Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Thursday, October 2, 2014

Game Thread: Knicks @ Robertcats

Good evening, good people. Your in-game comments / Boris Diaw nightmares go here.

178 comments on “Game Thread: Knicks @ Robertcats

  1. Thomas B.

    I wonder how much Michael Buffer got to do that opening line-up. Whatever it was, it was too much.

    Also, I would have gone with “Knicks @BobSaiettaCats”.

  2. BigBlueAL

    JR enters and immediately turns it over, allows his man to get an offensive rebound/dunk then misses a wide-open 3pter.

  3. Will the Thrill

    you would think the bandage on his hand would make him shoot LESS

    massive:
    Raymond Felton is 1-5 already. He needs to heat up soon.

  4. DRed

    Maybe it’s not a great idea for the guy with a bone bruise on his hand to hoist up a lot of shots?

  5. massive

    The Knicks need to stop ball-watching. Carmelo Anthony and JR Smith both just let guys run right by them.

  6. ethsurken

    To the people who say Chandler is a low volume scorer, he is scoring more points per 36 than JR Smith (14.8).

  7. Juany8

    Before people start freaking out too much about this game, the Knicks are playing Miami tomorrow at Miami. The Knicks have lost every single other road back to back they’ve played this season, I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Knicks use the Miami strategy of “stay kind of close with a bad team, play hard for 5 minutes at the end and destroy the scrubs”

  8. Will the Thrill

    Melo and Chandler have been great this season. I can’t wait until everyone’s love affair with Sheed dies down, the guy is only getting worse.

  9. maxwell_3g

    ok. lets put the half behind us and take control in the 3rd quarter….
    and am i the only one stuck with the charlotte announcers on league pass?? talk about homervision

  10. BigBlueAL

    maxwell_3g:
    ok.lets put the half behind us and take control in the 3rd quarter….
    and am i the only one stuck with the charlotte announcers on league pass??talk about homervision

    Yeah me too, at least its the game being shown in HD though (Comcast only has 1 HD channel for LP games).

  11. JK47

    Well, they battled back pretty good to close out the half there. But the defense needs to play better than this against the 27th ranked offense.

    32 points in the paint for the Bobcats… that’s wack.

  12. nicos

    Charlotte’s play by play guy is giving Tommy Heinsohn a run for his money- I guess acute homer-ism is a bit more forgivable with a crappy team.

  13. KnickFanInCelticLand

    BigBlueAL: Yeah me too, at least its the game being shown in HD though (Comcast only has 1 HD channel for LP games).

    Why don’t you two shut your sound off on your video and put on the free League Audio Pass (Knicks announcers) as your commentary.

  14. maxwell_3g

    BigBlueAL: Yeah me too, at least its the game being shown in HD though (Comcast only has 1 HD channel for LP games).

    i love how they are saying that our players complain about the refs so much and that somehow has led to our 12-4 start

  15. Thomas B.

    maxwell_3g: i love how they are saying that our players complain about the refs so much and that somehow has led to our 12-4 start

    It would be 14-2 if the refs weren’t so anti-Melo. I’m still pissed about the charging call in Dallas. And the awfulness in Memphis.

  16. d-mar

    Hey, Raymond, Walker hasn’t pulled up once for a jumper, you might want to think about staying in front of him

  17. massive

    Thomas B.: It would be 14-2 if the refs were so anti-Melo.I’m still pissed about the charging call in Dallas.And the awfulness in Memphis.

    You forgot the uppercut Chris Kaman gave Carmelo Anthony at the end of that Dallas game.

  18. JK47

    Knicks need to be more patient on offense. Not seeing a lot of ball movement these last few possessions.

  19. nicos

    After getting off to a great start this year JR has been pretty bad. He’s the worst defensive player on the team not named Novak- perpetually losing his man.

  20. JK47

    Turnover. Brick. Brick. Offensive foul. Offensive foul. Brick. Brick. Brick.

    JR is awful tonight. Get him out of there.

  21. maxwell_3g

    im actually impressed with melo for not resorting to hero ball and continuing to pass even though his teammates are bricking

  22. Thomas B.

    maxwell_3g:
    ummmjr.charlotte isnt even a party city

    Well he should apply the same rule to this game that he does at the Charlotte gentleman’s clubs: Take it hard to the hole.

  23. JK47

    I love Kidd, but he just can’t guard quick 2′s like Ben Gordon. He’s like a statue out there on defense. Gordon and Henderson just blow by him like he’s not even there.

  24. f.l.o.

    it might have worked so far this season but i don’t get how/why the knicks rely so much on their 3-pointers if they don’t fall.
    why not take it to the basket?

  25. JK47

    Remember when Tyson Chandler used to play defense? It’s layup after layup for the Bobcats tonight.

    Chandler’s defense has slipped BADLY.

  26. Thomas B.

    JK47:
    Remember when Tyson Chandler used to play defense?It’s layup after layup for the Bobcats tonight.

    Chandler’s defense has slipped BADLY.

    I don’t know. 90% of this problem is the Knicks guards being unable to keep anyone in front of them.

  27. Kurt

    DRed: yes, this is EXACTLY why I can’t wait for Amar’e to get back. No way STAT gets blocked on a cut like that.

  28. BigBlueAL

    Think Knicks will still win this game but doesnt bode well for tomorrow night having to expand this much energy to pull this game out. Might get ugly in Miami tomorrow.

  29. KJG

    following my fantasy… melo been stuck on 21 pts for quite some time…

    ok now were trading hoops… and like i said… ho hum… whizzing by

    3:30 to go

  30. Thomas B.

    The nice thing about NBALP is that I get to see commercials for fast food places that never advertise in the DC Metro Area. What in the world is a “Jack in the Box”?

  31. Juany8

    Thomas B.:
    The nice thing about NBALP is that I get to see commercials for fast food places that never advertise in the DC Metro Area.What in the world is a “Jack in the Box”?

    My college nightmare….

  32. maxwell_3g

    Thomas B.:
    The nice thing about NBALP is that I get to see commercials for fast food places that never advertise in the DC Metro Area.What in the world is a “Jack in the Box”?

    believe me. you are better off not knowing

  33. JK47

    Okay, enough with the “Rookie Of The Month” crap, you asshat. Like it’s the greatest thing that’s ever happened to your franchise. Oh wait… it is.

  34. Juany8

    JK47:
    Okay, enough with the “Rookie Of The Month” crap, you asshat.Like it’s the greatest thing that’s ever happened to your franchise.Oh wait… it is.

    They had an all star!

  35. JK47

    Ray Felton and JR Smith with a two-on-one to end the game… And then whatever happened happened.

    WTF

  36. DRed

    Thomas B.:
    The nice thing about NBALP is that I get to see commercials for fast food places that never advertise in the DC Metro Area.What in the world is a “Jack in the Box”?

    Basically, the devil’s own fast food establishment. Sons of bitches tried to poison me back in college.

  37. JK47

    Michael Kidd-Gilchrist played perfect defense on that, but JR is really athletic on that step-back jumper. That was ridiculous.

  38. Frank O.

    Forty-fucking-one three pointers…
    -14 in rebounds
    But nine steals and eight blocks. They forced 12 TOs
    Chandler 18 pts and 17 boards.
    Wow

  39. yellowboy90

    Heat look forward to the Knicks and lose.The knicks look forward to the Heat and win. Thursday night let’s win again.

  40. jon abbey

    Charlotte isn’t awful, they have a similar home record to our road record. people continually forget how hard it is to win road games in the NBA, and CHA is filled with quick guards who were hitting outside shots tonight.

    strange game, do we know what exactly happened to Melo yet?

  41. Frank O.

    Refs really let them just play.
    28 free throws, total.
    It got very physical down the stretch, but the refs swallowed the whistles.
    Fun game to watch.

  42. Frank O.

    jon abbey:
    Charlotte isn’t awful, they have a similar home record to our road record. people continually forget how hard it is to win road games in the NBA, and CHA is filled with quick guards who were hitting outside shots tonight.

    strange game, do we know what exactly happened to Melo yet?

    Lacerated middle finger on non-shooting hand. And I agree: CHA is a solid young squad and walker is quick and fast. He’s trimmed down from his Uconn days.

  43. BigBlueAL

    I guess it was a good thing Woody didnt bench JR for the rest of the game when I called for it late in the 3rd quarter :-)

  44. jon abbey

    BigBlueAL:
    Felton 7 for 19for 17 pts but he did have 9 asts and 0 to’s.

    and again a few of these were “missed shot/assists”, get the ball up on the backboard and let the uncovered Chandler put it back.

  45. Thomas B.

    Brian Cronin:
    They’re trying to out-dumb each other.

    Seriously! It was like “Anything you can do, I can do dumber. I can do anything dumber than you.”

  46. jon abbey

    and Jason Kidd is a god among men, he almost had a stroke trying to get a timeout before that last play, and a crucial, sick steal in the last few minutes too.

  47. DRed

    Melo needs to knock it off with the Jeter shit. Can’t knock the hustle, but it’s really not worth the injury risk.

  48. Frank O.

    Gonna be tired and dinged up for the Heat. Chandler and Melo will need to be great and JR and Novak need to shoot well.

  49. Juany8

    BigBlueAL:
    Felton 7 for 19for 17 pts but he did have 9 asts and 0 to’s.

    Heat are getting lucky recently, first San Antonio and now they get to play a Knicks team coming off a tight win on the road in which Melo gets injured. If the Knicks win tomorrow, no matter what happens, I’m saying that’s going to be the best win of the entire season. The Heat are trying tomorrow, I absolutely guarantee it, gonna be a fun game to watch.

  50. jon abbey

    DRed:
    Melo needs to knock it off with the Jeter shit.Can’t knock the hustle, but it’s really not worth the injury risk.

    agreed on this, it’s almost never worth the risk.

  51. yellowboy90

    What a night both my Blue and orange teams won tonight. UF and the Knicks. Blowout and nail bitter.

  52. ruruland

    Frank O.: Lacerated middle finger on non-shooting hand. And I agree: CHA is a solid young squad and walker is quick and fast. He’s trimmed down from his Uconn days.

    I’m with you both.

    Very good coach, one of the mos athletic teams in the league, Walker’s gotten a lot better.

    I can see them winning 30ish games and getting a few of these upsets at home.

    Outside of games at Oklahoma and Dallas they’ve been very competitive in all of their losses.

    Lost by 3 @ Atlanta, 6 against Philly, OT loss against Portland, beat Minnesota, Indiana and Dallas at home.

    On a night when the Knicks couldn’t make an open shot, you gotta love a game won on the road with defense and grit in the 4th quarter against the more energized team through 3.

  53. JK47

    When the Knicks started turning up the pressure on defense down the stretch, the Bobcats had no answer:

    3:04 Jeffery Taylor misses 15-foot jumper
    2:46 Ben Gordon bad pass
    2:10 JR Smith blocks Bismack Biyombo’s 2-foot layup
    2:10 shot clock turnover
    1:15 Gerald Henderson misses 10-foot jumper
    1:09 5 sec inbound turnover
    0:39 Ben Gordon traveling
    0:07 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist bad pass

    The Bobcats’ last points came with 3:49 left in the quarter.

    Charlotte is a bad offensive team, and there’s no excuse for letting them score so easily for most of the game. When the game was on the line and the Knicks stepped up the defensive intensity, Charlotte was hopeless. I know you can’t do that for 48 minutes, but if the Knicks had played more attacking defense throughout the game they would have been able to put this one away a lot easier.

  54. Juany8

    jon abbey: and again a few of these were “missed shot/assists”, get the ball up on the backboard and let the uncovered Chandler put it back.

    That has clearly become a strategy recently. I really don’t think Felton is stupid enough to take some of those floaters without a clear understanding that Chandler has better than a 50% chance of getting the rebound. Underrated way to pass it to a dominant roll man lol, I still think that while he shouldn’t get credit for an assist there, the offensive rebound should erase the miss. Chandler still gets his offensive contributions tallied, he doesn’t get to double dip by penalizing a guy who at least didn’t hurt the play

  55. ruruland

    Juany8: Heat are getting lucky recently, first San Antonio and now they get to play a Knicks team coming off a tight win on the road in which Melo gets injured. If the Knicks win tomorrow, no matter what happens, I’m saying that’s going to be the best win of the entire season. The Heat are trying tomorrow, I absolutely guarantee it, gonna be a fun game to watch.

    A win tomorrow is found money. Period. You can tell guys were mentally preparing for this 4 in 5 stretch and the energy they’d need tomorrow night against a pissed off and rested Heat.

    You don’t come out blazing against the worst team in that stretch in the first night. Probably had to use too much energy in the 4th, which kind of scares me for tomorrow.

    Going 2-2 in these 4 games would be a victory. 3-1 would be really amazing.

    this is the toughest part of the schedule for a while. the second half is eaier than the first. April gets tough. But this team will make it’s 60 win push (injuries notwithstanding) in 2013.

  56. Juany8

    JK47:
    When the Knicks started turning up the pressure on defense down the stretch, the Bobcats had no answer:

    3:04 Jeffery Taylor misses 15-foot jumper
    2:46 Ben Gordon bad pass
    2:10 JR Smith blocks Bismack Biyombo’s 2-foot layup
    2:10 shot clock turnover
    1:15 Gerald Henderson misses 10-foot jumper
    1:09 5 sec inbound turnover
    0:39 Ben Gordon traveling
    0:07 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist bad pass

    The Bobcats’ last points came with 3:49 left in the quarter.

    Charlotte is a bad offensive team, and there’s no excuse for letting them score so easily for most of the game.When the game was on the line and the Knicks stepped up the defensive intensity, Charlotte was hopeless.I know you can’t do that for 48 minutes, but if the Knicks had played more attacking defense throughout the game they would have been able to put this one away a lot easier.

    Lol called it! Sorry but I have to point out that I said that exact thing would happen. Charlotte kept it closer than I thought they would though lol

  57. ephus

    JR Smith has irrational confidence in his ability to make his shot. And that is a HUGE asset. I think JR knows that the ball is going in everytime he releases it. If he is out on the court, he is going to shoot when he is open (and sometimes when he isn’t).

    He has won me over, even though there are going to be games where he makes me tear my hair out.

  58. ruruland

    Juany8: That has clearly become a strategy recently. I really don’t think Felton is stupid enough to take some of those floaters without a clear understanding that Chandler has better than a 50% chance of getting the rebound. Underrated way to pass it to a dominant roll man lol, I still think that while he shouldn’t get credit for an assist there, the offensive rebound should erase the miss. Chandler still gets his offensive contributions tallied, he doesn’t get to double dip by penalizing a guy who at least didn’t hurt the play

    I honestly don’t think it’s possible to accurately credit each player for the points.

    The play works because of the spacing, Felton’s quickness and threat to make a great pass, Chandler’s quality screen and ability to finish on the lob.

    The only way to truly measure he play is to look at its success with all 5 players on the court. Of course, Felton is the decision-maker, so that;’s a very underrated aspect of all of it. He’s a very good decision maker too.

  59. JK47

    Charlotte really isn’t all that good.

    Coming into this game they were 27th in O-rating, 21st in D-rating and 29th in SRS. They were 7-9 coming into the game, but with a Pythag record of 5-11 and the second easiest schedule in the NBA.

    28th in offensive eFG%, 24th in defensive eFG%. Dead last in defensive rebounding.

    They’re bad.

  60. ruruland

    Juany8: Lol called it! Sorry but I have to point out that I said that exact thing would happen. Charlotte kept it closer than I thought they would though lol

    the thing is that smart teams and especially older ones know they can’t play the kind of defense the Knicks did in the 4th against bad-average teams throughout the season for gull games without breaking down when they NEED THE ENERGY.

    Also, Charlotte has good guard penetration and are really fast and athletic in transition — hat’s how they score point and they aren’t horrible on offense.

    On nights their shotsgo in like tonight, they are a threat to beat any team at home.

  61. Juany8

    ruruland: A win tomorrow is found money. Period. You can tell guys were mentally preparing for this 4 in 5 stretch and the energy they’d need tomorrow night against a pissed off and rested Heat.

    You don’t come out blazing against the worst team in that stretch in the first night. Probably had to use too much energy in the 4th, which kind of scares me for tomorrow.

    Going 2-2 in these 4 games would be a victory. 3-1 would be really amazing.

    this is the toughest part of the schedule for a while. the second half is eaier than the first. April gets tough. But this team will make it’s 60 win push (injuries notwithstanding) in 2013.

    Still thinking about 55 exactly because of games like this, this team is particularly vulnerable to nicks and bruises, and they need to exert a lot of effort to play legitimate D. While that seems like a given for most teams, the Knicks and Heat don’t have the traditional size that lets teams be a little lazy and just give up perimeter shots in the pick and roll, hoping for misses. The only way this scheme works is if players are crashing around all over the place, the Knicks are fully capable of it, but guys like Kidd, Sheed, and even Chandler can’t take that kind of beating every night. Melo might be able to, but he has to carry the offense for long stretches, and even Lebron isn’t actually guarding power forwards.

    I think the Knicks are a 57-58 win “quality” team in the playoffs if that makes sense. I’m starting to come around to Amar’e providing a positive impact, but only during the regular season, I don’t think Amar’e fits in with the Knicks best lineup, he might not hurt it but he won’t improve it

  62. jon abbey

    JK47:
    Charlotte really isn’t all that good.

    Coming into this game they were 27th in O-rating, 21st in D-rating and 29th in SRS.They were 7-9 coming into the game, but with a Pythag record of 5-11 and the second easiest schedule in the NBA.

    28th in offensive eFG%, 24th in defensive eFG%.Dead last in defensive rebounding.

    They’re bad.

    you need to separate out home and road performances, also that massive blowout by OKC skews things.

  63. JK47

    The impending return of Shump will help the Knicks maintain that defensive intensity, especially against guard-oriented teams like Charlotte.

  64. Brian Cronin

    Actually, I tried to edit awful but the server took so long to respond that it was up for a few minutes before I could get back in there. I agree that they are not awful (and I love their coach) but they were awful at the end of the game so I had not a single solitary doubt that the Knicks would pull it off. I didn’t think it would be on that particular shot, but I knew the Knicks were not losing that game.

  65. Juany8

    So does anyone know where I could get something like Hoopdata shot location info in an excel format? I wanna mess around with some numbers but I don’t have the time (i.e. laziness) to gather the data myself. I want to see if I can try to fit players into entirely new “roles”, different from the normal PG-SG-SF-PF-C positions that don’t really mean anything. I also want to see how assisted % on baskets affects efficiency, both from year to year for individual players and across the league.

  66. JK47

    Tyson Chandler’s TS% in this game was .765.

    This raised his TS% on the season by one point, to .753, which would demolish his own single-season record of .708 set last year.

    He has 213 points on 111 FGA.

    His FG% on the season is now .721. The all-time single season record is Wilt Chamberlain in 1972-73 with .727. Serge Ibaka ranks second in the NBA at .595.

    He’s averaged 16.6 PPG over his last 8 games.

  67. Thomas B.

    Brian Cronin:
    Actually,I tried to edit awful but the server took so long to respond that it was up for a few minutes before I could get back in there.I agree that they are not awful (and I love their coach) but they were awful at the end of the game so I had not a single solitary doubt that the Knicks would pull it off. I didn’t think it would be on that particular shot,but I knew the Knicks were not losing that game.

    The way they managed the final 3:30 was awful.
    Two Ben Gordon turnovers.
    A shot clock violation.
    A five second violation.
    A Kidd-Gilchrist turnover.
    0-2 from the floor in the final 3:49.

    On the other hand, you could say the Cats weren’t awful. You could argue the Knicks’ defense was amazing over that same period. Only one of those turnovers–Gordon’s travel–was unforced.

    Meh. Either way, I got what i wanted.

  68. Thomas B.

    JK47:
    The impending return of Shump will help the Knicks maintain that defensive intensity, especially against guard-oriented teams like Charlotte.

    It’ll also help Smith’s 1-8 from dowtown nights look better by comparison.

  69. jon abbey

    JK47:
    Tyson Chandler’s TS% in this game was .765.

    This raised his TS% on the season by one point, to .753, which would demolish his own single-season record of .708 set last year.

    He has 213 points on 111 FGA.

    His FG% on the season is now .721.The all-time single season record is Wilt Chamberlain in 1972-73 with .727.Serge Ibaka ranks second in the NBA at .595.

    He’s averaged 16.6 PPG over his last 8 games.

    at the same time, NY has 200 made 3s through 17 games, which is an alltime league record. no other team has made 200 even in 18 games.

    it’s almost as if those two alltime historical extremes occurring on the same team are related somehow, it’s almost as if it’s close to impossible to separate out individual performance… :)

  70. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, that was what I was going with, Thomas, that the bobcats were ending the game so poorly that I had no doubt they were going to find a way to lose. A five second violation followed by a near travel followed by a travel? Insane! And being loose with the ball in a tie game with nine seconds left? Ludicrous!

  71. Juany8

    My god Faried is an awful defender. Chandler is a star because he’s a good offensive player (not great) who is an absolute monster on defense. I can accept that people think he’s as, or even more, important then Melo to this team. Faried on the other hand gives up every possession he saves his team with an offensive rebound by playing laughably bad defense on the other end.

    Defense is very important, especially from your big men, and even more so when you have Gallinari and Lawson on the perimeter. You have to be Shaq good on offense to make up for defense that ineffective

  72. Juany8

    jon abbey: at the same time, NY has 200 made 3s through 17 games, which is an alltime league record. no other team has made 200 even in 18 games.

    it’s almost as if those two alltime historical extremes occurring on the same team are related somehow, it’s almost as if it’s close to impossible to separate out individual performance… :)

    Remember that Nate Silver article from a few years ago that said Melo was a star because of his effect on his teammates TS%? He’d be having a field day with the way Tyson Chandler suddenly started shooting AFTER winning a championship. His Efg is absurdly high compared to the rest of his career, it’s his free throws that have remained consistent. Guess which Melo can affect?

    Wonder what it says that the most successful online stat geek ever (he predicted the election results in all 50 states correctly for those that don’t know) thinks Melo is a superstar, and that Silver’s study would have predicted that Chandler would have a better TS% with Melo than with most other teams.

    http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/01/15/why-carmelo-anthony-is-the-ultimate-team-player-and-what-advanced-stats-miss-about-him/

  73. jon abbey

    worth noting that now Woodson has coached exactly one half season for NY, and has a ridiculously good 31-10 record, which obviously projects to a 62-20 pace.

  74. ruruland

    yellowboy90:
    RuRu I blame you for the laceration.

    I’ll take that one. But he’ll be fine it’s non-shooting hand.

    Hope it’s just stiches and not bandaged. Saw how that affected Felton.

  75. DRed

    ruruland: I’ll take that one. But he’ll be fine it’s non-shooting hand.

    Hope it’s just stiches and not bandaged. Saw how that affected Felton.

    Notice that Carmelo was awful once Felton took his bandage off? Like Abbey says, it’s almost impossible to separate out individual performance.

  76. BigBlueAL

    According to Tina Cervasio on Twitter this was first game-winning buzzer beater since Steve Francis and his crazy 3pter beat the Wizards in Washington. Also known as the shot that got Isiah a contract extension.

  77. massive

    So we play the Heat tomorrow without Battier and Chalmers? That means Norris Cole will be playing a LOT, which is great news for the Knicks. It also means that they will have to put LeBron on Melo, which should keep LeBron’s athleticism out of the passing lanes.

  78. jon abbey

    DRed: Notice that Carmelo was awful once Felton took his bandage off?Like Abbey says, it’s almost impossible to separate out individual performance.

    I think you’re joking, but it is funny to note that Melo and Chandler were both awesome in the first half, didn’t do nearly as much in the second half (13 of Chandler’s 17 boards were in the first half, I believe), yet NY lost the first half by 2 and won the second half by 4.

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