Johnson is not an elite guy, but he’s good. I don’t know if teams are actually looking to max him out. If nothing else his miserable playoff performance should convince them he’s not a max guy. It could just be media hype. Maybe he’ll get a max deal with all the money floating around, but that doesn’t mean every team would do that. (People will get overpaid like every year, but it’s not a perfect market where everyone gets a 20% overvalued contract… some teams might look for value rather than throw money around plus there might be salary dump trades.) Money aside he’s one of the better players on the free agent market. He can be the focal point of your offense, which despite playing with talented teammates he was in Atlanta. He can be involved in 50% of your scores between usage and ast%, and do it at an above average efficiency in terms of TS% and TO%.

Those stats are a bit misleading: The last 4 seasons his stats have been significantly better than those averages. Around 20 pts, close to 5 asts, TS% closer to 54%. Hawks are also one of the slowest teams in the league.

Mike Miller, on the other hand, has been trending downwards the past few seasons. While his assist numbers have been good, his TOs have shot up through the roof (TO% > ast% last season). The past two seasons Miller’s only put up 11 pts/36 on terrible teams and his TO% has been above 19 (he turns it over about 1/5 the time he makes a play). Miller is also a better rebounder in part because he plays equal time at the 2 and 3, while Johnson spends over twice as much times at the 2 than 3.

The Crawford comparisons are scary. One thing I can say is that while Johnson is not a good defender, Crawford is an actively horrible defender. Johnson is a significantly better rebounder, as well, if Miller gets credit for that.
The hope would be that Johnson has a few career years playing in the backcourt for D’Antoni: TS% around 56 on a healthy volume, ast% around 30. That he’s avoid the 1-20 nights Crawford routinely had and be a significantly better playmaker if called on to run the offense. For 12, 13 mill per for 5 years that’s not terrible. Johnson, bigman scorer, and shooter could result in a top 5-10 offense… which seems to be the Knicks’ biggest goal given their coach’s philosophy and decisions.

Johnson – 17.2 ppg, 4.1 reb, 4.4 ast, 52.8% TS%
Crawford – 17.2 ppg, 3.0 reb, 4.5 ast, 52.4% TS%
Miller – 15.2 ppg, 5.7 reb, 3.6 ast, 57.7% TS%

He is not an elite 2 guard. He is a good 2 guard but clearly below the elite wing players. I do not really understand how he has gotten to be thought of as such a good player. He is a borderline all-star and nothing more, that does not seem like the player that will raise out of the cellar.

No thanks. We can do without Ilgauskas.

Certainly not Rudy Gay I would pray. So who is the other big name guy??

My plan named JJ as a piece, so obviously I’m down with JJ. Not like “Rah rah, JJ, yeah!” but I think him, Lee plus $8-10 million worth of free agents along the lines of Chandler then using Curry for whoever would be the way to go if they whiff on Lebron/Wade/Bosh.

“If it wasn’t for Newark for two years, they [the Nets] would probably be the winner,” the individual said. “But they probably have surpassed the Knicks. I think the Knicks hurt themselves with the draft.”

It’s an anonymous source with “ties to LeBron” in the Post, so it doesn’t prove much of anything. Still, it wasn’t a totally crazy thought.

Great points, Ben, about Curry’s value and renouncing Lee.

I agree with a lot of Ben’s Johnson/Amare sentiment. However, I also agree with BBA re: 149. A team of Lee, Morrow and two other MLE type guys is not likely to be much better than last season’s Knicks. Same goes for Mike Miller and probably Childress as well (depending on how much he’s improved in Greece). Morrow especially is a really limited guy. Miller hasn’t much helped Minnesota or the Wizrads win games. Last time he was in the NBA Childress was a nice complementary piece, but a low volume scorer. Knicks are losing solid mid-level types in Harrington and Nate from the last few seasons (not to mention Duhon and talents like Crawford and Randolph before that), so I have a hard time seeing replacing them with limited upside MLE value guys taking the Knicks to the playoffs. The right combo might work, but I might be more comfortable getting a solid offensive 1-2-3 punch in Amare/Lee, Johnson, and Danilo going and fill in the Chandler’s, Douglas’, Walker’s, etc.’s around them. That should be a top 10, top 5 maybe offense. The big advantage I could see is if a cheaper Childress/Miller/Morrow type takes a short deal.

@150 rama

I tend to think Bosh is worth at least $4 mill more than Lee. Bosh is a real primary scorer who can carry a top 5 offense, and has done so before. He scores at a higher volume and lives at the FT line. His passing is just as good, he just didn’t run the offense the way Lee did last season. His length makes it seem like he could be a strong defender in the right situation and if he applied himself. $4 million may or may not make much of a difference. Could add that to Curry for a max guy.

My answer, I guess, would be Bosh and Chandler may be better than those three. While I like Mike Miller, the Knicks have a bunch of good young wing scorers. Miller is a very useful role player who would probably thrive for D’Antoni, but between Gallo, Walker, Douglas, and maybe Fields and/or Rautins he becomes pretty redundant.
At the same time, D’Antoni is unlikely to use/like Chandler at a true PF like Lee or Bosh. No one shooting 3s… I doubt the Knicks will add Chandler and a PF who can’t shoot the 3, but I hope I’m wrong and they at least would do that if it’s their best option.

Again, I agree with BBA in 152.

THCJ, Horford was only 23 as well. Smith is a very good player, but if he were a FA he’d be looking max. He really is a 3rd or 4th scoring option, so that’s a lot of $. Plus the attitude questions. Definitely a great x-factor, though. I would be very interested, but not falling over myself for the Knicks to sign him at the max. Outside of not having 3pt range, would be a great PF for D’Antoni.

@136 Ben R
Anthony Morrow, really? Bill Walker looks like he’ll give you the same or more at a fraction of the cost.

@143 Z
“Didn’t Nate give up his Bird rights when he agreed to the trade.”

Yeah, good catch, I think that’s true.

@146 THCJ

Contrary to popular belief, the sky is not falling. If a contract starts at $10 million, the most it can reach without a s&t is 13.2 mill and with a s&t is 15.25 mill. Raises are based on the first year of the contract, they do no compound.
Joe Johnson will be overpaid, but you can win 53 games and have the #2 offense in the league with him as one of your top 3 players. That’s a fact, because Atlanta just did that.