Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Wednesday, September 17, 2014

2011 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Nets

For your game thoughts.

200 comments on “2011 Game Thread: Knicks vs. Nets

  1. BigBlueAL

    Of course, Deron Williams returns tonight.

    Looks like Shelden starts tonight. Shawne was supposed to miss but looks like he will be suiting up tonight, Turiaf believe is out again.

    Interesting reading D’Antoni’s quotes from today talking about how Melo should approach a triple double every night.

  2. Brian Cronin

    Of course, Deron Williams returns tonight.

    And of course he missed the game against the Rockets.

  3. citizen

    Question: has there ever been a deal in which both teams have the option to swap picks? That would be quite interesting indeed – we would be able to see which GM’s hubris killed his team in the end, haha.

  4. citizen

    citizen: Question: has there ever been a deal in which both teams have the option to swap picks? That would be quite interesting indeed – we would be able to see which GM’s hubris killed his team in the end, haha.  

    The actual contract of the agreement would simply say that the picks are automatically switched every year, by the way.

  5. citizen

    Caleb: @4 you mean like in different years? That would be interesting..  

    What I mean is that, for example, you and I agree now to unequivocally swap picks in 2012. It doesn’t matter who’s record is higher (since the lower team will exercise its swap option).

    One reason to do this type of deal is to insulate yourself from the incentive to tank, since it wouldn’t make any difference if you did or not. The more obvious reason is simply a belief that you will be better than the other team in that year.

  6. TheRant

    John Kenney: Hollinger just kills it in this article. Finally. http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=PERDiem-110330 John Kenney

    Great piece. Except that Hollinger was too positive about the trade. In addition to all the other reasons to hate it, he forgot to mention how much it must have demoralized Donnie. So in addition to freezing our roster for five years, we won’t even have someone to get creative. But I think we’ve all said all of these things ten times already. I’ve never been sadder to be so right.

  7. latke

    d’antoni should be laying into them right now for not playing defense. NJ isn’t playing any either, but that shouldn’t be an excuse.

  8. David Crockett

    What is going on with Amare’s lift? He’s hitting the jumper but looks terrible.

  9. Robert Silverman

    It’s certainly a “Vacillating pace,” as Clyde would say (Got the sound off on the computer at work)

    And no, that makes no sense

  10. David Crockett

    latke: d’antoni should be laying into them right now for not playing defense. NJ isn’t playing any either, but that shouldn’t be an excuse.  

    Can’t do it now. They haven’t been guarding all year.

  11. Robert Silverman

    Oh Great. So this is the night we make Brook Lopez look like A vintage Lew Alcindor

  12. massive

    Is there a worse rebounder in the NBA at 6’11″ than Jared Jeffries? He has absolutely no instinct there.

  13. latke

    David Crockett:
    Can’t do it now. They haven’t been guarding all year.  

    Our defense went from bad pre-trade to now horrendous. You gotta have some kind of standards, right? If MDA doesn’t, then he really does need to go.

  14. art vandelay

    I swear one of these days when I have time I am going to compile data on Knicks opposing FG% in first quarters and compare it with rest of league, particularly against bad teams in home games…I swear teams must shoot around 60-70% as crazy as that sounds…

  15. hoolahoop

    I love DWills game. . . . looks like a young Jason Kidd.
    From the looks of the first quarter, the Nets got some good building blocks.

  16. art vandelay

    I think Lopez, although not great, is too good to be inducted into the middling opponents HOF…

  17. Jake S.

    How long before Amare’s entire body is covered in protective wrapping? It’s like they’re preparing him for an Egyptian burial.

  18. DRed

    massive: Is there a worse rebounder in the NBA at 6’11? than Jared Jeffries? He has absolutely no instinct there.  

    Jeffries has some uses on D. He’s long, and he can guard a bunch of positions. But he’s terrible at everything else. Just awful. I refuse to believe there aren’t a bunch of guys in the D-league better than this.

  19. Brian Cronin

    For what it is worth, it seems like D’Antoni believes that no D-Leaguer would be able to grasp SSOL in the time given, while Jeffries knows it already. And seeing as how Billups and Melo have not been able to grasp SSOL, there might be some truth to that.

  20. DRed

    Brian Cronin: For what it is worth, it seems like D’Antoni believes that no D-Leaguer would be able to grasp SSOL in the time given, while Jeffries knows it already. And seeing as how Billups and Melo have not been able to grasp SSOL, there might be some truth to that.  

    Knows what? How much offense do you need to know to never, ever fucking score?

    sorry-I really hate Jeffries.

  21. massive

    DRed:
    Jeffries has some uses on D.He’s long, and he can guard a bunch of positions.But he’s terrible at everything else.Just awful.I refuse to believe there aren’t a bunch of guys in the D-league better than this.  

    He makes a good play on the defensive end every once in a while. I really wish Anthony Randolph wasn’t traded because he can do everything Jared Jeffries does plus rebounding, ball-handling, passing (I think) and can actually score if you give him the ball within 10 feet. Jared Jeffries is just terrible and doesn’t deserve minutes on a playoff team (even if we’re under .500).

  22. art vandelay

    from what I see, no amount of knowledge of SSOL is going to save jeffries…he actually added value at certain points last year before being trades….this second go-round I think he has detracted more than he has added….especially with the opportunity cost lost by playing him earlier over shelden williams, or even derrick (devan?) brown.

  23. hoolahoop

    I have a pain in my gut watching D Will. Wow, if the knicks had D Will “instead” be watching some exciting basketball. Amare would thrive and the knicks would be a big man away from being as good as anyone in the east

  24. Brian Cronin

    Now imagine, hoolahoop, if D-Will ever learned to “take over a game” like Melo or Amar’e – he’d really be good then!

  25. SangaD

    This net team is playing with passion and pride that is dangerous to just approach unbridled one defensive spell and one offensive run will have them switching to things they can’t do. We got this one no worries.

  26. Jake S.

    Let’s sign Kris Humphries. He looks like a tough mofo and Kim K. may wan’t to move to Manhattan even more than Lala.

  27. art vandelay

    I have been watching for 5 minutes and this game may already be over….really pathetic!

  28. BigBlueAL

    DWil balling so far, 15 pts on 9 FGA with 4 asts and 3 rebs and only 1 to. Oh wait those are Melo’s stats so far.

  29. art vandelay

    biggest problem I see is that the auxiliary players just don’t move when STAT or Melo have the ball…..the knicks would iso STAT on extended elbow prior to the trade and they would have cutters and other screens to get people like gallo open…chandler, felton would move….billups just hangs out at the 3 point line….and the rest of the denver riff raff stand around waiting, hoping the big 2 will score…maybe that is lack of familiarity with the system and maybe that is just age (billups, carter) or relative lack of ability (sheldon williams)…TD is the only one I see moving around trying to get open.

  30. CapB

    art vandelay: biggest problem I see is that the auxiliary players just don’t move when STAT or Melo have the ball…..the knicks would iso STAT on extended elbow prior to the trade and they would have cutters and other screens to get people like gallo open…chandler, felton would move….billups just hangs out at the 3 point line….and the rest of the denver riff raff stand around waiting, hoping the big 2 will score…maybe that is lack of familiarity with the system and maybe that is just age (billups, carter) or relative lack of ability (sheldon williams)…TD is the only one I see moving around trying to get open.  

    When the other guys move, Melo will pass them the ball. Someone just tell them to keep moving.

    Knicks are getting killed on the boards. Can we please release Jeffries? The guy provides nothing

  31. latke

    If I’m not supposed to do this, ya’ll can just delete my post–

    a couple choice quotes from the Hollinger article on the ‘Melo trade (why didn’t he say all this before?):

    “But this is where we get to the same vicious cycle that has plagued the Knicks throughout James Dolan’s ownership. Ultimately, this is a franchise that cares a lot more about winning news conferences than it does about patiently building a winner, a wicked undercurrent that even Donnie Walsh was powerless to stop.

    So Dolan wanted to get Anthony regardless of the cost, and that they did. Along the way they convinced themselves Melo was a top-10 player when there isn’t a shred of evidence to support that contention… If this trade ends up building a contender, it will be in Denver, not New York.”

    “the opportunity cost of this acquisition was enormous — the Knicks basically can’t make any other moves involving a first-round pick for the next half-decade, and have no other young assets to put into deals for any other players. They recklessly committed all their assets to a deal that only marginally improved the team, much as they did nearly a decade earlier with the Stephon Marbury trade. ”

    Lots more good stuff, but I suppose you’ll have to subscribe to get it!

  32. art vandelay

    by biggest problem, I meant biggest problem OFFENSIVELY…clearly they are a total defensive debacle…just open mid-range jump shot and putback after another.

  33. hoolahoop

    art vandelay: biggest problem I see is that the auxiliary players just don’t move when STAT or Melo have the ball…..the knicks would iso STAT on extended elbow prior to the trade and they would have cutters and other screens to get people like gallo open…chandler, felton would move….billups just hangs out at the 3 point line….and the rest of the denver riff raff stand around waiting, hoping the big 2 will score…maybe that is lack of familiarity with the system and maybe that is just age (billups, carter) or relative lack of ability (sheldon williams)…TD is the only one I see moving around trying to get open.  

    They don’t move because they know they’re not going to get the ball back from melo.

  34. micdan

    this is pathetic!!! what is the point if nj miss if they dont care about taking the rebound

  35. Robert Silverman

    Wow. That replay showing Stat just standing there while Petro went by him was…what’s a worse word than horrendous?

  36. Jake S.

    How many years of this do you think we’re in store for before we blow it up and start over again?

  37. Frank O.

    given up 10 O boards, they just said.
    Pretty horrid.
    Amazing this late in Stat’s career that he can’t box out consistently.
    Stat now has three fouls.
    This is bad.

  38. micdan

    Jake S.: How many years of this do you think we’re in store for before we blow it up and start over again?  

    if they miss on cp 3 or d-will i give them 2 years

  39. art vandelay

    Can someone remember a possession this half when NJ did not ultimately score…meaning miss and knicks got the ball…maybe 1 turnover…but otherwise I think they have scored on almost every time down somehow via made basket, free throws or putback.

  40. hoolahoop

    latke: If I’m not supposed to do this, ya’ll can just delete my post–a couple choice quotes from the Hollinger article on the ‘Melo trade (why didn’t he say all this before?):“But this is where we get to the same vicious cycle that has plagued the Knicks throughout James Dolan’s ownership. Ultimately, this is a franchise that cares a lot more about winning news conferences than it does about patiently building a winner, a wicked undercurrent that even Donnie Walsh was powerless to stop.So Dolan wanted to get Anthony regardless of the cost, and that they did. Along the way they convinced themselves Melo was a top-10 player when there isn’t a shred of evidence to support that contention… If this trade ends up building a contender, it will be in Denver, not New York.”“the opportunity cost of this acquisition was enormous — the Knicks basically can’t make any other moves involving a first-round pick for the next half-decade, and have no other young assets to put into deals for any other players. They recklessly committed all their assets to a deal that only marginally improved the team, much as they did nearly a decade earlier with the Stephon Marbury trade. ”Lots more good stuff, but I suppose you’ll have to subscribe to get it!  

    On pont and well articulated.

  41. rohank

    Melo’s actually playing great D. It’s Amare that’s sucking on that end. NO AWARENESS WHATSOEVER

  42. micdan

    i loved the old knicks more than the new one. i never liked the trade for melo. i think we gave a lot to melo who i believe is a good player but not that good for the prize we payed for him. hope things works out well because its getting frustrating

  43. hoolahoop

    latke: If I’m not supposed to do this, ya’ll can just delete my post–a couple choice quotes from the Hollinger article on the ‘Melo trade (why didn’t he say all this before?):“But this is where we get to the same vicious cycle that has plagued the Knicks throughout James Dolan’s ownership. Ultimately, this is a franchise that cares a lot more about winning news conferences than it does about patiently building a winner, a wicked undercurrent that even Donnie Walsh was powerless to stop.So Dolan wanted to get Anthony regardless of the cost, and that they did. Along the way they convinced themselves Melo was a top-10 player when there isn’t a shred of evidence to support that contention… If this trade ends up building a contender, it will be in Denver, not New York.”“the opportunity cost of this acquisition was enormous — the Knicks basically can’t make any other moves involving a first-round pick for the next half-decade, and have no other young assets to put into deals for any other players. They recklessly committed all their assets to a deal that only marginally improved the team, much as they did nearly a decade earlier with the Stephon Marbury trade. ”Lots more good stuff, but I suppose you’ll have to subscribe to get it!  

    Was melo not complicit by his comments. “maybe the knicks don’t really want me”. He could have made is possible for a better knicks roster

  44. bouncerpr

    When they were about to go to the commercial the mic caught Dantoni saying “don’t foul”… Instead of saying play some good solid defense… or blosk out for God’s sake!!!!

  45. art vandelay

    saddest thing about watching teh knicks play is that it looks as though if they were even to play a scintilla of defense and aggressively box out they could be up 20 rather than down 10….new jersey is pretty porous defensively as well.

  46. Jake S.

    The box score suggests Fields has played 6 minutes. Is there no other solution to this guard problem? Can’t they try Melo at the 4 if they need to play Douglas alongside Billups?

  47. art vandelay

    We need TD to get hot and hit a few 3′s because if the opposing D collapses in the second half I don’t have confidence in anyone else being able to hit an outside shot…Walker, injured williams, Fields…no to all….

    basically billups and TD have to hit shots….TD did absolutely nothing (literally in the box score, save for a TO)…they will need a contribution from him to win in the second half.

  48. jaylamerique

    John Kenney: Hollinger just kills it in this article. Finally. http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=PERDiem-110330  

    from a Hollinger article a few weeks before the trade: The Knicks now are offering two of their wings — Gallinari and Chandler — plus agreeing to a side trade of Raymond Felton for Chauncey Billups, with Timofey Mozgov potentially going to Denver as well. On the surface, it’s still a positive move — Chandler was going to be a restricted free agent after the season, and both he and Gallinari play the same position as Anthony, and Billups, although 8 years older than Felton, is roughly equal as a player. The Knicks would be better the day after the trade than they were before it and would pose a more potent threat as the likely No. 6 seed from the East……..
    this new article smells of hindsight

  49. jaylamerique

    Brian Cronin: I really, truly, totally have no idea why Melo seemingly never plays the 4.  

    because that doesn’t improve our post defense. i wouldn’t try that lineup unless it was against the sixers and their small ball lineup.

  50. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, while I agree with most of Hollinger’s piece, I do agree that it is not totally consistent for him.

  51. hoolahoop

    jaylamerique:
    from a Hollinger article a few weeks before the trade: The Knicks now are offering two of their wings — Gallinari and Chandler — plus agreeing to a side trade of Raymond Felton for Chauncey Billups, with Timofey Mozgov potentially going to Denver as well. On the surface, it’s still a positive move — Chandler was going to be a restricted free agent after the season, and both he and Gallinari play the same position as Anthony, and Billups, although 8 years older than Felton, is roughly equal as a player. The Knicks would be better the day after the trade than they were before it and would pose a more potent threat as the likely No. 6 seed from the East……..
    this new article smells of hindsight  

    Busted!

  52. jaylamerique

    Brian Cronin: Yeah, while I agree with most of Hollinger’s piece, I do agree that it is not totally consistent for him.  

    yah, i remember him saying that the Knicks had no assets before the melo trade and now after the trade is done he is says that the Knicks had assets that they shouldn’t have given up. To be honest, Felton was hurting us, Chandler as a 4 isn’t a good idea nor was his constant disappearing act during games. The draft pick is the only thing that bothered me about the trade.

  53. jaylamerique

    The nba is loaded with chandler types, felton wasn’t anything special. Gallo was a lost but i don’t know how much better he can get as a player. I’ve already made my opinion clear about AR. Moz isn’t playing. the draft picks are the only important thing

  54. BigBlueAL

    Great job by Fields allowing Morrow to get the offensive reb, dribble out to the 3pt line and then bury it.

  55. Robert Silverman

    jaylamerique:
    from a Hollinger article a few weeks before the trade: The Knicks now are offering two of their wings — Gallinari and Chandler — plus agreeing to a side trade of Raymond Felton for Chauncey Billups, with Timofey Mozgov potentially going to Denver as well. On the surface, it’s still a positive move — Chandler was going to be a restricted free agent after the season, and both he and Gallinari play the same position as Anthony, and Billups, although 8 years older than Felton, is roughly equal as a player. The Knicks would be better the day after the trade than they were before it and would pose a more potent threat as the likely No. 6 seed from the East……..
    this new article smells of hindsight  

    Thank you for calling out Hollinger for his hack-tastic revisionist history!!!

  56. Jake S.

    That was the most convincing piece of Hollinger’s article. Melo is what he is–a very good player with limitations. The Knicks need to acquire 4 more rotation players and I don’t know how they do that before Amare’s body spontaneously combusts.

  57. Nick C.

    BigBlueAL: Great job by Fields allowing Morrow to get the offensive reb, dribble out to the 3pt line and then bury it.  
    I’m a little behind but worse was Lopez screened out 3 Knicks on the shot.

  58. Nick C.

    That five minute video review lets you catch up fast. Anyhew, they’re back in it just like that. Melo having an A game offensively.

  59. art vandelay

    reminds me of the milwaukee game…let’s get within 1 as many times as possible without ever getting the lead.

  60. Nick C.

    One thing that bugs me was before the Orlando game Melo said “we talked about it and these teams don’t belong on the court with us.” or something to that effect. If that’s really their attitude it shows.

  61. KnickInSeattle

    Melo ought to be taking every shot for us right now, unless there’s an open cutter.

  62. BigBlueAL

    TD with a horrific end to the quarter. Allows Farmar to get an offensive reb and putback then misses a layup. Knicks instead of being up 3 at end of quarter are down 1.

  63. latke

    Brian Cronin: I really, truly, totally have no idea why Melo seemingly never plays the 4.  

    From what I’ve seen, he seems to foul a lot whenever he’s guarding a big guy. I’m sure he could guard kris humphries though.

    jaylamerique: this new article smells of hindsight  

    It does, but it’s still a bit more brave of him to come out against the mainstream “wait a year” “d’antoni not making them play D” stuff.

    re: feed — free, legal and HQ @ espn3.com

  64. art vandelay

    is it just me or is jeffries COMPLETELY incapable of holding onto the basketball on rebounds…the ball slips through his hands almost EVERY time!

  65. BigBlueAL

    Knicks sadly are probably better off with Amar’e on the bench tonight. Of course that is if Melo is on the floor.

  66. BahamaKnick

    Billups, Carter, She-Will and Melo the Nicks!!! Keeping us in and helping us win this game.

  67. Mulligan

    Who would your dream commentators be for a game? I’d love a Hubie/Bill Walton combo, with maybe Mike Breen to keep things moving.
    Chris Webber and maybe… David Thorpe at halftime. Is Thorpe ever on TV? I love pretty much everything that dude writes.

  68. DRed

    I missed most of the second half coming home from work, so I have no idea what happened. But I approve.

  69. BigBlueAL

    Best part was Lopez missing his shot then trying to fix his shoe while having the rebound hit his back and go out of bounds.

  70. Kikuchiyo

    Not a great night for Knuggets fans. Our Nicks (Billups, Melo, Carter) played great. But check out the Denver halftime box. Chandler, Felton, Gallo, and Harrington are…..wait for it…..

    5 for 24.

  71. BigBlueAL

    Yeah, looking around the NBA recently there have been alot of bad losses by good teams to horrible teams at home. Right now dont care what the score is and how they win just win the game is fine with me.

  72. jon abbey

    lot of help out west in the Houston situation also, Houston loses, Memphis wins and NO is up 7 in the last two minutes.

    I’m sure we were all thinking the Anthony Carter to Shelden Williams scoring combo would be what turned this game. :)

    nice to see Billups playing better, but still some very dubious shooting decisions with a lot of time left on the clock. the one in the last minute almost killed us, thankfully Toney somehow came up with it.

    and I couldn’t have been the only one bummed Melo didn’t get to 40, it looked like he had a good shot at 50+ for a while. next time!

  73. Frank O.

    Kikuchiyo: Not a great night for Knuggets fans. Our Nicks (Billups, Melo, Carter) played great. But check out the Denver halftime box. Chandler, Felton, Gallo, and Harrington are…..wait for it…..5 for 24.  

  74. BigBlueAL

    jon abbey: lot of help out west in the Houston situation also, Houston loses, Memphis wins and NO is up 7 in the last two minutes.I’m sure we were all thinking the Anthony Carter to Shelden Williams scoring combo would be what turned this game. :)nice to see Billups playing better, but still some very dubious shooting decisions with a lot of time left on the clock. the one in the last minute almost killed us, thankfully Toney somehow came up with it.and I couldn’t have been the only one bummed Melo didn’t get to 40, it looked like he had a good shot at 50+ for a while. next time!  

    Nets were doubling him immediately for almost entire 4th quarter. Only time they didnt were in the final 2 minutes when Melo missed his layup (still say he was fouled by Lopez) hit the shot that gave them the lead for good and his final shot which he somehow missed because the shot looked perfect on the replay.

  75. BigBlueAL

    BTW, aside from his horrible final 3 FGA which made him 10 for 23 instead overall from the floor, Billups played well again. 6 asts and 0 to’s. Last 3 games he has 22 asts and 0 to’s. Also looking like he is getting healthy because he is getting to the FT line again, 10 for 10 tonight. I read today that D’Antoni mentioned to the press that Billups told him he feels like he is getting his explosiveness back on his knee. Looking like it recently thankfully.

  76. BigBlueAL

    Have to admit it will be nice for me to be rooting again for a real winning team starting tomorrow at 1 pm :-)

  77. nicos

    Well if the Melo we get for the next 3 years is the Melo of the last two games at least he’ll earn his 20 million. Also Billups with a nice line but it was pretty clear down the stretch that either he or Melo was going to shoot the ball- he really didn’t try to get Amar’e involved at all- there was one play where Amar’e set a screen and was standing by himself in the lane and Billups never even looked at him. Those two need to get on the same page if the Knicks want to have any chance of even making it interesting in the first round.

  78. CRJoe

    I only watched the second half, o I saw a great Knicks team dominating a clearly inferior team, but based on the boxscore and your comments, this isn’t really a win to cheer for… How is it that this far down the line we barely manage to take down a Nets team with the rusty version of D Will???

  79. Z-man

    I would rather have Melo than D-Will.
    We clunked our way into that win, but it’s better than what happened during the 1-9 stretch.
    Melo commits some dumb “flail the arms” fouls, but at least the defensive effort is there.

  80. BigBlueAL

    Hopefully these next 3 days off helps out Amar’e. Also once the Knicks clinch a playoff spot (should happen if they win next 2 games if not just by winning next game) they should seriously think about sitting him or severely limiting his minutes for rest of the regular season.

  81. Brian Cronin

    NO holds on, the draft pick is a bit safer.

    Down 2 1/2 games to Memphis (I don’t say three because they own the tie-breaker) with 7 games to go (and 3 1/2, possibly 4 1/2, depending on how the tie-breaker goes, to New Orleans)? That is huge! All great results for the Knicks tonight!!

  82. jon abbey

    CRJoe: How is it that this far down the line we barely manage to take down a Nets team with the rusty version of D Will???  

    there is no one on the roster to defend guys like Lopez or Hibbert, especially with Turiaf out. at one point in the Orlando game, their PG (Turkoglu) was about the same size as our C (Jeffries).

    so everytime you want to ask yourself that kind of question, just remember Dolan gave away Mozgov for no reason, Denver is not even playing him.

  83. Brian Cronin

    They can trade draft picks in 2016!!! Good lord, that trade was insane. Sorry, the Mozgov thing just reminded me about how bad that trade was (and yes, I can’t believe that Mozgov was going to stand in the way of that trade getting done).

  84. JR Sec 112

    Amare with 1 board tonight in 31 minutes. Nets with 16 ORBs. Maybe we should all stop debating Melo and Billups and lamenting the trade. Given how thin the Knicks are inside, their winning and losing ends with STAT. The only month they truly played well was in December, and the reason was Amare averaged almost 10 boards a game. We can blame Melo all we want for the recent struggles, but with Amare averaging less than 8 boards in the last 2 months, thats the difference right there. He doesnt help on D. He doesnt move anymore. Given his decline, I’d reckon the Knicks record would be worse without the trade. Melo at least takes some pressure off.

    The silver lining in this game tonight is D’Antoni may realize that Shelden Williams is the 4th best player on the team right now. He’s the only other guy on the roster who has a shot at starting for another team. And his post defense is VASTLY superior to Jeffries. JJ doesnt play good defense. He just makes a flashy steal or charge every once in a while. Similar to STAT and his blocks. Shelden shut down Lopez in the fourth and he saved the team tonight.

  85. CRJoe

    JR Sec 112: Amare with 1 board tonight in 31 minutes.Nets with 16 ORBs. Maybe we should all stop debating Melo and Billups and lamenting the trade.Given how thin the Knicks are inside, their winning and losing ends with STAT.The only month they truly played well was in December, and the reason was Amare averaged almost 10 boards a game.We can blame Melo all we want for the recent struggles, but with Amare averaging less than 8 boards in the last 2 months, thats the difference right there.He doesnt help on D.He doesnt move anymore.

    We’ll that’s pretty much the point everyone here has been making… it’s not that ‘Melo & Billups aren’t great, it’s just that we gave up so many assets in the game, that now we are just too weakened to put up a fight… In fact the last few posts all have been about losing Mozgov, depth or the complete ability to make a significant move via trade..

  86. bobneptune

    Frank O.:
      

    yeah… the knuggets sucked their way to a 13-4 rec ord since the trade and gallo iced the game with 9 points in the last 5 minutes.

    call me when the knicks go 13-4 with this depleted roster.

    even randolph led the t wolves in scoring tonight with 15 points/5 boards and 3 steals in 19 whole minutes…. but the nix didn’t need a 21 yr old like him…. we’ve got jared bleepin jefferies to throw up his nightly goose-egg in 25 minutes.

  87. gregory arkadin

    Please. Randolph ought not be mentioned, considering he got most of his minutes at the end of the game when, because of a 20-point deficit, both teams stopped caring and pulled their starters. Neither he, nor any of the T-wolves big men, could do much of anything against the Bulls bigs. Don’t make me bring up his worthless performance against the Celtics.

  88. slovene knick

    …bob get’s his call’s sometime late June when knicks meet nuggets in the finals and miraculously win the first game.

  89. Nick C.

    Nice of them to pull it out. I hope the recent version of Melo sticks around, becuase he rebounds, passes, makes shots without forcing the issue (much) an dlooks to be putting in an effort on defense. Billups great stat line but really he almost undid it all with those Crawfordesque shots in the last mintue. Lead and you shoot a non-wide open 3 with 15-20 seconds on the clock…blows my mind. I think the Brook Lopez tying his shoe while the ball is still live, the game is in doubt, time is runnign down and having it roll off his back and out of bounds is pretty much a snapshot of both him and that franchise. Now if the phone battery would cooperate I could actually post more often when it counts like during the game. Oh well.

  90. Caleb

    gregory arkadin: Please. Randolph ought not be mentioned, considering he got most of his minutes at the end of the game when, because of a 20-point deficit, both teams stopped caring and pulled their starters. Neither he, nor any of the T-wolves big men, could do much of anything against the Bulls bigs. Don’t make me bring up his worthless performance against the Celtics.  

    Yeah, I wouldn’t make too much of last night.

    BUT.. over the last 5… 2 blowout losses and 3 close losses against Boston, OKC and Dallas… Randolph has averaged 26 mpg… per 36 he’s averaged 23.5 points and 10.6 boards, on 56 percent shooting.

    Not blocking a lot of of shots but averaging almost 2 steals a game.

    4 turnovers per 36, but most of that was 7 Tos in 24 minutes against the Kings.

    None of this is that surprising, he had a lot of big games as a 19 y/o and 20 y/o.

    When all is said and done, he’ll be the biggest loss of the trade, even before you factor in that we gave him away for 1 day of Corey Brewer.

  91. Frank

    I’ve said it 1000 times and I’ll say it again -let’s stop bellyaching over how bad the trade was. What’s over is over. Don’t get me wrong – I think we totally overpaid. But…the trade wasn’t made so we could go 13-4 over a 17 game stretch to match the Knuggets. It was made for the next 4 years, and I think it’s way too early to decide who got the best of it. What if the Nuggets get knocked out in the 1st round this year (a real possibility), Chandler signs somewhere else this summer, and Gallo signs somewhere else next summer? Then Felton will be gone and they’re left with Mozgov and a 2014 pick to show for it. I don’t think we’ll know the full effect of this trade until the summer of 2012 is over.

    At least under the current CBA, being the #5-8 seed in the playoffs is maybe the worst place to be – little chance to win a ring, bad draft picks. Denver has played better than a #5 seed since the trade, but they are not better than SA, LAL, DAL, and OKC (although they are in spitting distance of them).

    Meanwhile – and again, I’m not defending our overpayment in the trade — Melo’s stats with us so far: 21 games, scoring 26.3 per 36, TS of 56.9%, 42% from 3 point range, all with a 30.8% usage. He has absolutely carried us the last few games when, as JR Sec 112 noted, STAT has been pretty horrible.

    I AM glad to see that D’Antoni has stopped playing to STAT’s ego, at least for the last few minutes of the game, taking him out when they need big defensive stands and going with Jefferies and Shelden. I don’t know how to get these stats, but I wonder whether Amare is last in the league in offensive rebounds against. It seems like he’s always just watching the ball get rebounded. No boxing out. No jumping. No nothing. It’s like Eddy Curry infected him with Eddy Curry disease right before he left.

  92. Brian Cronin

    When all is said and done, he’ll be the biggest loss of the trade, even before you factor in that we gave him away for 1 day of Corey Brewer.

    I, too, think it is pathetic how little they got back for Randolph, but you have to mention that they also traded him for Minnesota’s cap space. That was the real return, not Brewer. Brewer was just because NBA typically requires that something change teams in a trade, whether it be a player or a pick (in other words, you can’t just trade a player to another team for their cap space – something else has to be in the deal), and I guess Minnesota did not want to give up any picks to the Knicks. The cap space was important because the Knicks were insistent on giving Denver every single last concession that they asked for, and Denver did not want to take on any salary, so Minnesota being able to take on Curry’s salary was actually pretty important.

  93. gregory arkadin

    I was at the last two Wolves games. I was there, man. I was looking to be BLOWN AWAY by Randolph, but…16 minutes, shooting 0-5, 3 TO, and 4 PF (albeit with 4 RB) against Boston didn’t do it for me. He started for Love, and his lack of offensive or defensive prowess contributed to a 20+ point lead in the first quarter. After that he was sidelined with foul trouble.

Comments are closed.