to say). That might come down to title chances, playing time, location, some intangible chemistry things… who knows. For a guy who has grossed at least $161 mill, I just think those might have more value than a few bucks. I’m not Brand, of course.

      Garson: I am not looking forward to the style that we play

      I’ve mostly stopped watching the last few years because I really don’t like watching Melo play. Between him and JR Smith and Raymond Felton… I totally agree this is not a fun team to watch.
      I also agree, though, that I’ll take where the team is at right now compared to a the Layden/Isiah years.

    39. Brian Cronin

      Oh, and should we be assuming Chris Smith is a lock for the opening day roster as part of the unofficial JR negotiations, or will the Smith family be satisfied with another summer league spotlight?

      I think it likely will be the former. Which is pretty hilarious.

    40. jon abbey

      Brian Cronin: I think it likely will be the former. Which is pretty hilarious.

      yep, rarely have I rooted for a catastrophic injury to a player on my own team as much as I will be rooting for Chris Smith to go down now.

    41. Ted Nelson

      Juany8: let’s keep in mind that early in the season he looked terrified of having to actually take a shot.

      Let’s keep in mind that early in the season was his first look at NBA competition. I don’t think anyone is under the impression he is a high usage player. He’s efficient as a low usage player, though, which can be better than “creating your own shot” only to miss it. The Knicks do have those playmakers you are referring to and an offense can also create a shot through motion.

      Vinny L.: Regular season stats don’t mean jack in the playoffs, as JR Smith has shown us.

      Sample size.

    42. Caleb

      I may be biggest Nate Robinson fan out there, but we’re getting into fantasy-land here – he’s going to get more than the mini-MLE. At least we can avoid painful arguments about why Woody is a moron for refusing to play him.

      And Zaza is not in our price range either…

    43. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      Ted Nelson: Sample size.

      Plus, weren’t there confirmed reports that Smith was out doing lots of coke the night before games?

      It’s easy to assign causation to the “playoff style of play,” but with Smith, I think causality is pretty hard to lock down.

    44. massive

      Nothing was confirmed, just one article on it with nobody credible writing it.

      The Honorable Cock Jowles: Plus, weren’t there confirmed reports that Smith was out doing lots of coke the night before games?

      It’s easy to assign causation to the “playoff style of play,” but with Smith, I think causality is pretty hard to lock down.

    45. Zanzibar

      Vinny L.:
      Uhh Prigs played most of the 4th Quarter game 6 vs Pacers. Got abused by Stephenson, West, and George on picks and switch offs. ZERO offense ZERO assist in that Quarter. By contrast, the so-called coach sits Shump, Cope and Felton during that do or die quarter.

      There’s nothing prablomatic about Prigs playoff performance. According to Hollinger stat site, he ranked #1 in dime ratio in the playoffs among all PGs and BRef site showed him to have the second highest WS/48 among PGs, second only to Paul. And keep in mind Celtics and Pacers were top defensive teams.

    46. DCrockett17

      Ted Nelson:

      I’ve mostly stopped watching the last few years because I really don’t like watching Melo play. Between him and JR Smith and Raymond Felton… I totally agree this is not a fun team to watch.
      I also agree, though, that I’ll take where the team is at right now compared to a the Layden/Isiah years.

      This team mostly runs D’Antoni’s offense. Seriously, I don’t get this. Different strokes and all, but what should they be running with this basic collection of players?

    47. Unreason

      Caleb: And Zaza is not in our price range either…

      What is he likely to get? Just curious bc someone thought he’d be available for cheap.

    48. DCrockett17

      Caleb:

      And Zaza is not in our price range either…

      I wonder. With next year’s draft and FA class I suspect that some of these guys who just *know* they’re getting the full MLE may end up settling for something quite a bit less than they’d hoped.

    49. ptmilo

      This may be a little nuts, but has anyone suggested Turkoglu? Yes, he was suspended for PEDs and hasn’t played above replacement level in a couple of years. But unlike many of the names mentioned in the rumor mill, he is a genuinely excellent 3pt shooter, a skill that doesn’t usually vanish by 34. And relative to the genuine 3pt shooters, he is not a terrible defender. He can even help on the boards (a little). Most people think he will be bought out by Orlando, I think $6m of his $12m is guaranteed, but am not sure. He could be quite cheap after that.

    50. JK47

      Anthony Morrow for the vet min would be a pretty sweet pickup. Dude can shoot the three.

    51. Hubert

      I’m surprised no one’s posted an article today about how Washington’s strong 2nd half last year combined with the selection of Otto Porter in the draft means the Knicks realistically are looking at a ceiling of the 6 seed and a first round exit.

    52. Caleb

      DCrockett17: I wonder. With next year’s draft and FA class I suspect that some of these guys who just *know* they’re getting the full MLE may end up settling for something quite a bit less than they’d hoped.

      He could get screwed and end up settling for less than the full MLE, but he’s 7 feet tall, in his 20s and people know he can play a bit. Those guys don’t get stuck playing for $1.75.

    53. Caleb

      Hubert:
      I’m surprised no one’s posted an article today about how Washington’s strong 2nd half last year combined with the selection of Otto Porter in the draft means the Knicks realistically are looking at a ceiling of the 6 seed and a first round exit.

      Assume this is sarcastic. Between tankapalooza and the usual random comings and goings, it sure looks like a huge split is shaping up between the top 5 and the rest of the East. Pending injuries, of course. And yes, the Knicks are in the top part.

    54. Brian Cronin

      Interesting…I am unsure whether I think the biggest gap will be between the top five and #6 or between #7 and the rest of the East (presuming Washington and Milwaukee are #6 and #7). A lot of East teams will be awwwwwwwwful this year, so I think the gap between #7 and the rest might be bigger than the gap between #5 and #6, even though the top five seem to be a good deal better than Washington.

      Also, do note that I have no idea what Atlanta will look like. They might tank or they might not. Signing Korver is an odd move if they’re going to tank.

    55. Ted Nelson

      DCrockett17: This team mostly runs D’Antoni’s offense. Seriously, I don’t get this. Different strokes and all, but what should they be running with this basic collection of players?

      I dislike the way those three play across their whole lives, not the offense the Knicks run. (I watched maybe 5 games last season, so I really have no idea what offense they run.)

      Melo and Smith dominate the ball, dribble around, jack up terrible shots with hands in their faces. They’re more efficient and have better guys around them, but it’s not that much different from watching Marbury and Crawford.

      Felton just isn’t an efficient scorer, yet he still forces quite a few shots. Has about an average usage. I’d like to see him shoot less. Become low usage if he’s going to be low efficiency (and I see no reason to believe at 29 he’ll become efficient with a career TS% of .499 that was about equal to his last season at .505, never having broken a .525 TS%).

      I’m not arguing with the offensive results (#3 in the NBA) would just prefer to watch if they moved the ball better and moved themselves without the ball better as well. I don’t care for watching Melo, Felton, or especially Smith.

    56. danvt

      The Honorable Cock Jowles: I said 45 wins, so let’s see what happens.

      I know, Awesome. But you said it right after Bargnani and before they signed JR or Prigioni back. So, how scientific was the prediction? Did you assume those things?

      What if they took away Anthony and added Splitter? Would you revise your prediction upward?

    57. danvt

      danvt: self satisfied egotists like THCJ

      Sorry to call you that. I won’t get personal in the future. You have an arrogant style but I do enjoy your posts even though I also think your well researched conclusions are ironic.

    58. Caleb

      Brian Cronin:
      Interesting…I am unsure whether I think the biggest gap will be between the top five and #6 or between #7 and the rest of the East (presuming Washington and Milwaukee are #6 and #7). A lot of East teams will be awwwwwwwwful this year, so I think the gap between #7 and the rest might be bigger than the gap between #5 and #6, even though the top five seem to be a good deal better than Washington.

      Also, do note that I have no idea what Atlanta will look like. They might tank or they might not. Signing Korver is an odd move if they’re going to tank.

      Washington and Milwaukee will be ok… possibly Charlotte, Detroit and Atlanta. Those are the other playoff “contenders.” I expect Atlanta to go full-tank, but even if they try, they only won 44 last year and they’re not going to be better, without Josh Smith.

      The top 5 all look like solid 50-win teams (or better), especially since they’ll get to feast on the Celtics, Sixers, etc.

      Of course there is usually one semi-surprise team, and injuries & age could sink one of the top 5.

    59. ess-dog

      I dislike Felton’s play as much as anyone, but one thing about him is that he almost always seemed to be the player forced to put up shots when the shot clock was going off.
      I think that padded his attempts a little (and missed shots.)
      But yeah, we have a lot of inefficient scorers in our lineup. Shump is fairly inefficient too. That’s why it would be kinda cool if we could, you know, feed Tyson/Amare for more looks, but what the hell do I know? I’m no NBA coach…

    60. Hubert

      The Honorable Cock Jowles: Plus, weren’t there confirmed reports that Smith was out doing lots of coke the night before games?

      Absolutely not.

      There was a story from a guy named Incarcerated Bob who, by most accounts, is some kind of Internet shyster. Nothing that comes from him should be taken seriously, and that rumor came from him.

    61. JK47

      I’m not real worried about the Knicks’ offense– they should be able to play pretty much the same low-turnover style they played last year. I don’t think they’ll miss Kidd all that much. At the end of the regular season last year the Knicks went on a tremendous run with Kidd in full Mike Bibby mode and Prigioni playing more like, well, the “good” Jason Kidd. It’s the defensive side of the ball where I’m worried. Even the most ardent supporters of the Bargnani trade have to admit he’s clueless on defense overall, and in the Knicks’ switch-everything system he could be a real disaster. I’d like to see the rest of the Knicks’ signings be as defense-oriented as possible– they’ll need a couple of bangers and maybe one more good wing defender.

    62. danvt

      It was really terrific watching JKidd on NYK last season. It completely changed the team. It was beautiful, even after he hit the wall. The ball moved like effing Princeton. Sorry you weren’t there to see it. Against great defenses or maybe due to certain players bad tendencies at times we would revert to iso ball but it was by no means the norm.

      Another problem was that when there aren’t enough shooters on the floor. Like Prigs, Kmart and Chandler together, what happened sometimes was that the offense would work but the finisher would defer, setting up a less good shot with less left on the 24 often needing to be taken by Melo or JR.

      I really wonder if they’ll remember how to move the ball next year. This is my one genuine concern. My hope is that Prigioni took his year of Jason Kidd school to heart and is ready to be the new coach on the floor.

      Ted Nelson: I dislike the way those three play across their whole lives, not the offense the Knicks run. (I watched maybe 5 games last season, so I really have no idea what offense they run.)

    63. Hubert

      Caleb: Assume this is sarcastic. Between tankapalooza and the usual random comings and goings, it sure looks like a huge split is shaping up between the top 5 and the rest of the East. Pending injuries, of course. And yes, the Knicks are in the top part.

      It was definitely sarcastic.

      In the LeBron era, titles are going to be very hard to come by. I think there are 4 tiers below LeBron:

      Tier 1: top contenders. OKC, San Antonio, probably Chicago when (if) they’re ever healthy.

      Tier 2: Punchers’s chance. Knicks, Clippers, Grizzlies, Pacers, Warriors,

      Tier 3: all the stupid teams in the middle. Brooklyn, LA, Milwaukee, Denver, among others

      Tier 4: the teams that are punting on the LeBron era to position themselves for the next era. Boston, Toronto, Orlando, Philadelphia, et al.

      (the hardest team to place in those tiers, btw, is Houston. I could see them in any of the top 3 tiers depending on if Howard signs there and if he regains his health.)

      I think we’ve done a fantastic job positioning ourselves in that second tier. Had we been a little wiser we could have gotten into the top tier (if, for instance, we weren’t wasting a max salary on Amar’e). But I’d much rather have a Punchers’s chance than be punting, as so many people seem to be advocating.

    64. max fisher-cohen

      Hedo is following the path of his Orlando buddy, Rashard Lewis. Not sure the odds of him rewarding you are high enough, especially since we already have 3-4 poor defenders in our rotation.

    65. alsep73

      Shoes dropping elsewhere: Matt Barnes re-signed with the Clips, and Golden State unloaded Jefferson and Biedrins on Utah (deal details not out yet), not to clear room for Dwight, but for Iguadola. Takes them out of the Howard sweepstakes and would seem to make Houston the clear frontrunner.

      And since half the NBA is waiting for the Dwight issue to resolve before additional moves are made, that begin to make clear which players are getting paid (and are therefore out of NYK range) and which will have to settle for less than expected (and therefore could be had for the vets min).

    66. Brian Cronin

      Major blow to Denver. Probably knocks them out of the playoffs in the West, I think, since Gallo won’t be back until past midseason.

      By the way, does the GSW move really knock them out of the Howard sweepstakes? It seems to me that it makes Barnes and Thompson suddenly very available, ya know? Add them to Bogut and the sign and trade would be really appetizing to the Lakers.

    67. alsep73

      Good point. Woj was the one suggesting they were out now, but he has since backtracked, saying they have “tentacles everywhere.” Now, are Barnes and/or Klay attractive enough to get someone to take either the Bogut or DLee contracts to open up enough room? Or even for the Lakers to do a sign-and-trade with GSW?

    68. Brian Cronin

      Good point. Woj was the one suggesting they were out now, but he has since backtracked, saying they have “tentacles everywhere.” Now, are Barnes and/or Klay attractive enough to get someone to take either the Bogut or DLee contracts to open up enough room? Or even for the Lakers to do a sign-and-trade with GSW?

      I think Thompson is definitely appetizing enough for a team to take Bogut. But I dunno if that’s give them enough cap room. Instead, I think they might have to think about including Barnes with Thompson to the Lakers along with Bogut. That’s got to be quite a haul for the Lakers.

    69. ess-dog

      alsep73:
      Good point. Woj was the one suggesting they were out now, but he has since backtracked, saying they have “tentacles everywhere.” Now, are Barnes and/or Klay attractive enough to get someone to take either the Bogut or DLee contracts to open up enough room? Or even for the Lakers to do a sign-and-trade with GSW?

      Beats losing Dwight for nothing. Although if they lose Dwight to the Rockets, maybe they can resign Bynum, lol.

    70. Brian Cronin

      Really, the best thing about the Lakers’ situation is that they gave up so little for Howard, so losing him really wouldn’t kill them like it would most other teams, presuming they make a good sign and trade deal, of course.

    71. Brian Cronin

      Unless, of course, Howard returns to his 2010-11 self, in which case the Lakers will sorely miss him.

    72. mokers

      Klay would probably enjoy playing for the team his dad played for. Since he is a legacy, maybe Kobe will go easy on him.

      The only problem with Bogut is that he is not healthy.

    73. Ted Nelson

      ess-dog: he almost always seemed to be the player forced to put up shots when the shot clock was going off.

      It’s possible and I think Crawford himself might have used this line of reasoning (certainly his supporters, but I really think he might have used the excuse himself). Possibly an adjustment should be made for primary ball-handlers, but I’d imagine guys like LeBron and Steve Nash and Chris Paul are in the same position as often yet still manage really good efficiencies.

      danvt: My hope is that Prigioni took his year of Jason Kidd school to heart and is ready to be the new coach on the floor.

      Interesting about the offense last year.

      It’s possible he learned a lot from him, but I’m not really sure Prigs needed Kidd to teach him basketball. He was always a fairly low usage, high efficiency pass-first PG on really good teams in Europe and for Argentina. A veteran floor general in his own right.

    74. Frank

      JK47: Even the most ardent supporters of the Bargnani trade have to admit he’s clueless on defense overall, and in the Knicks’ switch-everything system he could be a real disaster.

      Actually, one might say that the switch-everything scheme is good for Bargnani. By all accounts he’s a reasonably good on-ball defender but a horrible team defender. At least by switching he can just concentrate on 1 guy.

      Brian Cronin: I think Thompson is definitely appetizing enough for a team to take Bogut.

      I’d definitely “take Bogut” even without Klay Thompson. Sure he has his injury issues, but that dude is a difference maker when healthy. One of the best shotblocker/rebounder/assists/team defender centers out there.

    75. Zanzibar

      From the THERE’S ALWAYS HOPE Department, here are the average WS/48 for the first 7 years of two players prominent in the news at the moment. Guess who they are before looking at the answer below.

      Player 1 WS/48: .057
      Player 2 WS/48: .067

      ********************************************

      Answer: Andrea Bargnani and Matt Barnes. Barnes made a quantum leap in years 8, 9, 10, 11 posting .135, .142, .142, and .146 respectively.

    76. Hubert

      I’m definitely skeptical about Howard, but even if i wasn’t, I can’t see how giving up Harrison Barnes, Klay Thompson, and Andrew Bogut to get Dwight Howard is smart. Bogut was pretty good when he returned. I think they’re better with him and those other two guys than Howard.

    77. Brian Cronin

      I would imagine that they’d like to keep it as Thompson/Bogut and perhaps throw in a #1 instead of Barnes. Thompson is clearly by far the odd man out in GSW right now.

    78. Brian Cronin

      I’d definitely “take Bogut” even without Klay Thompson. Sure he has his injury issues, but that dude is a difference maker when healthy. One of the best shotblocker/rebounder/assists/team defender centers out there.

      Oh definitely he’s great when healthy. He just isn’t ever healthy. That’s a lot of money to pay a guy who is never healthy.

    79. Unreason

      Hubert: Absolutely not.

      There was a story from a guy named Incarcerated Bob who, by most accounts, is some kind of Internet shyster. Nothing that comes from him should be taken seriously, and that rumor came from him.

      Not sure that the validity of that particular report matters much. His infamous admission last Fall about the previous year: “I was going out pretty much every other night, just not focused on the task at hand.”, followed by his decision in the play-offs to go clubbing before a game 1 says plenty without relying on rumor or rep. IMO it’s safe to say that JR’s professional maturity remains a work in progress.

      I’m not judging the guy as a human being. And when he’s on, I like watching him play. I just wish the Knicks’ success was less dependent on his capacity for sustained self-restraint.

      It’ll be interesting to see who he looks for in the second unit now that Novak’s gone. If Amare’s minutes are limited, his effectiveness could be hurt if JR consistently “ignores” him as he often seemed to last season.

    80. Caleb

      The Utah deal makes it a lot less likely, IMO, because they can’t offer a pick any more — they traded 2014 and 2017, so can’t offer 2015 or 2016 either.

      So it cuts down the options to Barnes/Thompson/Bogut, which I suppose is still possible.

      A pretty good move for GSW, either way. Iggy is a good fit – they need defense, and he can basically run the point for a team that doesn’t have a pure playmaker.

      With Howard, you have to have the medical staff involved. If he’s basically healthy, you give up whatever to get him. If you have health questions — tough call. As in, where does Andrew Bynum land?

    81. Brian Cronin

      Oh, I didn’t know they threw picks into the Utah deal. So yeah, it’d have to be Barnes/Thompson/Bogut. I dunno how L.A. can turn that down.

    82. Hubert

      Brian Cronin:
      I would imagine that they’d like to keep it as Thompson/Bogut and perhaps throw in a #1 instead of Barnes. Thompson is clearly by far the odd man out in GSW right now.

      I don’t know their situation well but I didn’t get that impression. I thought they were going the small ball route like us, with Barnes at the 4 and a really amazing trio of guards in Curry, Klay, and Iguodala. At least that’s what I hope they’re doing because I’d love to watch that team.

      I kinda figured Lee was the odd man out, though he could just as easily play the 4 in that lineup and let Barnes be the 6th man.

      They would essentially be us from last year, only with much better shooters.

    83. Brian Cronin

      I would agree that they’d look to deal Lee if they could, but I don’t think that they can. So instead they pick up Howard and play slower.

    84. Hubert

      Unreason: followed by his decision in the play-offs to go clubbing before a game 1 says plenty without relying on rumor or rep.

      But you’re relying on rumor in that very sentence. He himself stated on twitter that he did not go out before game 1. All that happened was a bunch of pictures of him with nothing indicating the time or date started swirling around twitter.

      JR is definitely immature and I don’t disagree w your larger point. But I also think some people on twitter have a lot of time on their hands and like to make shit up to get attention, and somehow the shit they make up ends up being considered fact instead of rumor.

    85. Hubert

      Brian Cronin:
      I would agree that they’d look to deal Lee if they could, but I don’t think that they can. So instead they pick up Howard and play slower.

      Just curious: do you think they would be better if they did that? I take my own thoughts on Howard w a grain of salt bc I’m not a fan. IMO a Curry-Iggy-Klay-Lee-Bogut w Barnes as 6th man team is better than a Curry-Iggy-Howard trio w questionable depth.

    86. Unreason

      Caleb: With Howard, you have to have the medical staff involved. If he’s basically healthy, you give up whatever to get him. If you have health questions — tough call. As in, where does Andrew Bynum land?

      Aren’t Bogut and Bynum both rapidly approaching Gred Oden territory in the elite strata of enormous risk? I don’t understand why Bynum would factor much into any decision about Howard or why Bogut would add much appeal to an S&T.

    87. JK47

      I know people are down on Dwight, and for good reason, but there’s no way he isn’t a major upgrade over Bogut. Bogut never gets in enough games to get in a groove– he’s always either injured or coming back from an injury. And when they DO play, Howard has a .598 career TS% to Bogut’s .535, and Bogut hasn’t been over the .500 mark since the 09-10 season. Dwight has a career .181 WS48 to Bogut’s .109.

      Klay Thompson and Barnes are nice young pieces but they’re hardly irreplaceable. This seems like a chance to buy low on Dwight, so I’d go for it if I’m GSW.

    88. ess-dog

      JK47:
      I know people are down on Dwight, and for good reason, but there’s no way he isn’t a major upgrade over Bogut.Bogut never gets in enough games to get in a groove– he’s always either injured or coming back from an injury.And when they DO play, Howard has a .598 career TS% to Bogut’s .535, and Bogut hasn’t been over the .500 mark since the 09-10 season.Dwight has a career .181 WS48 to Bogut’s .109.

      Klay Thompson and Barnes are nice young pieces but they’re hardly irreplaceable.This seems like a chance to buy low on Dwight, so I’d go for it if I’m GSW.

      Well said. And Iggy is still a good pick up even w/o Dwight. If they’re stuck with Bogut though, they need to be prepared to play some small ball, which I think they can do nicely. I’m surprised NO ONE wants Lee… he should be a nice fit somewhere.

    89. alsep73

      Yup, Sam Amick reporting it.

      http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2013/07/05/nba-dwight-howard-makes-his-decision/2492347/

      The last few years have not been good for Dwight’s image, but on that team, in that market, with Harden and Parsons and whatever Morey can get for Asik and/or Lin… that’s a very very dangerous team.

      Wonder how furious FA activity around the rest of the league will be now that the big shoe dropped. As others have noted, there’s been virtually no discussion of Bynum whatsoever to this point. That has to change in a hurry now. And it sounds like Utah will have to renounce Milsap to make the GSW trade work. Lots and lots of pieces suddenly in motion.

    90. Unreason

      Hubert: He himself stated on twitter that he did not go out before game 1. All that happened was a bunch of pictures of him with nothing indicating the time or date started swirling around twitter.

      You gave more credence to his denial than I did, and maybe I should have given it more. The other things that happened were Magic chastising him publicly for going out before games and his ex claiming he was hung over for games etc. He may have been feeding off rumors, but her word is unimpeachable of course :)

      If you think he might be coming around, I’ll take some comfort in that. I’d love to be wrong.

    91. ess-dog

      Do you really think anyone will take Lin with that contract after a middling season? I mean, I like the guy and he still has some upside, but I’m not sure where he lands…

    92. Unreason

      BigBlueAL:
      Rockets vs Lakers should be fun next season.

      I don’t know how fun the Lakers will be to watch, but viewing their place in the standing will probably be fun, if they suck as much as I’m guessing they will.

    93. mokers

      It’s interesting to take a look at Utah. Since their back to back finals appearance, they have been to the conference finals once and made it out of the first round only four times. In general, they are a team that appears to do the right things. They draft well and make the most of their assets. During most of that time, they had a very good coach. And since 1997 they haven’t been to an NBA finals. Shows how difficult it is to make an NBA finals even when your owner isn’t James Dolan and you never had Isaiah Thomas as your GM.

    94. JK47

      mokers:
      It’s interesting to take a look at Utah. Since their back to back finals appearance, they have been to the conference finals once and made it out of the first round only four times. In general, they are a team that appears to do the right things. They draft well and make the most of their assets. During most of that time, they had a very good coach. And since 1997 they haven’t been to an NBA finals. Shows how difficult it is to make an NBA finals even when your owner isn’t James Dolan and you never had Isaiah Thomas as your GM.

      If Utah can keep their young core together they’re going to be really, really good in the coming years. They added Trey Burke, who is just 20, to the core of 21-year old Enes Kanter and 22-year old Derrick Favors. Gordon Hayward at 22 years old is another solid piece. Alec Burks hasn’t worked out so far, but he’s still only 21. They’ve also got Rudy Gobert.

      That’s a lot of young assets.

    95. alsep73

      ess-dog:
      Do you really think anyone will take Lin with that contract after a middling season? I mean, I like the guy and he still has some upside, but I’m not sure where he lands…

      Based on how he played last season, it’s not a great contract, especially with that third year. That said, I think he’d still be a gate and merchandising attraction, especially if you send him to a bad team where he’d be the dominant ballhandler. It’s entirely possible that the league simply caught up to Lin and Linsanity was just a fluke. But his game is certainly not built for succeeding next to a ball-dominant guard like Harden. One of the teams that’s trying to tank for 2014 ping pong balls might be willing to surrender a useful player for the hope of Linsanity 2.0.

    96. Juany8

      Howard’s a Rocket! I don’t know how it’s all gonna work out but holy shit that is an amazing haul the last 2 years

    97. TDM

      Do the Warriors still have Scott Machado on their roster? He’s a local product that I always liked. More of a pass-first pg, but led the NCAA in dimes 2 years in a row.

    98. yellowboy90

      someone tell me how Ny could take on Asik and Lin to save teams from taking on that 15 million in the second year.

    99. alsep73

      Now there are rumors that Houston is trying to work a sign-and-trade for Josh Smith (presumably for Asik plus whatever horded assets Morey has left). Crazy.

    100. JK47

      yellowboy90:
      someone tell me how Ny could take on Asik and Lin to save teams from taking on that 15 million in the second year.

      Send Amar’e to Houston?

    101. maxwell_3g

      Vinny L.:
      Errr uhh

      Regular season stats don’t mean jack in the playoffs, as JR Smith has shown us.

      i think a larger sample of past basketball stats are a better predictor of future basketball performance than a hand selected couple of weeks. Know who agrees?? the San Antonio Spurs, who just paid Tiago Splitter.

    102. yellowboy90

      JK47: Send Amar’e to Houston?

      I doubt it. would have to be Tyson. Need to get a thirf team to take Chandler who don’t want to take on 30 million. Houston is likely to do two separate trades with Detroit and Houston.

    103. Douglas

      alsep73:
      Yup, Sam Amick reporting it.

      http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/2013/07/05/nba-dwight-howard-makes-his-decision/2492347/

      The last few years have not been good for Dwight’s image, but on that team, in that market, with Harden and Parsons and whatever Morey can get for Asik and/or Lin… that’s a very very dangerous team.

      Wonder how furious FA activity around the rest of the league will be now that the big shoe dropped. As others have noted, there’s been virtually no discussion of Bynum whatsoever to this point. That has to change in a hurry now. And it sounds like Utah will have to renounce Milsap to make the GSW trade work. Lots and lots of pieces suddenly in motion.

      That was mercifully quick.

    104. max fisher-cohen

      mokers:
      It’s interesting to take a look at Utah. Since their back to back finals appearance, they have been to the conference finals once and made it out of the first round only four times. In general, they are a team that appears to do the right things. They draft well and make the most of their assets. During most of that time, they had a very good coach. And since 1997 they haven’t been to an NBA finals. Shows how difficult it is to make an NBA finals even when your owner isn’t James Dolan and you never had Isaiah Thomas as your GM.

      Jazz win% over last 10 seasons: 55%
      Knicks win% over last 10 seasons: 41.5%

      Jazz playoff series played over last 10 seasons: 9
      Knicks playoff series played over last 10 seasons: 5

      I know which one I prefer.

    105. MKinLA

      If the Howard reports are true, you have to give Morey an unbelievable amount of credit. He was killed in the media for years for constantly moving pieces around, always making “small trades” to gather assets and preserve flexibility, but never landing the superstar. There was even talk that his job was in jeopardy.

      Then he goes out and gets not one, but two of the best 10 players in the NBA within a year or so. And he doesn’t have to strip the roster to do it – he may have pieces to get Josh Smith as well.

      Just an amazing performance.

    106. Unreason

      Juany8:
      Howard’s a Rocket! I don’t know how it’s all gonna work out but holy shit that is an amazing haul the last 2 years

      Good day to be Rocket fan. Better identify your designated driver early in the evening and make sure he/she’s a Mavs or Hawks fan.

    107. DRed

      good job by Houston getting big baby, obviously. I assume they gave him a pretty thorough physical, because if he’s dogged by injuries again he’s not a huge upgrade over Asik. It’s going to be very interesting to see what moves this leads to around the league. The Lakers have to blow up what’s left of their team now, right?

    108. mokers

      max fisher-cohen: Jazz win% over last 10 seasons: 55%
      Knicks win% over last 10 seasons: 41.5%

      Jazz playoff series played over last 10 seasons: 9
      Knicks playoff series played over last 10 seasons: 5

      I know which one I prefer.

      I don’t think you should take my comment as an endorsement of Dolan’s methods. Just that in general it is hard to win an NBA championship and sustain success, even when your organization is highly regarded. Imagine if Utah took Paul George instead of Hayward in 2010, does Indian beat us last year? Or if Utah took Serge Ibaka instead of Kosta Koufos does OKC do something different and Harden is still on the team. More of a though exercise and I am surely not saying anything bad about Jazz.

    109. jon abbey

      this is incredible, I defy anyone to find any analysis of this trade from last summer that doesn’t have ORL as the big losers:

      =================================

      One year later…

      Los Angeles Lakers:
      One-Year Rental on Dwight Howard
      One-Year Rental on Earl Clark
      One-Year Rental on Chris Duhon

      Philadelphia 76ers:
      One-Year Rental on Andrew Bynum (Did Not Play)
      Jason Richardson (Played 33 Games)

      Denver Nuggets:
      One-Year Rental on Andre Iguodala

      Orlando Magic:
      Arron Afflalo
      One-Year Rental on Al Harrington (Played 10 Games)
      Josh McRoberts (Traded for Hakim Warrick then Waived)
      Nikola Vucevic
      Moe Harkless
      Christian Eyenga (Immediately Waived)
      Romero Osby (Denver 2013 Second Round Pick)
      Philadelphia Conditional First Round Pick
      Denver/New York 2014 First Round Pick
      Los Angeles 2015 Conditional Second Round Pick
      Los Angeles 2017 Top-5 Protected First Round Pick

    110. ruruland

      danvt: Sorry to call you that.I won’t get personal in the future.You have an arrogant style but I do enjoy your posts even though I also think your well researched conclusions are ironic.

      Well researched posts? Uh.

      Also, I’m surprised not more of this board is in shock over Howard choosing to leave D’Antoni.

    111. ess-dog

      ruruland: Well researched posts? Uh.

      Also, I’m surprised not more of this board is in shock over Howard choosing to leave D’Antoni.

      Howard is/was a terrible fit for D’Antoni. I’m surprised the Lakers didn’t jettison MDA just to have a better shot at D12.

      Frankly, I think the Lakers are better off moving Pau to center and picking up a cheap, rugged forward like Elton Brand. They can probably afford a nice wing shooter too. I think they’ll still be playoff material.

      Btw, Howard might never return to form. This is not necessarily a slam dunk for Houston.

    112. jon abbey

      ess-dog:

      Btw, Howard might never return to form. This is not necessarily a slam dunk for Houston.

      yeah, I’m not sure how much of an upgrade he will be over Asik, but adding Josh Smith (if they pull that off too) will be a huge upgrade, as would Calderon over Lin.

    113. Unreason

      ess-dog: This is not necessarily a slam dunk for Houston.

      Right. It’s most probably a very large number of slam dunks for Houston.

    114. ess-dog

      jon abbey: yeah, I’m not sure how much of an upgrade he will be over Asik, but adding Josh Smith (if they pull that off too) will be a huge upgrade, as would Calderon over Lin.

      Idk, is Josh Smith a huge upgrade over Chandler Parsons? Do you put Smith at the 3 or the 4?

    115. jon abbey

      Smith at the 4, Parsons at the 3. Howard/Smith/Parsons/Harden/Calderon, they need to add some bench but that’s a tough team.

      the top six teams in the West look seriously loaded as of now, DEN has fallen back but OKC/SAS/MEM/LAC/GS/HOU all look really tough.

    116. danvt

      I was thinking that too. Kidd’s not be the only guy to play PG that way. It’s actually amazing how few guys are that flat out committed to not getting their own. Kidd was just so amazing in his prime because he was such a threat and also played like a classic pg. I think Prigs is a threat too and you have to be to be an effective pass first pg. Too many guys with that label are actually just limited pg’s. The pass first pg is kind of a throwback thing. Like a leadoff hitter that bunts. Like any hitter that bunts.

      Ted Nelson: It’s possible he learned a lot from him, but I’m not really sure Prigs needed Kidd to teach him basketball. He was always a fairly low usage, high efficiency pass-first PG on really good teams in Europe and for Argentina. A veteran floor general in his own right.

    117. alsep73

      Zwerling says Copeland is signing an offer sheet with the Pacers. Oh, well. As we’ve said, can’t blame a guy for going for his one shot at money, though I’ll be curious how much he ultimately gets.

      Was fun while it lasted, Cope.

    118. alsep73

      Houston now trading Royce White to Philly, presumably to clear up a bit of cap space for this Smith maneuver. Other dominoes are going to start falling now.

    119. danvt

      ruruland: Well researched posts? Uh.

      He’s putting stuff out there with #s to back it up. That’s all I’m saying. I just love his demented conclusions though. Like Splitter being better than Carmelo or making a 45 win prediction on July 3rd when there were like six guys on the roster.

      That’s what I look to you for RURU the troll killer (not that thjc is a troll exactly, bobneptune on the other hand…) I’m a seat of my pants guy. I’m not worthy really. I just love ball and NYK and have been watching forever. So, I enjoy rubbernecking on the 12 car pile ups that are that dudes posts. He does get some stuff right as well. Like Ty Lawson and Kenneth Faried. I like those guys.

      Hey, maybe, Splitter could beat Faried one on one. Faried only shoots from five feet in as well.

    120. BigBlueAL

      Cope to the Pacers. Also rumors are Asik might go to the Pelicans for Ryan Anderson.

    121. massive

      OKC took a step back, too. Their 6th man is one of Reggie Jackson/Jeremy Lamb. I’m shaking in my boots.

      Houston and the Clippers are the best teams out west right now.

    122. massive

      OKC is to blame for the rise of Houston. They should have just cut Kendrick Perkins. Trading Harden to Houston was the worst move that franchise made, and they traded away a championship when they did that.

    123. alsep73

      Isola says the Cope offer sheet is 2 years, $6.1 million — in other words, too high for Knicks to match even if they hadn’t signed Prigs. I suspect if we had offered Cope the entire mini-MLE, he might’ve stayed, as Indy’s offer is only a tiny bit bigger, but ultimately think Grunwald made the right call. Prigioni plus whatever we can get with the rest of the mini-MLE is more valuable to this specific roster than Copeland alone would be.

      Also liked this Isola tweet: “Knicks pitch to FA’s should be, “yes, we can only give the minimum but play here 1 year & cash in elsewhere. Look at Lin, Fields & Copeland”"

      https://twitter.com/FisolaNYDN/statuses/353311126806724610

    124. Juany8

      massive:
      OKC is to blame for the rise of Houston. They should have just cut Kendrick Perkins. Trading Harden to Houston was the worst move that franchise made, and they traded away a championship when they did that.

      I thought the trade was alright at first, but now that Kevin Martin left for nothing and they still have Scott brooks messing shit up, Sam presti is suddenly looking pretty terrible. Don’t count out OKC, they still have 2 top 10 players on that team and ibaka and sefalosha are nice pieces, but they seriously bombed out in that trade. Wouldn’t give up on lamb turning out to be good thoygh

    125. Juany8

      Also, how the hell are we already forgetting about San Antonio. They were a few seconds away from winning the finals, they deserve some respect, it’s not like Dwight Howard did shit against them in the playoffs.

      Also asik doesn’t want to play with Howard, which is understandable, and it’s kind of a shame, I feel the same way about losing asik to get Howard I’m sure a lot of people here feel about losing gallo for Melo.
      Don’t totally love it, although it might get us josh smith, who I also don’t exactly love, but maybe he pulls a Marion type season next to the right players, who knows

    126. Unreason

      jon abbey: OKC/SAS/MEM/LAC/GS/HOU all look really tough.

      I’m less sure of OKC and SAS than the others. If Westbrook regains his health fully I think they’ll be fine. SAS is an age defying mystery to me every year. If Kawhi Leonard stays on track, I guess they’ll be fine too. Kid was amazing in the finals.

    127. Juany8

      Also Jon is right, like with the pau gasol trade that Memphis improbably came out ahead in, Orlando won the Dwight Howard trade! Or more properly, golden state and the rockets won it lol.

    128. mokers

      Juany8: I thought the trade was alright at first, but now that Kevin Martin left for nothing and they still have Scott brooks messing shit up, Sam presti is suddenly looking pretty terrible. Don’t count out OKC, they still have 2 top 10 players on that team and ibaka and sefalosha are nice pieces, but they seriously bombed out in that trade. Wouldn’t give up on lamb turning out to be good thoygh

      Sticking with Brooks and Perkins is hurting them for sure. I still think if Westbrook is healthy, Presti doesn’t look as bad. And I thought they lost Martin mainly because the owner didn’t want to pay that extra tax.

    129. danvt

      Juany8: Also, how the hell are we already forgetting about San Antonio

      I thought their strong performance and IND’s 7 game loss said more about the Heat than anything. Think about who the Showtime Lakers had to beat. Think about who the 90′s Bulls had to get through. The Bad Boy Pistons. The 2004 Pistons! Any of those runner ups are better than 2012-2013 IND or SAS. With OKC fading SAS took the top slot but they were in no way a goliath and neither was effing IND. NYK is looking up.

      Juany8: I feel the same way about losing asik to get Howard I’m sure a lot of people here feel about losing gallo for Melo.

    130. danvt

      Oh yeah, on the second point. We drafted Gallo so not exactly like Asik. Hopefully Asik becomes the better player though, so, in that way I agree. I like him better than D12. Splitter might be able to beat D12 in a one on one if the refs call offensive fouls tightly.

    131. jon abbey

      Juany8:
      Also Jon is right, like with the pau gasol trade that Memphis improbably came out ahead in, Orlando won the Dwight Howard trade! Or more properly, golden state and the rockets won it lol.

      that one at least got LA a title, this one got the other teams involved absolutely nothing, not even a single playoff series win between the three of them.

    132. Spree8nyk8

      Is it possible for the Knicks to rescind their offer to Pablo and match on Copeland? I know it would be unlikely, I just wanted to know if it’s legal for them to do it.

    133. bidiong

      Spree8nyk8:
      Is it possible for the Knicks to rescind their offer to Pablo and match on Copeland?I know it would be unlikely, I just wanted to know if it’s legal for them to do it.

      Probably legal but you’ll never lock down another free agent again.

    134. Spree8nyk8

      Idk they could give Pablo a 2 year deal with the second year being player option and handshake him to improve him next year.

    135. Spree8nyk8

      I’d rather look like shit over a smart move, which I doubt is gonna be in many minds for long, than lose a player like Cope to a rival that will be in our path. If it were legal it would be done if it were up to me.

    136. Spree8nyk8

      If you truly are commited to winning it’s something that has to be done, otherwise you can’t say that you are. If you were you would be doing everything you could to win.

    137. Z-man

      All the action is exciting. Obviously it’s tough being on the sidelines when all this FA stuff is going down, but there’s always 2015!

    138. Z-man

      Can’t reneg on deals, sets terrible precedent. Especially since Cope is simply not worth it, he’s a back of the rotation player that is redundant on this team.

    139. Brian Cronin

      A. Yeah, you can’t do it. Your rep would be ruined.
      B. I believe you still can’t do it because the offer is apparently for more than the mini-MLE.

    140. Brian Cronin

      I think I sort of like the idea of Ryan Anderson more than Josh Smith for the Rockets. Harden, Parsons and Anderson surrounding Howard? Holy crap, that’d be awesome.

    141. massive

      Anyone think Frank Vogel, known for his #1 defense this year, is going to rely on Copeland to be a regular contributor? I wouldn’t be too worried about Cope.

    142. thenoblefacehumper

      “Source: D12 has landed in LA & told Lakers it’s 50-50 btwn them and the Rockets. He’s having 2nd thoughts about leaving $30 mill on table”

      That’s from Broussard. What the hell…

    143. mokers

      Lakers sign and trade dwight for Asik and Lin.
      Knicks send Chandler and Bargnani to LA for Gasol and Asik.

      Obviously way out there, but what do you do if you are the Lakers and Kobe is months away and you are still over the cap even without howard?

    144. Brian Cronin

      Anyone think Frank Vogel, known for his #1 defense this year, is going to rely on Copeland to be a regular contributor? I wouldn’t be too worried about Cope.

      They specifically let Psycho T go to free up money for Copeland, so yes, I do believe they intend for Cope to be a major part of the team. Remember, their offense can get stagnant at times and they saw what he did to their great defense last year (his performance against Indy is what convinced me he was legit on offense, so I am not surprised that it convinced them, as well).

    145. Z-man

      Brian Cronin:
      A. Yeah, you can’t do it. Your rep would be ruined.
      B. I believe you still can’t do it because the offer is apparently for more than the mini-MLE.

      Yeah, I wonder if IND submitted the offer pre-Prigioni deal, or afterwards just to prevent a reneg on the Knicks part…

    146. Brian Cronin

      Yeah, I wonder if IND submitted the offer pre-Prigioni deal, or afterwards just to prevent a reneg on the Knicks part…

      I could believe either. I definitely think it was designed to make sure the Knicks couldn’t match. I dunno about the timing, though.

    147. nicos

      D12 waffles again- if I’m Houston I might be asking myself if I really want him. The answer’s still probably yes but at this point he’s got to be regarded as one of the biggest head cases in the league.

    148. mokers

      Brian Cronin:
      I think I sort of like the idea of Ryan Anderson more than Josh Smith for the Rockets. Harden, Parsons and Anderson surrounding Howard? Holy crap, that’d be awesome.

      New Orleans suddenly doesn’t have a center with Lopez gone. but yeah, Ryan Anderson on that team looks really good.

    149. massive

      I’m not as optimistic about his chances, honestly. He’s a really good player on offense, but we thought the same thing about Landry Fields and Jeremy Lin before him. What happens when he builds a rap sheet and there’s a scouting report on him? I think he’s a less athletic version of Paul Pierce, personally. He’ll be good, but that was in a structured offense. Have you seen Indiana play offense? I’ve seen better offenses in the NCAA.

      Brian Cronin: They specifically let Psycho T go to free up money for Copeland, so yes, I do believe they intend for Cope to be a major part of the team. Remember, their offense can get stagnant at times and they saw what he did to their great defense last year (his performance against Indy is what convinced me he was legit on offense, so I am not surprised that it convinced them, as well).

    150. jon abbey

      Z-man:
      All the action is exciting. Obviously it’s tough being on the sidelines when all this FA stuff is going down, but there’s always 2015!

      how many of these huge deals work out well, and how many end up being albatrosses?

    151. Z-man

      jon abbey: how many of these huge deals work out well, and how many end up being albatrosses?

      Yeah, I wonder if the Rockets blog will have the same dialogue 3 years in as we have here…

    152. Unreason

      nicos:
      D12 waffles again- if I’m Houston I might be asking myself if I really want him.The answer’s still probably yes but at this point he’s got to be regarded as one of the biggest head cases in the league.

      I don’t like Howard and think he is a prima donna if not a head case, but this “waffling” is more a product of the media frenzy and people jumping the gun than him. Unless he told the Rockets he’d sign with them, which I don’t think he did, then he’s not back tracking. The reports were based on him not telling them they were out of the picture as he did with Dallas (others?) and seem to have been premature that’s all.

    153. lavor postell

      It would be just like the Lakers to get Howard to somehow come back even after all signs point to him going to Houston.

    154. bidiong

      I don’t think Melo is leaving. His wife has a career too and he wants to have sex so she’s probably making him stay unless he wants a divorce I’m sure she’s flaky take half his shit.

    155. Brian Cronin

      I think Howard is meeting with the Lakers just to tell them he’s leaving in person. It is being misrepresented as him giving them another chance.

    156. Brian Cronin

      I don’t think Melo is leaving. His wife has a career too and he wants to have sex so she’s probably making him stay unless he wants a divorce I’m sure she’s flaky take half his shit.

      I don’t think Melo will leave, either, but the idea of his wife being angry about a move to the entertainment capitol of the world seems silly.

    157. mokers

      Brian Cronin:
      I think Howard is meeting with the Lakers just to tell them he’s leaving in person. It is being misrepresented as him giving them another chance.

      I think the only person who said he was 50/50 was Broussard, so there is that too.

    158. bidiong

      Brian Cronin: I don’t think Melo will leave, either, but the idea of his wife being angry about a move to the entertainment capitol of the world seems silly.

      I highly doubt he’d be the Lakers top target in 2015.

    159. Brian Cronin

      I highly doubt he’d be the Lakers top target in 2015.

      Melo has an opt-out for 2014, right? I agree that he is not going to leave, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the Lakers were interested in him.

    160. lavor postell

      Random thought. Aren’t Baron Davis and Elton Brand supposed to be real chummy? If so maybe this is why the Knicks just paid Baron Davis to be our number 1 fan this past season.

    161. Z-man

      Well, Elton is a good guy and a good player with no ring, so maybe he comes here hungry?

    162. d-mar

      I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that the Houston Rockets and the Brooklyn Nets will be the most over hyped and underperforming teams in the NBA next season

    163. ess-dog

      Sounds like we’re kicking the tires on Delfino. He’d be a good fit as long as he’ll take the minimum.

    164. flossy

      d-mar:
      I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that the Houston Rockets and the Brooklyn Nets will be the most over hyped and underperforming teams in the NBA next season

      Why the Rockets? Assuming Howard is healthy, he, Harden, Parsons and whoever they can get for Asik and/or Lin (Ryan Anderson? Josh Smith?) have the makings of a really good team…

      We’ll see how it works out, but in the abstract… are there any two Knicks you wouldn’t immediately trade for Howard/Harden?

    165. JK47

      Knicks are looking at Delfino and also Francsico Garcia, both of whom could pretty much take on the Cope role without the Knicks losing too much. They’re both true small forwards and don’t have Cope’s size but we have Bargnani as a stretch 4 now.

      Both guys have a solid track record of consistent .360-ish 3-point shooting and both guys aren’t total zeroes on defense. I’d probably slightly favor Delfino but either of these guys would be reasonable vet min pickups.

    166. Brian Cronin

      I think the Rockets are planning on bringing Garcia back for the mini-MLE.

      Delfino, though, might actually be available for the vet minimum, which would be awesome.

    167. flossy

      ess-dog:
      Sounds like we’re kicking the tires on Delfino. He’d be a good fit as long as he’ll take the minimum.

      Hell, he’d be a good fit for all the mini-midlevel $ we have left over after Prigioni. I think he’s about on par with Copeland overall and obviously much more experienced and a better defender–seems to fit the bill for 9th man more than a high-volume shooter. He’s only a year older than Copeland too, crazy as that sounds.

    168. flossy

      Brian Cronin:
      I think the Rockets are planning on bringing Garcia back for the mini-MLE.

      Delfino, though, might actually be available for the vet minimum, which would be awesome.

      The Rockets have a mini MLE? I thought they were way under the cap (at the start of the offseason at least).

    169. Frank

      Yeah would love Delfino. Zwerlng mentioned Mikael Pietrus too who would be a nice pickup. He’s been injured the last few years which is why his numbers look awful. But when he’s healthy, he’s a pretty good 3 and D guy.

      I’m pretty glad we are in the eastern conference. Th West is going to be a bloodbath this year. Between SA, OKC, MEM, LAC, GSW, HOU any of those teams could honestly be the 1 seed (ok maybe not Memphis), and all of them would be at least the 2nd best team in the East. . But if Bogut is healthy GS is a really dangerous team that will be under the radar.

    170. BigBlueAL

      Would definitely be happy with either Delfino or Garcia. Still need to add a couple of decent bigs as well as a 3rd PG.

    171. JK47

      flossy: Hell, he’d be a good fit for all the mini-midlevel $ we have left over after Prigioni.I think he’s about on par with Copeland overall and obviously much more experienced and a better defender–seems to fit the bill for 9th man more than a high-volume shooter.He’s only a year older than Copeland too, crazy as that sounds.

      Yeah, agreed. I’m still holding out hope that at least one of Brand and K-Mart end up here for the vet minimum.

    172. Brian Cronin

      The Rockets have a mini MLE? I thought they were way under the cap (at the start of the offseason at least).

      Well, not the mini-MLE exactly, but the room exception. Which is $2.5 million.

    173. jon abbey

      CAA should lock up the K-Mart thing for us, we need two big guys at least and he should be one of them.

      it makes no sense to project HOU before they move Asik. the guy they get back there needs to be the third piece along with Howard/Harden if they are going to make a run at a conference title this year. Parsons is good, but they are weak behind those three right now, albeit with a fantastic trade chip in hand.

      their model needs to maybe be the Celtics of Garnett/Pierce/Allen, in which case Anderson should be the choice. that would give NO an interesting team too: Asik/Anthony Davis/someone/Gordon/Holliday with Tyreke Evans as sixth guy.

    174. Hubert

      MKinLA:
      If the Howard reports are true, you have to give Morey an unbelievable amount of credit.

      Just an amazing performance.

      He’s done a great job but if Sam Presti didn’t take stupid pills last summer he’d be looking at a team built around Jeremy Lin and Omar Asik making $30 mil next year.

      Got to give him credit, but he also caught an amazing break.

    175. Juany8

      flossy: Why the Rockets?Assuming Howard is healthy, he, Harden, Parsons and whoever they can get for Asik and/or Lin (Ryan Anderson?Josh Smith?) have the makings of a really good team…

      We’ll see how it works out, but in the abstract… are there any two Knicks you wouldn’t immediately trade for Howard/Harden?

      Rockets are gonna be closer to last year’s nuggets than any of the real contenders in my opinion. Depends on who exactly they get for asik and how they fill out the roster, but I do agree that their hype will probably exceed their performance this year, and doubly so for Brooklyn. On the other hand, moving harden off the ball a bit more and running a more traditional offense could be more sustainable in the playoffs. Harden is amazing roaming around off other good offensive players, and of course his pick and roll attack should go well. Depends on what Dwight Howard shows up…

    176. Juany8

      Hubert: He’s done a great job but if Sam Presti didn’t take stupid pills last summer he’d be looking at a team built around Jeremy Lin and Omar Asik making $30 mil next year.

      Got to give him credit, but he also caught an amazing break.

      On the other hand, he had pau gasol in hand and probably could have built a nice playoff team around him and signing asik. Not this good obviously, but I always had faith in morey, he’s had some bad luck in the past.

    177. Juany8

      Ugh I don’t know how to feel about all this, the rockets are suddenly relevant against and that’s exciting, but I hate the way harden and Howard play. Harden flops around too much for my taste, and Howard has been an absolute bitch the past few years. He hasn’t been all that good either, I don’t know that Howard was much better than asik last year

    178. Juany8

      flossy: Hell, he’d be a good fit for all the mini-midlevel $ we have left over after Prigioni.I think he’s about on par with Copeland overall and obviously much more experienced and a better defender–seems to fit the bill for 9th man more than a high-volume shooter.He’s only a year older than Copeland too, crazy as that sounds.

      Defino was a legit player last year, I’d be very happy if the Knicks managed to get him for cheap. He’ll be a nice backup at any wing position, and he held his own as a small ball 4 at times. I thought he was better than Novak

    179. Hubert

      I know all the arguments against Chris Copeland. I just feel we’re going to regret losing him. He’s going to kick ass for Indiana.

      Next time Grubwald uncovers a gem, could he just maybe give a team option on year 2?

    180. Brian Cronin

      Ugh I don’t know how to feel about all this, the rockets are suddenly relevant against and that’s exciting, but I hate the way harden and Howard play. Harden flops around too much for my taste, and Howard has been an absolute bitch the past few years. He hasn’t been all that good either, I don’t know that Howard was much better than asik last year

      Hehe, you really do sound like some Knick fans after the Melo deal. :)

    181. Hubert

      Juany8: On the other hand, he had pau gasol in hand and probably could have built a nice playoff team around him and signing asik. Not this good obviously, but I always had faith in morey, he’s had some bad luck in the past.

      Christ that’s another lucky break he got. It that trade isn’t vetoed he’s all in with Gasol and wasn’t he bringing Nene in too if that worked out?

      People are going to be worshipping at his altar and frankly he just got really lucky IMO.

      Smart guy. Great at ripping us off. But lucky as hell.

    182. Brian Cronin

      The worst thing about any big news period is that when you go searching for news, 90% of the stuff that gets turned up is fucking Bleacher Reports or Yahoo Contributor Network. Obviously, I know that there are plenty of good articles out there from people like these folks, but I also know that the vast majority of them are just shit shit shit shit. So it kills me that I have to sort through all this garbage just to get to some real news.

    183. Juany8

      Hubert: Christ that’s another lucky break he got. It that trade isn’t vetoed he’s all in with Gasol and wasn’t he bringing Nene in too if that worked out?

      People are going to be worshipping at his altar and frankly he just got really lucky IMO.

      Smart guy. Great at ripping us off. But lucky as hell.

      Not as lucky as Riley, Danny ainge, or Mitch kupchack :p no but seriously this has been his strategy from day one since Yao retired, a kind of pseudo tank where he kept recycling players while still remaining competive on a nightly basis. I’ve always had full confidence in morey as a gm, only time I lost a bit of hope was last year when it looked like the rockets had traded their 2 awesome point guards for just Jeremy Lin at the same price lol. Morey is gonna get a bit too muc credit, but then he was taking a lot of shit just a year ago for things that weren’t his fault, so it all balances out

    184. Juany8

      Also Hubert, you should see what morey has done to Sacramento the last few years. When they’re not trading all their good players for nothing, they’re signing our free agents and watching them suck. I still miss chuck Hayes, dude deserved better than Sacramento

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