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Saturday, October 25, 2014

Knicks Morning News (2013.12.29)

  • [New York Post] Injury-riddled Knicks could bring big man Tyler (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 00:37:35 -0500)
    TORONTO — The Knicks are plotting an entrance strategy for 6-foot-10 big man Jeremy Tyler, hoping he can give them a youthful spark. Knicks brass has seriously discussed re-signing Tyler…

  • [New York Times] Blake Griffin Scores 40, Clippers Beat Jazz 98-90 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 07:45:01 GMT)
    Blake Griffin’s dramatic improvement with his free throw shooting has added an important dynamic to the Los Angeles Clippers’ offense — particularly in the fourth quarter, when teams used to intentionally send him to the line because he missed more often than not.    

  • [New York Times] Banged-Up LeBron Sits Out 1-Point Win Over Blazers (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 07:15:07 GMT)
    An ailing LeBron James sat out Miami’s win over the Portland Trail Blazers on Saturday night, the first game the Heat star has missed this season.    

  • [New York Times] Bosh Carries Heat, Minus James, Past Blazers (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 07:03:37 GMT)
    Chris Bosh made his case: He wanted to go for the win.    

  • [New York Times] Millsap, Williams Help Hawks Rally Past Bobcats (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 06:15:12 GMT)
    Paul Millsap knows the Atlanta Hawks won’t have an easy time replacing Al Horford.    

  • [New York Times] Plumlee’s Career-High 22 Lead Suns Past 76ers (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 04:45:12 GMT)
    Miles Plumlee scored a career-high 22 points to go with 13 rebounds, and the Phoenix Suns bounced back from their worst loss of the season to beat the Philadelphia 76ers 115-101 Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Love and 3s Help Timberwolves Rout Bucks 117-95 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 04:09:15 GMT)
    Kevin Love had 33 points and 15 rebounds for his sixth straight double-double, and the Minnesota Timberwolves climbed back to .500 by routing the Milwaukee Bucks 117-95 on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Pacers 105, Nets 91: Nets Lose Power After Strong Start, and Pacers Pull Away (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 04:01:43 GMT)
    After a tight first half with eight lead changes, the Nets crept to a disappointing finish against the Indiana Pacers.    

  • [New York Times] Randolph, Bench Lead Grizzlies Past Nuggets 120-99 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 04:00:13 GMT)
    Zach Randolph scored 20 points and the Memphis Grizzlies got 62 points from their bench in a 120-99 victory over the Denver Nuggets on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] N.B.A. Roundup: Suspension May Be End for Bynum in Cleveland (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:55:38 GMT)
    The Cavaliers indefinitely suspended Andrew Bynum, their enigmatic center, on Saturday for “conduct detrimental to the team.”    

  • [New York Times] Rockets Rally to Beat Pelicans 107-98 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:54:00 GMT)
    Dwight Howard had 24 points and 17 rebounds, and James Harden scored 11 of his 21 points in the fourth quarter in the Houston Rockets’ 107-98 comeback victory over the New Orleans Pelicans on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Ellis Scores 22 as Mavericks Rout Bulls 105-83 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:51:03 GMT)
    Monta Ellis had 22 points and the Dallas Mavericks took control early in coasting to a 105-83 victory over the Chicago Bulls on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Raptors 115, Knicks 100: In Toronto, a Knicks Loss and a Boo-Filled Return (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:46:05 GMT)
    A late comeback fell short in a loss to the Raptors, giving the Knicks their second loss to Toronto in two nights. Former Raptor Andrea Bargnani’s contributions were limited.    

  • [New York Times] Millsap, Williams Help Hawks Rally Past Bobcats (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:42:03 GMT)
    Paul Millsap scored a season-high 31 points, Lou Williams scored 10 of his season-best 28 points in overtime and the Atlanta Hawks rallied to beat the Charlotte Bobcats 118-116 on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Pacers Use Third-Quarter Burst to Beat Nets (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 03:29:58 GMT)
    Paul George scored 24 points and Lance Stephenson added 23 to lead the Indiana Pacers to a 105-91 victory over the Brooklyn Nets on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Lowry Scores 32 as Raptors Beat Knicks 115-100 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 02:50:57 GMT)
    Kyle Lowry had a season-best 32 points and 11 assists, Terrence Ross made a career-high seven 3-pointers and the Toronto Raptors beat New York for the second straight night, topping the short-handed Knicks 115-100 on Saturday.    

  • [New York Times] Wizards Pull Away From Pistons, 106-82 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 02:39:02 GMT)
    John Wall had 20 points and 11 assists, Marcin Gortat added 16 points, and the Washington Wizards routed the Detroit Pistons 106-82 on Saturday night.    

  • [New York Times] Bass’ Block Saves Celtics in 103-100 Win Over Cavs (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 02:03:11 GMT)
    Brandon Bass couldn’t hide his smile after his timely blocked shot for the Boston Celtics.    

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks Insider: Mike hopes Melo is on Texas trip (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 06:30:35 GMT)
    Carmelo Anthony did not accompany the Knicks north of the border, but Mike Woodson is hopeful his hobbled All-Star will be back in time for the three-game swing through Texas beginning Thursday in San Antonio.    

  • [New York Daily News] End Zone: Dispirit of ’66! Big Apple sports were a disaster 47 years ago (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 05:55:49 GMT)
    Manager Ralph Houk was cleaning out his office at Yankee Stadium. The ash trays he emptied weren’t from victory cigars. It was September of 1966 and he hadn’t been through a year like it since he survived the Battle of the Bulge with just a bullet to the calf.    

  • [New York Daily News] Melo-less Knicks drop third straight, now 9-21 on season (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 02:44:13 GMT)
    Mike Woodson has leaned for weeks on the notions that the Knicks have not been playing with a “full deck” and that no team is “running away” with the shoddy Atlantic Division.    

  • [New York Newsday] Knicks fall to Raptors, 115-100 (Sun, 29 Dec 2013 00:10:06 EST)
    The Knicks ended their 2013 schedule in a fitting way, with a maddening, head-shaking performance featuring no continuity on offense, little effort on defense and a mostly half-hearted display of basketball.

  • 54 comments on “Knicks Morning News (2013.12.29)

    1. Frank O.

      it”s gotten to the point where i kinda don’t care.
      They appear now to be even more hapless than I’ve seen them.
      The only way this gets fixed is a fire sale.

    2. knickster

      Ship sank the minute all our decent players and cap flexibility were sent away in exchange for a one-trick pony named Carmelo Anthony.

      Time to rebuild.

    3. d-mar

      “Ship sank the minute all our decent players and cap flexibility were sent away in exchange for a one-trick pony named Carmelo Anthony.

      Time to rebuild”

      Yeah, true, Melo is the reason why we have without question the worst backcourt in the NBA and make guys like Kyle Lowry look like first team all-NBA players.

    4. ess-dog

      I wonder if the Clips would do a Chandler for Jordan/Collison trade?
      At least it gets us younger and gives us a fuller bench. And the contracts don’t go past the 2015 rebuild year.

      Chandler’s really our only worthwhile asset to a playoff team right now.
      I would also love to do that Bynum trade if we could dump JR’s contract in the process. Gives us even more room for the rebuild.

      With the Knicks you just can’t hope they will acquire draft picks, because it’s never going to happen. It’s prideful ignorance. Dolan thinks EVERYBODY wants to come to NYC via free agency and that’s all he needs. Yes it’s a great city, but the league has basically made this strategy close to impossible.

      Some parts of the strategy I don’t have a problem with. Is it smart to trade 2nd rounders when you can find equal or better talent in undrafted free agents every year? Sure, if you have good scouts.

      I just wish JR would heat up again so we could hope to trade that bastard. He’s dead weight.

      It’s going to be a slog until 2015, but then maybe we can get a Wes Matthews, Rondo, Milsap, Love, Marc Gasol, or Asik to go with our aging Melo.

      But yeah, I think Woody needs to go.

    5. mase

      I thought we showed flashes last night… Chandler looked good, Murray has some game, hardaway is fun to watch, jr showed some tenacity, amare was a force in the second half, iman is a strong defender besides mental lapses… I’m seeing the positive but in truth when was the last time the Knicks had a full healthy squad together?
      Just when we looked decent Tyson got hurt, Tyson comes back and we lose Felton then prigs, now Carmelo.

    6. knickster

      @#5 – i never said that melo as a player is responsible for all that ails the Knicks. I clearly stated that the FRONT OFFICE is responsible because it decided to grossly overpay for a one-trick pony like Carmelo.

    7. knickster

      Melo s no one trick pony… That’s a preposterous comment

      He is. The thing to remember is that Melo, pretty much like “ugly” beauty queens and “bad” great actors, is not being compared to common folks. Melo is not making the veteran minimum.

      So, in judging Melo against the claim that he is a superstar, I stand firmly behind my statement that he is a one-trick pony: the guy can score (very inefficiently!) and that’s about it – no other part of his game even whispers (let alone scream) “superstar”.

      “The ship be sinking and the king be naked…”

    8. stratomatic

      The sad part is that on my model, Melo is having the best year of his career!

      He’s making fewer of the types of mistakes that generally suck away whatever value he contributes as a volume scorer. His TOs and foolish PFs are down, his rebounding is up (albeit with help from Bargnani being so bad and Chandler being out), and I even sensed better shot selection over the last few weeks before he got hurt. Yet despite all that, we still aren’t any good.

      And yes, I also think the Melo trade (and of course the Amare signing) are the main reasons we have a terrible back court. We have no assets, picks, or cap room to bring in enough good players to contend because of that trade and we keep compounding the stupidity by giving away more draft picks trying to win “now” to keep Melo happy.

      At the core of the problem is that there is no one in the NY organization that value players even marginally well. That includes the owner, coach, GM, and Knicks media personnel.

      I watch the post game shows and can’t believe how bad Hahn and Wally are. I realize they are under pressure to try to spin a favorable tale for fans, but those bozos still think Bargnani is a good player, Melo is a bonafide elite superstar, and JR Smith is salvageable. The only players on the team that are reasonable values (contract vs. contribution) are a healthy Chandler, Hardaway Jr, Shumpert, and Prigioni. And considering one those players is old and the other might be starting to wear down, we are screwed. A good GM would blow up the team except for Shump and THJ and start all over.

      Trade Melo and Chandler, get younger while they still have a lot of value around the league, and get rid of Amare and JR Smith ASAP (only an idiot would want them now).

    9. Owen

      Just so I know what it feels like, I am going to defend Melo.

      He isn’t very inefficient. He’s actually barely above league average with respect to scoring efficiency on very high usage and he does it with relatively few turnovers. It would be more accurate to say he isn’t *very* efficient.

      And he’s had a decent year. Still doesn’t defend well, especially as a power forward. If he is your second biggest defender it’s an issue. But his play this year is just about the least of our problems, all things considered.

      Hmmm, that felt nice….

    10. er

      Tyson is a two trick pony……..
      Great last two games by the kb fan fave. 8 total boards lol. It’s melo melo melo lmao u guys kill me.

      Welcome to the melo is doctor evil /dearth vader portion of the program. Melo told Dolan to amnesty billups melo told Dolan to not sign Lin melo told Dolan to wipe his ass. Melo melo melo

      Melo melo melo melo melo

      Told woody to shape his facial hair in a well groomed goatee. Melo asked il mago to give up pasta selling to play for the Knicks . he also told Iman shumpert to practice shooting off the side of the rim rather than try to make shots. Melo also told Ray Felton to eat more tastycakes than vegggies

    11. d-mar

      I guess one way to look at Melo is how he might fare on a more talented team. For instance, if you substituted Melo for Durant over the last few seasons, how different would the Thunder’s results be? I would not argue for a second that Melo is as good a player as Durant, but I don’t think there would be that much difference in W-L, regular season or playoffs.

      You really do have to look at Melo in the context of who he’s surrounded by. Maybe someday we’ll be able to judge him fairly if he does have a strong supporting cast, which will probably be on a team other than the Knicks.

    12. stratomatic

      er,

      Chandler is clearly not anywhere near 100% at this stage of the season. And based on the end of last season, he might be at that stage where he’s going to start wearing down permanently. That’s why I recommend trading him before he becomes another albatross. If the Knicks were serious contenders now, you’d have to keep him because a healthy Chandler is the MVP of the team. You’d have to take a shot. But the Knicks are several years away now. What are the chances he’s still highly productive a few years from now when he already seems to be breaking down? I can’t say exactly, but I vote for trading him (and that hurts to say).

    13. Owen

      Durant is a lot better than Melo. Probably worth 6-7 games more than Melo.

      But yeah, again, Melo has been pretty good this year. Still not close to an elite talent, still not really a bargain on a max contract. But he’s been ok.

      I don’t know, things are bad. Things are even worse than 07 I think because the specter of Melo re-signing and the lack of draft picks going forward is making the next three years look almost impossibly bleak.

    14. d-mar

      So last year instead of winning 60 games and finishing first out West, the Thunder with Melo only win 53 and finish 6th? I really don’t believe that. With Westbrook as your 2nd best player, there’s not nearly as much pressure to score or to try and do too much offensively. And how did things work out for Durant in the playoffs last year without Westbrook?

      He’s better, no doubt, but I don’t think he’d be having much fun playing with the bunch of scrubs that currently constitute the NY Knicks.

    15. Owen

      D-Mar – Thinking about it, I would probably go the other way and say my estimate was too low. A 50 win team with Melo is probably a 60 win team with Durant and a championship contender.

      The disparity between Lebron, Durant, Paul, Love, and I guess maybe George (don’t know if I am really a believer) and everyone else is profound.

      Melo just isn’t in that zip code, imo.

    16. max fisher-cohen

      So let’s say after the heat game, the Knicks are 9-25, and let’s say also that to make the playoffs in the east, you need 36 wins. That would mean the Knicks would need to finish out the season 27-21, which is still totally possible IMO if everyone gets healthy and Woodson goes back to two PG lineups while cutting Bargnani down to about 15 MPG.

      I’m going to target February 9th as reckoning day for the Knicks. From now until February 9th, they play three games against teams they’ve beaten this season — vs Brooklyn, vs Charlotte and @ Milwaukee. If they win just those three and maybe four other games, their record at that point would be 16-35, which would necessitate a 21-11 close to the season to get to 36 wins, and even James Dolan will have to accept that whether or not they make a trade, the playoffs are almost definitely out of reach. That’s 11 days before the trade deadline, giving the Knicks a full 11 days to be beaten down by the media for not making moves, for Anthony to be beaten down with questions about why he would possibly stay with NY after this awful season.

      That IMO is the only way this season becomes interesting. If the Knicks manage to get things together to a degree and rather than going 7-14 over these next 21 games, they instead go 10-11 or something like that, I think nothing changes, and the Knicks maybe make it in as a low seed or maybe don’t, but they just wait and (stupidly) pray that Melo re-signs. If not though, the pressure may be high enough to force Dolan to accept a rebuild. What will he have to look forward to, after all? The knicks likely won’t be much better in 13/14, and who’s going to want to join a 40 win team (optimistically) losing it’s 2nd best player (Chandler) and with lots of aging players? Might as well blow it up and tank 13/14 and see what happens in the free agent period in 2015.

    17. kronicfatigue

      If this team gets healthy, they’ll be good enough to beat bad teams consistently. But so what? We’re seeing things during these shorthanded games that should be cause for concern. JR Smith isn’t suddenly going to get un-stupid when Chandler and Melo are on the court at the same time. ISOs are ISOs and aren’t a successful end of the game strategy.

      What’s the current upside? Back into the playoffs because the Atlantic division is terrible, then beat Charlotte in the first round? Will that make anyone feel good?

    18. maxwell_3g

      I wasn’t the only one but I said this at the melo trade, when we were building around max contracts of amare and melo. it was never going to work and I stated we could wait 4 years and hopefully learn something about the value of young players and cap flexibility. when I said that (I was still on the espn boards at the time) I was dreading the next 4 years but had to think that we would learn our lesson and this would never happen again.
      and now, as it becomes 2014 and people are looking to 2015, our plan seems to be…..resign a 30 year old melo and then get another max players, such as a currently injured rondo, or kevin love to join him. in other words, lets dream about another pairing that wont work and will eat up our cap space.
      for the love of God, as a Knicks fan, it is unbelievable to me that anyone would suggest we should look to resign melo as opposed to turn him into any assets possible. same with chandler. of course, same with stat, but there are no assets to obtain for him, and Im not willing to give assets just to get him off the books early.
      we are approaching decision time again, a time that will affect the knicks for the next 1/2 a decade. I doubt that we have learned anything from allan Houston, to keith van horn, tim Thomas, to stephon Marbury, to penny hardaway, to Antonio mcdyess, to steve francis, to Jerome james, to eddy curry, to jarred Jeffries, to Jamaal Crawford, to Zach Randolph, to amare stoudamire, to Carmelo Anthony, to ??????

    19. hoolahoop

      Melo s no one trick pony… That’s a preposterous comment

      Well, he’s no four legged pony either.

      His game is flawed. His talent level and confidence allow him to dictate ball domination at the expense of winning, especially against high level teams.

    20. hoolahoop

      My biggest gripe with Melo is that he has the talent to be one of the top three players in the league, maybe the best, but his style and approach to the game make him a perennial loser.

    21. hoolahoop

      So last year instead of winning 60 games and finishing first out West, the Thunder with Melo only win 53 and finish 6th? I really don’t believe that. With Westbrook as your 2nd best player, there’s not nearly as much pressure to score or to try and do too much offensively. And how did things work out for Durant in the playoffs last year without Westbrook?

      I disagree. I think OKC is a 6 – 8 seed, and a first round exit with Melo replacing Durant. Not that Durant is better athletically, but Melo is a chemistry killer. Everybody on OKC, including Westbrook, would not look nearly as good playing with Melo. And I doubt Scott Brooks is the coach that would make Melo play smart basketball.

    22. er

      Yes hoolahoop. Melo who was a two seed and top 4 seed the last 3 years in Denver with less talent would be 6-8 with okc. Yep you got it

    23. knickster

      Open question for my fellow posters:

      What do you think we could *realistically* get for Melo in terms of assets (young talent, picks) toward a full rebuild?
      I would love to have the opportunity of rooting for a mediocre 20014 team full of young players getting ready to join one or two solid free agents (not necessarily max-salary players) in 2015. At this point, I don’t even think of a championship – I just want a team I can root for. I truly dislike most of our roster.

    24. d-mar

      @27 that’s just way over the top, so Melo would turn Westbrook into an average PG and Ibaka into an average defender? C’mon man, you may not like the way he plays, but to argue that he makes other players worse? Yeah, he’s really bringing down Felton, Shumpert and JR, such a shame their seasons are being derailed by selfish Melo.

    25. hoolahoop

      Yes hoolahoop. Melo who was a two seed and top 4 seed the last 3 years in Denver with less talent would be 6-8 with okc. Yep you got it

      Melo averaged 46 wins in Denver. Made it out of the first round once. 54 wins (highest) once. Last season Denver had 57 wins.
      He’s a real winner.

    26. max fisher-cohen

      @Knickster — IMO the best two assets out there right now are NY’s 2014 pick and the Nets’ 2016 pick, both of which look to be high lottery. I would trade Melo for either of those two assets. Denver I’m sure wouldn’t want Melo back, but a three way trade with Melo going to LAC and Griffin going to Denver might work, and Denver might even throw in our swap rights if we take back McGee’s bad contract. Of course, that wouldn’t happen for ego reasons.

      Boston has a ton of assets right now, and I wouldn’t be surprised if they went right back into win now mode. Brooklyn’s pick as become super valuable with the way the team is crashing and burning, so I could see a trade of Anthony and Chandler for the two Nets picks plus Olynyk. If we take back all their bad contracts in some multi team deal, some of which we’d have to take to make salaries match, we might even get another first rounder or two.

    27. hoolahoop

      C’mon man, you may not like the way he plays, but to argue that he makes other players worse? Yeah, he’s really bringing down Felton, Shumpert and JR, such a shame their seasons are being derailed by selfish Melo.

      Agreed. mgmt has done a putrid job, including the deal for Melo.
      And yes – Melo makes other players worse. exhibit A – Amare was healthy and having a great season when Melo arrived.

    28. ess-dog

      A Melo trade would be tough. I’m not sure any team wants him to be “the guy” now, but he has a guy contract. The Lakers could be desperate enough, but D’Antoni’s there. I’m sure Chris Paul would lobby for Melo to the Clips. There’s Sacramento of course, but I doubt Melo would want to go there.
      I would start any trade around two 1sts and go from there, but the Knicks seem to hate draft picks for some reason. I just don’t see it.

    29. BigBlueAL

      For everyone who wants to rebuild and pickup all these 1st rd picks, what the hell makes you think the Knicks will actually make smart draft picks with them?? Plus its not like they will be able to trade Melo/Chandler and get a top 5 pick for the 2014 draft. Bad teams who are tanking this season are not going to trade away their 1st rd picks. Dunno how excited I will be to trade Melo and/or Chandler for a 2015 or 2016 1st rd pick from a team that will probably be good enough in those years that the pick wont even be a lottery pick.

      I guess the best solution would be to just really suck next season since they have their own 2015 1st rd pick and maybe pickup another 1st rd pick from that draft which even if its later in the 1st rd would be decent and I guess if possible also get a 2016 1st rd pick regardless of how low it could be since the Knicks dont even have a 1st rd pick that year. I dunno man, rebuilding thru the draft when you dont even have your own 1st rd pick in 2 of the next 3 years isnt exactly ideal.

    30. BigBlueAL

      Speaking of Melo, how many players could have replaced Melo on the 2012-13 Knicks and still win 54 games if not more?? Obviously LeBron/Durant/CP3 but thats a given, not sure how many other players could have handled the burden of the high usage on offense that Melo handled and been as successful as Melo and the team’s offense was.

      Im not saying Melo is a Top 5 player because he isnt, but he certainly isnt some overrated nowhere near a max player like his detractors on this site make him out to be either. Melo is a very good player, probably a borderline Top 10-15 player. He certainly isnt worth the possible max contract he can re-sign with the Knicks but that doesnt to me lessen his value as a player.

    31. Hubert

      Max F-C, I think Boston is too smart to make that trade.

      Besides, once you move to tank mode and get your fan base to accept it, it’s like getting free time. They literally have two years of cashing paychecks and having job security and the patience to wait for the right opportunity.

      Paying Melo Super Max money and going all in with him and a declining Chandler is not something I’d want to give that up for.

      The Denver – LAC 3 way scenario is more interesting, tho if we could get Blake I wouldn’t want to flip him, I’d happily build around him.

      I don’t think Sterling wants to pay Melo tho and is probably happy with Blake. But if you offered Melo and Tyson would that be too much to turn down?

    32. ess-dog

      Blake seems pretty much untradable to me, but who knows?

      My hunch is that Dolan WILL pay Melo his extension money (as much as he wants.)

      So realistically, you have to try and trade everything else of value we have and clear as much cap space as possible by 2015.

      I’m sure Dolan will offer Rondo a bunch of under the table money to sign a smaller contract anyway, right?

    33. ess-dog

      Also, if we can trade Tyson/Felton for an expiring contract(s), then we can make a play for Lance (Born Ready) Stephenson!

    34. er

      Oolahoop how many wins have love, Durant and cp3 avg in the west? Smh I would love to see it so let’s see some of your excellent math skills.

      Cp and melo and love have had guy make the asg with them but none on the level of Westbrook and harden but ok Melo is a loser

      If you weren’t on lal, spurs phx, or Dallas you weren’t winnin much in those days.

    35. Hubert

      I wonder what would happen if we don’t trade Melo and Blake has another disappointing playoff and the Clips go out in round 1 again.

      We’re not just going to get Blake for Melo unless there is something driving LA into short term thinking and CAA works something out. And that’s unlikely to happen by Feb.

      But, let’s say Blake disappoints in the playoffs and the national narrative becomes “Blake isn’t clutch”, and Chris Paul (who reportedly is often at odds w Blake anyway) gets political within the Clippers’ organization, and Melo realizes that signing in NY is a terrible decision for his career (which it would be) and forces us to move him..then I could potentially see a blockbuster sign and trade happening in the offseason.

      But I think you need something like that to make it happen. Because I don’t think between now and Feb the Knicks will stop being delusional or the Clippers will be sufficiently compelled to make the move.

    36. yellowboy90

      @ Hubert There is no way the great Chris Paul does not make it out of the 1st round this year. It is a lock.

    37. knickster

      If the general consensus is that we have little or no chance of getting anything of value for melo this year, doesn’t that strengthen the Knicks’ position when it comes to negotiating a new contract? However, I suspect Melo may not opt out after all, given that he does not seem to have a great number of “suitable suitors”…

    38. JK47

      Melo will probably just come back here for the max, and the front office will probably offload some of the expiring contracts for longer contracts in the name of “surrounding Melo with talent,” also known to us as “fucking up the 2016 season and beyond.”

    39. bobneptune

      It is clear there is no way to build a team around Melo with the assets currently on the roster and waiting another years to recreate the mess of trying to get a top UFA to sing with an aging Melo and no complementary players on the roster is foolish.

      The way to go is to move Melo and Chandler for low paid, young, efficient, up and coming players/Picks, and with your 2015 likely lottery pick then have 5 or 6 cheap pieces to hopefully seduce one or 2 top UFA’s in 2016.

      Keep Shumpert , Hardaway and Prigs,

      Call Houston and see if they like Melo for Terrence Jones, Lin (who is back-up when Beverly is healthy) and Asik (who doesn’t play) and their #22 pick this year. A Melo/Harden/Parsons/Howard/Beverly line up would be awfully tough to defend.

      Call OKC and see if they like Chandler for Jeremy Lamb, the corpse of Perkins and their #23 pick. Chandler helps them immensely in potential trouble match-ups with Indiana and SAS

    40. Robtachi

      Ship sank the minute all our decent players and cap flexibility were sent away in exchange for a one-trick pony named Carmelo Anthony.

      Time to rebuild.

      Oh my freaking god, just stop with this steaming horse shit. YES, this season is sunk and this current team sucks. YES the Knicks gave up too many assets for Melo at the time. But for chrissake this organization won 54 games and a very respectable Atlantic Division last year, so STOP perpetuating this narrative that they never had a chance to do anything the moment they acquired Carmelo Anthony. I’m so tired of this overly derivative, boneheaded narrative. The Knicks were mediocre Melo’s first year and improved significantly each season until this one which no one would argue has been disastrous. But the insistence that all improvements and accomplishments to this point were nothing more than an inconvenient mirage is brainless and overly simplistic. One guy cannot possibly change the fortunes of a franchise so drastically such that you can heap the results of one season among four entirely upon him. LeBron James is the greatest player since Jordan, and he had to go with ANOTHER All-Star (Bosh) in free agency to turn Miami into a perennial contender. And by the way, the Heat were already a 47-win, mid-conference seed playoff team with a track record of success by the time he got there. I don’t think anybody would argue the Knicks have been working from a MUCH lower starting point (read: utter NBA ignominy). I’m not saying we should be happy with how things have gone. I’m not saying we should be satisfied with this season or those past. I’m saying it’s past time we buried the narrative that Carmelo Anthony buried the Knicks all by himself. The organization bears the responsibility, individual players are just easy and lazy targets.

    41. Robtachi

      Melo averaged 46 wins in Denver. Made it out of the first round once. 54 wins (highest) once. Last season Denver had 57 wins.
      He’s a real winner.

      Team wins as they relate to individual players are about as useful a metric in basketball as they are to a pitcher in baseball.

      Useless, abstract and highly circumstantial.

    42. Brian Cronin

      The utility of team wins as they relate to individual players seems to vary depending on what argument is being made on any given day.

    43. Brian Cronin

      Watching a marathon of the first season of JB Smoove’s interview show on MSG. John Sally just told this absurd story about running into Oakley and MJ at the Kentucky Derby two years ago. Oakley asks him whether MJ could still take Kobe. Sally says no and Oakley punches him in the stomach. Oakley is a legend.

    44. Hubert

      There is no way the great Chris Paul does not make it out of the 1st round this year. It is a lock.

      No, it really isn’t. It’s likely, sure. But frankly, even a second round exit would be considered a very large disappointment. The Clippers are in win now mode. At least, Chris Paul is. But they’re really not good enough to win it all now, in my opinion, in part because DeAndre Jordan offers them so little as an interior defender and Blake (unlike Melo) is still too early in his development. And for us to get Blake, I think you’ll need Paul to be frustrated and CAA to pull some strings. Neither of which is likely to happen before February, but might happen in the summer if Paul and Melo are both sufficiently disgruntled.

    45. Hubert

      Melo will probably just come back here for the max, and the front office will probably offload some of the expiring contracts for longer contracts in the name of “surrounding Melo with talent,” also known to us as “fucking up the 2016 season and beyond.”

      Now this is a man who’s been around the block a while and knows what’s likely to happen.

      But it’s much more fun to make believe we’re smart and imagine what we’d do if we were.

    46. Hubert

      If the general consensus is that we have little or no chance of getting anything of value for melo this year, doesn’t that strengthen the Knicks’ position when it comes to negotiating a new contract?

      As a rule of thumb, the Knicks have no strength in their negotiating position because their owner is a petulant, spoiled brat who, when he wants his toy, will fuck up everything to get it. And everyone we’re negotiating with knows this.

      Seriously, there could 20 teams under the cap, all of them could decide not to offer Melo a contract, and Dolan would still give him the super max.

    47. knickster

      @46

      One guy cannot possibly change the fortunes of a franchise so drastically such that you can heap the results of one season among four entirely upon him.

      You have it backwards: it’s the front office – not me or other fans – who believed that Carmelo could be a fortune-changer by himself. He was not that type of player in Denver. He has not been that type of player in New York. He is not capable of that because, like JR Smith, he has flashes of greatness followed by ample doses of stupidity; after a while, you realize the greatness is just an illusion, a tease. The JR we get is the real JR. The Melo we get is the real Melo. They won’t ever elevate their game beyond what they have provided their entire careers.

      At some point, even the most rose-colored glasses have to come off and reality has to sink in: we are not a good basketball team and Melo is not a franchise player.

      The proof? We can’t even get 1/4 of what we paid for Melo just 3 years ago!

      Melo is a good, even great player – just not worth his asking price. Sorry for perpetuating reality.

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