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Tuesday, October 15, 2019

Knicks Morning News (2019.08.13)

  • [SNY Knicks] Knicks 2019-2020 season schedule released, will open up at Spurs on Oct. 23
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 4:35:54 PM)

    The Knicks 2019-2020 schedule has been released, and here’s some of the notable games to look out for.

  • [SNY Knicks] WATCH: Nate Robinson recalls special moment with former Knick Steve Francis
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 3:38:56 PM)

    Nate Robinson has played with many NBA All-Stars and legends during his time in the league. But throughout his career, Robinson remembers a special moment with former Knick Steve Francis during his time in New York.

  • [SNY Knicks] Here’s when the Knicks face LeBron James, Anthony Davis this season
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 11:18:33 AM)

    The NBA schedule for the 2019-2020 season will be released this afternoon, but there are a few dates that have already been found out, including the Knicks’ bout with the Lakers at MSG.

  • [SNY Knicks] Knicks sign undrafted guard Lamar Peters to non-guaranteed contract
    (Sunday, August 11, 2019 10:08:41 PM)

    The Knicks have signed guard Lamar Peters to a non-guaranteed training camp contract, as confirmed by SNY’s Ian Begley.

  • [SNY Knicks] Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson will sit out of Friday’s Team USA scrimmage as a precautionary measure
    (Friday, August 09, 2019 7:46:30 PM)

    Knicks fans received a bit of a scare on Thursday when it was learned that Mitchell Robinson has been dealing with a knee injury at Team USA World Cup training camp in Las Vegas.

  • [NYTimes] Knicks 2019-2020 season schedule released, will open up at Spurs on Oct. 23
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 4:35:54 PM)

    The Knicks 2019-2020 schedule has been released, and here’s some of the notable games to look out for.

  • [NYTimes] WATCH: Nate Robinson recalls special moment with former Knick Steve Francis
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 3:38:56 PM)

    Nate Robinson has played with many NBA All-Stars and legends during his time in the league. But throughout his career, Robinson remembers a special moment with former Knick Steve Francis during his time in New York.

  • [NYTimes] Here’s when the Knicks face LeBron James, Anthony Davis this season
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 11:18:33 AM)

    The NBA schedule for the 2019-2020 season will be released this afternoon, but there are a few dates that have already been found out, including the Knicks’ bout with the Lakers at MSG.

  • [NYTimes] Knicks sign undrafted guard Lamar Peters to non-guaranteed contract
    (Sunday, August 11, 2019 10:08:41 PM)

    The Knicks have signed guard Lamar Peters to a non-guaranteed training camp contract, as confirmed by SNY’s Ian Begley.

  • [NYTimes] Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson will sit out of Friday’s Team USA scrimmage as a precautionary measure
    (Friday, August 09, 2019 7:46:30 PM)

    Knicks fans received a bit of a scare on Thursday when it was learned that Mitchell Robinson has been dealing with a knee injury at Team USA World Cup training camp in Las Vegas.

  • [NBA] Knicks 2019-2020 season schedule released, will open up at Spurs on Oct. 23
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 4:35:54 PM)

    The Knicks 2019-2020 schedule has been released, and here’s some of the notable games to look out for.

  • [NBA] WATCH: Nate Robinson recalls special moment with former Knick Steve Francis
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 3:38:56 PM)

    Nate Robinson has played with many NBA All-Stars and legends during his time in the league. But throughout his career, Robinson remembers a special moment with former Knick Steve Francis during his time in New York.

  • [NBA] Here’s when the Knicks face LeBron James, Anthony Davis this season
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 11:18:33 AM)

    The NBA schedule for the 2019-2020 season will be released this afternoon, but there are a few dates that have already been found out, including the Knicks’ bout with the Lakers at MSG.

  • [NBA] Knicks sign undrafted guard Lamar Peters to non-guaranteed contract
    (Sunday, August 11, 2019 10:08:41 PM)

    The Knicks have signed guard Lamar Peters to a non-guaranteed training camp contract, as confirmed by SNY’s Ian Begley.

  • [NBA] Knicks’ Mitchell Robinson will sit out of Friday’s Team USA scrimmage as a precautionary measure
    (Friday, August 09, 2019 7:46:30 PM)

    Knicks fans received a bit of a scare on Thursday when it was learned that Mitchell Robinson has been dealing with a knee injury at Team USA World Cup training camp in Las Vegas.

  • [NYPost] 2020 Knicks schedule: Kyrie Irving’s New York reality comes early
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 11:15:56 AM)

    Five takeaways from the Knicks’ 2019-20 schedule: 1. That the Knicks are on ESPN and TNT a combined three times, were scratched from the Christmas Day schedule and play a road game on MLK Day is indicative of James Dolan’s franchise not being considered a glamor team. Of their three national TV appearances, the 17-65…

  • [NYPost] Knicks will host Celtics in home opener on Oct. 26
    (Monday, August 12, 2019 8:01:16 AM)

    The Knicks’ home opener will take place Saturday, Oct. 26 vs. the revamped Celtics at the Garden, The Post has learned. The immediate Celtics visit means ex-Knick center Enes Kanter will make an early Garden return. It also will give new Knicks forward Marcus Morris, who played for the Celtics, a chance to go against…

  • [NYPost] Where Knicks’ RJ Barrett stands in continued development
    (Sunday, August 11, 2019 5:20:11 PM)

    Knicks rookie RJ Barrett finished summer league in July with a flourish following a horrendous start and hopes he will carry that improvement over. However, it won’t be with Team Canada at the World Cup in China. Though his father, Rowan, is the general manager of Team Canada, Barrett elected to show up for the…

  • [NYPost] Trading Kristaps Porzingis was right move even with Durant snub
    (Friday, August 09, 2019 6:54:35 PM)

    Taken at face value, Kevin Durant’s silence-breaking remarks this week indicated the Knicks were never on his radar — just Brooklyn. Most NBA cognoscenti, however, were skeptical about that comment. But even if Knicks president Steve Mills was misled by Durant’s agent and manager Rich Kleiman, it doesn’t change the franchise’s view that it did…

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    231 comments on “Knicks Morning News (2019.08.13)

    1. Donnie Walsh

      You know it’s august when three of the Knicks Morning News articles are about Nate Robinson meeting Steve Francis at a basketball camp once.

    2. swiftandabundant

      I took a look at the schedule. There is an absolutely brutal stretch of 13 games in November/December. But I counted 27 games we should win, so I’m gonna make my prediction and say we win 30 games as I think we can be slightly better than the sum of our parts and I think we should see improvement from Knox, Mitch, and DSJ.

    3. TheClashFan

      Well, the Mets open up a three game series in Atlanta tonight. Can the run (15-2) continue? Which team’s lousy bullpen will be worse?

      For the Mets, its Seth Lugo and cross your fingers!

    4. Ntilakilla

      @3

      Edwin Diaz is so bad. He has no clue where the baseball is going when hurls it, especially when he hurls the slider. The trade to bring him and Cano for some of our best prospects is aiming to go down as even worse than a Scott Kazmir for Victor Zambrano type liability.

    5. TheClashFan

      @4
      I really wonder how Diaz was so successful last year and why his slider is so awful this year. There’s like no break to it; it just hangs there to be hit a long way… Probably safe to say that his 2018 year will end up his career year and he might never be close to that good again. Still, he shouldn’t be THIS bad. I mean, he’s awful, and his body language Sunday after the HR was not good.

      Other than the nice JD Davis deal, the rest of BVW’s marquee deals have all been pretty bad. And the long term effects of the Cano deal are potentially awful. And, they’ve got Lowry for another year and Familia for 2 more!

    6. DS

      You know it’s august when three of the Knicks Morning News articles are about Nate Robinson meeting Steve Francis at a basketball camp once.

      This year’s team sorta reminds me a lot of that group that Larry Brown coached. A bunch of unproven, 15-20ppg scorers about whom Isiah Thomas would feel very optimistic with Marcus Morris and Taj Gibson being the Antonio Davis and Malik Rose type vets who are supposed to magically turn the young guys into winners.

    7. Ntilakilla

      I really wonder how Diaz was so successful last year and why his slider is so awful this year. There’s like no break to it; it just hangs there to be hit a long way… Probably safe to say that his 2018 year will end up his career year and he might never be close to that good again. Still, he shouldn’t be THIS bad. I mean, he’s awful, and his body language Sunday after the HR was not good.

      I don’t find it coincidental that Noah Syndergaard had a similar problem commanding his wipeout Warthen slider this year as well. He blamed a supposedly new baseball design for making it harder to grip and control. He and several other pitchers blamed a supposedly new design and feel for making it harder to grip and control the baseball. Last year Noah threw his slider with a 3.69″ of average vertical movement. So far this year that same slider has -0.31″ of average vertical movement. That’s a huge difference. I haven’t look into Diaz’s numbers but I am willing to bet there is similar dynamic at play here.

    8. KnickfaninNJ

      I read or heard somewhere that Tanaka on the Yankees also feels the actual ball is different. He had to change his grip to accomodate the new ball.

    9. Totes McGoats as Totes McGoats

      @4 & 5
      Oof! Edwin Diaz. The stuff is still there..you can see it. I think it’s mental with him. Thank God the starting pitching has rebounded. Who would’ve thought the Mets would be in this position sans Cespedes, Lowrie, Nimmo, and Cano- and with a crappy bullpen? As a Mets fan, I’m happy to see the guys playing hard for Callaway..but sheesh! It’s like Dolan’s Razor has crossed over and effected another blue and orange clad NY team

      DAMMIT JIM!

    10. The Ghost of Ted Nelson

      This year’s team sorta reminds me a lot of that group that Larry Brown coached. A bunch of unproven, 15-20ppg scorers about whom Isiah Thomas would feel very optimistic with Marcus Morris and Taj Gibson being the Antonio Davis and Malik Rose type vets who are supposed to magically turn the young guys into winners.

      Yes, we’ve recreated the 23 win Larry Brown team by piling over-paid garbage on top of the few promising young players the team has ever had. Nice!

      Gibson = Antonio Davis
      Morris = Malik Rose
      Robinson = David Lee
      Barrett = Channing Frye
      Knox = Qyntel Woods
      Randle = Eddy Curry
      Smith jr = Jamal Crawford
      Ellington = Allan Houston
      Portis = Mo Taylor

    11. JK47

      It’s probably time to send Diaz down to Syracuse to sort himself out. He’s so bad you can’t really use him in anything other than mopup duty right now. He has given up runs in 5 of his last 6 outings.

    12. GoNYGoNYGo - Dolan must sell

      @8 – I heard that before the all-star game. Apparently the seams are tighter and don’t protrude as much which creates less spin on the pitch and less drag when the ball is hit in the air – a double whammy.

      And not that any Met fan wants to hear from a rabid Yankee fan, but Diaz is an enigma. Totes, you’re right about it being in Diaz’s head and the metrics back you up. His velo, spin rate, mix of pitches are all still there – and elite. But he’s getting hit very hard: Statcast

      Statcast metrics

    13. Hubert

      Gibson = Antonio Davis
      Morris = Malik Rose
      Robinson = David Lee
      Barrett = Channing Frye
      Knox = Qyntel Woods
      Randle = Eddy Curry
      Smith jr = Jamal Crawford
      Ellington = Allan Houston
      Portis = Mo Taylor

      I just became ill.

    14. swiftandabundant

      I’m sorry but this comparison is ridiculous.

      Channing Frye was a late first round pick.
      Robinson is WAY better on defense than David Lee ever was.
      Ellington is getting paid a fraction of what Allan Houston was getting paid. Wasn’t he all ready hurt and not playing by that time?

      Also who is Peyton? Who is Trier in this analogy?

    15. JK47

      The Larry Brown Knicks were full of players who were useful in other circumstances but hopelessly awful when paired together. Like you can’t really run a Zach Randolph/Eddy Curry frontcourt out there with some David Lee sprinkled in and expect any degree of rim protection. Eddy Curry was probably the best rim protector on that team, which is, uh, something.

    16. Donnie Walsh

      swiftandabundant
      August 13, 2019 at 4:20 pm
      I’m sorry but this comparison is ridiculous.

      Channing Frye was a late first round pick.
      Robinson is WAY better on defense than David Lee ever was.
      Ellington is getting paid a fraction of what Allan Houston was getting paid. Wasn’t he all ready hurt and not playing by that time?

      Also who is Peyton? Who is Trier in this analogy?

      I mean, it’s august, so ridiculous analogies are fair game.

      Houston was retired by then, but luckily we can slide Wayne Ellington into the Quinton Richardson slot.

      And Trier would be Nate Robinson.

      And Peyton would be Stephon.

      Too easy.

    17. DS

      I’m sorry but this comparison is ridiculous.

      Channing Frye was a late first round pick.
      Robinson is WAY better on defense than David Lee ever was.
      Ellington is getting paid a fraction of what Allan Houston was getting paid. Wasn’t he all ready hurt and not playing by that time?

      Also who is Peyton? Who is Trier in this analogy?

      I don’t think he’s being too serious with this post: but Channing Frye was a top 10 pick; I think he’s just saying Lee and Robinson were both picked in the 30’s and turned out to the best on team, according to advanced stats. Houston was, indeed, not on that team.

      The Larry Brown Knicks were full of players who were useful in other circumstances but hopelessly awful when paired together. Like you can’t really run a Zach Randolph/Eddy Curry frontcourt out there with some David Lee sprinkled in and expect any degree of rim protection. Eddy Curry was probably the best rim protector on that team, which is, uh, something.

      I believe Larry Brown was gone for at least a year by the time Z-Bo arrived but your point is well-taken. Q-Rich, Crawford, Ariza, Z-Bo, Lee all had places on very good teams… it also reminds me that MSG had an annoying campaign that year in which hipster actors were interviewed about the Knicks. In one, this dude said something to the effect of, “Eddy Curry, Zach Randolph, David Lee. That’s a formidable front court. Do you know what that word means, Boston? [They won the title that year] Formidable. Look it up.”

    18. swiftandabundant

      I think the thing that threw me off was Ellington = Alan Houston. I mean, Alan Houston was getting paid like 20 million a year and not playing at all at that point.

    19. DS

      I think the thing that threw me off was Ellington = Alan Houston. I mean, Alan Houston was getting paid like 20 million a year and not playing at all at that point.

      It’s the shooting stroke, I’m guessing.

    20. JK47

      That’s right, Z-Bo didn’t come until actually two years after the Larry Brown team, which amazingly remained pretty intact. Two years after the Larry Brown debacle it was still Steph, Crawford, Q-Rich, Curry and the gang stinking out the joint night after night.

      The Larry Brown team won 23 games. The two years later team with Z-Bo won 23 games. Sisyphus had better luck with the boulder.

    21. Hubert

      I’m sorry but this comparison is ridiculous.

      It’s not perfect but there is enough to have a good laugh and cry about on a summer Tuesday.

    22. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      yes, this team is like that team in that there are a lot of bad players and will lose a lot of games, next topic

    23. Z-man

      Gibson = Antonio Davis
      Morris = Malik Rose
      Robinson = David Lee
      Barrett = Channing Frye
      Knox = Qyntel Woods
      Randle = Eddy Curry
      Smith jr = Jamal Crawford
      Ellington = Allan Houston
      Portis = Mo Taylor

      I know you’re just trying to have fun, but it’s a ridiculous comparison.
      Gibson was very productive last year at age 33, Davis was a shell of a player at age 37.
      Morris is better than Malik, who never had a positive VORP after we acquired him.
      Robinson had double the WS48 compared to Lee and is a two-way player.
      Barrett is totally unknown at this point.
      Knox vs. Woods…got me there for now, but at least Knox has a chance to improve, Woods was 24.
      Randle is WAY better than Curry.
      Jamal was better than DSjr. but was also 25.
      Houston didn’t play a minute.
      Portis is 24, Mo Taylor was 29.

    24. Z-man

      I would take DSjr over Nate, Iggy over Ariza and Payton over Marbury. Ariza obviously got a lot better later, but he was nothing special on the Knicks…better than Ntilikina and Knox, but that’s a pretty low bar.

    25. Hubert

      yes, this team is like that team in that there are a lot of bad players and will lose a lot of games, next topic

      Don’t tempt Satan.

    26. The Glass Half Rebuilt

      When you can’t just LOLKnicks your way to a comparison sometimes you just reach and hope that LOLKnicks is solid enough reasoning that nobody dives deep. The comparison is obviously bad, but let’s not let logic get in the way. The Knicks will likely miss the playoffs unless RJ Barrett hits the ground running like Tatum did, but let’s not pretend like RJ Barrett isn’t a blue chip prospect. There are reasons to be excited about the youth on this team even if you aren’t a fan of the front office or head coach. Maybe those three get canned and Dolan makes a godfather offer to Toronto or OKC for Ujiri/Presti. I know I’d easily offer a first round choice for either one of those guys.

    27. danvt

      Hey Fellas. Long time no see. I gonna take the over on the 28 wins. That seems an easy bar to reach. Just trying to win will be the major factor there. It would be perfectly in line with the organization to win 33 games and pick 11th or something.

      If you squint you can see a strategy. Randle, Morris, Peyton, Gibson, Ellington, and Bullock would have been viewed as good moves for another front office. That is, one with, actual foundational players. If LAL had those guys around LBJ and AD there would be great optimism, I think. For the Knicks, they’re hoping a confluence of good players can compete in a league dominated by superstars. It’s not a terrible idea. Maybe these aren’t the right “good” players and this isn’t the right situation to try it and the Knicks were pushed into the strategy after avowing another, but it is interesting to try to compete with depth and hopefully unselfish team play with defense. Of course, one year contracts may beget the opposite.

      So, I’ll take the over and say 33 wins. Beyond that, I’ll hope that there’s a surprise or two and we get to .500 Like RJ flashing all star potential…

    28. Hubert

      That seems an easy bar to reach.

      There are no easy bars around here, dan. You should know that.

      28 actually strikes me as a perfect o/u and would probably be my prediction. 28 wins and the #6 pick.

    29. Z-man

      ZMAN is delusional every season.. let us all remember Ron Baker

      Yeah, imagine rooting for an undrafted FA to make good. And don’t forget how badly I wanted Kay Felder…

      But at least I’m not you…wrong about pretty much everything.

    30. Z-man

      Let me rephrase…at this point, I would take the potential of DSjr over the reality of Nate. Nate was a terrible defender and passer, and not a great shooter either. But I will always be thankful for buying 8th row center court seats to take my son to see Nate go off for 45 vs. Portland in an electrifying OT loss.

    31. dtrickey

      Nate was a terrible defender and passer, and not a great shooter either.

      Hey now. Let’s not forget that Nate was a 3x dunk contest winner. I mean sure that is in no way a valid indicia of a good player, but I mean he still did it.

      Looking back on that Larry Brown team and it is such a head scratcher anyone thought that team would do anything.

    32. Z-man

      Isaiah Thomas (pre-injury) was what we all hoped Nate would become. He just never turned the corner.

    33. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      not trying to be pedantic but Isiah and Isaiah luckily have different spellings so we never confuse the tiny warrior fucked over by Danny Ainge with the dipshit sexual harasser

    34. Bo Nateman

      The video did have a pic of Bargnani.
      On a positive note, MSG was an early catalyst for the #metoo movement.

    35. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      All I know is that near the start of that video I saw a picture of a young Steven Mills. Maybe that’s the problem?

    36. JK47

      Steve Mills is a symptom of the disease. The disease is James Dolan.

      I hope the fedora’d one reads this blog. Fuck you Guitar Jimmy! I’m gonna get plastered and heckle your shitty band next time you make the mistake of playing at the Troubador. Consider your day ruined in advance.

    37. Donnie Walsh

      You can’t talk about the 21st century Knicks without talking about the Bargnani trade and all of the stupid shit that Jackson did.

      The video is called “Collapse”, not “The Chaos That Ensued Post-Collapse”.

      (Perhaps there are a few sequels in the works)

    38. Donnie Walsh

      Steve Mills is a symptom of the disease. The disease is James Dolan.

      I have it from a pretty reliable source that when Allan Houston took that shot against the Heat in game 5 in 1999, and the ball bounced off the front of the rim, time stood still and both God and the Devil appeared and put Houston through a Jobian test of his faith. Houston was weak and went with the Devil’s offer to have the ball bounce up and in, despite it being against God’s greater plan for the universe, leading God to smite the Knicks and it’s fan base. Mills and Dolan are merely mortal punching bags for Houston’s Hubris.

    39. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      The video is called “Collapse”, not “The Chaos That Ensued Post-Collapse”.

      It feels more like a quadruple-dip recession to me

    40. Sly Wi-yums

      Kool Video Jowles.

      Reminds me that I lived through all those details, but selectively forgot many.

      For what its worth, Marv Albert was an integral part of my Knicks experience. I just finished laughing about “Van Gundy took the punch!”

      I miss Marv.

    41. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      There’s a picture of what KP’s body looks like these days on Ian Begley’s timeline. He’s starting to fill out and get a LOT stronger.

    42. Z-man

      Well Jeff McNeil is hitting the IL it looks like so that’s a wrap for NYM.

      Diagnosed with a mild hamstring strain, sounds like he could be back in a couple of weeks.

    43. Hubert

      I have it from a pretty reliable source that when Allan Houston took that shot against the Heat in game 5 in 1999, and the ball bounced off the front of the rim, time stood still and both God and the Devil appeared and put Houston through a Jobian test of his faith. Houston was weak and went with the Devil’s offer to have the ball bounce up and in, despite it being against God’s greater plan for the universe, leading God to smite the Knicks and it’s fan base. Mills and Dolan are merely mortal punching bags for Houston’s Hubris.

      Hmm. Might have been worth it. That’s probably a top 5 Knicks moment of my life.

      That, LJ’s 4, Patrick’s putback slam, Patrick’s 3 at Boston Garden… I can’t even think of a 5th, tbh. It should be something that Bernard King did but I was too young.

    44. alsep73

      Apparently, Terry Rozier was on the verge of taking the contract we gave Elfrid Payton when Phoenix and then Charlotte offered him much bigger/longer deals.

      I wouldn’t have wanted Rozier on the contract Charlotte gave him, but for the same money as Payton, as essentially a one-year deal? Thoughts?

    45. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      I wouldn’t have wanted Rozier on the contract Charlotte gave him, but for the same money as Payton, as essentially a one-year deal? Thoughts?

      Rozier makes more sense for a team with a glaring hole at PG so long as the team doesn’t have huge holes elsewhere. RAPM and PIPM have him around league average despite his horrendous shooting and low assist rate. If he were an elite scorer, you could look past the 6 AST per 100 poss. number, and if he were an elite passer, you could look past the ~.500 TS%. In AST/100, he ranked 43rd out of 72 pure guards (PG/SG, no time at wing) over 1500 MP. Many of the players around him were taller SGs.

      The defense is anecdotally strong but he appears to be an above-average defender. The advanced metrics are all over the place on that side. I suspect that the Celtics are going to fall off a cliff this season (and I can’t fucking wait).

    46. JK47

      Rozier did have the one nice season in 2017-2018 and looked like he was an emerging player. But then he kind of regressed last year which apparently was somehow Kyrie Irving’s fault if you talk to a C’s fan. So I dunno. On Elfrid’s deal that would have been a pretty decent signing but Rozier is not really very point guard-y. Maybe Payton is the better fit.

    47. danvt

      Hubert,
      My thought at post number 29 was that just having a strategy that involves going all out would mean a pretty substantial increase in win totals. I also, btw, feel Knox will benefit from that strategy and his #s will start to look better. He was a significant cog in that tank last year and I don’t think it was fair to him. I’m not saying the strategy nets playoffs or is better for the future than one more tank year I’m just trying to extrapolate a possible win total. I agree that 28 is a good O/U number and think that Morris and Randle are significant upgrades, the bench is upgraded, the three pick will be in uniform, and Mitch will start. Could that make for a 16 win improvement? I think possibly that or better and I’m down to see a season where I’m rooting for wins as opposed to seeing Charley Brown try to kick the football. You do make a good point that an NBA game is tough to win…
      Not trying to seem like a soothsayer. Just a fan tired of losing on purpose and expressing the tiniest amount of optimism that something might go our way for once.

      As to the historical point brought up by Jowlsee’s video. At least we can say that the books make sense and that we have our first round picks.

    48. Z-man

      I think Elfrid is a nice player at the price we got him for. You don’t just stumble into 5 consecutive triple-doubles. He’s an above-average passer and an exceptional rebounder for a PG. In fact, he might have been a good player to throw a 3-year team option deal at the same AAV since he would probably be reasonably easy to trade at that money.

    49. d-mar

      That, LJ’s 4, Patrick’s putback slam, Patrick’s 3 at Boston Garden… I can’t even think of a 5th, tbh. It should be something that Bernard King did but I was too young.

      It was a meaningless game but David Lee’s tip in with .01 on the clock to beat Charlotte was pretty damn exciting (and I was there to experience it)

    50. Owen

      Speaking of swole, someone posted a photo of Randle. Dude is absolutely ripped. I am bumping my win projection to 29 on that alone.

    51. Donnie Walsh

      Hmm. Might have been worth it.

      Perhaps a poll question is in order:

      1) Allan Houston’s game 5 shot bounces in and history stays as it is

      2) Allan Houston’s shot bounces out and God doesn’t smite the Knicks

      For me, the elation of that shot and the ensuing run to the finals has worn off. I could survive 7 years of famine, but now we are in year 20. We’re in a perpetual state of eating our cow before we use it to grow a herd. I was at the LJ 4 point game, and I watched Duncan and Robinson celebrate their first title mere feet from me as I stood and applauded Spre as he and the other Knicks walked dejectedly off the court. I thought it was the start of a new era of eastern domination by the Knicks. Not the beginning of the end of my fandom.

    52. Hubert

      Joseph Tsai was already the defecto owner of the nets, but his assumption of majority ownership is going to push him even more to the front. That’s terrible news for us, who will suffer tremendously by comparison.

      Where have you gone, Mikhail Prokhorov?

    53. Z-man

      The Knicks are in a perfect situation for the FO, but it might be a pressure-cooker for Fiz. Expectations are pretty low and there is no pressure to make a monumental decision i.e. locking up KP for 4+ years. Probably the biggest sources of pressure are the Nets and Dallas for obvious reasons, but beyond that, you have a combination of:

      *hungry neophytes (Mitch, Knox, RJ, DSjr, Frank, Trier, Dotson, Iggy)
      *hungry young vets looking to take the next step (Randle, Payton, Portis)
      *experienced role players with professional attitudes (Morris, Ellington, Gibson, Bullock)

      I think a brilliant coach could work some magic with this group. If they perform only up to expectations or worse, Fiz might not make it to next season. Hopefully he shows more imagination than last year.

    54. Hubert

      For me, the elation of that shot and the ensuing run to the finals has worn off.

      Watch it again. I just did. Biggest Knicks-related smile I’ve had in a long time.

    55. geo

      There’s a picture of what KP’s body looks like these days on Ian Begley’s timeline. He’s starting to fill out and get a LOT stronger.

      still skeptical of his limbs and mechanisms of movement…before he got hurt, seemed every time he came down from a dunk his knee(s) would bend at odd angles…he’s just got some crazy long levers that may not be well suited for extreme exertion…

      kind of like how these monster sized dudes the yanks are putting together on their roster have a lot of recurring injuries…despite obvious size and strength, athletes are still dependent on small joints, ligaments, tendons and cartilage to keep it all working…

    56. Ingmarrrr

      @58 Starks’s dunk against the Bulls in the 1993 playoffs is tops for me. They lost the series but I was at the garden for that one and it was incredible.

    57. Hubert

      @58 Starks’s dunk against the Bulls in the 1993 playoffs is tops for me. They lost the series but I was at the garden for that one and it was incredible.

      Jesus. Of course. It’s probably #1. I was at that game, too. Not sure how I omitted that.

    58. Sly Wi-yums

      The best part of the “dunk” at the time is that it sealed the game and a 2-0 lead against the bulls. Everyone was sure we were going to the finals.

    59. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      I think the Celtics are probably going to be better than people here think despite the significant loss of Horford, but I’m not so sure they are a finished product yet anyway. I think Ainge will probably make at least one more move for a big man. I consider the loss of Irving to be practically a non event. IMO, Kemba is a very good player and will shine in Boston.

      IMO Rozier is an “ok” player, but he probably fits better on a team that’s going to use ball movement, player movement, and multiple playmakers to generate good shots. I don’t think he’d fit on this Knicks team. These Knicks are allergic to all 3 of those. Their goal is individual shot creation and isolation (in other words we don’t know how to play basketball and he needs to be on a team with a management and coach that does, same as Frank).

    60. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      still skeptical of his limbs and mechanisms of movement…before he got hurt, seemed every time he came down from a dunk his knee(s) would bend at odd angles…he’s just got some crazy long levers that may not be well suited for extreme exertion…

      That was Phil’s view (mine also). He looked injury prone before he even started to actually prove the point. Supposedly, that’s exactly what they’ve been working on in Dallas. They are trying to change his body over and above just adding weight and muscle so he can take contact better and be less likely to land awkwardly. We’ll see. To me, that’s the whole ball of wax. I have no doubt he has the talent to be a two way impact player and big star in this league “IF” he can stay healthy and take the pounding.

    61. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Melo is working out with Nets players?

      Melo to the Nets would be so entertaining. I really hope it happens. That would really lock in my interest in taking the under for Brooklyn.

    62. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      The worry about taking the Nets’ under is that (1) Durant will have zero effect on this year’s O/U, so you can’t bank on hopelessly optimistic betting driving the line up and (2) Melo could be jettisoned as quickly as he was in Houston, so his minutes could go to someone that won’t put up a -6.0 BPM and drag every lineup into the gutter.

      I’m curious as to where it’ll end up. The only time I’ve seriously considered betting actual money on an 82-game season was that 2013-14 Knicks team at 48.5 and the 2014-15 team at 40.5. Those that bet the over should’ve rethought ever betting on sports again.

    63. Bruno Almeida

      The Nets don’t even have an open roster slot for Melo, I really doubt they’re cutting anyone for him.

    64. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      I could see teams signing a bunch of rookie/vet minimums and two-way contracts and then saying publicly, “Hey, I, uh… no room for Melo on the roster, but if we had an open slot, boy oh boy!

    65. bobneptune

      still skeptical of his limbs and mechanisms of movement…before he got hurt, seemed every time he came down from a dunk his knee(s) would bend at odd angles…he’s just got some crazy long levers that may not be well suited for extreme exertion…

      Lol at him looking “cut” in that stupid photo. Any 13 yr old working out for a JV football team with 85lbs on a bar curling with his arms tensed at a 90 degree angle looks more pumped than this praying mantis. Christ, I’m 67 years old and haven’t picked up a weight heavier than 15 lbs in 48 years and I have a better “cut” than that!

      The man has had nothing better to do than work out in a gym for 18 bloody months as a 23 yr old with max testosterone flowing through his veins and THAT’s what he looks like???

      Of course, we get him twice the first 3 weeks of the season when he won’t be suffering from fatigue/anemia/ and he’ll probably go for 38 whatever cuz Knicks. But I do hope MR sends a few of his 3 balls into the 8th row and Randall pummels him down low.

      Hey … we might suck, but we gave him the keys to the castle and he spit in our faces…. bleep him.

    66. The Glass Half Rebuilt

      Has anybody seen Julius Randle’s workouts/body this summer? He looks like James Harden’s big little brother these days. Not saying that he’s going to turn into the offensive force James Harden is, but he’s already a good player and seems to be refining his body and skills. If he can keep that efficiency/usage combination going he might have a case to be an all star this season.

    67. DRed

      Z-Bo gave us that priceless sequence against Toronto where he almost committed a backcourt violation after losing his dribble on the perimeter before recovering and air-balling a 3

    68. Owen

      The Glass – I mentioned it above. I don’t know how to pull the link off Twitter on my phone but his physique is truly impressive.

      Bob- not going to lie, I enjoyed that takedown. I mean, does KP even really lift?

    69. TheClashFan

      Ah, man. Seth Lugo taking his turn melting down out of the Mets bullpen…

      Why didn’t Calloway just let Matz come out for the 7th? He was dealing, and he batted in the top of the inning (singled)!

    70. TheClashFan

      Despite all that, the Mets are rallying in the 9th, and the Braves just botched a potential game ending double play!

      Edit, yeah, and Matz had retired 14 Braves in a row!

    71. TheClashFan

      Well, another “Mickey Special,” where he makes some puzzling moves… the Braves tried to hand the game back, but no go.

    72. Hubert

      That was Phil’s view (mine also). He looked injury prone before he even started to actually prove the point. Supposedly, that’s exactly what they’ve been working on in Dallas. They are trying to change his body over and above just adding weight and muscle so he can take contact better and be less likely to land awkwardly. We’ll see. To me, that’s the whole ball of wax. I have no doubt he has the talent to be a two way impact player and big star in this league “IF” he can stay healthy and take the pounding.

      Didn’t the same thing happen every year here, though? I thought he was diagnosed anemic. He’d start every year beefed up and strong from his off season workout, dominate for 8 weeks until he burned off all the muscle because he’s anemic, and then get hurt and/or drop off a cliff. That was the KP cycle I grew accustomed to.

    73. Hubert

      Bob- not going to lie, I enjoyed that takedown. I mean, does KP even really lift?

      Seconded.

      Bob is so good at takedowns I even enjoy when he’s doing it to me.

    74. Ntilakilla

      Nothing to see here folks. Nothing to see…everything’s fine.

      Epstein autopsy: Among the bones broken in Epstein’s neck was the hyoid bone, which in men is near the Adam’s apple…. Such breaks… are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said. https://t.co/neiA9TzpuL— kendis gibson (@kendisgibson) August 15, 2019

    75. bobneptune

      Didn’t the same thing happen every year here, though? I thought he was diagnosed anemic. He’d start every year beefed up and strong from his off season workout, dominate for 8 weeks until he burned off all the muscle because he’s anemic, and then get hurt and/or drop off a cliff. That was the KP cycle I grew accustomed to.

      It doesn’t work quite that way :-)

      You don’t lose muscle mass because of anemia, you just can’t perfuse peripheral tissue sufficiently due to lower than normal oxygen carrying capacity which causes fatigue. There has been a pretty good solution to most anemias since about 1990 known as HrEpo (human recombinant erythropoeitin).

      It is a hormone that is produced by the kidney that signals your bone marrow to amp up the production of red blood cells. It has been used on cancer patients, AIDS patients , competitive athletes (read Tour de France) and any other normal person that wants to get a competitive edge in any endurance sport.

      I used to give 10,000 IU every other day to my top race horses for decades. I’m sure KP’s doctors knew of it so I’m guessing he doesn’t have a lingering anemia.

    76. Hubert

      Hmm, I wonder if those ellipses in the tweet you posted, Ntilakilla, are covering up anything important. Let’s take a look:

      Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said.

      Ah, so now we know he could have hung himself or he could have been strangled. Wow, that’s such an illuminating piece of information.

    77. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      The worry about taking the Nets’ under is that (1) Durant will have zero effect on this year’s O/U, so you can’t bank on hopelessly optimistic betting driving the line up and

      My thinking has nothing to do with Durant. His absence is clearly already built into the line.

      My view is that they gave up a few very good role players to create that space. IMO, those players added more wins than people realize. I also think Irving is overrated and won’t add as much as people think. Offsetting that is what I would call “competence risk”. By that I mean, the Nets front office and coaching is so good, they may get more out of these players than I think or they may make another deal/signing that adds value that I can’t foresee now. If you throw Melo into the mix, I can’t see him being anything other than a negative for as long as it lasts regardless of whether he moves the line up or not. It’s a close call. I don’t have to make the decision yet, but the Nets are one of the teams on my radar.

    78. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Hey … we might suck, but we gave him the keys to the castle and he spit in our faces…. bleep him.

      We gave him the keys to the castle, Hardaway, Mudiay, Hezonja, Trey Burke, Kanter etc… and he spit in out faces.

    79. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      @89

      I think when you are very young, very thin and very weak relative to the other players, the game takes a much greater physical toll, you get more nagging injuries, and you wear down faster than more physically mature men. That goes double for big men.

      In the last season I’m not sure how much was him wearing down and how much was the fact that teams started game planning against him, double teaming him, and taking away the things he wanted to do. It was probably both and he was nowhere near ready for it. He had no idea what to do. He was just starting to figure it out when he got hurt.

      It’s a shame for him he got hurt at that point. It was a chance for him to learn how to play out of those situations even when there wasn’t a clear #2 or #3 option on the court with him. He shouldn’t have that problem in Dallas with Doncic. KP is more of a #1a or #2 option. With Doncic, that will be his role.

      I’m very curious to see how many minutes per game he plays for Dallas once he gets back into the swing of things. He’s been out a LONG time. I don’t think he’s going to come back guns blazing in the beginning. Most of these ACL guys take half a season to start playing well again. Even when/if he’s back to 100%, they may play him fewer minutes than the Knicks until he gets still stronger just to avoid injuries.

    80. Hubert

      The Nets O/U is 45.5. They may have given up some decent role players but they’re also getting LeVert back and he was outstanding down the stretch. I think he’s going to take a big step forward next season. Jarrett Allen might, too. They have a solid backup for Kyrie in Dinwiddie, they’re two deep at center with Jordan and Allen (both of whom bring something totally different to the table), and they have an army of flexible wings in LeVert, Harris, Temple, Prince, Kurucs, and Chandler.

      Irving is only overrated if you’re talking about him as first team all NBA. He’s an incredible player and a big step up from Russell.

      I’ll take the over on that, even if they’re dumb enough to add Melo.

    81. Hubert

      Question for the board:

      I already made my nets envy quite clear around the middle of last season. I love the players they have and the system they implement. I admire their coach and GM. And now they have arguably one of the best owners in sports. They’re everything I wish the Knicks would be. I’m never going to switch and become a Nets fan, but I’m on the fence about whether or not I will enjoy watching them next season.

      How many of you are ambivalent enough about the Nets to tune in just to be entertained by decent basketball?

      Actually the more I think about it… maybe I am thinking about switching on a level I don’t even realize I am thinking.

    82. JK47

      I’m a Porzingis skeptic but even I have to admit holding onto him and trying to build around him was probably a better idea than kicking the can down the road every year with a bunch of 1+1 contracts in the vain hopes that Giannis or whatever lust object gets fooled by the 32 wins compiled by the Bobby Portis/Wayne Ellington Experience.

      The Razor says KP stays healthy and becomes a .200+ WS48 superstar in Dallas, and the Razor is rarely wrong.

    83. JK47

      Ah, so now we know he could have hung himself or he could have been strangled. Wow, that’s such an illuminating piece of information.

      Either way this is somehow good news for Bernie Sanders

    84. swiftandabundant

      I don’t know if Porzingis will turn into a true superstar or not. What I do know will happen is that since we play Dallas twice at the beginning of the season, Porzingis will probably roast us in both of those games since its early in the season and he’ll be in true early season form. And the media will blast us for letting him go but then when he does fall off a cliff in January, there won’t be a single follow up to that narrative.

    85. swiftandabundant

      What is everyone’s starting line up for the start of the season?

      My guess is Peyton, Barrett, Morris, Randle, Mitch.

      This gives Barrett and Mitch 3 solid veterans to be in the starting line up with them. 3 point shooting is a bit shaky but I think the passing and rebounding with this unit is not bad.

    86. alsep73

      I think DSJ has the initial advantage on the PG starting spot, because he’s under more favorable contract terms long-term, has higher upside, and was part of the KP trade. But I also wouldn’t be surprised if Payton outplays him in camp and starts early in the season.

      Meanwhile, Boogie tore his ACL. Woof. I didn’t want to sign that guy, but at this point I just feel bad for him with all those injuries.

    87. Ntilakilla

      Ah, so now we know he could have hung himself or he could have been strangled.

      False equivalency.

      Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said

      I deduct 10 logic points.

    88. Ntilakilla

      Either way this is somehow good news for Bernie Sanders

      Really? You think so? Let’s hope.

    89. rama got that Fizdale Magic

      I never thought “sympathy for Boogie Cousins” would be something I’d experience, but here we are. Really bad luck.

      As for KP, I was one of the few (with Strat) who thought the board was underrating him. My single concern when it came to a max was his health. I don’t know if his tendency to tire and fade is something he’ll grow out of, or whether he can strengthen his legs and change his technique so as to avoid further major leg injuries. If he does, though, he’s going to be a top-20 player in the league. I’m going to hate seeing him destroy teams – including ours – for the next few years.

      He does seem like a total tool, though, and being advised by your brother is pretty dumb at this level unless your brother happens to be an experienced agent. But I’m still bummed he’s gone, even though it was a good trade and we pretty much had to do it.

      Of course, once we sign AD to pair up front with Skynet, I’ll feel better about it all.

    90. Nick C.

      Ah, so now we know he could have hung himself or he could have been strangled.

      False equivalency.

      Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said

      I deduct 10 logic points.

      You weren’t in danger of the Ted Nelson rule so why not put out the full quote originally?

    91. Hubert

      My single concern when it came to a max was his health.

      Why were you so unconcerned with his high volume / bad efficiency offense and his anemic rebounding numbers?

    92. DRed

      Kristaps was just a below average rebounder. If he got better at creating shots for himself or took better shots as part of a better offense you could absolutely live with his rebounding. His health and his not particularly efficient scoring are the things to worry about with Kristaps. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if the Mavs can solve his usage problems, but that’s a lot of money to bet on your ability to do so.

    93. Bruno Almeida

      I won’t lose any sleep over Porzingis. He has the potential to be pretty damn good, but the Knicks still made the right choice in trading him. If he becomes a superstar it kinds sucks to watch, but he asked for a trade and there was nothing the current management could really do to keep him, so it’s a whatever for me. Every offseason we also heard how he would be stronger and more resistant and etc etc, so I’ll believe it when I see it.

    94. TheClashFan

      For me, the injury concerns and the growing evidence of his bad off the court bad behaviors made me fine with trading KP. It was sad to see him go, since he was such a huge symbol of hope, and he might still turn out to be a star. DSJ “growing up” and shooting better would sure help for us Knicks fans.

      I think I have “turned the page” on that trade, but the Mets trade for Cano (giving up Kelenic and Dunn) is one I”m still trying to chill out about, and having Cano for 4 more years is going to be a constant reminder.
      :-)

    95. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      Kevin Durant had an ORB every 82 minutes of floor time last year, worse than Ntilikina’s one ORB per 75. Rebounding doesn’t matter if you put the ball in the hole better than 95% of the league.

    96. swiftandabundant

      DRed, yeah win basketball games. I think this is the best starting 5 and then letting DSJ, Knox, Frank/Dotson/Iggy…be in the second unit with Portis/Gibson and Ellinson also gives them some veteran calming influence.

    97. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      yes, Bobby Portis definitely has a reputation as a calming veteran presence

    98. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Frank got the starting job for France’s game today.

      Frank, Batum, Gobert, Fournier, and somebody named Moerman

    99. Owen

      That is an awesome Randolph clip. I had forgotten that.

      Re Cano, the Mets will probably trade him to like the Rays with Ronny Mauricio. Cano will then lead the league in doubles as their DH and Mauricio will be ROY.

      With the way this offseason has worked out, I am having some KP regrets. Because there definitely is strong possibility nothing better is coming down the pike for a while, other than Skynet of course. But I can’t get upset about it. I still see him maxing out as an injury prone #2 at best.

    100. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      O/U on national-writer thinkpieces before the ASB about why Doncic and Porzingis haven’t yet “gelled” and why it’s too soon to label Porzingis’s max a huge mistake

      12.5

    101. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      .

      Porzingis going off on the Knicks is a total lock.

      Almost no one comes back from ACL in top form immediately. Since the Knicks are so early in the season, he may even still be on a minutes restriction at that point. I’m expecting him to be disappointing to “casual fans and media” for the first 40 games or so. If anything, he’ll be better in the 2nd half as his game sharpens and his confidence grows that the knee is OK and he can move and jump like before without getting hurt again.

    102. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      How many of you are ambivalent enough about the Nets to tune in just to be entertained by decent basketball?

      I’m going to enjoy listening to the experts trying to figure out why they aren’t winning as many games as expected given how good they were last year and having added Kyrie. That’s the most likely scenario unless they get upside from other young players. They are going to be begging for Durant to come back.

    103. Ntilakilla

      You weren’t in danger of the Ted Nelson rule so why not put out the full quote originally?

      I really don’t know what the hell the Ted Nelson rule is.

    104. bobneptune

      Almost no one comes back from ACL in top form immediately.

      Jesus he’ll be out for 21 bloody months and have a full and extended training camp and a handful of real games FFS.

      Jesus Rod Woodson blew out his ACL , had a reconstruction and played in super Bowl XXX 19 weeks later…. yeah…. football!

      I’ll just take a guess and say Klay T won’t take 21 months to get back on the floor……

    105. bobneptune

      I’m expecting him to be disappointing to “casual fans and media” for the first 40 games or so. If anything, he’ll be better in the 2nd half as his game sharpens and his confidence grows that the knee is OK and he can move and jump like before without getting hurt again.

      If Georges Santayana is correct the under should be taken on this one :-)

    106. bobneptune

      O/U on national-writer thinkpieces before the ASB about why Doncic and Porzingis haven’t yet “gelled” and why it’s too soon to label Porzingis’s max a huge mistake

      12.5

      You are off by an order of magnitude…

    107. DRed

      Saw this on the twitter:

      Frank Ntilikina ne veut absolument pas tirer, c’est impressionnant

      Translated from French by google

      Frank Ntilikina absolutely does not want to shoot, it’s impressive

    108. Hubert

      If he got better at creating shots for himself or took better shots as part of a better offense you could absolutely live with his rebounding.

      I couldn’t. I think a defensive team built around a rim protector who can’t rebound is like a Death Star with an exhaust port.

      It’s not the kinda thing that will matter in the reg season but when you’re in crunch time in close playoff games it will destroy you.

      You could compensate for it with exceptional rebounding at other positions but that makes team building much more challenging.

    109. Hubert

      Kevin Durant had an ORB every 82 minutes of floor time last year, worse than Ntilikina’s one ORB per 75. Rebounding doesn’t matter if you put the ball in the hole better than 95% of the league.

      I’m talking about the impact of his anemic rebounding on team defense. ORB isn’t relevant.

      Also, Durant was largely a perimeter defender. If Draymond Green rebounded as poorly as Porzingis, the Warriors would have had a lot less success the last 5 years.

    110. Hubert

      Ah, so now we know he could have hung himself or he could have been strangled.

      False equivalency.

      Such breaks can occur in those who hang themselves, particularly if they are older, according to forensics experts and studies on the subject. But they are more common in victims of homicide by strangulation, the experts said

      I deduct 10 logic points.

      The cognitive dissonance is strong in you.

    111. DRed

      You could compensate for it with exceptional rebounding at other positions but that makes team building much more challenging.

      We’re talking like 1 or 2 rebounds per 36 minutes. Kristaps isn’t Bargnani. You have a really weird blind spot on this.

    112. Hubert

      Surrendering, on average, 2 offensive rebounds per 36 minutes is a significant handicap in a 7 game series against a team you are closely matched with.

    113. JK47

      Porzingis has a 12.5 TRB% for his career, but some of that is inflated by his season playing alongside boxer-outer extraordinaire Robin Lopez. His last two seasons he’s averaged 11.6 TRB%. Not great.

      Bargs was at 9.5 for his career though, which is impressively bad.

      For reference, Amar’e Stoudemire had a career 14.4 TRB%, Lauri Markkanen has a 14.3 average, Domantas Sabonis has 16.4, Marvin Bagley had 15.5 as a rookie…

      Porzingis IS a shitty rebounder.

    114. geo

      The cognitive dissonance is strong in you.

      as long as raz isn’t getting ready to subjugate the barbarian hordes on pluto – he’ll be fine…

    115. vincoug

      FIBA’s site is stupidly difficult to navigate so I haven’t been able to find exact numbers but it sounds like Frank had another dump of a game today against Montenegro.

    116. chrisconley

      “The Nets O/U is 45.5.”

      Swapping Russell for Kyrie and DAJ plus a healthy Levert is worth 3.5 additional wins in the now Kawhi-less East. They better hope post-surgery KD is worth like an additional 15-20 if they want to contend.

    117. 2FOR18, understands math

      The Knicks made the right move in trading KP vs signing him to a max. The unfortunate parts = the return was correcting past stupidity by including bad contracts, rather than getting more assets back, and trading him at his lowest value point. But it’s the Knicks so I’ll take breaking even.

    118. rama got that Fizdale Magic

      You could compensate for it with exceptional rebounding at other positions but that makes team building much more challenging.

      Not really. The most undervalued players are good rebounders/inside defenders. Ed Davis is always on some small salary, for example. For that matter, Skynet is already decent and should get better.

    119. 2FOR18, understands math

      O/U on national-writer thinkpieces before the ASB about why Doncic and Porzingis haven’t yet “gelled” and why it’s too soon to label Porzingis’s max a huge mistake

      12.5

      Under. There aren’t 13 writers who care about the Mavs.

    120. JK47

      If you’re playing KP at the 5 and hoping for his rim protection, it’s kind of hard to pair him with a burly but slow Ed Davis type, because the burly/slow type 4’s will get roasted by stretch 4’s. You need somebody who can rebound AND is fleet-footed enough to play reasonable perimeter defense, and those are not easy to find or undervalued.

    121. domiknick

      The league leaders in TRB last year is a murderer’s row of…burly/slow types who will get roasted by stretch 4’s. To get to fleet-footed enough to play reasonable perimeter defense you have to go down to Giannis at 12 (LOL), then mayyyybe John Collins or Larry Nance at 18 & 19. Anyone wanna guess who shows up next at 24? Hint: It’s too bad we never got to see it…

    122. BigBlueAL

      Kevin Pelton came out with his projections today and the Knicks are projected to have the fewest wins in the NBA with 26.

    123. the don nelson era

      26 wins & worst in the league is below what I expect but then again, the Knicks are worse than I expect pretty much every year

    124. 2FOR18, understands math

      Anyone who can look at this roster and predict over 30 wins must believe Epstein killed himself

    125. vincoug

      26 wins is pretty reasonable and I think is what my prediction was. I don’t see us having the worst record in the league, I can’t even remember the last time the worst team had 26 wins.

    126. vincoug

      Took a little bit to find but the last team to win at least 26 games and finish with the worst record in the league were the 1983-84 Indiana Pacers. Their reward that season was nothing! They pulled a Knicks a couple of years earlier and traded their unprotected 1st in 1984 for Tom Owens who was a 30 year old nobody. Portland stupidly used the pick on Sam Bowie instead of Michael Freaking Jordan.

    127. Ntilakilla

      Jeffrey Epstein Associate Ghislain Maxwell Prefers In-N-Out https://t.co/CZRk6xtzPn via @@GDBlackmon— Leo Janysek, Jr. (@ljanysekjr) August 15, 2019

      So the entire FBI couldn’t find her but the NY Post did. LOLOLOLOL

      And where is this great criminal mastermind? Eating in public at In N Out Burger. Hahahaha! You can’t make this shit up.

    128. Ntilakilla

      The cognitive dissonance is strong in you.

      You just can’t throw out random big words in response to the ones I use. They have to actually make sense in the context of the discussion.

    129. Hubert

      Not really. The most undervalued players are good rebounders/inside defenders. Ed Davis is always on some small salary, for example. For that matter, Skynet is already decent and should get better.

      They’re not really undervalued. They’re poorly valued, and for good reason. If all you can do is defend and rebound, your team is fucked on the other side of the court.

      If you can defend, rebound, and not fuck your team on the other side of the court, then you’re not undervalued. You’re someone every team is dying to have.

      Name a player on a championship team since Ben Wallace who could play 30+ minutes a night in the playoffs while only being good at defense and rebounding.

    130. DRed

      Tim Duncan? Thristan Thompson? Bogut was like 2-3 minutes off that. Tyson Chandler? (I think he was good offensively, but a lot of you don’t)

    131. DRed

      Also if you’re looking to pick up a rebound or two over 36 minutes you don’t need your Ed Davis type to play 30 minutes. Or you could get a wing or a PG who is better than average at rebounding. It’s not that big of a deal.

    132. Owen

      I never dreamed we would talk about Frankie this much. It’s a credit to how long it’s been since we saw a good defensive wing on this team I think. There is some part of every Knicks fan that just wants to see one guy out there, after 20 years, who can guard someone on the perimeter.

    133. DS

      Ntilikina with 3 points (1 of 5 from the field), 3 rebounds in 19:23 minutes. I also watched the game highlights and he’s not active on offense and got burned a couple of times on defense.

      I’ve been a fan of the Ntilikina idea and always hoped he’s still learning but I think it’s pretty obvious by now that he’s not getting it.

      I’m not optimistic about Frank. But I also don’t think poor individual stats in 1 game of international play, in which his team beat the 2nd highest ranked team in the tournament, is a reason for concern.

    134. Name is Bron - James Bron

      Vucevic on Frank:

      he was a game changer for the French team, he helps them to score easy basket and move the ball great , and on defense he just stop us possession after possession , he is tough !

    135. Hubert

      Also if you’re looking to pick up a rebound or two over 36 minutes you don’t need your Ed Davis type to play 30 minutes. Or you could get a wing or a PG who is better than average at rebounding. It’s not that big of a deal.

      It is, in fact, extremely hard to find a wing or PG who, in addition to being good enough to play on a championship team, can provide you with enough excess defensive rebounding to offset a center who can’t rebound well.

    136. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Jesus he’ll be out for 21 bloody months and have a full and extended training camp and a handful of real games FFS.

      It has absolutely nothing to do with physical healing. He’s been physically healed for a long time. It’s mental. He has to be mentally ready to drive all out, take contact, change directions, leap for a pas and dunk etc.. They all come back afraid and their timing and shot is a little off.

    137. Hubert

      Tim Duncan? Thristan Thompson? Bogut was like 2-3 minutes off that. Tyson Chandler? (I think he was good offensively, but a lot of you don’t)

      I’m going to graciously overlook the fact that you inexplicably put Tim duncan’s offensive skills in the range of Ben Wallace and Ed Davis.

      Tyson Chandler was an elite offensive player no matter what some people think.

      Bogut and Thompson are fine examples but they both played center and they were both $16mm players.

      I’m sorry you disagree, but it is, in my opinon, undeniably difficult to build a championship team around a center making the max salary who can’t rebound his position. You’re not going to offset that with an Ed Davis type making the MLE. It’s a fatal flaw. You pair him with an Ed Davis, now you have to compensate for Ed Davis getting roasted on the perimeter. If you pair him with wings who are elite rebounders, you’re paying a huge premium for them and it impacts who you fill the roster out with.

      To quote Joe Girardi: “It’s not what you want.”

    138. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Porzingis IS a shitty rebounder.

      1. Porzingis is typically playing PF not C. He’s the secondary rebounder.

      2. Porzingis is playing and often covering stretch PFs and is on the perimeter more often than a traditional PF.

      3. Porzingi’s best role on defense is to help protect the paint, not try to get rebounds.

      4. Porzingis is built like Ronzoni angel hair pasta. So even when he actively seeks and gets position for a rebound, he gets pushed out of the paint and stripped constantly.

      1-3 are a function of role not ability, but impact his rebounding at the margin.

      He’s not a good rebounder primarily because of #4. That’s one of several reasons he needs to put on weight and get a lot stronger. He can’t allow small men to push him around and strip him. But I’d gladly take the space and 40% from 3 even if he misses out on an occasional OREB and I’d gladly take impact level rim protection and allow someone like Randle, Kanter etc.. to get the DREBs.

    139. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Vucevic on Frank:

      he was a game changer for the French team, he helps them to score easy basket and move the ball great , and on defense he just stop us possession after possession , he is tough !

      He’s the same Frank.

      He doesn’t want to shoot.
      When he does shoot, he doesn’t make the shot often enough.
      His teammates want him on the court.
      His boxscore looks like crap, but he was +16 and the team was way better with him on the court.

    140. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      So Draymond is the ultimate KP running mate

      Edit: Or Mase

      Draymond would be great, but Julius Randle would have been nice.

    141. Hubert

      Bogut and Thompson are fine examples but they both played center and they were both $16mm players.

      I take that back. Bogut averaged 12 minutes per game in the first two NBA finals he played in (not counting this past one bc it’s unfair to hold that against him).

      That just proves my point that the deeper you go you can’t play these guys, and there’s no way in hell you’re going very far if you’re counting on an Ed Davis / Kyle O’Quinn type to compensate for your center’s shitty rebounding.

    142. vincoug

      I’m not optimistic about Frank. But I also don’t think poor individual stats in 1 game of international play, in which his team beat the 2nd highest ranked team in the tournament, is a reason for concern.

      It’s not 1 game though, it’s 3 games in this tournament and 2 years of NBA play.

    143. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Marc Gasol is a shitty rebunder for the C position (for reasons I can’t comprehend) but it didn’t seem to stop him from being a very high level all around player and eventually a critical piece to a championship team even after declining a bit.

      There are only a handful of guys that do everything well.

      Rebounding is probably the least significant thing because good rebunders that can defend and score OK around the basket are a dime a dozen. You don’t need or necessarily even want 5 high level scorers out there. You need balance of all the important facets of the game.

    144. vincoug

      Just did some quick calculations. In the 3 games of this tournament, here’s Ntilikina’s per game stats:

      4 PTS, 1.7 REB, 4.3 ASST, 0.7 TO, 0.3 STL, 0 BLK, 20% FG%, 14.3% 3FG%, 83.3% FT%, 23.3% eFG%, and 34% TS% in 18.7 MPG.

      If I have time later I’ll figure out more of his advanced stats but this is pretty brutal.

    145. KnickfaninNJ

      His teammates want him on the court.
      His boxscore looks like crap, but he was +16 and the team was way better with him on the court.

      Given Vucevic’s quote and this, I predict we will trade Frank to Orlando for a second round pick. Then he will help them make the playoffs. Frank has drawbacks for sure, but he has skills to. Our management doesn’t want the skills he brings so they are likely to throw him away.

    146. DS

      4 PTS, 1.7 REB, 4.3 ASST, 0.7 TO, 0.3 STL, 0 BLK, 20% FG%, 14.3% 3FG%, 83.3% FT%, 23.3% eFG%, and 34% TS% in 18.7 MPG.

      Oof. How many minutes of basketball are we talking about, though? 40?

    147. KnickfaninNJ

      Vincoug, those are mostly offensive stats. I think that if he neutralizes the opposing teams point guard, he can have stats like that and still affect the game positively if the four teammates on the floor with him do a little better because of his passing and the point guard position is a wash because he and the opposing point guard both don’t do well on offense.

    148. Ingmarrrr

      Re defending someone on the perimeter check out this sequence on defense. 3 possessions where he does not, um, impose his will. Not pretty, although of course it’s (rotten) cherry picking.

    149. Dink

      3. Porzingi’s best role on defense is to help protect the paint, not try to get rebounds.

      Why wouldn’t “protecting the paint” include rebounding? They go hand in hand. Forcing a missed shot is a lot better when your team gets the defensive board.

      1. Porzingis is typically playing PF not C. He’s the secondary rebounder.

      2. Porzingis is playing and often covering stretch PFs and is on the perimeter more often than a traditional PF.

      Think we got a chicken + egg situation here. You think that Porzingi’s role as a PF is making him look like a worse rebounder than he is. This isn’t totally wrong, but I think he’s playing PF/is the secondary rebounder because he’s not good enough at it (and never will be) to play C/be a primary rebounder. It’s not like he’s playing PF because he’s good at perimeter D. He’s not. KP is being forced into that role due to his lack of rebounding skills.

    150. JK47

      For Frank’s defense to make him a plus player, he’d have to turn the opposing point guard into an offensive player who is worse than Frank Ntilikina.

      Gary Payton in his prime wasn’t that good.

    151. Donnie Walsh

      I take that back. Bogut averaged 12 minutes per game in the first two NBA finals he played in (not counting this past one bc it’s unfair to hold that against him).

      That just proves my point that the deeper you go you can’t play these guys, and there’s no way in hell you’re going very far if you’re counting on an Ed Davis / Kyle O’Quinn type to compensate for your center’s shitty rebounding.

      Though I largely see your point, and agree with it to an extent, I don’t think one needs to be dogmatic about this. The NBA finals, and other late round playoff matchups, represent a very small sample of basketball teams, and the results are largely impacted by luck. I think that if you put Ed Davis on the 2015 Warriors and play him 20+ minutes a game, they probably still make the finals. Though Bogut only averaged 12 minutes against the Cavs, he played his usual 22+ against the likes of Dwight Howard and Josh Smith in the WCF and the Warriors had no issues whatsoever. Ultimately, you want the right balance of skills on your team, play your best ball, and hope luck works in your favor, like it did for the Raptors this year. Without the luxury of having multiple transcendent talents on your team, that’s the best formula for success.

    152. DS

      For Frank’s defense to make him a plus player, he’d have to turn the opposing point guard into an offensive player who is worse than Frank Ntilikina.

      Gary Payton in his prime wasn’t that good.

      Great post.

    153. ess-dog

      So Alibaba co-founder buys Brooklyn Nets and Barclay’s for 3.5 billion. That’s amazing for the organization. They probably are going to surpass the Knicks in global popularity now, or at least make it a lot closer.

    154. DS

      What accounts for the Knicks having any “global popularity?” The location of their home building and how they performed in 70’s and 90’s.

    155. Hubert

      Marc Gasol is a shitty rebunder for the C position (for reasons I can’t comprehend) but it didn’t seem to stop him from being a very high level all around player and eventually a critical piece to a championship team even after declining a bit.

      Marc Gasol averaged 8.2 DREB/36 this year.

      And any examples of players playing with the best player on the planet don’t counter my argument. I agree that if you put Porzingis next to peak Kawhi or peak LeBron, his rebounding will not harm you as much. Those are the kind of wings that can compensate for a center’s shitty rebounding. Hell, they can compensate for pretty much anything.

    156. Owen

      Porzingis is built like Ronzoni angel hair pasta.

      I love that you specified a brand.

      Gasol had a d-reb rate of 25.5 this year, almost an all time high. Porzingis is at 18. That’s a big difference.

    157. swiftandabundant

      Thinking about this upcoming season, I came up with 5 Factors/Questions for success for next season:

      1. Will we see improvements from Mitch, Knox, DSJ, Trier, Dotson and Frank? A leap forward from one of these guys would be nice. If we get a leap forward from two or more, I think we can do better than people think.
      2. Can Randle handle the being “the man” and can he continue his improvement in his still young career? 2A – can Peyton also improve to be a decent starting PG for us?
      3. Can RJ be an impact player his rookie year or show enough signs that he can be an all-star caliber or even franchise player for us? 3A – can Iggy show us anything worth keeping around?
      4. Can the veterans brought in provide stability and guidance for the young players? Can they accept the role of role players and step aside if/when the youngsters shine?
      5. Can Fizdale coach up a team that has a lot of veterans and a lot of youth. He’s got depth but no real stars on the team. He has a lot of interesting line ups. I think if you are optimistic about the win total this year (over 30 games) its based on the belief mainly that Fizdale was tanking last year somewhat intentionally. A lot of the previous 4 factors, of course, are related to this 5th factor.

    158. Hubert

      I think that if you put Ed Davis on the 2015 Warriors and play him 20+ minutes a game, they probably still make the finals.

      If you recall, that team had to drop David Lee to get over the final hump.

      Either way, citing one of the best teams of all time doesn’t exactly refute my point that it’s difficult to build a team around a center making max money who can’t rebound. All you have to do is recreate the 2015 Warriors, huh?

    159. thenoblefacehumper

      If “entering his 3rd year in the NBA and still can’t do shit against the likes of the Montenegrin national team” doesn’t convince people literally nothing will. There’s barely any point in arguing with the Frankophiles. He’s a bust. It’s settled. Every front office knows it, evidenced by the fact that we couldn’t get a single second round pick for him. I’d say it’s 50/50 that his next contract is from an NBA team. He shouldn’t be in our plans at all.

      Re: Porzingis, one of the things that got me excited about him as a rookie is his TRB% was at least close to what we were hoping for at his peak. As JK47 mentioned, it’s now looking like that was a Robin Lopez-caused based mirage and he’s a shitty rebounder. No matter how impactful you think that is to his team, it can’t be denied that it’s yet another legitimate flaw for a guy about to make over $30M AAV. We were simply in no position win curve wise to give a guy that money and hope he improves his scoring efficiency, rebounding, stamina, and health.

    160. Hubert

      Dirk’s mavs were the blueprint for building around porzingis. They had an elite rebounding guard (Kidd), wing (Marion), and center (Chandler), all of whom were plus players on the other side. It’s not impossible, it’s just fucking hard.

    161. bobneptune

      Do you realize how good and unique Marion and Kidd were? Add Chandler to Dirk….. there is about zero chance of getting 4 guys that special in their own individual unique ways on the same squad. And old KP is about .170 ws/48 points light on prime Dirk

    162. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      That Mavs team was a fluke, too. It’s a weird Oakland A’s-like phenomenon, but between their first Finals appearance and the end of the >.500 era (2015-16), they were bounced from the 1st round in 7 of 9 playoffs appearances and had an elite SRS only once (7.28). They had all sorts of weird stuff happen, like winning 50 games with a 1.68 SRS and 55 with a 2.66 SRS (seeded 2nd, ranked 8th in SRS).

    163. Hubert

      Do you realize how good and unique Marion and Kidd were?

      Yeah, that was my point.

      It is really hard to find guys like that to compensate for the fact that your center can’t rebound. It’s even harder if you’re paying said center a max salary.

    164. KnickfaninNJ

      What accounts for the Knicks having any “global popularity?” The location of their home building and how they performed in 70’s and 90’s.

      I don’t think the Knicks have any global popularity to speak of. I told a Beijing hard core NBA fan that I was a Knicks fan and his response was a shocked “Why”

    165. JK47

      Brandon Nimmo is playing a baseball game, I repeat, Brandon Nimmo is playing a baseball game today

    166. domiknick

      So Dominick, who was number 26 on the list?

      It was our very own Noah Vonleh. (sorry for the late response)

    167. DRed

      It’s interesting that in one thread I am both arguing with people who say a big man who only plays defense and rebounds can’t play at the highest levels of NBA basketball and you also can’t win with a big man who isn’t a good rebounder.

    168. DRed

      Draymond Green has averaged 9.5 rebounds per 36 minutes in his somewhat successful playoff career. Let’s throw out Kristaps decent rookie season and put him at 7.5 rebounds per 36. Are we really arguing that finding extra 2 rebounds in a game (remember, this is for a hypothetically good on offense Kristaps) is some sissyphean teambuilding task?

      Editing this to add that the guy the Mavericks played as their starting 2 guard last year was probably the best rebounding guard not named Ben Simmons in the NBA

    169. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      Looking at Draymond’s numbers — what a unique player. Reminds me of Jason Kidd in that he’s kind of an abysmal shooter but he clearly makes everyone around him better on both sides of the ball. Also, it’s wild that Kevon Looney was responsible for almost 25% of GSW’s ORB last year while playing only 7.4% of their available minutes.

    170. JK47

      I mean Dirk was a fine player, and he wasn’t a dramatically better rebounder than KP (but was better). It just means that KP gives back some of his defensive value with his crummy rebounding, and on offense he ain’t no Dirk.

      The platonic ideal of KP, “November KP,” is good enough to win with even with the soft ass rebounding, because November KP is essentially Dirk with rim protecting ability.

    171. TheClashFan

      Happy to see Nimmo playing again. I hope he can get back to the Mets.

      ME rules Epstein’s death a suicide. What’s next, conspiracy folks?

    172. The Infamous Cdiggy

      @188 I definitely believe Fizdale was coaching to tank. Not hard to do when you’re giving Mudiay significant minutes. That said, I don’t know if he can coach this team up. And even with that, I think with the new guys brought in I feel pretty good about them hitting 30 wins.

      Boy it’d be great if Knox, DSJr and Trier can take a big step forward. Not excluding Mitch or RJ (bc Mitch is great and RJ is a rookie), but those three could potentially really move the needle this year.

    173. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      ME rules Epstein’s death a suicide. What’s next, conspiracy folks?

      > Epstein taken off suicide watch
      > cellmate transferred out
      > on the very same night, two guards sleep through mandatory check-ins for approximately three hours around 3 AM
      > Epstein is awake, notices that he’s unattended, commits suicide

      Nothing fishy about that.

    174. Hubert

      Re: Daniel Jones, I’m becoming more open to accepting a results-based grade.

      EDIT: I only saw the box score, which looks good. Narrative seems to say it was an up and down performance/

    175. TheClashFan

      Jowles, been reading a bit about suicide watch (admittedly I was totally ignorant about what it means and how it works). From what I’ve read, your 1 and 2 are not necessarily fishy at all. 3 kind of is, but could be incompetence, too. Not the first time law enforcement has been incompetent. 4, well, yeah, I agree that he was awake and unattended when he killed himself, as is everyone who commits suicide in jail.

      Maybe something’s up, but the medical examiner will now also have to be in on it.

    176. bobneptune

      Re: Daniel Jones, I’m becoming more open to accepting a results-based grade.

      EDIT: I only saw the box score, which looks good. Narrative seems to say it was an up and down performance/

      What!!! Mel Kuiper’s opinions have a half life??? The media (we are smarter than you/I love clickbait) narrative by the Greek Chorus has a half life? Or as the great Senator Moynihan once said, “Sir…. you are entitled to your own opinions…. but not your own facts!!!”

      The guy posted a 158.3 and a 130.0 QBR in two appearances. He flubbed 2 plays yesterday (muffed a good snap and got needlessly stripped when the RT whiffed on a block) but he was 11-14 (with one stone drop) for 161 yards threw 2 beautiful deep balls and consistently put the ball in the right place with extreme precision. I can’t remember a single throw that the receiver had to make a “tough catch” on a mediocre throw.

      Now for sure he wasn’t up against the ’85 Bear’s defense, but he has no control over that. He is still a baby and the game will get much faster toot de suite when front line D’s start scheming it up, but they guy’s first baby steps into the NFL have been beyond anyone’s (maybe except Giant’s management) wildest imagination.

    177. Z-man

      No matter what the sport, once preseason starts, draft position and pedigree shouldn’t matter anymore. Jones has played very well regardless of where he was drafted. He looks like a potential starting NFL quarterback. That’s all you can ask of him at this point. Obviously it’s too early to draw any firm long-term conclusions, but right now he’s looking very good, it’s stupid to dispute that. Some will continue to say, yeah, but at the time it was a dumb pick. My feeling is, if as a GM thinks you think you see something that others don’t and you are confident enough to take the risk, you have nothing to apologize for when it works out the way you had hoped. Conversely, if it doesn’t work out, you deserve all the shit that is thrown at you.

    178. Hubert

      What!!! Mel Kuiper’s opinions have a half life??? The media (we are smarter than you/I love clickbait) narrative by the Greek Chorus has a half life? Or as the great Senator Moynihan once said, “Sir…. you are entitled to your own opinions…. but not your own facts!!!”

      I am offended that you think I even know what Mel Kiper or the Greek chorus think about Daniel Jones. His stats were available and I don’t need anyone to explain numbers to me.

      But hey, I will be thrilled if he’s a great QB and would be happy to be wrong.

      Ironically, if he does turn out to be a great QB, it flies directly in the face of that Moynihan quote. Gettelman went with his gut (i.e. his opinion) instead of the facts. If this is one of the rare instances where that faulty process works out, bully for him.

    179. The Honorable Cock Jowles

      Jowles, been reading a bit about suicide watch (admittedly I was totally ignorant about what it means and how it works). From what I’ve read, your 1 and 2 are not necessarily fishy at all. 3 kind of is, but could be incompetence, too. Not the first time law enforcement has been incompetent. 4, well, yeah, I agree that he was awake and unattended when he killed himself, as is everyone who commits suicide in jail.

      It’s about the confluence of those four events, not any individual one. It’s possible that he realized that he had not been regularly or adequately monitored before that night, and took the first opportunity he had without a cellmate.

    180. bobneptune

      I am offended that you think I even know what Mel Kiper or the Greek chorus think about Daniel Jones. His stats were available and I don’t need anyone to explain numbers to me.

      But hey, I will be thrilled if he’s a great QB and would be happy to be wrong.

      Ironically, if he does turn out to be a great QB, it flies directly in the face of that Moynihan quote. Gettelman went with his gut (i.e. his opinion) instead of the facts. If this is one of the rare instances where that faulty process works out, bully for him.

      I have to laugh sometimes…. Eli manning who was the #1 pick in the NFL draft came out of ole Miss under similar circumstances…. a player playing with sub conference athletes who elevated the players around him. For the record:

      Eli’s career completion % at ole Miss = 60.8% Jones 59.9% and Jones came out as a junior not a senior. For their junior seasons:

      Eli’s completion % = 58.0% Jones = 60.5%

      My university degree is in Biochemistry and by nature I am a math/science guy. I like to quantify thing. But in some cases the metrics don’t completely capture what is going on. Unlike the NBA, college FB players are playing vs different levels of athletes.

      I don’t know squat about Daniel Jones as I never saw him play one minute in college. However anyone who has seen him play so far can say with metaphysical certitude he has an NFL arm, and throws with touch and extreme accuracy. That jumps off the screen. He seems to be way ahead on the mental side of things for a rookie QB. He seems to get them in the right protection and delivers the ball on time to the right guy.

      The idea he was drafted on gut feeling is pure nonsense. or to quote Hamlet, ” There are more things in heaven and earth Hubert than are dreamt of in your philosophy!” :-)

    181. DRed

      My university degree is in Biochemistry and by nature I am a math/science guy. I like to quantify things.

      I don’t know squat about Daniel Jones as I never saw him play one minute in college. However

      I’d like to chop this up and snort it

    182. Z-man

      For some reason, NBATV is showing an old Knicks-Cavs game from the “Bomb Squad” days (I believe 1988-89.) I guess you could argue that Pitino was ahead of his time…

    183. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Given Vucevic’s quote and this, I predict we will trade Frank to Orlando for a second round pick. Then he will help them make the playoffs. Frank has drawbacks for sure, but he has skills to. Our management doesn’t want the skills he brings so they are likely to throw him away.

      I agree.

      Both Vucevic and Fournier have made very strong statements about how Frank is impacting games positively. Orlando was also rumored to be interested in him at one point. So he’s on their radar. It would be a good spot and good fit for him. They are young, up and coming, value defense under Clifford, were playing a terrific brand of basketball down the stretch last year, and seem to be finally turning the corner as an organization under Hammond and Clifford. It’s best for him to get out of NY. This management and coach will never value anything he does well and will never develop the things he needs to develop.

    184. Hubert

      anyone who has seen him play so far can say with metaphysical certitude he has an NFL arm, and throws with touch and extreme accuracy. That jumps off the screen. He seems to be way ahead on the mental side of things for a rookie QB. He seems to get them in the right protection and delivers the ball on time to the right guy.

      I can’t deny this is true. Of course, it is preseason. I’d like to see how he looks in a real game before officially submitting my mea culpa. But I have to admit I’ve got my writer’s working on it.

      It still seems like it’s a case of splitting tens and getting two aces if it works out. But fuck me, I’ll take two blackjacks the dumb way.

    185. JK47

      If you squint your eyes really really really hard and take a megadose of DMT you can see the greatness inherent in Frank, nevermind that .081 eFG%

    186. JK47

      If you’d like to see a highlight reel of Mike Glennon making accurate throws in an NFL preseason game where he went 11 for 14 for 175 yards and a 158.3 quarterback rating I can provide that for you.

    187. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      > Epstein taken off suicide watch
      > cellmate transferred out
      > on the very same night, two guards sleep through mandatory check-ins for approximately three hours around 3 AM
      > Epstein is awake, notices that he’s unattended, commits suicide

      Nothing fishy about that.

      If this was Joe Blow, there probably wouldn’t be anything too fishy about it. But when it’s a global sex trafficker and pedo with a private island and plane that caters to the rich and famous in politics, business, Hollywood, media, royalty and that was already either attacked or tried to commit suicide in jail, the only thing that’s fishy is why he was still alive so long.

    188. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Epstein was never going to be allowed to testify.

      The only question was whether it was going to be a murder made to look like a suicide, accident, jailhouse attack, natural causes, or it was going to be like a scene out of the movies and he’d been given the option of committing suicide to avoid an even worse fate in prison.

    189. Stratomatic: Sometimes referred to as Satan

      Frank Ntilikina France ???
      @FrNtilikina
      Only 13 mins for Frank tonight but he was agressive, good shooter, organizer, always strong on the man in D.

      8 pts (3-3 FG)
      2 rebs
      3 assists
      1 stl

    190. Farfa

      Guys there’s nothing wrong in acknowledging we drafted our own Nikoloz Tskitishvili or Yaroslav Korolev. Frank is a 99.9% bust because it’s clear that he lacks the attitude to make it in the NBA. No one can deny his effectiveness as a POA defender, but if two years in the NBA don’t fix your mindset, nothing will. His option will be renounced and that’s ok.

    191. Z-man

      I disagree. Frank might be a good NBA 8th-9th guy when he’s around 25 years old. The blunder was thinking that he could ever be anything but a 3-and-D bench player. He would have been a good mid-late 2nd rounder if he was in the 2019 draft.

    192. Z-man

      I truly hope that Frank does defy the odds and become successful one day. He’s an innocent victim of Knicks ineptitude. Same with Knox, and to a lesser extent, RJ.

    193. bobneptune

      > Epstein taken off suicide watch
      > cellmate transferred out
      > on the very same night, two guards sleep through mandatory check-ins for approximately three hours around 3 AM
      > Epstein is awake, notices that he’s unattended, commits suicide

      Nothing fishy about that.

      Of course you neglected the best part…. there hasn’t been a single suicide in the facility since 1996….. :-) :-)

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