Statistical Analysis. Humor. Knicks.

Thursday, November 20, 2014

2011-2012 Game Thread: New York at Charlotte

Perhaps a road trip is just the thing to get the Knicks back on the right track. Your in-game thoughts here.

180 comments on “2011-2012 Game Thread: New York at Charlotte

  1. Thomas B. Post author

    Was anyone else filled with panic and dread when they saw Jeffries start that drive?

  2. Bruno Almeida

    our (lack of) offense is absolutely laughable.

    and will Melo intentionally shoot less just to prove he’s not the problem with the team?

  3. latke

    Lots of ball movement, only problem is guys are turning down open shots, notably Anthony (???) and Fields. Oh, and turnovers, but I’m fine with that.

  4. Juany8

    Every round of ball movement that doesn’t involve Melo looks horrific. Douglas and Fields are simply incapable of dribbling properly unless they have a wide open lane to the basket. Fields is improving rapidly, so of course he’s still air balling 3’s, the area he can help the most.

  5. latke

    I’m calling a 30+ point blowout here by the knicks. They look really good. If the open layups had fallen, they’d already be up double digits, and they’ve played good defense.

  6. Bruno Almeida

    latke:
    I’m calling a 30+ point blowout here by the knicks. They look really good. If the open layups had fallen, they’d already be up double digits, and they’ve played good defense.

    the ball movement has been nice and it’s good to see Diaw won’t crush us again (Jeffries definitely improves us a lot on the defensive end)

    but Amare being in foul trouble once again is a joke, the whole idea of having ball movement in the first place is to get him more involved on offense, and yet again he’s sitting.

    Melo seems to be hellbent on passing and not forcing shots, let’s see if this trend keeps up until the 4th quarter.

  7. Bruno Almeida

    that’s what you gotta do Amare, perfect!

    and Walker is looking like a pretty decent rotation player, i wouldn’t mind seeing his minutes increase.

  8. Will the Thrill

    Even if the shots aren’t falling for Shump and Melo, the offense looks SO much better this game. This is how they want/need to play on the offensive end. Also, not too shabby on defense either…

  9. Bruno Almeida

    lol Julius Peppers just told the Bobcats reporter that he’s still following the Bobcats, and that he thinks they are doing pretty well.

    if we keep moving the ball, we’re a much better team… but let’s not get carried away, the Bobcats are awful and Augustin is not playing…

  10. Will the Thrill

    I know the Bobcats are bad, but the Knicks weren’t much better, and this is certainly a very good sign. But who knows, they might end up losing this game and totally regressing in the second half.

    Bruno Almeida:
    lol Julius Peppers just told the Bobcats reporter that he’s still following the Bobcats, and that he thinks they are doing pretty well.

    if we keep moving the ball, we’re a much better team… but let’s not get carried away, the Bobcats are awful and Augustin is not playing…

  11. domiknick

    I’m watching at work with the sound off. Why was that a flagrant? Looks like he went for the ball.

  12. LamontWallace

    domiknick:
    I’m watching at work with the sound off.Why was that a flagrant?Looks like he went for the ball.

    He grabbed his arm and knocked him down.

  13. Thomas B. Post author

    Landry needs to concentrate on slashing and cutting. The ball movement is making everyone–outside of Shumpert–look really good on offense.

  14. Frank O.

    Melo takes and misses five shots.
    The Knicks offensive flow looked best with Melo on bench and Amare hitting shots and being featured where he is most effective.
    I wish Melo could figure out how to let the game come to him, rather than grabbing and holding it.

  15. SSS

    To be fair, these Bobcats are just a horrible, horrible team. And, as predicted, Kemba Walker is having his breakout performance.

    Still…progress.

  16. Bruno Almeida

    Melo is shooting badly but all his shots came on reasonable attempts, he didn’t force anything…

    the ball movement has been nice, but we do need to involve Carmelo on the offense, so far he’s been getting the ball and passing, we need some plays designed for him to come off screens or to handle the ball on the p’n’r with Amare.

  17. d-mar

    SSS:
    To be fair, these Bobcats are just a horrible, horrible team.And, as predicted, Kemba Walker is having his breakout performance.

    Still…progress.

    Yeah, they have no rebounders and no one to guard STAT. But I’ll take a damn win over any team at this point.

  18. ruruland

    Bruno Almeida: Melo is shooting badly but all his shots came on reasonable attempts, he didn’t force anything…the ball movement has been nice, but we do need to involve Carmelo on the offense, so far he’s been getting the ball and passing, we need some plays designed for him to come off screens or to handle the ball on the p’n’r with Amare.

    You’re crazy if you want Melo touching the ball more.

  19. Will the Thrill

    Melo needs to be healthy before he should be shooting a lot on offense. We can’t afford for him to shoot his normal dosage because they are just not going in. I think the way he’s playing tonight is good for the team and will give others confidence.

  20. ruruland

    Will the Thrill: Melo needs to be healthy before he should be shooting a lot on offense. We can’t afford for him to shoot his normal dosage because they are just not going in. I think the way he’s playing tonight is good for the team and will give others confidence.

    Melo is clearly faking it.

  21. Frank O.

    Bruno Almeida:
    Melo is shooting badly but all his shots came on reasonable attempts, he didn’t force anything…

    the ball movement has been nice, but we do need to involve Carmelo on the offense, so far he’s been getting the ball and passing, we need some plays designed for him to come off screens or to handle the ball on the p’n’r with Amare.

    Honestly, if his wrist hurts and he can’t make anything, he’s better as a decoy out there

  22. Bruno Almeida

    ruruland: You’re crazy if you want Melo touching the ball more.

    if his touches mean stupid iso’s on the right wing then yes, I’m perfectly fine with 5 shots in a half.

    but if we can consistently move the ball like we did for a good part of the 1st half with Melo being more involved and playing within the offense, that’s definitely a step in the right direction.

  23. Frank O.

    And I believe it is no surprise that the Knicks have 52 points at half. Melo hasn’t been killing the flow with 20 shots

  24. ruruland

    Frank O.: Actually, the shots have been largely uncontested. But he could hit Cotto if he tried.AMARE!

    Agree. He shouldn’t be playing. Will be awhile before his trade value will make him moveable again.

  25. Will the Thrill

    Something must have gotten into Shumpert’s head. One of his strengths coming out of college was his ability to finish around the rim. Hopefully he gets it together (I’m sure he will).

  26. Business Socks

    Chandler is a ball magnet on the glass. Ball movement has been great, Melo is taking shots in the flow of the offense. If only Shump could finish at the rim tonight.

  27. Bruno Almeida

    Frank O.: Actually, the shots have been largely uncontested. But he could hit Cotto if he tried.

    AMARE!

    to be fair, his wrist is definitely bothering him, because he usually hits those wide open 3’s he took so far.

    but that’s great, we are doing what good teams do (and that’s RARE for us): the Bobcats can’t rebound and can’t stop anybody inside… so we’re rebounding really, really well and getting Amare the ball inside.

    sometimes basketball is really simple, you have a big advantage over your opponent, you explore it and win easily.

  28. ruruland

    Bruno Almeida: to be fair, his wrist is definitely bothering him, because he usually hits those wide open 3?s he took so far.but that’s great, we are doing what good teams do (and that’s RARE for us): the Bobcats can’t rebound and can’t stop anybody inside… so we’re rebounding really, really well and getting Amare the ball inside.sometimes basketball is really simple, you have a big advantage over your opponent, you explore it and win easily.

    Sore wrist ???

  29. Bruno Almeida

    and Chandler is an absolute beast, he’s BY FAR the best free agent signing I remember for the Knicks in a long, long time…

  30. Will the Thrill

    I don’t understand how it looks like the Knicks have boughten into the system in a matter of 1 game. Well, the signs started with the Denver game, now we are really getting the offense going.

  31. Frank O.

    Bruno Almeida: to be fair, his wrist is definitely bothering him, because he usually hits those wide open 3?s he took so far.

    If by usually you mean 32% of the time, yeah he usually makes those…
    Not trying to be too hard on him, but the dude needs some tough love. For a veteran ball player he seems like he’s a pretty low IQ guy lately.
    I keep oping something clicks for him

  32. ruruland

    Frank O.: If by usually you mean 32% of the time, yeah he usually makes those…Not trying to be too hard on him, but the dude needs some tough love. For a veteran ball player he seems like he’s a pretty low IQ guy lately.I keep oping something clicks for him

    He’s a terrible three point shooter… and you’re right a moron because he keeps taking them

  33. Bruno Almeida

    ruruland: Sore wrist ???

    dude, really, we get that you love Carmelo and hates the fact that people are blaming the team’s poor play on him, but ironizing every single comment about him on this thread won’t help a bit.

  34. ruruland

    Bruno Almeida: dude, really, we get that you love Carmelo and hates the fact that people are blaming the team’s poor play on him, but ironizing every single comment about him on this thread won’t help a bit.

    I’m 100 percent in the right, just like most of the board.

  35. Frank O.

    ruruland: He’s a terrible three point shooter… and you’re right a moron because he keeps taking them

    If your being sarcastic, I don’t know. But he’s shooting 32% from the arc this year, and that is his career average also.
    I want him to be better and find his place on the offense, but everyone, everyone that has been watching the knicks has said he is stopping the offense and the flow. Even the MSG homers are saying it.
    If he let’s it come to him, he’s going to be dominant

  36. ess-dog

    Wow, Chandler has a .667 eFG right now. If he’s within 10 feet of the basket, we should pretty much give him the ball, huh?

  37. ruruland

    Frank O.: If your being sarcastic, I don’t know. But he’s shooting 32% from the arc this year, and that is his career average also.I want him to be better and find his place on the offense, but everyone, everyone that has been watching the knicks has said he is stopping the offense and the flow. Even the MSG homers are saying it.If he let’s it come to him, he’s going to be dominant

    How is going to be dominant? What does he do well?

  38. Will the Thrill

    Lol now Melo is running around like his wrist is broken, making it very evident that he is injured. If it is actually getting worse (which is doubtful) why is he still in the game?

  39. ruruland

    Will the Thrill: Lol now Melo is running around like his wrist is broken, making it very evident that he is injured. If it is actually getting worse (which is doubtful) why is he still in the game?

    Melodramatic much? Guy is a total coward.

  40. cgreene

    I wish players were given an assist for plays that lead to free throws. Melo would probably have an additional 3 or 4.

  41. d-mar

    Mulligan: Come on now, they’ve been beaten by them before this season.

    Just being cynical, I hope we can build off this somehow. But the Bobcats total lack of any inside presence is a huge advantage for us, don’t think we’ll see that too often this season.

  42. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    wow another step out of bounds turnover by walker what a suprise he wasnt even close to the side line smh

  43. latke

    Carmelo is a great shooter. His shooting percentage has been deflated during his career because he takes so many difficult (and arguably unnecessary) shots. Tonight, he’s taking great shots and making great passes. He’s played a lot of point guard tonight and a lot of hockey assists (the pass that led to the assist). The only thing wrong is that he’s missing easy shots, which just happens sometimes and is of no long term concern at all. Same with Shumpert. He’s getting great shots and playing within himself. He’s had a few bad passes, but mostly he’s just missed easy shots.

  44. Jake S.

    Will the Thrill:
    Lol now Melo is running around like his wrist is broken, making it very evident that he is injured.If it is actually getting worse (which is doubtful) why is he still in the game?

    This seems like a bit much, but I agree that there’s a whiff of Vince Carter about the way he plays in pain. Can be frustrating to watch.

  45. ruruland

    cgreene: I wish players were given an assist for plays that lead to free throws. Melo would probably have an additional 3 or 4.

    lmao… you’re that desperate to make Melo look like a decent player.

  46. Mulligan

    good god, bill walker has been called for being out of bounds at least once a game multiple times this season. i recall 3 off the top of my head. what is wrong with him? is that not the definition of a boneheaded play? really indicative of a lack of focus on his part…

  47. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    ess-dog:
    Wow, Chandler has a .667 eFG right now.If he’s within 10 feet of the basket, we should pretty much give him the ball, huh?

    Fear the Beard

  48. Will the Thrill

    Even with one arm though, he is definitely playing within the offense more this game than in the past. If his shots were going in it’d be perfect.

    ruruland: Melodramatic much? Guy is a total coward.

  49. cgreene

    ruruland: lmao… you’re that desperate to make Melo look like a decent player.

    No. Just stating a fact. I could care less how Melo looks. I was just noting that he, in particular tonight, has made several excellent passes that led to free throws. And in general it is a flaw in stat keeping that the passer is not credited with those plays.

  50. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    HAHAHAHA

    9-10 FG, 8 OREB, 0 TO

    HE’S OVERRATED, DEFINITELY NOT WORTH HIS CONTRACT

  51. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    TWO GOOD THINGS IVE SEEN amare has hit an elbow jumper and he had a put back dunk with jeffries bibby walker and shumpert in the game woooooooooowwwwwwwww we might see him get a little better nice supporting cast by the knicks tonite and great ball movement

  52. ess-dog

    Damn Melo has 11 boards?

    Of course, 7 of those are off his own misses. ba dum tss!

    (cue ruruland)

  53. LamontWallace

    ruruland: lmao… you’re that desperate to make Melo look like a decent player.

    11 rebounds 4 assists. I don’t know what you want the guy to do.

  54. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    ess-dog:
    Damn Melo has 11 boards?

    Of course, 7 of those are off his own misses.ba dum tss!

    (cue ruruland)

    I wish that were true. He’s got 0 OREB.

    Also, I love that graphic: “Wizards 2-15: Have lost 5 games by 8 points or less” as if it’s supposed to be indicative of anything. Why not just say “Have lost 10 games by 9 points or more?”

    Either way they look (and are) terrible.

    By the way, Chandler couldn’t have this kind of game without Amar’e clearing the paint for him. Right? That’s why we pay the latter $16M a year, right? Right guys? Right?

  55. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    LamontWallace: 11 rebounds 4 assists. I don’t know what you want the guy to do.

    Well, for starters, he could hit a field goal. For “one of the best shooters in the league,” 0-7 is abysmal.

    Hell, I could go 0-7 in the NBA.

  56. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    wow jeffries doesnt look scared going to the basket anymore theses past games arent a fluke

  57. Mulligan

    The Honorable Cock Jowles: I wish that were true. He’s got 0 OREB.

    By the way, Chandler couldn’t have this kind of game without Amar’e clearing the paint for him. Right? That’s why we pay the latter $16M a year, right? Right guys? Right?

    Seriously? This is the game you choose to make a snarky comment about STAT? 18 & 8 on 7-12 shooting w/ 0 turnovers ain’t too shabby. Also, Melo does have 11 rebs so I don’t know what you’re talking about…

  58. dogrufus

    Thomas B.: stop taking bad shots.

    Would you settle for greatly reducing his frequency of bad shots, taking care of the ball, making decent passes, helping Chandler dominate the glass, and playing solid defense?

    Because whatever you think of Melo it appears he does realize his wrist is limited right now and has really reined it in. What else do you want? Balkman?

  59. cgreene

    Thomas B.: stop taking bad shots.

    He hasn’t taken bad shots tonight. Most nights he does but let’s be accurate. He rebounded and passed well. He can’t shoot to save his life right now.

  60. Mulligan

    Whoa – did ya’ll just see that shot of Melo’s wrist? What is up with that bandage? Looks like spiderman’s webshooter or something…

  61. Jake S.

    I’m totally geeking out for the these last five minutes. Legitimately excited to see Jordan and Lin. I need help.

  62. Spree8nyk8

    I mean the guy is hurt, it’s obviously affected his shot, so he curtailed that and didn’t shoot much. So instead of taking 30 shots and missing 20 of them he missed 7 shots. No matter what the guy does you’ll hate on him. Unless he goes 13/15 every night, and even if he did that you’d say “he’ll come back to earth soon”.

    He cut back his shots, got his teammates involved and they won a blowout game. Be quiet and be happy.

  63. Bruno Almeida

    D’Antoni definitely hates Balkman and he won’t play meaningful minutes this season, but Novak has a sweet shot, I think he could be useful sometimes.

  64. Thomas B. Post author

    LIVE FROM THE PHANTOM ZONE!
    He is General Zod’s top lieutenant and our own personal victory cigar.
    Give it up for Renaldo Balkman!!

  65. Shad0wF0x

    latke:
    I’m calling a 30+ point blowout here by the knicks. They look really good. If the open layups had fallen, they’d already be up double digits, and they’ve played good defense.

    Wow. You were right.

  66. SSS

    It was nice of John Stockton to come out of retirement and play some garbage time minutes in Lin’s jersey tonight.

  67. ruruland

    Spree8nyk8: I mean the guy is hurt, it’s obviously affected his shot, so he curtailed that and didn’t shoot much. So instead of taking 30 shots and missing 20 of them he missed 7 shots. No matter what the guy does you’ll hate on him. Unless he goes 13/15 every night, and even if he did that you’d say “he’ll come back to earth soon”.He cut back his shots, got his teammates involved and they won a blowout game. Be quiet and be happy.

    Give it a rest. Team won in spite of Melo tonight, as it will be forced to do so long as he’s around doing his typical no-passing, no-defense, below average shooting stuff.

  68. Spree8nyk8

    ruruland: Give it a rest. Team won in spite of Melo tonight, as it will be forced to do so long as he’s around doing his typical no-passing, no-defense, below average shooting stuff.

    Troll has spoken

  69. KnicksFanInVA

    Novak has to get some burn. He’s too good of a shooter to sit. Yea, he sucks at everything else, but damn he can shoot.

  70. Jake S.

    I know this is like whiffle ball at this point, but the Knicks can’t find a couple of back-up point guard minutes for Lin?

  71. Jake S.

    KnicksFanInVA:
    Novak has to get some burn. He’s too good of a shooter to sit. Yea, he sucks at everything else, but damn he can shoot.

    Ditto. He’s a better pure shooter than Walker.

  72. domiknick

    Tell me somebody else saw Amar’e do a little “karate arms and bow” on the bench just now?!?

  73. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    killer crossover by lin than the madelicious dunk by j jordan smh the play that couldve been

  74. Kikuchiyo

    Novak has his eyes on that high water mark of lanky white guy Knicks shooters, Brad Lohaus’ 42% 3P% in ’95-’96.

  75. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    Maybe Lin would get diced by the Chris Pauls of the league, but c’mon, the kid can drive and pass.

  76. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    can u say smashing of a bad team. i like that o and its a no melo showing. report he shoulda sat out like he said he was gonna do. he wouldnt have made such a fool of himself by doing absoultly nothing for the Knicks except be Amares and Chandlers decoy. wow how the tables turned. the funny thing is we smashed them without him. smh. wow i know there is a god and melo said “give me a sign” and he said “ill do you one better, ill make you give my sign to the world” to bad his ego didnt listen smh

  77. Jake S.

    The Honorable Cock Jowles:
    Maybe Lin would get diced by the Chris Pauls of the league, but c’mon, the kid can drive and pass.

    I’m with you. Worth taking a flyer on him for 10 minutes a night. How much less can he give you than Douglas or Bibby?

  78. d-mar

    I’ve got bad news for the Melo haters, we’re gonna need him the next 3 games a lot more than we did tonight.

  79. latke

    Melo and Fields were the ball handlers on most of the Knicks’ screen and rolls. As many here love to point out, you need a good guard to make that play work. Well, it worked. Our bigs were a combined 16/22 from the field for 38 points. If that guard is so important, then both Carmelo and Fields deserve a ton of credit in this win.

  80. ess-dog

    The Honorable Cock Jowles:
    Maybe Lin would get diced by the Chris Pauls of the league, but c’mon, the kid can drive and pass.

    Wait a minute… are you making an off the cuff comment based on a purely visual reaction!?!? Please tell me you have some handy statistics on Lin. Please?

  81. LMNYKFAN4LIFE

    wow it seams to me that they are alot better (meaning the team) when melo is not ball hogging. thought two; while lin looks like he would do good on the offense he is definatly a liability on defense. 3 fouls in 6 minutes wow. thats 6 points to the other team, that he would give them of the bat. no thank you hes not that good offensively.

  82. bobneptune

    Robert Silverman (@BobSaietta):
    Where’s Bobneptune to tell us how overrated Tyson Chandler is?

    i’m right here.

    the man is the nizzles on put backs. unfortunately he won’t be going up against bj mullens much the rest of the season and he’ll go back to his 3 for 5 from the floor and 8 points…….

    but it is always nice to see actual basketball played by the knicks with ball movement and actual passing.

  83. The Honorable Cock Jowles

    ess-dog: Wait a minute…are you making an off the cuff comment based on a purely visual reaction!?!?Please tell me you have some handy statistics on Lin.Please?

    I don’t need stats on Lin. I have stats on Toney.

  84. Mulligan

    ess-dog: Wait a minute…are you making an off the cuff comment based on a purely visual reaction!?!?Please tell me you have some handy statistics on Lin.Please?

    Small sample size (1 game ptd (post-triple double)): 8 points on 2 shots, 4:1 assist:to ratio (+ 1 block and 2 rebs) in 6 minutes.

  85. Robert Silverman (@BobSaietta)

    bobneptune: i’m right here.

    the man is the nizzles on put backs. unfortunately he won’t be going up against bj mullens much the rest of the season and he’ll go back to his 3 for 5 from the floor and 8 points…….

    but it is always nice to see actual basketball played by the knicks with ball movement and actual passing.

    The nizzles?

  86. Degree_Absolute

    Chandler is a beast. Amare hit an elbow jumper. Landry was offensive lubricant. Melo only missed seven shots. Good stuff.

    Also, on the Charlotte feed, I swear I heard a player shout “Chinese Sensation!” when Lin was at the line. That third unit is fun to watch.

  87. daJudge

    That’s a good one Robert. Enjoyed the game tonight. Landry seems to be on the mend. Don’t know what else to say, but my wife won big at the Racino tonight, Giants are in the Superbowl, Knicks win big, BD ready to play and little stupid sh-t makes life good. How ’bout some burn for Lin? See y’all tomorrow.

  88. dogrufus

    Kikuchiyo:
    Novak has his eyes on that high water mark of lanky white guy Knicks shooters, Brad Lohaus’ 42% 3P% in ’95-’96.

    I’d put an asterisk on Lohaus’ mark due to the shortened line that season… Novak will be without peer.

  89. d-mar

    Z-man:
    My take on this game: I was wrong, the Knicks have only the 2nd worst backcourt in the league.

    I’d also be hard pressed to find a worse frontcourt than Byron Mullens, Tyrus Thomas and Derrick Brown.

  90. Juany8

    I’m one of the people who usually seems to agree with ruruland on Melo, but it was quite amusing to read all his sarcastic comments. Melo has not proven to be as good as Kobe when it comes to playing with injuries, but as long as he continues being a good decoy and moving the ball along it won’t matter if he doesn’t shoot that well. The Knicks still need him to have a coherent half court offense, not every team is the bobcats, and he is still the only guy that can dribble like he’s done it since high school. Forcing jumpers that aren’t falling right now obviously isn’t the answer, but he played more within the offense and we destroyed a team on the road, which is a good sign when you consider just how terrible we’ve been.

  91. xduckshoex

    Brian Cronin (@Brian_Cronin):
    I would understand it if ruruland didn’t post here consistently, but he does, so the failure of soooo many people to realize he was being sarcastic all night long was painful to read.

    Almost as painful as his misplaced sarcasm itself.

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