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Monday, September 22, 2014

Knicks Morning News (2013.12.19)

  • [ESPN.com - New York Knicks] Smith shot 17 3s!? J.R. would 'do it again' (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:15:13 EDT)
    J.R. Smith had some interesting things to say about his shot selection after Wednesday’s win over Milwaukee. “Lol 17 threes tho! Had to say damn my self!” Smith tweeted after taking 17 three-pointers against the Bucks. He then added: “But trust me give me that chance again I’ll shoot it again!” As if anyone doubted that. Smith tied a team record with his 17 attempts from deep. He hit five of those 17 attempts and finished 7-for-23 for 19 points.

  • [ESPN.com - New York Knicks] Knicks pick up Bargnani after ill-timed 3 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 01:41:12 EDT)
    MILWAUKEE — Andrea Bargnani threw up a 3 after the Knicks came out of a timeout late in the first overtime. With the Knicks leading 94-92, J.R. Smith inbounded the ball to Beno Udrih with 33 seconds left in the opening extra session. Udrih dished off to Carmelo Anthony, who missed, but Tyson Chandler grabbed the rebound. The Knicks worked the ball around the perimeter before it landed in Bargnani’s hands with 11.9 seconds to play. He missed his 3-pointer, and the Bucks rebounded the errant shot and quickly called a timeout.

  • [ESPN.com - New York Knicks] Chandler cruises through huge test (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 00:49:13 EDT)
    MILWAUKEE — Tyson Chandler didn’t think he’d get this big of a test in his first game since early November.Carmelo Anthony scored eight of his 29 points in the second overtime, and Chandler played almost 37 minutes in his return to action, lending a huge defensive presence as the New York Knicks outlasted the Milwaukee Bucks 107-101 on Wednesday night. Chandler hustled and muscled his way to nine points on 3-of-4 shooting, 3-for-4 from the line and 9 rebounds, including several key ones down the stretch in the second overtime.

  • [New York Post] It doesn’t get much uglier, but it’s a win (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 00:15:31 -0500)
    MILWAUKEE — There comes a moment in every Knicks game when hilarity ambles over to the scorer's table, draws a buzzer, shuffles onto the floor, and announces: "I got this.”…

  • [New York Newsday] Tyson Chandler's return sparks Knicks in double-overtime win over Bucks (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 00:56:38 EST)
    The return of Tyson Chandler looked as if it would save the Knicks and help them avoid another humiliating loss.

  • [New York Daily News] Buck Wild: Knicks take two OTs to defeat worst team in NBA (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 06:28:51 GMT)
    The Knicks nearly crashed all the way to rock bottom on Wednesday night, but they barely squeezed out a shaky and wild double-overtime win over the team with the worst record in the NBA.    

  • [New York Daily News] Woody backtracks, looks to set Amar’e story straight (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 06:27:53 GMT)
    Mike Woodson has been engulfed by confusion on and off the court this week, and he attempted to clarify his public miscommunication with Amar’e Stoudemire before Wednesday’s game against the Bucks.    

  • [New York Daily News] Knicks Insider: Bargnani’s bad gaffe doesn’t cost game (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 06:27:15 GMT)
    Andrea Bargnani’s gaffe during the first overtime of Wednesday’s double-OT outlasting of the Bucks almost was as inexcusable — and as costly — as Mike Woodson’s failure to call a timeout one game earlier.    

  • [New York Times] Heat Top Pacers in Last Meeting Until March (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 08:10:57 GMT)
    The best rivalry in the Eastern Conference is now on hiatus until March 26.    

  • [New York Times] Clippers Beat Pelicans 108-95 for 3rd Win in a Row (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 06:10:53 GMT)
    Blake Griffin and DeAndre Jordan each had a double-double, and the Los Angeles Clippers beat the New Orleans Pelicans 108-95 Wednesday night to give coach Doc Rivers a victory over his son’s team.    

  • [New York Times] Knicks 107, Bucks 101 (2OT): Knicks Get a Much-Needed Victory, Albeit a Frustrating One (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 05:37:52 GMT)
    After missing chances to win in regulation and in overtime in Milwaukee, the Knicks finally prevailed in Tyson Chandler’s first game back from an injury.    

  • [New York Times] Howard Leads Rockets Over Bulls 109-94 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 05:31:55 GMT)
    Dwight Howard scored 23 points and James Harden and Chandler Parsons added 19 each as the Houston Rockets used a big third-quarter run to pull away for a 109-94 win over the Chicago Bulls on Wednesday night.    

  • [New York Times] N.B.A. Roundup: Heat Use Late 10-0 Spurt to Beat East-Leading Pacers (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 05:04:31 GMT)
    Dwyane Wade scored 32 points as the Heat moved within a game of the Eastern Conference-leading Pacers.    

  • [New York Times] Knicks 107, Bucks 101 (2OT): Knicks Struggle to Win in Chandler’s Return (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 05:04:13 GMT)
    After missing chances to win in regulation and in overtime in Milwaukee, the Knicks finally prevailed in Tyson Chandler’s first game back from an injury.    

  • [New York Times] Ginobili, Spurs Snap Suns’ 5-Game Winning Streak (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 04:58:50 GMT)
    Manu Ginobili scored 11 of his 24 points in the final four-plus minutes, and the San Antonio Spurs pulled away for a 108-101 victory over Phoenix on Wednesday night, snapping the Suns’ five-game winning streak.    

  • [New York Times] Rodman Says He’s Going to North Korea for Fun, Not to Talk Politics (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 04:49:33 GMT)
    Retired U.S. basketball star Dennis Rodman said on Thursday he was not going to North Korea to talk about politics or human rights, despite political tension surrounding the execution of leader Kim Jong Un’s uncle.    

  • [New York Times] Nowitzki Leads Mavs Past Depleted Grizzlies 105-88 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 04:40:43 GMT)
    Dirk Nowitzki scored 20 points in his return to the lineup and the Dallas Mavericks defeated the short-handed Memphis Grizzlies 105-88 on Wednesday night.    

  • [New York Times] Knicks Outlast Bucks 107-101 in Double OT (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 04:31:42 GMT)
    Tyson Chandler returned from injury and J.R. Smith hit a go-ahead jumper in the second overtime and the New York Knicks beat the Milwaukee Bucks 107-101 on Wednesday night.    

  • [New York Times] Late Run Lifts Heat Past Pacers 97-94 in Showdown (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 04:22:52 GMT)
    For so much of the night, just about everything was going wrong for the Miami Heat. They were missing every 3-pointer, arguing plenty of calls, even screaming at one another.    

  • [New York Times] Wizards 113, Nets 107: With Their Stars (but Not Their Act) Together, the Nets Come Up Short (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:52:32 GMT)
    Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Joe Johnson, Deron Williams and Brook Lopez played together in the fourth quarter and nearly rallied the team from an 8-point deficit.    

  • [New York Times] Love Outplays Aldridge to Lead Wolves Past Blazers (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:31:47 GMT)
    Kevin Love made an emphatic case for the title of the NBA’s best power forward.    

  • [New York Times] Korver’s 3s Lead Atlanta Past Sacramento (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:22:56 GMT)
    Kyle Korver made seven consecutive 3-point attempts on his way to a season-high 28 points, leading the Atlanta Hawks to a 124-107 victory over the Sacramento Kings on Wednesday night.    

  • [New York Times] Jennings Carries Pistons Past Celtics 107-106 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:22:51 GMT)
    Brandon Jennings scored 28 points, making a key 3-pointer with 46.7 seconds left, and matched his season high with 14 assists Wednesday night and the Detroit Pistons held on for a 107-106 win over the Boston Celtics.    

  • [New York Times] Wall Scores 21, Wizards Beat Nets 113-107 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:16:56 GMT)
    John Wall scored 21 points and made two big defensive plays against Deron Williams down the stretch to lead the Washington Wizards to a 113-107 victory over the Brooklyn Nets on Wednesday night.    

  • [New York Times] Walker Hits OT Winner, Bobcats Top Raptors 104-102 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 03:10:45 GMT)
    Kemba Walker hit a buzzer-beating jump shot in overtime and the Charlotte Bobcats beat the Raptors 104-102 on Wednesday night, snapping a three-game losing streak in Toronto.    

  • [New York Times] Trey Burke’s 30 Leads Jazz Past Magic, 86-82 (Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:52:59 GMT)
    Trey Burke had a career-high 30 points and eight assists, Gordon Hayward added 15 points and the Utah Jazz held off the Orlando Magic 86-82 on Wednesday night.    

  • 68 comments on “Knicks Morning News (2013.12.19)

    1. chrisk06811

      Beno played well, but how does Shump not step up in a game like this? 6 boards and 5 dimes is nice, but how do you not hit a single shot? Is he just dejected, or if he not as good as we thought he was?

    2. pablopilot

      Beno played well, but how does Shump not step up in a game like this? 6 boards and 5 dimes is nice, but how do you not hit a single shot? Is he just dejected, or if he not as good as we thought he was?

      The latter, for sure. Well, maybe both…

    3. salbls

      I think Shumpert needs to play for a team that runs a lot and wins in transition. That will never be this team as long as Carmelo is there, and it doesn’t matter if they find some young legs. This will be a walk it up, iso oriented offense. Melo is a great rebounder when he wants to be, but neither he nor Chandler look for the quick outlet pass. It often looks like Sumpert is just outrunning everyone on his own team, for no purpose. Let him get a few transition buckets and I bet his J will improve.

    4. hoolahoop

      Woodson tries to reign in JR’s shooting and JR responds by taking only one shot the next game. A couple of games later he takes 17 3′s.
      Accountability?

    5. johnno

      I realize that I am very much in the minority (ok, I might be a member of a club that has exactly 0 members besides me) but I enjoyed last night’s game. Despite still another example of the team’s collective single digit basketball IQ, I even took some positives from the game –
      – The team has not quit on Woodson. They could have easitly rolled over in OT, but they didn’t.
      – Melo has not quit on Woodson. Despite having a horrible shooting night, he managed to come through in the 51st through 55th minute that he played.
      – JR, despite his many faults and despite a horrible shooting night, showed me something — i.e., hitting two big threes when everyone assumed that he would brick them.
      – The team has not turned on, or quit on, each other.
      – Tyson Chandler is a very very tough guy, not to mention a real professional and a pretty good basketball player.
      – I realize that the Bucks stink, but the Knicks won a game in which their third string point guard had to play 40+ minutes because their 1st, 2nd and 4th string PGs were all hurt.
      Call me crazy (as I am sure many of you will and, if they get blown out by the Grizzlies, I will call myself crazy) but I think that Chandler’s performance last night could have the same inspirational impact on the team that Kurt Thomas’s game in Utah had last year. I also think that, after losing so many games in mind-numbing fashion this season, winning a game that they were in a real position to lose took a big monkey off of their backs.

    6. johnno

      By the way, I wish that people would stop blaming everyone but Shumpert for Shumpert’s lousy play. He needs to toughen up and start playing better.

    7. DRed

      Call me crazy (as I am sure many of you will and, if they get blown out by the Grizzlies, I will call myself crazy)

      Memphis is 2-8 over their last 10 games. Memphis is 5-10 at home. The Grizzlies suck right now. We should, at least, be competitive.

    8. Nick C.

      Maybe Shumpert wasn’t really as good as we wished. Sure he picked Dewayne Wade clean x2 in the playoffs as a rookie and hit some shots v. Indy last year but still. Is this another curse of the Knicks (Fields, Shump and to some extent Balkman) or their win now mentality or do we see and project the best from the home grown talent?

    9. JK47

      Shumpert is, at best, a serviceable rotation guard. His shortcomings are well-documented at this point. He doesn’t finish well and doesn’t get to the free throw line, and he’s a mediocre shooter from distance. He’s probably a good defender but who can really tell considering the hare-brained defensive scheme this team plays.

    10. Frank

      Maybe it’s just me, but Shumpert just seems to play better on both sides of the ball when he’s guarding the guy with the ball. Maybe it gets him into an aggressive mindset that carries over. But the kid just seems so tentative out there. On the break he doesn’t know whether to take it hard to the hoop or pass it out. When he gets the ball swung to him, he hesitates for a half-second which means the window to shoot the open 3 has passed. Almost every time he shoots it looks like he’s already decided to do so well before the play presents itself – like he has to plan it seconds in advance rather than just attacking.

      I’d like to see the Knicks run some plays for him to get him an open 3 or something attacking the rim. He needs his confidence back, and he basically excludes himself from the offense when left to his own devices.

      I dunno. He certainly has regressed. But the season is still sorta young, and so is he.

    11. Nick C.

      Has anyone ever actually run with him? If they have I can’t remember it unless it is THJ. It seems like the Knicks run less than 5x a game and usually only b/c of a steal near halfcourt. Any data on where they rank?

    12. DRed

      Shump is still a solid player. He’s still one of our better back court players. I think this year we’re focusing too hard on his negatives while in the past we focused too much on his positives. His 3-point shot has totally vanished lately, but he’s still shooting better from downtown than MWP, fucking Bargnani and Ray-Ray. If he can rediscover his outside shooting he’ll be a very good player. Or maybe we’re using him incorrectly this season. But it’s too soon to switch from “This kid’s about to be a star” to “trade this bust immediately”.

    13. mokers

      I think Shumpert would be good on a team with a fast break. Hell, even Beno tries to move the ball. There were a few times when he would drive the baseline looking for somebody to dish only to have the pull the ball out. Everybody seems to just want to run to the 3pt line and float until they get set. Having an idea on transition would help with easy buckets, but why should Woodson work on getting easy buckets?

      I feel bad for my fiancee. Her best friend is a Heat fan, and we live in the Bay Area so we see lots of Warriors games on TV, but she never had a reason to watch too much NBA until my LeaguePass loving butt moved in. She has been watching mostly Knicks games now and I am afraid that I am ruining basketball for her. When watching the game last night, she used the best malpropism to describe Bargnani. After that stupid shot, she said “How long has Biscotti played? Maybe he’ll learn?” with an optimistic lilt I am sure was intended to make me feel better. So I will call Bargs Biscotti since I can at least enjoy that name if not his performance on the court.

      Re: The minutes people are playing. Like others said, we all saw this at the beginning of the year. There was the possibility of using a fairly deep bench to play hot hand/ matchups and not need to run guys out there past their limits. I’m expecting Melo to evaporate at any point soon and afraid Chandler is soon going to be right behind him.

    14. DRed

      and afraid Chandler is soon going to be right behind him.

      “I apologized to him [for playing him so much], but hell, I needed him.”

      Well, thank goodness you got that win, coach. Nobody can say you didn’t beat the worst team in the NBA in two overtimes.

    15. JK47

      The inability of the guards on this team to take the ball to the hole is a pretty crippling weakness, reflected in the teams dismal free throw rate. Our guards don’t get to the line at all; look at free throw attempts per 36 minutes– there’s not a guard on the roster that averages more than 2 free throws per 36. I know the team plays a slow pace but that is still pitiful.

      With the offensive talent that’s on the team, you’d expect the Knicks to be better than 19th in the league on offense, but the way they play they rarely get easy points. They don’t score a lot in transition and they don’t get to the free throw line.

    16. DRed

      JK, we’re also 19th in 3 point percentage. We’re just not good on offense, probably to some degree because of the way coach allots playing time, but also because we replaced good offensive players with mediocre ones.

    17. Crumple

      5-4 in their last 9 games!

      And now the big man is back!

      Obviously this is a pretty flawed team and they are playing badly to boot….but let’s get 3 of the next 5 and go from there in 2014.

    18. DRed

      San Antonio is the only team in the NBA with a FTr lower than our own, but they also have one of the league’s best offenses. I agree that our low FTr doesn’t help, but with us it’s no one thing. Basically, all we’re really good at is not turning the ball over. 3PT shooting, 2 PT shooting, ORB, Assist Rate-we’re below average at all of them. Aside from being a decent defensive rebounding team, we’re not good at anything else on offense.

    19. Frank

      This is just mind-boggling:

      @IanBegley: Woody: “I think true fans who know what’s going on … they accept what’s going on around me & there r some who don’t accept it & that’s OK

      Holy Sh*t. “They accept what’s going on around me”?!?!?!?!?!!?!? Like you’re blameless in this whole clusterf*ck and the whole thing is just happening to you?!?!!?

      I was semi-reserving judgement re: his motivations before, but between the “Melo was begging for the ball”, “Joe Johnson didn’t need a TO in that situation”, playing Tyson 37 minutes, “Amare will be out awhile– no wait sorry he’s playing 30 minutes on Saturday, you guys ran with that story and I didn’t say anything like that”, and “they accept what’s going on around me”, I, a “true fan”, am done with this coach. Lying snake like Hubert said.

    20. yellowboy90

      Shump is a two leg jumper that lacks explosion when jumping off of one. This makes it difficult to finish on fast breaks. What makes it worst is that the he tries to do the worst euro step in the nba and that decrease his explosion even more which leads to his attempts getting block.

      Ii do agree with Frank that I would like them to run him off screens to get him going. Let him curl to the rim or take the 15 ft jumper. Even run an elevator screen for him to shoot a three. Maybe he doesn’t do well in practice. IDK, they seem to run THJr off of screens but Shump just stands out there.

    21. flossy

      I think Shumpert needs to play for a team that runs a lot and wins in transition. That will never be this team as long as Carmelo is there, and it doesn’t matter if they find some young legs.

      Why do you say that? Here’s how Melo’s Denver teams ranked in terms of pace of play:

      1st, 4th, 2nd, 2nd, 1st, 6th, 5th, 2nd.

      Now here’s the pace for Mike Woodson-coached teams (excluding the 24 games he inherited from MDA):

      13th, 17th, 24th, 18th, 24th, 27th, 26th, 29th.

    22. Hubert

      Woodson tries to reign in JR’s shooting and JR responds by taking only one shot the next game. A couple of games later he takes 17 3?s.
      Accountability?

      And he benched him against the Hawks but he plays 48 minutes last night.

      Naturally, we played our best stretch of basketball this month while he was benched. But did Couch notice? Of course not.

    23. Hubert

      Frank December 19, 2013 at 2:45 pm

      This is just mind-boggling:

      @IanBegley: Woody: “I think true fans who know what’s going on … they accept what’s going on around me & there r some who don’t accept it & that’s OK

      Holy Sh*t. “They accept what’s going on around me”?!?!?!?!?!!?!? Like you’re blameless in this whole clusterf*ck and the whole thing is just happening to you?!?!!?

      I was semi-reserving judgement re: his motivations before, but between the “Melo was begging for the ball”, “Joe Johnson didn’t need a TO in that situation”, playing Tyson 37 minutes, “Amare will be out awhile– no wait sorry he’s playing 30 minutes on Saturday, you guys ran with that story and I didn’t say anything like that”, and “they accept what’s going on around me”, I, a “true fan”, am done with this coach. Lying snake like Hubert said.

      When I see him say things like this, it becomes very obvious that he has real, firm backing from the owner. This must be what they believe together. If it wasn’t, it would be as galling to his superiors as it is to us.

      Remember, Dolan values unity & loyalty more than competence. It highly likely he is firmly behind Woodson, despite rumors of a security guard following him around everywhere he goes.

    24. JK47

      The sheer magnitude of JR’s awfulness is kind of incredible. It is really hard to win when you give 30 minutes a night to a high-volume 33% shooter who plays 30+ MPG and is also a horrendous defender. He’s creating so much negative value it’s insane.

    25. nicos

      I think JR can’t be anywhere near 100%. He’s never been a great defender but most of his issues on that end were caused by inattention (ball watching) or poor decision making (gambling for steals). Now everybody is just blowing by him with ease- no screens necessary- and that wasn’t the case last year. Hardaway is almost as bad but at least he’s hitting shots so there’s absolutely no reason JR should be playing twice as many minutes as THJ. I’m hopeful that having Shump play a few minutes a night at point guard while everyone is hurt might help get him out of his slump- he just seems totally lost out on the wing- this should at least help get him moving to some other spots on the floor and as Frank mentioned above, he seems much more engaged when he gets to defend on the ball. I’m still shocked he’s struggled as much as he has- he shot pretty well in camp and the first week of the season and then fell off of a cliff.

    26. ephus

      I do not know what goes through James Dolan’s mind and I doubt that anyone who posts on this blog does either. It’s pretty clear that talking outside of the MSG walls about MSG issues is a firing offense. It’s also pretty clear that Dolan has a hair trigger on some issues and an extremely slow fuse on others. Glen Sather has survived for over two decades despite some horrific teams (and 1 Stanley Cup).

      I doubt that there is a linear path from gruesome on-court performance by the Knicks and Dolan stepping in to fire Coach Woodson. There might be some W-L that would inexorably lead to a firing, but I think it is much more likely that there would have to be some intervening cause — like Woodson saying something to the press in the wake of a loss that Dolan perceived as disloyal.

      Bottom line – Rooting for the Knicks to lose in the belief that the loss will cause Woodson to be fired is (IMO) fruitless.

    27. Frank

      Bottom line – Rooting for the Knicks to lose in the belief that the loss will cause Woodson to be fired is (IMO) fruitless.

      yeah you’re probably right. *sigh* Go Knicks
      =)

    28. DRed

      Rooting for the Knicks to lose in the belief that the loss will cause Woodson to be fired is (IMO) fruitless.

      I tend to agree, although I am sympathetic to those who disagree. From what I’ve seen, Dolan cares about perception more than reality. If we can sell “lots of guys are injured, the team will get better” than Dolan won’t make a move. If we actually do get better (now that Tyson is back and we’re playing a lot of teams about as shitty as we are) then Dolan won’t make a move. I still think there’s a decent chance we make the playoffs this year, and we’ll spin it as overcoming unfortunate injuries. As long as Woodson doesn’t say anything crazy or lose too badly on the nights Jimmy has cool guests he probably will stay on.

    29. ephus

      Some thoughts on Kobe’s injury:

      1. I will be shocked if he is back on the court in six weeks. If he made it back right after the ASG, that would be 8 weeks and still a very fast recovery.

      2. This probably means that Kobe never catches Karl Malone for second on the all-time scoring list. It would have been unlikely even if Kobe played every game this season, but he does not have 5000 points left in him.

      3. $48 million looks like a hell of a severance package. Over the course of his career, Kobe made a lot more money than that for the Buss family.

      4. If Kobe is forced into medical retirement, the Lakers become much more likely to try to sign Carmelo Anthony. Because Kobe only played six games this year, if he cannot come back then his salary comes off of the cap on the anniversary of the last game he played last year. So the Lakers could be sitting on a virtually clean salary cap.

    30. Brian Cronin

      4. If Kobe is forced into medical retirement, the Lakers become much more likely to try to sign Carmelo Anthony. Because Kobe only played six games this year, if he cannot come back then his salary comes off of the cap on the anniversary of the last game he played last year. So the Lakers could be sitting on a virtually clean salary cap.

      Wait, how does that work? Would they have the cap room during the offseason or would he still be a cap hold until some point next season?

    31. Hubert

      Glen Sather has survived for over two decades despite some horrific teams (and 1 Stanley Cup).

      That’s because Dolan doesn’t know he owns a hockey team. Shhhhhh…..

      (And Sather was not around for the cup. That was Checketts and Neil Smith).

    32. Hubert

      Bottom line – Rooting for the Knicks to lose in the belief that the loss will cause Woodson to be fired is (IMO) fruitless.

      There’s always a bottom, Ephus. You gotta get there.

      I fear it might be on Christmas. I can see a Buttfumble-esque debacle occurring next Wednesday with the whole world watching.

    33. dtrickey

      I got a chance to watch the replay last night and it definitely wasn’t pretty, but I’m happy we got the win. Mostly because we have been prone to lose games like that this season.

      A few things I picked up on that were kind of hinted on above:
      1. For a first game back Chandler put in a beastly effort. Whilst it will still take a couple of games for him to find his feet, I think it’s clear how much the team needs him on a defensive and emotinal level (re: getting fired up after the block in the 4th);
      2. I genuinely think that we will miss STAT this year when he’s out. I think last night would have been a lot easier if we actually had an option in the post. STAT has worked into good form and I personally think would have made a big difference last night;
      3. I genuienly feel for AB on that last play. There’s no denying it was stupid, but of all the people for it to happen to, c’mon now! I think he just had his shooters hat on. He got a ridiculoulsy open look and his eyes lit up. I love how evryone got around him and picked him up though, which was good to see from a solidarity point of view.;
      4. The team was just flat out cold. I know there were some dumb passages of play, but there were a lot of misses last night I could live with. Using JR as an example, 17 3′s is probably excessive, but there were a lot of misses where he was open and caught the ball in rhythm. It just wasn’t a night for jump shooters.
      5. I know a lot of people are pining for the Knicks to lose games like this so the team will fire the coach, overturn the roster, burn it all down blah, blah blah. However, I honestly believe that a win here is better than a loss. Yes they had some dumb moments, but never underestimate what eeking out a close win can do for a team. I’m not saying they’ll come out on a huge streak, but rather the win should put a bit of a pep in their step and wind in their sails.

    34. er

      There’s always a bottom, Ephus. You gotta get there.

      I fear it might be on Christmas. I can see a Buttfumble-esque debacle occurring next Wednesday with the whole world watching.

      —-I would agree but Melo beats up on KD like clockwork so i dont think they will get embarrased

    35. ephus

      4. If Kobe is forced into medical retirement, the Lakers become much more likely to try to sign Carmelo Anthony. Because Kobe only played six games this year, if he cannot come back then his salary comes off of the cap on the anniversary of the last game he played last year. So the Lakers could be sitting on a virtually clean salary cap.

      Wait, how does that work? Would they have the cap room during the offseason or would he still be a cap hold until some point next season?

      CBAFAQ.com explains it here. If Kobe retires for medical reasons after having played less than 10 games this season:

      1. Lakers can waive him (for his entire career). If he attempted a comeback, it could not be as a Laker.
      2. If the NBA doctors concur that the injury is career-ending, he comes off of the Lakers’ salary cap the later of (1) 60 days after his last game or (2) one year after his last game played last year. In either event, he would be off the Lakers’ salary cap this summer.

      If Kobe is ready to play after the ASG, I do not see the Lakers even suggesting this route. If Kobe wants out (which would probably only happen if rehab went haywire), he could allow the the Lakers to walk away from the salary cap impact of the contract and still receive the $48 million as severance.

    36. ephus

      (And Sather was not around for the cup. That was Checketts and Neil Smith).

      Hubert – you are right. I always forget that because it would make so much more sense of Dolan kept Sather around because of the 1994 Stanley Cup run.

    37. lavor postell

      -I definitely don’t see Woodson getting fired this year, or next unless he strays from Dolan’s perverse obsession with loyalty or fires CAA as his management agency.

      Also if Kobe retires and the Lakers get cap relief, I still can’t see them as a viable option for Melo as long as D’Antoni is there. It really would make absolutely no sense unless he was willing to play out the same charade for the first half of the season as he did during the first half of the 11-12 season, where his effort left a lot to be desired until MDA got the axe. The only place that makes sense for him to go to would be Miami and that’s if they could flip Bosh or Wade for some set of expiring deals that still allows them to contend this season.

      Whoever mentioned that Shump seems to play better when he has to defend on the ball a lot is absolutely on the money. He was great against the Pacers when he did the lion’s share of defensive work against George and his best game of the season was against Brooklyn when he was tied up with JJ for most of the night.

      JR is definitely still feeling the affects from surgery this summer, which makes it even more frustrating that he is playing a significantly higher minutes load than THJR. If Timmy was playing like shit and was shooting poorly from the field I would understand, but on current form it is becoming exceedingly obvious their minutes should be flipped. Unfortunately Woodson is our head coach and JR is the player version of him and as such will never play less than 30 minutes. Woodson would probably still be playing Kidd 35 minutes a night if he had the option.

    38. DRed

      “What is he doing? What is he doing, folks? Why would he shoot the ball? Why?”

      It’s painful to listen to how horrified Clyde was by that play. This season must be pure agony to watch for the poor guy. I know a lot of people think of Clyde as a buffoon in some bad suits, but he’s probably the best player in the history of the franchise (I would also not argue with Ewing on longevity) and he was a genius with the basketball. I hope he gets hazard pay for sitting through this debacle.

    39. ephus

      Clyde is the man. Greatest Knick icon in history, when you include his twenty-five years as a broadcaster. He loves the Knicks, but he loves the platonic ideal of Knick (Red Holtzman) basketball more. 1) On defense, see the ball and see your man, 2) Never jump to pass, 3) Never jump in post defense, 4) Move the ball to the open man.

      The Knicks championship teams had an amazing collection of basketball IQ. Frazier, Bradley, DeBeusshere, Reed, Lucas and Phil Jackson each would be the wisest current Knick. Monroe revealed that he was a brilliant creative force when he came to NYC.

      I wish that Woodson was imparting the Holtzman legacy.

    40. johnno

      I have to disagree with DRed. Clyde was not “probably” the best Knick in history. He was definitely the best Knick. Go to basketball-reference.com and check out his offensive numbers….and then remember that he was a better defensive player than offensive (as in 1st team all-NBA defensive team 7 years in a row). He also regularly played over 40 minutes a game. He was great.
      The early 70′s Knicks were the smartest team ever assembled — Bradley was a Rhodes scholar, Lucas had a photographic memory who graduated college with a 4.0 average and who tracked everyone’s stats in his head DURING games, Dick Barnett has a doctorate degree, Phil Jackson was Phil Jackson, etc., etc. It must absolutely kill (and amaze) Clyde to watch the Knicks’ incessant brainfarts.

    41. Brian Cronin

      Best Knick based on peak value is Frazier. Best Knick based on total career as a Knick? I think Ewing inches past Frazier, but they’re basically a wash. They were both amazing.

    42. flossy

      I know a lot of people think of Clyde as a buffoon in some bad suits

      Who are these horrible people? I will fight them.

      Also if Kobe retires and the Lakers get cap relief, I still can’t see them as a viable option for Melo as long as D’Antoni is there. It really would make absolutely no sense unless he was willing to play out the same charade for the first half of the season as he did during the first half of the 11-12 season, where his effort left a lot to be desired until MDA got the axe. The only place that makes sense for him to go to would be Miami and that’s if they could flip Bosh or Wade for some set of expiring deals that still allows them to contend this season.

      If Kobe retires, the Lakers have clean books and want to rebuild around Melo (seems likely enough), you don’t think they’d fire D’Antoni in a hot second if Melo made it a condition of signing there? I do. MDA would be leaving on the first thing smoking.

    43. lavor postell

      If Kobe retires, the Lakers have clean books and want to rebuild around Melo (seems likely enough), you don’t think they’d fire D’Antoni in a hot second if Melo made it a condition of signing there? I do. MDA would be leaving on the first thing smoking.

      They didn’t fire MDA to keep Dwight Howard. Not sure why Melo would make them want to fire him and rebuild around him. If Kobe doesn’t resign Melo is signing to play with who exactly? A roster that may manage to have less talent than we currently have, which is saying something. The Lakers also are more fucked than we are in terms of future first round picks after trading for Nash and Howard. To me Melo to LAL is a non-starter.

    44. Unreason

      Best Knick based on peak value is Frazier. Best Knick based on total career as a Knick? I think Ewing inches past Frazier, but they’re basically a wash. They were both amazing.

      He and Patrick might be a wash in on-court monstrosity but there was never any contest in stellar luminosity. 40 years on and Clyde is still the Knicks the north star, ever guiding them toward the origin of cool.

    45. Owen

      ?I have to disagree with DRed. Clyde was not “probably” the best Knick in history. He was definitely the best Knick. Go to basketball-reference.com and check out his offensive numbers….and then remember that he was a better defensive player than offensive (as in 1st team all-NBA defensive team 7 years in a row). He also regularly played over 40 minutes a game. He was great.”

      Walt > Ewing

      I wish Melo were as good as Durant.

    46. lavor postell

      This Bulls team really could be in full tank mode. I could see them moving Deng, Gibson and if they can conjure a miracle Boozer before the deadline. There are soooo many point guards that would instantly be an upgrade on what the Knicks have in Raymond Felton, but Jeff Teague is certainly not one of them.

    47. Jack Bauer

      Biscotti, that is awesome. I am going with that for Bargnani from now on. This team plays sooooo stupid it is unwatchable .

    48. ruruland

      That Herring piece changed my mind about Bargnani.
      Seriously brilliant.
      AB does enough good things where he shouldn’t consistently be a net negative player.
      But his abnormally poor transition defense is compounded by his abnormally low shot trajectory.

    49. mokers

      Chris Herring has got to be in the top 10% of beat writers in the NBA. Refreshing to see somebody who is into reporting and doesn’t just snark to make himself seem cool. Great follow if you are on twitter.

    50. flossy

      Does anyone believe the Knicks have even one person in their front office as insightful as Herring? I sure as hell don’t.

    51. d-mar

      “Patty Mills was the 55th pick in the draft and sucked in portland. How do the Spurs keep doing this shit”

      The Spurs starting lineup tonight vs. Golden State was Leonard, Diaw, Baynes, Mills and Green. And they’re ahead by 3 in the 3rd quarter. If Popovich isn’t the greatest NBA coach in our lifetime, I don’t know who is.

    52. Donnie Walsh

      Chris Herring has got to be in the top 10% of beat writers in the NBA.

      Is Spiked Glee also in the top 10%?

    53. Owen

      Herring is really good.

      I will say, it is amazing how good the scrubs on the ends of benches are in the NBA.

      I feel like this game is one more knock on the idea you need “scoring” in the NBA, or at least one guy capable of taking a ton of shots.

      All these guys can take shots….

      Not that I expected the Spurs to be in this, surprisingly great game….

    54. Owen

      Wow, Patty Mills pulling up for a transition three in a 2 on 1.

      Amazing…..

      Just amazing. Got to applaud an organization that gives him the green light like that.

      Steph Curry is ridiculously awesome…

    55. ruruland

      It’s pretty obvious why WOW folks always, yes always, reduce the usage/offensive ecosystem debate into “taking shots isn’t a skill.”

    56. lavor postell

      Yeah we should make vast judgments on the value of players and skillsets based on one game. Basically all I’ve learnt from this game is that everybody should run their organization like the Spurs. The Knicks obviously will never do this.

      Also how pissed is everybody now about letting Grunwald go? He did create this roster with fairly little interference. Dolan is an idiot, but that was not the next in his series of stupid and inane basketball decisions, sticking with Woodson regardless of results and common sense is.

    57. Owen

      It’s pretty obvious why WOW folks always, yes always, reduce the usage/offensive ecosystem debate into “taking shots isn’t a skill.”

      You don’t need someone to take 30 shots per game in the NBA. And you don’t need a “closer.”

      Reggie: You got to get the ball to Kawhi Leonard, he is the only starter on the floor

      Reggie: Nice interior passing there, Diaw to Splitter and back to Diaw for the bucket….

    58. lavor postell

      You don’t need someone to take 30 shots per game in the NBA. And you don’t need a “closer.”

      Absolutely you don’t. Nobody here is going to say isolation scoring 30 times a game as an offensive system is a good design and that you should be running plays even down the stretch of games. However, when a play breaks down it definitely is valuable to have guys that can create something for themselves like Lebron, Melo, Durant, Curry, etc.

    59. Owen

      Well, not trying to kill a scarecrow here. But that has been the dominant mindset in the Knicks FO for about 13 years.

    60. flossy

      You don’t need someone to take 30 shots per game in the NBA. And you don’t need a “closer.”

      There’s more than one way to skin a cat. The Lakers don’t seem to have suffered from having Kobe on their team all these years. No reason a good team can’t be built around a ball-dominant, high-usage player. It just means the rest of the roster needs to be constructed accordingly.

    61. DRed

      It’s pretty obvious why WOW folks always, yes always, reduce the usage/offensive ecosystem debate into “taking shots isn’t a skill.”

      To make Carmelo look bad?

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