Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Wednesday, October 18, 2017

ESPN.com: Sources: Knicks trade Melo to OKC

I literally just got off a cruise ship in Vancouver after a week long cruise in Alaska, turn on my phone for the first time in a week and that was quite good timing.

From ESPN

The New York Knicks have agreed to trade 10-time All-Star forward Carmelo Anthony to the Oklahoma City Thunder, league sources told ESPN on Saturday.

The Thunder will send center Enes Kanter, forward Doug McDermott and a 2018 second-round pick (via the Chicago Bulls) to New York, league sources said.

Anthony, 33, will waive his no-trade clause and his $8.1 million trade kicker to accommodate the deal, league sources told ESPN.

As a pure trade, it’s probably a C, as it is basically nothing for Melo but the benefit of getting rid of Melo and getting a second round pick. And that isn’t all that impressive-sounding.

However, from a psychological standpoint, it’s huge, so I’ll give the trade a B, maybe even a B+.

Never thought this day would happen. Good job getting something done, Perry! Phil wanted to buyout the guy, ya know? So just getting rid of him without buying him out or taking on toxic assets is an achievement of sorts.

Melo sharing the ball with Westbrook should be hilarious. With Paul George, too!!

119 comments on “ESPN.com: Sources: Knicks trade Melo to OKC

  1. yellowboy90

    So will KP and Melo guard each other opening night or will Roberson match up on KP?

    Westbrook/Sessions
    Roberson/Lee
    George/Lance or McDermott or Beasley
    Anthony/Kp
    Adams/ Willy or Kanter or Noah or Oquinn

  2. daaarn

    I hope we can finally flop in earnest and accrue assets thru the draft. Got about 2 years to do that before we can offload a bunch of shit contracts for a decent second option behind KP.

  3. The Glass Half Rebuilt

    If we get decent point guard play, I think Doug McDermott will be as good as Gerald Green was in 2014 for Hornacek.

  4. yellowboy90

    Edit: I forgot about the return of THjr. I guess he’ll start at the two and Lee at the 3 or vice versa

  5. Z-man

    Baker, kuz and Dotson are going to play a lot. I think Lee is the next to go. Might have to include a sweetener.

  6. The Glass Half Rebuilt

    The Knicks are going to win more games this year than they won last year. We need to let go of the idea that Melo was somehow worth 10-12 wins a year to our franchise.

  7. iserp

    The Knicks are going to win more games this year than they won last year. We need to let go of the idea that Melo was somehow worth 10-12 wins a year to our franchise.

    With the guards we have, either Ntilikina is a good playmaker from the very beginning, or the team is going to have a lot of trouble elaborating a passable offense. I think we will see lots of THJr and KP isos, and it’s not going to be pretty.

  8. johnnyhoops

    I hope that we can keep Kanter safe here in New York. The Turkish embassy seems to employ plenty of thugs.

  9. Cock Jowles, #1 Tanking Denialist

    Now we’re trying to convince ourselves that a secound round pick is really better than a first round pick???

    Ok we’ll go with that for now…. SMH

    The 31st pick is MUCH more valuable than the 30th pick. But you’re not very good with facts, as you’ve demonstrated in the past.

  10. johnnyhoops

    We’ve added Kanter, THJr, Sessions and Frank while losing only Rose and Melo. We should be much better.

  11. iserp

    The 31st pick is MUCH more valuable than the 30th pick. But you’re not very good with facts, as you’ve demonstrated in the past.

    It’s more valuable, but not by that much. And I’d rather have the 26th than the 31st.

  12. danvt

    There are a lot of people who post here that I’d like to hug right now. Obviously the big winner right now is that we’re free to develop a team concept.

    Kanter isn’t good, Brian? Best thing is the second rounder (and no 3rd year)?

  13. The Glass Half Rebuilt

    Enes Kanter is a more productive player than Carmelo Anthony and he has no problem coming off the bench. He was tearing us up last year when OKC visited the Garden. 27 points and 10 rebounds in 28 minutes.

  14. danvt

    Center: Wily, Kanter, Noah
    PF: KP, O’Quinn
    2: TH, Lee, Dotson
    1: FK, Jack, Sessions, Baker
    SF: Kuz, Lance,

    Starting 5: KP, Frank (sooner or later), Wily, TH, +?

    Either I have “superstar” withdrawal or the cupboard seems a bit bare. I guess I’m hoping we have some good development, a monster coming in the draft and then via FA once Noah, Enes sunset.

  15. johnnyhoops

    Can The Bease be as good (or bad) as Melo was?

    I’d still like to add a Harkless type as a young defender.

  16. JK47

    Finally the Amar’e/Melo era and the whole failed attempt to create an answer to the Miami Heat “Big 3″ is over. It was a long and mostly shitty era. This is the first time in a long while that the Knicks have felt like a normal NBA team and not some starfucking nightmare.

  17. Ntilakilla

    This trade is a fucking A grade. Perry inherited an almost impossible decision where a terrible deal was about to happen and extracted something of value from it. For those people who think Melo was worth more, think again. His NTC, the overpriced contract with an option year, his poorly aging game and refusal to play the team game are exactly the reasons why. The most important thing moving forward is the fact that this young team can develop without the specter of his shadow over it. And now we don’t have to spend hours upon hours obsessing over him and his influence on the team. Good riddance!

  18. stratomatic hates the Melo trade & is despondent again

    The problem with Kanter is not his statistics. It’s that if you play him at Center he can’t defend the paint and gets targeted with P&Rs. If you play him at PF, he can’t guard the perimeter and gets targeted with P&Rs.

    There was a game in last year’s playoffs where he got targeted and embarrassed defensively on two consecutive plays. The camera just happened to be on the coaches right after the second one. You could read Donovan’s lips. He said, “This guy is unplayable”. He took him out and didn’t play him much the rest of the game.

  19. Ntilakilla

    This is a European Union type team now. Latvia (KP), Spain (Willy), France (Frank), Turkey (Ines), Lithuania (Kuz). All we need is Doncic to give us Slovenia and our world domination shall be complete!

  20. DRed

    Yeah Melo can’t or wouldn’t have played any defense either. I wish we didn’t have Kanter, but we weren’t getting rid of Melo without taking something bad back. And we’re not going to have to worry about Enes Kanter’s playoff defense.

  21. Zanzibar

    Kanter has a WS48 of about .200 for the past three years. That’s not nothing.

    And OKC’s been worse all 3 of those years when Kanter’s been on the court in terms of both raw and adjusted plus/minus. That ain’t nuttin’ either. BPM/VORP and RPM do a better job incorporating defense than WS/48 and WP48. WS and WP are not appropriate metrics when evaluating players like Calderon and Kanter. My fear is that our front office will not appreciate that.

    reub (aka charley aka johnnyhoops), did you recommend that Vancouver cruise to Bryan? Also what do you think of Bron calling your favorite POTUS a “bum”?

  22. DRed

    Kanter could be situationaly useful-he does have some high level NBA skills, but I’d certainly rather give those minutes to Willy. I guess we just nail Noah to the bench a lot and hope we can trade Enes at some point?

  23. johnnyhoops

    Barkley is saying that he likes Kanter and the trade from the Knicks perspective. Kanter’s toughness is what Hornacek has been asking for. He’s averaged over 5 offensive rebounds per 36 over the past 3 seasons. Dennis Rodman averaged slightly less than 6 for his entire career.

  24. Silky Johnson, Fleet Admiral of the Tank Armada

    @31
    I think we’ll be pretty activist about trading two of our bigs. Noah is untradeable, so that leaves KOQ and Kanter on the block. I wouldn’t be surprised if KOQ is gone before the season starts.

  25. DRed

    Enes Kanter isn’t a bad player. He’s a problematic mismatch, but he has value.

    I agree, but not as much on a team that already has Billy Hernangomez.

  26. stratomatic hates the Melo trade & is despondent again

    The only part of this trade that has any long term value is the Chicago 2nd round pick (If that’s what it really is. I haven’t seen hard details). That might be in the 30s. So there’s a chance we could pick up long term rotation player. As far as I am concerned we don’t need either of the other two. Both should be playing behind multiple players we already have. We should already be thinking about trying to move Kanter eventually (even though that will be really tough). McDermott is at least cheap and we don’t have to pick up his option unless he shows he can do more than shoot.

  27. stratomatic hates the Melo trade & is despondent again

    I agree, but not as much on a team that already has Billy Hernangomez.

    Exactly.

    If Hernangomez develops even a little, he’ll be a better version of Kanter. We are overloaded with bigs. KOQ should be playing ahead of him. KP will get minutes at both 4 and 5. Even a healthy Noah will get minutes.

  28. Cock Jowles, #1 Tanking Denialist

    I’ll have nothing but fond memories of this six-season stretch of .434 win percentage basketball.

  29. JK47

    We subtracted a guy who takes fuckloads of shots, plays no defense and whose only value is as a scorer, and who had a .488 eFG% and .535 TS%. We replaced him with a guy who takes fuckloads of shots, plays no defense but who can rebound, and who had a .549 eFG% and .599 TS%. The guy who replaced him makes $10M less per year and is eight years younger, and does not have a no-trade clause. We got what is likely to be a high second-round pick as a throw-in. Dougie McBuckets is kind of an afterthought but the guy can at least shoot: he had a .536 eFG% last year.

    From what I can tell the Knicks did not get appreciably worse on defense, they stayed about the same, but they improved on offense. They got younger. They gained payroll flexibility, since they broke Melo’s onerous contract with the NTC into two smaller contracts without NTCs attached to them. I’m fucking psyched, and I’m basically Mr. Negativity around here.

  30. Ntilakilla

    I think Kanter and/or KOQ could next us a draft pick with the right team.

    Also, I find it interesting that we traded a mismatch problem in Melo for a younger more tradeable mismatch problem in Kanter. Like Kanter’s mismatch issues with certain types of 5s and 4s, Melo is a tweener who matches up well against certain types of 4s and 3s and matches up poorly against others. At least we’re not grossly overpaying for one who won’t run the plays the coaches tell him to.

  31. Ntilakilla

    @40

    Don’t forget we have more trade flexibility now, too. This trade was a major step in the right direction.

  32. danvt

    If we’re top 5 pick bad I’ll be unhappy because it’ll mean there’s no one here. That’s why I’m torn on tanking. I think I’d rather be at 35 wins and feel good about some of our players. Tanking is like throwing four cards down in 5 card stud. Can you be a twenty win team and one player away?

  33. JK47

    The Knicks had the #18 offense and #26 defense last year, and they finished exactly at their Pythag projection, 31-51. My guess is that the offense improves a bit and the defense stays about the same. So something like the #12-15 offense, and the #25-28 defense. I’d expect the team to improve slightly after this trade and the development of some of the young players. It’s a 35-win team right now.

  34. mase

    Here’s my rotation, call me crazy

    C.. Kanter/Noah/kornet
    Pf..willy/koq
    Sf…kp/ lance / kuz/ McDermott
    Sg… Thjr/Lee/Dotson
    Pg…frank/baker/jack/sessions

    Why not play kp at 3 , he and Thjr probably our best 3pt shooters… probably tallest starting 5 in the league…if kp gets beat on the perimeter there’s two bigs down low to protect.

  35. Ntilakilla

    @45

    The bigger problem isn’t that KP will get beat off the dribble by smaller, quicker 3s on defense even though that will happen with your lineup. The real problem is that he’s bound to get himself into major foul trouble guarding NBA 3s overcompensating for his slower feet by using his hands more to keep them in check as they move right by him.

  36. danvt

    I always saw Melo as somewhat similar to Eli Manning. Not as good as Brady but a guy with some elite ability who in the right situation could help bring it home. Too bad it didn’t work out. He just never played to his cap number and the organization never put players around him to maximize his strengths and hide his weaknesses. Ultimately I’ll always like him and root for him. Maybe not against GSW who I actually really like but you know. He was one of us and I wish him the best.

  37. Boriqua3

    YEA-ESSSSSsssssssss!!!! It’s over! He’s gone!
    Now, at least, when the Knicks are dropping games, I can rationalize “Youth” and not “iso, jab-stepping, chucks”.

  38. chrisk06811

    So I guess now we try to break the log jam of mediocrity.
    Don’t trade: KP, Willie, Frank, THJr
    Nobody wants: Noah, maybe Thomas
    trade ANYONE else for whatever picks it may bring. even if it’s a boat load of 2nds.

  39. Scorpio Dragon

    I’m strictly in the this is a C trade, at best, camp. Which I guess could be considered the best of a bad situation grade.

    Any trades that happen after the Dec 15 trade restriction date will be more telling. No way I think the Knicks are done dealing with the way the roster is currently constructed.

  40. Bruno Almeida

    I really don’t care much for Kanter inability on the defensive end. The Knicks we’re 26th in the league in defense, we have subtracted Melo and Rose, two of the worst offenders, he cant possibly be this incredibly terrible on D to be a relevant net negative.

    And yes he’ll take minutes away from Hernangomez or KP, but do we even know if they’re ready to play 35 minutes per game? Kanter is obviously not here for the long term, he’s only staying is he improves (which is possible since he’s 25) and if he doesn’t, good riddance, he doesn’t have a damn NTC.

  41. johnnyhoops

    We obviously need a center in the 2018 draft so please stop talking about Doncic, who isn’t tall enough.

  42. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    I think with McBuckets strengths on offense, he fits better as a starter. It actually would be nice to see him start and improve on both ends enough to hold that job. Unfortunately, he’s gonna hafta go Hoodie McBuckets to hold off Beasley or Lance for that starting SF spot. Either way, we need a PG who penetrates well enough to take advantage of McBuckets’ presence- whether he starts or not. Still, I’m excited he’s on the roster. I loved him in college. I hope he takes the next step or 2 with our Knicks

  43. mase

    Everyone is moveable except Noah now but at least we have better trade chips…
    Thjr, kp, McDermott, frank, Lee, Beas, kuz… New bomb squad! Lol

  44. JK47

    Depth Chart
    C: Willy H/Kanter/Noah
    PF: Porzingis/KOQ
    SF: Hardaway/McDermott/Kuz/Lance/Beasley
    SG: Lee/Baker/Dotson
    PG: Sessions/Ntilikina/Jack

  45. Bruno Almeida

    The good thing is also that the team is in the hands of Porzingis now. He’s the featured star, #1 option unquestionably and it’s sink or swim. And for the first time in a long time for the Knicks it does look promising and the team is well suited if he develops into a true #1, or if it sinks and we have to look to the Draft for another player… finally some direction and focus on young players instead of mindlessly chasing useless wins.

  46. Jack Bauer

    @11 “The 31st pick is MUCH more valuable than the 30th pick. But you’re not very good with facts, as you’ve demonstrated in the past.”

    Oh Jowles someday I’ll be as smart as you and as adept at personal attacks. It depends who’s on the fucking draft board at 30 or 31. I guess under your “facts” the 31st pick is better than the 26th or 25th pick too because you can see into the future as to who will be available. You know that the OKC pick will be the 30 or 31 right? How about if our genius GM got a first round pick a few years out after Russ, George and Melo are gone, that would have been the plan – but I’m sure you’re so much better at he “facts” that your advanced stats research tells you otherwise. You are a seriously troubled person that you have to attack so many other posters on a site where we are all in theory rooting for the same team.

  47. Bruno Almeida

    I think forcing THJr to guard 3s won’t end well in the long run, as there are far more strong 3s in the NBA then scary 2s. I would let him loose on the offensive end and use Lee / Thomas to check the opponents best wing and we get to see what he can do. That means he would be fixed as the starting 2 and the 3 position becomes a revolving door between Lee, Thomas, Walking Bucket and McBuckets, whoever is playing better.

  48. Bruno Almeida

    @61

    Honestly you’re reading too much into it. The 31st pick is better than the 30th literally because the 31st pick does not demand a guaranteed contract due to being in the 2nd round, while the difference in quality is generally not big between players in that region. That’s it. Of course if the 30th pick is Jimmy Butler and the 31st is Bojan Bogdanovic it makes a difference, but that’s by far the exception and not the rule.

  49. d-mar

    From what I can tell the Knicks did not get appreciably worse on defense, they stayed about the same, but they improved on offense. They got younger. They gained payroll flexibility, since they broke Melo’s onerous contract with the NTC into two smaller contracts without NTCs attached to them. I’m fucking psyched, and I’m basically Mr. Negativity around here.

    JK, you made my day. Yes, you are Mr. Negativity, but you tell it like it is and don’t sugarcoat.

    I’m fucking psyched too, this off season we got rid of a GM who didn’t really want to be here and sucked at his job, a PG who doesn’t pass (Rose) and a “star” who can’t shoot (Melo)

    It’s the dawn of a new era.

  50. Jack Bauer

    @63 I thought the main idea behind the draft is trying to find the best player available. I could be wrong ( I’m supposedly “not very good with facts”) but the chances of drafting a better player likely go up the earlier you pick. I get the guaranteed contract issue, but if you get the better player that would seem more important than the cap issue of the guaranteed contract. Given the state of affairs with the Knicks (Noah, THJR, etc..), guaranteed contracts and the cap don’t seem to be high on the list of priorities.

  51. mase

    Thjr is starting at sg…
    Kanter is the real deal, willy now backup… Doesn’t make us better because kp should start at center but this move puts us closer to putting our team together…. No mo melo

  52. mase

    Addition by subtraction…. Presti that star fucker has $ in mind not winning if he thinks this makes them contend with gsw

  53. Bruno Almeida

    @67

    I’m obviously not saying you’re wrong, the goal of the Draft is to give yourself the best chance at getting rb best player (higher picks mean obviously better chances). But how many good players are in each draft? 15 max? 12? What are the odds that going from the 30th to the 31st will be a major difference in talent acquired?

    On the other hand, a young player on an unguaranteed contract is always 100% better for the team than having to pay guaranteed money to a dude who’s unlikely to even be a rotation player. It’s not much money, but it’s more significant than the skill gap between 30th and 31st.

  54. Bruno Almeida

    @70

    The fawning over Presti’s “incredible” trading abilities is starting to get tiresome already. Dude traded James freaking Harden for Kevin Martin + Jeremy Lamb and now he’s a damn trading genius for landing George (when Indiana made a gigantic mistake) and Melo, who’s washed up and might not even mesh well with their core. It’ll be very fun to watch this team not being capable to best the top dogs in the west.

  55. mase

    If melo knew jack shit he would’ve said sas or bust after Houston was a no go!
    Play next to Kwahi and let pop take you to the promise land

  56. Z-man

    There is no telling who will play and how many minutes. The only sure-fire big minutes player on the roster is KP. The rest is totally up in the air. There will be open competition for minutes at every position. That’s my guess. And that will be a beautiful thing!

  57. Z-man

    Obviously Lance and Lee are available for a bag of balls, I wonder if any team would be willing to take them off of our hands…

  58. rrude

    Wait, the Knicks only have one washed up ‘star’ (Noah) and a bunch of young guys…it’s safe to be a fan again?

  59. Z-man

    They are probably going to go with lots of different lineups early on and boil down to a 10 man rotation after a couple of weeks. Not sure the minimum salary guys (Beasley, Sessions, Jack) or the older guys (Noah, Lee). Are suited for that. O’Quinn is probably on his way out.

  60. Scorpio Dragon

    Without Duncan or Robinson to make up for defensive shortcomings, I’m not sure Melo’s willing to take the type of approach Pop is going to employ. Aldridge’s already looking at the door because of what Pop expects from him. So I don’t think Pop’s willing to trade his current headache for Melodrama (will he stay or won’t he? Will he be willing to play 2nd fiddle to Kahwi? etc).

  61. Bruno Almeida

    @80

    I think he would accept Kawhi is a bigger star today, but the Pop Melo combination would be impossible to work out to be honest. Pop would flip out the first time he watched a guy drive by him without contest and I don’t think Melo wants a field sergeant as his coach lol.

    I hope the Melo trade also means a vote of confidence in Hornacek. He was successful before making good work with flawed rosters in Phoenix and I hope he buys into the youth movement and really experiments with the lineups with not much pressure.

  62. er

    ” I doubt they even crack the top 4 in the west”

    ….yo don’t let your hate blind you. They were a 6th seed with no Melo OR George. They traded junk to get them. Lol. And the 4 and 5 seeds may have gotten worse. This site is gonna be fun to read this year

  63. er

    Super happy Melo is on a competent team for the first time in years. I’m excited to watch Okc.

    Westbrook
    Roberson
    George
    Melo
    Adams

    Is nothing to sneeze at. They will also get a chance to” run” the team in the second unit because the bench is so weak. So one of the three will always be on the court.

    As for the bockers. They need to at least get a high 2 for O’Quinn

    Noah is a good mentor for our bigs so he should stay.

  64. mase

    @84

    Yo!

    They now have traded guys who compliment Russ for one guy who needs his touches and pg who doesn’t… it’s a wash

  65. mase

    Presti won the trade with pg but he still gambled… with melo he doubled down in my opinion.

    He has a racehorse in Russ and complimentary pieces but it didn’t work… now what, miracle trade to get pg! Bang he should’ve stopped there. He’s a star fucker and perry knew that.

    I think we won the deal contrary to reports online but it remains to be seen what moves we compliment this deal with. Either way we changed course.

  66. danvt

    Wow. What a day. Long time coming, fellas. Serious high fives all around.

    I think addition by subtraction is maybe too much to ask. I think Frank is the X factor along with the possibility of KP and Wily taking big steps forward. Most likely this roster as presently constructed does not get us to the playoffs or beyond.

    However, it does seem that we’re becoming a normal functioning system. We have our picks going forward. As contracts sunset we can potentially upgrade those positions and maybe we can even win a trade or two.

    Maybe in the next few seasons we’ll become a fun team to watch and we’ll get treated to some good playoff battles like back in the old days.

    If so we’ll look back on this day as a big step toward that outcome.

    Beer’s on me guys. Happy to read what you write. Congrats. Thanks for sharing this obsession with me.

  67. danvt

    Danvt resident shrinkn in this nut house !

    Don’t quite know what that means but I’ll take it. I’m happy right now. I was so fucking tired of watching reruns of that same movie.

    Mase, did you used to post on the lohud blog knickknacks?

  68. KnickfaninNJ

    Two things I notice about this trade that haven’t been mentioned. One, we have a really tall team. Two, our second unit may not defend well, but it’s likely to be really good on offense.

  69. er

    @ 86
    Oladipo
    Mcbuckets
    Kanter
    Sabonis

    Vs

    Melo
    PG

    Are u fucking kidding me??? How is this even a convo?

    FOH. How sway

  70. Totes McGoats Makes 18mil For 14ppg

    If no one else goes after Randle, I think a rotaion could work if it looked like this(but Hornacek’s gonna hafta go 10-11 deep somehow):
    C- Willy, Kanter, Noah, KP.
    PF- KP, KOQ, Beasley, Thomas
    SF- McBuckets, Beasley, Kuz, Thomas.
    SG- TH2, Lee, Dotson, Baker
    PG- Jack, Baker, Ntilikina, Sessions (if Jack is healthy. If not, then that helps the backcourt rotation clear up alot)

    We have a deep roster..some guys are gonna really have to check their egos because there’s gonna be a few deserving of minutes but not getting any.

  71. wetbandit

    I see us as a better overall team that will still lose more games than last year. Big change in personnel, big change in coaching, new point guards, lots of very young players, and basically our wins hinge on guys like KP, Hardaway, and Frank. Don’t see it.

    And I like it. If we are losing a lot of games by early next year, shutting down a couple of key players will be disastrous :)

  72. stratomatic hates the Melo trade & is despondent again

    After the initial shock of getting Kanter back, I took a deep breath and gave this trade some more thought. I’ve concluded that it’s actually a good trade for NY.

    We’ve basically swapped a bad Melo contract (with 1 year and a player option) for a bad Kanter contract (with 1 year and a player option), but the Melo contract is for more money than Kanter and McDermott and the Knicks are in control of McDermott. They don’t have to offer the qualifying amount after his year unless we actually want him back.

    So depending on what else happens, it appears this deal could actually buy us a little extra cap space and net a decent 2nd round pick without hurting anything.

    I still think Kanter and McDermott are duplicative and won’t help move the chain at all for our team the way adding someone like Harkless might have, but I’m OK with this deal.

  73. heavencent35

    The battle for starting sf is interesting.
    Westbrook, Melo, pg vs durant, curry and dray.
    We also hoped melo, amare, Chandler could match lbj, wade, and bosh.
    So some are really optimistic

  74. stratomatic hates the Melo trade & is despondent again

    Are u fucking kidding me??? How is this even a convo?

    If the Thunder can figure it all out, they are probably the 2nd best team in the NBA. They have several elite defenders and now they have 3 scorers. The only weak link on defense is Melo. You can get away with 1 weak defender when he’s surrounded by some high level ones.

  75. geo

    my initial reaction was that was a pretty week trade – then I read post #40, jk47…

    I feel much better now…the focus was and should have been moving on – without it costing a bunch short or long term…

    so yeah, mcdermott or kanter didn’t thrill me – but, yeah the thought that this year we won’t have phil, rose or melo associated with the team is pretty freaking cool…

  76. Bruno Almeida

    @97

    That’s actually a pretty apt comparison.

    The Thunder will be that 4 seed that will take 2 games out of the Warriors in a series that leads ‘Writers’ to use terms like “Melo turned back time!” or “Westbrook, a real alpha dog” or “Is Paul George the Durant stopper?” and then they’re off to the Lakers or getting older together in what should be a clusterfuck of drama. It’s a mess I can’t wait to see.

  77. stratomatic's love hate relationship with The Knicks because of Melo is over

    I hope Vegas is as pessimistic about the Thunder as some people around here because I think they could be dynamite. They could easily be a top 5 defense in the NBA with the addition of George and Patterson to go along with Roberson, Adams and Westbrook and their scorers are Westbrook, George and Melo. Maybe they don’t have a long shelf life because Melo is declining and George could leave, but Melo is now only 3rd option and doesn’t have to play as many minutes & I have a funny feeling George could hang around after he sees how good this team is gong to be.

  78. KnickfaninNJ

    I’m ok with the trade. I think it works for both teams. Not that the Knicks are wonderfully better, but they traded an unhappy player somewhere he wanted to go, which should help team chemistry, and they got some future flexibility. They do have too many centers, but they werent going to be good this year anyway, and it’s good to have competition at that spot.

    On a different note, since Noah is suspended, does anyone know if he can attend training camp? I hope so. The Knicks need to see what he has left in the tank

  79. Nick C.

    @103 the issue will be, is Melo going to be cool with being a third option. Will he be Olympic Melo in the NBA or grow discontented with standing in the corner waiting for the ball like he did with D’Antoni. Anyway, he is gone and KP gets the chance to show that (if) he is worthy of having a team built around him.

  80. Bruno Almeida

    The Thunder could definitely succeed, I have no doubt about it… Paul George is definitely better than what they traded him for.

    However, this team got 4-1 by the Rockers last year. The possibility of them beating a team like the Rockets this time around relies on if Melo + Paul George are more impactful than Chris Paul, and have enough of an impact to sway the matchup a lot towards the Thunder. If you wanna bet on that, be my guest, I just definitely wouldn’t.

    I think its much more likely Vegas or other predictors will overrate their stars as usual and they’ll go under.

  81. The Glass Half Rebuilt

    Melo to OKC makes a ton of sense, but Billy Donovan isn’t much of a coach. The Knicks replaced a 33 year old scorer with two 25 year old scorers that are more efficient and one that is an offensive rebounding stud. I like the trade for both teams. McBuckets should start and hopefully he replaces Ron Baker as the lovable white American.

  82. ClashFan

    I’m still at a B for this trade, for now.

    The second round pick is a decent asset, esp. given that it is highly likely to be at or near the top of the round. Kanter might be, too, if he can be flipped for something. He can score and rebound, but not play D. He seems to have been very well liked in OKC, too. McD is just an expiring in there to make the contracts work.

    Even if the Knicks can’t deal Kanter, there’s the chance that he opts out after this year, and the Knicks gain about $18m more in cap space for next summer. Now, this past season they overpaid a couple of guys, but maybe the new GM will use cap space wisely. If he doesn’t opt out, there’s still the chance that, as an expiring, he could yield something.

    Here’s a Woj article from about 2 hours ago:
    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20793120/new-york-knicks-agree-trade-carmelo-anthony-oklahoma-city-thunder

    Looks like Cleveland may have offered basically Shump, Frye plus a couple cheap garbage contracts and their own 1st rounder (likely will be in the upper 20s). I’m guessing that the Knicks think that they can get something for decent for Kanter. We’ll see.

    Melo appears to have waived his trade kicker to make the OKC deal go down.

  83. Bruno Almeida

    @106

    That’s one thing I didn’t realize about the trade, now the Knicks have pretty much a monopoly on lovable, scrappy white american dudes! How can this team not succeed?

    We also might hold first place in most nationalities in a team, with 8 (counting Noah and Ntilikina both as French). USA, Canada, France, Turkey, Lithuania, Latvia, Spain and Serbia!

  84. ess-dog

    I mean, I’m not fond of the idea of Shumpert, but is the #26-28 pick better than the #34? I guess they valued Kanter more than that difference. Kanter is overpaid, but a serviceable player. I actually think we could have a super solid big rotation with Willy and KP starting, backed by O’Quinn and Kanter. We might as well stretch or buy out Noah.
    That being said, we should be in tank mode. There are no real solutions at pg and sf, and we already have an overpaid, mediocre sg. We are one draft and one free agent stud away from having any real shot at contention.

  85. stratomatic's love hate relationship with The Knicks because of Melo is over

    However, this team got 4-1 by the Rockers last year. The possibility of them beating a team like the Rockets this time around relies on if Melo + Paul George are more impactful than Chris Paul, and have enough of an impact to sway the matchup a lot towards the Thunder. If you wanna bet on that, be my guest, I just definitely wouldn’t.

    I think you are underrating how good their defense is going to be this year.

    They were a top 10 defense last year. They added George and Patterson (2 top defenders) to go along with an elite defender like Roberson and a very good defender like Adams. They also got rid of several weak/very weak defenders. They are likely to have a top 5 defense to go along with 3 legitimate scorers instead of 1 guy doing everything. They are a lot better on both sides of the ball. Even if they don’t quite pass Houston, the gap between them and everyone else at the top is minimal.

  86. Bruno Almeida

    @109

    It probably is, even if slightly so, but Kanter is much better and much younger than Frye… I dont think Shump is terrible but he’s also very redundant with Hardaway and Lee, so I don’t know. Kanter is good value at least and all the contracts will be gone either way in two seasons worst case scenario.

  87. JK47

    There’s nothing wrong with a trade that benefits both teams. OKC is obviously on a different trajectory than us as far as win curve, of course they should make win-now moves. Honestly I don’t think Melo is a huge needle-mover for them at this stage of his career simply because he’s not very good anymore, but they were a good team before the trade and they’ll make some noise in the West.

  88. Bruno Almeida

    @110

    My issue is that they 100% have to play Melo at the 4, right? They might get away with having him on bench units at the 3 with Patterson coming in, but in the starting lineup he’s playing the 4.

    George obviously replaces Oladipo’s defensive value, while they get noticeably worse at the 4 position with Melo instead of Gibson (seeing as George, Melo, Roberson and Patterson can’t possibly all be on the court at the same time), so I don’t buy into them being 100% better defensively than last year.

    They also have a gaping hole at backup center (Collison is the closest they have to an adequate backup) and their bench overall could be really terrible unless Abrines and or Ferguson steps up massively.

    The Spurs also beat the Rockets pretty well last year and they are the same team. Is OKC better than the Spurs now? Maybe, but Kawhi is still the best player in both teams. You could be right, but I’m not about to assume 33 year old Melo will be a huge addition to a team before I see it on the court. Ive watched too much Melo in the last couple of years to just assume he’ll score more efficiently just because he changed teams.

  89. Ntilakilla

    We’re so much better. Is there any question of this? Who cares about how this fits together? We’re just beginning our rebuild and have yet to see what’s what. We’ll decide the specifics as the season progresses and we have more data to gauge about this team.

  90. Ben R

    I think Carmelo helps OKC more than people think. He is not a great player anymore and is not even close to the star people think he is, but he is still capable of huge games, games where he will be the best player on the floor for OKC, he will also have games where he is a liability defensively and will force shots and be a drain on the team. OKC is good enough that they can weather his bad games, even if they vastly outnumber his good ones, and hope he pulls out a couple of gems in the playoffs and helps them win a series or two they couldn’t without him. Melo gives them a punchers chance against better teams and with PG and Russ they don’t even need him against poorer ones.

  91. Ntilakilla

    I don’t think people are really contemplating how poorly a plodding, high usage player like Melo fits within a team identity where 1.) his star teammate leads the league USG% per game, which 2.) relies a great deal on its full-court offense (third in the league in transition frequency) and 3.) was fifth in the league in FGA per game. Does anyone think he’s going to be able to a.) easily defer to Russell Westbrook as the team’s top usage rate player or b.) function well within their high pace, full-court offense pressing the action for a full NBA season? I don’t. Everyone talks about the “Olympic Melo” who plays in the summer. But when the NBA season comes around and he has to play serious minutes in an 82 game schedule + playoffs what you see is “Hold onto the ball, freeze the offense, jab step, and Iso-Melo.”

  92. stratomatic's love hate relationship with The Knicks because of Melo is over

    Haralabos Voulgaris?Verified account @haralabob 10h10 hours ago
    Sam Presti has killed this off season. Ridiculously good haul

  93. Silky Johnson, Fleet Admiral of the Tank Armada

    I’m just so, so glad the Melo era is over in New York. The trade could’ve been a straight up Kanter Melo swap (which wouldn’t have been possible but you get the idea) and I’d still be happy about it. He needed to go and now we can start relatively anew with all of our picks, KP, Willy, and hopefully Frank to build around.

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