Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Monday, September 25, 2017

Knicks Morning News (2017.09.03)

52 comments on “Knicks Morning News (2017.09.03)

  1. wetbandit

    Great game by KP yesterday. A lot of that Melo jab-step in there. I’m not a fan of that type of game, and it will hurt his efficiency if he favors an ISO-ball game, but Melo with rim protection, height, and blocking ability is a damn fine player.

    Still hope he doesn’t end up playing Melos brand of offense.

    And I hate that nickname yesterday. Very lower-tier for this blog. Lets keep it classy in our little world at least, when the rest of the larger world seems utterly devoid of it.

  2. lavor postell

    The Markkannen debate from yesterday is pretty fascinating. I’m not sure he’s going to make the teams that passed on him regret him, but I didn’t really agree with people panning Chicago for him being the selection. His offensive game is pretty special for a big man and he got picked in the range he was protected to. Defensively he’s likely to always be a negative as he has really poor instinct in rim protection, but he’s young so maybe that can change or he can become a better defensive rebounder.

    The issue with that trade for Chicago wasn’t drafting Markkanen it was that they somehow managed to give up their 16th pick in the trade.

  3. Zanzibar

    everytime I see “KPussy” I double-check my URL and toss back a thumb of bleach when I confirm the worst

    …not on a public forum as dignified as this one.

    So a guy named “Cock” takes umbrage at the name “KPussy”? Very dignified indeed!

    I’m glad Hornacek’s comment leaked. For KP to be a real impact player, he’s gonna have to play the 5 and that means he’s gonna have to toughen up. Remember it was KP who proclaimed at the start of his career he wouldn’t be a soft Euro. If Phil and Hornacek were not able to get through to him, then maybe some public mockery will. I recall the Mavs-Miami chip series turned when Bron and Wade mocked Dirk’s comment about the flu impacting his performance. That infuriated Dirk and to this day he’s upset they did that. Maybe this will have the same kind of effect on KP.

  4. ClashFan

    There’s a rumor out there that Cleveland is shopping the NJ pick. I just can’t see a realistic deal where the Knicks get that.

    RE KP’s new nickname. It is bit crass, but for better or worse, it is now out there for him to deal with. As for the word not being “dignified” enough for this forum, what about the posts here laced with F-bombs and other personal insults from time to time?

    Whenever I hear the word I just think of Goldfinger’s personal pilot.

  5. lavor postell

    I just think the nickname is a little harmless fun.

    Btw the Kings guy, Bogdanovic looks like a real player. I’m excited to watch him in the league.

  6. Z-man

    I personally have no problem with profanity and occasional off-color/insinuatory banter. The KB authors have been pretty consistent in accepting profanity/crudeness on its face, but drawing the line at racism/homophobia/misogyny, and have banned those who found it difficult to accept that after fair warning. In my opinion, the proposed nickname is clearly over the line, while “Cock Jowles” is not.

  7. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    Does anyone think this would be more palatable than just taking back Anderson in a Melo trade?

    If anyone clicks that link and it’s not loading just like it isn’t for me, the trade was:

    NYK gets Marvin Williams & MKG
    CHA gets KOQ, Anderson, & Ariza
    HOU gets Melo & Kaminsky

  8. lavor postell

    Locker room talk, right?

    Umm sure. If you want to get upset about it go for it. I don’t particularly care one way or another. I haven’t been using it.

  9. Donnie Walsh

    I remember back two years when Mike K put the kibosh on Porzingis nicknames that were racially inspired. I imagine it’s hard to validate KPuss under that same criteria (but I’m also maybe a bit bitter because Mike’s rule kept me from proposing the nickname White Howard.)

  10. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    Houston is not giving up Ariza

    They most likely won’t, but I think that would be a mistake if they want to compete with the Dubs. They signed 2 defensive minded players in Tucker and Mbah A Moute who can defend 2-4. That makes Ariza a luxury they can’t afford to keep, in a way. When I say that, I mean to imply that in D’Antoni’s system, Ariza isn’t so more of a difference maker than Tucker and Mbah A Moute. He doesn’t lock down perimeter threats and he’s never been a great shooter.

    Let’s say we trade Melo to them and they keep Ariza. Ariza’s job is gonna be to spot up, rebound and defend. Same as Tucker and Mbah A Moute. Difference is, Ariza can check 2’s and 3’s. He can’t slide to the 4 with the bigger guys and defend, which makes the defense less flexible with Melo playing the 4 for them. On top of that, Tucker and Mbah A Moute are comparable if not better rebounders. Besides, don’t they have Troy Williams to replicate Ariza’s skill set? He’s not as experienced as Ariza, but he does the same things.

    I’m not suggesting Tucker and Mbah A Moute are better individually. Just that having them makes it easier to let go of Ariza. If there was ever a good time for him to be expendable, it’s now. I think the only way they get a better return for Ariza is if Cleveland offers up Crowder and a pick- which will never happen. Or if some other contender offers a 1st and a rotation player.

  11. Bruno Almeida

    I have no issues at all with profanity, crudeness or whatever, I just feel it’s tasteless and dumb that people associate immediately the word pussy with representations of weakness, fragility or lack of perceived “manly” traits. I live surrounded by “pussies” who are stronger and able to endure much more hardships than most “real men” I’ve ever met in my life.

    But I understand that’s the way the NBA goes and it’s typical lingo that will get repeated without much thinking, so yeah, I dont care much. Its just unnecessary and evokes concepts that should be dead long ago.

  12. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    Imma end this debate right now.

    A pussy is the strongest thing on the planet! On average, 6-8 pound HUMAN BEINGS come out of that! Sometimes bigger! If seen some of the physically strongest and mentally toughest people succumb to pussy power! LOL..I’m just sayin..

    I say that in jest, but please let’s put the KPussy thing to rest. It’s a good locker room joke in a realm of masculinity and gladiator mentality such as sports, but it becomes offensive when people constantly use it to describe someone or as a known nickname. It’s almost as offensive as using derogatory homosexual labels to label someone soft.

    Personally, I don’t think KP is soft in any way. He needs to be stronger physically so the team can properly deploy him, but the kid’s got a ton of toughness to him. Now, does he need to develop a mean streak? Absolutely! But I wouldn’t call him soft. His problem is we’re used to seeing American athletes overcome ghettoes, violence, absent fathers, etc. So suddenly, because KP doesn’t act like a caged beast- for lack of a better term- he’s soft. I don’t use caged beast to offend, I’m trying to intimate that when you grow up in the environments I mentioned, you tend to feel that way. And when those energies and emotions come out, it’s typically misunderstood and demonized. Some people can balance it out, but plenty can’t.

  13. er

    You guys are weird man.

    OT….

    I have completely reversed course on the Kyrie trade. I think the Celtics won. They got to shed an injured 29 yo IT and a 1 to get a younger bethere still growing Kyrie.

  14. wetbandit

    I don’t care what people say, it’s a free country. But It’s still tasteless and I will think less of the poster’s opinion for it. You say what you want, I will think what I want. In these times I have to think this way constantly.

  15. Jack Bauer

    “Kpussy” , that’s Not Cool – Let it go
    I don’t think he’s done anything remotely close to bad enough to earn that type of scorn

  16. danvt

    @17 Yeah the Brooklyn pick isn’t that valuable…

    Re KP’s new nickname: I really hope the Knicks finally have some good karma coming. What I mean is, KP becomes an all star and leads the team to the playoffs. Hardaway plays well. Wily plays well. Frank turns out. Melo finally plays on a good NYK team. I hope that nickname becomes a little blip in our closed world and everyone forgets it. I hope it’s not an omen.

    We didn’t have a horrible off season. Maybe we’ll fucking play well and beat some people for a change. (Is that the proper use of an expletive?)

  17. Cock Jowles, #1 Usage Soaker

    I personally have no problem with profanity and occasional off-color/insinuatory banter. The KB authors have been pretty consistent in accepting profanity/crudeness on its face, but drawing the line at racism/homophobia/misogyny, and have banned those who found it difficult to accept that after fair warning. In my opinion, the proposed nickname is clearly over the line, while “Cock Jowles” is not.

    Total agreement here, but let me pile on: I can’t believe that some posters are unable to distinguish between a misogynistic slur and the word “cock,” simply because it has a crude alternate meaning. For the record, I came up with my name years ago for a Team Fortress 2 server and meant to invoke the jowlsy looseness of a rooster’s beard. The fact that it’s also a silly, sophomoric word brought some depth. But even if it were a reference to a penis, it’s fundamentally different from “pussy” as insult. The word “cock” doesn’t demean someone by comparing them to a cis woman’s genitalia, essentially implying inferiority on grounds of innate weakness. In this case, “KPussy” means he’s soft, weak-willed, timid. There’s no way to call someone a pussy and have it not be misogynistic. It’s crude and gross and has no place on this site.

    In the past, I’ve made comments about one man holding another man’s pockets and some fellatio insults here or there, particularly w/r/t ruruland and #stayme70. Those were offensive, and I apologized to Doug Chu, who was the only one openly upset about it.

    You can call me a 13-year-old boy for my silly username, but you can’t call me a sexist for it.

  18. danvt

    @23 we’ll done. Thanks for that.

    Times change. In high school we used to routinely use language that would be unacceptable today.

    A few years ago I used a term, that had become unacceptable on its face, at work. Though I meant no disrespect, and had heard it many times before, context had become irrelevant with regard to the term. I apologized wholeheartedly.

    It’s time that the p word went the same way. It’s become an unacceptable choice.

  19. Silky Johnson, Fleet Admiral of the Tank Armada

    Man I miss TF2

    And yes, don’t use “pussy” as a pejorative term, please

  20. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    Total agreement here, but let me pile on: I can’t believe that some posters are unable to distinguish between a misogynistic slur and the word “cock,” simply because it has a crude alternate meaning. For the record, I came up with my name years ago for a Team Fortress 2 server and meant to invoke the jowlsy looseness of a rooster’s beard. The fact that it’s also a silly, sophomoric word brought some depth. But even if it were a reference to a penis, it’s fundamentally different from “pussy” as insult. The word “cock” doesn’t demean someone by comparing them to a cis woman’s genitalia, essentially implying inferiority on grounds of innate weakness. In this case, “KPussy” means he’s soft, weak-willed, timid. There’s no way to call someone a pussy and have it not be misogynistic. It’s crude and gross and has no place on this site.

    CHUUCH Jowles! Beyond well said..hopefully that will end the KPussy madness as we are better than that on this site. Sophomoric..great touch..

    + alot

  21. Cock Jowles, #1 Usage Soaker

    Warning for extreme language–

    I too threw around lots of words like bitch, pussy, slut, whore, cunt, and f—– when I was an adolescent because, yes, times were different, and I was a youth. It seems to me that a part of adolescence in a sexist, racist, xenophobic society like our America is testing the limits of free and/or acceptable speech. The issue for those of us who came of age in the pre-internet era is not necessarily that we once used those words. The test is what wedo after we come to know the harsh reality of marginalized people in our world, and how those words, and many others, are weaponized to destroy equality, status and humanity. “Pussy” is one of those words, whether one admits it or not.

  22. Ntilakilla

    I am going to pretend this thread didn’t exist. I am also going to pretend that we have people openly defending the use of “pussy” to describe a player multiple times when I was almost kicked off here for telling someone to clear the sand out of their vagina. Hypocrisy is a hell of thing.

  23. KnickfaninNJ

    Totes, you made a case why Houston would do it, but I don’t understand why Charlotte would. They give up two players who are relatively young and have long term usefulness (Kaminsky and MKG) and get back KOQ (a useful player), an expiring contract and Anderson. And taking KOQ for Kaminsky will be taking back a backup for a starter. I know Howard is their starter but they have to think Kaminsky has that potential. I don’t see them wanting to do that.

  24. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    @29,
    It would be a tougher sell with Charlotte. I would have no problem with Houston’s 1st going there to make it work. I figure that while they are in the mood to spend (Howard) they might as well get Anderson since those 2 played so well together. Also Anderson, Monk, Kemba, Batum, and Ariza would theoretically leave the paint open for a Howard resurgence. Doesn’t Clifford prefer to play inside out?

    One can dream, right?

  25. Cock Jowles, #1 Usage Soaker

    I am also going to pretend that we have people openly defending the use of “pussy” to describe a player multiple times when I was almost kicked off here for telling someone to clear the sand out of their vagina.

    Well, the language you used certainly warranted a talking-to, since it’s as misogynistic as calling someone a pussy, but the key difference is that you attacked another poster.

    “James Dolan should drink bleach on Christmas morning” and “Z-Man should drink bleach on Christmas morning” are very different sentences here. The former is justifiable — perhaps even a morally-correct thing for one to say and certainly for Dolan to hypothetically do. The latter is not a nice thing at all and doesn’t belong on the site.

  26. Zanzibar

    I can’t believe that some posters are unable to distinguish between a misogynistic slur and the word “cock,” simply because it has a crude alternate meaning.

    Speaking for myself, here’s what I wrote: “So a guy named “Cock” takes umbrage at the name “KPussy”? Very dignified indeed!” I was referring to Z-Man’s comment about the “dignity” of this site. To me, puerile, sophomoric humor is not consistent with the use of the word “dignified”.

    The word “cock” doesn’t demean someone by comparing them to a cis woman’s genitalia, essentially implying inferiority on grounds of innate weakness. In this case, “KPussy” means he’s soft, weak-willed, timid. There’s no way to call someone a pussy and have it not be misogynistic.

    Uh, yes there is. The “soft, weak-willed, timid” connotation has its roots in domesticated house cats versus cats in the wild. Here’s one of the definitions of “pussycat” from a dictionary: “one that is weak, compliant, or amiable : softy”. Now it would be just as disingenuous for me to imply that many do not use the term having the female anatomy in mind as it would be for you to claim you selected your user ID exclusively based on its connection to a rooster. That’s why I agree that the term should not be used (certainly not repeatedly) but, like Lavor, I’m not gonna be too exercised if it pops up on occasion because I believe some are thinking in terms of “pussycat”. Jon Stewart used to use the word on his show. I used it originally as a joke in the context of KP getting no respect, that the woman he’s pursuing on-line tweeted that he should change his twitter ID from @KPorzee to @KPussy. The similar word structure (alliteration, syllables) to @KPorzee is why I believed it to be humorous. I haven’t used it since then.

  27. Ntilakilla

    Well, the language you used certainly warranted a talking-to, since it’s as misogynistic as calling someone a pussy, but the key difference is that you attacked another poster.

    And yet I only see one person here is calling KPussy misogynistic. Why? No one is giving anyone a talking to for using the expression for days. Ah, the hypocrisy.

  28. chrisk06811

    I guess if we really have a prob with that word, maybe someone should tell coach Hornacek not to use it?

  29. Zanzibar

    I guess if we really have a prob with that word, maybe someone should tell coach Hornacek not to use it?

    Hormacek should have used the word “wuss” instead. But that won’t fly on a blog like this because it doesn’t have the all-important “P”; KWussy just doesn’t work. The solution here is to abandon the crude and controversial “P” word and substitute a more elegant “P” word to convey the gist – “Porcelingus”.

  30. danvt

    Hornecek should not have said it. It may not be the most flagrantly reprehensible thing ever said by a coach but at the same time I doubt Brad Stevens or Steve Kerr said it last season.

    It used to be we thought stuff like that would toughen young men up. Bob Knight used to physically rough up his players. We’ve learned that disrespect doesn’t build character or correlate with winning.

    So, coach Hornecek saying it is probably the most disappointing aspect of this.

  31. danvt

    @38 I agree z but the implication isn’t flattering for our coach or the organization if our star player is getting called a pussy in practice.

    It does not inspire confidence. That’s all.

  32. KnickfaninNJ

    Reaming players out publicly is definitely old school coaching, but I think still very common. It doesn’t have to be. In a recent podcast Doris Burke talked about watching Jeff van Gundy coach our FIBA team. She said he was really good at teaching stuff and at correcting bad behavior without attacking a player personally.

  33. JK47

    How weak is it that Hornacek didn’t even say it, but had Willy say it to KP instead? What, he’s afraid to tell KP himself because KP is gonna like whoop his ass or something?

    I don’t know about Hornacek, man. And not just because of this particular incident. The guy just does not seem like a real great leader overall.

  34. Grocer

    And yet I only see one person here is calling KPussy misogynistic.

    Using a word for female genitalia to call someone weak is inherently misogynistic because you are saying that women as a group are weak at the same time. This seems so obvious it doesn’t really need additional comment. Don’t use gendered insults. It’s real fucking simple.

  35. Grocer

    I don’t know about Hornacek, man. And not just because of this particular incident. The guy just does not seem like a real great leader overall.

    I’ve got some doubts about him too but for all we know this incident never actually happened. It doesn’t make a ton of sense. Why skip the exit meeting with Phil because you’re pissed at someone else? Until Hornacek and KP confirm it publicly I’m not buying it.

  36. JK47

    I’ve got some doubts about him too but for all we know this incident never actually happened. It doesn’t make a ton of sense. Why skip the exit meeting with Phil because you’re pissed at someone else? Until Hornacek and KP confirm it publicly I’m not buying it.

    It’s not really this alleged incident that has me giving Horny the side-eye. He just seems kind of passive-aggressive to me, which is a terrible trait for a leader to have. Maybe I’m wrong, and the guy will do a better job without Phil Jackson and his lickspittle breathing down his neck.

  37. GoNyGoNyGo

    The season can’t come soon enough for me. Only that will prevent stupid threads like this one from happening. Sad that we have to talk about ugly Knick-names

  38. johnnyhoops

    Ntilikina is now a Yankee fan and took a picture next to 6’7″ Aaron Judge. They seem to be about the same height.

  39. Grocer

    Could coaches like Vince Lombardi, Bill Belicick or even Gregg Popovich pass the PC test these days?

    It’s not a ‘PC test’, it’s a ‘you’re being a fucking asshole and you’re getting called out for it. Are you gonna act like an adult and quit it or are you gonna cry like a child and act out because you think it’s your right to be a fucking asshole and not get called out for it’ test. I figure Pop is an adult. Dunno about the others.

  40. The Glass Half Rebuilt

    Did Aaron Judge have cleats on in that picture? Because if he did Frank Ntilikina and Kristaps Porzingis will be an unreal defensive duo. That’s just too much length.

  41. KnickfaninNJ

    We know from the press that Ntilikina was drafted because tall guards who can defend and pass are good for the triangle. So now that we don’t have to run tghe triangle, it must be those attributes aren’t of any use to us.

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