Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Tuesday, December 23, 2014

2011 Game Thread: Knicks @ Hawks

For your game thoughts.

204 comments on “2011 Game Thread: Knicks @ Hawks

  1. Robert Silverman

    Billups, Turiaf, and Walker all out.

    So the rotation’s: Stat, Melo, DWTDD, Fields, Jeffries, Extra E, Carter and…um. Big Shelden? Balkman? Brown?

    Eep. That’s tough

  2. Brian Cronin

    That’s kind of hilarious. So, what, Toney or Fields has to play 48 minutes, basically? Or will Mason actually see some time at the 2?

  3. John Kenney

    My prediction: we won’t ever have a carter-mason backcourt. But we’ve thrown carter out at the two before. so depending on who atlanta has out–

    start DWTDD-fields
    switch carter-DWTDD (or DWTDD-carter)
    switch carter-fields
    (maybe mason-fields)

  4. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, you’re right, I guess you can get 96 minutes out of Carter/Douglas/Fields.

  5. Robert Silverman

    Brian Cronin: Yeah, you’re right, I guess you can get 96 minutes out of Carter/Douglas/Fields.  

    The thought of Carter/Fields trying to check Joe Johnson/Jamal Crawford is pretty hilarious. As is 36 mins of Anthony Carter in general.

  6. tenebrous

    put stat at the 3 melo the 2 now u don’t care about the pg and two rebounders/foul takers/Dunkers. Rotate td n ac. rotate melo and fields. rotate stat n dbrown. Rotate sw n balkman. Rotate jj n shelden. Rotate mason as needed.

  7. BigBlueAL

    Yeah, with the injuries this could get ugly tonight. But regardless it will all be Melo’s fault.

  8. BigBlueAL

    BTW, after last night’s game Chandler now has a TS% with Denver lower than what Melo has as a Knick so far. Felton’s TS% with Denver is still way below 50%.

    Brian, Adamek tweeted that D’Antoni said both Mason and Brown will get minutes today due to the injuries. Will see if that happens or not though.

  9. Brian Cronin

    It makes sense to give Mason some minutes, I guess. I’d rather see Balkman than Brown, though.

  10. Jim Cavan

    tenebrous: I would love Carter mason back court. R these guys on our team????  

    I’m gonna go ahead and say I would most definitely not love this.

  11. Jim Cavan

    1) Anyone have predictions as to who was actually crying in the Heat locker room today?

    2) Is this Spoelstra’s last game as coach? The logic being Riley wouldn’t sell his guys out by telling reporters — REPORTERS — that players were crying in the locker room?

  12. Brian Cronin

    I thought it was meant as a good thing. You know, like “You think these guys don’t care? They care! They were crying after the game!”

  13. Jim Cavan

    My bet: Wade and Miller. Wade because he’s a baby, and Miller because he can’t hit the broad side of a barn right now.

  14. Robert Silverman

    What are the gambling odds on the first NY beat reporter to make a lame/predictable “There’s no crying in basketball!” tweet/joke.

    I gotta put it at Berman -400, Isola -350, Vescey -300, Adamek -100, Hahn -50, Beck +100

  15. tenebrous

    Knicks lost big to magic but Howard got suspended before stat or melo so I feel a lot better now

  16. Jim Cavan

    Robert Silverman: What are the gambling odds on the first NY beat reporter to make a lame/predictable “There’s no crying in basketball!” tweet/joke.I gotta put it at Berman -400, Isola -350, Vescey -300, Adamek -100, Hahn -50, Beck +100  

    Vescey. He seems like the one with the most “”””clout””” to be able to go off topic and write a column about it. Yes, I put three sets of quotations around “”””clout””””.

  17. marxster

    Did anyone hear Chuck the other day, trashing the Knicks? One two separate occasions, he didn’t waste anytime to say that the Knicks are garbage. I wonder what the Knicks did to piss him off that much. I guess he really doesn’t like D’Antoni. Oh well…

  18. tenebrous

    marxster: Did anyone hear Chuck the other day, trashing the Knicks? One two separate occasions, he didn’t waste anytime to say that the Knicks are garbage. I wonder what the Knicks did to piss him off that much. I guess he really doesn’t like D’Antoni. Oh well…  

    Knicks didn’t fight for him when he was being traded.

  19. marxster

    tenebrous:
    Knicks didn’t fight for him when he was being traded.  

    It’s just so annoying to hear someone repeatedly say that a team is garbage without explaining why his thinks so. It’s a little childish…but then again, I’m not all that surprised, Chuck isn’t exactly the sharpest tool in the shed.

  20. CRJoe

    marxster: Did anyone hear Chuck the other day, trashing the Knicks? One two separate occasions, he didn’t waste anytime to say that the Knicks are garbage. I wonder what the Knicks did to piss him off that much. I guess he really doesn’t like D’Antoni. Oh well…  

    Chuck’s been royally pissed at the Knicks ever since the trade, he even seems disgusted whenever he’s on the subject…

    I find it hypocritical from him, in one segment he was praising Jordan for the Crash trade saying that if you’re not contending then you gotta make the big trade and shoot to develop your team over the years… In the following segment, his trashing the Knicks for trading for a bad fit and dismantling the team in the process… If anything I think the Knicks trade makes a hell of a lot more sense than Charlotte’s (but that’s not saying much really)…

  21. tenebrous

    marxster:
    It’s just so annoying to hear someone repeatedly say that a team is garbage without explaining why his thinks so. It’s a little childish…but then again, I’m not all that surprised, Chuck isn’t exactly the sharpest tool in the shed.  

    they sell sharpereners at staples

  22. Michael Cline

    Whew, Melo is ok. Can you even imagine how bad we would be if he or Stat went down for a couple of weeks? We’d be in the 8th spot for sure

  23. Jake S.

    I’m catching a whiff of Vince Carter about Melo in these ESPN interviews. Watching him writhe around on the floor like he’s been shot isn’t helping matters.

  24. Robert Silverman

    Jake S.: Ken Bannister, Chris Dudley, Scott Brooks, JR Reid and Carmelo Anthony  

    Pat Cummings and Bob Thornton just checked in.

  25. art vandelay

    I think this will have to be a bombs away game for us to win a la the jersey game…hope the 3s go in by toney d, easy e, landry, maybe even unusual suspects like mason and carter….otherwise their defense is so zoned in on the 2 guys knowing we have little else to offer with 3 guys out due to injury.

  26. BigBlueAL

    marxster: I hate Doug Collins…these guys are breathing down our necks. Pressure is on.  

    The difference between the 6th and 7th seed is negligible.

  27. Jake S.

    I wouldn’t mind having a peek at Derrick Brown and that 45-second jump shot of his.

  28. BigBlueAL

    How the hell did TD not see Amar’e WIDE open from 15 ft away and instead dribble into 2 players and try to hit a circus layup??

  29. Jake S.

    With Roger Mason and Shawne Williams on the floor, they should outfit the front row with protective head gear. Their shots really fly off the rim.

  30. Jake S.

    BigBlueAL
    March 6, 2011 at 7:22 pm
    Jesus Christ, TD trying to run the offense is brutal to watch.

    Yes. Total spaz.

  31. BigBlueAL

    lol, Shawne is money when its a straight catch and shoot situation but any time he tries to shoot off the dribble yeah the rim takes a beating.

  32. cgreene

    Re: Carmelo being a ballstopper. If I looked up and the next pass was to Jeffries I’d probably shoot over 4 people too.

  33. Spree8nyk8

    I have 100 bucks to bet anyone that thinks we are gonna finish worse than sixth in the east. Any takers?

  34. Jim Cavan

    Joe Johnson is really not that good. Maybe the most overrated “star” of the decade?

  35. Thomas B.

    Spree8nyk8: I have 100 bucks to bet anyone that thinks we are gonna finish worse than sixth in the east.Any takers?  

    It could happen. But with the way the Bulls are playing, we’d end up playing them as the 2 seed. So six of one, a half dozen of the other.

    I’m not liking MDA lineups this game. There is no reason to have RMj–or Rimjob as I call him because he sucks @$$–on the floor. Unless JJ is pulling down 10 boards a night, I don’t see the need to start him.

  36. Spree8nyk8

    Thomas B.:
    It could happen. But with the way the Bulls are playing, we’d end up playing them as the 2 seed. So six of one, a half dozen of the other.I’m not liking MDA lineups this game. There is no reason to have RMj–or Rimjob as I call him because he sucks @$$–on the floor. Unless JJ is pulling down 10 boards a night, I don’t see the need to start him.  

    not sure what this has to do with what i said?

  37. Thomas B.

    Spree8nyk8:
    not sure what this has to do with what i said?  

    I’m saying falling from 6th probably doesnt matter in terms of match ups. Did you miss the part where I wrote “It could happen”?

  38. Jim Cavan

    Jake S.: Shelden Williams really has a serious dinosaur thing going on.  

    Assuming he and Candace Parker spawn, that has to be the ultimate breeding crapshoot.

  39. Spree8nyk8

    no i didn’t miss it, but I was looking for a bet. Anything could happen, they could finish with the best record in the east….it could happen. It won’t but it “could”. As far as if it matters, that I agree on for the most part unless finishing 6th or 7th puts us up against Orlando. It’s the only first round match I dread.

  40. Thomas B.

    But there is no reason to bet when the outcome really changes nothing. At 6 we play either Bulls or Heat. At 7 we play either Bulls or Heat. So why take the bet? It makes no difference.

  41. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    Re: Charles Barkley

    I used to respect him for being “honest,” but I know better now. What’s more surprising than his media/social hall pass (really, if he got caught with two trans call girls in a woodshed in Tempe, no one would care after the first week) is that that round person was one of the most athletic NBA players in league history. Every time I watch a highlight clip I believe it’s been engineered by NASA to make me believe something happened that didn’t actually happen.

  42. Robert Silverman

    Thank you, thank you. I’m here all week. Don’t forget to tip your waitress

  43. Robert Silverman

    Jim Cavan:
    You seriously have a gift. A very strange, very awesome gift.  

    “My power is beyond your understanding!” — Skeletor

  44. Brian Cronin

    Yeah, 7th or 6th is not a big deal to me. Hell, 8th isn’t much worse. The Knicks would be underdogs against any of the top 3 teams but could theoretically beat all three. There really isn’t any one team I’m hoping that they face in the playoffs. I guess I wouldn’t want them to be #8 and face the Celtics, but really, I don’t think it particularly matters.

  45. Brian Cronin

    By the way, the Hawks should be embarrassed to be trailing in this game. If the Knicks could steal this one, what a big win it would be.

  46. BigBlueAL

    Agree, but no chance in hell Knicks fall to 8th seed. Although they do play the Pacers 3 more times so losing all those games could make it happen I guess.

  47. Spree8nyk8

    Thomas B.: But there is no reason to bet when the outcome really changes nothing. At 6 we play either Bulls or Heat. At 7 we play either Bulls or Heat. So why take the bet? It makes no difference.  

    For the 100 bucks?

    Winning duh /sheen

  48. Jake S.

    Is it sexist if I say that I have the same reaction to Doris Burke’s voice as Kramer did to Mary Hart?

  49. BigBlueAL

    Knicks have no clue on offense right now. Not having a PG right now is killing them tonight.

  50. latke

    missed 1st half. Where’s carmelo getting all the assists? Is he playing pick and roll with amare?

  51. BigBlueAL

    Apparently Chris Paul was taken out in a stretcher tonight in game at Cleveland. Looks like he hit his head on Sessions’ knee from what Ive read.

  52. jaylamerique

    Jake S.: Why didn’t we get Carlos Arroyo? Bueller?  

    cause he sucks. the heat released him cause he cant shoot.

  53. Jake S.

    Boston obviously thought he could play. And anything is better than watching Toney Douglas tazmanian devil routine.

  54. latke

    jaylamerique:
    cause he sucks. the heat released him cause he cant shoot.  

    He’s 44% from three this year. For his career he’s a bad shooter. I’m really not sure why they released him. Maybe they figured Bibby was the same thing except a little better.

  55. Brian Cronin

    Monta Ellis ties the Sixers game with a few seconds left. Come on, Warriors, get a stop!

  56. Count de Pennies

    Is it premature to start referring to the deal with Denver as “the Anthony Carter trade”?

  57. Robert Silverman

    If Axe Body Wash commercials have taught me anything, it’s that hot women will go crazy over smells.

  58. BigBlueAL

    latke:
    He’s 44% from three this year. For his career he’s a bad shooter. I’m really not sure why they released him. Maybe they figured Bibby was the same thing except a little better.  

    They released him because he couldnt cover a broom stick. So actually he would fit in perfectly with the Knicks I guess lol.

  59. Brian Cronin

    Philly heading into overtime.

    Crazy ending of regulation! Come on, Golden State! A win would be great.

  60. art vandelay

    Maybe they didn{t go after arroyo because they thought anthony carter was at least as good as he is if not better.

  61. marxster

    BigBlueAL:
    They released him because he couldnt cover a broom stick.So actually he would fit in perfectly with the Knicks I guess lol.  

    Knicks D getting better. Stop dissing.

    BigBlueAL:
    They released him because he couldnt cover a broom stick.So actually he would fit in perfectly with the Knicks I guess lol.  

  62. art vandelay

    I really think the knicks must have the 2 LEAST respected “superstars” in this league in the eyes of the refs….how easily are they t´d up and how infrequently do they get calls on drives or aren{t given benefit of doubt like wade and lbj….amazing!

  63. Max

    Carter, S.Williams, Mason, Jeffries, Stoudamire… somebody tells STAT that we’re not up by 30… :)

  64. Michael Cline

    How does Melo get called for a charge by simply dribbling towards someone, but STAT can blatantly push off and draw a foul?

  65. David Crockett

    BigBlueAL: What a pass by Amar’e to Extra E for 3!!!  

    Just now saw that on the replay.

    Wow. Didn’t know he had THAT in the arsenal.

    Damn, STAT. Save some for the playoffs bro.

  66. David Crockett

    When the ball moves we are getting anything we want.

    Let’s not pull out the all-iso offense right now fellas.

    Keep it moving.

  67. Max

    The working class is going to Heaven (from a very political 70’s italian movie)… Mason & Carter? WOW!

  68. Jim Cavan

    Jake S.: Toney Douglas, you are such a tool.  

    He’s like a socket wrench. You have to have the perfect socket for the perfect job, otherwise it’s useless.

  69. David Crockett

    Defensively, we are so much better prepared to play a team that runs isos than a team that runs the screen roll — especially the high screen roll.

  70. Michael Cline

    ATL is just falling apart. I’d love to see this team in the playoffs. They are getting worked.

    Knicks really playing hard this half

  71. Robert Silverman

    David Crockett: When the ball moves we are getting anything we want.
    Let’s not pull out the all-iso offense right now fellas.
    Keep it moving.  

    Discerning why this team can’t move the ball consistently would be like figuring out the unified field theory for b-ball

  72. latke

    latke: man that MVP chant for Amare seemed to totally take the will out of the Hawks  

    or was it Carmelo going to the bench………

  73. Jim Cavan

    Good time out by D’Antoni. Definitely one of the weirdest games I’ve seen all year. But if we pull this out, what a gutsy win.

  74. BigBlueAL

    David Crockett: Defensively, we are so much better prepared to play a team that runs isos than a team that runs the screen roll — especially the high screen roll.  

    I mentioned this the other night too. We can play good D on teams who just Iso all the time, especially now with Jeffries who is excellent at providing help when necessary. But any team who runs some semblance of an offense using picks and screens the Knicks get lost on how to play defense.

    Thats why I think they have a great chance at beating the Heat or Bulls because thats all they run especially late in games.

  75. David Crockett

    Robert Silverman:
    Discerning why this team can’t move the ball consistently would be like figuring out the unified field theory for b-ball  

    Pre-trade we had guys who could hit shots, but didn’t necessarily make the defense move. Now, we have a few guys who don’t always move the ball.

  76. Michael Cline

    Could one reason the ball has been moving much better is because Melo is on the bench? Just saying…

  77. Michael Cline

    A Field-Battier comparison on ESPN. Starting to her an awfully lot of those lately

  78. Kikuchiyo

    DRed: So how many games will it take Jeffries to make a bucket?  

    And on which day will the sun rise in the west, grasshopper?

  79. jaylamerique

    Michael Cline: Could one reason the ball has been moving much better is because Melo is on the bench? Just saying…  

    he has like seven assists.

  80. Jake S.

    Why does every NBA player wear a jacket or a shirt with epaulets? Someone needs to get the bottom of this.

  81. David Crockett

    BigBlueAL:
    Melo is a +5 tonight though.  

    I do have to say, his floor game is a *little* better than I thought. I knew he could rebound. He *can* pass. He just doesn’t always do it.

  82. Michael Cline

    BigBlueAL:
    He has 7 assists tonight.  

    True. And I’m not saying that he doesn’t pass EVER. He had 5 of those assists in the first half. But he is still prone to isos and holding the ball.

  83. BigBlueAL

    I was on TD’s case earlier for running the offense horribly, but he has 7 assists and 2 to’s. He definitely played alot better in the 4th quarter.

  84. Spree8nyk8

    DRed: So how many games will it take Jeffries to make a bucket?  

    who cares, he’s not there for that

  85. David Crockett

    BigBlueAL:
    I mentioned this the other night too.We can play good D on teams who just Iso all the time, especially now with Jeffries who is excellent at providing help when necessary.But any team who runs some semblance of an offense using picks and screens the Knicks get lost on how to play defense.Thats why I think they have a great chance at beating the Heat or Bulls because thats all they run especially late in games.  

    That, I put on the coaching staff more than the players. I’ve NEVER understood what D’Antoni likes to do vs the screen roll. EVER. Not even in Phoenix.

  86. Spree8nyk8

    Jake S.: Why does every NBA player wear a jacket or a shirt with epaulets? Someone needs to get the bottom of this.  

    Hang on lemme go google epaulets….

  87. BigBlueAL

    Michael Cline:
    True. And I’m not saying that he doesn’t pass EVER. He had 5 of those assists in the first half. But he is still prone to isos and holding the ball.  

    Oh definitely. But Im just saying I know everybody loves to dump on Melo every chance they can get but he was passing the ball alot tonight. W/o Billups the ball was in his hands practically every possession and most of the teams he was looking to pass.

  88. cgreene

    Have to say that I think Shawne Williams is a rotation level player on an elite team. Think he will just get better as well.

  89. Kikuchiyo

    As I’ve always said, if we can get double digit scoring form Anthony Carter, we’ll be fine.

  90. Jim Cavan

    Not saying it was his prime motivation, but D’Antoni keeping Melo on the bench down the stretch I think sent a good message. Yes he was a +5, and yes he had 7 assists. But he also took a lot of horrible shots and let Damien Wilkins get in his head. Sometimes a subtle message like that can work.

  91. David Crockett

    On Miami…

    Wade is the better iso player.

    But either way, take the pull up jumper Bron Bron.

  92. BigBlueAL

    When the hell was the last time the Knicks held an opponent under 80 points?? Had they done it before under D’Antoni??

  93. tenebrous

    Robert Silverman:
    Discerning why this team can’t move the ball consistently would be like figuring out the unified field theory for b-ball  

    unified field theory? It says everyone goes to the middle and than spreads apart

  94. fushknicken

    On D, I like AC fighting over screens, we didn’t have to trap as much tonight. Didn’t double in the post quite as much either, Horford was kind of a non-factor, didn’t rotate off him, maybe allowing too much guard penetration off the pick, something to look out for. Love that one and half screen play where AC or TD get a fake screen from JJ and then gets a real screen from Amare, leaves Williams in the corner open every time, is this a new three man set? Can’t wait to see Billups running that. Knick fans are the best! Love to see an away game turn into a home game like that.

  95. Jim Cavan

    Jake S.: I still can’t f-ing believe they lost to the Cavs at home.  

    I know we’ve cited plenty of candidates for “wake-up call game”, but I think that one really woke us up. Granted we played a Hawks team that was trending towards the depressive end of the manic-depressive scale, but we definitely brought the energy on the defensive end. Hopefully we’ll have Billups, Turiaf and Walker back tomorrow. The guys that played tonight will probably be gassed.

  96. BigBlueAL

    This Knicks team might continue to alternate big wins with bad losses for the rest of the season. They could very well drop to the 7th seed. But one thing is for sure the playoffs are going to be pretty fun because no matter if its the Bulls, Heat or the Magic (if they get up to the 3rd seed) the Knicks are going to be hell for either of those teams.

  97. Spree8nyk8

    BigBlueAL: They could very well drop to the 7th seed.  

    I have $100 that say’s that won’t happen…….

    still looking for a taker

  98. Z-man

    Some observations:
    Al Horford was completely invisible in this game

    The Hawks might miss Bibby for a while

    Kudos to Mason Jr. for staying ready, he has looked good for a guy who has been buried on the bench and reviled by fans for his 1-18 shooting over the first 50 games. Loved the way he and AC stepped up big time.

    As always, we lived or died by the 3, tonight, man did we live!

    If ever there was a player that exposed the limitations of PER, It’s Landry Fields. Despite his gaudy efficiency and rebounding stats, his PER is 13, i.e. a below avg player

  99. Jim Cavan

    Spree8nyk8:
    I wish they’d take over this board lol  

    C’mon now. We’re tough on our Bockers, sure. But we’re critical out of love.

    Let’s use the parenting analogy. What would you rather be: the parent who takes every opportunity to tell anyone who’s willing to listen how much of a genius their 6 year old kid is; how special they are; how they’re first in their class; how they watch Law & Order and know all the characters; or worse, how every failure or bad grade or failed sports team tryout had nothing to do with said child’s ability, but some grudge held by a higher power or authority figure?…. Or the parent who’s willing to impart praise and criticism judiciously and where appropriate? More importantly, which parent would you want to be stuck sitting next to at the annual Christmas play? Exactly.

    I’ve read many a Knick blog, and the reason why this one is the shiznit is because people here are critical and even-handed, for the most part. We can be slow to praise, but that’s just because we’re trying to keep expectations tempered.

  100. jon abbey

    we’re now a kind of shocking 3-1 since the trade against playoff teams, and even in the loss we were leading most of the game on the road in Orlando before Nelson and Anderson went nuts at the end.

    basketball is a crazy game sometimes, Anthony Carter with some highlight plays tonight back home in Atlanta. you know you’re old when you’re still in the NBA and your high school doesn’t exist anymore.

    I’d also like to be the first to point out how hilariously ironic it is that the player who may have finally got D’Antoni to focus more on the defensive side of the ball is Carmelo Anthony.

  101. Spree8nyk8

    Jim Cavan:
    C’mon now. We’re tough on our Bockers, sure. But we’re critical out of love.
    Let’s use the parenting analogy. What would you rather be: the parent who takes every opportunity to tell anyone who’s willing to listen how much of a genius their 6 year old kid is; how special they are; how they’re first in their class; how they watch Law & Order and know all the characters; or worse, how every failure or bad grade or failed sports team tryout had nothing to do with said child’s ability, but some grudge held by a higher power or authority figure?…. Or the parent who’s willing to impart praise and criticism judiciously and where appropriate? More importantly, which parent would you want to be stuck sitting next to at the annual Christmas play? Exactly.
    I’ve read many a Knick blog, and the reason why this one is the shiznit is because people here are critical and even-handed, for the most part. We can be slow to praise, but that’s just because we’re trying to keep expectations tempered.  

    I respectfully disagree

  102. joengai

    Jake S.: Why does every NBA player wear a jacket or a shirt with epaulets? Someone needs to get the bottom of this.  

    stop stealing material from GQ, they asked this like twice already

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