Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Wednesday, July 23, 2014

Knicks 93, Heat 88

Every now and then there comes a basketball game that electrifies an entire city. Fans are glued to their television to see the greatest players in the world. Unfortunately, Madison Square Garden has been in the shadows for the past few years. For the last decade or so, the most anticipated Knick games of the season were ones that featured the league’s upper echelon teams. The only reason why the Heat vs. Knicks or Cavs vs. Knicks games were on national television were because the league’s best players traveled to the Mecca of Basketball. The match-ups weren’t necessarily amazing nor were the games always competitive. It was just a chance to watch the LeBrons and Wades of the NBA perform under the lights of New York City.

While the Knicks were a sub-.500 team last year, this year’s team is bound for the playoffs. Coming into tonight’s game the Knicks were the sixth seed in the East with a record of 23-21. Unlike the previous seasons, this Heat-Knicks matchup was significant because the Knicks are a relevant team in the NBA again. And the result of yesterday’s game confirmed it.

The Knicks beat Miami 93-88, in a tightly fought contest. New York got off to a good start in the first quarter, and matched the Heat’s intensity. In the second quarter, the game got feisty as Juwan Howard and Amar’e Stoudemire got into an altercation. Ultimately Howard was whistled for a technical foul, and the fight brought back memories of the Knicks-Heat rivalry of the early 2000s.

The halftime ended with the Knicks trailing 48-46. New York’s leading scorer was Amar’e Stoudemire with 14 points on nine shots. Landry Fields contributed with 11 points, five rebounds, and three assists. The Knicks had to feel lucky going into the locker-room trailing by only two points, because they shot 18-45 from the field and only attempted eight free-throws. In addition, Raymond Felton had a less than impressive first half, with two points and +/- of -6.

The last time the Heat played the Knicks at Madison Square Garden, Miami completely dominated in the third quarter. In their previous meeting the Knicks were stagnant on the offensive end, and trailed by double-digits by the end of the third. This game appeared to be a replica of the last, as New York failed to have any offensive continuity. The Knicks missed seven of eight three point shots in the quarter, most of them were of the wide open variety.

But instead of yielding to a great team, New York clawed back in the fourth quarter. Unlike the period prior, New York began to hit their threes. With the Knicks trailing 84-83 and less than two minutes to go, Danilo Gallinari and Landry Fields hit back to back treys giving New York a 5 point advantage that would sustain them for the rest of the game. The Knicks outscored the Heat 29-15 in the quarter. Amar’e ended with 24 points on 17 attempts, and the Knicks also got efficient scoring from Gallo (20 points on 15 shots) and Landry Fields (19 on 11 shots). Fields also added 13 rebounds and 6 assists, and finished +14.

The Knick crowd was electric with a playoff-like atmosphere. For once a game at the Garden against one of the league’s best team’s was great television. And this time it wasn’t due to the star power of the opposing team.

95 comments on “Knicks 93, Heat 88

  1. Ben R

    Big win.

    The best part of this win is the discipline our team showed on offense. It’s easy to run this offense and move the ball when we’re hitting our shots but in the past when we weren’t hitting our shots we would stop passing and Amare and Felton would go 1 on 1 and we would lose. Tonight we weren’t hitting our shots, we missed at least 10 wide open threes, but we kept moving the ball. We had faith that if we kept taking good shots they would eventually fall, and they eventually did.

    24 assists on 30 fgs. Felton and Douglas both shot poorly but both moved the ball. Felton had more assists than shots. Amare with 17 shots, Gallo with 15, Chandler with 14, Fields and Williams with 11, that is great balance. We executed our offense against the best defense in the NBA and while it wasn’t always pretty we stayed within our scheme and it worked.

  2. John Kenney

    So uh…. Sheridan says Fields big game means he’s probably gonna be traded to Denver..”logically.”

    HOW CAN I HATE ONE MAN’S OPINION SO MUCH????

    In Donnie We Trust.

  3. BigBlueAL

    This game was the exact opposite of the Thunder game which we had alot of discussion afterward about the ISO offense down the stretch.

    Felton and Amar’e werent selfish and passed the ball and thankfully Fields and Gallo made their shots. Of course thru 3 quarters I was yelling for someone to score on their own other than Amar’e lol.

    For everyone trying to say the Heat played bad offense down the stretch it wasnt the Knicks defense I gotta tell you, what you saw tonight is the same offense the Heat run EVERY game down the stretch. They have no offense except ISO LeBron and Wade. They are now 1-8 in games decided by 5 points or less mainly because their offense down the stretch is horrific (as latest example before tonight see the home loss to the Hawks last week).

    Give the Knicks credit, they contested almost every shot in the 4th and were getting deflections and actually grabbing most of the defensive boards (although James Jones and Chalmers each missed a wide open 3pter late). They also didnt turn it over much to allow the Heat to run in the 4th quarter (the Gallo miss drive and everybody crashing and not getting the offensive board late in the game not withstanding).

    At this point of the season I could care less how ugly a win is. I will take 20 more wins like tonight if I have to.

  4. Brian Cronin

    This game was the exact opposite of the Thunder game which we had alot of discussion afterward about the ISO offense down the stretch.

    What was especially amazing about it was that it was the exact opposite, but only after it was exactly the same for the previous two possessions, as the Knicks went from being up 3 to being down 1 and Yogi Berra was shouting, “It’s Deja Vu all over again” in my mind. And then Felton and STAT snapped out of it and played team ball and unsurprisingly, it worked really really well.

  5. Jimmy C

    John Kenney: So uh…. Sheridan says Fields big game means he’s probably gonna be traded to Denver..”logically.”HOW CAN I HATE ONE MAN’S OPINION SO MUCH????
    In Donnie We Trust.  

    In Donnie We Trust is right. If Melo really wants to come here, he’ll get here eventually. I’m assuming Sherridan didn’t read Walsh’s quote comparing Fields to John Havlicek. I don’t know, that’s just not a comparison you toss around lightly. Maybe he did that to plant some kind of inflated value seed in the heads of Nugget management, but I doubt it. He knows how much value Fields brings — and at a ridiculously low price. Why mess with that?

    The closer the deadline gets, if we decided to make a move, I don’t see him moving too far beyond Curry, Randolph, Chandler, and throw-in X. Denver fans won’t be thrilled, but at least theirs won’t be the fate of Cleveland and Toronto.

  6. Nick C.

    The disconnect between the basketball press and reality is almost comical. In the last few days Walsh is quoted as saying he wouldn’t trade half the team (or somehing to that effect) and that they are looking for a center and backup PG (needs only brought up here what a surprise).

  7. rohank

    Here’s my game summary:

    No one is afraid of the Heat!!!

    GALLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    There was a playoff atmosphere in the Garden last night. 

    P.S. They FINALLY called a travel on LeBum, albeit with 3 seconds to go lol. 

  8. Caleb

    It is a little weird to see both national ESPN columnists covering the Knicks, take for granted without a hint of doubt that trading 3 of the hot young prospects for Carmelo would be a slam dunk (for the Knicks!) Not surprise given what they’ve been writing all along but it’s weird how that’s your takeaway from a game where the Knicks young guys all played great.

    Knicks have been looking sharp ever since San Antonio – their worst game was against Washington. I know the offense looked ugly last night but credit is due Miami’s D. Announcers were right to point out how great they are closing out.

  9. Thomas B.

    What was really interesting was watching the Heat offense in the 4th turn into well the Knick offense of the 6 game losing streak. They stopped pushing the ball. They got a number of open shots, I recall at least two open threes for James Jones, Wade went very cold, James stayed cold and the did not get to the line much.

    Please don’t call it great defense.

    The Knicks outscored the Heat by 14 in the 4th 15-29 to win by five. If the Heat even get to 20 in the fourth, its overtime. 21 and well we are singing a new tune this morning. The Heat missed 15 shots from the floor in the 4th. And Wade missed a bunch from the line.

    The Heat got 5 offensive boards in the 4th, they just couldn’t convert many of them. The Knicks really need a strong rebounding player that does not need the ball too much on offense and that can block shots. Hmmm where can we find a player with that skill set?

  10. njnick

    The pushing of Carmelo Anthony to the NY Knicks by the national media has to stop. With the game that Fields and Gallo had last night it would be foolish for the Knicks to trade them away plus eat up the rest of their cap space for a one dimensional player, albeit great at that one dimension.

  11. Brian Cronin

    I didn’t agree with a few of his points, including the knock on taking threes. Yes, logic dictates it is easier to hit shots closer to the basket, but logic also dictates that 3 points is better than 2 points and if you take 4 threes and 4 twos, you only need to make 50% of the threes to equal the points you’d get by making 75% of the twos.

    But really, to knock taking threes when being committed to taking threes even when they weren’t falling early on ended up winning the day just seems odd to me.

  12. Z

    Jimmy C:
    I’m assuming Sherridan didn’t read Walsh’s quote comparing Fields to John Havlicek. I don’t know, that’s just not a comparison you toss around lightly. Maybe he did that to plant some kind of inflated value seed in the heads of Nugget management…   

    If Walsh was trying to inflate his value, all it would show is how old and out of touch he is. John Havlicek isn’t exactly fresh in people’s minds these days. It would be like comparing Carl Crawford to a young Tris Speaker. Not to say Ujiri wouldn’t know who Havlicek is, but… The man wasn’t even born when “Havlicek stole the ball!”, and even if he was alive, the game probably wasn’t broadcast in Nigeria.

    Now… If Donnie starts saying Fields is the next Hakeem Olajuwon… Then his motives may be a little less than pure… :)

  13. Jimmy C

    Z:
    Now… If Donnie starts saying Fields is the next Hakeem Olajuwon… Then his motives may be a little less than pure… :)  

    Right, which is why I think it’s more a reflection of his genuine admiration for our precocious neophyte. It just brings my piss to a boil to see Sherridan et. al constantly harp on the ridiculous idea that we’d trade three promising young talents for a one-dimensional cap-eater, as njnick and many others have said.

    Not to say that Melo would necessarily jeopardize our team chemistry, but this team genuinely seems to like playing with eachother. And that element of gestalt isn’t something you should tamper with, particularly if you’re a team on the upswing, IMHO.

  14. Frank

    Thomas B.Not sure I agree with the take on the Knick defense, way too many open threes in the 4th for my tastes.  

    I’ll wholeheartedly disagree with this. There are a lot of “if Jones did this”, “if Wade did that”, or my favorite “what if Miami scored more points than they did”. Give me a frickin break. Wade shot 14-22 from the field — what if Wade actually shot his usual 49% from the field? What if his ridiculous degree of difficulty shots didn’t go down? Yes, there were some open 3′s but that is the nature of 3′s — more often than not, you miss them. Overall there were MANY fewer open 3′s than one would expect given that defenses generally collapse on Wade and Lebron. We can attribute that to better defense on Wade/Lebron and less helping off the 3 point shooters in general.

    I’d prefer to concentrate on Lebron’s inability to score on Shawne Williams until the last 2 minutes. Should Lebron have been posted up so much when he has no discernable post game? Maybe – but whatever, that is what MIA decided to do with him.

    I’d prefer to concentrate on Fields still giving great effort in the 4th guarding Wade even though he totally went off in the 3rd quarter. Maybe it was defense and not ” Wade went cold” that caused him to miss shots.

    I’d prefer to concentrate on the Knicks outrebounding the Heat handily in the second half even though MIA has the 6th best rebounding rate in the league.

    While we’re playing “what if” — how about the 74255 wide open 3′s and layups that we couldn’t hit?

    At the end of the day this is not as good a win as the Spurs win. MIA without Bosh is clearly worse than MIA with Bosh. But enough with disparaging the defense – we held Miami to 88 points, Lebron to 7-24 shooting, and got the W.

  15. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    njnick: The pushing of Carmelo Anthony to the NY Knicks by the national media has to stop.With the game that Fields and Gallo had last night it would be foolish for the Knicks to trade them away plus eat up the rest of their cap space for a one dimensional player, albeit great at that one dimension.  

    He’s not great at that one thing! His value lies in his ability to be the last person to touch the ball before it hits the rim. That’s essentially it!

  16. DS

    @3 and others – It’s funny how Hahn and some other saw last night’s game as evidence that we need a wing scorer like ‘Melo for situations in which Amar’e is stymied on offense. Meanwhile, in the very same game two of top three wing scorers of this generation were unable to carry the Heat when forced to play 1-on-1.

    I am have trouble seeing the endgame in getting ‘Melo. Fields is very intelligent, his plane of improvement could be parallel to David Lee’s or Boozer’s if the Knicks invest in him. He’s the sort of player who will work on FT shooting, jumpers, rebounding, and D in the offseason because it helps the team. i.e. why sell so low? I believe that Gallo’s curve of improvement is also very good, seeing as he’s younger than Fields.

    CP3 (.608 TS???) or possibly even Deron will be the key to winning a title with D’Antoni and I think we need to stay on the path to get them. I don’t see how ‘Melo moves us along that path.

  17. ess-dog

    Great things happen when Gallo gets involved.
    And could Fields be any more clutch? That’s why it’s great to have MDA playing him at the end of games. I mean, his +/- is absurd. When he’s on the floor, we are much better.

    One thing to remember is that even without Bosh out, we match up well against the Heat (unless big Z happens to have had a blood transfusion that day.)
    We still need some answers for teams that have great interior players. In fact, the Hawks and Horford will be a good test of that. Maybe Shawne can channel his new found badassedness against Horford?

    Re: Anthony, just not sure where he fits now that Gallo has stepped up and is getting the ball. I suppose he could trade places with Chandler which would give us more offense from the 4 (assuming he becomes a bit more selective), but clearly less defense.

    I think the ideal would be to get a ‘Sheed type player next to Amare and have Chandler be the 6th man. Chandler’s great, but we need a 4 who can defend the Paus and KGs of the world.

  18. DS

    ess-dog: I think the ideal would be to get a ‘Sheed type player next to Amare and have Chandler be the 6th man. Chandler’s great, but we need a 4 who can defend the Paus and KGs of the world

    Little things about Felton-Fields-Gallo-Amar’e actually remind me of Billups-Prince-Rip-’Sheed minus a lot of the defense. Maybe an aged ‘Sheed himself would sign with the Knicks for a playoff run and to be A. Randolph’s life coach.

  19. Jimmy C

    Sheridan chatting today at 2pm. Just sent him a serious yet polite question about this morning’s article. Guarantee he doesn’t answer it.

  20. Jimmy C

    Brian Windhorst’s last two tweets:

    1)Chandler & Fields are nice pieces but you can find guys like that. Melo is a top 10 player. Pairing stars has been Walsh’s plan for years.

    2)Knicks doing a good job of hyping (both PR & on court) their assets to try to entice Denver. Make no mistake tho, they want Melo.

    Who the hell are these idiots, and how did they get to work for ESPN? Where is he getting the idea that Walsh has been trying to pair two stars “for years”? And how the hell do you “hype” a player on the court?

    No, you DON’T “just find” players like Fields. I’m not saying he’s the next John Havlicek. I’m not saying he’s the next anything. But “just finding” a high volume, low efficiency scorer is a hell of a lot easier to do than it is to find a player with Fields’ intangibles and at Fields’ price.

    I know Walsh isn’t listening to any of this. I just want it to be February 24th already.

  21. Thomas B.

    @Frank 15

    I respectfully disagree. I do not think the Knicks found defensive lightning in a bottle against the 4th best offense in the NBA.

    “what if Wade actually shot his usual 49% from the field? What if his ridiculous degree of difficulty shots didn’t go down?”

    Okay so you want to put Wade back to average then you have to do the same for everyone else. So Wade shoots a bit worse from the floor, James and the rest much better and Wade doesn’t miss a bunch of FTs in the 4th. That gives the Heat the edge even with the Knicks playing at average. It is fool’s gold to look at that game and say “Good defensive effort” because of poor offensive execution. The Heat got out of sink because Wade tried to go all Kobe last night, and they were missing Bosh. If those same open threes dropped for Miami, then folks would scream “Horrible defense. How could he be that open?” But the open shots dont fall so its good defense? Not buying it.

    Over the season the Knicks have been a well below average defensive team. They are 20th in defensive efficiency, 26th in defensive boards, and 16th in defensive eFG%. Miami is 4th in offense. Even subtracting Bosh, the Heat win 6/7 matchups. This is the one time the Heat play way below average.

    I will say this, the Knicks did force a good number of turnovers while keeping their own down. That counts as defense I guess. Oh and the pace of the game stunk (90.2).

  22. Caleb

    If the other team makes all their shots you will usually lose and vice-versa – over the course of a game, 80 or 90 shots, you have to look at the overall effort. All in all the Knicks were pretty tight on D. A couple of times they let in a few easy ones, and Turiaf stepped in to settle things down. Amare didn’t give up the matador baskets avoiding fouls. LeBron looked like he didn’t have a ton of lift (ankle?) but Williams played him well. They forced Wade into tough shots.

    Does this mean the Knicks are better than the Heat? Of course not! But are they worse than Sacramento? No! The worst team in the league does not go 0-82. I wouldn’t make a big deal out of “they’ll win this one and that one, lose these three, win this, etc. Sometimes they will play well and lose (San Antonio, OKC); sometimes they’ll look rough and win. In the big picture they’ve established themselves as a .500 team or slightly better. Barring injury they should have at least 19 or 20 more wins which makes the playoffs a no-brainer and the #6 seed more than likely.

    Chandler will be ok, assuming he stays. I think the law of averages is catching up to him (he’s not really a better 3-point shooter than Gallo) but he is a good all-around player who can contribute on the boards, and on D.

    The most discouraging thing is watching Toney Douglas. I realize last night was sort of a low point, but he’s not a great shooter, he can’t run the offense and when he ALSO makes ugly turnovers… he really hurt the Knicks last night. If we had any kind of backup he would be playing himself out of the rotation.

  23. Doug

    Jimmy C: Brian Windhorst’s last two tweets:1)Chandler & Fields are nice pieces but you can find guys like that. Melo is a top 10 player. Pairing stars has been Walsh’s plan for years.2)Knicks doing a good job of hyping (both PR & on court) their assets to try to entice Denver. Make no mistake tho, they want Melo.Who the hell are these idiots, and how did they get to work for ESPN?

    Brian Windhorst used to be the Cavs beat writer for the Cleveland Plain Dealer. His coverage of the Lebron drama this summer earned him a job with ESPN blogging about the Heat.

    He’s a reporter, not an analyst. His basketball opinions aren’t worth any more than yours or mine.

  24. Nick C.

    “Pairing stars has been Walsh’s plan for years.” Reallly????? Like in Indy?? Who was the other star assuming Reggie Miller qualified Rik Smits? Jalen Rose? How do these people get jobs?

  25. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, Doug’s spot on. Windhorst is a great reporter, but I wouldn’t go to him for analysis. That said, he likely does represent “conventional wisdom” on this issue, and that conventional wisdom has been driving me nuts for months now.

  26. DS

    Caleb: What award do you think he won? (No googling!)  

    A Peabody? Or was it a Nobel Prize in Economics for his “Waiting Game Theory”?

  27. Jimmy C

    DS: This is the worst article I’ve read on the topic yet:
    http://web.sny.tv/news/article.jsp?ymd=20110127&content_id=16517784&oid=36320&vkey=18

    That was horrifyingly bad.

    This idea that the new power paradigm revolves around teams having “Big 3s” is incredibly toxic. By my count, it’s worked exactly once, with Boston. I don’t count LA because Odom really isn’t a “star”, although he’s an incredibly good player. Even putting Ray Allen on that level is misguided, though he is also a very good player as well.

    But to take the leap from “you need three great players” to “you need 3 of the top 15 players” is a ridiculous stretch. Garnett, Pierce and Allen were maybe three of the top 30 when they joined forces. The Heat? Maybe 3 of the top 20 (and two of the top 5).

    The Lakers have won twice, but let’s assume you count Kobe as one of the top 5 (a stretch today, I think), and Gasol and Odom each in the top 30. Now what do the Knicks have? Stat is arguably top 15, and there’s a pretty big falloff to the next level — Gallo, Felton or Chandler — who are top 50. But they’re also still developing, and any one of them could end up being top 30 players. At that point, shouldn’t we be more concerned with filling in gaps than with chasing after cap-eating “stars”?

    New York doesn’t need Melo as bad as Melo seems to need New York. If that’s the case, he’ll come here in the summer and take a few million dollar haircut to bring a banner to the Garden rafters. If not, who needs him anyway? Not us. I’ll be happy to wait for D-Will, who I can almost guarentee would take a paycut to come here.

  28. ess-dog

    Ugh, from the Bucher chat:

    Chris Fiegler (Latham,NY)

    Where will Carmelo Anthony be traded to?

    Ric Bucher
    (1:37 PM)

    I don’t know but I find it hard to believe he won’t be traded because both he and Denver lose if he isn’t. He walks as a FA, leaving Denver with nothing and he takes the hit of signing under the new CBA. The question is, does he relent and go to NJ, as many of the people around him want, or does he hold out for NY no matter what? I can’t answer that question. I can tell you that as of right now, it’s NJ or NY. Chicago pulled out months ago and talk of them getting back in smacks of Melo’s people trying to create leverage, not legitimacy.

  29. Frank

    Thomas B.: Over the season the Knicks have been a well below average defensive team. They are 20th in defensive efficiency, 26th in defensive boards, and 16th in defensive eFG%.Miami is 4th in offense. .  

    So a team ranked 20th in defensive efficiency can’t play good defense on a single night? I’m not sure anyone is saying that Shawne Williams is the next coming of Bruce Bowen – just that last night, he played very good defense against Lebron. Fact is – for one night (and hopefully more in the future) – the NYK defense came to play. There’s bad offensive execution and there’s good defensive execution, and usually bad offensive execution happens because of defensive effort and denial. Spoelstra said it himself – the Knicks defense baited them into playing the iso game, and defended it well. The teams are not out there playing solo against their statistical history.

    Then to say “if the Heat score 21 in the 4th we’d be talking differently” is just kind of ridiculous to be honest. If the Knicks scored 64 in the 4th we’d also be talking differently. Neither happened, so what we’re doing is talking about a solid win in which the Knicks offense sort of sucked but we won with clutch late shooting by Gallo/Fields and excellent defensive effort – exactly the type of win that we’ve all been waiting for.

  30. Frank

    Nick C.: “Pairing stars has been Walsh’s plan for years.”Reallly????? Like in Indy?? Who was the other star assuming Reggie Miller qualified Rik Smits? Jalen Rose?How do these people get jobs?  

    Umm… he did spend the first 2 years here dumping contracts and assets in order to open up 2 max slots. I guess that could be considered working for > 1 year to pair stars.

  31. Frank

    The most discouraging thing is watching Toney Douglas. I realize last night was sort of a low point, but he’s not a great shooter, he can’t run the offense and when he ALSO makes ugly turnovers… he really hurt the Knicks last night. If we had any kind of backup he would be playing himself out of the rotation.
      

    Totally agree – but I think many of his mistakes are due to a lack of coaching. He gambles WAY too much. The reach-in foul 75 feet from the basket last night with the Knicks already in the penalty – just horrible. Could’ve been the margin of the game if (yes Thomas B) the Heat hit one of those open 3′s in the 4th. For every steal and open layup he gets from his ball pressure, he probably gives up 10 points in blow-bys and stupid fouls.

    I’d love to see the NYK take a flyer on Jason Williams – he would be much better as a backup PG than TD. If Felton goes down we are seriously screwed.

  32. ess-dog

    also:

    Disco (S. Burlington, VT)

    What do you think will be the next version of “Super Friends” and when/where will we see it?

    Ric Bucher
    (1:57 PM)

    I’m not sure you will. I believe the next CBA will make it harder to do and I don’t get the sense the next wave of stars thinks the way the CP3-Howard-Bosh-LeBron generation do. I also know this: Knicks’ fans should be careful what they wish for. Melo-Amare is not a nucleus that spells instant championships. Not in the traditional way. Titles are won on two-way players. Lots of them, but especially your superstars.

  33. Jimmy C

    Frank:
    Umm… he did spend the first 2 years here dumping contracts and assets in order to open up 2 max slots.I guess that could be considered working for > 1 year to pair stars.  

    True, but a serious housecleaning was in order anyway. When you’re talking about LBJ, you’re talking about the best player on the planet, and pairing him with any great player is more than enticing, and I don’t begrudge DW for trying. But we didn’t land LeBron. We got Stat, and I think everyone is thrilled we did. Just because for 18 months DW’s strategy was to create cap space for 2 max players doesn’t necessarily mean that’s his strategy TODAY. It doesn’t mean it’s his endgame.

  34. Caleb

    Jimmy C:
      

    I would put Gasol pretty high, maybe top 10… Odom, say #25-30… Healthy Bynum would be up there but they won with him dragging a leg so I wouldn’t factor him in.

    But basically I agree: there’s no magic formula. The better your best players are, the worse the rest of your roster can be. And vice-versa. Look at Orlando.

    For a hint of the guy’s mindset, look at Walsh in Indy. Not once but twice he build legit contenders with no definitive superstar. In version 1, Reggie Miller was a great player but I’m not sure he ever cracked the Top 10 guys in the league. After that were were several good, borderline All-Stars (Smits, Davis, Davis) and a legit all-NBA defender in McKey.

    In version 2, he re-tooled around Jermaine O’Neal and Artest – excellent players, but again, neither a top-10 NBA guy in my opinion.

    Part of it is opportunity. Was there a superstar FA willing to come to Indy? And he never had the budget he does in NY. Still, based on track record, it’s hard to think of another successful GM who is less tied to star power. Maybe Geoff Petrie?

    Don’t get me wrong – he’d have loved to sign LeBron and do the same dance Miami is doing right now. But I don’t think he believes he has to fill the imaginary “superstar slot” with the best player available. Replace LeBron with Carmelo and give up the farm, regardless…

  35. Frank

    ess-dog: also:Disco (S. Burlington, VT)What do you think will be the next version of “Super Friends” and when/where will we see it?Ric Bucher (1:57 PM)… Melo-Amare is not a nucleus that spells instant championships. Not in the traditional way. Titles are won on two-way players. Lots of them, but especially your superstars.  

    I would love to think that Amare would play much harder on defense if he knew that the offense wouldn’t totally fall apart without him if he gets in foul trouble. The Knicks are amazingly 10 points worse per 100 offensive possessions when he’s off court.

    I think a lot of Amare’s failings as a rebounder are due to the fact that he’s a little bit of a “watcher” — ball goes up, he’s staring at it, not getting into position a la Landry Fields. On man-to-man and help defense I think he’s a little afraid of foul trouble on top of being undersized against a large portion of his matchups.

    If we get Melo, maybe STAT’s foul anxiety will be less and he’ll be more willing to be more aggressively defensively. One can hope at least.

  36. Nick C.

    Frank: Umm… he did spend the first 2 years here dumping contracts and assets in order to open up 2 max slots. I guess that could be considered working for > 1 year to pair stars.  (Quote)

    Ya got me there … but once I read years I took to mean longer than the 2+ as GM of the NYK or else why not write that.

  37. Brian Cronin

    I wonder what Ric Bucher thinks of giving up Fields/Chandler/AR for Melo. I bet even though he doesn’t think Melo/STAT is a great match, he would still probably echo the conventional wisdom of “that’s a low ball offer.”

  38. Thomas B.

    Frank:
    So a team ranked 20th in defensive efficiency can’t play good defense on a single night?

    Sure they can; it just wasn’t last night. :-) Through three the Heat were on pace to score 98 points. Considering the pace was barely 90 (not a fast pace), I don’t know if that is great defensive effort. But let’s set that aside.

    The real reason I dont want to call this a good defensive team even for one night or one quarter is that to be an elite level team we need a defensive minded rebounding big. And I dont want one night or quarter like last night to change the focus. When need a Tyson Chandler, Camby or Okafor. Hell a Pryzbilla (sp?) would be a great addition. Donnie should be working toward that everyday. No matter what this group pulls together for one night, they cant contend without better interior defense and better rebounding.

    Sorry if I’m taking away from last night’s lock down, but one game does not a strong defense make.

  39. Frank

    @ myself and Thomas B – not sure why I’m being so argumentative so sorry for being annoying. Just feeling a little defensive about my NYK I guess!

  40. DS

    kburt8:
    Probably not too many people here who would favor a max deal for Melo.I’d give Chandler, Curry, Azubuike, AR, and a first.And give melo $14 mil.That’s all.  

    Agreed, but Denver wouldn’t take that deal. No chance. AR is the only one who is not a FA and the first rounder won’t be very high.

  41. ltmurray

    ess-dog: Great things happen when Gallo gets involved.
    Re: Anthony, just not sure where he fits now that Gallo has stepped up and is getting the ball.  

    I keep watching the highlight of Gallo hitting that contested, go-ahead 3 from about a foot behind the line (the 2nd one he hit in that quarter, I think it was in Lebron’s face and right before Field’s hit his).

    Before he gets the ball, you can see him waving his hands for a pass at the bottom of the screen. Obviously, I friggin’ LOVE THAT! Hopefully he’ll keep consistently calling for the ball, but that’s seldom been the case with Gallo this year.

    I’m driving myself crazy over this Melo bullcrap — when the Knicks stink up the place, like they had been for that 6 game stretch, I’m all about Melo. But after they beat the Heat, Melo can go screw. It sucks.

    You guys have done a good job covering this topic already, but I think if Amare and Felton share the ball with Gallo in crunch time like they did last night, we should have enough firepower to get by without Melo (this year, at least).

  42. Caleb

    Denver might not take it, but any more than that and the Knicks are not making themselves better, IMO, over a 2-3 year window.
    Even that deal might be a wash unless you think Melo makes it more likely, not less, that they can real in a CP3 or another 3rd star.
    Mark my words, AR is going to be a big-time player somewhere.

  43. Robert Silverman

    For all the tea leaves the ESPN/tabloid guys are reading, I think the best indicator of what will happen is Walsh’s history as a GM with this sort of thing — namely, the Ron Artest trade post-brawl.

    Everyone (again, the aforementioned “experts”) said that Walsh had to trade Artest and would never get fair value. If you recall, Tru Warier was at the top of his game at the time (though not as esteemed as ‘Melo). Walsh held firm for months and wouldn’t make a move (The Nix/Isiah were rumored to be VERY interested) until he got what he liked — a still-effective Peja Stojakovic (who was also an expiring contract) from Sacto and the “experts” were shocked Walsh was able to get so much for a toxic asset like Ron-Ron.

    My guess is this deal, if it happens, goes down to 3pm on Feb. 24th. Walsh holds firm on one of Gallo/Will/The Natural plus a first for AR, Curry, a 2014 1st, and a bagful of Dolan’s $. If Denver says no, Donnie leaves the table.

  44. Caleb

    @53 I think that is a good guess although if it were me I would not go quite that high… or at least, I wouldn’t do it unless Melo agreed to a lower contract # than he is likely to get.

  45. NYK Ewing

    @25

    ‘No, you DON’T “just find” players like Fields. I’m not saying he’s the next John Havlicek. I’m not saying he’s the next anything. But “just finding” a high volume, low efficiency scorer is a hell of a lot easier to do than it is to find a player with Fields’ intangibles and at Fields’ price. ‘

    These posts are intolerable. You CAN’T just toss around the label ‘high volume low efficiency’ and say that the tag sums up Melo. You can call him overrated, whatever, but saying you can find a Carmelo Anthony easier than a Wilson Chandler is inane and baseless.

  46. NYK Ewing

    Sorry, read Chandler not Fields. Obviously the guy is underpriced, but I’d still disagree with the notion of slapping that label on Melo and saying people like him are highly available in the NBA.

  47. ess-dog

    I’m sorry, but I don’t feel like Sheridan knows what he’s talking about:

    “As I write last night, Fields is playing like a lottery pick. But if you have to give up two of the three, I believe the Knicks would prefer those two to be Gallinari and Fields.”

    WHY???

  48. Robert Silverman

    Caleb: @53 I think that is a good guess although if it were me I would not go quite that high… or at least, I wouldn’t do it unless Melo agreed to a lower contract # than he is likely to get.  

    To up the offer, Walsh could also throw in Azu’s insurance-covered contract and front-load Melo’s extension, thereby saving $ for 2012, aka the CP3/DWill/Howard free agency binge.

    To be clear, my trade is only ONE of Gallo/Will/The Natural – not 2 or even all of them, like the ESPN guys seem to think would be a fair trade

  49. Brian Cronin

    I dunno, I presume Sheridan knows more about the Knicks’ thinking than we do.

    If he says that is how they rank them, I would tend to believe him.

  50. Brian Cronin

    So long as it is only 1 of the 3, I’m fine with any trade proposal anyone could come up with. I just draw the line at giving up 2 of the 3. If that’s not enough, then Denver can have 1 of the 3 this summer in a sign and trade.

  51. ess-dog

    Hell a Fields/AR trade would be good for the Nuggs. I would almost be jealous. AR as your high-scoring pf, Fields as your heady sf, Aflalo being the same at sg, Lawson taking over at point….
    That is a GREAT young squad. And AR is the only shall we say “lower iq” player out there but he’s physically gifted and the rest of the team would help him out.
    Denver doesn’t like Gallo and that’s good I think – we need his shooting and with the other two we could have something akin to the Ray Allen (outside), Pierce (midrange), and KG (inside) scoring presence.
    If we keep Chandler does he move back to sg?

  52. DS

    @59 How can it be Chandler if he’s a RFA?? Getting Chandler for a half season and the right to match any offers this summer is really not that desirable.

  53. Brian Cronin

    The Knicks are in a position to match any offer made to Chandler, and I presume they’ll do as much (if he stays a Knick).

    So when they rank Gallo, Fields and Chandler, I don’t think Chandler’s RFA status factors into their thinking. I think they’re just doing it based on who they feel they’d miss the most, and I think it is reasonable to believe that they think they’d miss Chandler the most.

    I don’t agree with that, as I think I’d rank them

    Gallo
    Fields
    Chandler

    with Gallo and Fields being extremely close together

    but Chandler is probably the best defender of the three, so I can see an argument to be made for having him #1 on the Knicks’ ranking of the three.

  54. BigBlueAL

    Also Im sure they see Chandler as much more versatile too. He can genuinely play/defend at the 2, 3 and 4. Plus he seems not to care if he comes off the bench or starts.

    Still I think its ridiculous because clearly Gallo and Fields should be much more untouchable in a trade than Chandler. But I do understand why the Knicks would value Chandler a bit more in certain circumstances.

  55. Caleb

    #53/58 You’re basically trading 3 good assets (Chandler/Gallo/Fields + Randolph + the 2014 pick). The pick isn’t that big a deal – it’s probably around #25. But as you know I am high on Randolph.

    With that trade, your core is Stoudemire/Anthony/Gallo*/Chandler*… your next best players are Felton and a #20 pick in 2011. No meaningful draft picks to speak of.

    That’s not a contender. You’d have to find a way to add another borderline star. Either cross your fingers and pray for Gallo, or find $10 million to pay a FA center. If you somehow worked the contract numbers to set aside $8-10 million, it might be a good deal. It WOULD be insurance against a CBA that includes a franchise tag cutting off hope of a big get in 2012.

    But consider the alternative. Think about playing the odds. It’s probably 3:1, at least, against Chandler ever becoming an All-Star. I’d say the same about Fields. But if you have 4 balls in the lottery… Chandler, Gallo, Fields and – yes – Randolph… each one has a chance of being really good. It would be shocking if they all became stars, but it would be just as surprising if they all plateaued where they are right now (3 @average starters, and one decent role player). Most likely, you get one star, a couple of above-average starters and a contributing role player. I wouldn’t be shocked if 1/4 ended up as good as Carmelo. And in the meantime you’d definitely have that $10-million plus for FAs…

    *or swap in Fields.

  56. Caleb

    @64 I’d assume Fields is the most untouchable, because of his rookie contract – $788,000 next year.

    Just observing, it seems that MDA really likes Chandler. And versatility is definitely a bonus, especially if the roster is stripped down in a big trade.

  57. Brian Cronin

    I was right with you all offseason, Caleb, in not wanting to deal Gallo and AR in the same deal (heck, I was wary about trading either one of them), but if the Knicks have just made up their mind about AR (and they seem to have), then he’s basically a sunk cost, which is why I don’t mind dealing him.

  58. DS

    Brian Cronin: So when they rank Gallo, Fields and Chandler, I think they’re doing it based on who they feel they’d miss the most, and I think it is reasonable to believe that they think they’d miss Chandler the most.

    Isn’t that completely academic? Why would Denver take Chandler instead of Gallo (or even Fields) in a trade involving ‘Melo, even if Chandler was NY’s favorite of the 3?

  59. Robert Silverman

    Caleb, I’m extremely pro-AR as well. (You, me n’ Jimmy C seem to be the only ones left) It took Marcus Camby until he was 25 (the ”99 playoffs) to figure it out/emerge and another few years after that to shed the “but he’s so injury-prone” tag. I think the curve is the same for AR. Someone’s going to reap the rewards, I just don’t think it’s gonna be the ‘Bockers.

  60. Caleb

    @67 I know what you’re saying. Part it is just me as the commentator, arguing against the (maybe) inevitable. But there’s also opportunity cost. Let’s say MDA is really resistant to playing Randolph – you might could swap him for a pretty high draft pick, just to keep that extra lotto ball. Of course keeping him nailed to the bench hurts trade value, which is one reason I hate to see it.

    I also think Walsh is not so down on AR as D’Antoni is… based on the fact that he pushed for the trade in the first place, based on public comments and based on AR being sort of the Walsh “type” (cf Jermaine O’Neal, Al Harrington, Shawne Williams – raw, lanky forwards). He may not be inclined to give him away cheap. Heck, he might even be willing to trade other players (in the right deal), to basically force MDA to play the guy, at least next year.

  61. Jimmy C

    NYK Ewing: Sorry, read Chandler not Fields. Obviously the guy is underpriced, but I’d still disagree with the notion of slapping that label on Melo and saying people like him are highly available in the NBA.  

    All I’m saying is, at that price –let’s say between $13 and 16$ million a year — it almost doesn’t matter which max player you sign. I’m not saying there’s no difference between Melo and, say, Dwight Howard. But to the extent that you’re trying up an enormous amount of cap space on one piece — in our case two, with the “goal” of a third in 2012 — they become “a dime a dozen” simply by virtue of their inflated price.

    Compare this to a player like Fields, who offers a relatively high value for a comparably low price.

    Does that make sense?

  62. ess-dog

    Fields also fills a tough position to fill with a good player. But he probably has less upside than Gallo and Chandler and maybe even AR as a “star”.
    I also like AR but I just assume they will cash in on him this year. I would think he could fit well next to STAT, especially given 2 years to work on his outside shot. But MDA/Walsh don’t have 2 years. The life of a coach/GM is always at risk every minute.

  63. Robert Silverman

    FYI – Really good Simmons article on NBA longevity (when he skips the MTV/Reality show/Porn references and just writes as an unabashed fan, I dig his stuff).

    http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/110128&sportCat=nba

    To me, this is another argument in favor of Melo, who (again to me, w/o using advanced #’s) reminds me a ton of Paul Pierce. Pierce too, if y’all recall, was considered a me-first, low-efficiency, volume shooting, no defense guy before KG and Jesus Shuttlesworth showed up.

    Here’s both of them at age 26:

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=piercpa01&y1=2004&p2=anthoca01&y2=2011

  64. Caleb

    Pierce is an interesting comparison – except, he has been an excellent or even elite defender. But he has added value for durability and longevity, and I would put melo in the same category.

  65. Frank O.

    I watched every second of the game last night, and while it was elating to win, it was excruciating to watch.
    I have to say defense was important for both teams. Both teams closed on three point shots very quickly. Both were very athletic.
    Wade looked virtually unstoppable for a period there, where it appears he was moving normal speed and Knicks’ defenders in slow motion.
    Lebron seemed genuinely frustrated with the Knicks’ physical play. He wasn’t getting the calls he’s accustomed to, and he was a bit flustered. Indeed, his isos at the end were pretty ridiculous, and the Knicks converged on him effectively.
    I am mystified at the end that the weak side 3 pt defender collapsed on Lebron, leaving Chalmers open. Great that he missed. But shooting 37 percent from 3, the odds were with us that he would miss.

    This idea that wins are more or less important based on how the opponent played seems pretty cyclical. The Knicks have lost games where they didn’t play their A game against subpar opponents, and lost games against grade A teams bringing their very best at that time.
    That the Knicks were able to come from so far behind in the 4th and win is a major accomplishment, and something from which they can build.
    Anyone that argues this isn’t important is missing the point. To whit:
    - Landry Fields played one of his most clutch games against arguably the best team in the league. He was aggressive, intuitive, and efficient. The rookie played an important role in a quality victory. His evolution continues. In my view the best true rookie in the game.
    - Gallo is cementing opinions that in big games he is a clutch shooter. When Felton and Amare get him involved, he is a powerful penetrator at 6’11 or so, who is made much more threatening because defenders must guard his 3. That the Knicks expanded the offense to him in crunch time was an important lesson.

    A valuable victory, indeed.

  66. Robert Silverman

    Caleb: Pierce is an interesting comparison – except, he has been an excellent or even elite defender. But he has added value for durability and longevity, and I would put melo in the same category.  

    He has been a plus defender the last few years (or at least perceived to be so) and maybe was all along. But his rep was that he didn’t care about/put forth max effort during the Antoine Walker years.

  67. Caleb

    re: Pierce – IF Pierce + Carmelo in value (which sounds about right), then to be title-worthy we need:
    =Garnett (I’ll say Stoudemire = @2009 Garnett)
    =Allen (Gallo or Chandler or possibly even Fields could pull that off)
    =Rondo (i.e. someone as good as Rondo – that’s the hard one – the extra star I was talking about… if we trade everyone so we end up praying for Chandler or Fields to become as good as Rondo, I don’t like our odds).

  68. ess-dog

    Caleb: re: Pierce – IF Pierce + Carmelo in value (which sounds about right), then to be title-worthy we need: =Garnett (I’ll say Stoudemire = @2009 Garnett) =Allen (Gallo or Chandler or possibly even Fields could pull that off) =Rondo (i.e. someone as good as Rondo – that’s the hard one – the extra star I was talking about… if we trade everyone so we end up praying for Chandler or Fields to become as good as Rondo, I don’t like our odds).  

    Yes but our #5 – Chandler or Fields – is likely better and could be a fair amount better than 2011 Jermaine O’Neal or Perkins (can defend well but can’t score much.) And if we can add to our “solid” bench of Turiaf, Shawne, Bill….

  69. Frank O.

    To continue my point, teams bring to the table the team they have in the moment. All teams must fight through injuries, exhaustion, back to back games, etc.
    Miami was down Bosh, but the Knicks have to deal with Amare’s sprained shoulder, Felton’s sprained ankle and bruised knuckle, Turiaf’s sore hip, Douglas’s two sprained shoulders, etc.
    You play the game with what you have. If you win, you win. You get a W and your record improves by one.
    If you take a win from a team in your division or conference, that win is even more meaningful.
    If you beat a team that had out-physicalled you in the previous two games and sport two of the greatest players on the planet, well, you should feel awfully good about that win.
    If you found a way to physically frustrate the best player on the planet, you should feel good about that.
    If you are able to contain the second best player on the planet in the fourth period so that he shoots 1-7, you should feel good about that.
    If you completely eliminate their center from the game, when he killed you the last time you played on the boards and in scoring, you should feel good about that. You forced your opponent to play small. Knicks were only out rebounded by 4 last night.
    If your best player has an efficient and effective game – with four assists – after a series of not so good performances, you should feel good.
    If your point guard can’t hit the ocean with the basketball, but is finding key players open in key moments and is not throwing up foolish, self-serving shots in crunch time, enabling a victory, you should feel good.
    If you nearly double Miami’s assists output, you should feel great.
    If you hit 82 percent of your FTs, you should feel good, especially when the other guys hit only 69 percent.

    There are a lot of reasons to feel good about this win, without trying to denigrate it because the other team played poorly, or had injuries. Lord knows the Knicks have had to contend with both this season.

  70. Caleb

    ess-dog:
    Yes but our #5 – Chandler or Fields – is likely better and could be a fair amount better than 2011 Jermaine O’Neal or Perkins (can defend well but can’t score much.)And if we can add to our “solid” bench of Turiaf, Shawne, Bill….  

    Maybe, but I wouldn’t bank on that (at least not compared to a healthy Perkins).

    And, I’m not sure I’d call Turiaf/Shawne/Walker “solid.” I guess our bench could be comparable to Glen Davis/pre-injury Leon Powe/Tony Allen. (I’m focusing on 2008 + 2009 because we don’t know if this year’s team is championship-caliber or not)

    So i guess the overall talent level might be similar, if we keep two young prospects and they both pan out. And we can afford to keep Felton and/or this year’s draft pick can play. I don’t think we’d be as well-balanced, though, since our four best players would all be forwards, and most/all better on offense than defense. .

    Trading Chandler/Randolph for Carmelo wouldn’t doom the Knicks to mediocrity, but I’m not sure it leaves the team in better position than standing pat. Either way is a gamble.

  71. Frank O.

    At the end of the day, who expected the Knicks to be this interesting at this point in the season?
    Maybe a few of you, but I think they are exceeding most of our expectations.
    Certainly, no one – maybe one of us – expected Landry Fields to be this effective, this smart, this much of an effort guy. Let alone one of the best rebounding guards in basketball…as a rookie.
    Certainly, none of us saw Gallo being this effective a penetrator, although I still believe he is underutilized as a scorer.

    Granted, I get frustrated with some of the lapses. I think WC has fragile confidence and I think this trade stuff is freaking him out. I believe he is one player that would willingly take less money to remain with the Knicks, to ensure the Knicks can get that next max guy.
    I want to see D’Antoni take more risks with Mosgov…or, and this is tough for me, AR. I think they need to be all over AR to make sure he plays a limited role with a focus on rebounding and defense, while picking up garbage points around the basket.
    I think the Knicks need a back up for Felton.

  72. Z

    Brian Cronin: I think I’d rank them
    Gallo
    Fields
    Chandler
    with Gallo and Fields being extremely close togetherbut Chandler is probably the best defender of the three, so I can see an argument to be made for having him #1 on the Knicks’ ranking of the three.  

    I’d rank them

    1) Fields
    2) Gallinari
    3) Chandler

    Especially when deciding who stays/goes for Carmelo. We’d need a Fields type more than a Gallo and WAY more than a Chandler if we got Carmelo.

  73. BigBlueAL

    D’Antoni specifically mentioned in his post-game press conference that he needed to look at film and see what happened that allowed Chalmers to get that open. What happened was Fields had a brain fart and left Chalmers to help on LeBron when he got to the basket which of course at that stage of the game was a big No-No. At least Gallo tried to get to Chalmers and somewhat contest the shot.

  74. Z

    Caleb:
    Mark my words, AR is going to be a big-time player somewhere.  

    Define “big time” and consider your word’s marked. (I’ll give you a “big time” player in Greece. maybe Turkey. But I don’t think that’s what you mean :)

  75. Owen

    #53/58 You’re basically trading 3 good assets (Chandler/Gallo/Fields + Randolph + the 2014 pick). The pick isn’t that big a deal – it’s probably around #25. But as you know I am high on Randolph.

    “With that trade, your core is Stoudemire/Anthony/Gallo*/Chandler*… your next best players are Felton and a #20 pick in 2011. No meaningful draft picks to speak of.

    That’s not a contender. You’d have to find a way to add another borderline star. Either cross your fingers and pray for Gallo, or find $10 million to pay a FA center. If you somehow worked the contract numbers to set aside $8-10 million, it might be a good deal. It WOULD be insurance against a CBA that includes a franchise tag cutting off hope of a big get in 2012.”

    I just find this the most unappetizing scenario. I don’t understand how this can possibly be a good option compared to holding off a year and trying to sign Paul to a roster chock full of young talent.

    If I were Donnie I would wait a year. But perhaps he doesnt feel he can afford to…

  76. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    This debate about Fields’s worth (especially as a 2nd round pick making less than $800k next year) is inane.

    Shot creation is a myth. Most NBA players are athletic enough to shoot without being blocked 40% of the time. Fields chooses — I want to emphasize this: he chooses — to pick his shots carefully. Not all NBA players can do this. Most of them have egos (or physical gifts, or coaches, or all of the above) that prevent them from acting so rationally on the court.

    So next time you see Field crashing the boards, his hands above the rim after a made shot (and I seem to see this quite often), think of that as shot creation — would Carmelo, or many other players, be where he is when a play ends? And if Fields doesn’t crash the boards, how many of those missed shots terminate the Knicks’ possession?

    My reasoning leads to this conclusion: like Carmelo, Fields is fantastic at creating his own shot. It just so happens that it tends to come within a foot of the basket instead of 15 feet out. Who wants to argue against that?

  77. ess-dog

    The Honorable Cock Jowles: So next time you see Field crashing the boards, his hands above the rim after a made shot (and I seem to see this quite often), think of that as shot creation — would Carmelo, or many other players, be where he is when a play ends?   

    But isn’t Fields’ game somewhat predicated on the games of a guy like Melo? Or in our case, a guy like Amare? Fields gets a lot of putbacks off of misses and dishes from Amare/Felton as it stands and supplements that with open threes and transition baskets.
    This just reminds me of the debate over whether David Lee could be “the guy” or not despite his excellent advanced stats.

  78. Brian Cronin

    D’Antoni specifically mentioned in his post-game press conference that he needed to look at film and see what happened that allowed Chalmers to get that open. What happened was Fields had a brain fart and left Chalmers to help on LeBron when he got to the basket which of course at that stage of the game was a big No-No. At least Gallo tried to get to Chalmers and somewhat contest the shot.

    Yeah, I saw someone knock Gallo for that, but I was pretty sure it was Fields who left his man and it just looked like Gallo because it was Gallo who was running out on him. I wasn’t sure, though (these things go pretty fast, as you might imagine), so good to hear confirmation.

  79. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, I think a guy like Fields “needs” a guy like Carmelo to be optimally effective, in the sense that you tend to like to construct teams with a certain amount of high volume guys and a certain amount of low volume guys (but I use quotes around needs because I guess they could change things around and just have a motion offense where the ball just moves a lot – as people have noted, the Knicks had a pretty good offense last year with pretty much only two players having very good offensive seasons, Lee and Harrington – and I guess Gallo wasn’t bad – so if you gave them better players at the other spots plus gave them a good passer to replace Lee, then the offense might be an improvement on last year’s team without having a high volume lead scorer).

    That said, since the Knicks already have a guy like Carmelo in Amar’e, I don’t think Fields would get much extra assistance from a second guy like Carmelo, and heck, might actually lose out on shot attempts.

  80. NateRobinson

    Frank O.:

    Certainly, none of us saw Gallo being this effective a penetrator, although I still believe he is underutilized as a scorer.

    I want to see D’Antoni take more risks with Mosgov…or, and this is tough for me, AR. I think they need to be all over AR to make sure he plays a limited role with a focus on rebounding and defense, while picking up garbage points around the basket.
    I think the Knicks need a back up for Felton.  

    I agree completely with you Frank. Imo Gallo should be utilized more with the bench to create for himself and others off the p&r. Something TD lacks on. That way our bench could get more burn time and keep STAT and Felton fresh for the -wait for it- playoffs!

    I’ve had dreams of AR getting putbacks and alley-oops on transition. Why is he not used on a Turiaf role -who is non existent on offense unless its created for him- is beyond me. Plus AR is the better rebounder, I remember a game between GS and the Lakers and he got OReb after OReb on Odom prompting both to jaw at each other.

    AR sees himself like a Lamar ‘Scrotum’ type of player and I see him in that mold as well.

  81. ess-dog

    Brian Cronin: That said, since the Knicks already have a guy like Carmelo in Amar’e, I don’t think Fields would get much extra assistance from a second guy like Carmelo, and heck, might actually lose out on shot attempts.  

    This could be the key to the argument. Are two “exceptional” scorers necessary? Of course you want all your players to be all-around “good” players, but each with an area of expertise, if you will. An exceptional shooter, rebounder, defender, scorer and passer – all on the floor at one – would probably be ideal, no?

    Therefore, a lineup like CP3, Fields, Gallo, Gerald Wallace and Stat might be preferable.

  82. Brian Cronin

    I don’t think there’s any might about it, that lineup is definitely better. How would Wallace be acquired, though?

  83. ess-dog

    Brian Cronin: I don’t think there’s any might about it, that lineup is definitely better. How would Wallace be acquired, though?   

    Chandler or AR, 2014 pick and Curry?

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