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Monday, September 1, 2014

2012-13 Game Thread: Knicks v. Nets

Your game thoughts here

154 comments on “2012-13 Game Thread: Knicks v. Nets

  1. jon abbey

    HA! this was exactly what I was thinking, really hope this happens…

    Seth Rosenthal ?@seth_rosenthal

    Likely won’t be tonight, but when and if the Knicks hold an unassailable lead at MSG against the Nets, I want to hear a “BROOOOKLYN” chant.

    Seth Rosenthal ?@seth_rosenthal

    That cadence was meant to be mocking

  2. Hubert Davis

    Watching the ESPN broadcast. Nets sure spent a lot on advertising. Two commercials for BK tickets in one break!

  3. Juany8

    jon abbey:
    HA! this was exactly what I was thinking, really hope this happens…

    Seth Rosenthal ?@seth_rosenthal

    Likely won’t be tonight, but when and if the Knicks hold an unassailable lead at MSG against the Nets, I want to hear a “BROOOOKLYN” chant.

    Seth Rosenthal ?@seth_rosenthal

    That cadence was meant to be mocking

    Absolutely, I can’t believe they actually pipe it in. I hope the Knicks make it happen, my favorite fan moment even was when the Celtics started cheering “New York Knicks!” the last year Lebron was in Cleveland

  4. Juany8

    BigBlueAL:
    Chandler protecting the rim on defense then trying to grab a rebound over 3 Nets players.

    He’s playing monstrous defense right now, I can see why he can’t do this every single game. I think Cope showing signs is a really good sign for the rotation, Camby still hasn’t played a minute…

  5. jon abbey

    BigBlueAL:
    Chandler protecting the rim on defense then trying to grab a rebound over 3 Nets players.

    this is what worries me this week: three very big teams in Brooklyn/Minnesota/Chicago, he needs help on the boards, especially with Sheed/Camby out.

  6. Juany8

    jon abbey: he has played a bit, just not well and not for a few weeks now.

    True I forgot about that lol, he hasn’t really contributed anything I should say

  7. BigBlueAL

    I believe I read somewhere that Camby was getting a cortisone shot early this week and plans to be available for Friday’s game.

  8. BigBlueAL

    Its pretty ridiculous how easy it is for opposing teams to get wide open shots vs the Knicks right now. Any semblance of dribble penetration by a Nets player is leading to wide ass open 3pters.

  9. Nick C.

    BigBlueAL:
    Somebody might want to guard Bogans or any Nets player for that matter at the 3pt line.

    That might be the first time that’s ever been said. But I thought the same thing lol

  10. yellowboy90

    BigBlueAL:
    Its pretty ridiculous how easy it is for opposing teams to get wide open shots vs the Knicks right now.Any semblance of dribble penetration by a Nets player is leading to wide ass open 3pters.

    The knicks D does not respond well to getting their guards posted up. It forces a double which creates rotation but the big is slow to rotate off of his man to guard the 2

  11. BigBlueAL

    Sorry about harping on the defense, nothing annoys me more than horrible looking defense. Blame it on me growing up with the 90′s Knicks lol.

  12. Nick C.

    yellowboy90:
    Priggy does not trust his shot

    He single handedly killed that possession. Paused on the open shot dribbled around to refind save then rushed a pass that Copeland couldn’t handle(in part because he dithered away the clock)

  13. BigBlueAL

    Knicks doing a much better job running the Nets players off the 3pt line now, forced a 24 sec violation cause of it.

  14. Juany8

    Nick C.:
    Nice pass by Melo. Alas a score but no assist.

    Only 1 assist for the night, continuing a trend of Melo getting far less credit than he deserves for playmaking.

  15. d-mar

    It’s pretty obvious Knicks opponents are going to continue to defend the roller on the pick and roll and dare Felton to shoot. We used to see multiple Tyson smashes per game, so far this game, only one.

  16. maxwell_3g

    just caught up on dvr at halftime. 2 thoughts.
    1) the Knicks continue to double team perimeter plays far too often. Joe Johnson was the iso player for the Hawks to poor results. Let him run iso. D Will is shooting 40%. let him run iso. But no more open 3′s for Bogans and company. that is what they want us to do
    2) Brewer is killing us on offense with the first unit. he started out hot but now the Nets and other teams (especially the Nets) have determined not to worry aout him. He was okay spotting in the corner in the beginning ofthe year, as he was hitting that shot at a high rate. not anymore. we need to have him doing what has been most effective for him throughout his career, baseline cuts ad offensive rebounds

  17. maxwell_3g

    DRed: At least he’s got more assists than our point guard.

    if brewer could space the floor, felton would have plenty of assists. brewers inability to score when unguarded is killing the pick and roll. its not that dfficult to see

  18. d-mar

    Would it be an understatement to say that Brewer is offensively challenged? He’s our new Jeffries minus the drawn charges.

  19. Nick C.

    Don’t get mad BBA but the Knicks have been leaving guys uncontested only now it’s Johnson and D-Will

  20. maxwell_3g

    DRed: At least he’s got more assists than our point guard.

    i marvel at this constantly. quick and strong. i guess hand speed is one of the last things to go (at least for kidd)

  21. hegotgame

    FIRST POST EVER. YAY.

    After watching for the last 3 years its about time I came out of my shell. This game is too damn close and Brooklyn scoring at will this half.. WTF. Not feeling raymond’s play tonight either, I’m a fan of his aggressive play but hes just taking retarded shot. its like the more people complain about his shot the more bad shots he takes. I dont mind long twos if hes open, gotta keep the defense honest and he makes those at a decent clip, but hes made some very bad reads tonight as far as the managing the offense is concerned and chucked up some some screamers. I think its 3 airballs already…

  22. BigBlueAL

    Nick C.:
    Don’t get mad BBA but the Knicks have been leaving guys uncontested only now it’s Johnson and D-Will

    Well Deron did straight up dominate Felton on a post-up so that wasnt an uncontested shot at least lol.

  23. hegotgame

    That last ‘oop. That was more like it. Damn. Tyson nearly tore the roof off. AND it looks like felton passed his airball-itis on to d.will.

  24. Juany8

    hegotgame:
    FIRST POST EVER. YAY.

    After watching for the last 3 years its about time I came out of my shell. This game is too damn close and Brooklyn scoring at will this half.. WTF. Not feeling raymond’s play tonight either, I’m a fan of his aggressive play but hes just taking retarded shot. its like the more people complain about his shot the more bad shots he takes. I dont mind long twos if hes open, gotta keep the defense honest and he makes those at a decent clip, but hes made some very bad reads tonight as far as the managing the offense is concerned and chucked up some some screamers. I think its 3 airballs already…

    Welcome to the board! :)

    I agree about Felton, looking too much for his own shot rather than trying to work it inside to Chandler, especially early in the clock when you can always give it to Melo later on

  25. Z-man

    Kidd looking tired out there. We really need a guard. What if Nate becomes available, I heard the Bulls might waive him?

  26. BigBlueAL

    DRed:
    Kidd looked like me shooting a 3 on that last one.He might need a breather.

    Looks like Kidd has completely lost his 3pt stroke.

  27. Will the Thrill

    And it definitely does not look like he is just throwing them up because he sees Chandler in position for a rebound this game.

    BigBlueAL:
    Felton has the ugliest floater Ive ever seen.

  28. maxwell_3g

    BigBlueAL:
    Felton has the ugliest floater Ive ever seen.

    i used to chalk it up to indecision, unsure if he should oop to tyson or not. now, i think hes just not good at it. but maybe lopez has an uglier floater after that one

  29. DRed

    d-mar:
    It’s pretty obvious Knicks opponents are going to continue to defend the roller on the pick and roll and dare Felton to shoot. We used to see multiple Tyson smashes per game, so far this game, only one.

    Are you not entertained?!

  30. Juany8

    maxwell_3g:
    COPE!!!!!!if he could only play d

    Can Novak? That’s who he’s playing for. If he keeps it up Novak might be out of the rotation by Christmas, and the Knicks would be sitting on a gold mine of cheap assets…

  31. hegotgame

    Jeez, its like rayray heard me talkin that sh*t lol. loooooooving chris copeland though, its like having EXtra E back again but he can score in places other than the corner. Pabs gtting the allery-oop dwn too. Suh-weet. What a turn around. I mean nets were shooting something like 6-7 to start the half. wunderbar.

  32. maxwell_3g

    Juany8: Can Novak? That’s who he’s playing for. If he keeps it up Novak might be out of the rotation by Christmas, and the Knicks would be sitting on a gold mine of cheap assets…

    agreed. ut im not exactly putting cope’s shooting in novak’s neighborhood yet. the defenses key on novak and he often shoots with people flying all around him. cope is doing a great job, but he is not exactly on other team’s radars yet. the key is that we have depth that people can step up when othes get injured, and we are only getting deeper

  33. hegotgame

    I mean, Prigs, what is this? Dude plays like a mob boss bet 50 grand on him not attempting a shot for the entire season…. AS I TYPE THIS HE HITS A 3??

  34. ruruland

    Juany8:
    Chandler deserves the A he’s going to get for this game, he’s played beast defense.

    Yep. He’s back. A couple breakdowns notwitstandig

  35. ruruland

    BigBlueAL:
    Holy crap what a pass by JR to Chandler.

    Lucky. Chandler passed the ball with a 1-1 at the free throw line and no one else in the paint with 4 seconds on the clock.

  36. ruruland

    d-mar:
    Would it be an understatement to say that Brewer is offensively challenged? He’s our new Jeffries minus the drawn charges.

    You imagine Stat getting those kinds of looks in a few days???

    How do you defend that?

    I don’t think we’ve seen what this team can really be on either end.

  37. ruruland

    d-mar:
    Once again Woody pushing all the right buttons with substitutions

    If Cope is a 37-40% 3pt shooter, he’s going to take a ton of Novak’s minutes.

    Better in every single dimension. Still want Novak out there at times.

  38. hegotgame

    ruruland: Lucky. Chandler passed the ball with a 1-1 at the free throw line and no one else in the paint with 4 seconds on the clock.

    True re: chandlers rim shyness. THe pass was just good tho and I think shows some of the maturity we would like to expect out of JR. I mean I thought he was gonna chuck cos the clock was at 4 when he got it.

  39. ruruland

    BigBlueAL:
    Its pretty ridiculous how easy it is for opposing teams to get wide open shots vs the Knicks right now.Any semblance of dribble penetration by a Nets player is leading to wide ass open 3pters.

    Defense is starting to come back. They need a practice or two. Always start halves slow. that’s not practicing.

  40. maxwell_3g

    ruruland: You imagine Stat getting those kinds of looks in a few days???

    How do you defend that?

    I don’t think we’ve seen what this team can really be on either end.

    stat would not space the floor either. his midrange last year was no etter than prewer. the long term answer with the first team is shump. stat has a roll, but his presence clogs the lane for the tyson smash

  41. hegotgame

    WOW.from the pass to cope. who had the lovely fake for a good shot to Chandlers Tip-out to his eventual assist to copeland, that was beautfiful bball.

  42. maxwell_3g

    ruruland: Defense is starting to come back. They need a practice or two. Always start halves slow. that’s not practicing.

    jvg just hit the nail on the head. we are letting them do their iso thing without the doubles. the doule teams were just bailing them out of their sorry offensive strategy

  43. Thomas B. Post author

    Do those tip outs count as rebounds, or does it go to the player who gets the possession? Chandler really should get some credit in the stat sheet for those.

  44. BigBlueAL

    Does Barkley still think the Nets are the best team in NY?? I mean his boy Brook Lopez played tonight and it aint helping them much.

  45. ruruland

    maxwell_3g: stat would not space the floor either.his midrange last year was no etter than prewer.the long term answer with the first team is shump.stat has a roll, but his presence clogs the lane for the tyson smash

    You’ll see.

  46. ruruland

    maxwell_3g: jvg just hit the nail on the head.we are letting them do their iso thing without the doubles.the doule teams were just bailing them out of their sorry offensive strategy

    agreed

  47. Douglas

    Thomas B.:
    Do those tip outs count as rebounds, or does it go to the player who gets the possession?Chandler really should get some credit in the stat sheet for those.

    They don’t count in the box score, but the Knicks probably track them

  48. Nick C.

    We may have just discovered the key to the Knicks plays after timeouts. They showed Kidd diagramming.

  49. d-mar

    BigBlueAL:
    Does Barkley still think the Nets are the best team in NY??I mean his boy Brook Lopez played tonight and it aint helping them much.

    Yeah, as I said in a prior thread, Brooklyn is way overrated, they’ve lost some really bad home games this year and just don’t impress me all that much. 13-12? Meh.

  50. Juany8

    Nice win for the Knicks, the defense is starting to come back to it’s early season levels, and I’m starting to get excited about what Shump, camby, and Amar’e could add to this team. Going to be a very interesting season, Felton needs to calm the fuck down though, Amar’e should help with that if nothing else

  51. d-mar

    Also, re: Brooklyn, their tendency to wilt in 4th quarters to both good and mediocre teams is a serious problem.

  52. ephus

    I know it was on the verge of garbage time, but I love the play that Kidd diagrammed for ‘Melo to get the wide-open foul-line jumper. Kidd catches on the right block, with Chandler setting the pindown screen for ‘Melo coming off of the left block. Either the defense concedes the wideopen jumper from 15′ to ‘melo — or switches on to him, which would allow Kidd to throw the lob for the Tyson Smash. I hope to see that set a lot in the future.

  53. maxwell_3g

    Thomas B.:
    Do those tip outs count as rebounds, or does it go to the player who gets the possession?Chandler really should get some credit in the stat sheet for those.

    i demand this on the advanced stats page on KBlogger- 2 new stats
    1) felton assists- where he draws attention and shoots an ugly floater that tyson scores on
    2) tyson swatboards- where he swats the ball back to the top on offense

  54. BigBlueAL

    Im just glad the Knicks whooped the Nets tonight and their records are what they are because of all the bullshit we had to read/listen to before the season and even after the first game when they were both 9-4 about how the Nets are the best team in NY.

  55. DRed

    Prigs was a nice steadying factor during our run there. It’s frustrating sometimes when he looks to pass too much, but it’s easier to watch than Ray bricking shot after shot.

  56. Hubert Davis

    22-2 at MSG w m.o.v. of 13.17 pts under Woodson. Amazing. Two losses were obviously Monday and an 8 pt loss to Heat last year.

    For those of us who remember the days when we used to dominate at home, man it sure is nice.

  57. hegotgame

    DRed:
    Prigs was a nice steadying factor during our run there.It’s frustrating sometimes when he looks to pass too much, but it’s easier to watch than Ray bricking shot after shot.

    This made me imagine how awesome a Prigs/Felton love-child would be. Just right ;)

  58. Owen

    Tip outs are generally credited as rebounds by scorers if there is any directionally to them…..

    Just saw the highlights, wish I had seen it….

  59. Hubert Davis

    ruruland: You’ll see.

    I agree. Amar’e doesn’t have to hit the mid range jumper to space the floor. He can explode to the basket from the middle of the floor and further open up space. Ronnie Brewer can’t do that.

  60. d-mar

    A few weeks ago I was projecting that we could finish the year at 23-7, which would be truly awesome. Right now, that means winning 4 out of the next 5, which should be doable – win the next 2 at home vs. Chicago and Minny, 2 out of 3 on the road vs. LA, Phoenix and Sacramento.

    This win showed me a lot about this team and equally as important, its coach.

  61. Owen

    Durant is amazing. I never thought he would be this good. And he definitely is. That clip of his block was surreal.

  62. nicos

    maxwell_3g: stat would not space the floor either.his midrange last year was no etter than prewer.the long term answer with the first team is shump.stat has a roll, but his presence clogs the lane for the tyson smash

    The big difference with Stat as opposed to Brewer is you still have to account for him off of the ball- the Nets paid absolutely no attention to Brewer. Double off of Stat or turn your head and he’s cutting to the rim. The Knicks are creating space not just with the three but with movement- having another guy who can drag a defender off of the ball can only help. Teams will slump off of him when he’s got the ball until he reestablishes his jumper but you have to account for him off of the ball- he’s just too quick, too adept at finding seams, and way too good of a finisher at the rim not to.

  63. yellowboy90

    nicos: The big difference with Stat as opposed to Brewer is you still have to account for him off of the ball- the Nets paid absolutely no attention to Brewer.Double off of Stat or turn your head and he’s cutting to the rim.The Knicks are creating space not just with the three but with movement- having another guy who can drag a defender off of the ball can only help.Teams will slump off of him when he’s got the ball until he reestablishes his jumper but you have to account for him off of the ball- he’s just too quick, too adept at finding seams, and way too good of a finisher at the rim not to.

    Also, those potential shots at the rim that Brewer had in Amar’e hands is more than likely points.

  64. cgreene

    It’s funny. I just got back from the game and read the thread and there are like 0 comments about how ridiculous Melo played. Guess this debate is finally over.

  65. ruruland

    There’s a pretty glaring misconception that Amar’e has most often functioned in high pnr and struggles elsewhere. Off base.

    He doesn’t set good screens, he slips them, and uses power dribbles, shoulder width/strength and his quickness/explosion when he catches the ball in high pnr around the free throw line.

    He is a much better side screen and roll player where the baseline help takes longer…..

    From Robin Lopez, to Steven Hunter, Shaq, Mosgov, Turiaf et al, Amar’e is frequently the secondary screener in the 4-out, and often functions on the weakside of the high pnr where he can catch the ball at the elbow, drive or shoot that elbow jumper…..He is far more accustomed to operating in traffic than I think people are aware.

    Do you realize he posted a .668 TS the first year of the Shaq trade, after the trade!!

    All of those looks Brewer is getting are ridiculously easy opportunities for STAT. He’s never played with a screener as good as Chandler.

    The entire offense was broken down prior to Lin/Davis because Douglas, Bibby and Shumpert were ludicrously incompetent pnr players.

  66. cgreene

    ruruland:
    There’s a pretty glaring misconception that Amar’e has most often functioned in high pnr and struggles elsewhere. Off base.

    He doesn’t set good screens, he slips them, and uses power dribbles, shoulder width/strength and his quickness/explosion when he catches the ball in high pnr around the free throw line.

    He is a much better side screen and roll player where the baseline help takes longer…..

    From Robin Lopez, to Steven Hunter, Shaq,Mosgov, Turiaf et al, Amar’e is frequently the secondary screener in the 4-out, and often functions on the weakside of the high pnr where he can catch the ball at the elbow, drive or shoot that elbow jumper…..He is far more accustomed to operating in traffic than I think people are aware.

    Do you realize he posted a .668 TSthe first year of the Shaq trade, after the trade!!

    All of those looks Brewer is getting are ridiculously easy opportunities for STAT. He’s never played with a screener as good as Chandler.

    The entire offense was broken down prior to Lin/Davis because Douglas, Bibby and Shumpert were ludicrously incompetent pnr players.

    Use your connections to tell Woodson to look at the plays of those tapes of the Suns w STAT playing next to Shaq(: If he is not hesitant bc of injuries he could beast w this team.

  67. jon abbey

    Shumpert is going to be so huge for the D against most teams too, Woodson is going to have a lot of options if everyone is ever healthy at the same time.

  68. maxwell_3g

    ruruland:
    There’s a pretty glaring misconception that Amar’e has most often functioned in high pnr and struggles elsewhere. Off base.

    He doesn’t set good screens, he slips them, and uses power dribbles, shoulder width/strength and his quickness/explosion when he catches the ball in high pnr around the free throw line.

    He is a much better side screen and roll player where the baseline help takes longer…..

    From Robin Lopez, to Steven Hunter, Shaq,Mosgov, Turiaf et al, Amar’e is frequently the secondary screener in the 4-out, and often functions on the weakside of the high pnr where he can catch the ball at the elbow, drive or shoot that elbow jumper…..He is far more accustomed to operating in traffic than I think people are aware.

    Do you realize he posted a .668 TSthe first year of the Shaq trade, after the trade!!

    All of those looks Brewer is getting are ridiculously easy opportunities for STAT. He’s never played with a screener as good as Chandler.

    The entire offense was broken down prior to Lin/Davis because Douglas, Bibby and Shumpert were ludicrously incompetent pnr players.

    i obviously agree that he is an upgrade over brewer, but i still dont think that he is ideal for the starting unit. i think shump (assuming hes working on his 3 with Hopla) is. i like stat running the p and r with prigs and the second unit, along with playing some minutes with the starters. the one thing that I do disagree with is stat’s aility to catch the ball away from the hoop and create with the dribble. for the past 2 years, his ability to create of the dribble has been nil and has lead to an unbelievable number of turnovers. i realize some of this can be chalked up to bad health (hopefully his explosion will e better now) and some can be chalked up to bad teammaes that have failed to open up driving lanes for him, but I am weary.

  69. maxwell_3g

    we have relied on stt is the past, and he has never really delivered, despite talking a big game. In his first year, he was injured for the playoffs. In his second year, despite talking about improved defense all the time, he utterly failed on the defensive end. Most recently, he missed his second straight playoffs becaue he decided to punch glass. im just skeptical. as a Knicks fan, I DO hope like hell I am wrong though. If so, I will be more that happy to say you guys are right

  70. jon abbey

    cgreene:
    It’s funny.I just got back from the game and read the thread and there are like 0 comments about how ridiculous Melo played.Guess this debate is finally over.

    great to see Chandler in beast mode in that third quarter, but Melo kept them in it in the first half.

    JR Smith with a ton of energy too, it’s incredible how such poor shot selection could somehow end up as a 7-11, only JR.

  71. Kurt

    ephus 122: I couldn’t agree more. i think off ball screens involving Melo and a big could be deadly and lead to pick your poison situations.

    In fact, I’ve been thinking that off ball screens would be the perfect way to integrate STAT into the lineup with Melo and Chandler (even if STAT does come off the bench, they’re still going to play at least 10 plus minutes with each other every game). Just imagine the play ephus describes–Chandler setting screen for Melo leading to wide open jumper–and then picture STAT rolling to the basket on the weak side. Alternatively, Amar’e screening for Melo with Chandler as a risk on weak side for an alley oop.

    This is from Zach Lowe’s Grantland piece on two bigs playing with each other:
    The Splitter-Duncan Spurs don’t shoot nearly as many 3s as San Antonio normally does, and that can cramp the team’s spacing a bit. But the team as a whole is adjusting with more varied play calling, whip-smart passing from both bigs, and the developing chemistry between them. They move on opposite north-south planes, so that if Duncan sets a high screen on the left side and rolls to the hoop, Splitter will move up from the right block toward the foul line — flashing for a possible catch and high-low chance with Duncan. The two will sometimes screen for each other, including some Splitter pin-down picks designed to free Duncan for a mid-range jumper, and the coaching staff is smart about having one of them doing something to occupy the defense on the weak side when the other sets a pick for Tony Parker on the ball.

    STAT and Chandler can’t pass like Duncan/Splitter, but I really think Amar’e setting down screens for Chandler can be deadly.

    Maxwell: Between Amar’e's back, brother, lack of point guard play and many other things, I really think last year was an exception regarding Amar’e's jumper. Considering that he’s been a very good open shooter in previous seasons, I think it’s fair to believe last year was a fluke.

  72. DRed

    cgreene:
    It’s funny.I just got back from the game and read the thread and there are like 0 comments about how ridiculous Melo played.Guess this debate is finally over.

    Melo was really good. He was great on offense and didn’t turn it over. He kept us in the game until Tyson went berserk. But he also had only 3 rebounds and one assist. I’ll take that game from Melo, any day, but it’s not ridiculous.

  73. bockadoo

    Ok, enough with Felton shooting this much. He’s now almost under 40% for the year. I like him because he’s tough, gets steals, plays pretty good d, but he’s having an overrated season. Hopefully when Stat and Shump get back he’ll shoot less. When’s the last time he made more than half his shots? Maybe his hands are bothering him, but why keep shooting? Watching Jennings against Memphis do the same thing over and over.

  74. Kurt

    cgreene: Use your connections to tell Woodson to look at the plays of those tapes of the Suns w STAT playing next to Shaq(:If he is not hesitant bc of injuries he could beast w this team.

    Yes, I’ve been thinking about that period too. I’d really like to see those clips myself. I still can’t understand why D’Antoni himself didn’t try to use the same techniques last year and this year with the Lakers. Am I crazy for thinking that he should be able to similarly integrate two big men in a similar pattern?

    On a similar note, Memphis has a number of plays in which Marc Gasol serves as screener and then passes it either to a three point shooter or down low to Randolph. Other than Marc being a step slower than his brother, I don’t see why this couldn’t be used on the Lakers.

    I’d also love to see clips from the end of Suns 09-10 when Robin Lopez played center and the Suns offense was as good as ever.

  75. ruruland

    bockadoo:
    Ok, enough with Felton shooting this much.He’s now almost under 40% for the year.I like him because he’s tough, gets steals, plays pretty good d, but he’s having an overrated season.Hopefully when Stat and Shump get back he’ll shoot less.When’s the last time he made more than half his shots?Maybe his hands are bothering him, but why keep shooting?Watching Jennings against Memphis do the same thing over and over.

    Most of his shots are open shots he’s getting on the switch.

    This is another situation where Chandler’s absolute dearth of post-moves hurts his teammates.

    Teams switch because they want Felton to shoot knowing that Chandler can’t hurt them on post-ups, even against guards.

  76. ruruland

    DRed: Melo was really good.He was great on offense and didn’t turn it over.He kept us in the game until Tyson went berserk.But he also had only 3 rebounds and one assist.I’ll take that game from Melo, any day, but it’s not ridiculous.

    Ankle hurt his general activity tonight. Assist numbers deceiving given the situations he was in tonight.

    If he’s not asked to force things his efficiency will continue to be off the charts The assists are going to come.

    rebounds are a concern. Part of it is blocking out bigger power forwards so guards can come down,…. I expect his rebound rate to rise with a pf on the floor, paradoxically until you watch what his role is…. But there were a couple of loose ball he would normally get.

  77. ruruland

    maxwell_3g:
    we have relied on stt is the past, and he has never really delivered, despite talking a big game.In his first year, he was injured for the playoffs.In his second year, despite talking about improved defense all the time, he utterly failed on the defensive end.Most recently, he missed his second straight playoffs becaue he decided to punch glass.im just skeptical.as a Knicks fan, I DO hope like hell I am wrong though.If so, I will be more that happy to say you guys are right

    Amar’e posted a 630 TS last playoff despite guards being unable to get below the 3pt line or make a serious pass in the pnr.

    the one game he was healthy against Boston he destroyed them.

    Amar’e is a big game guy, and he is the difference in beating the elite teams in a 7 game series. he will have to be great, and I think we’ll soon find out that he’s still capable of being great as he was just two years ago…

  78. ruruland

    cgreene:
    It’s funny.I just got back from the game and read the thread and there are like 0 comments about how ridiculous Melo played.Guess this debate is finally over.

    Pretty much the norm now. Wallace still a very good defender.

    There is a pretty substantial shift in the way Melo’s playing — he’s finally in an offense where the offense comes to him.

    In the past, against a defender like Wallace, he would have had to expend so much more energy grappling with him on the block and then trying to beat him 1-1 with the help. That leads to a higher percentage of difficult shots and kills your legs when you have to work so hard to just get the shot off.

    Now, he’s picking his spots to attack, and doing a lot more catch-and-shoot.

    And there will be nights that when his shots are off he will go back into the full-out attack mode that he’s more accustomed to historically.

    Having nights like tonight is what will allow Melo to last efficiently throughout the year.

    He’s had stretches of roughly the same efficiency, but it took a lot more work, and often led to injury.

  79. massive

    If Felton could be as good a shooter as Jameer Nelson was when the Magic were a contender, then we would really be going somewhere. Raymond Felton either shoots too early in the shot clock, misses wide open looks when they collapse on Chandler, or takes that stupid floater he has a lot of difficulty making at a reliable rate. I like that he had 4 assists and 15 FGA with zero turnovers, but going 4-15 is completely unacceptable.

  80. Juany8

    massive:
    If Felton could be as good a shooter as Jameer Nelson was when the Magic were a contender, then we would really be going somewhere. Raymond Felton either shoots too early in the shot clock, misses wide open looks when they collapse on Chandler, or takes that stupid floater he has a lot of difficulty making at a reliable rate. I like that he had 4 assists and 15 FGA with zero turnovers, but going 4-15 is completely unacceptable.

    Only problem with this logic was that it was Rafer Alston that got them to the Finals, not Jameer Nelson. Few players had a worse shot selection than Rafer Alston trust me…

    As far as Felton, it’s become pretty clear Brewer needs to go from the starting unit. The spacing is starting to get cramped now that Brewer is being left open and everyone is collapsing to the paint, at that point it’s either felton takes that jumper or resets the offense so that Melo can hopefully get something out of nothing. Then we’d be bitching at Melo for taking tough shots instead of being disappointed that Brewer completely lost his shooting stroke and is an offensive liability out there. Coupled with Chandler’s utter lack of ability to do anything but roll hard to the rim in a straight line, this cramps the spacing on the starting unit. Amar’e helps because you can’t just leave him open, he’s too good with the ball, but I think Shump will be the ideal guy eventually, especially if he can be even an average shooter.

  81. Nick C.

    That doesn’t excuse Felton for his inability to hit open 15 foot shots. If he could hit them maybe teams wouldn’t be so eager to let him fire away. I don’t see why that gets glossed over, wasn’t that an issue with Duhon ultimately on the PnR or was it the inability to finish (yet another issue).

  82. Juany8

    Nick C.:
    That doesn’t excuse Felton for his inability to hit open 15 foot shots. If he could hit them maybe teams wouldn’t be so eager to let him fire away. I don’t see why that gets glossed over, wasn’t that an issue with Duhon ultimately on the PnR or was it the inability to finish (yet another issue).

    Again, I’m not saying Felton is a great guard, just that nobody was available that could defend and pass as well as him while also being able to shoot (Lin does not come close to counting). Those kinds of point guards get payed a lot more than Felton. I think he’s been an average player overall, and I definitely agree that he is shooting too much right now, earlier in the year I really did feel like a lot of his shots had Tyson at least very close to the rim, now he’s just jacking shots up too quickly. At least let Melo do that, people will bitch about his lowered efficiency but the team will probably do better. Felton is still shooting a solid percentage from 3 so he can space the floor, Felton is being given a little too much freedom

  83. DRed

    Juany8: Again, I’m not saying Felton is a great guard, just that nobody was available that could defend and pass as well as him while also being able to shoot (Lin does not come close to counting). Those kinds of point guards get payed a lot more than Felton. I think he’s been an average player overall, and I definitely agree that he is shooting too much right now, earlier in the year I really did feel like a lot of his shots had Tyson at least very close to the rim, now he’s just jacking shots up too quickly. At least let Melo do that, people will bitch about his lowered efficiency but the team will probably do better. Felton is still shooting a solid percentage from 3 so he can space the floor, Felton is being given a little too much freedom

    Felton has been utterly terrible lately. I’m hoping it’s his hand, because he was at least decent before his injury. If Brewer can’t hit his shots I have no problem with us reducing his minutes, but Felton simply has to stop shooting so much.

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